Legod Third Coming Posted 11 May, 2012 Share Posted 11 May, 2012 Can you tell me what Pompey's was ???? ........... I seem to have missed it On the one hand there is a great example of how not to run a football club... On the other, there is the evidence of how simple these plans can be. 1. Find a good manager. 2. Give him the budget to buy and pay the best players available. It took Pompey from nowhere to Europe and a Cup. (They couldn't afford it, but that is not the point). Turkish seems to want revolution in football but we don't need it. The recipe is old and proven. It's never been changed. Chelsea - Mourinho plus cash equals win the league. United - Ferguson plus cash equals win the league. Citeh - Mancini plus cash equals win the league.... I could go on but I think you get the point... What HAS changed dramatically is one thing. The source of the money. And that is what a changing world (yes HTC and all) has done to football and will keep on doing, in ways we cannot predict or imagine. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wes Tender Posted 11 May, 2012 Share Posted 11 May, 2012 It is posts like this on threads like this that really make mefear for the sanity of some posters on this forum. He's just so superior, isn't he? If there was an award for most arrogant poster, nobody else would stand a chance. He would win it year after year. It's useless trying to debate anything sensible against this towering intellect, as he is never wrong and his opinion cannot be challenged, unless one wishes to gain a response full condescending sarcasm. Again, were there awards for that, he would undoubtedly have no peers. He is the master of twisting what others say to suit his own position. If one dares to suggest for example that Southampton has a better catchment area than most other clubs at this level, it is translated in his small-mindedness into area, with a sparse population. In sharp contrast, the areas around his examples are more densely populated than Hong Kong. But like you, and I'm sure many others, his snide arrogance will not make people believe how clever he is; they will pity him, that he cannot indulge in debate without resorting to this puerility. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CB Fry Posted 11 May, 2012 Share Posted 11 May, 2012 He's just so superior, isn't he? If there was an award for most arrogant poster, nobody else would stand a chance. He would win it year after year. It's useless trying to debate anything sensible against this towering intellect, as he is never wrong and his opinion cannot be challenged, unless one wishes to gain a response full condescending sarcasm. Again, were there awards for that, he would undoubtedly have no peers. He is the master of twisting what others say to suit his own position. If one dares to suggest for example that Southampton has a better catchment area than most other clubs at this level, it is translated in his small-mindedness into area, with a sparse population. In sharp contrast, the areas around his examples are more densely populated than Hong Kong. But like you, and I'm sure many others, his snide arrogance will not make people believe how clever he is; they will pity him, that he cannot indulge in debate without resorting to this puerility. Not more densely populated than Hong Kong. Just more densely populated than the New Forest. No twisting. Just facts. You're wrong but can't help being a squinnying drama queen about it. Other clubs on earth have potential too. No twisting. Just facts. Run along. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CB Fry Posted 11 May, 2012 Share Posted 11 May, 2012 Can you tell me what Pompey's was ???? ........... I seem to have missed it Funny I can remember lots of CAPITAL LETTER strewn rants from you about POMPEY SHOW US HOW TO INVEST IN THE TEAM AFTER THEIR CUP FINAL WHY DIDN'T WE DO THAT. You were a very big advocate of their plan at one point. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thedelldays Posted 11 May, 2012 Share Posted 11 May, 2012 so, we got to a cup final last time in the prem and top half of the league no problem and mixed it up with the best...yet I would say an SMS a little bit bigger would have been enough.. why all of a sudden, are we going to attract thousands off all over the south.....why won't these floating fans go to reading..? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wes Tender Posted 11 May, 2012 Share Posted 11 May, 2012 Not more densely populated than Hong Kong. Just more densely populated than the New Forest. No twisting. Just facts. You're wrong but can't help being a squinnying drama queen about it. Other clubs on earth have potential too. No twisting. Just facts. Run along. Derby's got massive potential, what with their catchment area including the Peak District. My word, that's really densely populated, isn't it? When other clubs have potential, that's a fact, but when we've got potential, that's just an opinion and one that is met with derision. And Sheffield Wednesday, Derby and Notts Forest could be huge. Provided that they had decent managers, decent players, wealthy owners. But they don't, unfortunately. And anyway, the perceived wisdom by the most intelligent posters (at least in their own minds), on here is that the top four positions can never be breached. Mind you, I recall them saying that before Man City broke into the top four and before Liverpool left it. And Newcastle and Tottenham weren't doing quite as well then either. Things change, apart from certain individuals' perception of what is possible and what is written in stone. These are facts, by the way. Because I say so. