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Adkins still here at end of season?


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Chris ‏@cj_garrett

@reluctantnicko Also...why would Di Matteo come to Southampton after winning the Champions League !??

 

Alan Nixon ‏@reluctantnicko

@cj_garrett If he gets bumped it would be an attractive job. Long-term links between him and Cortese.

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If this reporter had no previous with Saints then I would just ignore it as ********, but he was spot on about Sharp and I think a few other things as well. Very interesting to keep an eye on. I just cannot see us going and spending huge amounts of money, QPR showed that didnt really work last season whereas the building gradually that Swansea and Norwich did last season did.

 

QPR's struggle had more to do with who the money was spent on and when it was spent rather than the fact that they spent the money.

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I think the problem many of have is that we have been Saints supporters for a long time and do not let ourselves think big! For many years we punched above our weight perhaps and for the last seven years we have been on the ropes and down on the canvas at times.

 

NC does not carry this baggage, he is used to being successful. It is quite possible (I am not ITK) that NC told NA from the start, "Get us to the Prem and I will make you a rich man but once that objective is achieved I make you no promises - we may need someone to take us further than you can go." That might explain NA comments at the ends of the season. A mixture of joy at success and being rich and a moment of sorrow knowing he may soon be parted from the team he had worked so well with.

 

We have no idea what it is like to have control of so much money, we have no idea how much is invested in the project, we have no idea whether more will now be invested on development. NC comes from a Swiss banking background, he is used to making rich people even richer! If you can protect the value of peoples' investment and give them a good return then you have a successful business and people will want to invest further. For NC, staying with NA may be too much of a risk because he (NC) has to deliver to the investors and needs to be sure that those working for him can deliver too. This talk of Champions League may seem crazy to us little, long time, Southampton supporters but to those investing it may be what they are demanding.

 

The club changed the day ML & NC rode in to town. We may love the eventual outcome, we may not. One thing is for sure - things will never be the same as they once were, times have changed but there is nothing we can do about it but enjoy the ride while we can. NC may seem a crazy and impulsive man but I am pretty certain that could not be further from the truth. I suspect he is pretty ruthless though!

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Panda I think you are spot on there. While the fans want to be sentimental and believe Adkins deserves his chance (as will alot of outsiders) maybe the demands are much high and the strategy is to actually be fighting in the top 6 each season. I know everyone has 5 years plans but ours seems to have a long term strategy of how we are going to approach the next few years. The first signing we make this summer will give us a good idea of how we are going to go about it this season.

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I think the problem many of have is that we have been Saints supporters for a long time and do not let ourselves think big! For many years we punched above our weight perhaps and for the last seven years we have been on the ropes and down on the canvas at times.

 

NC does not carry this baggage, he is used to being successful. It is quite possible (I am not ITK) that NC told NA from the start, "Get us to the Prem and I will make you a rich man but once that objective is achieved I make you no promises - we may need someone to take us further than you can go." That might explain NA comments at the ends of the season. A mixture of joy at success and being rich and a moment of sorrow knowing he may soon be parted from the team he had worked so well with.

 

We have no idea what it is like to have control of so much money, we have no idea how much is invested in the project, we have no idea whether more will now be invested on development. NC comes from a Swiss banking background, he is used to making rich people even richer! If you can protect the value of peoples' investment and give them a good return then you have a successful business and people will want to invest further. For NC, staying with NA may be too much of a risk because he (NC) has to deliver to the investors and needs to be sure that those working for him can deliver too. This talk of Champions League may seem crazy to us little, long time, Southampton supporters but to those investing it may be what they are demanding.

 

The club changed the day ML & NC rode in to town. We may love the eventual outcome, we may not. One thing is for sure - things will never be the same as they once were, times have changed but there is nothing we can do about it but enjoy the ride while we can. NC may seem a crazy and impulsive man but I am pretty certain that could not be further from the truth. I suspect he is pretty ruthless though!

 

May just be something in this. If you improve the playing squad for a higher challenge, why not the management? Would love NA to stay and be given a chance to prove himself personally, but then I am not in charge or gambling my investment!

