Diving (Lallana)

[Chez]

Which one was monks tackle? I saw Lalana dive for two, then when he didn't get a decision which wa a foul you can't blame the ref for not giving it when the same player had dived twice before.

 

I thought the first was more a case of him running out of steam, his lack of pace meant he just made a desperate attempt to make up for it and he went down. Maybe not a dive just a going down easy. The second looked a huge dive. The third was too far from me but looked like a foul. The ref had a good game if you ask me apart from not playing advantage once. Clyne was lucky not to get a yellow before he did otherwise he would gone

[Badger]

Slight correction needed:

 

Sadly, he is. He's by no means the worst around, but hethinks he knows the game, he knows that going down easily might win him a penalty and he makes the most of it. He did it last season, he's doing it this season.

[John Boy Saint]

Think the best comment I heard today was "Lallana you go down faster than Linda Lovelace in Deep Throat"

Hey that was a banner at the League cup final in 1979 "Steve Williams lays on more balls than Linda Lovelace" (you can see all the youngsters on here scratching there heads: googling Malcolm Allison in the bath in images will explain it).

 

In slight defence of Lallana apart from when Monk planted his foot and really did block him Adam did not go into histrionics in begging for the penalty................ But when you have a ref who awards a free kick when a Swansea player stands on the ball and falls on his Ar$e without a Saints player in feet of him you know you are going to get the sh1tty end of he stick off the ref

[dan17]

Just seen it on motd.....it really isn't clear cut IMO.

 

Can't argue that Adkins doesn't care!...

[dan17]

I think the Monk challenge is a definate pen!

[saint si]

Didn't show the first one or clyne's penalty shout.

 

Second one looked a very harsh booking but a debatable pen... Shot from the chapel showed the defender's right leg coming across lallana's right leg which was the contact.

 

Third one was nailed on and just inside the box.

[SuperMikey]

Monk one was definitely a foul, whether it was in the box or not I don't know.

 

Surprised no mention of Clyne's pen, thought it was a stonewaller.

[Saint in Paradise]

Hey that was a banner at the League cup final in 1979 "Steve Williams lays on more balls than Linda Lovelace" (you can see all the youngsters on here scratching there heads: googling Malcolm Allison in the bath in images will explain it).

 

I thought that bird was Fiona Richmond with Malcolm A not Linda Lovelace ? Can't be bothered to look though.

[Flyer]

It was a dive and he is a serial diver. He will get the Suarez treatment if he keeps it up. I think thats already happening because the late challenge was clearly a penalty but the refs dont like being made a fool of.

[ericofarabia]

I thought that bird was Fiona Richmond with Malcolm A not Linda Lovelace ? Can't be bothered to look though.

 

It was defo Fiona Richmond pictured with Malcolm Allison.

 

Probably why the palarse players weren't totally focused for the semi final at Stamford Bridge.

 

NSFW ish

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k6DzO6iaUYU

[obelisk]

Well, having just watched a recording of MOTD, my original opinion has been proved correct. Both incidents in the 2nd half that were shown indicate that Lallana was fouled in the penalty area. They looked like penalties at the time and that is confirmed by the replays.

 

The incidents in the first half were not shown and I was too far from the action so can't comment.

[Saint Martini]

Well, having just watched a recording of MOTD, my original opinion has been proved correct. Both incidents in the 2nd half that were shown indicate that Lallana was fouled in the penalty area. They looked like penalties at the time and that is confirmed by the replays.

 

The incidents in the first half were not shown and I was too far from the action so can't comment.

 

Well, that's pretty much the point I was making. We didn't get 1/2 penalties because Lallana lost his credibility with the dive in the first (which was a dive). Awful decision from Marriner but Lallana should stay on his feet so that he actually gets the decision when he should get it.

[shurlock]

Hope he's reading Peter and the Wolf to his new-born. Might learn from it too. Silly c**t.

[Turkish]

I thought the first was more a case of him running out of steam, his lack of pace meant he just made a desperate attempt to make up for it and he went down. Maybe not a dive just a going down easy. The second looked a huge dive. The third was too far from me but looked like a foul. The ref had a good game if you ask me apart from not playing advantage once. Clyne was lucky not to get a yellow before he did otherwise he would gone

 

Having seen the last two again, the one he got booked for he went down very easily, the first one in the first half was right in front of us and a clear dive, the lads I go with all said exactly the same thing ss well. The third one was a definite foul. Young Adam needs to be careful or he'll get a reputation. I agree the ref was pretty decent overall.