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CB Fry Posted 11 May, 2012 Share Posted 11 May, 2012 (edited) Derby's got massive potential, what with their catchment area including the Peak District. My word, that's really densely populated, isn't it? When other clubs have potential, that's a fact, but when we've got potential, that's just an opinion and one that is met with derision. And Sheffield Wednesday, Derby and Notts Forest could be huge. Provided that they had decent managers, decent players, wealthy owners. But they don't, unfortunately. And anyway, the perceived wisdom by the most intelligent posters (at least in their own minds), on here is that the top four positions can never be breached. Mind you, I recall them saying that before Man City broke into the top four and before Liverpool left it. And Newcastle and Tottenham weren't doing quite as well then either. Things change, apart from certain individuals' perception of what is possible and what is written in stone. These are facts, by the way. Because I say so. That will the Peak District with towns like Buxton, Ashbourne, Belper and Bakewell as well as the other towns in the Derwent Valley. Plenty of people there son. And lets be clear I never said Saints have no potrntial to grow. Just that our catchment area is not some "unique" commercial advantage we have over other which you and others are saying. And you made great play of clubs like Derby and Forest being close being a problem but it isn't much like Sheff Weds can blow our attendances out of the water in League one last weekend. And I've never said we could never get in the top four. Yet more fiction in your twisted head. Of course we can. If we do though its not suddenly going to bring thousands of new fans from Trowbridge just because you've scrawled it on a map with a biro between your teeth. Edited 11 May, 2012 by CB Fry Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CB Fry Posted 11 May, 2012 Share Posted 11 May, 2012 ... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frank's cousin Posted 11 May, 2012 Share Posted 11 May, 2012 All clubs have 'potential' - but if you want to get beyond the hard core (which in itself depends on what division you are in), you have to offer the punters something in return... for some its the opposition, for some its success, for others attractive entertaining football and others a decent prawn sandwich and other quality catering. Its a chicken and egg scenario: success attracts more regular follows, but without funding from other sources in very competitive leagues its very difficult for the Derby's, Forest and Saints of this world to begin to realise it all. Its why our 18 mil spent over revenue in 3 years, despite being not the most, has been good value and what the club has achieved remarkable... Football attendences were in massive decline from the early 70s to late 80s. Interesting programme on BC2 on the '70s' last night, suggested this was initially due to a cultural and economic shift - up to teh late 60s and early 70s footbal was a generational passtime, Grandads, sons and grandchildren all hitting the terraces on a saturday - engrained in the working mans culture. By teh mid seventies (so the premise went), many of the fathers and grandfathers had a new (relative) affluence and other pastimes took over and census data was used to back this up... even if that equarted to no more than polishing the Hilman or Rover on the drive of the new semi-detached. It left the terraces to the youth and without the fathers and grandfathers to keep them in check, 'allowed' the terrace culture to evolve into the tribalistic nature that drove the hooligan element... which in turn kept others away. So using the early 80s when we had great success as a benchmark for our potential is flawed. The 90s saw another shift - the Sky years - the new money enable many clubs to build new satdia, cash in on premium priced inner city land and replace crumbling terraces with shiney new identikits compete with plastic seats and what some would say are plastic fans - the ticket prices shot up and families and clowns were encouraged, but with the added all seater restrictions, came further price hikes in response to both demand and the costs associated with the new breed of football wage packet... You could argue that for a club to realise its true potential it needs to attract: All locals with an interest in the local side more regularly - 45K (and we could have sold more) for the paint pot final, shows ther is interest - OK so half of thsoe probably only go to one game a year, but how do you get them to go to more? Folk from the surrounding areas that have a passing interest, but dont see the value/quality in the price you have to pay for a ticket - success would help as does decent infrastructure and ease of access Get the generations going again... again quality, atmosphere and entertainment helps, but you need to catch them young with success. I have no idea what average gate we COULD achieve if we were regularly challenging for a top 8 place, flirting with Europe and were not restricted by capacity so that ticket price bands could make the cost more acceptable and barable for a greater demographic, but to say its limited to x, when we have never been in that position seems just as ignorant a view as thsoe that believe NC will fund CL football inside of 5 years. