Jack Butland

[CB Fry]

To be frank, you don't need to know anything about anything to give an opinion. On the other hand knowledge gives some validity to the opinion.

 

Yes. And I have the knowledge that six million for a teenage keeper is a hell of a lot of money for a club our size in our first season back.

 

I've not seen him play but it doesn't matter as you'll notice I am not even saying he isn't worth six million. I'm saying I am uncomfortable with us spending that kind of money on that kind of player.

 

Understand now?

[EBS1980]

All I can assume is that it was much lower fee with lots of add on's, say international caps that took it up to £6m.

 

I can't see saints offering a flat £6m for a keeper who has only played L2 and I can't see Birmingham turning down £6m in their situation.

[Gingeletiss]

Maybe, just maybe, that figure of 6 million, is for two players, just maybe!

[Nigel=God-Poyet=Sod]

Get Allan McGregor in from Rangers on a free, save the money for an outfield player (CB, CM etc.). £6M for a player who has only played at L2 level and who would likely to be understudy to Kelv for a bit, is quite high but he does have potential I suppose.

[Cabrone]

Whilst a new GK has been my no.1 issue since we got promoted £6M is a huge gamble on a GK that hasn't even played for Brum let alone in the prem.

 

Being as this is our 1st season back in the prem shouldn't we be looking at more established\better\safer\cheaper GK options?

 

Rob Green would have been fine with me and quite a few have mentioned McGregor who also would do a great job.

[CHAPEL END CHARLIE]

We can argue about the merits of this young keeper but the real significance behind this story is that the club are (reportedly) prepared to spend this kind of money on any player. If anyone on here, or in the English game generally, still doubts just how serious this club now is about becoming a firmly established PL club then they need to think again.

 

The next few months look set to become a exciting time for Saints fans everywhere.

[goneawol]

http://www.birminghammail.net/birmingham-sport/birmingham-city-fc/birmingham-city-fc-news/2012/06/28/colin-tattum-exclusive-birmingham-city-reject-6m-bid-for-jack-butland-97319-31278783/

[Sour Mash]

We can argue about the merits of this young keeper but the real significance behind this story is that the club are (reportedly) prepared to spend this kind of money on any player. If anyone on here, or in the English game generally, still doubts just how serious this club now is about becoming a firmly established PL club then they need to think again.

 

The next few months look set to become a exciting time for Saints fans everywhere.

I don't think I have seen one single comment anywhere suggesting that Saints weren't serious about establishing themselves in the Prem - why wouldn't they be serious?

[Thedelldays]

to put this into prospective.. Jack Butland is no better at 19 than Joe Lewis was at the same age. Lewis too had represented England at all age levels, save at first team level, and he had as much league experience albeit at a tad higher level. He was being touted as the next England No1..

Peterborough managed to get him from Norwich for what was then an enormous fee of £300k. 4 years ago I know.

Now Joe has joined Cardiff City on a free.

 

Indeed

Maybe we should just get joe Lewis???

[Window Cleaner]

Well, whatever it is that we're doing on the GK front we need to flippin well get on with it and stop tarting about, MLMC is just about 2 weeks way,then the French training camp and we have one valid GK on the books unless of course you rate TF as "valid".

[Turkish]

http://www.birminghammail.net/birmingham-sport/birmingham-city-fc/birmingham-city-fc-news/2012/06/28/colin-tattum-exclusive-birmingham-city-reject-6m-bid-for-jack-butland-97319-31278783/

 

If £6m isn't considered eye popping we should take our money elsewhere.

[IOWSaintDaz]

Personally i'd go for Alex Smithies from Huddersfield, a top keeper who is consistent and still young at 22.

[EBS1980]

Personally i'd go for Alex Smithies from Huddersfield, a top keeper who is consistent and still young at 22.

 

Wasn't he number 2 for most of last season to someone in their 40's?

[Saint Garrett]

I do think Smithies is a bit of an FM myth, wasn't he dropped for Huddersfield last season ?

[SaintRichmond]

Well, whatever it is that we're doing on the GK front we need to flippin well get on with it and stop tarting about, MLMC is just about 2 weeks way,then the French training camp and we have one valid GK on the books unless of course you rate TF as "valid".[/QUOTE]

 

 

Of course it could be that he turns out to be a Long Range Forecast

 

He's been saving himself for the Prem

 

Joe Hart beware ....... (Too much laughing can kill you )

[SaintRichmond]

I do think Smithies is a bit of an FM myth, wasn't he dropped for Huddersfield last season ?