[VectisSaint]

Well, having just watched a recording of MOTD, my original opinion has been proved correct. Both incidents in the 2nd half that were shown indicate that Lallana was fouled in the penalty area. They looked like penalties at the time and that is confirmed by the replays.

 

The incidents in the first half were not shown and I was too far from the action so can't comment.

Agree with you completely on the 2nd half. Like you I was too far away at the match for the one in the first half, but having just watched Match Choice on Sky it was a bit lame, but I still wouldn't class it as a dive. 1st one in the 2nd half the pundit on Sky was sucked in and thought it was a dive because AL was alreay falling when the foul came in, not true, AL was turning to go left, when Williams clattered him. Last one was just blatant body check by Monk, only doubt with that one was whether it was in the area, but I believe it was. Lallana proved time and again in the game that he is not a diver, staying on his feet many times when he was clattered.

[ottery st mary]

To suggest the referee had a good game......Sorreeee, I do not like to lay blame at refs...But to me and a few Swansea lads ...the poorest performance I have seen for a while.

 

Even to prevent a couple of our advantages was poor refereeing......Referee get some glasses FFS:p

[Whitey Grandad]

Just seen MOTD. Unusual, but I agree with the pundits, the Williams incident probably not a penalty but certainly not a dive. The Monk one was a definite body charge and Monk was inside the area. Very poor decision.

[Bensfcno1]

All you having ago at Adam should **** off and go a support another team! He puts 110% into every game he plays for this club! First half he went down easy, but not a dive and the 2 in the second half at least 1 was a pen! The Pompey game apart were I think he had a poor lack of judgement (if he did get a wining pen against the skates, would you really care that it was a dive) we have been punished by cheating opponents plenty of times down the years! It happens in football and I don't like it but, there are alot worse culprits in football, an Adam is not a cheat, just trying to male the most of potential fouls! The type of player he is, he is going to win fouls! Even before the last penalty shout he did really well to stay on his feet a couple of times, which you lot seem to ignore and give him credit for! End of rant but just get behind a player who loves the club and wants to do his best every time he puts the shirt on!

 

Ps. Both MOTD and Goals on Sunday pundits agree that they were not dives and possible penalties!

 

HE PLAYS ON THE LEFT......

[VectisSaint]

To suggest the referee had a good game......Sorreeee, I do not like to lay blame at refs...But to me and a few Swansea lads ...the poorest performance I have seen for a while.Even to prevent a couple of our advantages was poor refereeing......Referee get some glasses FFS:p

Agreed, most round me thought he was one of the worst seen and that he was probably going out for dinner with some of the Swansea lads afterwards to celebrate. Didn't realise until after the game it was Andre Mariner, what happened to Dowd who was supposed to be in charge?

[CHAPEL END CHARLIE]

All you having ago at Adam should **** off and go a support another team! He puts 110% into every game he plays for this club! First half he went down easy, but not a dive and the 2 in the second half at least 1 was a pen! The Pompey game apart were I think he had a poor lack of judgement (if he did get a wining pen against the skates, would you really care that it was a dive) we have been punished by cheating opponents plenty of times down the years! It happens in football and I don't like it but, there are alot worse culprits in football, an Adam is not a cheat, just trying to male the most of potential fouls! The type of player he is, he is going to win fouls! Even before the last penalty shout he did really well to stay on his feet a couple of times, which you lot seem to ignore and give him credit for! End of rant but just get behind a player who loves the club and wants to do his best every time he puts the shirt on!

 

Ps. Both MOTD and Goals on Sunday pundits agree that they were not dives and possible penalties!

 

HE PLAYS ON THE LEFT......

 

Well while I'd never suggest that any Saints fan goes way and supports another team, everything else here is spot on. Yesterday he should have had at least one pen award and a incompetent ref got it hopelessly wrong.

 

The opportunity many on here are taking to slate Adam Lallana is shameful. Having followed his progress since he was a mere teenager, I have not the slightest hesitation in stating that I have never seen Adam 'take a dive' and it seems to me that not only is he easily our best player, but also an exceptionally honest one too. The splendid effort this lad is putting in to salvage something from this 'train wreck' of a season is truly exemplary. We are lucky to still have him.

