derry Posted 9 May, 2012 Share Posted 9 May, 2012 At the start there was nothing like this just a diver and bottles slung on the hull. Originally just the standard one at a time use of the escape hatch but then modified for five to use. I believe only on the D/E boats. Two drowned in Loch Long many years ago when the boat sank rapidly and pulled the guard boat tethered to the periscope mount under, but the rope broke. One SBS managed to make the surface but two sank due to all the equipment attached and negative buoyancy as the bottles didn't have enough air to inflate the suits. I think they added lifejackets to inflate and get them to the surface after that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dubai_phil Posted 9 May, 2012 Share Posted 9 May, 2012 too late Phil - One Shot comes out on 21st December - with Tom Cruise as Reacher. Bizarre choice as reacher is supposed to be 6'4" and 220lbs! I did know that hence the WTF were you thinking when you cast the dwarf Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thedelldays Posted 9 May, 2012 Author Share Posted 9 May, 2012 At the start there was nothing like this just a diver and bottles slung on the hull. Originally just the standard one at a time use of the escape hatch but then modified for five to use. I believe only on the D/E boats. Two drowned in Loch Long many years ago when the boat sank rapidly and pulled the guard boat tethered to the periscope mount under, but the rope broke. One SBS managed to make the surface but two sank due to all the equipment attached and negative buoyancy as the bottles didn't have enough air to inflate the suits. I think they added lifejackets to inflate and get them to the surface after that. pretty dangerous shyt Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
derry Posted 9 May, 2012 Share Posted 9 May, 2012 pretty dangerous shyt Understatement of the year, you'd need a deathwish to do it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
moonraker Posted 9 May, 2012 Share Posted 9 May, 2012 At the start there was nothing like this just a diver and bottles slung on the hull. Originally just the standard one at a time use of the escape hatch but then modified for five to use. I believe only on the D/E boats. Two drowned in Loch Long many years ago when the boat sank rapidly and pulled the guard boat tethered to the periscope mount under, but the rope broke. One SBS managed to make the surface but two sank due to all the equipment attached and negative buoyancy as the bottles didn't have enough air to inflate the suits. I think they added lifejackets to inflate and get them to the surface after that. I was there HMS ORPHEUS not quite as you describe but close enough. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deeps Posted 9 May, 2012 Share Posted 9 May, 2012 At the start there was nothing like this just a diver and bottles slung on the hull. Originally just the standard one at a time use of the escape hatch but then modified for five to use. I believe only on the D/E boats. Two drowned in Loch Long many years ago when the boat sank rapidly and pulled the guard boat tethered to the periscope mount under, but the rope broke. One SBS managed to make the surface but two sank due to all the equipment attached and negative buoyancy as the bottles didn't have enough air to inflate the suits. I think they added lifejackets to inflate and get them to the surface after that. I was on that boat at the time fitted with the chamber carrying out exit and re-ntry when the two Royals drowned. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
moonraker Posted 9 May, 2012 Share Posted 9 May, 2012 I was on that boat at the time fitted with the chamber carrying out exit and re-ntry when the two Royals drowned. Ships company or rider? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
so22saint Posted 9 May, 2012 Share Posted 9 May, 2012 Can I weigh in with being chuffed when I saw the waterfall sonar we'd worked on on Hunt for Red October.. Not as macho as escaping drowning mind you Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deeps Posted 9 May, 2012 Share Posted 9 May, 2012 (edited) Ships company or rider? Ships Company. - Scratcher. We probably know each other. I was on Orpheus for 11 years (and 2 months)!! Edited 9 May, 2012 by Deeps Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BadgerBadger Posted 9 May, 2012 Share Posted 9 May, 2012 I preffered 20,000 Leagues Under the Sea, James Mason was cool coz he kept what he had forgotten to himself - nice pad also: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hamster Posted 9 May, 2012 Share Posted 9 May, 2012 Respect. All in the name of the greater good. Genuine respect. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
