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Rafa benitez

saintdaz

By saintdaz,
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This Charming Man

This Charming Man

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Yes, it was hugely unlikely they'd win it and a great achievement, but there was a huge amount of luck and poor finishing from opposition involved, the sort of thing that can only happen in cup football. Great achievement yes, but in the same way Di Matteo winning it was, and I'm not convinced he's a wonderful manager just yet. Odd things happen in cups, that's why we all love cup football, it's erratic and the best team doesn't always win. That's why I think it's best to judge managers on league performance mainly.

 

How have Liverpool fared since he's left? They've been on a downward spiral and he gave them their best period since the 80's. He's also won La Liga (twice I think) with Valencia, out muscling the likes of Real and Barca.

 

He signed the likes of Torres, Alonso and Reina who were fantastic for them. Anyone who think's he's not a great manager is quite simply an idiot.

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This Charming Man

This Charming Man

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Rafa was the start of their decline IMO, but he jumped ship before it was obvious to everyone else.

 

Hardly his fault. Everyone around them was getting Billionaire Arabs, they got some stingy Yanks - all the other teams around them kicked on and they fell behind as they couldn't match the spending power. I bet Liverpool fans wish now that Benitez had stayed on and the new board armed him with a £100m kitty, rather than King Kenny.

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tajjuk

tajjuk

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Hardly his fault. Everyone around them was getting Billionaire Arabs, they got some stingy Yanks - all the other teams around them kicked on and they fell behind as they couldn't match the spending power. I bet Liverpool fans wish now that Benitez had stayed on and the new board armed him with a £100m kitty, rather than King Kenny.

 

 

They do, my Liverpool supporting mate said something pretty similar to this to me recently, he said the whole board wrangling thing was the downfall of the club and Rafa left because of this and the lack of investment. Liverpool fans and and football fans in general are 'grass is greener' types and Rafa was quickly forgotten when 'King' Kenny came in. My mate said that there is no way Liverpool would have bought the likes of Carroll, Henderson and Downing whilst if he was still in charge.

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Matthew Le God

Matthew Le God

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Rafa was the start of their decline IMO, but he jumped ship before it was obvious to everyone else.

 

Was that after winning the European cup, other trophies and coming 2nd in the league?

 

Did he not also contribute to them buying a lot of crap. (Don't get me wrong I do think he's a good manager)

 

He won the Champions League, FA Cup, European Super Cup and came 2nd in the Premier League with Liverpool, I think if he did that for Saints we'd forgive him no matter how many "crap" signing he made... ;)

 

He also won the Spanish title twice and UEFA Cup with Valencia and the World Club Cup with Inter Milan.

Edited by Matthew Le God
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tajjuk

tajjuk

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Did he not also contribute to them buying a lot of crap. (Don't get me wrong I do think he's a good manager)

 

Hmmn he was hit and miss in transfers, he bought the likes of Torres, Reina, Alonso, Agger, Mascherano, Lucas Leiva, Dirk Kuyt, Skrtel,

 

Other were not so good like Arbeloa (although now world cup winner!) Morientes and Luis Garcia didn't quite hit it off but did ok. , he bought Crouch who did ok, Glen Johnson?

 

Out right flops - Robbie Kean, Ryan Babel, Andrea Dossena, Aquilani

 

£229 million in 5 years for 76 players. - http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/football/article-1221975/Rafa-Benitezs-229m-spending-spree-The-76-players-signed-Liverpool-managers-reign.html

Edited by tajjuk
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Saint Garrett

Saint Garrett

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Hmmn he was hit and miss in transfers, he bought the likes of Torres, Reina, Alonso, Agger, Mascherano, Lucas Leiva, Dirk Kuyt, Skrtel,

 

Other were not so good like Arbeloa (although now world cup winner!) Morientes and Luis Garcia didn't quite hit it off but did ok. , he bought Crouch who did ok, Glen Johnson?

 

Out right flops - Robbie Kean, Ryan Babel, Andrea Dossena, Aquilani

 

£229 in 5 years for 76 players. - http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/football/article-1221975/Rafa-Benitezs-229m-spending-spree-The-76-players-signed-Liverpool-managers-reign.html

 

Looking through that list, it was impressive to begin with but then the last 3 years spent a lot of money on very average players.

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tajjuk

tajjuk

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Looking through that list, it was impressive to begin with but then the last 3 years spent a lot of money on very average players.

 

Most are just squad players though, his big errors were letting Alonso go and getting Aquilani to replace him and spending £20 million on Robbie Keane, apparently though rumours are that this was part of some sort of tit for tat between him and the boardroom.

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Saint-Armstrong

Saint-Armstrong

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Most are just squad players though, his big errors were letting Alonso go and getting Aquilani to replace him and spending £20 million on Robbie Keane, apparently though rumours are that this was part of some sort of tit for tat between him and the boardroom.

 

I don't think I will ever believe it was Rafa's choice to sell Xabi Alonso.