 

Fraser Forster is the one we SHOULD be after IMHO

 

Very good for Norwich in their Promotion year

[Quickfire Double]

If £6m isn't considered eye popping we should take our money elsewhere.

 

 

Exactly so, and sharpish. £6m should buy us genuine competition for KD, if not better. Hope if this story's genuine, the club have moved onto an alternative target already.

[Gemmel]

Exactly so, and sharpish. £6m should buy us genuine competition for KD, if not better. Hope if this story's genuine, the club have moved onto an alternative target already.

 

Nothing really to back it up, but I get the feeling that in addition to our Premiership windfall, clubs are now realising we have some decent money to spend and the price goes up when Saints call. Nothing gets leaked from our end, so it must be frustrating for Cortese and Co. but whilst it is just paper talk, six million for Butland will send a message to all clubs to hike the price up when Saints come calling.

[Thedelldays]

if butland is serious about being a footballer...he should stay and be No.1 for brum next season

[Quickfire Double]

Nothing really to back it up, but I get the feeling that in addition to our Premiership windfall, clubs are now realising we have some decent money to spend and the price goes up when Saints call. Nothing gets leaked from our end, so it must be frustrating for Cortese and Co. but whilst it is just paper talk, six million for Butland will send a message to all clubs to hike the price up when Saints come calling.

 

Quite possibly, especially if we're trying to buy British, and even more so (I'd imagine) if we're trying to get anyone off of another Prem club with experience of the division.

 

Pretty sure a half decent scouting network should be able to source a better and younger keeper than Kelv for that money if they cast the net wide enough.

[Turkish]

if butland is serious about being a footballer...he should stay and be No.1 for brum next season

 

I don't disagree with that Jamie. Far more players get ruined by big moves early in their career than go on and flourish. Especially goalkeepers. The last 10 years in littered with promising young keepers who got big moves and it ruined them.

[Saint Charlie]

Difference between Butland and the Fosters, Forsters, McGregors etc is two things:

 

1. He is rated by many within the FA as potentially better than Hart - been watched by loads of top teams

 

2. Although the fee would be higher he would most likely not lose any value and is wages now would be less than the names I mentioned above (probably quite considerably.

 

Its great that we are in the market for a player like this, and I would trust Adkins to know a decent keeper.

[Thedelldays]

Tommy Forecast was highly regarded when he was young...even made the spurs bench numerous times

[Thedelldays]

I don't disagree with that Jamie. Far more players get ruined by big moves early in their career than go on and flourish. Especially goalkeepers. The last 10 years in littered with promising young keepers who got big moves and it ruined them.

that is if he can even get the NO.1 spot for brum next season

[Doctoroncall]

Tommy Forecast was highly regarded when he was young...even made the spurs bench numerous times

 

Butland is down to be the keeper in the GB team at the Olympics so maybe more highly regarded than TF.

[Thedelldays]

Butland is down to be the keeper in the GB team at the Olympics so maybe more highly regarded than TF.

I remember all the fuss about steve simmonson years ago...he was DEFINATELTY going to be the next big thing....

 

to throw that much money behind a 19 year old keeper is mental IN MY OPINION

I would like to think that saints paying that sort of money for a player right now would mean he is a first team starter.

we need players better than what we have right now

[Saint Charlie]

Tommy Forecast was highly regarded when he was young...even made the spurs bench numerous times

 

I never saw any comments to suggest he was regarded with more potential than one of the best England keepers of the last 20 years though?

 

http://footballleagueblog.dailymail.co.uk/2011/12/talent-scout-jack-butland.html

 

And as far as im aware he hasn't represented England at any level whilst Butland has at all levels from U16 to U21 with a call up to a major finals.

[Thedelldays]

scott carson was another BIG thing.......even played for england senior team

would you think he is worth £10m..?

[buctootim]

£6m would put him in or around the 10 most expensive goalkeepers of all time according to this http://www.cricbeat.com/2011/06/most-expensive-goalkeepers-ever.html

 

Cant see it somehow. Why spend £6m on potential when you can buy a top top keeper at their peak for that kind of money?

