Saints 0 Udinese 4

[ALWAYS_SFC]

Guly bashing has starter again then? I didn't think he was that bad, plus he only had about 15 mins in the pitch. Udinese played at a high tempo so would have been difficult for even the best players in the world to come on an make an impression. At the end of the day the WHOLE TEAM were not good enough! I don't understand why individuals on here must insist on singling out certain players because of hatred.

 

 

It has NOTHING to do with how he plays at all, it is all down to their previous stance about him being supposedly crap

and they are not man enough to admit being wrong even occasionally...bit pathetic tbh...

[Elmore]

We had a lot of possession (60%?) but were very slow in moving the ball forward and the passing in the final third was dire. We were given a lesson in finishing by Di Natale who clearly had not been told it was a friendly. Udinese showed pace power and control which we did not. Well worth £20 if only to watch Di Natale.

 

And Willians, and their number 27. In fact almost every one of their players was class. I looked up Di Natale on Wiki and he is 34 now, but he looked one of the fittest players on the pitch. How much would he have been worth when he was 27 I wonder?

[up and away]

Originally Posted by shurlock

 

That will happen with the current formation - its expected to double up as a 4-5-1 when we're not in possession -sensible enough as we can't go gung-ho in the prem. But its very hard not leave the striker isolated unless the wide men can get up quickly and support him. In theory, Lallana should be able to support Lambert but I think he's confused by his mix of responsibilities in the current set-up.

 

We don't have the players to play the 4-5-1 (or variations of it). Rodrigues is being wasted in his current role, that's been apparent throughout pre-season, so I'm not sure why we've continued to persist with using him out there. Adkins in all his recent interviews has made a big play about new formations, being flexible etc, but if anything we haven't tried enough different approaches/line ups etc and keep using the same system that hasn't really worked too well.

 

I don't think we have the perfect selection of players for 451 either, but it would help significantly if we picked the best players for that system to get something from the system.The 442 we were playing last season had all it's limitations exposed then.

Originally Posted by captainchris

I think you are forgetting that we played very ordinary football for the second half of last season and were often outplayed in midfield. This symptom would have been further exposed in the premier league - we had to change it. However we are playing this system of one up front without the energy or commitment to run for your life to support the lone striker when we have the ball. Without this total commitment the new system cannot work.......Of course we also need pace but how committed are we to put the energy into the system, this is my question.

 

We can go back to playing the 442 of last season and have a Blackpool type of effect where some some extraordinary results will be ground down to mediocrity. For 451 to work we would have to adopt the system as England did in the Euros, The optimum set up throughout most of the game against top sides, getting more adventurous when we have the opportunity to push our weight around. Like England the more we expose ourselves with attacking play, the greater the risk becomes. Like England, we just do not have the players. Playing 451 against top teams we have to have the right players in the right positions. That means players that can defend effectively and get forward with as much pace as we can deliver.

 

I know exactly what I can expect from last seasons 442 and that is definitely not good enough. I've seen the problems we are having with 451 but that looked doomed from the start with the players selected and their positions. Build the team up with players in positions that stand a chance of doing what is required and if that means no Lambert or one from Lallana and JRod, so be it. What we really need is a blinding injection of pace that would only come from a quality loan. Splash the boat out and bugger the wage structure for that one player who would make a difference. You never know, even those you had temporarily written off previously come back into the playing equation.

[derry]

I know one thing: I prefer DeRidder's erratic delivery and pace to no delivery or pace.

[kpturner]

but na loves i`m waste of space!

Pardon?

[captainchris]

This ad. appeared as I read the thread. Appropriate?

 

Bedwetting Problems

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Udinese very impressive -pace, power, commitment. Two superb strikes and clinical finishing. Having said that we didn't play badly and held our own for much of the game. However we didn't create much despite some neat build-up play.

 

I was impressed by Clyne and thought his partnership with Puncheon worked well. Our left hand side (Fox and Rodriguez) didn't work at all - Fox constantly looking for cross-field passes rather than playing the ball down the left. During one break Rodriguez seemed to be making the point to Fox who did then play more balls down the left but to little effect - often his passes were misplaced or to a player under pressure. Why SFC would spend all that money on a player (Rodriguez) and then play him in a position where his abilities seem to be wasted is puzzling. Ward-Prowse caught the eye - he played with much energy and obviously has a bright future. We looked better in the second half - I was impressed by the pace of Shaw who on one occasion outsprinted di Natale over 30 yards - and di Natale is quick. Puzzled by earlier disparaging comments about Guly - personally I thought he played well particularly when he briefly appeared at inside left! Sharp looked more effective than Lambert; displayed greater mobility and tenacity. And all those requests for new centre backs? I thought Jos and José both played pretty well.