moonraker Posted 10 May, 2012 Share Posted 10 May, 2012 Ships Company. - Scratcher. We probably know each other. I was on Orpheus for 11 years (and 2 months)!! 2 years greeny/fore-endy left Orpheus 77 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
doddisalegend Posted 10 May, 2012 Share Posted 10 May, 2012 Wow we're blessed with a lot of navy boys around here.....shouldn't you lot be supporting the club down the road (joke) Fair play to all you sub boys my old man point blank refused to go on subs and left the navy early rather than go on subs. He loved ships on top of the water, he still talks about HMS cleopatra (Leander class) with great fondness today, not so keen on boats that go under the water though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thedelldays Posted 10 May, 2012 Author Share Posted 10 May, 2012 Wow we're blessed with a lot of navy boys around here.....shouldn't you lot be supporting the club down the road (joke) Fair play to all you sub boys my old man point blank refused to go on subs and left the navy early rather than go on subs. He loved ships on top of the water, he still talks about HMS cleopatra (Leander class) with great fondness today, not so keen on boats that go under the water though. the fellas above are "proper" submariners....they were what is was all about on the old "O" boats...what i serve on sometimes are like ships anyway. just a bit cramped Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
doddisalegend Posted 10 May, 2012 Share Posted 10 May, 2012 the fellas above are "proper" submariners....they were what is was all about on the old "O" boats...what i serve on sometimes are like ships anyway. just a bit cramped Closest I've been to a sub was the tour of HMS alliance at the sub museum at Gosport. Basically a WW2 sub that was built to late for WW2 so soldier on through the cold war...way to claustrophobic for me and the thing wasn't even under water. Fair play to you or anyone else that could live on one of those things I need the blue (or at least the grey drizzily) sky above my head. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thedelldays Posted 10 May, 2012 Author Share Posted 10 May, 2012 Closest I've been to a sub was the tour of HMS alliance at the sub museum at Gosport. Basically a WW2 sub that was built to late for WW2 so soldier on through the cold war...way to claustrophobic for me and the thing wasn't even under water. Fair play to you or anyone else that could live on one of those things I need the blue (or at least the grey drizzily) sky above my head. yeah, they kinda moved on since those things Go on a Trident boat and that is circa 18k tons dived.......not much smaller than HMS Ark Royal (obviously not as big but massive all the same) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ken Tone Posted 10 May, 2012 Share Posted 10 May, 2012 Respect to anyone who can put up with any sub ....even your modern 'luxury pad' Delldays. If you want a good (fiction) read about the really early days, ie 1st world war subs, try 'A Sailor of Austria' by John Biggins. They were just tin cans that went underwater for a while. Must have been terrifying. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ohio Saint Posted 10 May, 2012 Share Posted 10 May, 2012 (edited) Respect to anyone who can put up with any sub ....even your modern 'luxury pad' Delldays. If you want a good (fiction) read about the really early days, ie 1st world war subs, try 'A Sailor of Austria' by John Biggins. They were just tin cans that went underwater for a while. Must have been terrifying. Not as bad as the American civil war sub. 7 guys hunched over a hand crank to make the thing go! http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/H._L._Hunley_(submarine) Edited 10 May, 2012 by Ohio Saint Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
View From The Top Posted 10 May, 2012 Share Posted 10 May, 2012 As an ex-skimmer Jack I have to say I think all submariners are 'kin nuts. That is all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thedelldays Posted 10 May, 2012 Author Share Posted 10 May, 2012 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thedelldays Posted 10 May, 2012 Author Share Posted 10 May, 2012 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thedelldays Posted 10 May, 2012 Author Share Posted 10 May, 2012 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dubai_phil Posted 10 May, 2012 Share Posted 10 May, 2012 On the subject of Not Bad Submarine movies. Ice Station Zebra. That was well cool well it came out (oops sorry didn't mean cool as in cold but cool as oh sod it) Rock Hudson in a Nuclear Sub eh? What a hunk he was......... (Said my Mum as we left the cinema all those years ago.) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
