Does Lallana need dropping to give him a kick up the backside?

[Saint Garrett]

I've seen this mentioned a couple of times across this forum.

 

Ok, probably when Ramirez is injured he will start as we need someone with creativity in there. But for me, he's not looked great since he has been given the armband.

 

Is he too comfortable?

 

Are we expecting too much from him ?

 

Is he playing in his most effective position?

 

Discuss...

[doddisalegend]

I've seen this mentioned a couple of times across this forum.

 

Ok, probably when Ramirez is injured he will start as we need someone with creativity in there. But for me, he's not looked great since he has been given the armband.

 

Is he too comfortable?

 

Are we expecting too much from him ?

 

Is he playing in his most effective position?

 

Discuss...

 

Yes, despite the song he isn't better than Messi, he is up against some very good players in the PL. I think we've come to expect him to pull something special out of the bag when ever we need it not as easy to do in the PL as it is in the champ or league 1.

[Lets B Avenue]

Yes.

[get_rich]

Lallana has the joint most number of assists in the PL this season.....

according to The Sun, along with Hazard and Mata (4)

[St_Tel49]

Nothing to discuss - no.

[S-Clarke]

He's not a captain, end of. But he has been one of our more effective attackers this season in terms of assists.

 

But he was completely rubbish in open play yesterday, if truth be told.

[Weston Saint]

So who do you bring into that position who is better and as his skill?

[tajjuk]

So who do you bring into that position who is better and as his skill?

 

Yeh essentially we have no one better and he is still a good player, he just had an average game yesterday, he still worked his socks off though and his set piece delivery was good.

 

Not sure he should be captain though, maybe Steven Davis or Morgan or the Holy Goalie

[Dig Dig]

Again, knee jerk comments based on one performance.

 

If Lallana has been so poor this season, how has he got an England call up, top assists to date and has been involved in a lot of our good play this season?

 

Yes he didn't have his best game yesterday but do we really need a player inquest after each below average performance?

[Saint Garrett]

I don't mean drop him forever, I just mean for one game. At the moment he probably feels that he is undroppable. Just an idea.

[Special K]

I suspect he's still getting to grips with being a new dad and all that goes with it, including a lack of sleep and wandering mind! Personally i wouldn't have him as a captain, but i would definitely keep him in the side as he provides some much needed guile to our forward play. But his decision making needs work and I still am not convinced he knows what his best position is. If GR is out for a number of weeks, his importance to the team will be more focused than before; he has a key role in our fortunes over the next 6 weeks, wherever NA decides to play him.

[S-Clarke]

I don't mean drop him forever, I just mean for one game. At the moment he probably feels that he is undroppable. Just an idea.

 

But who replaces him? We'd be weaker straight away.

[trousers]

No.

[Dig Dig]

I don't mean drop him forever, I just mean for one game. At the moment he probably feels that he is undroppable. Just an idea.

 

Why do you say that he feels he's undroppable? Are you suggesting that his slightly below par performance yesterday was down to him not bothering to try as hard? Whatever you say about him, he's one of our most committed players and runs his socks off. He has a very difficult job in having to be our creative outlet plus having to provide defensive cover against top quality wingers.

[Saint Garrett]

I agree, he is one of our best players, but like you say, I don't think he's amazing at CM, and at LF I think he struggles. I still think he's coming to terms with teh league and the fact he's getting much less space, but i'd be interested to see what percentage of his passes are completed compared to other players in those attacking positions.

[Dig Dig]

But who replaces him? We'd be weaker straight away.

 

Probably Chaplow because he runs around a lot and was good against Utd 2 years ago.

[Tom28]

I don't mean drop him forever, I just mean for one game. At the moment he probably feels that he is undroppable. Just an idea.

 

A bad one.

[Saint Garrett]

Probably Chaplow because he runs around a lot and was good against Utd 2 years ago.

 

No, I don't rate players who just run around a lot. I just think there is a lot of abuse thrown Fox's way, because of the lack of cover Lallana provides. I'm not saying he's a bad player at all.

[Winchester Red]

The guy in front of me against Fulham spent the whole match slagging him off.

 

I wonder how many people would like to be judged in their lives by the standards they like to apply to others...

