JustMike Posted 20 August, 2012 Share Posted 20 August, 2012 Preben Walle @Ohpebbles "Bologna make me feel like a prisoner. I want to play for a club that competes for European trophies." -Gaston Ramirez, now at Southampton. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Suhari Posted 20 August, 2012 Share Posted 20 August, 2012 has he signed yet? In first? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
S-Clarke Posted 20 August, 2012 Share Posted 20 August, 2012 Preben Walle @Ohpebbles "Bologna make me feel like a prisoner. I want to play for a club that competes for European trophies." -Gaston Ramirez, now at Southampton. We're not quite competing...just yet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
St.Patrik Posted 20 August, 2012 Share Posted 20 August, 2012 Europeah Trophies - bloody hell someone is sweet talking Saints at the mo - love it !! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saint Garrett Posted 20 August, 2012 Share Posted 20 August, 2012 Preben Walle @Ohpebbles "Bologna make me feel like a prisoner. I want to play for a club that competes for European trophies." -Gaston Ramirez, now at Southampton. Who is Preben Walle? And very encouraging that it says 'now at Southampton' Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saint Without a Halo Posted 20 August, 2012 Share Posted 20 August, 2012 Can I just strike a note of concern here? Seems that this transfer looks like it will happen based on tweets/Italian articles above. But there are two possible sticking points. 1. The % owed to Penarol and how this is handled, but more worryingly: 2. Whether we pay in installments or cash up front. If we don't have the ability to pay upfront, I'm a tad concerned about our finances.[/QUOTE] I think the majority of transfers even by the big clubs are based on instalments nowadays. Even Real paid for Ronaldo in instalments. I think the cost of the % owned by Penarol is more worrying though. Theres nothing to say that they have to sell their 30% at the same ratio Bologna are selling their 70% so will be interesting to see how much we eventually end up paying for him. Errr Cortese is an International Banker If he doesnt know how to finance a European deal then no one does! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
S-Clarke Posted 20 August, 2012 Share Posted 20 August, 2012 Mina Rzouki: "Bologna, Southampton, Penarol and the agents are working on a deal right now to send Ramirez to EPL. What a coup if this does happen." Mina Rdouki is a Mirror columnist on Italian football, football writer, BBC Sportsworld radio pundit and @sportstonighttv European Football correspondant. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Minty Posted 20 August, 2012 Share Posted 20 August, 2012 I think there was a bit of sarcasm in that tweet... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JustMike Posted 20 August, 2012 Share Posted 20 August, 2012 Who is Preben Walle? And very encouraging that it says 'now at Southampton' No idea lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Minty Posted 20 August, 2012 Share Posted 20 August, 2012 Who is Preben Walle? And very encouraging that it says 'now at Southampton' A Man U fan who runs 7cantonas.com ... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maggie May Posted 20 August, 2012 Share Posted 20 August, 2012 Preben Walle @Ohpebbles "Bologna make me feel like a prisoner. I want to play for a club that competes for European trophies." -Gaston Ramirez, now at Southampton. No he doesn't. He wants to play for a club who can bolster his bank balance. If this does happen, and I sincerely hope it does (intent yada yada etc), he'll be soon off once it's clear we're not challenging for honours. Clearly he's not stupid. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Webby Posted 20 August, 2012 Share Posted 20 August, 2012 Christ these co ownership deals are tricky... http://www.google.co.uk/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=italian%20football%20dual%20ownership&source=web&cd=2&ved=0CGQQFjAB&url=http%3A%2F%2Fjuventiknows.com%2Fco-ownership-in-italian-football-explanations-examples%2F&ei=ECAyUN2TEOLB0gWFuYCADQ&usg=AFQjCNFStWWJiXo_UCNWW9MmVCwzhfKcAg Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matthew Le God Posted 20 August, 2012 Share Posted 20 August, 2012 No he doesn't. He wants to play for a club who can bolster his bank balance. If this does happen, and I sincerely hope it does (intent yada yada etc), he'll be soon off once it's clear we're not challenging for honours. Clearly he's not stupid. I think he is being refreshingly honest. Most footballers are in it for the money, nice to hear one actually admit it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dig Dig Posted 20 August, 2012 Share Posted 20 August, 2012 No he doesn't. He wants to play for a club who can bolster his bank balance. If this does happen, and I sincerely hope it does (intent yada yada etc), he'll be soon off once it's clear we're not challenging for honours. Clearly he's not stupid. Don't underestimate the power of the season ticket DVD. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saint Without a Halo Posted 20 August, 2012 Share Posted 20 August, 2012 I really don't see how it can be a different ratio cos then it's not 30% is it? That would be farcical. I guess Bologna set e fee as they have the majority share but probably have to clear that with Penarol just to see if they're happy with that. I really don't get this dual ownership though. As I said before, do Penarol pay 30% of his wages? What do they get for owning 30% of him? If they get nothing until his sale, then why not just make it a sell on %? A sell on clause means you leave all the negotating to the owner and get 30% of what they agree Owning a 30% share is very different if for instance there were 100 shares then you can agree to buy the 70 shares owned by Bologna at a price per share of say £10 but would still need a separate deal with Penerol for their 30 shares and they may only sell theirs at £15 a share (thay may seek a higher or lower price per share) We may of course be able to buy them out based on some money now and sell off clause going forward. So quite a complicated deal to negotiate more so if you add in the agents fees that bologna want us to pay as they want there 15m Euros nett. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SaintBobby Posted 20 August, 2012 Share Posted 20 August, 2012 We've already shelled out around £10m on players so far. Ram would take it to about £25m, Phillips £31m, two CBs maybe £40m, a LB £45m? That is a lot of money to be paying out before the season has even begun. It's like buying your first house, you don't walk into an estate agents with £200,000 in a briefcase. We are probably trying to spread some of the payments out so they coincide with TV payments and gate revenue. Fair enough. I claim no expertise in this area. But I'd think the rich probably do buy their houses outright rather than over a period of 3, 5, 25 years or whatever. I accept that installments are the norm - but this smells to me like football living on tick. If the thinking is "we are spending our whole transfer budget for the next 3 years now, so let's spread the payments over 3 years" I get it though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Millbrook Saint Posted 20 August, 2012 Share Posted 20 August, 2012 I really don't get this dual ownership though. As I said before, do Penarol pay 30% of his wages? What do they get for owning 30% of him? If they get nothing until his sale, then why not just make it a sell on %? Seems to me it is another way of selling a player with a 30% sell no clause. Why they call it dual ownership though I have no idea, maybe it's a way of keeping the 30% seperate from the sell on clause. So Bologna can say we want £15mil for the player and then leaving the sell on clause between us and Penarol to sort out, the sell on caluse could then in theory be transferred with the player, meaning if we sell him for £50mil further down the line they'd be entitled to 30% of that, unless of course the sell on caluse got transferred with the player again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VectisSaint Posted 20 August, 2012 Share Posted 20 August, 2012 I really don't see how it can be a different ratio cos then it's not 30% is it? That would be farcical. I guess Bologna set e fee as they have the majority share but probably have to clear that with Penarol just to see if they're happy with that. I really don't get this dual ownership though. As I said before, do Penarol pay 30% of his wages? What do they get for owning 30% of him? If they get nothing until his sale, then why not just make it a sell on %? If they are part owners, then they have a say in how much the fee will be, i.e. they negotiate what the 30% is part of, Blogna cannot decie a fee in isolation. If its just a sell-on clause they just get what they are given. Very different. I suspect they also pay some of his wages so that aloso bear some of the risk of ownership. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ollysaints1 Posted 20 August, 2012 Share Posted 20 August, 2012 Dont think people should be to worried about whether we have the money or not, if we dont actually have it in cash at the moment we certainly will by the end of the season. Remember our promotion is worth around £60,000,000 even if we go down Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VectisSaint Posted 20 August, 2012 Share Posted 20 August, 2012 Mina Rzouki: "Bologna, Southampton, Penarol and the agents are working on a deal right now to send Ramirez to EPL. What a coup if this does happen." Mina Rdouki is a Mirror columnist on Italian football, football writer, BBC Sportsworld radio pundit and @sportstonighttv European Football correspondant. So to be consistent with yesterday's comments about Sky (Brian Woolnough), this guy is probably also a 3rd rate hack who knows nothing. Then again he may be ITK. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kelkel31 Posted 20 August, 2012 Share Posted 20 August, 2012 am i not reading what he said wrong. everyone is going on that we offered him 'so much money' when what i thought i read was something like 'so much money for my family'. puts a diiferent context on it as it then becomes relative to his background and that he is saying that i would secure his family for life by signing this contract. yes we are going him a lot of money, more than has ever been seen at this club before but i dont think its going to be in the 50k - 80k per week range and will not be causing finacial problems to the club. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colinjb Posted 20 August, 2012 Share Posted 20 August, 2012 Match of the Day 3. They are discussing the top ten potential transfers before the window shuts. Gaston Ramirez is on there. Mark lawrenson's immediate reaction after Colin Murray mentions how he would love the transfer to come off, a very direct 'He won't be going to Southampton.' Purely his opinion, and he is entitled to it, not particularly endeering though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saint Garrett Posted 20 August, 2012 Share Posted 20 August, 2012 Match of the Day 3. They are discussing the top ten potential transfers before the window shuts. Gaston Ramirez is on there. Mark lawrenson's immediate reaction after Colin Murray mentions how he would love the transfer to come off, a very direct 'He won't be going to Southampton.' Purely his opinion, and he is entitled to it, not particularly endeering though. Saw that this morning, he's such a budgie. I read this morning it will be 4 year deal worth 10m euros. That works out at about £38k/week (unless I've done the calculations wrong ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SuperSAINT Posted 20 August, 2012 Share Posted 20 August, 2012 Match of the Day 3. They are discussing the top ten potential transfers before the window shuts. Gaston Ramirez is on there. Mark lawrenson's immediate reaction after Colin Murray mentions how he would love the transfer to come off, a very direct 'He won't be going to Southampton.' Purely his opinion, and he is entitled to it, not particularly endeering though. He's Liverpool through & through. They'll never believe a potential target of there's will go to Saints. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thedelldays Posted 20 August, 2012 Share Posted 20 August, 2012 Lawro is such a dinosaur Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Boy Saint Posted 20 August, 2012 Share Posted 20 August, 2012 Dont think people should be to worried about whether we have the money or not, if we dont actually have it in cash at the moment we certainly will by the end of the season. Remember our promotion is worth around £60,000,000 even if we go down Add to this we don't have the noose of a £32m Mortgage for the stadium hanging round our necks sucking funds from the club, plus I thought when ML & NC came in a comment that debt was frowned upon was made. There was also a rumour picked up somewhere that when NC was playing hardball on the Oxo deal, one proviso was that they paid "cash" no installments for the headline fee. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ken Tone Posted 20 August, 2012 Share Posted 20 August, 2012 Match of the Day 3. They are discussing the top ten potential transfers before the window shuts. Gaston Ramirez is on there. Mark lawrenson's immediate reaction after Colin Murray mentions how he would love the transfer to come off, a very direct 'He won't be going to Southampton.' Purely his opinion, and he is entitled to it, not particularly endeering though. It really is time they got some fresh young faces into match of the day. Hansen, Lawrenson etc are like parodies of themselves now. You can predict what they are going to say before they open their mouths. As to bringing Redknapp into it. ... are the BBC trying to lower the audience figures? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bearsy Posted 20 August, 2012 Share Posted 20 August, 2012 I quite like Lawrenson. I like it when he's co-commentater on 5Live and Alan Green says something dumb and you can hear Lawrenson LOLing in the background. I also like it on Football Focus when he says "merment". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saint Charlie Posted 20 August, 2012 Share Posted 20 August, 2012 If it goes through we should fax him a copy of the transfer papers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stu0x Posted 20 August, 2012 Share Posted 20 August, 2012 Fair enough. I claim no expertise in this area. But I'd think the rich probably do buy their houses outright rather than over a period of 3, 5, 25 years or whatever. I accept that installments are the norm - but this smells to me like football living on tick. If the thinking is "we are spending our whole transfer budget for the next 3 years now, so let's spread the payments over 3 years" I get it though. I remember listening to an interview on Five Live with Niall Quinn, when Bent went to Villa. The interviewer (I think Gary Richardson) asked him about the well-worn issue/assumption of, once you sell a player for big money, do your own transfer targets suddenly become more expensive, as the selling club knows you now have cash? His reply was absolutely unequivocal. He said that, for the overwhelming majority of transfers, the payment of the transfer fee is paid in 3 stages. 