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Turkish Posted 11 May, 2012 Share Posted 11 May, 2012 He's just so superior, isn't he? If there was an award for most arrogant poster, nobody else would stand a chance. He would win it year after year. It's useless trying to debate anything sensible against this towering intellect, as he is never wrong and his opinion cannot be challenged, unless one wishes to gain a response full condescending sarcasm. Again, were there awards for that, he would undoubtedly have no peers. He is the master of twisting what others say to suit his own position. If one dares to suggest for example that Southampton has a better catchment area than most other clubs at this level, it is translated in his small-mindedness into area, with a sparse population. In sharp contrast, the areas around his examples are more densely populated than Hong Kong. But like you, and I'm sure many others, his snide arrogance will not make people believe how clever he is; they will pity him, that he cannot indulge in debate without resorting to this puerility. Utter bollix again. It would be a two horse race between you and verbal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thedelldays Posted 11 May, 2012 Share Posted 11 May, 2012 i wanna know where all these new fans were when we were actually proven in the prem and got to a cup final etc.. why won't they go to reading also..? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matthew Le God Posted 11 May, 2012 Share Posted 11 May, 2012 i wanna know where all these new fans were when we were actually proven in the prem and got to a cup final etc.. Well as St Mary's was sold out most weeks last time in the Premier League and averaged over 30k every season (including the relegation season), anyone unable to get a ticket was able to do whatever they wanted on a matchday. As soon as the "sold out" banner goes up why would you try to get a ticket from the ticket office? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thedelldays Posted 11 May, 2012 Share Posted 11 May, 2012 Well as St Mary's was sold out most weeks last time in the Premier League and averaged over 30k every season, anyone unable to get a ticket was able to do whatever they wanted on a matchday. As soon as the "sold out" banner go up why would you try to get a ticket from the ticket office? most weeks....but what about all these 1000's that are going to push us to CL level..? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elias Posted 11 May, 2012 Share Posted 11 May, 2012 What's the point of this thread really? Just enjoy the ride, it's never dull. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Turkish Posted 11 May, 2012 Share Posted 11 May, 2012 Well as St Mary's was sold out most weeks last time in the Premier League and averaged over 30k every season (including the relegation season), anyone unable to get a ticket was able to do whatever they wanted on a matchday. As soon as the "sold out" banner go up why would you try to get a ticket from the ticket office? How come Tottenham have a waiting list of 15,000 fans then? Why don't they just give up knowing they could never possibly get a ticket. Is it just our fans that suffer from sold out apathy syndrome? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Legod Third Coming Posted 11 May, 2012 Share Posted 11 May, 2012 i wanna know where all these new fans were when we were actually proven in the prem and got to a cup final etc.. why won't they go to reading also..? They did go to Reading DD! Reading attracted wavering Southampton/Glory fans during their meteoric rise - fans who had previously travelled to and 'supported Southampton' because their local club wasn't big enough. Look at my local team, Walton and Hersham. Would I go and watch them? Rarely. If they rose to the Premiership would I? Yes (when not watching Saints), and even if the Championship or League One it would give me a good day out when we're not playing... Now, that is not to say we can regularly attract 50k fans. But we did twice. Wembley and Cardiff. Those were hard core and glory fans. What would you say the split is? 20k proper every weekers? 10-12k Premiership fans? And what 10k glory day-outers? So it's converting them isn't it. Which, given the above, you can only do by winning. But put it this way. Spin the clock back to my formative years. You're a young lad growing up in Petersfield. If you're going to support a local club now, who is it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Legod Third Coming Posted 11 May, 2012 Share Posted 11 May, 2012 How come Tottenham have a waiting list of 15,000 fans then? Why don't they just give up knowing they could never possibly get a ticket. Is it just our fans that suffer from sold out apathy syndrome? 22,000 actually. My mate is 4800th! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matthew Le God Posted 11 May, 2012 Share Posted 11 May, 2012 (edited) most weeks....but what about all these 1000's that are going to push us to CL level..? If being bottom of the Premier League was an attractive enough proposition to attract over 30k on average, the club in 8th/7th/6th/5th/4th would be vastly more attractive. What makes up the difference in support from now on are the "Johnny come lately fans", rarely seen in the Championship or League these past 7 years, put as soon as Premier League football appears even if a relegation campaign, Saints average over 30k. Edited 11 May, 2012 by Matthew Le God Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matthew Le God Posted 11 May, 2012 Share Posted 11 May, 2012 How come Tottenham have a waiting list of 15,000 fans then? Why don't they just give up knowing they could never possibly get a ticket. Is it just our fans that suffer from sold out apathy syndrome? How does that counter anything I said in that post? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thedelldays Posted 11 May, 2012 Share Posted 11 May, 2012 If being bottom of the Premier League was an attractive enough proposition to attract an average of over 30k on average, the club in 8th/7th/6th/5th/4th would be vastly more attractive. What makes up the difference in support from now on are the "Johnny come lately fans", rarely seen in the Championship or League these past 7 years, put as soon as Premier League football appears even if a relegation campaign, Saints average over 30k. but we were not bottom of the premier league in 2003 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matthew Le God Posted 11 May, 2012 Share Posted 11 May, 2012 but we were not bottom of the premier league in 2003 You've lost me. So what? We finished 20th in 2004/05 and averaged 30,610. The season after the 8th place finish and Cup Final saw an average of 31,699 with the vast majority of the 19 games sold out. The gaps between those figures and the official capacity are largely due to segregation and away fan allocations not being filled. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thedelldays Posted 11 May, 2012 Share Posted 11 May, 2012 You've lost me. So what? We finished 20th in 2004/05 and averaged 30,610. The season after the 8th place finish and Cup Final saw an average of 31,699 with the vast majority of the 19 games sold out. The gaps between those figures and the official capacity are largely due to segregation and away fan allocations not being filled. just curios to think how we are going to pull in thousands of floating fans that we never did last time....enough to propel us to CL level....I doubt we are going to see mass saints shirts being worn in guildford, tunbridge wells and dorchester Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Turkish Posted 11 May, 2012 Share Posted 11 May, 2012 How does that counter anything I said in that post? I thought that would be quite obvious sunshine. Tottenham have fans trying to get tickets to games despite them selling out every week. I seem to recall Newcastle also having a long waiting list. If we had these thousands of disapointed fans every week wh didn't we do have what most clubs that sell out have, a waiting list. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matthew Le God Posted 11 May, 2012 Share Posted 11 May, 2012 (edited) I thought that would be quite obvious sunshine. Tottenham have fans trying to get tickets to games despite them selling out every week. I seem to recall Newcastle also having a long waiting list. If we had these thousands of disapointed fans every week wh didn't we do have what most clubs that sell out have, a waiting list. So you think when Saints sold out a game against Man Utd for example in the Premier League years of 2001 to 2005, exactly the same numbers of people wanted to see that as they did a game against Bolton that also sold out? Added to that, the Bolton game would actually have more Saints fans at it that the Man Utd game due to fewer Bolton fans going compared to Man Utd so home allocation would be increased. Edited 11 May, 2012 by Matthew Le God Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
This Charming Man Posted 11 May, 2012 Share Posted 11 May, 2012 I thought that would be quite obvious sunshine. Tottenham have fans trying to get tickets to games despite them selling out every week. I seem to recall Newcastle also having a long waiting list. If we had these thousands of disapointed fans every week wh didn't we do have what most clubs that sell out have, a waiting list. It would be a bit silly having a waiting list when we've never once even come close to selling the full quota of Season Tickets that we're allowed to sell. Which I believe is around the 27k mark. Someone like Norwich or Derby would have a good case for expanding their ground as they have huge number of season tickets holders. We don't. Would be a bit of a gamble expanding the ground on the off chance of attracting floating fans. In order to expand we would need a good few years where it's nigh on impossible to obtain a ticket as it's all season ticket holders. I can't see us having that problem any time soon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Turkish Posted 11 May, 2012 Share Posted 11 May, 2012 So you think when Saints sold out a game against Man Utd for example in the Premier League years of 2001 to 2005, exactly the same numbers of people wanted to see that as they did a game against Bolton that also sold out? Added to that, the Bolton game would actually have more Saints fans at it that the Man Utd game due to