 

After 30 years of following football (and Saints), the sad truth of the modern game is that it is a business and not a passionate hobby as it once was, and NC is a very successful businessman. Hope we are happy with the eventual outcome?

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Because if our board can show no loyalty to the management even though they have done all that can be asked of them, when they are ahead of schedule, the club doesn't deserve the players to be loyal in the same way IMO. Obviously I want the players to be loyal and stay at all costs if we want them, but at the same time, if this does happen then you cannot blame any players if they want to leave.

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Just thinking outside the box, is there any way that Di Matteo could be on his way here but to work alongside Adkins and become another coach rather than replace him?

 

He offers Premier League and European experience and most probably has some good links after working at Chelsea.

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Just thinking outside the box, is there any way that Di Matteo could be on his way here but to work alongside Adkins and become another coach rather than replace him?

 

He offers Premier League and European experience and most probably has some good links after working at Chelsea.

 

Willing to accept a coaching assistant role to Adkins having just won the Champions League? Ridiculous suggestion!

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I know you all dismissed the comments made to myself by Alex Pearce of Reading,reference the fact that all was not well between Cortese and Adkins,well, there is no smoke without fire I'm afraid.

Nigel is likely to be shown the door,which in my view is quite ridiculous.

 

Most people said the same when Pardew was axed. How did that one turn out?

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Because if our board can show no loyalty to the management even though they have done all that can be asked of them, when they are ahead of schedule, the club doesn't deserve the players to be loyal in the same way IMO. Obviously I want the players to be loyal and stay at all costs if we want them, but at the same time, if this does happen then you cannot blame any players if they want to leave.

exactly the same was said when pardew was moved on.....

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Adkins got the job as a result of a ruthless decision by Cortese. I expect Cortese to be equally ruthless with his next managerial decision. Why would anyone expect any different, Adkins included?

 

Adkins only got the job in the first place due to Cortese's ruthlessness. It would therefore be unsurprising if he lost it in the same circumstances.

 

We can all agree that Cortese is consistent.

 

IMHO of course

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Adkins got the job as a result of a ruthless decision by Cortese. I expect Cortese to be equally ruthless with his next managerial decision. Why would anyone expect any different, Adkins included?

 

Adkins only got the job in the first place due to Cortese's ruthlessness. It would therefore be unsurprising if he lost it in the same circumstances.

 

We can all agree that Cortese is consistent.

 

IMHO of course

As disappointed as I will be if there is any truth in this report, I have to agree with what you have said. Last summer, I did wonder if Adkins would last the season and obviously because the team surpassed expectations, he did (and deservedly so). It would therefore be very harsh to replace him now but then if true, he is due to be replaced by somebody that has just won the biggest club championship in the world, which was still not enough to secure his current job.
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Most people said the same when Pardew was axed. How did that one turn out?

 

I have heard from a number of sources who have connections within the club that Pardew's removal was not for footballing reasons.

 

I can't think of any precedent of a manager winning promotion for a team and getting replaced before the start of the season. Di Matteo was given the boot from West Brom, despite getting them promoted and replaced by Hodgson, but that was mid-season.

 

Adkins has managed the club well, in my opinion. Also, I'm not convinced by the story that Cortese wants to suddenly start throwing money about. Most of our transfers have been taking the best players from clubs who are skint and can't turn down the money (Barnard, Sharp, Dickson, Lambert, Seaborne, Fonte) or players who are out of favour at their current club and can be bought on the cheap (Chaplow, Hooiveld).

 

It would seem odd to suddenly change this previously successful strategy. However, if this journo has heard talk from three sources, then there may be something in it.

 

Having met Cortese at one of his dinners, he did come across as fiercely ambitious. He told a story at the one I went to where Markus said [paraphrased], "When we get to the Premiership, I don't want us to spend too much, too soon. Let's just consolidate within the league." to which Cortese replied "But I want to win the Champions League."

 

This is easy to laugh at, but I think it's an insight into his mentality.

 

I hope we keep Adkins, that he neither gets sacked nor lured away to manage another Premier League team.