 

In summary I think there are many question that remain unanswered. Were Saints playing flat out? Are we really going to use Rodriguez as a left wing? Is our midfield going to track back more effectively than they did last night? And (this is conjecture, not criticism) has Nigel adequate awareness of the quality we'll be facing this season and how to deal with it? And is he a fast learner?

 

Your point about Fox is a good and one and has been glaring ever since he arrived. Fox does not play Lallana in either when he was playing on the left!. My question is why haven't the coaches picked up on this???? Why is Fox consistently allowed to cut inside and pass across field thereby breaking up the attack and cutting out the left hand side. It really is poor that our coaches are not picking up on basics. As for defending the 20 - 25 yard line, well we don't want to go there do we....Come on you coaches lets see if you are up to it - give us some real analysis of the personal performances and your strategies - we keep being told you have the tools however I am not convinced we have the coaches to correct the issues....

[Frank's cousin]

...beaten by CL side of qaulity players - shock horror!

 

... Oh no, it exposes our aspirations as rubbish?

 

Well, we have a long term aim to be able to compete at that level - did anyone expect that yesterday? really? Or was this a good measure of where we are and how long/far that journey is going to be?

 

Surely the whole reason we enjoy football and comeback time and again is that a club ahs ambition and you enjoy the journey?

 

we will get exposed and beaten on many an occasion - what is more importamt is the experience and learnings we get from it and what this adds to our play.

 

I dont think its a case of bed wetters v doom and gloom merchants (although this board seems 'dominated' by both extremes) but more a case of those that expect it NOW! v those that think the clubs aspiration is naive and impossible.

 

Having said that, IMHO the only thing that is impossible is to accurately predict how long it will be to realise the aspirations - whether some have the stomach for the inevitable ups and downs along the way is more easy to predict, as there are those for whom failure seems desirable to satisfy their 'I told you so' ego/or at extremes stick the knife in to those trying to build something. Mistakes ..big mistakes will be made by those at the club - decisions will go wrong - part of feckin life when you are learning and challenging yourselves and stretching your abilities, but either you TRY or throw in the towel and be satisfied with mediocrity - choice is yours I guess, but I reckon following a side that is determined to 'over achieve' is more fun than watching one happy will mediocrity or frightened of failure.

[Bentley]

 

Video of the goals here

[The Kraken]

Frank, I've read that twice and apart from it sounding like a complete rant I'm not sure I undertsand what you're getting at.

 

What "told you so" ego are you talking about? Surely the vast majority of posters on here agree with Nigel Adkins that we need to bring in a centre back or two and inject some pace into the side with a winger, such as Phillips? And that the team will struggle in the Premier League without those additions. Would that be afair assumption to make? If so, as I believe its a fair representation, where is the "told you so" line, if the majority of people agree?

[S-Clarke]

 

Video of the goals here

 

The 2 first goals were hit with such quality. Unlucky to get hit with 2 of that quality in any game.

 

We could have done better with the 3rd and 4th's though, the 4th was the worst.

[Turkish]

 

Video of the goals here

 

Two great strikes for the first two but no one closing them down, Hooliveld caught ball watching for the third and christ knows what they were doing for the 4th.

[Saint_clark]

What at ?? On NA's "formations" that are blatantly obvious to most absolute garbage ??

 

NA's "use" of JayRod is a prime example of wasting a talent. I'm surprised he hasn't played DeRidder in goal

 

The only chance we have against Man City is if they havn't stopped laughing

 

And so the season hasn't even started and people are turning on Adkins, amazing. Absolute garbage, are they? Tell that to Man City who won the league playing it.

 

What's the lowest points tally reached at the end of a premiership season?

 

Might be worth a wager.

 

Don't be absurd.

[S-Clarke]

And so the season hasn't even started and people are turning on Adkins, amazing. Absolute garbage, are they? Tell that to Man City who won the league playing it.

 

 

 

Don't be absurd.

 

It was always going to be the case, it's all we will have now as certain posters will not be able to change their mindset from winning every week.