fewer Bolton fans going compared to Man Utd so home allocation would be increased. But you think people all over the country are desperate to see Premier league football at St Mary's. You claim there were literally thousands of people who couldn't get in so didn't bother trying. You say we should be competing with clubs like Spurs and Newcastle for 4th place. Both of these clubs have bigger stadiums than us and Spurs have a waiting list. Bigger than some of our attendances this season. I must be missing something Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Turkish Posted 11 May, 2012 Share Posted 11 May, 2012 It would be a bit silly having a waiting list when we've never once even come close to selling the full quota of Season Tickets that we're allowed to sell. Which I believe is around the 27k mark. Someone like Norwich or Derby would have a good case for expanding their ground as they have huge number of season tickets holders. We don't. Would be a bit of a gamble expanding the ground on the off chance of attracting floating fans. In order to expand we would need a good few years where it's nigh on impossible to obtain a ticket as it's all season ticket holders. I can't see us having that problem any time soon. But what about all the plastic mancs that will come to SMS in their thousands from Epsom and Chobham? What about all those Bristol City fans over there who want to watch premier league football? What are they going to do if we don't expand? And I haven't even mentioned our catchment area which is quite literally the biggest catchment area in the world and history of soccerball Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matthew Le God Posted 11 May, 2012 Share Posted 11 May, 2012 (edited) I must be missing something Yep, ignoring to counter all the points I put to you. Instead of answering them directly you go off on a new tangent and the process repeats ad infinitum. Edited 11 May, 2012 by Matthew Le God Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Turkish Posted 11 May, 2012 Share Posted 11 May, 2012 Yep, ignoring to counter all the points I put to you, instead of answering them directly you go off on a new tangent and the process repeats ad infinitum. What like the point you made the other day that we have more match going fans than Everton despite having never in our history had a higher average attendance than them. Those sort of points? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matthew Le God Posted 11 May, 2012 Share Posted 11 May, 2012 What like the point you made the other day that we have more match going fans than Everton despite having never in our history had a higher average attendance than them. Those sort of points? Yep, exactly those points. Points you still don't seem to understand. I'll try again... - Everton this season are 7th in the Premier League - They have an average attendance this season of 32,879 - They have a stadium capacity of 40,394 - Their 40k stadium allows them to boost the average as it allows for an "overflow" in big games. Southampton on the other hand have averaged 31k in a 32k stadium whilst in the Premier League (bear in mind segregation and away allocations not always filled). If Saints had a 40k stadium like Everton do, they would also be able to boost their average with higher attendances from the "big" game vs Man Utd, Arsenal, Spurs, Newcastle, Man City, Liverpool, Chelsea etc. It is likely that would see them above the 32k average Everton have. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Turkish Posted 11 May, 2012 Share Posted 11 May, 2012 Yep, exactly those points. Points you still don't seem to understand. I'll try again... - Everton this season are 7th in the Premier League - They have an average attendance this season of 32,879 - They have a stadium capacity of 40,394 - Their 40k stadium allows them to boost the average as it allows for an "overflow" in big games. Southampton on the other hand have averaged 31k in a 32k stadium whilst in the Premier League (bear in mind segregation and away allocations not always filled). If Saints had a 40k stadium like Everton do, they would also be able to boost their average with higher attendances from the "big" game vs Man Utd, Arsenal, Spurs, Newcastle, Man City, Liverpool, Chelsea etc. It is likely that would see them above the 32k average Everton have. Speculation, pure speculation. Based on what you say if Everton had a 50k stadium then they'd have a higher average than 32,000. The FACT is we have never had a higher average crowd than Everton, never. So we dont have a bigger match going fan base than them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