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This theory of Cortese wanting to spend big and Adkins wanting to be cautious doesn't really fit with the rumour we're going back in for Gary Hooper with a £7m bid. Clearly if its true Hooper is an Adkins choice, and £7m is a lot for a striker playing in a league which is miles below the Premier League in terms of quality.

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Alan Nixon ‏@reluctantnicko

@cj_garrett If he gets bumped it would be an attractive job. Long-term links between him and Cortese.

 

I'll take a guess at what those long term links are.

In 1993 Di Matteo was a member of FC Aarau's Swiss Championship winning side. He is actually dual nationality Swiss-Italian.

Cortese grew up in Menziken and lived in Ennetbaden, in the Canton on Aargau. The capital of Aargau is Aarau - about 20km from Menziken.

Both Italian speaking Swiss, living in the same area, similar age. I'd be amazed if their paths never crossed, particularly if Cortese was already involved in Sports banking at that time.

Makes the link an interesting one - that said, I'd still rather see NA given a proper chance at the role. He's got us to where we are today, so deserves to give it a shot in the top league.

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This theory of Cortese wanting to spend big and Adkins wanting to be cautious doesn't really fit with the rumour we're going back in for Gary Hooper with a £7m bid. Clearly if its true Hooper is an Adkins choice, and £7m is a lot for a striker playing in a league which is miles below the Premier League in terms of quality.

 

Unless £7m for Hooper IS us being cautious?

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I'll take a guess at what those long term links are.

In 1993 Di Matteo was a member of FC Aarau's Swiss Championship winning side. He is actually dual nationality Swiss-Italian.

Cortese grew up in Menziken and lived in Ennetbaden, in the Canton on Aargau. The capital of Aargau is Aarau - about 20km from Menziken.

Both Italian speaking Swiss, living in the same area, similar age. I'd be amazed if their paths never crossed, particularly if Cortese was already involved in Sports banking at that time.

Makes the link an interesting one - that said, I'd still rather see NA given a proper chance at the role. He's got us to where we are today, so deserves to give it a shot in the top league.

 

I remember reading somewhere that NC had an eye for an investment in sport and Di Matteo was the one who alerted Cortese to our situation back in 2009.

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Maybe Nige would be happy to take a job as senior physio with us if RDM took over.

 

In all seriousness, I can't believe for one second that a Champions League winning manager would take the Saints job. I think he'll get the Chelsea job, I don't believe that Adkins will get the boot, and even if Di Matteo and Adkins lose their jobs, Di Matteo will be a very sought after manager.

 

As mentioned before, it would be an absolute travesty if NA wasn't given a fair shot with us in the PL.

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I remember reading somewhere that NC had an eye for an investment in sport and Di Matteo was the one who alerted Cortese to our situation back in 2009.

 

Interesting. Not heard that before.

 

Wasn't it something to do with Oldknow?

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I have heard from a number of sources who have connections within the club that Pardew's removal was not for footballing reasons.

 

I can't think of any precedent of a manager winning promotion for a team and getting replaced before the start of the season. Di Matteo was given the boot from West Brom, despite getting them promoted and replaced by Hodgson, but that was mid-season.

 

Adkins has managed the club well, in my opinion. Also, I'm not convinced by the story that Cortese wants to suddenly start throwing money about. Most of our transfers have been taking the best players from clubs who are skint and can't turn down the money (Barnard, Sharp, Dickson, Lambert, Seaborne, Fonte) or players who are out of favour at their current club and can be bought on the cheap (Chaplow, Hooiveld).

 

It would seem odd to suddenly change this previously successful strategy. However, if this journo has heard talk from three sources, then there may be something in it.

 

Having met Cortese at one of his dinners, he did come across as fiercely ambitious. He told a story at the one I went to where Markus said [paraphrased], "When we get to the Premiership, I don't want us to spend too much, too soon. Let's just consolidate within the league." to which Cortese replied "But I want to win the Champions League."

 

This is easy to laugh at, but I think it's an insight into his mentality.

 

I hope we keep Adkins, that he neither gets sacked nor lured away to manage another Premier League team.

 

Cortese took the only course available to him when he suspended Pardew and Downes.