25% up front, 25% in year 2, and the remaining 50% in year 3. This is regardless of the club and their financial situation, and is down to how the value of players as an asset is calculated. It is standard practice. We, as fans, massively simplify football finances. We think it's as simple as adding together or subtracting headline figures and getting an absolute. In truth, it is far more complicated than that. For instance, supporters think that buying a player for 10mill and selling him for 8mill 3 years later is a loss, when in fact it's a considerable profit due to the effects of amortisation. Case in point - look at the 'story' made out of the *huge* wages we are apparently offering Ramirez - 35,000 after tax! Football players' wages are always net, not gross. It's just conveniently ignored/forgotten by the industry to prevent the real story coming out, ie 1) footballers are even more over paid than we thought, and 2) they dodge tax just as much as those nasty bankers and celebrities. Anyway, the long and short of it is, paying in installments is absolutely standard, and is in no way a negative indicator of our finances. I suspect the noise being made by bologna is more reflective of the perilous nature of *their* finances and of calcio in general, and of the need to turn losing their best player into a PR success instead of disaster. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
S-Clarke Posted 20 August, 2012 Share Posted 20 August, 2012 Lawro is going to look pretty silly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saint Garrett Posted 20 August, 2012 Share Posted 20 August, 2012 Lawro calling Silva's penalty last night 'minging'.....made me lol. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stattmeister Posted 20 August, 2012 Share Posted 20 August, 2012 It really is time they got some fresh young faces into match of the day. Hansen, Lawrenson etc are like parodies of themselves now. You can predict what they are going to say before they open their mouths. As to bringing Redknapp into it. ... are the BBC trying to lower the audience figures? Agreed - even Robbie Savage on 5Live yesterday added value - he was talking through the physio's action with Aguero and explaining that was a test for the cruciate ligament injury.... the Lawro brigade is just tiresome and the format needs some new vitality; disappointing following the beeb's decent coverage of the Olympics... it's all a bit old boys brigade and therefore tiresome! Back to Ramirez, here's hoping. The lad uploaded a pic of himself on his official twitter yesterday with him in the crowd at the Varese game - I assume to appease fans/board etc that he is not being disrespectful. Clearly someone's had a word in his ear...? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mulletsaint Posted 20 August, 2012 Share Posted 20 August, 2012 Match of the Day 3. They are discussing the top ten potential transfers before the window shuts. Gaston Ramirez is on there. Mark lawrenson's immediate reaction after Colin Murray mentions how he would love the transfer to come off, a very direct 'He won't be going to Southampton.' Purely his opinion, and he is entitled to it, not particularly endeering though. Or maybe with his Liverpool connections he knows something we don't. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colinjb Posted 20 August, 2012 Share Posted 20 August, 2012 Or maybe with his Liverpool connections he knows something we don't. Considering the speculative tone of the rest of the conversation, I doubt it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SaintRichmond Posted 20 August, 2012 Share Posted 20 August, 2012 If it goes through we should fax him a copy of the transfer papers. IF He would not have said it without insider info IMHO Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
S-Clarke Posted 20 August, 2012 Share Posted 20 August, 2012 IF He would not have said it without insider info IMHO lol, nah he just spouts random crap all the time to be fair. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Appy Posted 20 August, 2012 Share Posted 20 August, 2012 IF He would not have said it without insider info IMHO I really can't imagine he has much insider info at Liverpool these days. Not since Kenny left anyway. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saint Charlie Posted 20 August, 2012 Share Posted 20 August, 2012 (edited) lol, nah he just spouts random crap all the time to be fair. He also didnt think De Rossi would improve Man City... Nixon on Twitter says he has heard from two good sources that Saints are very confident on Ramirez...also said he has a story about another target in the Mirror Onlien tonight. Edited 20 August, 2012 by Saint Charlie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prince Jazzbo Posted 20 August, 2012 Share Posted 20 August, 2012 Or maybe with his Liverpool connections he knows something we don't. Has he still got any? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