[Frank's cousin]

Frank, I've read that twice and apart from it sounding like a complete rant I'm not sure I undertsand what you're getting at.

 

What "told you so" ego are you talking about? Surely the vast majority of posters on here agree with Nigel Adkins that we need to bring in a centre back or two and inject some pace into the side with a winger, such as Phillips? And that the team will struggle in the Premier League without those additions. Would that be afair assumption to make? If so, as I believe its a fair representation, where is the "told you so" line, if the majority of people agree?

 

No rant, just an observation based on the repetitive stance of those at the extremes of both sides of what one or two results mean

[The Kraken]

No rant' date=' just an observation based on the repetitive stance of those at the extremes of both sides of what one or two results mean[/quote']

 

Again, what stance? I don't get the "I told you so" argument. "I told you so" what? Pretty much everyone agrees with the manager that we need to strengthen the team, don't they?

[Frank's cousin]

It was always going to be the case, it's all we will have now as certain posters will not be able to change their mindset from winning every week.

 

Thankfullly the majority of fans (not necessarily the majority of posters on here which is a bit of an 'odd' sample) will appreciate that the step up will mean getting used to fighting for every point and being happy with one away at the likes of Wigan. There are many for whom NCs 'vision' is a naive exercise in 'dreaming the impossible', for others a 'statement of intent', but suspect the majority are just glad we have a chairman who is prepared to make statement of aspiration, even if the road to such heights will be littered with dissapointments along the way.

 

We are on the cusp of a prem season, for the first time in 7 years - we have shown faith in thsoe that got us there and added a few young players with potential - we are experimenting with formations and ideal roles - and we were happy to run against better quality rather than stick 4 past a non league in effort to boost confidence but nothing else. For me we should be excited, nervous but in a positive way and looking forward to it. If we find we are not good enough, so be it, we try again, and again, and again -until we get it right (and as long as the funding is in place to support it), but we dont throw the towel in - ever - or we might a swell do what so many others are happy to do and support who ever is at the top - to avoid disspointment, if we cant handle it.

[Frank's cousin]

Again, what stance? I don't get the "I told you so" argument. "I told you so" what? Pretty much everyone agrees with the manager that we need to strengthen the team, don't they?

 

Kracken, I am sure you know exactly what I mean and who I am talking about - unless you dont actually read alot the threads that is.

[The Kraken]

OK, you still haven't answered my question about the "I told you so" part and that's after a few efforts, so perhaps best we leave it.

[The Kraken]

Kracken' date=' I am sure you know exactly what I mean and who I am talking about - unless you dont actually read alot the threads that is.[/quote']

 

I genuinely don't get what you mean by "I told you so". I cannot think how anyone could potentially come back and say (if we don't strengthen at CB and at RM) "see, I told you we should have got more players". Everyone knows it.

[S-Clarke]

Can't see that anyone has actually mentioned it, but Tadanari Lee was training with the lads at HT - looked very mobile, he wasn't a named substitute though so I guess the plan was to just ease him back into situations like this - but he looks like he's back in training anyway.

[Saint Charlie]

Can't see that anyone has actually mentioned it, but Tadanari Lee was training with the lads at HT - looked very mobile, he wasn't a named substitute though so I guess the plan was to just ease him back into situations like this - but he looks like he's back in training anyway.

 

Good news.

[Saints foreva]

No surprise to see Davis be beaten from range, he really is poor at long range shots. Didn't help that no one closed the two down though.

 

That will probably be the side that starts vs City. They really are going to embarrass us on Sky Sports.

[Clifford Nelson]

The difference between 4-4-2 and 4-3-3 isn't in the numbers, but in the flexibility. NA found quickly that nearly the only thing he could do was to shunt the two CMs into a diamond or not. With a basic 4-3-3 you can play a large number of ways without having to change formation. If we believe that highly paid, professional players with the ambition to play in the PL finds this too difficult the answer is not in the system.

 

Yesterday I found the difference laid in the speed Udinese changed from defense to attack or from right to left, etc. In comparison we often looked plodding. They also seldom mislaid a pass, which we too frequently do. Their thinking and reactions seemed to be that half- or quarter second faster than us.

 

As for the players I'm stuck with some niggles: Why did Lallana see so little of the ball in the first half. Players like him needs to be used and needs to be given the ball. Puncheon is still showing what was my major worry from the beginning, i.e. the lack of end product. How many crosses did he actually get in? And when he shot it was rather feeble. Chaplow, so admirable in his high work rate, cannot pass and shoot and therefore needs to be used as a simple breaker-upper of the game.Win the ball and give it to Lallana could be a good and simple rule to play to. Let's give up on the idea of being a wide man.