 

If Cortese makes the mistake of buying expensive and real class is very expensive we may well be back in the NPC next season. The spirit of this squad is still the backbone of any team we field, to get rid of Adkins after successive promotions would be crass. Norwich and Swansea showed the way manager and transfer wise and didn't pay silly money or salaries. QPR on the other hand chose the big name road and were nearly relegated. Last season Adkins organised a pre season that gave us a succession of wins for the first time in many years which ultimately was the difference in gaining automatic promotion. Liverpool, Aston Villa etc have shown that big names are no guarantee.

 

The People have speculated rubbish for the last fifty years. Alex Pearce was out of order and hardly a confidant of Cortese. I'll stick to the OS as the official news confirmation of anything changing. I would like to think that Cortese will back Adkins.

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Cortese took the only course available to him when he suspended Pardew and Downes.

 

If Cortese makes the mistake of buying expensive and real class is very expensive we may well be back in the NPC next season. The spirit of this squad is still the backbone of any team we field, to get rid of Adkins after successive promotions would be crass. Norwich and Swansea showed the way manager and transfer wise and didn't pay silly money or salaries. QPR on the other hand chose the big name road and were nearly relegated. Last season Adkins organised a pre season that gave us a succession of wins for the first time in many years which ultimately was the difference in gaining automatic promotion. Liverpool, Aston Villa etc have shown that big names are no guarantee.

 

The People have speculated rubbish for the last fifty years. Alex Pearce was out of order and hardly a confidant of Cortese. I'll stick to the OS as the official news confirmation of anything changing. I would like to think that Cortese will back Adkins.

 

Why would it be a mistake buying class?

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Why would it be a mistake buying class?

 

It wouldn't, many of the speculated targets are expensive, but unproven at Premier level. The real class is very expensive and I suspect way out of our salary expectations. Better to shop the best players we have played against in the last two years. With the possible addition of a couple of good foreign players.

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It wouldn't, many of the speculated targets are expensive, but unproven at Premier level. The real class is very expensive and I suspect way out of our salary expectations. Better to shop the best players we have played against in the last two years. With the possible addition of a couple of good foreign players.

 

Spot. On.

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Does nobody else find it strange that cortese hasn't said one word since we were promoted? Also the fact Adkins did not and has mentioned Cortese once is very worrying. I think he thanked everyone apart from Cortese. Will be gutted if Adkins left, let's hope tomorrows press conf is a new contract for Adkins and not his marching orders.

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A couple of thoughts:

 

1. Just because a manager is successful at one thing does not mean he is the right man for the next job. Di Matteo has worked wonders at Chelsea but if they have a desire to rebuild a team to play in the style of Barcelona, then surely the best qualified manager available is Pep Guardiola?

 

2. I used to be all for managerial stability but the world has changed. Arsenal have had one manager for nine years and won NOTHING. Chelsea have had 8 managers and won TEN trophies during the same period...

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I dont buy this, NC wants to spend big and Adkins wants to be sensible.

 

There's not a Manager alive who would try and persuade the Chairman to put his money away. If there is anything in it, it's more likely to be that NC doesn't think Nigel has the clout or pull to bring big players in, but I dont believe for one minute that given the chance Nigel would say, "No Mr chairman, we need to build slowly and be sensible". I can see it now, "Nigel we need a top class international Keeper, and I'm willing to fund him", "No, I'm happy with Kelvin, he's a good lad".

 

IF.... NC is offering to take us to another level money wise, and Nigel is resisting, then he needs to be moved on. But, I dont buy that theory.

 

There's no doubt that NC is ruthless, bad start and Nige will be toast. Let's hope that Nigel hits the ground running becaues I'd love to see him here for a decade or so.

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A couple of thoughts:

 

1. Just because a manager is successful at one thing does not mean he is the right man for the next job. Di Matteo has worked wonders at Chelsea but if they have a desire to rebuild a team to play in the style of Barcelona, then surely the best qualified manager available is Pep Guardiola?

 

2. I used to be all for managerial stability but the world has changed. Arsenal have had one manager for nine years and won NOTHING. Chelsea have had 8 managers and won TEN trophies during the same period...

