Saint Charlie Posted 10 October, 2012 Share Posted 10 October, 2012 After one sub appearance? Some said the same about Lambert.. No - more about watching him for the 6months before. He is clearly not a Prem player. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The9 Posted 10 October, 2012 Share Posted 10 October, 2012 If Mayuka can't get a game then Billy Sharp isn't going to either. This is the crux of the matter. Much as I like Billy Sharp, and thought he was less likely to get injured than Lambert this season , with the players we signed in the summer, his poaching skills, ability to play as a mobile front man and general nippiness and movement around the box in a pair to create space for his strike partner are not things that can't be provided (and possibly better) by either Rodriguez or Mayuka, and they have a far greater likelihood of being able to develop further. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The9 Posted 10 October, 2012 Share Posted 10 October, 2012 I do agree.... I do feel we paid the £1.8m to get us over the line.... And he did just that... Sadly, goal poachers are just not suited to top flight football He's not good enough for the prem, you can see that pretty easily.. Ah, the power of hindsight. I don't recall all of the calls from you lot for Sharp to be dumped as he "clearly wasn't a Prem Player" when he was dragging us across the line last season with his run of scoring... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Duckhunter Posted 10 October, 2012 Share Posted 10 October, 2012 If we had signed Billy S in the summer, people would be jumping up and down about a lack of ambition and saying he wasn't premiership quality. Lambert has the touch of a premiership player and passes the ball like one. He also strikes a great ball, the only doubt anyone had about his ability to play in the top flight is his lack of pace. Billy S, nice bloke that he appears to be, is a championship player. Jay Rod and Mayuka could become decent premiership players, Billy never will . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bucks Saint Posted 10 October, 2012 Share Posted 10 October, 2012 Ah, the power of hindsight. I don't recall all of the calls from you lot for Sharp to be dumped as he "clearly wasn't a Prem Player" when he was dragging us across the line last season with his run of scoring... I dont recall being asked, or it being proposed by you. I was happy we got there; I was very certain we needed at least one new striker (Hooper or JRod seemed the most likely). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chez Posted 10 October, 2012 Share Posted 10 October, 2012 Ah, the power of hindsight. I don't recall all of the calls from you lot for Sharp to be dumped as he "clearly wasn't a Prem Player" when he was dragging us across the line last season with his run of scoring... you make it sound like he single handedly got us promotion in the end, which is miles off the truth. The side as a whole put chances on a plate for him, some of which he finished. How many times was a game going away from us and a piece of magic from Sharp changed the game our way? I can remember a single occasion. Almost all his goals came from concerted pressure or chances created by others. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bucks Saint Posted 10 October, 2012 Share Posted 10 October, 2012 If we had signed Billy S in the summer, people would be jumping up and down about a lack of ambition and saying he wasn't premiership quality. Lambert has the touch of a premiership player and passes the ball like one. He also strikes a great ball, the only doubt anyone had about his ability to play in the top flight is his lack of pace. Billy S, nice bloke that he appears to be, is a championship player. Jay Rod and Mayuka could become decent premiership players, Billy never will . This. Plus Lee may have the potential too Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SB Posted 10 October, 2012 Share Posted 10 October, 2012 Not a great deal, but bear in mind that 70% of his time here he has been accommodated in a position which isn't his. So that goes against him, as he hasn't been able to make a great of an impact. Yesterday was his chance as a central striker, and I didn't think he did too badly. His movement and runs along the back 4 are terrific and always well timed. You can see the quality there, but I think he's still not quite sure about his surroundings. Whatever though, it's a little silly to write off a player who is only 7 games into his saints career. Nice to have a well worded reply, and I agree with what you’ve said, was good to see him playing in his correct position against Fulham. I had no faith in him even being a danger to Fulhams defence, in fact he looked like he didn’t want the ball. Don’t get me wrong though, I’m no Jay Rod hater, in fact I was over the moon when he signed, just haven’t seen the potential yet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The9 Posted 10 October, 2012 Share Posted 10 October, 2012 I dont recall being asked, or it being proposed by you. I was happy we got there; I was very certain we needed at least one new striker (Hooper or JRod seemed the most likely). I was happy to keep him, I'd anticipated that we'd signed him to improve him and play in the Prem, which we did by increasing his overall fitness and physique at the end of last season - though when we signed Rodriguez and Mayuka there was some question as to how he'd fit in, just as there was about Lambert, Lee, Barnard, Forte... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The9 Posted 10 October, 2012 Share Posted 10 October, 2012 (edited) you make it sound like he single handedly got us promotion in the end, which is miles off the truth. The side as a whole put chances on a plate for him, some of which he finished. How many times was a game going away from us and a piece of magic from Sharp changed the game our way? I can remember a single occasion. Almost all his goals came from concerted pressure or chances created by others. You can't argue with the goals. If all of his goals this season also came from "concerted pressure or chances created by others" we wouldn't be complaining. I don't see anyone slating Lambert because all his goals are "concerted pressure or chances created by others" ? Well, not yet anyway, give me a chance! If we go down the "creating your own chances" road, that's been one of my main criticisms of Lambert - that he doesn't have the pace to threaten to do that. An example at the moment is his shot against Villa - 4 defenders around him, because they knew he wasn't going to run anywhere with it. Rodriguez against (admittedly only) Sheff Wed took a touch into space behind the defence and finished under no pressure because they couldn't get to him in time. So "not creating your own chances" is a stick to beat more strikers than just Sharp with. Plus Sharp's movement created more time and space for Lambert and also offered a threat to distract defenders from only marking Lambert, allowing him