 

Our biggest challenge to any system is our strikers. I think we need to consider playing Lambert at no 10 with maybe Sharp in front of him. He is much more effective in that position, maybe because he started life as a midfielder. The 10 position is crucial to success and apart from Lambert I can only really see Guly in that role. Lallana wants to do to much, and middle of the park in the front third isn't the place to do it. You need to control the ball and move it fast and accurate as a play maker, so why not play Lambert there. The Swedes played Ibrahimovich there, and he is as much a striker as Lambert.

[CanadaSaint]

Well, the clip of the goals was quite revealing.

 

All four originated down our right, where we seemed to struggle with the defensive midfield role.

 

Two areas in which we could learn a lesson are these. Udinese are very quick to move the ball forward and then switch it inside - no hoofs but great runs and early delivery; not many square passes in the build-ups we saw. Udinese, unlike us, are very quick to shoot.

 

Yes, the first two goals were crackers, but if Davis persists in trying to save high shots with his low hand he's going to let a lot more in like that at PL level.

[derry]

The difference between 4-4-2 and 4-3-3 isn't in the numbers, but in the flexibility. NA found quickly that nearly the only thing he could do was to shunt the two CMs into a diamond or not. With a basic 4-3-3 you can play a large number of ways without having to change formation. If we believe that highly paid, professional players with the ambition to play in the PL finds this too difficult the answer is not in the system.

 

Yesterday I found the difference laid in the speed Udinese changed from defense to attack or from right to left, etc. In comparison we often looked plodding. They also seldom mislaid a pass, which we too frequently do. Their thinking and reactions seemed to be that half- or quarter second faster than us.

 

As for the players I'm stuck with some niggles: Why did Lallana see so little of the ball in the first half. Players like him needs to be used and needs to be given the ball. Puncheon is still showing what was my major worry from the beginning, i.e. the lack of end product. How many crosses did he actually get in? And when he shot it was rather feeble. Chaplow, so admirable in his high work rate, cannot pass and shoot and therefore needs to be used as a simple breaker-upper of the game.Win the ball and give it to Lallana could be a good and simple rule to play to. Let's give up on the idea of being a wide man.

 

Our biggest challenge to any system is our strikers. I think we need to consider playing Lambert at no 10 with maybe Sharp in front of him. He is much more effective in that position, maybe because he started life as a midfielder. The 10 position is crucial to success and apart from Lambert I can only really see Guly in that role. Lallana wants to do to much, and middle of the park in the front third isn't the place to do it. You need to control the ball and move it fast and accurate as a play maker, so why not play Lambert there. The Swedes played Ibrahimovich there, and he is as much a striker as Lambert.

 

Picking a system and shoehorning in players that have to adapt to play it, mostly ineffectively, is a recipe for failure. The only thing that works is to design a system that gets the collective best out of the player's abilities. It is better to be efficient because the system suits the players, than neutered by a system that doesn't suit, no matter how technically sound it is.

Edited 12 August, 2012 by derry

[Bailey]

Are people seriously criticising Kelvin based on Udinese's opening two goals?

 

Two fantastic strikes, you've got to hold your hands up and say fair play.

 

Granted, we could have been quicker to close the oppo down, but to blame Davis is ridiculous.

[Cabrone]

Another reality check for the one eyed on here.

 

17th was and still is my expectation, if we survive we'll have done well this season.

 

Keep on thinking we should have bought a quality keeper, KD is going to get beaten a lot this season and the team are going to have to show some real grit.

[David Strover]

Are people seriously criticising Kelvin based on Udinese's opening two goals?

 

Two fantastic strikes, you've got to hold your hands up and say fair play.

 

Granted, we could have been quicker to close the oppo down, but to blame Davis is ridiculous.

 

No for most posters it's just easier.

 

Looking at the very short clips the game still seemed to be played at a 'friendly' pace. I'm not sure there is too much to be learned by this game.

[CanadaSaint]

Are people seriously criticising Kelvin based on Udinese's opening two goals?

 

Two fantastic strikes, you've got to hold your hands up and say fair play.

 

Granted, we could have been quicker to close the oppo down, but to blame Davis is ridiculous.