[saint-crinny]

You could argue, and i certainly would, that when you bring Ramirez back into the side, Lallana will be one of the players to benefit most. Ramirez is such an intelligent player, great eye for a pass etc, and he will bring him into the game more and more, putting him in more space to operate, as well as taking the creative burden off Lallana a little and attracting more defensive attention, therefore hopefully given Adam slightly more space to work in.

 

To the original question, no way would i drop him. Who would you replace him with?

 

Along with Lambert, Morgan and Gaston, he is one of our best players.

[Saint Garrett]

What about away from home? Can we afford him and Gaston in the same side ?

[S-Clarke]

What about away from home? Can we afford him and Gaston in the same side ?

 

We'd have little chance of doing anything without them in the side. Teams will still score against us even if we don't have those players in the midfield. So leaving those out puts us at a disadvantage straight away.

 

I think we need to carry on playing on the front foot, if you start dropping the likes of Gaston or Lallana for away games then you're kind of accepting defeat.

[tajjuk]

No, I don't rate players who just run around a lot. I just think there is a lot of abuse thrown Fox's way, because of the lack of cover Lallana provides. I'm not saying he's a bad player at all.

 

 

He covered Fox fine on Sunday, he also covers Fox a whole lot better than Puncheon covers the right back.

 

whoscored.com had him as our second best player, rated at 8.1, 5 key passes, fouled the most, 2nd most tackles and interceptions behind Morgan. Most crosses, only bad aspects were he only had a 69% pass success rate and he was dispossessed the most times.

[Webby]

He doesn't need dropping, he needs coaching to be more direct imo.

[Lord Duckhunter]

He covered Fox fine on Sunday, he also covers Fox a whole lot better than Puncheon covers the right back.

 

whoscored.com had him as our second best player, rated at 8.1, 5 key passes, fouled the most, 2nd most tackles and interceptions behind Morgan. Most crosses, only bad aspects were he only had a 69% pass success rate and he was dispossessed the most times.

 

I guess it's about opinions, but I dont think he's defended correctly all season. I dont think he covered Fox particulary well on Sunday and he also gave away a silly free kick from which they hit the post. Most of the season he's left Fox pretty exposed, Arsenal being a prime example. I dont think he should be dropped, but shoud have come off on Sunday, I thought he ran out of ideas and some of his crosses towards the end weren't a patch on Fox's.

 

I struggle to see how we can get enough of the ball to play him and GR in most away games.

[tajjuk]

I guess it's about opinions, but I dont think he's defended correctly all season. I dont think he covered Fox particulary well on Sunday and he also gave away a silly free kick from which they hit the post. Most of the season he's left Fox pretty exposed, Arsenal being a prime example. I dont think he should be dropped, but shoud have come off on Sunday, I thought he ran out of ideas and some of his crosses towards the end weren't a patch on Fox's.

 

I struggle to see how we can get enough of the ball to play him and GR in most away games.

 

The first bit is my opinion, the second bit is stats, certainly from an attacking point of view, no one tried more or came close to what Lallana offered attacking wise against Fulham. Looking at stats from previous games, attacking wise he has offered and created on average every game about the same as Ramirez has done in the few games he has played.

 

Defensively he has only been out tackled per game by Clyne and Morgan, he is second to only Morgan in interceptions and he has only committed 3 fouls in 7 appearances. That to me indicates he's doing about as much as he can to protect fox, his primary job is not to protect the full back.

 

Statistically he is rated as out third best player behind Lambert and Ramirez.

[The Kraken]

He covered Fox fine on Sunday, he also covers Fox a whole lot better than Puncheon covers the right back.

 

whoscored.com had him as our second best player, rated at 8.1, 5 key passes, fouled the most, 2nd most tackles and interceptions behind Morgan. Most crosses, only bad aspects were he only had a 69% pass success rate and he was dispossessed the most times.

 

:lol:

 

I must have been watching another game where, in the last 10 or 15 minutes, Fox was overloaded with a two on one at least 3 times while Lallana was jogging back from a foray up the pitch.

[david in sweden]

what he needs is ...a few good nights sleep.

 

.....anyone with a new baby in the family will know what that means ........

[Sour Mash]

The first bit is my opinion, the second bit is stats, certainly from an attacking point of view, no one tried more or came close to what Lallana offered attacking wise against Fulham. Looking at stats from previous games, attacking wise he has offered and created on average every game about the same as Ramirez has done in the few games he has played.