This Charming Man Posted 11 May, 2012 Share Posted 11 May, 2012 Speculation, pure speculation. Based on what you say if Everton had a 50k stadium then they'd have a higher average than 32,000. The FACT is we have never had a higher average crowd than Everton, never. So we dont have a bigger match going fan base than them. But Everton don't have a massive catchment area like us. Full of people earning a decent wage, aimlessly strolling through life, desperately seeking a Premiership team to follow but have yet to make up their minds as who to follow. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Turkish Posted 11 May, 2012 Share Posted 11 May, 2012 But Everton don't have a massive catchment area like us. Full of people earning a decent wage, aimlessly strolling through life, desperately seeking a Premiership team to follow but have yet to make up their minds as who to follow. True. Sadly for Everton they are just north of the imaginary line that goes from Liverpool to Birmingham to London and covers all of Wales, Devon and Cornwall which are potential Saints fans. If only they'd been a few miles further South they too could claim to be the new Barcelona. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stev2001 Posted 11 May, 2012 Share Posted 11 May, 2012 Are people forgetting Newcastle got relegated with an average attendance of 48k? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Legod Third Coming Posted 11 May, 2012 Share Posted 11 May, 2012 Speculation, pure speculation. Based on what you say if Everton had a 50k stadium then they'd have a higher average than 32,000. The FACT is we have never had a higher average crowd than Everton, never. So we dont have a bigger match going fan base than them. What a circular argument?!! Everton have a bigger stadium so their average can be bigger. MLG is right - in the Premiership we sold out nearly every game. Everton don't. We might have been able to sell more tickets but couldn't. They can but don't. Of course, this does not mean we WOULD have, but they simply don't. End of. (And before you ask, no I do not consider us as 'big' a club as Everton... yet...) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thedelldays Posted 11 May, 2012 Share Posted 11 May, 2012 True. Sadly for Everton they are just north of the imaginary line that goes from Liverpool to Birmingham to London and covers all of Wales, Devon and Cornwall which are potential Saints fans. If only they'd been a few miles further South they too could claim to be the new Barcelona. why won't these floating fans not fill readings expanded ground...? why us....? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
This Charming Man Posted 11 May, 2012 Share Posted 11 May, 2012 why won't these floating fans not fill readings expanded ground...? why us....? We're building a new academy and they're not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Turkish Posted 11 May, 2012 Share Posted 11 May, 2012 why won't these floating fans not fill readings expanded ground...? why us....? How many times Jamie FFS. Because Chelsea only got 13k in 1984. Because the world is changing and people use Ipads now instead of PCs. Because Nokia used to be massive but arent anymore. Because someone on here went to Old Trafford once in the 80's and there were only 30,000 there. Because we've got more match going fans than Everton. Because Cortese has ambition. Because we've got the worlds biggest catchment area. Because who'd have thought 10 years ago Man City would win the league. Because Sunderland only got 17k at Roker Park and now get 38,000 regularly. You just need to open your eyes and see the possibilites, its so obvious. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Turkish Posted 11 May, 2012 Share Posted 11 May, 2012 What a circular argument?!! Everton have a bigger stadium so their average can be bigger. MLG is right - in the Premiership we sold out nearly every game. Everton don't. We might have been able to sell more tickets but couldn't. They can but don't. Of course, this does not mean we WOULD have, but they simply don't. End of. (And before you ask, no I do not consider us as 'big' a club as Everton... yet...) But if Everton sell out for their big games such as Liverpool, Man United & City etc then this means they could sell more for these so their average would be bigger if they had a bigger stadium. That is his argument with us. That is we had a bigger stadium our average would be bigger, well so would theirs be if they did. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Legod Third Coming Posted 11 May, 2012 Share Posted 11 May, 2012 But if Everton sell out for their big games such as Liverpool, Man United & City etc then this means they could sell more for these so their average would be bigger if they had a bigger stadium. That is his argument with us. That is we had a bigger stadium our average would be bigger, well so would theirs be if they did. Gotcha - in which case I agree! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Legod Third Coming Posted 11 May, 2012 Share Posted 11 May, 2012 How many times Jamie FFS. Because Chelsea only got 13k in 1984. Because the world is changing and people use Ipads now instead of PCs. Because Nokia used to be massive but arent anymore. Because someone on here went to Old Trafford once in the 80's and there were only 30,000 there. Because we've got more match going fans than Everton. Because Cortese has ambition. Because we've got the worlds biggest catchment area. Because who'd have thought 10 years ago Man City would win the league. Because Sunderland only got 17k at Roker Park and now get 38,000 regularly. You just need to open your eyes and see the possibilites, its so obvious. This is the first of your posts which (with the exception of the bold) contains a number of indisputable FACTS. (I can provide the evidence from Gartner (Carlina Milanesi, VP Research) and Microsoft on the tablet data (we call them that, not 'iPads' since they only make up about 60% of the tablet market) and the stadium data is freely available via Google) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