 

Very selective indeed. When Arsenal were winning lots of trophies, Wenger had already been at the club for nearly 10 years.

 

And Chelsea have had a largely settled core of a side since Mourinho who have been in many ways bigger than most the managers they have gone through. Arsenal have lost key players in their prime time and time again, mainly due to their refusal to compete with other big teams on salaries.

 

Chelsea have been a declining force in the prem and would be in the Uefa cup if they handn't won the champs league, so their erratic management decisions haven't been a complete success.

 

Very rarely do sides achieve success through choping and changing. It's not some kind of modern revolution. If Real Madrid had done their usual thing by sacking Mourinho after 1 season, they probably wouldn't have won the league this year.

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Does nobody else find it strange that cortese hasn't said one word since we were promoted? Also the fact Adkins did not and has mentioned Cortese once is very worrying. I think he thanked everyone apart from Cortese. Will be gutted if Adkins left, let's hope tomorrows press conf is a new contract for Adkins and not his marching orders.

 

What press conference?

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A couple of thoughts:

 

1. Just because a manager is successful at one thing does not mean he is the right man for the next job. Di Matteo has worked wonders at Chelsea but if they have a desire to rebuild a team to play in the style of Barcelona, then surely the best qualified manager available is Pep Guardiola?

 

2. I used to be all for managerial stability but the world has changed. Arsenal have had one manager for nine years and won NOTHING. Chelsea have had 8 managers and won TEN trophies during the same period...

 

That managerial stability thing is the biggest myth in football.

 

Pretty much every successful manager in every successful club is successful within a year (or a first full season). And that includes common poster boys for stability Moyes and Wenger, both successful very quickly.

 

And all our successful managers since the eighties have been instant successes: Ball, Hoddle, Jones, Strachan, Pardew, Adkins.

 

Instant success works, so you can see why chairmen chop and change. If the team aint working after a year or so, twisting is just as good as sticking.

 

Thankfully for us is it is working, so no need to do anything except support our Nige.

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Than managerial stability thing is the biggest myth in football.

 

Pretty much every successful manager in every successful club is successful within a year (or a first full season). And that includes common poster boys for stability Moyes and Wenger, both successful very quickly.

 

And all our successful managers since the eighties have been instant successes: Ball, Hoddle, Jones, Strachan, Pardew, Adkins.

 

Instant success works, so you can see why chairmen chop and change. If the team aint working after a year or so, twisting is just as good as sticking.

 

Thankfully for us is it is working, so no need to do anything except support our Nige.

 

Pretty much but Sir Furious was a c**t hair away from being fired in his first season at united.

 

You cant mould a team without time.

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That managerial stability thing is the biggest myth in football.

 

Pretty much every successful manager in every successful club is successful within a year (or a first full season). And that includes common poster boys for stability Moyes and Wenger, both successful very quickly.

 

And all our successful managers since the eighties have been instant successes: Ball, Hoddle, Jones, Strachan, Pardew, Adkins.

 

Instant success works, so you can see why chairmen chop and change. If the team aint working after a year or so, twisting is just as good as sticking.

 

Thankfully for us is it is working, so no need to do anything except support our Nige.

 

Yes it's fine if you realise that something isn't working and it's largely down to the manager. Mostly this comes down to the chairman appointing a complete and utter numpty (wigley, gray, burley, dutch clowns)or not backing their man.

 

When chopping and changing is due to sheer impatience when there was not much wrong in the first place, then it's a problem. Too much is often a sign of a chairman trying to mopp up his own mess.

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Hmmm Di Matteo would be a great manager.... Seriously why the bloody hell would we get rid of Nige though???

 

Agreed, however RDM seems to favour the Italian way - defensive and cautious tactics, which is totally against what ML and NC have always stated - that they wanted exciting football?? Think we shoud stick with NA - he could be our greatest manager in time (if he has said time!)

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One of the best threads I've read on here for a while, even if some of the stuff is potentially going to create some short-term uproar. The journo is being pretty candid with responses, which could come back to haunt him if he's wrong or telling porkies. I think he's probably legit. Stands to lose quite a bit for dishing out bad info, and we've seen other signs or "misspeaks" that would support his claims.