 

If we were to look for any criticism, then you could say that his lack of bulk allows opposition players to knock him off the ball more easily than I'd like ideally. But as for Adam Lallana being some kind of cheat?

 

Not in my book.

[red&white56]

Watched them both again and don't think he dived for the first; it was a collision and no way a yellow - but not a penalty. The second was, imo, a penalty but the ref was not in the mood.

[Greenridge]

Just seen MOTD. Unusual, but I agree with the pundits, the Williams incident probably not a penalty but certainly not a dive. The Monk one was a definite body charge and Monk was inside the area. Very poor decision.

 

Agree on both counts. He certainly did not dive in the Williams challenge.

[Norm]

Agreed re the first 2...thought the last was outside the area though.

 

Either way, he's made a rod for his own back. Refs watch games, notice things, and talk amongst themselves. Suarez doesn't get blatant penalties unless the ref is absolutely convinced...they'll always have it in the back of their mind that they may have been conned. It's up to AL to shed that image.

 

Have to agree with the above. I do wonder if it had been any other player that had been fouled (last one was a stone cert pen) if the ref would have given it? In my view, the Ref wouldn't have given a fould against AL even if he had his legs cut off by a tackle. I honestly think Mariner let his dislike of AL's previous 'dives' cloud his judgment!

[cambsaint]

I'm sure the first wasn't a dive, but a perfectly reasonable loss of balance, it wasn't a pen though. The second right at the end was definitely a penalty.

If referees are going to accuse a player of cheating-which is what a yellow for diving is, then the logical corollary of that is that the referee can be accused of cheating if he get's it wrong.

They must be absolutely certain before making such a serious accusation, just as I must be in order not to make a libellous comment and accuse a referee of cheating.

While writing this I have just seen a blatant dive by Adebayor which resulted in a totally unfair yellow card to the City player.

 

I believe that the one thing that ref's hate is being called a cheat-they don't mind being insulted but they would hat a chant of "Cheat", or "The Referee's a cheat, ditto, We all say the referee's a cheat." It might make them think a bit more.

 

I know it's a very difficult job, and they only have a fraction of a second to decide from their view, but this season I've seen so many bad decisions already that something has to be done.

Why can't the fourth official be a TV reviewer, and if and only if play has stopped review the slow-mo and other angles.

Almost every sport has adopted this process, in cricket it has removed false LBW decisions, in tennis incorrect line-calls, and in rugby most of the really nasty dangerous fouls. The referees and umpires in these sports don't consider their authority is being undermined.

It won't happen until Blatter goes, but I hope Platini may have a more logical open-minded approach.

[John Boy Saint]

I thought that bird was Fiona Richmond with Malcolm A not Linda Lovelace ? Can't be bothered to look though.

I stand corrected, that's the trouble when you post about stuff from 30 odd years ago through the haze of time and a little alcohol ..........................either way both a pair of strumpets from a similar time that made the eyes of most teenage boys eyes pop out on stalks!!!

[benjii]

So, basically, what we're saying is the ref thought Adam dived in the first half.

 

Instead of taking the correct action (yellow card and a free kick to Swansea) he booked him for a non-dive in the second half and turned down a clear penalty.

 

And that passes for decent refereeing in some people's eyes?!

[benjii]

Anyway, his set-pieces are a far bigger crime! Useless!

[Lord Duckhunter]

All you having ago at Adam should **** off and go a support another team! He puts 110% into every game he plays for this club! First half he went down easy, but not a dive

 

.

 

It was right in front of where I sit and the first one WAS a dive and an embarressing one at that. It was a decent situation and by diving the move broke down. It also meant that maybe the Ref had second thoughts when he went down later in the box. I'm all for Ref's clamping down on diving by ignoring serial divers subsequent peno claims. There was one on Mon and now one yesterday, maybe that's what they're doing (although nobody will ever admitt to it). He does dive and he goes down too easily as well. That's a fact. I'm not getting all moral over it because every side has players that do so, but people saying he's just not that type of player are wrong.

 

People are not having a go at Adam, they are commenting on a fact. After 40 years of following Saints up and down the country, I'm entittled to my opinion about players, just as you are to yours.

