Our Future? Stadium Expansion Proposal on Season Ticket DVD

[saint1977]

This looks fantastic, as someone has pointed out plenty of clubs have published such ideas (including one about 20 miles from SMS) but clearly developing the site is on the agenda. With the Fair Play regulations coming in, this is one of the best ways to raise revenue and profile although the new TV deal may keep wages inflated. The waterfront in that part of the city is badly underutilised and regeneration would be very welcome. Soton only really has the De Vere for conferences and SMS in its current guise so I can see the sense there. A double decker Kingsland would also have fabulous river views and could make the stadium stand out in a way that it doesn't at present. Any sponsorship on the upper level seats would be visible from miles away and from the air so could command premium money.

 

This would cost big money and the cautious side of me thinks we'd need to stay up this season and have full houses with quite a bit of pent up demand for the next couple of years for it to happen. I'd love to be proven wrong though. Who we bring in for player recruitment this summer will also be a litmus test of where we are aiming short-term. J-Rod was certainly a good start/

[Colinjb]

Though they will probably want to see a couple of season's revenues first?

 

Probably need to get into a season-ticket-waiting-list-type-scenario before we see anything concrete?

 

 

 

All together now: - let's go round again, baby we'll turn back the hands of time, let's go round again, one more time.

 

See (at the risk of starting this type of discussion off again) I don't believe that a stadium expansion is required per sé. An improvement to the stadium facilities on the other hand would make a lot of sense.

[hypochondriac]

What is sarcastic about that?

 

Because some pictures on a DVD confirm absolutely none of that. It may be the case but to say that those pictures confirm all of that is just silly.

[suewhistle]

It has the potential for a life of it's own seperate from the 'What the Season Tickets Look Like' thread so..

 

Not 'arf!

[dune]

Because some pictures on a DVD confirm absolutely none of that. It may be the case but to say that those pictures confirm all of that is just silly.

 

The cult of cortese don't need planning applications/approvals to live the dream.

[S-Clarke]

Because some pictures on a DVD confirm absolutely none of that. It may be the case but to say that those pictures confirm all of that is just silly.

 

I just don't think the guys that run this club are the sort to tease us with crap. We barely get any bits like this out of the club, so when it does pop out you can be assured that there is serious intent to make it happen in the long-term future, and therefore financial backing.

 

Similar was said about the training ground when the pictures first came out, but you could tell the intent was there and after a bit of a wait it finally started and that won't be cheap either.

[Patrick Bateman]

I assume that is just a pure vision and an end goal. If they are to move towards that end goal then it'll definitely be completed in baby steps, small bits at a time. Redevelop the front and road, buy the land next to the ground, develop on that ground, link the two buildings, expand the stadium if there is demand, wrap the stuff around it, etc etc etc.

 

I think it's great to have a vision like that, but it'll certainly be protracted over many years.

[S-Clarke]

I assume that is just a pure vision and an end goal. If they are to move towards that end goal then it'll definitely be completed in baby steps, small bits at a time. Redevelop the front and road, buy the land next to the ground, develop on that ground, link the two buildings, expand the stadium if there is demand, wrap the stuff around it, etc etc etc.

 

I think it's great to have a vision like that, but it'll certainly be protracted over many years.

 

Exactly this.

[suewhistle]

This particular design would, as Colin has alluded to, also require the purchase and subsequent demolition of at least three sites that adjoin St Mary's in its current guise. If, for the sake of argument, we assume the club proceeded with this, the timescale involved would surely be a minimum of 5 years, perhaps even 10, simply because of the complexity and scale.

 

To complete the project certainly those timescales would seem likely, but I presume it would be phased? For example, the Kingsland expansion might be done first, to give additional capacity from the off? The fact that even these sketches are being put in the public domain seems significant enough. We just aren't a "Harbourdome" type club: when our players pose with diggers they're actually being used....

[saint1977]

Anyone can do some pretty drawings and stick them in the public domain, tbf.

 

Loads of clubs have released similar artist's impressions in the past only to not follow through with any building work to that effect (or even so much as a planning application).

 

This particular design would, as Colin has alluded to, also require the purchase and subsequent demolition of at least three sites that adjoin St Mary's in its current guise. If, for the sake of argument, we assume the club proceeded with this, the timescale involved would surely be a minimum of 5 years, perhaps even 10, simply because of the complexity and scale.

 

Oh certainly that's the case, the planning alone would take quite some time in terms of re-routing the road layout and would need to be part of a wider regeneration strategy. The City Council's track-record is distinctly patchy in this regard and look at how long the Vospers regeneration took! The Kingsland expansion could happen in a couple of seasons although again, the Council would have to be satisfied that the transport planning would work as that footbridge would not take much more traffic.