[Saint Charlie]

£6m would put him in or around the 10 most expensive goalkeepers of all time according to this http://www.cricbeat.com/2011/06/most-expensive-goalkeepers-ever.html

 

Cant see it somehow. Why spend £6m on potential when you can buy a top top keeper at their peak for that kind of money?

 

 

Only get a top, top keeper by breaking your wage structure. Mark Schwarzer was a free for Fulham but easily on 40k a week.

[Saint Charlie]

scott carson was another BIG thing.......even played for england senior team

would you think he is worth £10m..?

 

Clearly they won't get 10m for Butland. Carson, at one time was easily worth 5-7m.

[Thedelldays]

Only get a top, top keeper by breaking your wage structure. Mark Schwarzer was a free for Fulham but easily on 40k a week.

how do you know that butland would not break our wage structure..?

england no.3 around the 10th most expensive keeper of all time in the world..

if we think he is all that then it won't be unreasonable for him to think we will pay him accordingly?

[Thedelldays]

Clearly they won't get 10m for Butland. Carson, at one time was easily worth 5-7m.

was that when he was a premiership regular and got the NO.1 jersey for England on merit..?

[jasoneuelllfanclub]

I think on one hand it is refreshing to see that adkins is trying to build a young and hungry team with english players of great potential however how would we all feel should we go down this route and end up being being relegated largely due to the lack of premiership experience in the team?

 

so perhaps £6m on butland could be better spent on a experienced defender or midfielder although wages would be a potential stumbling block.

 

i do trust adkins and cortesi fully but surely some PL experience is a must. Maybe we have some freebies lined up to compliment these youngsters?

[saint lard]

Breaking news on SSN .....Birmingham reject £6m bid from Southampton.

madness.

[Verbal Kint]

I remember all the fuss about steve simmonson years ago...he was DEFINATELTY going to be the next big thing....

 

to throw that much money behind a 19 year old keeper is mental IN MY OPINION

I would like to think that saints paying that sort of money for a player right now would mean he is a first team starter.

we need players better than what we have right now

 

Do you seriously think we've offered 6 million up front? And that if we have Birmingham, a club with massive financial problems, have rejected it?

 

It's the same scenario as the Rodriguez deal. We've probably offered a million now and all the rest is dependent on appearances for us and England, in the same way we probably only paid about 3 or 4 million for Rodriguez up front with the rest in add-ons.

 

If we end up paying the full fee for either of them then they would have been worth every penny...

[Thedelldays]

Do you seriously think we've offered 6 million up front? And that if we have Birmingham, a club with massive financial problems, have rejected it?

 

It's the same scenario as the Rodriguez deal. We've probably offered a million now and all the rest is dependent on appearances for us and England, in the same way we probably only paid about 3 or 4 million for Rodriguez up front with the rest in add-ons.

 

If we end up paying the full fee for either of them then they would have been worth every penny...

but won't that be the same with say...ben foster though

 

I want saints to sign players that are good enough to oust whoever occupies their position in the team now.....we need to stay up first. spending £6m for the future when it could easily be spent on both now and the future is madness IMO

[The Kraken]

Do you seriously think we've offered 6 million up front? And that if we have Birmingham, a club with massive financial problems, have rejected it?

 

It's the same scenario as the Rodriguez deal. We've probably offered a million now and all the rest is dependent on appearances for us and England, in the same way we probably only paid about 3 or 4 million for Rodriguez up front with the rest in add-ons.

 

If we end up paying the full fee for either of them then they would have been worth every penny...

 

You think we got Jay Rodriguez for £3M up front?

 

Ok then. I'd suggest that's highly unlikely.

[Saint Charlie]

was that when he was a premiership regular and got the NO.1 jersey for England on merit..?

 

 

It was when he was a Prem regular and we had a dearth of quality goalkeepers.

 

I know Butland is expensive, but you generally get what you pay for. You might not be, but I am happy that we are in for players that highly rated and would be very happy if we signed Butland.

 

Whoever signs him for 6-8m will get a player that potentially could be worth 20m in 2 or 3 years, much like Alex Chamberlain is.

 

Sometimes you have to take risks to progress and if in 2 years we have the England no 2 who is challenging Hart then 8m would be well spent. If he is another Tommy Forecast like you say then it is a gamble gone bad, but from what I have read that seems unlikely.

[Verbal Kint]

You think we got Jay Rodriguez for £3M up front?