more freedom than when he was carrying the load alone. Oh, and Johnno Forte and Lee Barnard v MK Dons are the ultimate example of a game going away from us and a piece of magic changing things our way, but I'm not advocating them as starters either. Edited 10 October, 2012 by The9 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bucks Saint Posted 10 October, 2012 Share Posted 10 October, 2012 I was happy to keep him, I'd anticipated that we'd signed him to improve him and play in the Prem, which we did by increasing his overall fitness and physique at the end of last season - though when we signed Rodriguez and Mayuka there was some question as to how he'd fit in, just as there was about Lambert, Lee, Barnard, Forte... We wanted Hooper as our number 1 choice. I believe Nigel saw him as a good future premiership player, as well as to secure promotion. When Celtic played hard ball (as they are entitled to), we put away the £7-8m intended for Hooper and bought Sharp at a much lower price instead. The riches of promotion mean it was money well spent. But it was never intended as a signing to bolster the campaign this season IMO. Lee was in that category, Sharp was not Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The9 Posted 10 October, 2012 Share Posted 10 October, 2012 We wanted Hooper as our number 1 choice. I believe Nigel saw him as a good future premiership player, as well as to secure promotion. When Celtic played hard ball (as they are entitled to), we put away the £7-8m intended for Hooper and bought Sharp at a much lower price instead. The riches of promotion mean it was money well spent. But it was never intended as a signing to bolster the campaign this season IMO. Lee was in that category, Sharp was not Difficult to say isn't it ? We didn't buy Hooper in the summer either despite spending £7-8m on another striker so clearly having it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tajjuk Posted 10 October, 2012 Share Posted 10 October, 2012 Difficult to say isn't it ? We didn't buy Hooper in the summer either despite spending £7-8m on another striker so clearly having it. Might have been the Champions League factor. Maybe celtic wanted a lot more for Hooper than Burnley want for Jay Rod, who knows. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bucks Saint Posted 10 October, 2012 Share Posted 10 October, 2012 Might have been the Champions League factor. Maybe celtic wanted a lot more for Hooper than Burnley want for Jay Rod, who knows. Definitely. They did not want to sell at all (he is too important to them, plus his wages are quite modest). Offer would have needed to be £10m plus to even get them to talk I think Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saint Charlie Posted 10 October, 2012 Share Posted 10 October, 2012 Clearly when we signed Sharp he wasnt our first choice, we wanted Hooper or JR but couldnt get either. Thats why Sharp was a done deal for msot of the transfer window and then happened right at the end. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gammon cheeks Posted 10 October, 2012 Share Posted 10 October, 2012 Clearly when we signed Sharp he wasnt our first choice, we wanted Hooper or JR but couldnt get either. Thats why Sharp was a done deal for msot of the transfer window and then happened right at the end. Did we not try and sign super Billy back in the summer for 3 million ? But he choose not to come at that time ? Not our first choice then? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
david in sweden Posted 10 October, 2012 Share Posted 10 October, 2012 No - more about watching him for the 6months before. He is clearly not a Prem player. ....can't disagree with that part, but he was almost single-handedly responsible for our winning goal tally in the last 8 games. AND .....looking at the what happened to the "alternative " signings we didn't make ; Nicky Maynard and Lukas.....I think we got a good deal anyway...... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VectisSaint Posted 10 October, 2012 Share Posted 10 October, 2012 With the injury list ever growing, I believe we are going to rue the day we loaned out Billy, not to mention Martin. We were in too much of a hurry to reduce the salaries following the close of the transfer window. If we'd kept both we would not have been able to bring in Boruc. We didn't ship people out to cut wages (imho) we had to make room in the squad and still leave us with an option or two to bring in an out of contract player - it is still a moot point whether we have one space left or not. In my view I would rather have kept Martin than Seaborne but Martin has not been any good at Palace so what do I know? We have 5 strikers at the moment, how would we have kept 6 happy? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chez Posted 10 October, 2012 Share Posted 10 October, 2012 You can't argue with the goals. If all of his goals this season also came from "concerted pressure or chances created by others" we wouldn't be complaining. I don't see anyone slating Lambert because all his goals are "concerted pressure or chances created by others" ? Well, not yet anyway, give me a chance! there is a lot less of us dominating in the top flight, so we aren't putting chances on a plate for our strikers, so Sharp wouldn't score many goals IMO. If we go down the "creating your own chances" road, that's been one of my main criticisms of Lambert - that he doesn't have the pace to threaten to do that. So "not creating your own chances" is a stick to beat more strikers than just Sharp with. Plus Sharp's movement created more time and space for Lambert and also offered a threat to distract defenders from only marking Lambert, allowing him more freedom than when he was carrying the load alone.Sharp offers little movement IMO and all at a very slow pace. I saw more movement from Rodriguez on Sunday if I'm honest. OK so Lambert doesn't create his own chances, but he wins headers, holds the ball up and links the play. Sharp does none of these things. Oh, and Johnno Forte and Lee Barnard v MK Dons are the ultimate example of a game going away from us and a piece of magic changing things our way, but I'm not advocating them as starters either.In magic, I'm talking about beating a man with raw ability not tucking away a chance. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saint Garrett Posted 25 October, 2012 Share Posted 25 October, 2012 Anyone see his celebration after scoring on Tuesday night?! Made me laugh. http://www.101greatgoals.com/blog/goal-celebration-of-the-week-billy-sharp-scoffs-a-fans-hot-dog-nottingham-forest-v-blackpool/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lazlo78 Posted 25 October, 2012 Share Posted 25 October, 2012 Anyone see his celebration after scoring on Tuesday night?! Made me laugh. http://www.101greatgoals.com/blog/goal-celebration-of-the-week-billy-sharp-scoffs-a-fans-hot-dog-nottingham-forest-v-blackpool/ Good stuff! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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