This is serious. How close could Rickie be to an England call-up ???

[farawaysaint]

Don't have goals to starts, goals to minutes however is 2187/22 or a goal every 99 minutes (not bad at all.) In the last 3 years it's 8 goals in 461 minutes or a goal every 57 minutes which is phenomenal. [Apologies if the stats are incorrect but this is the greatest detail I could find.]

 

Ah, found something. Over his entire career 19 starts, 22 goals; over the last 3 years 5 starts and 8 goals.

[stu0x]

Lambert will likely never play for England. Even if he gets 20 this season, and Carroll gets 5, Carroll will get in the team over him. And if not Carroll then Defoe. And if not Defoe then Young or Gerrard shoehorned to the position.

 

There are simply too many 'proven' (ie been knocking about the PL for a while, even if unspectacularly) 'experienced' (ie play/played for a big club, even if without performing) players around for Rickie to get a call up. It's always been that way, and it always will be.

 

The only way it happens is for a meaningless friendly and a host of injuries to come along together, and he might get 45 minutes playing with a side full of also-rans and has-beens. And that will be it. I'd rather he was never selected than he played half a match against Finland with Bobby Zamora or Gabriel Agbonlahor for company.

[Noodles34]

I think thats right, i mean look at Kevin Davies, what a waste of time that was and he bet he is embarrased by it. Wouldnt want SRL to go through that, concentrate on the job in hand Rickie, Saints in the CL.

[Chez]

Unless the lad is in the squad to stay then I don't want him anywhere near it. I know you have to start somewhere, but a days training and 45 minutes is not enough to get the best out of Ricky. Also I seem to recall BT's confidence suffered massively after his England call up so I'm not sure I ever want to see him get the call.

[alpine_saint]

The last 3 posts are all valid comments.

 

Personally, I think the Venables / Hoddle f**king about of Matty had a detrimental effect on his performance during the later stages of his Saints career. And I certainly wouldnt want to see that for Rickie.

[Noodles34]

The last 3 posts are all valid comments.

 

Personally, I think the Venables / Hoddle f**king about of Matty had a detrimental effect on his performance during the later stages of his Saints career. And I certainly wouldnt want to see that for Rickie.

 

That is a good point actually, Matty was never the same after being left out of the 98 WC squad.

[tajjuk]

I think thats right, i mean look at Kevin Davies, what a waste of time that was and he bet he is embarrased by it. Wouldnt want SRL to go through that, concentrate on the job in hand Rickie, Saints in the CL.

 

I think that is frankly a ridiculous statement, playing for your country is a massive honour regardless of how many minutes you get. There is no way that Kevin Davies is anything other than proud to have been capped by his country.

 

Rickie would be no different, you only have to see the article in this thread, for a player who has worked his way up from the lower leagues to get ANY time in an England shirt would be massive honour for him. The MLT and Beattie situations were different, MLT was amongst the best players of his generation, the England team should have been built around him, he couldn't have done a lot more to be an England regular and it's no wonder he was miffed. Beattie just wasn't good enough, he had one 'hot' season in a team that was punching above it's weight.

 

The inclusion of the likes of Zamora and Davies, shows that this could be a possibility.

 

Also i don't know why anyone is bringing age into this, Defoe will be the same age as RL in a month. Also

 

Ashley Cole is 32.

 

Steven Gerrard is also 32.

 

John Terry is 32.

 

Lampard is 34.

 

Carrick is 31.

 

We don't have an abundance of players to be fussy over ages. A good point was also made in the earlier thread about Pirlo and Scholes. Older players can have massive impacts.

 

Possible England forwards from the top flight:-

 

Rooney (26) - 27 goals last year, 0 this year, injured.

Defoe (29) - 11 goals last year, 1 so far this year, not a regular for club.

Carroll (24) - 4 goals last year, 0 this year, injured.

Bent (28 ) - 9 goals last year, 0 this year,

Wellbeck (21) - 9 goals last year, O this year, not a regular for club (only 18 league goals ever)

Zamora (31) - 7 last year, 2 this year.

Crouch (31) - 10 last year, 1 this year.

Graham (27) - 12 last year, 1 this year.