suewhistle Posted 11 May, 2012 Share Posted 11 May, 2012 It is posts like this on threads like this that really make mefear for the sanity of some posters on this forum. Ah, so I'm not the only one. Since CB is the only one on here talking about European domination is he calling himself a swivel eyed loon? As someone else on here said: (Note to nutters, I am STILL not saying we will be in the CL ANY time soon & certainly not in 5 years. I just maintain that a vision of AIMING for that ONE DAY instead of a Lowe style survive and pay a dividend until eternity is where we now are) Can people stop setting up strawman arguments to then demolish: you're argueing with yourself. Of course we've got to aim high: the secret is not to do it in the way Portsmouth did, but having competent, realistic and honest owners and management may help a leetle... Hoping that we aim high doesn't mean we expect CL football anytime soon, clear? We're certainly going to dominate 'Ampshire though! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
david in sweden Posted 11 May, 2012 Share Posted 11 May, 2012 (edited) Lets just be clear. You said forty million, in january, to get promoted. I thought you'd be back sometime. In a mad moment- I suggested such a figure, at a time when we had a considerable number of injuries in the squad, but fortunately most of them recovered, but NA seemed satisfied with the squad (rightly so it proved) and Lee and Sharp cost considerably less than some people (including me) had thought, and in the end - we didn't buy another central defender. We were also in a spell when some contributors were suggesting that the planned re-building at Staplewood was going to be shelved - or even cancelled. I'd read Cortese on this and didn't believe that he was only playing with PR....as it turns out to be a commitment of £15 mill? (did I understand that correctly) and the redevelopment of Staplewood is ongoing - is it not? I have noted that you tend to " tweak people's noses " when they "over-use their fantasy" on various threads and so we must be prepared to accept your overt criticism from time to time. I also see that you have written quite a bit yourself recently. Might I suggest... you might like to re-read some of your own scrift, and be prepared for some comeback. Personally, I won't bother. Thanks for the reminder though, and I'll reign in my imagination a little more in future. Edited 11 May, 2012 by david in sweden Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wes Tender Posted 11 May, 2012 Share Posted 11 May, 2012 That will the Peak District with towns like Buxton, Ashbourne, Belper and Bakewell as well as the other towns in the Derwent Valley. Plenty of people there son. And lets be clear I never said Saints have no potrntial to grow. Just that our catchment area is not some "unique" commercial advantage we have over other which you and others are saying. And you made great play of clubs like Derby and Forest being close being a problem but it isn't much like Sheff Weds can blow our attendances out of the water in League one last weekend. And I've never said we could never get in the top four. Yet more fiction in your twisted head. Of course we can. If we do though its not suddenly going to bring thousands of new fans from Trowbridge just because you've scrawled it on a map with a biro between your teeth. Ah, the great Metropolitan Cities of Buxton, Belper and Bakewell. The New Forest, for all your sneering, actually has a population of 174,000. That's people, not horses by the way. Eastleigh and Winchester combined have a population of 240,500, pretty well the same as Southampton, so we are talking about around half a million people living within a radius of about 10 miles from the stadium just with those three, ignoring the additional populations towards Fareham which fall within that radius too. If you wish to believe that having a large population density in the catchment area surrounding us when there is simultaneously no other club at our level in that area, will make little difference to our future attendances, then go on thinking that. Where did I say that you were of the opinion that we couldn't break into the top four? I said that it was the perceived wisdom of some posters. And whilst we're about it, kindly point out where I said that if we were in the top four, we'd suddenly bring in thousands of fans from Trowbridge. We will no doubt be getting fans from Trowbridge, Milton Keynes, Welwyn Garden City, Margate, Truro during the next season. But they'll be coming to see ManUre. And how did you know that it was a party trick of mine drawing with a pen in my mouth? Probably more pertinent me calling you son, rather than the other way about, I expect. I was born between the two seasons that the Skates were first division champions. So unless you can beat that, then I suspect that at the very least I have more idea of historical perspective than you about the changing fortunes of football clubs. I can even remember when Sheffield Wednesday were a huge club and Liverpool were minnows. I also have a vivid memory of the Munich Air Crash. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matthew Le God Posted 11 May, 2012 Share Posted 11 May, 2012 (edited) The New Forest, for all your sneering, actually has a population of 174,000. That's people, not horses by the way. Eastleigh and Winchester combined have a population of 240,500, pretty well the same as Southampton, so we are talking about around half a million people living within a radius of about 10 miles from the stadium just with those three, ignoring the additional populations towards Fareham which fall within that radius too. If you wish to believe that having a large population density in the catchment area surrounding us when there is simultaneously no other club at our level in that area, will make little difference to our future attendances, then go on thinking that. - Plus the 140,000 people on the Isle of Wight - Possibly could even include the 158,000 on the Channel Islands, St Mary's is the easiest English Premier League stadium for them to get to and you have the Le Tissier connection for them. Thats another 300,000 people on top of what you said! Edited 11 May, 2012 by Matthew Le God Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CB Fry Posted 11 May, 2012 Share Posted 11 May, 2012 Have all these people moved in since our relegation then? That's the only explanation for Saints being no better than Derby or Forest or Leicester or Sheffield Wednesday in attendance terms pretty much ever in the last 126 years. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matthew Le God Posted 11 May, 2012 Share Posted 11 May, 2012 Have all these people moved in since our relegation then? Can the same not be applied to the population areas in Yorkshire and the midlands? Saints have areas like the New Forest, Eastleigh, Winchester, Isle of Wight to gain support from with little competition from close by rivals like all the teams you listed. That's the only explanation for Saints being no better than Derby or Forest or Leicester or Sheffield Wednesday in attendance terms pretty much ever in the last 126 years. Have you considered it being down to Saints being limited by The Dell? Let's just pick one of your choices for comparison... - League One runner's up Southampton 2010/11 average attendance = 22,161 - League One runner's up Sheffield Wednesday 2011/12 average attendance = 21,336 So Saints in similar circumstances outdid Sheffield Wednesday. Plus Sheffield Wednesday had derbies vs Sheff Utd and Huddersfield and the added benefit of a 39,814 capacity which meant for their derby games and run in of the season they could boost the average. Had both clubs had a stadium the size of St Mary's, Saints would have had an even greater gap between them and Sheff Weds in two similar seasons. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CB Fry Posted 11 May, 2012 Share Posted 11 May, 2012 Half a million people. In that hotbed of football passion the New Forest and everything. Someone, not me, quietly pointed out that Nottingham population is north of 600,000. But hey. Whose counting. Saints have the most unique-est catchment area in the world. And if someone who remembers the Munich Air Crash and Powdered Milk or something says it then that's that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CB Fry Posted 11 May, 2012 Share Posted 11 May, 2012 (edited) Can the same not be applied to the population areas in Yorkshire and the midlands? Saints have areas like the New Forest, Eastleigh, Winchester, Isle of Wight to gain support from with little competition from close by rivals like all the teams you listed. Have you considered it being down to Saints being limited by The Dell? Let's just pick one of your choices for comparison... - League One runner's up Southampton 2010/11 average attendance = 22,161 - League One runner's up Sheffield Wednesday 2011/12 average attendance = 21,336 So Saints in similar circumstances outdid Sheffield Wednesday. Plus Sheffield Wednesday had derbies vs Sheff Utd and Huddersfield and the added benefit of a 39,814 capacity which meant for their derby games and run in of the season they could boost the average. Had both clubs had a stadium the size of St Mary's, Saints would have had an even greater gap between them and Sheff Weds in two similar seasons. Hang on. We didn't have a 23,000 capacity that season so we had scope for more. And our attendances were basically the same. And lets not forget Sheffield have not one but two clubs so have a miniscule catchment area. Someone who remembers when BBC2 went colour said so so it must be true. On the other hand Saints have GIGANTIC CATCHMENT OF HALF A MILLION PEOPLE including the channel islands and can't beat a club in a city with two football clubs. Edited 11 May, 2012 by CB Fry Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matthew Le God Posted 11 May, 2012 Share Posted 11 May, 2012 Someone, not me, quietly pointed out that Nottingham population is north of 600,000. But hey. Whose counting. - Nottingham is a two team city. - Nottingham has Derby, Leicester, Notts County, Peterborough, Coventry, Birmingham, Aston Villa, West Brom, Sheffield United, Rotherham, Lincoln, Northampton, Milton Keynes, Wolverhampton, Walsall, Stoke, Port Vale and a few others all relatively close to it. - Southampton has 1) Bournemouth and 2) Pompey fighting for a share of the fanbase. - Southampton considering the lack of competition relative to the size of the population in surrounding areas from other clubs is in a very strong position. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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