[rallyboy]

so many different views of the same incidents!

 

Firstly we all have our own definition of 'diving'.

Personally I see a dive as going to ground when there is NO contact, or leaving a trailing leg as you pass a keeper so that you actually instigate the contact - see Bale v Aston Villa the other week, or Pires v pompey.

 

However, if a player is stupid enough to leave a leg sticking out in the box I would rush headlong towards it and be straight over it given the chance - it is not the attacking player's job to stay on his feet if someone is intent on bringing him down.

 

Re yesterday -

IMO, Incident One in first half - I was as close as Lord D and I saw it as Adam being fairly outmuscled and not happy - no dive, no pen.

incident Two - clumsy and late challenge, some contact made, technically a pen but 50:50 on whether it is given - certainly not a dive.

Incident Three - cynical professional foul, clearly a free-kick or a penalty.

From my view the defender clearly stepped across him and took him out, I thought the guy was being clever and using the edge of the box for his assault, TV suggests otherwise.

 

Add in the guy putting hands on Clyne from behind in the box and you have one shocking refereeing performance - but not as bad as the bizarre last minute booking in the Everton Sunderland game.

 

So I'm trying not to look at it through red-tinted glasses, and I can understand how if a player chucks himself down when there is no contact it will cost him real penalties, but to use poor judgement by a ref to criticise one of our players seems a little harsh.

 

And the only reason I've bothered to highlight this stuff in detail is because you can be fricking sure that WE will be on the end of a VERY poor penalty decision anytime soon, and life will look pretty unfair.

 

(which it is by the way )

 

And when that atrocity occurs, polite Nige will have to stand there and take it on the chin, when in reality he will want to scream what the **** are these refs up to???

 

It does seem that you need the air ambulance to be scrambled before a ref even considers giving us a penalty these days.

Do they have some sweepstake running for the season and the winner is the one left who hasn't given Saints a spotkick?

That's the obvious explanation...

[sandwichsaint]

Just seen MOTD. Unusual, but I agree with the pundits, the Williams incident probably not a penalty but certainly not a dive. The Monk one was a definite body charge and Monk was inside the area. Very poor decision.

 

Glad you've backed that up, I haven't seen any telly but that's how I called it from the back of block 39 in real beer-time. First one wasn't a penalty and wasn't a card, the fd can be unseated and lose his balance - doesn't make it a penalty nor a card - second one looked blatent and from our angle was a stride inside the line. Bit of a twit for going down too easily in the first half (Deepthroat was def Linda Lovelace, she died last year, Malcolm Allison used to get in the team bath with Mary Millington, I think). Other than that it was AL's best game for quite some time - still not sure we can play him and GR away from home but very entertaining at home.

[davefoggy]

I had a good view of the second, never a pen. No way, went down way too easily. I was embarrassed for him to be honest.

 

I actually thougt the ref was good and got all the big calls right.

 

WTF???? with that point of view you were clearly not at the game. muppet!!!

[krissyboy31]

Which one was monks tackle? I saw Lalana dive for two, then when he didn't get a decision which wa a foul you can't blame the ref for not giving it when the same player had dived twice before.

Two should have been penalties IMO and to say you can't blame a ref is rubbish. A foul's a foul and if its's the penalty area it's a penalty. Each decision should be taken on it's own merit and if he thought he'd dived three times after being booked for the second than he should have sent AL off. The spineless git copped out of both decisions.

[LostBoys]

I am more worried about his poor form.

[Sour Mash]

So, basically, what we're saying is the ref thought Adam dived in the first half.

 

Instead of taking the correct action (yellow card and a free kick to Swansea) he booked him for a non-dive in the second half and turned down a clear penalty.

 

And that passes for decent refereeing in some people's eyes?!

 

Yep, pretty much my take on it. We should have had 3 penalties on Saturday, we didn't get one.

[Thedelldays]

Lallana has let himself down bug time this season

 

Diving all over the place, horrific defensively.

 

Maybe he is not as good as we thought he would be

[Sour Mash]

Lallana has let himself down bug time this season

 

Diving all over the place, horrific defensively.

 

Maybe he is not as good as we thought he would be

What/ when are all these dives you speak of?

[Monk]

Anyone that thinks Lallana doesn't dive is a moron. Adkins included. I can think of 5 occasions.