Sturridge (23) - 11 last year, 0 this year, not a regular for club

Holt (31) - 15 last year. (injured?)

Walcott (23!) - 8 last year, 0 this year.

 

Have I missed anyone? Slim pickings there, not an abundance of youth either with quite a few that are very injury prone (bent).

[alpine_saint]

I think that is frankly a ridiculous statement, playing for your country is a massive honour regardless of how many minutes you get. There is no way that Kevin Davies is anything other than proud to have been capped by his country.

 

Rickie would be no different, you only have to see the article in this thread, for a player who has worked his way up from the lower leagues to get ANY time in an England shirt would be massive honour for him. The MLT and Beattie situations were different, MLT was amongst the best players of his generation, the England team should have been built around him, he couldn't have done a lot more to be an England regular and it's no wonder he was miffed. Beattie just wasn't good enough, he had one 'hot' season in a team that was punching above it's weight.

 

The inclusion of the likes of Zamora and Davies, shows that this could be a possibility.

 

Also i don't know why anyone is bringing age into this, Defoe will be the same age as RL in a month. Also

 

Ashley Cole is 32.

 

Steven Gerrard is also 32.

 

John Terry is 32.

 

Lampard is 34.

 

Carrick is 31.

 

We don't have an abundance of players to be fussy over ages. A good point was also made in the earlier thread about Pirlo and Scholes. Older players can have massive impacts.

 

Possible England forwards from the top flight:-

 

Rooney (26) - 27 goals last year, 0 this year, injured.

Defoe (29) - 11 goals last year, 1 so far this year, not a regular for club.

Carroll (24) - 4 goals last year, 0 this year, injured.

Bent (28 ) - 9 goals last year, 0 this year,

Wellbeck (21) - 9 goals last year, O this year, not a regular for club (only 18 league goals ever)

Zamora (31) - 7 last year, 2 this year.

Crouch (31) - 10 last year, 1 this year.

Graham (27) - 12 last year, 1 this year.

Sturridge (23) - 11 last year, 0 this year, not a regular for club

Holt (31) - 15 last year. (injured?)

Walcott (23!) - 8 last year, 0 this year.

 

Have I missed anyone? Slim pickings there, not an abundance of youth either with quite a few that are very injury prone (bent).

 

Well, you make a compelling argument I have to say. Pity Woy with his pathetic traditional big-club mentality wont see it that way.

Edited 7 September, 2012 by alpine_saint

[Noodles34]

I think that is frankly a ridiculous statement, playing for your country is a massive honour regardless of how many minutes you get. There is no way that Kevin Davies is anything other than proud to have been capped by his country.

 

Rickie would be no different, you only have to see the article in this thread, for a player who has worked his way up from the lower leagues to get ANY time in an England shirt would be massive honour for him. The MLT and Beattie situations were different, MLT was amongst the best players of his generation, the England team should have been built around him, he couldn't have done a lot more to be an England regular and it's no wonder he was miffed. Beattie just wasn't good enough, he had one 'hot' season in a team that was punching above it's weight.

 

The inclusion of the likes of Zamora and Davies, shows that this could be a possibility.

 

Also i don't know why anyone is bringing age into this, Defoe will be the same age as RL in a month. Also

 

Ashley Cole is 32.

 

Steven Gerrard is also 32.

 

John Terry is 32.

 

Lampard is 34.

 

Carrick is 31.

 

We don't have an abundance of players to be fussy over ages. A good point was also made in the earlier thread about Pirlo and Scholes. Older players can have massive impacts.

 

Possible England forwards from the top flight:-

 

Rooney (26) - 27 goals last year, 0 this year, injured.

Defoe (29) - 11 goals last year, 1 so far this year, not a regular for club.

Carroll (24) - 4 goals last year, 0 this year, injured.

Bent (28 ) - 9 goals last year, 0 this year,

Wellbeck (21) - 9 goals last year, O this year, not a regular for club (only 18 league goals ever)

Zamora (31) - 7 last year, 2 this year.

Crouch (31) - 10 last year, 1 this year.

Graham (27) - 12 last year, 1 this year.

