New 5 year Plan

[jam]

pes·si·mism (ps-mzm)

n.

1. A tendency to stress the negative or unfavorable or to take the gloomiest possible view.

 

The gloomiest possible view would be to suggest we'll probably be relegated, Adkins will leave or we'll be sold to some Mongolian horse milk traders. Haven't seen much of that on here...

 

de·lu·sion/diˈlo͞oZHən/

 

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[TD]

1. An idiosyncratic belief or impression that is firmly maintained despite being contradicted by what is generally accepted as reality,...
   

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What? You mean like suggesting we have a bigger catchment area, than for example... Nottingham, despite it being pointed out that the latter has a much larger population to draw upon?

[Thedelldays]

all this catchment area etc.....how does that translate to CL football in 5 years...which is the meat of this discussion

 

as for covering the asian market....dear, christ

[Wes Tender]

What? You mean like suggesting we have a bigger catchment area, than for example... Nottingham, despite it being pointed out that the latter has a much larger population to draw upon?

 

I think that you're confusing population with catchment area, an easy mistake, as even those who consider themselves amongst the brightest intellects on the forum also don't realise the difference or the implications of it.

 

Yes, Nottingham has a bigger city population than Southampton, but Southampton almost certainly has the bigger catchment area. Read this on Wikipedia:-

 

Southampton combines with Portsmouth to form a single metropolitan area; with a population of over a million this makes the region one of the United Kingdom's most populous metropolitan areas.[5]

 

There are several towns in close proximity to Southampton such as Eastleigh/Chandlers Ford, Romsey and Winchester that play a large part in our catchment area. There is nothing around Nottingham of comparable size to those within a similar radius, apart from Derby, which is closer to Nottingham than Portsmouth is to us.

[This Charming Man]

I think that you're confusing population with catchment area, an easy mistake, as even those who consider themselves amongst the brightest intellects on the forum also don't realise the difference or the implications of it.

 

Yes, Nottingham has a bigger city population than Southampton, but Southampton almost certainly has the bigger catchment area. Read this on Wikipedia:-

 

Southampton combines with Portsmouth to form a single metropolitan area; with a population of over a million this makes the region one of the United Kingdom's most populous metropolitan areas.[5]

 

There are several towns in close proximity to Southampton such as Eastleigh/Chandlers Ford, Romsey and Winchester that play a large part in our catchment area. There is nothing around Nottingham of comparable size to those within a similar radius, apart from Derby, which is closer to Nottingham than Portsmouth is to us.

 

Slight problem with that though is it's not a very popular lifestyle choice to come from Pompey and support us...

[Wes Tender]

Slight problem with that though is it's not a very popular lifestyle choice to come from Pompey and support us...

 

And the same could be said of the Derby fans, of course. But even there the comparison is weighted in our favour, as the Skates are likely to cease to exist in anything resembling their current form, so apart from a hardcore who will follow them to Moneyfields or H & W, anybody who wants to watch a decent football match in their immediate catchment area will gravitate towards us. Although those actually living in Portsmouth might be difficult to budge, those between there and here will be easier as well as those outside of the city like Waterlooville, Cowplain, Cosham, Havant, etc.

[Thedelldays]

so, are we going to be some mega club, appealing to the 1.2m people of the southampton-portmsouth metropolitan area

[This Charming Man]

And the same could be said of the Derby fans, of course. But even there the comparison is weighted in our favour, as the Skates are likely to cease to exist in anything resembling their current form, so apart from a hardcore who will follow them to Moneyfields or H & W, anybody who wants to watch a decent football match in their immediate catchment area will gravitate towards us. Although those actually living in Portsmouth might be difficult to budge, those between there and here will be easier as well as those outside of the city like Waterlooville, Cowplain, Cosham, Havant, etc.

 

Fareham would be turned red as well.

[david in sweden]

I can only presume you're on a wind-up or a bit mental?