 

Ok then. I'd suggest that's highly unlikely.

 

Probably about 4 mill or so up front, a fee for if we stay up, a fee if we finish in top 10 for example, another fee for 50 appearances, for 20 goals, for 10 England appearances and so on and so on.

 

Butland will be slightly different. Birmingham are absolutely desperate for cash and they won't be able to reject a decent offer. The fact it was rejected tells you that very little of that 6 million is being offered up front. If it was, they would have accepted it

[rshephard3]

Any wage structure that existed up to now is going to have to be broken in the prem isn't it? Look what rigidity in this respect did for us last time, granted coupled with poor management at 2 levels within the club. Spurs spent 7m on a young football league star, Bale a few years back and could probably flog him for about 30 million now. Sometimes a gamble will pay off. I'd rather see us have a go with young hungry English players even if it costs some cash. Who knows, even after just a season of top flight football someone like Butland might be worth 12 million. Things have changed in the last 7 years, I think we should get used to the increased prices expected for players.

[Saint Charlie]

Probably about 4 mill or so up front, a fee for if we stay up, a fee if we finish in top 10 for example, another fee for 50 appearances, for 20 goals, for 10 England appearances and so on and so on.

 

Butland will be slightly different. Birmingham are absolutely desperate for cash and they won't be able to reject a decent offer. The fact it was rejected tells you that very little of that 6 million is being offered up front. If it was, they would have accepted it

 

Probably quite accurate, apprantly most transfer fees are 50% upfront with the remainder spread.

[Saint Charlie]

Any wage structure that existed up to now is going to have to be broken in the prem isn't it? Look what rigidity in this respect did for us last time, granted coupled with poor management at 2 levels within the club. Spurs spent 7m on a young football league star, Bale a few years back and could probably flog him for about 30 million now. Sometimes a gamble will pay off. I'd rather see us have a go with young hungry English players even if it costs some cash. Who knows, even after just a season of top flight football someone like Butland might be worth 12 million. Things have changed in the last 7 years, I think we should get used to the increased prices expected for players.

 

The wage structure will certainly increase, indeed many of our players wages will have risen for being promoted. However, with younger players generally they are on less money then more established players. hence Rodriguez at 6m will probably be on the same as Lambert or Lallana as he was probably on less than 10k at Burnley and would have got a nice rise to around 20k.

 

We could have signed Yakubu for free but he would have been on over 40k which then upsets the other players you have etc.

 

Just because a fee is high or low it doesn't mean that wages follow suit.

[ChrisPY]

With the recent quotes from Birmingham regarding 'eye popping offers' and now the story of a rejected £6mil bid makes me think we're close to having an offer accepted.

 

Any sane Birmingham fan has to see the club can't refuse more than £6mil for butland. If we now have an 'undisclosed' offer accepted the logical conclusion is the it's higher than £6million when in fact it might just be a little more up front and as speculated the rest as add ons.

 

Birmingham happy. Birmingham fans happy. Saints happy. Saints fans?

[Saint Charlie]

@benfoster: I see my boy Jack Butland is attracting interest!! Didn't think it would be long! #crazygood

[jasoneuelllfanclub]

according to the ever reliable Talk****e; Butland wants to move to us. Been guaranteed 1st team football apparently.

 

http://www.talksport.co.uk/sports-news/football/premier-league/transfer-rumours/120628/butland-desperate-make-southampton-move-175385

[Saint Charlie]

The talksport website is even worse than the radio Stn - wouldn't believe anything it says.

 

That said, Im sure he does want the move!

[Turkish]

joe Lewis, 2008 the best young keeper in England and a shoe in for England in a couple of years. 2012, dropped by Peterborough and released in a free.

 

 

On separate note though its fantastic to see us linked with and bidding for players like this, the best young ones in the country, regardless of what we think of the fee. The days of Kamil Kosowski and Ryan Smith seem a long time ago!!

[trousers]

@TonyHusbandBBC: Led to believe reports of £6m bid for #bcfc goalkeeper Jack Butland from #saintsfc are wide of the mark at this stage. #bbcsportsday

[isplumm]

joe Lewis, 2008 the best young keeper in England and a shoe in for England in a couple of years. 2012, dropped by Peterborough and released in a free.QUOTE]

But he let his contract run down & has now signed for Cardiff ....