Sturridge (23) - 11 last year, 0 this year, not a regular for club

Holt (31) - 15 last year. (injured?)

Walcott (23!) - 8 last year, 0 this year.

 

Have I missed anyone? Slim pickings there, not an abundance of youth either with quite a few that are very injury prone (bent).

 

embarrased may not have been the right word, granted. But I would still wonder if he thought it was really all worth it in the end.

You can quote players like Scholes and Pirlo, but they are not CF's, Defoe has been around the England team for years, as have all the rest you have quoted.

The point is age is a barrier if you haven't been proved at a high level.

[tajjuk]

embarrased may not have been the right word, granted. But I would still wonder if he thought it was really all worth it in the end.

You can quote players like Scholes and Pirlo, but they are not CF's, Defoe has been around the England team for years, as have all the rest you have quoted.

The point is age is a barrier if you haven't been proved at a high level.

 

Worth it? He got to play for England, some people would give their arm for that, it's hardly a chore and I can't see how it can in anyway be detrimental unless you got massively injured in your England appearance.

 

Zamora, If I'm correct he was 29 when he got capped in 2010, off the back of a scoring record of 8 goals in 27 games. His top flight record for Fulham is 20 goals in 91 appearances, before his first cap he had a 28 goals in 157 premier league games! Hardly 'proven' at the top level.

 

Defoe is also clearly not really wanted by any England manager, he is pretty much always a sub, pretty much always gets taken off when he starts, he;s not even valued that much by any premiership manager. It's just that we don't have many options.

 

BTW Kevin Davies was 33 and 200 days when he made his England debut.

[Cascadia Saint]

http://www.thesun.co.uk/sol/homepage/sport/football/4522911/England-can-rule-out-glory-if-they-have-only-3-main-hitmen.html

 

I would argue if he continues to get a few goals, it might not be long.

 

Yes! Finally I agree with alpine. Feck me!

[Cascadia Saint]

The last 3 posts are all valid comments.

 

Personally, I think the Venables / Hoddle f**king about of Matty had a detrimental effect on his performance during the later stages of his Saints career. And I certainly wouldnt want to see that for Rickie.

 

And that's two! Alpine mate, I'm buying a lottery ticket tonight, and if I win, I'm sending you a fiver.

[Dr Who?]

He is a long way off considering Holte banged in many goals last season and did not get a call up.

[westmidlandsaint]

A

He is a long way off considering Holte banged in many goals last season and did not get a call up.

 

I do tend to agree with you, however I honestly think Lambert is an allround better player than Holt. I think the have had similar paths ie lower league players quick success with Norwich/Saints but in my opinion Lambert has added more to his game than just being the big target man that Holt is, Lambert has got leaner and fitter too. If Lambert does get to say 10 prem goals by Christmas then he has to be considered especially with lack of options at present.

 

Interestingly I watched the football show on sky the other night and they were talking about how the influx of foreigners is now starting to have a real effect on the national team. Hoddle was a guest and he said when he was England manager he had club first team regulars like Shearer, Sherrngham, Sutton, Wright, Ferdinand, Fowler, Owen, Cole to choose from compared to Hodgson who yesterday had Defoe, Welbeck & Sturridge and the two latters aren't even regulars for their clubs, so why not play players like Lambert who are regulars....it seems over the past few years England managers hav picked fringe players at United, Chelsea, Liverpool & Arsenal because of the club more than the players abilities

 

All in my honest opinion of course

[Ewell]

Interestingly I watched the football show on sky the other night and they were talking about how the influx of foreigners is now starting to have a real effect on the national team. Hoddle was a guest and he said when he was England manager he had club first team regulars like Shearer, Sherrngham, Sutton, Wright, Ferdinand, Fowler, Owen, Cole to choose from compared to Hodgson who yesterday had Defoe, Welbeck & Sturridge and the two latters aren't even regulars for their clubs, so why not play players like Lambert who are regulars

 

It would be interesting to see if the England manager adopted a policy of only picking players based on their appearances in a clubs first team how many of these players would stay at a club warming the bench instead of pursuing the dream of playing for their country. It may take a while to filter through but I tend to believe most would want to be playing for their national team.