 

I've travelled quite a bit around Asia and can assure you we're not big news over there and that's not going to change any time soon. When asked by anyone local where I was from and I replied England, they would go mad "ahh Mr, what team you support?" "Southampton" "who?" In the end I got bored of trying to explain about Southampton and used to answer with Man Utd, it just saved the hassle. As far as people over there are concerned, we don't even exist. QUOTE]

 

 

I'd guess that when they equate T.Lee (as the man who won the Asian Cup for them)..with Premier League Southampton ..then you might get a few more positive responses. Man.U and Liverpool didn't get their big foreign fan base overnight, it took some time and clever marketing.

[jam]

I think that you're confusing population with catchment area, an easy mistake, as even those who consider themselves amongst the brightest intellects on the forum also don't realise the difference or the implications of it.

 

 

If the catchment area has no population, what's the use of the catchment area?

 

 

Yes, Nottingham has a bigger city population than Southampton, but Southampton almost certainly has the bigger catchment area. Read this on Wikipedia:-

 

Southampton combines with Portsmouth to form a single metropolitan area; with a population of over a million this makes the region one of the United Kingdom's most populous metropolitan areas.[5]

 

 

How does the amount of people in Portsmouth affect the Southampton fanbase? I've met one or two of them and they don't seem likely to be buying season tickets at St. Mary's anytime soon.

 

 

There are several towns in close proximity to Southampton such as Eastleigh/Chandlers Ford, Romsey and Winchester that play a large part in our catchment area. There is nothing around Nottingham of comparable size to those within a similar radius, apart from Derby, which is closer to Nottingham than Portsmouth is to us.

 

According to that Wikipedia page the Southampton urban area population is 304,400. Add on 41,420 for Winchester and you're only 40k more than the population of the City of Nottingham. The figure Wikipedia provides for the Nottingham urban area (not including Derby) is 666,358.

 

I'm sorry but the population figures just don't seem to match your assertions. (And I'm going on about population as these are the potential customers...)

[Thedelldays]

I can only presume you're on a wind-up or a bit mental?

 

I've travelled quite a bit around Asia and can assure you we're not big news over there and that's not going to change any time soon. When asked by anyone local where I was from and I replied England, they would go mad "ahh Mr, what team you support?" "Southampton" "who?" In the end I got bored of trying to explain about Southampton and used to answer with Man Utd, it just saved the hassle. As far as people over there are concerned, we don't even exist. QUOTE]

 

 

I'd guess that when they equate T.Lee (as the man who won the Asian Cup for them)..with Premier League Southampton ..then you might get a few more positive responses. Man.U and Liverpool didn't get their big foreign fan base overnight, it took some time and clever marketing.

maybe a few....as someone who has had a drink in the man u bar in singapore will tell you, we have years and years of winning many major trophies and having iconic players like Beckham, Rooney, Gerard, ronaldo, drogba to play for us before we even think about making major head way into an already staunch united/liverpool stronghold

[Legod Third Coming]

Based on my opinion. We're on the 11th page and you STILL don't understand what this thread is about do you? Where have I claimed to know more than our Chairman? Making stuff up is a sign of desperation.

 

I understand that. This thread is entitled 5 year plan. You are saying our five year plan should not include the Champion's League. I understand that.

 

I am saying that the five year plan could include Champion's League.

 

On the basis that we have no idea what the financial position may or may not be.

 

Whereas you are saying no, no and thrice no. Regardless.

[This Charming Man]

I'd guess that when they equate T.Lee (as the man who won the Asian Cup for them)..with Premier League Southampton ..then you might get a few more positive responses. Man.U and Liverpool didn't get their big foreign fan base overnight, it took some time and clever marketing.

 

Japan doesn't represent the whole of Asia.

 

Hull, Blackpool, Skates, Norwich, Swansea all have been or are Premier League. Where was this massive clamour from the Asian market for them? There was none because nobody over there cares about them, same applies to us.

 

Clubs like Everton have tried to tap into the market, they were sponsored by 'Chang' (a Thai beer) and whilst in Thailand I did see a few locals in Everton shirts but it never really took off. How far do we go to try and appeal to this market? Shall we change the colour of our kit? Change our nickname? Change our badge? Get Mongolia to sponsor us? Those are the steps being taken by Cardiff (swap Malaysia for Mongolia) to try and get a foothold in the market over there.