moonraker Posted 10 May, 2012 Share Posted 10 May, 2012 The difinitive SM movie is Das Boot, best watched in German with subtitles. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ken Tone Posted 10 May, 2012 Share Posted 10 May, 2012 Not as bad as the American civil war sub. 7 guys hunched over a hand crank to make the thing go! http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/H._L._Hunley_(submarine) Ah but at least they didn't die from the diesel fumes like submariners in the 1st WW ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
derry Posted 10 May, 2012 Share Posted 10 May, 2012 I was on that boat at the time fitted with the chamber carrying out exit and re-ntry when the two Royals drowned. Was that the boat that had the deck modified to provide a recess that a team could ride in outside, breathing air from the sub. Used after helicopter drop to sub outside radar range, then transit to target (ie rig) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ohio Saint Posted 10 May, 2012 Share Posted 10 May, 2012 Ah but at least they didn't die from the diesel fumes like submariners in the 1st WW ! Diesel fumes or drowning. Tough choice! I choose dry land and old age please! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deeps Posted 10 May, 2012 Share Posted 10 May, 2012 (edited) Was that the boat that had the deck modified to provide a recess that a team could ride in outside, breathing air from the sub. Used after helicopter drop to sub outside radar range, then transit to target (ie rig) Hi Derry, The chamber was fitted under the casing (deck) and attached over one of the submarine's hatches.(the casing was free flood) . The chamber held 5 persons who could breath on air being fed through a system from inside the submarine. They could leave and access the boat whilst dived but by god you had to be going at a very, very slow speed or they would get washed off the casing. With the accident previously mentioned the Captain had a lot of decisions to make - Increase speed which could of then washed them off the casing and possible through the propellors, Emergency Surface (Rapid Ascent) which could of still washed them off the casing or blow internal tanks to give him slower controlled ascent which is what he did. One of the team (Dutch) was hanging off the top of the fin (conning tower) when we surfaced but alive. We spent all night on the surface together with RNLI, Helicopters, Coastguard looking for two to no avail until a Minehunter was called in and the two were identified at the bottom of the loch quite deep. Your correct with regards to being used for Rigs.(and other things!!) Edited 10 May, 2012 by Deeps Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
derry Posted 10 May, 2012 Share Posted 10 May, 2012 The report I had was from an SBS on the tender above who was waiting for the three to finish then join the sub. He saw the inflatable pulled down but the rope mounting broke before the thing was pulled under. Apparently the first out went back to warn the two coming out but they didn't understand in the dark, so as he had no air he went for the surface, then they were blown off before they could plug their bottles in because the sub reached 110 ft and blew the tanks. The suit inflation bottles at that depth were almost empty because of the pressure at that depth so they weren't able to regain positive buoyancy so sank to the bottom (220ft ?) Takes a really special type to do that. The recess apparently in front of the conning tower and contained pipes etc which were moved to make room for a team to squat breathing from umbilicals, I understand the turbulence was unbelievable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thedelldays Posted 10 May, 2012 Author Share Posted 10 May, 2012 Derry, what is it you did/do to have such knowledge..? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
derry Posted 10 May, 2012 Share Posted 10 May, 2012 Airline Captain. Just read a lot. I did a four week round the world trip with an ex SBS engineer and ex SAS catering operative. The SBS guy Joined the marines and trained as an engineer was eventually invalided out with frost bitten feet in Norway, went back to engineering. The SAS guy was older and working for a catering company at Heathrow. He was very twitchy about his address and photographs. We used to spend the evenings chewing the fat. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
moonraker Posted 10 May, 2012 Share Posted 10 May, 2012 The accounts above are fairly accurate, Orpheus was the first boat fitted with the system and this was one of the earliest trials. I served in two other boats with the same systems and fortunately there were no other incidents like this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