 

It isn't "ridiculous."

 

Yes, they were cracking shots but - as I said above - he went for them with his low hand, possibly because he didn't read the flight early enough. Had he gone for them with his high hand, he had a much better chance.

 

I'm not as critical of Davis as some but this won't pass unnoticed in a league that does a lot of scouting. And it might be one (but certainly not the only) reason why we concede a fair few from longer range.

[adrian lord]

Pre-season results and 'performances' mean nothing.

[up and away]

No surprise to see Davis be beaten from range, he really is poor at long range shots. Didn't help that no one closed the two down though.

 

That will probably be the side that starts vs City. They really are going to embarrass us on Sky Sports.

 

Nothing we have not seen there from the NPC. First goal was special but second was stoppable but that is the type of shot Kelvin gets beaten by. If this continues into the Premier we will be in big trouble, he won't know whether to make space off his line for the through ball or stay on his line from that far out. Hooiveld was just following the ball for a very poor third but the attacker was real class putting the ball through the defenders legs for the fourth.

 

I was wondering where the 451 was for their first goal. Clear enough with a pedestrian team like Ajax to wander back into shape, a bit different against Udinese. Does not bode well for what many describe as the most dynamic league in world football? At present we are the worst of both worlds, neither attacking cohesively or defending cohesively. We don't have the players or the skill to make these systems work with just a fleeting acceptance of the principles. Either commit 100% to the system or stop wasting time with the charades.

[RonManager]

the whole match...

 

http://udinesecalcio.portals.twww.tv/

[Saint Charlie]

the whole match...

 

http://udinesecalcio.portals.twww.tv/

 

Just watched and wasn't as bad as some have suggested. Two worldies and then two goals we could have done better on. Just need more flair and pace in final third.

[S-Clarke]

Just watched and wasn't as bad as some have suggested. Two worldies and then two goals we could have done better on. Just need more flair and pace in final third.

 

Pretty much nailed it there, exactly spot on. There's isn't a great deal wrong at Saints as some like to make out, and it won't take much to improve things.

[Sour Mash]

the whole match...

 

http://udinesecalcio.portals.twww.tv/

Cheers for that. Seemed like one of our problems that hasn't been mentioned so much on here was a fair bit of sloppy passing?

[The Kraken]

Just watched and wasn't as bad as some have suggested. Two worldies and then two goals we could have done better on. Just need more flair and pace in final third.

Phew. I'm glad it will be quite easy to fix, I'm relieved now.

[Saint Charlie]

Phew. I'm glad it will be quite easy to fix, I'm relieved now.

 

Chill, I didn't say it would be easy to fix or that there is a huge problem. Just that I didn't feel we played as badly as others have suggested. The Champions League opposition were good and certainly better than us which didn't surprise me.

 

Nothing wrong with that, and ultimately you will have your own opinion which is fine - no need to try to provoke!

 

Thought Clyne looked good again and Davis used the ball well when he came on.

 

If we make the additions Adkins knows we need then we will be competitive.

Edited 12 August, 2012 by Saint Charlie

[shurlock]

the whole match...

 

http://udinesecalcio.portals.twww.tv/

 

Not as bad as I thought it would be. For all the rusty passing, we had options to pass to and closed down well. JWP didn't have a bad game by any stretch but Davis looked bright when he came on. Udinese were more direct than us and showed the value of having mobility up. Hard pressed to think of any attacks we started down the left.

[The9]

Just watched and wasn't as bad as some have suggested. Two worldies and then two goals we could have done better on. Just need more flair and pace in final third.

 

From two players given a ton of time and space.

[Saint Charlie]

From two players given a ton of time and space.

 

True - lots of Prem players who are capable of the same. That's why we have played good teams in pre season rather than Eastleigh, Yeovil etc

[Foxstone]

First of all, it was a pleasure to watch Udinese play - They were quicker to the ball, quicker to close down, quicker in thought and quicker in movement generally.

 

I saying that though, 2 of their goals were unstoppable 25 yarders that would grace any game and we did compete well, but not well enough.

 

Davies when he came on made a difference, seemed to have that extra second on the ball that provided more continuity in midfield, Jay worked hard and Clyne was excellent down the right.

 

I think this was a positive game for us to shake us out of any complacency we might have had.

 

Forza senor Di Natalie though - He was a pleasure to watch!