Edited 9 May, 2012 by This Charming Man

[Thedelldays]

pompey won the asia trophy...look at the state of them

[Legod Third Coming]

so, how much do you all think the family will pump into the club for nothing over the next couple of years...?

 

I predict we will be sold.

To the Chinese.

But no-one seems to listen, or care...

[Legod Third Coming]

I've also been over in Asia quite a bit this past decade. The situation will begin to change when the new Premiership season kicks off. We have been out of the top flight for 7 years, so we disappeared off the radar over there.

It was interesting to see the changes recently when I was in Thailand just last month. Yes, ManUre and Liverpool are still prevalent, but there were numerous Arsenal and Chelski shirts too. But the increasing number of Barcelona, Real Madrid, Milan and Bayern shirts was noticeable this trip. In the Far East, they are football mad and watch it avidly on the telly. But these are the ultimate glory hunters, so naturally they get more exposure to the glory teams and reckon they gain kudos for supporting the teams that are successful, or with whom they can establish some sort of personal connection. So when we play the likes of ManUre, Chelski, Man City, Arsenal, Liverpool, we will raise our profile and therefore the awareness of our brand. But it will only be by beating those glory teams and climbing the table that we will get the plastics to switch. Mostly, these are not the loyal types, they go with which way the wind is blowing. I have encountered a situation there whereby many young Thais were wearing Arsenal shirts. When asked how this came about, it became clear that the shirts had been awarded to them by a politician after their votes. They weren't particularly Arsenal supporters, but the brand was recognisable and cool in their eyes.

 

Apart from the glory team brands, the other factor that affects support over there is having a team member from Asia. From that point of view, our matches will attract greater attention in Japan and Korea. If Lee establishes himself in the Premiership and is knocking in goals against the glory teams, that attention will increase.

 

Regarding income from shirt sales, I doubt whether much of it finds its way to the clubs anyway, not even the glory teams, as most of it is fake. The revenue comes mostly from sponsorship and TV. For example, Air Asia has an association with ManUre and sells some branded goods on their planes. Everton and Leicester have done themselves no harm in Thailand being sponsored by Chang Beer and King Power, although Leicester's exposure isn't great while they are in the second division.

 

Interesting.

[david in sweden]

Japan doesn't represent the whole of Asia. QUOTE]

 

Naturally not, but with the J League clubs ...and those former English players turning up in their teams periodically, there is surely a strong interest in English Prem. games... and if we get a few good results people will start to take notice. Having a Japanese international in the squad will surely help a bit.

 

Man.U partly got their Korean following because they'd signed Park...and what a good deal they got , too!

 

Surely, Japan must be one of the foremost footballing countries in Asia - isn't it ?

[Legod Third Coming]

maybe a few....as someone who has had a drink in the man u bar in singapore will tell you, we have years and years of winning many major trophies and having iconic players like Beckham, Rooney, Gerard, ronaldo, drogba to play for us before we even think about making major head way into an already staunch united/liverpool stronghold

 

Yes and no.

 

It took those clubs many, many years because there was no access to football other than the FA Cup on the World Service.

Remember that.

The whole landscape of access has changed in a very few years...

[Thedelldays]

Yes and no.

 

It took those clubs many, many years because there was no access to football other than the FA Cup on the World Service.

Remember that.

The whole landscape of access has changed in a very few years...

you really think loads of the little fellas over there are going round in wigan shirts..?

[dubai_phil]

so, are we going to be some mega club, appealing to the 1.2m people of the southampton-portmsouth metropolitan area

 

Nope.

 

 

We're going to be a mega club appealing to the 8 million people of the Central South and West of England who are deprived of the chance to watch their favourite team each week. Hence why we need room for more Away Fans.

 

Remember TWO teams play a game of football, so the people coming to watch Man Ure don't HAVE to be Londoners

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[This Charming Man]

Everton and Leicester have done themselves no harm in Thailand being sponsored by Chang Beer and King Power, although Leicester's exposure isn't great while they are in the second division.

 

Leicester have a small table in the duty free section of Bangkok airport (because their owners own the duty free there) other than that, their exposure there has been minimal.

[shurlock]

Japan doesn't represent the whole of Asia.