 

Good spot on the close geographical and cultural connections between Cortese and Di Matteo, ZurichSaint and Saint-Armstrong.

 

Superficially, Di Matteo looks the dogs boll*cks with the Champions League win, and he's to be rightly commended for that success. I actually do think that fact alone could tip the balance in many of the players that we might want to sign. If this is actually on the cards, the headlines alone would raise the profile of the club, first because the club has dispensed with the services of a successful manager, and second because the winner of the Champions League has joined lowly Southampton. Cortese gets to add to his reputation, and can point to Di Matteo as proof that he is able to carry out his vision.

 

Di Matteo's future at Chelsea far from certain - largely because they don't know how effective he'll be in the transfer market or how he will perform over a league season.

 

To answer Lord D's point a little bit, "why wouldn't Nige want big players?":-

 

Well, he would. But if Cortese identifies someone Nige doesn't feel he can convince then Nige has a problem, especially if Cortese takes the view that someone with Di Matteo's newly-increased stature could.

 

All comes down to what "spend big" means. If Cortese is looking to make a 30M marquee signing, would the club be more likely to land him with Di Matteo or Adkins in charge?

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An example of the "dark arts" employed by RL. Why doesn't he just accept that he is history, we were all glad to see the back of him, and leave it at that? There is no way RDM will come here after winning the European Cup, and, quite frankly, I don't think he is all that. On another day, Chelsea would have been beaten comprehensively. I don't fancy watching Saints with 10 men behind the ball when we play Wigan. That's the equivalent scenario.

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Does nobody else find it strange that cortese hasn't said one word since we were promoted? Also the fact Adkins did not and has mentioned Cortese once is very worrying. I think he thanked everyone apart from Cortese. Will be gutted if Adkins left, let's hope tomorrows press conf is a new contract for Adkins and not his marching orders.

 

Adkins did mention in a post promotion interview (can't remember where I read it) that cortesi has "massive ambitions" for the club. I know he has praised cortesi for working hard behind the scenes during transfer windows. I am trying to recall if adkins mentioned cortesi @ awards dinner. Maybe someone else who was there can remember?

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Whatever happens it is out of our hands and there isn't a thing we can do about it.cortese has a vision and a target,he is acting on behalf of a family that has probably specified that they want a certain amount of return on their investment and cortese will do whatever it takes to fulfill his obligations,if that includes dispensing with NA then that is what he will do.

There seems to be little room for sentiment in the world of cortese,he obviously has a job to do and tbh we have to trust his decisions because so far he has delivered success (mostly),I'm not one for blind faith without question, but he is delivering and I'm happy for him to keep doing his stuff.

I believe NA was signed to get us to the prem,this has happened a lot sooner than everyone expected so I now think cortese is in a difficult position,does he stick with Nigel or does he stick with the master plan.

He doesn't seem the type to stray from his duty so if he now decides NA isn't the man for the task ahead then a change is on the cards.

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Whatever happens it is out of our hands and there isn't a thing we can do about it.cortese has a vision and a target,he is acting on behalf of a family that has probably specified that they want a certain amount of return on their investment and cortese will do whatever it takes to fulfill his obligations,if that includes dispensing with NA then that is what he will do.

There seems to be little room for sentiment in the world of cortese,he obviously has a job to do and tbh we have to trust his decisions because so far he has delivered success (mostly),I'm not one for blind faith without question, but he is delivering and I'm happy for him to keep doing his stuff.

I believe NA was signed to get us to the prem,this has happened a lot sooner than everyone expected so I now think cortese is in a difficult position,does he stick with Nigel or does he stick with the master plan.

He doesn't seem the type to stray from his duty so if he now decides NA isn't the man for the task ahead then a change is on the cards.

 

Not disputing what you say but it would be strange for cortesi to have extended adkins contract like he did if he saw no future for him to manage in prem. Maybe it was more of a financial reward rather than faith in his ability?

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He isn't looking to make a 30m marquee signing!

 

That's why I said if.

 

Anyway, do you definitely know this or are you just basing your opinion on your own expectation?

 

Like I said, depends on what "spend big" means.

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