 

Defensively he has only been out tackled per game by Clyne and Morgan, he is second to only Morgan in interceptions and he has only committed 3 fouls in 7 appearances. That to me indicates he's doing about as much as he can to protect fox, his primary job is not to protect the full back.

 

Statistically he is rated as out third best player behind Lambert and Ramirez.

Stats like that can only tell you so much, a lot comes from actually watching the game.

[Paul Chuckle]

he doesn't need dropping but he does need the arm band taken off him so he can get on with his game instead of having to deal with incidents etc. Would rather Steven Davis be given the arm band

[VectisSaint]

:lol:

 

I must have been watching another game where, in the last 10 or 15 minutes, Fox was overloaded with a two on one at least 3 times while Lallana was jogging back from a foray up the pitch.

Matches last for 95 minutes, the fact that he may have had problems in the last 10 minutes or so doesn't mean he had a bad game. I thought he had a decent game yesterday, not his best but he was really getting stuck in and making a lot of decent runs, interceptions and tackles. His corner led to our 1st goal (struggling to remember the 2nd, although I was still in the ground unlike about 5000 of our so-called supporters).

[Lets B Avenue]

The first bit is my opinion, the second bit is stats, certainly from an attacking point of view, no one tried more or came close to what Lallana offered attacking wise against Fulham. Looking at stats from previous games, attacking wise he has offered and created on average every game about the same as Ramirez has done in the few games he has played.

 

Defensively he has only been out tackled per game by Clyne and Morgan, he is second to only Morgan in interceptions and he has only committed 3 fouls in 7 appearances. That to me indicates he's doing about as much as he can to protect fox, his primary job is not to protect the full back.

 

Statistically he is rated as out third best player behind Lambert and Ramirez.

 

Lies damned lies and statistics. His job as a left sided midfielder when we dont have the ball, is to mark the right full back. He has hardly done that at all this season apart from once at Everton, when Coleman seemed to walk through him and cross for their 3rd goal.

 

:lol:

 

I must have been watching another game where, in the last 10 or 15 minutes, Fox was overloaded with a two on one at least 3 times while Lallana was jogging back from a foray up the pitch.

 

Agreed.

 

The guy in front of me against Fulham spent the whole match slagging him off.

 

I wonder how many people would like to be judged in their lives by the standards they like to apply to others...

 

Probably me if you were in Block 34.

 

And what the hell are you on about "like to be judged"? We are football supporters, on a football message board, discussing our team.

 

Dont be so precious.

[Gingeletiss]

You just gotta love our fans! Up in arms because the manager subbed a 'below par' SLR, told he is inept, does't know what he is doing. Then start a thread calling for one of our best players in years to be dropped........

 

If NA done this, those same fans (many who think they know better), would be calling for his head! The bloke can't win!

[The Kraken]

Matches last for 95 minutes, the fact that he may have had problems in the last 10 minutes or so doesn't mean he had a bad game. I thought he had a decent game yesterday, not his best but he was really getting stuck in and making a lot of decent runs, interceptions and tackles. His corner led to our 1st goal (struggling to remember the 2nd, although I was still in the ground unlike about 5000 of our so-called supporters).

 

I don't think I mentioned anything about his overall game, did I? I pointed out that his covering of Fox was very poor for the last 10-15 minutes especially.

[shurlock]

:lol:

 

I must have been watching another game where, in the last 10 or 15 minutes, Fox was overloaded with a two on one at least 3 times while Lallana was jogging back from a foray up the pitch.

 

Agree- everything went down our left second half-maybe they thought Fox was the weak link but Lallana didn't help.

The partnership was a liability last season -nightmares of Adomah still linger- one reason why I was happy to see Lallana play in a more central position as he did early on in the season, though many were critical.

Punch isn't as talented as AL but he arguably offers more defensively.

[The9]

I've seen this mentioned a couple of times across this forum.

 

Ok, probably when Ramirez is injured he will start as we need someone with creativity in there. But for me, he's not looked great since he has been given the armband.

 

Is he too comfortable?

 

Are we expecting too much from him ?

 

Is he playing in his most effective position?

 

Discuss...

 

I should think he's probably knackered from just having his first child, on which basis he's doing remarkably well.

[The9]

I don't think I mentioned anything about his overall game, did I? I pointed out that his covering of Fox was very poor for the last 10-15 minutes especially.