[Eastcowzer]

Vorderman?

 

no. Levis

[LostBoys]

I thought it was astonishing that Carrick Welbeck and slightly less so Cleverley were rubbish against us but still made the England side and then were rubbish again. Would SRL have converted the chances we missed against Moldova?

[theyin]

I'd be more inclined to go with this school of thought......

 

http://www.mirror.co.uk/sport/football/news/matt-law-column-no-matter-1302224

[lordswoodsaints]

I'd be more inclined to go with this school of thought......

 

http://www.mirror.co.uk/sport/football/news/matt-law-column-no-matter-1302224

 

This ^^

This has always been the case IMO and one of the reasons I show little interest in the england team and one of the reasons why the national team will never move forward.

I cannot see the logic of playing players who mostly sit on the bench for their clubs,or strikers who struggle to find the back of the net for long periods but still getting stupidly extended runs for England.

The whole setup stinks,it's like a tight knit gentlemans club riddled with snobbery and plenty of back slapping.

Fools.

[sentry]

While I love Lambert, not just for his goals, but his touch, passing and vision ( I think he has been quality ever since we had him and always knew he could do well at the top level), he now is 30 and therefore I think that stands against him more than anything. If he was carrolls age he should be picked ahead of him. People will compare him to Carroll but as most Saints fans know he plays more like Sheringham.

 

AS long as he plays for saints I dont really care who else he plays for although at least one cap for him would be nice.

[RobM]

The last 3 posts are all valid comments.

 

Personally, I think the Venables / Hoddle f**king about of Matty had a detrimental effect on his performance during the later stages of his Saints career. And I certainly wouldnt want to see that for Rickie.

 

I agree. I think RL for England would be a mistake, as you can bet England won't filter so much of their play through him like we do. That's when you get the best out of him, when he is an integral part of your build-up play. For England, they'd just stick him up front with Defoe and let him crack on with it.

 

He'd come back in a worse state than he left. I'd rather he was somebody we all wished and shouted and pleaded to have a chance for England as we love him so much, while secretly hoping it doesn't happen.

[Toadhall Saint]

This ^^

This has always been the case IMO and one of the reasons I show little interest in the england team and one of the reasons why the national team will never move forward.

I cannot see the logic of playing players who mostly sit on the bench for their clubs,or strikers who struggle to find the back of the net for long periods but still getting stupidly extended runs for England.

The whole setup stinks,it's like a tight knit gentlemans club riddled with snobbery and plenty of back slapping.

Fools.

 

Ditto.

[Crab Lungs]

I'd love Rickie/Adam/Clyne to be capped but I really, really don't want them surrounded by the current crop of kn0bheads...

[VectisSaint]

This ^^

This has always been the case IMO and one of the reasons I show little interest in the england team .

It hasn't always been the case, Mick Channon would not have captained England and won 46 caps if it was. It really started with the **** Ericsson and seemed to be backed up by the Beckham/Neville union who resisted certain players being included. Like you I have little or no interest in England partly as a result of this (and partly because international football is so utterly tedious for the most part). It would be nice one day for Rickie to be recognised with a cap or two, but I would not be too unhappy if he manages to avoid being dragged into the England circus, it doesn't seem to do anyone any good. Its ironic that the Mirror article mentions amongst others Swansea and Saints, two team that play the passing game, where touch is important, and yet England cannot play this way and their touch is awful (did not watch the "game" against the might Moldova so if they played one touch, pretty passing football I would have missed it, but I bet they didn't).

[PhilippineSaint]

As they scored 5 against Moldova the chances of Ricky getting near the team have slipped by quite a margin as Hodgson will always believe that the top 5 Prem teams should supply the players even if the main strikers are not available and this just goes to prove that they can score.

 

We all know that Blackfield and Langley could have scored 5 against Moldova but thats by the by.

