The9 Posted 18 September, 2012 Share Posted 18 September, 2012 I think Dean Wilkins takes defensive training. Crosby focuses more on set-pieces. Just wondering, I have no idea. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saint Charlie Posted 18 September, 2012 Share Posted 18 September, 2012 I think Dean Wilkins takes defensive training. Crosby focuses more on set-pieces. Out of interest why do you think this? Adkins said said Wilkins does great work with the likes of Lallana and Chamberlain and Crosby used to be a CH so would be logical he focused more on the defensive side of things. Coaching worked last season - its the step up in class and illumination of making basic errors that is costing us at the moment. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The9 Posted 18 September, 2012 Share Posted 18 September, 2012 making basic errors that is costing us at the moment. All from the speed of thinking required at a higher level than any of them are used to. Even Kelv could only watch as his Sunderland side plummeted out of the Prem with a then-record points low, so he's not going to have much positive experience to draw on. That rapid 4 man passing move down the Arsenal left which ended with Clyne conceding a corner was probably the greatest piece of multi-player football passing I have ever seen, and I've been to a LOT of football. It was right in front of us and I nearly pooed. It only got them a corner, but it was SO quick and so technically perfect we knew we were going to have some big problems. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SuperMikey Posted 18 September, 2012 Share Posted 18 September, 2012 Out of interest why do you think this? Adkins said said Wilkins does great work with the likes of Lallana and Chamberlain and Crosby used to be a CH so would be logical he focused more on the defensive side of things. Coaching worked last season - its the step up in class and illumination of making basic errors that is costing us at the moment. To be honest I don't know much about our coaching structure. I remember Adkins talking about Crosby's work on set-pieces last season. Basic errors do need to be worked on, but I think we need somebody like Arsenal have in Steve Bould to instill confidence in our defence and share their experience of defending in the top flight. I have no doubt that Crosby is a good coach, but does he have the experience of a Bould, a Neville or a Keown? Who can do that for us? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The9 Posted 18 September, 2012 Share Posted 18 September, 2012 To be honest I don't know much about our coaching structure. I remember Adkins talking about Crosby's work on set-pieces last season. Basic errors do need to be worked on, but I think we need somebody like Arsenal have in Steve Bould to instill confidence in our defence and share their experience of defending in the top flight. I have no doubt that Crosby is a good coach, but does he have the experience of a Bould, a Neville or a Keown? Who can do that for us? I don't think anyone can. The "back 9" shape is basically ok. Neville was much more critical of Reading's players right afterwards, he kept referring to decision-making at the very top level, and the margins being so fine (the "windscreen wipers" and "one second rule" being particularly enlightening for anyone who's never been coached). It's not like Clyne doesn't know what his body shape is meant to be, or that Fonte doesn't know he should be 5 yards closer to Yoshida, it's just thinking it and doing it before it's too late. It is purely about getting used to anticipating and reacting at a higher speed than ever before. I think having Ramirez around might help our defence quite a lot actually, as he may well have the kind of speed of thought they need to learn to react to. Of course from an attacking perspective, as I keep mentioning, I'm not sure Lambert offers Ramirez the movement or passing options Mayuka or Rodriguez would. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LostBoys Posted 18 September, 2012 Share Posted 18 September, 2012 I really did not like Neville as a player - I never thought he was any good - but as a commentator/pundit he is excellent. I do not know why he would like us I remember he used to get terrific abuse at the Dell. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pat from Poole Posted 18 September, 2012 Share Posted 18 September, 2012 Gary Neville may be an insightful pundit, but I'm not convinced he's all that as a defensive coach. Certainly, some of England's defending since Hodgson got the gig hasn't been all that great. Sweden's two goals against us at Euro 2012 were embarrassing, and the Ukraine game last week again was dicey defensively at times, particularly down our right-side, as it happens. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bearsy Posted 18 September, 2012 Share Posted 18 September, 2012 Played 9 conceded 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Duckhunter Posted 18 September, 2012 Share Posted 18 September, 2012 (edited) The difference between what Neville said about us and Reading was vast. He said that our defensive shape was pretty good and had a bit of praise, whereas basically said Reading were a bit of a shambles. This suggest to me that Nigel does in fact know what he's doing, and sets us up right. It's just down to errors. Watching Neville last night highlighted how much these people know, compared to some of the "experts" we have on here. Most posters critical of our play always seem to exclude Clyne from critisism of the back 4 and keeper. Yet Neville blamed him for 2 goals. I guess it's about opinions because Fat Sam on Goals on Sunday blamed Lallana for not closing down Artetta for the third goal and Yoshi for stepping up, whereas Neville blamed Fonte's starting position and the gap between the 2 centre halves. What they both agreed on was that our shape was right. If our shape "right", then Nigel must be doing something right and maybe he does know a bit more than some give him credit for. Edited 18 September, 2012 by Lord Duckhunter Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dangermouth Posted 18 September, 2012 Share Posted 18 September, 2012 All from the speed of thinking required at a higher level than any of them are used to. Even Kelv could only watch as his Sunderland side plummeted out of the Prem with a then-record points low, so he's not going to have much positive experience to draw on. That rapid 4 man passing move down the Arsenal left which ended with Clyne conceding a corner was probably the greatest piece of multi-player football passing I have ever seen, and I've been to a LOT of football. It was right in front of us and I nearly pooed. It only got them a corner, but it was SO quick and so technically perfect we knew we were going to have some big problems. So. What was your view of the new boys then? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SW11_Saint Posted 18 September, 2012 Share Posted 18 September, 2012 Absolutely, no team has ever overturned a MASSIVE two point gap with only thirty-four games to play... Like it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The9 Posted 18 September, 2012 Share Posted 18 September, 2012 So. What was your view of the new boys then? Ramirez didn't get much ball but looked decent when he did have it but IMHO needs someone who can get on the end of through balls. Yoshida was put in a very difficult position and was clearly partially at fault for one of the goals, but it's much more important to communicate and know the defensive system than anywhere else on the pitch, and it wasn't the ideal place for him to have an unexpected debut at short notice. Could go either way, but couldn't draw many conclusions from that particular game, let's see what happens when they've had some coaching and know what's expected of them, rather than just being expensive foreign signings. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The9 Posted 18 September, 2012 Share Posted 18 September, 2012 The difference between what Neville said about us and Reading was vast. He said that our defensive shape was pretty good and had a bit of praise, whereas basically said Reading were a bit of a shambles. This suggest to me that Nigel does in fact know what he's doing, and sets us up right. It's just down to errors. Watching Neville last night highlighted how much these people know, compared to some of the "experts" we have on here. Most posters critical of our play always seem to exclude Clyne from critisism of the back 4 and keeper. Yet Neville blamed him for 2 goals. I guess it's about opinions because Fat Sam on Goals on Sunday blamed Lallana for not closing down Artetta for the third goal and Yoshi for stepping up, whereas Neville blamed Fonte's starting position and the gap between the 2 centre halves. What they both agreed on was that our shape was right. If our shape "right", then Nigel must be doing something right and maybe he does know a bit more than some give him credit for. To be fair to Clyne, Neville did say "at that level", presumably meaning Champions League level was how he was critiquing that Clyne made mistakes, and Neville himself said the criticism was "harsh". He also pointed out that his body shape was right in later attacks (though he had a pop for wafting his leg at the OG). I don't think Neville thought our shape was "right" for the 3rd goal, Fonte's positioning was what he was critical of and that wouldn't be symptomatic of good shape - on that occasion. But he was scathing about Reading's midfield (and Ian Harte and Gorkss as well) in comparison. Thanks for flagging up who provided the pass for the 3rd goal, I hadn't been looking at that bit but Lallana was certainly partially culpable, just as one of the two players tackling Podolski were partially to blame for the 1st for not staying goalside. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RedArmy Posted 19 September, 2012 Share Posted 19 September, 2012 I don't think getting Neville in to help would do much. Coaching isn't our problem, it's a lack of good defenders. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gambol2K9 Posted 19 September, 2012 Share Posted 19 September, 2012 What about the worrying statistics he mentioned? Ie that no promoted club has ever stayed up that has lost the first four games! And not just last season either. Those who thought are season started after the first four games are in denial twelve points lost is massive lose the next two and we are effectively gone. I know people will say its over reactionary but it's being realistic Look at Swansea's record. A bad start against tough teams does not dictate immediate relegation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Create an account or sign in to comment
You need to be a member in order to leave a comment
Create an account
Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!
Register a new accountSign in
Already have an account? Sign in here.
Sign In Now