[suewhistle]

I went to the game and thought it was a useful exercise. It won't tell NA anything he doesn't already know about his recruitment targets, but it was a good learning experience for the team. They were a better team, but Saints weren't outclassed. The lesson was in how they exploited their superiority. Clyne looked useful and Puncheon was trying, but his decision making lets him down. Rodrigues was anonymous in his position, JWP looks the part and has good movement, Schneiderlin looked good in the first half but got tetchy and lost concentration in the second, perhaps frustrated by the poor off-the-ball movement at times. Some of our passing was crisp but could have been snappier and more accurate and we were given a much needed lesson in long range shooting, the need to close down in those areas and how players coming from deeper are difficult to pick up.

 

There was a lack of bite in the game with one week to go to the real thing, but that aspect didn't concern me. I'm sure NA will find the video of the game a very useful educational tool.

[The9]

True - lots of Prem players who are capable of the same. That's why we have played good teams in pre season rather than Eastleigh, Yeovil etc

 

I completely agree.

[saint_ed]

Having watched the Udinese highlights a few things caught my attention. Firstly, Steven Davis added much needed class to our midfield and had a calming influence, on first glance seems like a terrific signing. Sadly though we lacked a distinct cutting edge both in attack and defence, only further highlighting the belief that we are lacking one or top top quality players with big game experience.

 

Also, Jay Rodriguez is absolutely wasted out on the left wing which is unfortunate, while I have doubts over Lambert's mobility to play as a loan front man. He seems very lethargic from what I've seen so far this pre season.....just me?

[DrunkenSaint]

NA is playing the 433 formation all wrong, i watched the game he needs to stick Rod, lambo or sharp upfront not use of of them as a winger or playing one behind it just does not work. You always need a wide midfielder or a attacking midfielder playing along side the forward since when we dont have the ball they will get back and help, atm Rod is lost on the left and fox needs help at defending. Really for this to work we need to have a good mix of midfielder's which we do have but NA's problem he has 3 strikers for 1 spot. Lambo the fans favourite, Rod the record signing and Sharp the goal poacher who is the best suited for the role. He is tryign to please all 3 of them and it just wont work. He'll have an even bigger headache when Lee comes back, he is infact used to playing upfront on his own for japan but he can and has played on the left in a 433, so what will he do? He can't play 2 of them unless we go 442 but i don't think that will work, our midfield will get stretched against most teams in the premier as they use pace and thats what let us down last season. 451/433 formation does suit us cause we have a good number of midfield players but if he knew he was going to do this formation he should of got players in to suit that formation and sold the ones who don't. I still think shaw would do a great job in the left midfield spot, he'll cover Fox and he will also gain experience he needs and i would push Lallana out on the right and have 3 from Jwp, Morgan, Cork, Davis, Chappers in the centre. I just think NA is jumping on the 433 bandwagon without thinking.

[Norm]

NA is playing the 433 formation all wrong, i watched the game he needs to stick Rod, lambo or sharp upfront not use of of them as a winger or playing one behind it just does not work. You always need a wide midfielder or a attacking midfielder playing along side the forward since when we dont have the ball they will get back and help, atm Rod is lost on the left and fox needs help at defending. Really for this to work we need to have a good mix of midfielder's which we do have but NA's problem he has 3 strikers for 1 spot. Lambo the fans favourite, Rod the record signing and Sharp the goal poacher who is the best suited for the role. He is tryign to please all 3 of them and it just wont work. He'll have an even bigger headache when Lee comes back, he is infact used to playing upfront on his own for japan but he can and has played on the left in a 433, so what will he do? He can't play 2 of them unless we go 442 but i don't think that will work, our midfield will get stretched against most teams in the premier as they use pace and thats what let us down last season. 451/433 formation does suit us cause we have a good number of midfield players but if he knew he was going to do this formation he should of got players in to suit that formation and sold the ones who don't. I still think shaw would do a great job in the left midfield spot, he'll cover Fox and he will also gain experience he needs and i would push Lallana out on the right and have 3 from Jwp, Morgan, Cork, Davis, Chappers in the centre. I just think NA is jumping on the 433 bandwagon without thinking.

 

If this had been at the begining of your post, I would not have reached the second line.

[The9]

What "4-3-3 bandwagon" is this anyway ? Is everyone playing it during the close season then ? If there's a bandwagon to be getting on, it's 4-6-0. Though I suppose Spain do claim it's 4-3-3...