 

I think we should see how the club gets on in the top flight over this season (and hopefully next!) before we get too excited.

[dune]

The red box. Please don't tell me it's one of those ghastly rust effect monstrosities?

 

Why can't we go for a mock tudor, colonial, or gothic look. Something more traditional.

Edited 19 June, 2012 by dune

[once_bitterne]

It's the monkey-chicken petting zoo.

[K,Billy's supersound]

Well they are some pretty pictures to show any potential new signing or commercial partners how ambitious we are and where we are trying to go in the world of moneyball. But alas only pictures and dreams.

[hypochondriac]

I just don't think the guys that run this club are the sort to tease us with crap.

 

No one said that, but as has been pointed out, loads of clubs have plans that look into possible expansions. The images themselves even have a question mark. It's very different from confirming we have a load of money to spend.

We barely get any bits like this out of the club, so when it does pop out you can be assured that there is serious intent to make it happen in the long-term future, and therefore financial backing

Where do you get that assurance from? A couple of photos on a DVD and you extrapolate all of that? We may well have financial backing for a long term project but I certainly wouldn't take three images on a DVD as proof like you seem to.

 

Similar was said about the training ground when the pictures first came out, but you could tell the intent was there and after a bit of a wait it finally started and that won't be cheap either.

That is completely different though. For a start, I believe the training ground plans were released because they had applied for planning permission. That's a very significant step. hen we start applying for planning permission, making the details of these plans public and set some sort of timescale maybe then I will agree with you. Three images on a DVD is not the same thing at all.

[hypochondriac]

Exactly this.

 

And when these things start to happen then maybe I will agree. Some pictures are not proof though of all that you claim.

[stevegrant]

To complete the project certainly those timescales would seem likely, but I presume it would be phased? For example, the Kingsland expansion might be done first, to give additional capacity from the off?

Without any detailed knowledge of stadium construction I'd only be guessing, but that guess would be that it would be very difficult to do in one go, especially considering the fact that there's only usually 3 months of the year when there's no football being played there, and therefore only 3 months when there wouldn't be tens of thousands of people milling around at a time.

 

That said, I remember when West Ham built their main stand about a decade ago, they built it behind the existing stand, which didn't seem to cause too much disruption at the time. The problem with expanding rather than replacing (as I guess we'd assume will happen - they surely wouldn't knock the whole stand down and rebuild it from the ground up) is that the roof needs to be removed/lifted at some point, and with the current design, the roof is an integral part to the whole stadium's structure. Also, for reasons of working space, they might see an expansion of the two ends as a better starting point.

[Patrick Bateman]

The red box. Please don't tell me it's one of those ghastly rust effect monstrosities?

 

Why can't we go for a mock tudor, colonial, or gothic look. Something more traditional.

 

?

[Sour Mash]

I just don't think the guys that run this club are the sort to tease us with crap. We barely get any bits like this out of the club, so when it does pop out you can be assured that there is serious intent to make it happen in the long-term future, and therefore financial backing.

 

Similar was said about the training ground when the pictures first came out, but you could tell the intent was there and after a bit of a wait it finally started and that won't be cheap either.

That's all fair enough, but why not at least tell us what these pictures are?

[hypochondriac]

Well they are some pretty pictures to show any potential new signing or commercial partners how ambitious we are and where we are trying to go in the world of moneyball. But alas only pictures and dreams.

 

 

I imagine this will have played a significant part too. From a commercial perspective it is a really good idea to show us as a progressive club.

[Saints foreva]

Those designs look pretty nice.

 

We are years away from that though IMO, but it would be nice for St. Mary's Stadium to look more unique.

[Dig Dig]

Anyone can do some pretty drawings and stick them in the public domain, tbf.

 

Loads of clubs have released similar artist's impressions in the past only to not follow through with any building work to that effect (or even so much as a planning application).

 

This particular design would, as Colin has alluded to, also require the purchase and subsequent demolition of at least three sites that adjoin St Mary's in its current guise. If, for the sake of argument, we assume the club proceeded with this, the timescale involved would surely be a minimum of 5 years, perhaps even 10, simply because of the complexity and scale.

 

 

All true, however, it would be unusual for the club to put something like this in the public domain but not actually have the desire or resources to follow through with it. If not, it's contray to eveything the club have done to date under the new regime. I'm sure they are a little further down the line than just having some nice looking pictures.

[Matthew Le God]

Without any detailed knowledge of stadium construction I'd only be guessing, but that guess would be that it would be very difficult to do in one go, especially considering the fact that there's only usually 3 months of the year when there's no football being played there, and therefore only 3 months when there wouldn't be tens of thousands of people milling around at a time.