[Toadhall Saint]

It hasn't always been the case, Mick Channon would not have captained England and won 46 caps if it was. It really started with the **** Ericsson and seemed to be backed up by the Beckham/Neville union who resisted certain players being included. Like you I have little or no interest in England partly as a result of this (and partly because international football is so utterly tedious for the most part). It would be nice one day for Rickie to be recognised with a cap or two, but I would not be too unhappy if he manages to avoid being dragged into the England circus, it doesn't seem to do anyone any good. Its ironic that the Mirror article mentions amongst others Swansea and Saints, two team that play the passing game, where touch is important, and yet England cannot play this way and their touch is awful (did not watch the "game" against the might Moldova so if they played one touch, pretty passing football I would have missed it, but I bet they didn't).

 

England's way of playing is based on huff and puff. How may times do you hear the same old rubbish that its all about anything other than actually being able to control a ball (you know that thing your trade is based on). I mean if your an electrician you need to be good with electrics, being good at getting to work won't stop you electrocuting yourself.

 

What makes the likes of Messi great? The fact that they have complete control over the ball no matter if they are standing still or running at pace. Some of the so called England internationals cannot even control a straight forward pass to them - try to trap it and it squirts about 6 feet away.

[Flyer]

I'd be more inclined to go with this school of thought......

 

http://www.mirror.co.uk/sport/football/news/matt-law-column-no-matter-1302224

 

Good article, youd have thought scoring for the smaller clubs would have been a lot harder than the big clubs so they should stand more of a chance of getting in. Its not as if they are playing against NPC sides.

 

Crouch has always been the price example. scores 1 in 2 yet not considered because apparently "he doesnt score against the big international sides" but how is he going to get a chance to prove that if he is never picked. Crouch should always at least be a sub for England.

[david in sweden]

If he plays for England, then that would just show how dire our international team choice is.

 

you maybe right, but if the half dozen before him are injured...then his number will come up.....let's hope that he does get a chance anyway.....

[david in sweden]

I'd love Rickie/Adam/Clyne to be capped but I really, really don't want them surrounded by the current crop of kn0bheads...[/QUOTE]

 

Ah, and thereby hangs a tale.

 

Giving a new guy a cap is one thing, but allowing him to get a kick....thats something else.

 

Best way to get rid of an " unwanted intruder " in the squad.....is to ignore him, and the" regulars " will obviously do that to keep their mates in....

[LostBoys]

He is certainly a better choice at the moment that the 'bambi on ice' Welbeck

[Dimond Geezer]

I'd love Rickie/Adam/Clyne to be capped but I really, really don't want them surrounded by the current crop of kn0bheads...[/QUOTE]

 

Ah, and thereby hangs a tale.

 

Giving a new guy a cap is one thing, but allowing him to get a kick....thats something else.

 

Best way to get rid of an " unwanted intruder " in the squad.....is to ignore him, and the" regulars " will obviously do that to keep their mates in....

 

Exactly what happened to Beattie. I doubt if the other players could look him in the eye after the match.

[S-Clarke]

He is certainly a better choice at the moment that the 'bambi on ice' Welbeck

 

Welbeck is a fine example of this country's obsession over players who run around a lot, but achieve very little.

 

He works hard, chases down lost causes, is quick. But actually doesn't do anything. He doesn't score enough, he doesn't create enough chances and he's not got the greatest of touches.

 

But who cares, he runs around alot. Welbeck for england!

[Noodles34]

I'd love Rickie/Adam/Clyne to be capped but I really, really don't want them surrounded by the current crop of kn0bheads...[/QUOTE]

 

Ah, and thereby hangs a tale.

 

Giving a new guy a cap is one thing, but allowing him to get a kick....thats something else.

 

Best way to get rid of an " unwanted intruder " in the squad.....is to ignore him, and the" regulars " will obviously do that to keep their mates in....

 

exactly what happened to Le tiss, said it so himself.

[Thedelldays]

Welbeck is a fine example of this country's obsession over players who run around a lot, but achieve very little.

 

He works hard, chases down lost causes, is quick. But actually doesn't do anything. He doesn't score enough, he doesn't create enough chances and he's not got the greatest of touches.

 

But who cares, he runs around alot. Welbeck for england!

 

Agree about welbeck.. I just don't get the hype... Same with cleverly... Same with Phil Jones..

 

I just love the way journos claim without hesitation that Jones will skipper England one day.

 

Why the fuk for?