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Lord Duckhunter

Lord Duckhunter

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I really do wonder at some of our posters and their grip on reality. They seem to package up opinion as fact.

 

Benitez is in a different league than Nigel Adkins. I hope Nigel grows the club and is with us in 10 years time, but come his retirement from the game, if he's achieved half of what Benitez has he'll be the most sucsessful English manager for a generation. I can understand people saying Benitez is not for us my , but you cant knock what he's a achieved in the game. If NC is looking to replace Nigel, then the players will be impressed if a man with Benitez's CV walks through the door to replace him.

 

For those saying it's unfair to judge NA on 4 games. 4 games is a lot more than Nigel judged Deano and Billy Sharp on. Football is ruthless..........

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Saint Charlie

Saint Charlie

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I really do wonder at some of our posters and their grip on reality. They seem to package up opinion as fact.

 

Benitez is in a different league than Nigel Adkins. I hope Nigel grows the club and is with us in 10 years time, but come his retirement from the game, if he's achieved half of what Benitez has he'll be the most sucsessful English manager for a generation. I can understand people saying Benitez is not for us my , but you cant knock what he's a achieved in the game. If NC is looking to replace Nigel, then the players will be impressed if a man with Benitez's CV walks through the door to replace him.

 

For those saying it's unfair to judge NA on 4 games. 4 games is a lot more than Nigel judged Deano and Billy Sharp on. Football is ruthless..........

 

NA judged them in every match and training session they played in for Saints.

 

Do any fans think that Hammond or Sharp will ever be a good Premier League player? Pretty sure we were all in agreement that they won't, certainly in Hammond's case.

 

Adkins however, has us playing some great football and could well be a success in the Prem - in the four games so far we have showed promise, and its pretty clear to most sensible people that we should judge once he has been able to embed his signings and has been able to play some of the type of teams we have a genuine chance of getting points from.

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Lord Duckhunter

Lord Duckhunter

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NA judged them in every match and training session they played in for Saints.

 

Do any fans think that Hammond or Sharp will ever be a good Premier League player? Pretty sure we were all in agreement that they won't, certainly in Hammond's case.

 

 

And NC has been judging Nigel since he set foot in the door.

 

I dont believe Sharp or Hammond were good enough and fully support ditching them. My point is that maybe NC feels the same about Nigel. Nigel is paid to make judgement calls like that and NC is also in a position that requires him to do the same. I'm not saying he should get rid of NA, merely pointing out that if he does he's just making a judgement call on NA ability in the top flight. Nigel didn't give Deano or Billy Sharpe 12 games to prove themselves he went with his gut feeling and from what he's seen in the past. NC will be doing the same.

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Saint Charlie

Saint Charlie

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And NC has been judging Nigel since he set foot in the door.

 

I dont believe Sharp or Hammond were good enough and fully support ditching them. My point is that maybe NC feels the same about Nigel. Nigel is paid to make judgement calls like that and NC is also in a position that requires him to do the same. I'm not saying he should get rid of NA, merely pointing out that if he does he's just making a judgement call on NA ability in the top flight. Nigel didn't give Deano or Billy Sharpe 12 games to prove themselves he went with his gut feeling and from what he's seen in the past. NC will be doing the same.

 

 

Of course NC makes a judgement call on Adkins. But he also knows we had a very tough start and Im sure wouldn't have expected a whole lot more than we got (probably as we all know, 3 points would have been very good).

 

Hence, he will give NA at least the next few matches to show he can do it at this level - and no reason to doubt that based largely on a thrashing by a very good Arsenal team.

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Hopkins

Hopkins

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As much as having Benitez would be quite cool (Even though losing Adkins would be a bit of a bummer), I think people should take into account that Benitez and his people have been whoring him around for any and every half decent job going since he got sacked by Inter. Constantly putting himself in the media around the same time his name gets linked to a job is not a coincidence. I have a mate who did some work for the Guardian for a few months and he told me that Benitez's representatives were constantly telling the Guardian and other media outlets that he was interested or being considered for jobs.

 

Clever but a bit annoying and should make people take links like this with a pinch of salt.

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Turkish

Turkish

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I really do wonder at some of our posters and their grip on reality. They seem to package up opinion as fact.

 

Benitez is in a different league than Nigel Adkins. I hope Nigel grows the club and is with us in 10 years time, but come his retirement from the game, if he's achieved half of what Benitez has he'll be the most sucsessful English manager for a generation. I can understand people saying Benitez is not for us my , but you cant knock what he's a achieved in the game. If NC is looking to replace Nigel, then the players will be impressed if a man with Benitez's CV walks through the door to replace him.

 

For those saying it's unfair to judge NA on 4 games. 4 games is a lot more than Nigel judged Deano and Billy Sharp on. Football is ruthless..........

 

Quite. Incredible that some are saying Benitez isn't good enough for us and wouldn't want him, truely incredible.