 

Wolves managed to knock down an entire stand in May and had people watching games in the lower tier of the new stand in September of the same year whilst work progressed on finishing the upper tier and rest of the stand.

[stevegrant]

The red box. Please don't tell me it's one of those ghastly rust effect monstrosities?

That bit of it looks like the hideous things that have been built at Old Trafford cricket ground:

 

[Matthew Le God]

Can someone put the video of just the bit about the stadium on Youtube please?

[K,Billy's supersound]

 

i have already had word of the cultivation of this new super species has begun and a floop ( neither a flock of chickens or a troop of monkeys) of chionkeys would be thriving by the time the staduim is built.

[stev2001]

Without any detailed knowledge of stadium construction I'd only be guessing, but that guess would be that it would be very difficult to do in one go, especially considering the fact that there's only usually 3 months of the year when there's no football being played there, and therefore only 3 months when there wouldn't be tens of thousands of people milling around at a time.

 

That said, I remember when West Ham built their main stand about a decade ago, they built it behind the existing stand, which didn't seem to cause too much disruption at the time. The problem with expanding rather than replacing (as I guess we'd assume will happen - they surely wouldn't knock the whole stand down and rebuild it from the ground up) is that the roof needs to be removed/lifted at some point, and with the current design, the roof is an integral part to the whole stadium's structure. Also, for reasons of working space, they might see an expansion of the two ends as a better starting point.

 

I was thinking the same that this would be done in phases like what wolves have done.

If each stand was done as a phase then I can't see there being much disruption as SMS was built with this in mind. Whether each phase could be done in 3 months I doubt it but the major structural works could possibly be done in this time with the remaining lesser works done during the season.

My guess which is based on nothing is each stand would take 1 season to complete.

[toofarnorth]

As a concept I think it's great to see, but not time to get excited just yet.

[dune]

That bit of it looks like the hideous things that have been built at Old Trafford cricket ground:

 

 

These ghastly modern structures soon date, so much like with my wardrobe I would advocate a classic look. Cotswold stone with a collyweston slate roof would be my suggestion.

[dune]

http://www.flickr.com/photos/paul_stokes/3588657936/

?

 

Oh yes. Now that is classy. Now that would be "doing it the southampton way".

[Turkish]

If MLG had drawn those we all know what you and your other small-minded pleb's responses would have been.

 

We've only EVER talked about plans and ambitions.

 

Though they will probably want to see a couple of season's revenues first?

 

Probably need to get into a season-ticket-waiting-list-type-scenario before we see anything concrete?

 

 

 

All together now: - let's go round again, baby we'll turn back the hands of time, let's go round again, one more time.

 

Welcome to the ranks of the small minded plebs Sandwich. This is exactly whay myself and the other small minded pleb, Dell sized mentialities posters have been saying. The fact building work isn't going on right now suggests Cortese agrees with us. It's a shame as usual dumbass fails to understand this.

[stev2001]

As a concept I think it's great to see, but not time to get excited just yet.

 

Yep all these pics mean is we are a step closer to getting something like this but there is still a long way to go before this becomes reality.

However a step closer nonetheless.

[Turkish]

i assume that is just a pure vision and an end goal. If they are to move towards that end goal then it'll definitely be completed in baby steps, small bits at a time. Redevelop the front and road, buy the land next to the ground, develop on that ground, link the two buildings, expand the stadium if there is demand, wrap the stuff around it, etc etc etc.

 

I think it's great to have a vision like that, but it'll certainly be protracted over many years.

 

* puts fingers in ears, stamps feet and screams "dell sized mentality, build it now" *

[dune]

 

Visted this stadium in Turkey. It puts our mechano flat pack into perspective. And it's over 2000 years old.

Edited 19 June, 2012 by dune

[rshephard3]

Oh yes. Now that is classy. Now that would be "doing it the southampton way".

 

And did those feet in ancient time..

[dune]

And did those feet in ancient time..

 

The thing is who do these ghastly modern monstrosities actually appeal to? It's the old emperors news clothes mentality. If we were to break from the mould and build something traditional it would become an iconic stadium loved by all (except the weirdos who like modern structures).

[hypochondriac]

Yep all these pics mean is we are a step closer to getting something like this but there is still a long way to go before this becomes reality.

However a step closer nonetheless.

 

Now this is the sensible reaction.

[stev2001]

 

Visted this stadium in Turkey. It puts our mechano flat pack into perspective. And it's over 2000 years old.

 

Not a very big pitch and where are the goals?

[ThreeSixty]

Hear there is a ground a few miles down the road that will be sitting empty if we need a temporary home during construction.

[buctootim]

 

Visted this stadium in Turkey. It puts our mechano flat pack into perspective. And it's over 2000 years old.