derry Posted 10 May, 2012 Share Posted 10 May, 2012 Lot of varied experiences on here. It's very interesting reading. One of the SW members is the Captain of the BA 747 that lost all four engines in an eruption over Java in 1982 ish. He reads but doesn't post. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deeps Posted 10 May, 2012 Share Posted 10 May, 2012 (edited) The report I had was from an SBS on the tender above who was waiting for the three to finish then join the sub. He saw the inflatable pulled down but the rope mounting broke before the thing was pulled under. Apparently the first out went back to warn the two coming out but they didn't understand in the dark, so as he had no air he went for the surface, then they were blown off before they could plug their bottles in because the sub reached 110 ft and blew the tanks. The suit inflation bottles at that depth were almost empty because of the pressure at that depth so they weren't able to regain positive buoyancy so sank to the bottom (220ft ?) Takes a really special type to do that. The recess apparently in front of the conning tower and contained pipes etc which were moved to make room for a team to squat breathing from umbilicals, I understand the turbulence was unbelievable. I assure you the inflatable/safety boat was not pulled down or not even secured to the boat in anyway. Its a different matter when towing and normally two inflatables are used with a rope laid between them and they are snagged by the periscope and then towed. Being a scratcher I was "invited out" when they did this on a practice run in the Channel and it's scary see the scope coming towards you at a few knots and it's quite noisey with the "feather" formed from the scope. I remember the Captain saying to me later as he had (obviously) been watching through the scope that I was obviously enjoying myself. It was nervous laughter - I was shatting myself!! The inflatable coxswains have to get it more or less exactly centre as they could capsize. Edited 10 May, 2012 by Deeps Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alpine_saint Posted 11 May, 2012 Share Posted 11 May, 2012 On the subject of Not Bad Submarine movies. Ice Station Zebra. That was well cool well it came out (oops sorry didn't mean cool as in cold but cool as oh sod it) Rock Hudson in a Nuclear Sub eh? What a hunk he was......... (Said my Mum as we left the cinema all those years ago.) As sub movies go, that has to rate as the absolutely worst adaption of a book. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alpine_saint Posted 11 May, 2012 Share Posted 11 May, 2012 The difinitive SM movie is Das Boot, best watched in German with subtitles. Excellent series, can now be bought as one joined (6 hour long) film. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
derry Posted 11 May, 2012 Share Posted 11 May, 2012 (edited) I assure you the inflatable/safety boat was not pulled down or not even secured to the boat in anyway. Its a different matter when towing and normally two inflatables are used with a rope laid between them and they are snagged by the periscope and then towed. Being a scratcher I was "invited out" when they did this on a practice run in the Channel and it's scary see the scope coming towards you at a few knots and it's quite noisey with the "feather" formed from the scope. I remember the Captain saying to me later as he had (obviously) been watching through the scope that I was obviously enjoying myself. It was nervous laughter - I was shatting myself!! The inflatable coxswains have to get it more or less exactly centre as they could capsize. I wouldn't argue with you as you were there. The SBS eye witness in the tender said that the safety boat was tethered and pulled down but not under as the attachment broke but the three crew were tipped out then one was nearly brained by one of the outboards as the boat crashed back down. He said he went back to the shore in the tender whilst the search was going on with Huk? the NCO that survived. I presume that was where he got his underwater information. He also said that the diver was also trying to tell the two (Chris & Jim?) to get back to the chamber but was snatched off by his communication lead tautening as the sub dropped so made for the surface, but he had a proper air supply. Apparently the three had a fresh water excursion the day before but nowhere as deep and no problem for them. That was interesting because he described a technique for recovering at night canoes or boats on a 100 ft line stretched from the bow of each craft with the sub's sonar tracking different frequency transmitters in each craft. He described it as difficult for the sub and the craft although there was guidance the angle of approach was anybody's guess. He was supposed to be picked up one night, the sub spotted them on the sonar but made a parallel approach and passed a yard or so away but the rear pax jumped and initially tried to catch the periscope but fell off. The sub left them there. (off Isle of Arran) Edited 11 May, 2012 by derry Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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