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Jack

Jack

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NA is a young manager and had no experience at this level. He has made mistakes, and will make more. But he's a good intelligent manager, and will learn quickly from these mistakes, as he has done in the past.

 

It's sad to hear all this talk of who his replacement is going be, after 4 games at this level.

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Turkish

Turkish

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Yes, it was hugely unlikely they'd win it and a great achievement, but there was a huge amount of luck and poor finishing from opposition involved, the sort of thing that can only happen in cup football. Great achievement yes, but in the same way Di Matteo winning it was, and I'm not convinced he's a wonderful manager just yet. Odd things happen in cups, that's why we all love cup football, it's erratic and the best team doesn't always win. That's why I think it's best to judge managers on league performance mainly.

 

Huge luck, as was getting to the again 2 years later. Just like making Valencia la Liga champions twice, the only club to have won La Liga other than Barcelona or Real since 2000. All just because of a huge amount of luck.

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derry

derry

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Spot on???? Lordswoodsaints admits that the entire post was based purely on his speculation and you dress it up as fact, presumably on the grounds that your thoughts echo his?

 

So pray tell us the background reasons why the pre-transfer window signings didn't materialise? We know that there were widely reported reasons for failing to sign Buttner, but it isn't even clear to anybody posting on here exactly what the fly in the ointment was, just speculation again. So what was the situation regarding the others? Chapter and verse please regarding who we were after and the reasons why they didn't sign. And you'd bet the shirt off your back that the signings we did make weren't the ones that Adkins wanted too? Based on what, exactly?

 

Others on here have posted their opinion as fact that Cortese is ruthless, that opinion being based on the sacking of Pardew for reasons that have never been made clear in the public domain. He might well be single-minded, focussed, ambitious, quite possibly he is ruthless, but I am yet to see anything that he has done which endorses that epithet being attached to him. If he were to sack Adkins at this early stage, then he could be deemed to be ruthless. But there is no evidence that that is his intention, so unless somebody can come up with a reasonable explanation for why they consider him ruthless, can we please stop making things up?

 

I have a contact who worked closely with him, was treated really well but gave up in the end. 'He was hard to work for'. As for the Bristol Rovers episode, I know what happened and NC had no choice. The same outcome in any company in the land. I think he doesn't take any prisoners.

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This Charming Man

This Charming Man

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Sacking AP was a good decision, worked out best for both parties and loaning out Sharp is very logicial - he wouldnt have got many games.

 

Nobody was to know that. We took a big gamble sacking him and Newcastle took an even bigger gamble hiring him.

 

If we sack Adkins now, get a manager in who actually addresses our areas of weakness in January and guides us to a mid-table finish, then sacking NA would also be a good decision. Who knows, Adkins could well keep us up but is NC willing to take that gamble, or will he gamble on a more experienced manager doing the business?

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hypochondriac

hypochondriac

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I have a contact who worked closely with him, was treated really well but gave up in the end. 'He was hard to work for'. As for the Bristol Rovers episode, I know what happened and NC had no choice. The same outcome in any company in the land. I think he doesn't take any prisoners.

 

Well if you know what happened then why not say? It's not like it will matter now.

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Turkish

Turkish

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Spot on???? Lordswoodsaints admits that the entire post was based purely on his speculation and you dress it up as fact, presumably on the grounds that your thoughts echo his?

 

So pray tell us the background reasons why the pre-transfer window signings didn't materialise? We know that there were widely reported reasons for failing to sign B, but it isn't even clear to anybody posting on here exactly what the fly in the ointment was, just speculation again. So what was the situation regarding the others? Chapter and verse please regarding who we were after and the reasons why they didn't sign. And you'd bet the shirt off your back that the signings we did make weren't the ones that Adkins wanted too? Based on what, exactly?

 

Others on here have posted their opinion as fact that Cortese is ruthless, that opinion being based on the sacking of Pardew for reasons that have never been made clear in the public domain. He might well be single-minded, focussed, ambitious, quite possibly he is ruthless, but I am yet to see anything that he has done which endorses that epithet being attached to him. If he were to sack Adkins at this early stage, then he could be deemed to be ruthless. But there is no evidence that that is his intention, so unless somebody can come up with a reasonable explanation for why they consider him ruthless, can we please stop making things up?

 

No point Les, they'd just be a rag tag collection of mercaneries you'd never heard of.

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Turkish

Turkish

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I just think his Liverpool sides were generally sh!te. Brought some dire players.

 

Apart from the one which won the champions league and got to the final two years later. And the one that one the FA Cup and trhe one which finished second in the league and finished in the top 4 every season he was there, apart from the last, you mean?

Edited by Turkish
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aintforever

aintforever

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Apart from the one which won the champions league and got to the final two years later. And the one that one the FA Cup and trhe one which finished second in the league you mean?

 

I just don't think a past it old manager like Benitez is what we need. I don't want Redknapp either but think he would get more out our players.

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