[Leicestersaint]

He was a dreadful referee and Lallana's booking was absolutely ridiculous to the point of being risible. On our side the officials got lots of decisions worng on fouls, throw-ins and many other things. Awful referee.

[Bartosz Bialkowski]

Are you lot ****ing kidding?!

 

Adam Lallana is by 1 million miles our best player, he got contact in the box and went down, no different to any other player.

 

He works his arse off every game. Tracks back, intercepts and keeps going for 95+ mins.

 

If we had 8 AL's and 2 decent centre backs we would be pushing for europe.

 

Wash you f'ing mouths out

[Thedelldays]

Are you lot ****ing kidding?!

 

Adam Lallana is by 1 million miles our best player, he got contact in the box and went down, no different to any other player.

 

He works his arse off every game. Tracks back, intercepts and keeps going for 95+ mins.

 

If we had 8 AL's and 2 decent centre backs we would be pushing for europe.

 

Wash you f'ing mouths out

the way I look at these situations...if another player did exactly what lallana did and won a penalty..what would my reaction be...

I would be livid about the cheating fecker.....so, IMO, lallana was trying to cheat...if that is OK for saints players only, then fine

 

im guess, when we play liverpool and Suarez is falling all over the place when he is merely brushed...you wont have a problem with it..?

[Bartosz Bialkowski]

the way I look at these situations...if another player did exactly what lallana did and won a penalty..what would my reaction be...

I would be livid about the cheating fecker.....so, IMO, lallana was trying to cheat...if that is OK for saints players only, then fine

 

im guess, when we play liverpool and Suarez is falling all over the place when he is merely brushed...you wont have a problem with it..?

 

I dont think he dived. He was caught on both occasions and went down.

 

Clyne didnt go down and we got nothing, he did but we also got nothing.... He's trying to do his best for our team. I dont believe AL to be in the same category as Suarez.

[Sour Mash]

the way I look at these situations...if another player did exactly what lallana did and won a penalty..what would my reaction be...

I would be livid about the cheating fecker.....so, IMO, lallana was trying to cheat...if that is OK for saints players only, then fine

 

im guess, when we play liverpool and Suarez is falling all over the place when he is merely brushed...you wont have a problem with it..?

 

How many times has Lallana dived this season? When were these dives?

[Cricketphilly]

Luckily, Mick Channon never dived.

[shurlock]

How many times has Lallana dived this season? When were these dives?

 

He did it several times last season but a blatant one at wham last season really sticks out. Been inclined not to give him the benefit of the doubt ever since.

[Sour Mash]

He did it several times last season but a blatant one at wham last season really sticks out. Been inclined not to give him the benefit of the doubt ever since.

I'm not saying he's never dived. But loads of times? This season? In Saturday's game? As DellDays insinuates? I don't think so.

[fish fingers]

Are you lot ****ing kidding?!

 

Adam Lallana is by 1 million miles our best player, he got contact in the box and went down, no different to any other player.

 

He works his arse off every game. Tracks back, intercepts and keeps going for 95+ mins.

 

If we had 8 AL's and 2 decent centre backs we would be pushing for europe.

 

Wash you f'ing mouths out

 

So much nonsence in one post.

[Window Cleaner]

Does he "dive" or is he just far too easily destabilised ? Needs to buck up because we need goals and Lambert ain't scoring all that many.

[david in sweden]

Marriner screwed up and should have given us one and perhaps two penalties but in the end Lallana's dive in the first half cost him (and Saints).

 

When Lallana dived when he and Rangel where shoulder to shoulder and wanted the penalty Marriner took notice and warned Lallana. When he then got barged over by Williams he gets a yellow for diving which was absolutely ridiculous but he also has to look at himself. If he doesn't start looking for it in the first situation then Marriner wouldn't be as sceptical in later situations.

I for one am totally convinced we would have gotten a penalty for at least the Monk tackle if Lallana hadn't taken a dive in the first.

 

 

I don't believe he does dive....but for someone who looks to only be about 5' 9"(?)...and probably 10 stone wringing wet, any confrontation with a burly opponent will put him on the ground every time.

 

....so........do you do your utmost to stay on your feet even though you've already lost possession ?......or go down (not dive) because you have been fouled?

Edited 12 November, 2012 by david in sweden