 

Agreed on that point especially, Fox played well until Fulham started attacking 2 on 1 against him (though that was mainly because they'd targetted Yoshida on the opposite wing for obvious reasons).

 

Lambert was gash, but it's an indicator of how infrequently he actually performs poorly that it was so glaringly obvious this time. He's usually very consistent. The biggest problem seems to be a combination of lack of depth (especially yesterday with injuries) and an inability for the team to adjust to not having Lambert on the pitch.

 

I thought the combination of Rodriguez and Lambert gave us quite a few options yesterday, with Rodriguez's pace basically doubling the passes we could use and maximising the opportunities for Lambert's passing ability to be effective by giving an option other than just rolling it to the right winger. I somehow doubt it'll be Lambert who makes way when Ramirez comes back though, which is the point about not maximising our opportunities to score that I've been making since before we even signed Ramirez. Of course, not conceding stupid goals all the bloody time would probably help more, we're scoring plenty as it is.

Edited 8 October, 2012 by The9

[Miffy]

No he doesn't need to be dropped.

[david in sweden]

I should think he's probably knackered from just having his first child, on which basis he's doing remarkably well.

 

well, of course, his wife has that problem really, but I can bet he's not getting too many undisturbed nights !

Edited 8 October, 2012 by david in sweden

[The9]

well, of course, his wife has that problem really

 

Ho ho.

[up and away]

What about away from home? Can we afford him and Gaston in the same side ?

 

IMO Ramirez adds such to our defensive abilities it allows more of an attacking threat. The problem lies in that Lallana, Rodriques, Puncheon and Ricky are not offering sufficient an attacking threat on their own. I was hoping that Mayuka would provide that extra threat, though I expect he would have been used by now if there was the slightest evidence from training. If we don't manage to coax a far more meaningful threat from them all our chances this season are slim. We just have to keep going and hopefully one of them will start doing the business, it's all we have.

[LGTL]

A new baby, England call up, Premier League debut and a captain to boot. It's probably been a mental few months or so, he'll be fine.

[egg]

I think he needs a kick up the arse, but not dropping - yet. He gets pulled infield too often and if he's played wide left he needs to be more disciplined in his positioning. We cant play all season with a winger who exposes his full back.

 

He also needs to release the quicker and stop faffing about with it.

[Miltonroader07]

I dont think AL needs a kick anywhere, he just needs to not be captain and concentrate on the game as he has done,

[Miltonroader07]

At the risk of being controversial (again) I think that AL is without doubt one of the best and most loyal players ever to wear the shirt of SFC; I think that his game has been affected this year by being made Skipper and I think that it makes sense to relieve him of the duty and let him play his own game that we all know he is so good at, Question is who would we have as Skipper??

[Mr X]

At the risk of being controversial (again) I think that AL is without doubt one of the best and most loyal players ever to wear the shirt of SFC; I think that his game has been affected this year by being made Skipper and I think that it makes sense to relieve him of the duty and let him play his own game that we all know he is so good at, Question is who would we have as Skipper??

 

 

I suggest the new guy Davis

[Charlie Wayman]

He was not at his best on Sunday but hell's bells lads he has just become a dad and you know what that means, totally ****ged through sleepless nights and early starts even before he turns up for training. I should think the poor lad is shell-shocked and walking around in a permanent daze.

 

There is no answer until little Arthur goes through the night without waking and gets up at 8.00 am and that will be 3 years down the track so maybe we should sell him now?

[Dibden Purlieu Saint]

If people are expecting him to take apart teams like he has in the last couple of years I think they're exaggerating his ability. If he could he would be one of the best players in the Premiership, and worth a fortune. He's good, but he aint Mata/Silva.

[Huffton]

Take that bloody armband off him. Sorry Nigel, most of your decisions I agree with but not this one. He doesn't need the added pressure, and to be honest he isn't really captain material for me. Give it to Fonte/Davis/Morgan

[Ziggy]

I have read some crap on here but this takes the biscuit. Let's drop our best player and while we're at it sack the manager. I go to St Mary's and come back with a warm glow that we're all pulling together. We are miles from being perfect but at least the 28,000 or so at the game understand and accept this. Then I get home and read the ****e that people write and wonder how we move from the reality of match day to the twilight zone of the Internet.