 

I hate those out of town stadiums

[rshephard3]

Thoroughly agree mate. My post sounded like I was taking the Michael I realised. Noone will cross borders and sail seas just to look at buildings like this. My idea when moving to SMS was to be the first club in the country to attempt to maintain some class by scaling up the Dell 2 times bigger, triangle stand and all (without pillars in the way of seats of course). I was genuinely sad we didn't build 4 stands and went for a bowl. I fear people on here will think I'm mad for saying this. Never mind.

[stev2001]

Hear there is a ground a few miles down the road that will be sitting empty if we need a temporary home during construction.

 

God no!

[St Marco]

I think some people just need to accept they were wrong rather then continue to dig their hole...

 

These pictures show the stadium as it would look expanded. It isn't a confirmation that it is happening. It is a confirmation that the club are seriously thinking about it to the point they have paid someone to make some designs.

Who knows if it will happen soon or even under the current ownership. But one day it will happen. With everything that has gone on since Nicola and co moved in I can imagine this would be on the "next phase" list. The 5 year plan was to get back to the pl. we have done that. I'm sure Cortese will have new targets now.

[dune]

Thoroughly agree mate. My post sounded like I was taking the Michael I realised. Noone will cross borders and sail seas just to look at buildings like this. My idea when moving to SMS was to be the first club in the country to attempt to maintain some class by scaling up the Dell 2 times bigger, triangle stand and all (without pillars in the way of seats of course). I was genuinely sad we didn't build 4 stands and went for a bowl. I fear people on here will think I'm mad for saying this. Never mind.

 

I don't think you're mad. I hate St Marys as a stadium (i hate all modern stadiumds). It's utterly characterless. The Dell was always a pleasure to visit - a thing of beauty.

[Turkish]

I think some people just need to accept they were wrong rather then continue to dig their hole...

 

These pictures show the stadium as it would look expanded. It isn't a confirmation that it is happening. It is a confirmation that the club are seriously thinking about it to the point they have paid someone to make some designs.

Who knows if it will happen soon or even under the current ownership. But one day it will happen. With everything that has gone on since Nicola and co moved in I can imagine this would be on the "next phase" list. The 5 year plan was to get back to the pl. we have done that. I'm sure Cortese will have new targets now.

 

Who is wrong?

 

And its confirmation that it MIGHT happen, not confirmation that it will. Which is exactly what the Del sized mentality posters have been saying. It seems the "build it now" brigade are the ones that are wrong.

Edited 19 June, 2012 by Turkish

[Matthew Le God]

I don't think you're mad. I hate St Marys as a stadium (i hate all modern stadiumds). It's utterly characterless.

 

Do you think these proposals have "character"?

[Saint J 77]

It has the potential for a life of it's own seperate from the 'What the Season Tickets Look Like' thread so here we go.

 

 

 

 

But where is the Ted Bates statue in these drawings? Are we sure this is a St Mary's extension and not a new stadium?

[Sour Mash]

I think some people just need to accept they were wrong rather then continue to dig their hole...

 

These pictures show the stadium as it would look expanded. It isn't a confirmation that it is happening. It is a confirmation that the club are seriously thinking about it to the point they have paid someone to make some designs.

Who knows if it will happen soon or even under the current ownership. But one day it will happen. With everything that has gone on since Nicola and co moved in I can imagine this would be on the "next phase" list. The 5 year plan was to get back to the pl. we have done that. I'm sure Cortese will have new targets now.

These pictures aren't actually "designs" or "plans" though are they? They are nice looking drawings.

[dune]

Looking at the image above, does anyone else think it looks like a multistorey car park?

[SO16_Saint]

can we not just take these pictures / drawings for what they are.... speculative.

 

it's not going to happen for definite, likewise it's not NOT going to happen.

 

why does EVERY thread have to turn into a slanging match FFS?

[Crazy Diamond]

Don't worry everyone, MLG has taken to Twitter to correct people - even when they aren't wrong.

 

I don't think you're mad. I hate St Marys as a stadium (i hate all modern stadiumds). It's utterly characterless.

 

I agree. There's only so much you can do but look at the New York Yankees' new stadium. It oozes character. They had a hell of a lot of money to spend, admittedly, and are far and beyond anyone else in their sport, but it shows it can be done.

 

Everything was thought of - look at the frieze here. That's not there for the sake of it, it's a copy of an original 1923 design from the first stadium that the Yankees played in. Character right there, from something oh so simple.

 

 

The club have made an effort to tart it up on the inside, indeed there have been many changes since it was opened, but really it's nothing amazing. A bit more paint here and there doesn't change what the stadium is - a job that was done to a price, and not a huge price.