S-Clarke Posted 20 August, 2012 Share Posted 20 August, 2012 He also didnt think De Rossi would improve Man City... Nixon on Twitter says he has heard from two good sources that Saints are very confident on Ramirez...also said he has a stroy about another target in the Mirror Onlien tonight. Yep, add that to everything else and it's pretty concrete. I thought this was a good laugh a week or so ago, but I was surprised when I was told on Thursday at how serious our intent was - this is apparently our number 1 target, and Cortese has been trying for the last 18 months to secure a major signing for this club. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mulletsaint Posted 20 August, 2012 Share Posted 20 August, 2012 Has he still got any? Who knows, just a point. I guess we'll find out sooner rather than later if this is a go'er or not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
S-Clarke Posted 20 August, 2012 Share Posted 20 August, 2012 Who knows, just a point. I guess we'll find out sooner rather than later if this is a go'er or not. It's a go'er, don't worry about that. We just need to get it over the line now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saint Scott Posted 20 August, 2012 Share Posted 20 August, 2012 He also didnt think De Rossi would improve Man City... Nixon on Twitter says he has heard from two good sources that Saints are very confident on Ramirez...also said he has a story about another target in the Mirror Onlien tonight. Sky Sports are linking us with Biglia, imagine its him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saint Charlie Posted 20 August, 2012 Share Posted 20 August, 2012 (edited) Sky Sports are linking us with Biglia, imagine its him. Could tell he was class for Anderlect against us. Don't think we overly need any other central midfielders but couldn't say no to this guy. EDIT: We might have asked about him but he will only leave for a team in Europe: http://www1.skysports.com/football/news/11661/8005625/Biglia-wants-bigger-club Edited 20 August, 2012 by Saint Charlie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
supersonic Posted 20 August, 2012 Share Posted 20 August, 2012 Could tell he was class for Anderlect against us. Don't think we overly need any other central midfielders but couldn't say no to this guy. Hammond is nowhere near good enough for this league, and depending on how bad Cork's injury is, that still leaves us Davis/Schneiderlin/Chaplow(seems out of favour)/JWP(only 17) I agree a CM isn't priority, but Biglia is a class above what we already have. Plus I believe he can fill in a CB if needed (As can Cork) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matthew Le God Posted 20 August, 2012 Share Posted 20 August, 2012 Hammond is nowhere near good enough for this league, and depending on how bad Cork's injury is, that still leaves us Davis/Schneiderlin/Chaplow(seems out of favour)/JWP(only 17) Lallana is being used in central midfield and Cork will be back soon. Central midfielders aren't what we need with Lallana, Davis, Schneiderlin, Cork and Ward-Prowse. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shurlock Posted 20 August, 2012 Share Posted 20 August, 2012 Lallana is being used in central midfield and Cork will be back soon. Central midfielders aren't what we need with Lallana, Davis, Schneiderlin, Cork and Ward-Prowse. Lallana isn't being played as a CM though - where did you get that idea from? He's playing 'in the hole' - v.different from Morgan, Cork, JWP and Davis who have greater defensive responsibilities. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mulletsaint Posted 20 August, 2012 Share Posted 20 August, 2012 It's a go'er, don't worry about that. We just need to get it over the line now. I'm not worried, it looks like a great signing but I wouldn't lose sleep if we failed with it. All the whispers seem promising but I for one won't believe it's definite until it's announced by the club and Bologna and Penarol. As I said before Buttner was reported in the press as a done deal and it wasn't. The way football is these days I wouldn't put it past a player like Ramirez making the wages we have offered public to let his other suitors know what he'll be happy with should they fancy coming back in with another offer. Some managers and chairmen can be so knee jerk with their signings. That's why I was gutted Liverpool started the season so badly. I am half expecting a late bid from them. Suarez obviously wants his mate there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mulletsaint Posted 20 August, 2012 Share Posted 20 August, 2012 Lallana isn't being played as a CM though - where did you get that idea from? He's playing 'in the hole' - v.different from Morgan, Cork, JWP and Davis who have greater defensive responsibilities. Unfortunately for much of yesterday's match the 'hole' seemed to be situated in CM. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Create an account or sign in to comment
You need to be a member in order to leave a comment
Create an account
Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!
Register a new accountSign in
Already have an account? Sign in here.
Sign In Now