 

Hull, Blackpool, Skates, Norwich, Swansea all have been or are Premier League. Where was this massive clamour from the Asian market for them? There was none because nobody over there cares about them, same applies to us.

 

Its about costs and benefits. It takes practically no effort and investment to market us in places like japan (still one of asia's largest markets in terms of discretionary spending), so even selling one extra shirt is a good return.

From my own experience -and I'm bumped into the lad at Heathrow, I have been surprised by the extra exposure Lee's move has got us and it is bound to increase now we are in the prem, especially if we're successful.

Your reference to Hull, Norwich, Swansea is odd given none have asian players (I agree with you- I dont think you can succeed on branding and sponsorship alone a la Leicester or Everton). Indeed given no asian player apart from park has really made it in english football, its too early to conclude that asian fans wouldn't care about us. If Lee scored 10+ goals next season, I'm sure the impact would be noticeable.

Edited 9 May, 2012 by shurlock

[doddisalegend]

I've also been over in Asia quite a bit this past decade. The situation will begin to change when the new Premiership season kicks off. We have been out of the top flight for 7 years, so we disappeared off the radar over there.

It was interesting to see the changes recently when I was in Thailand just last month. Yes, ManUre and Liverpool are still prevalent, but there were numerous Arsenal and Chelski shirts too. But the increasing number of Barcelona, Real Madrid, Milan and Bayern shirts was noticeable this trip. In the Far East, they are football mad and watch it avidly on the telly. But these are the ultimate glory hunters, so naturally they get more exposure to the glory teams and reckon they gain kudos for supporting the teams that are successful, or with whom they can establish some sort of personal connection. So when we play the likes of ManUre, Chelski, Man City, Arsenal, Liverpool, we will raise our profile and therefore the awareness of our brand. But it will only be by beating those glory teams and climbing the table that we will get the plastics to switch. Mostly, these are not the loyal types, they go with which way the wind is blowing. I have encountered a situation there whereby many young Thais were wearing Arsenal shirts. When asked how this came about, it became clear that the shirts had been awarded to them by a politician after their votes. They weren't particularly Arsenal supporters, but the brand was recognisable and cool in their eyes.

 

Apart from the glory team brands, the other factor that affects support over there is having a team member from Asia. From that point of view, our matches will attract greater attention in Japan and Korea. If Lee establishes himself in the Premiership and is knocking in goals against the glory teams, that attention will increase.

 

Regarding income from shirt sales, I doubt whether much of it finds its way to the clubs anyway, not even the glory teams, as most of it is fake. The revenue comes mostly from sponsorship and TV. For example, Air Asia has an association with ManUre and sells some branded goods on their planes. Everton and Leicester have done themselves no harm in Thailand being sponsored by Chang Beer and King Power, although Leicester's exposure isn't great while they are in the second division.

 

As long as we don't have to re-name SMS the "Siam Cement Arena" or the "Thai Rung Union Car stadium" no reason not to try and cash in on foreign sponsorship.

[Thedelldays]

Its about costs and benefits. It takes practically no effort and investment to market us in places like japan (still one of asia's largest markets in terms of discretionary spending), so even selling one extra shirt is a good return.

From my own experience -and I'm bumped into the lad at Heathrow, I have been surprised by the extra exposure his move has got us and it is bound to increase now we are in the prem, especially if we're successful.

Your reference to Hull, Norwich, Swansea is odd given none have asian players (I don't think you can succeed on branding and sponsorship alone a la Leicester or Everton). Indeed given no asian player apart from park has really made it in english football, its too early to conclude that asian fans wouldn't care about us. If Lee scored 10+ goals next season, I'm sure the impact would be noticeable.

how many asian fans are wearing bolton shirts do you think...or sunderland shirts......

 

not many what so ever would be my guess

[Give it to Ron]

you really think loads of the little fellas over there are going round in wigan shirts..?

 

There aren't loads of big or small fellas in Wigan going round in Wigan shirts either!

[skintsaint]

I've seen 3 Saints shirts at Uni this semester compared with seeing feck all in Perth ever, all worn by Jap looking lads. Guess its the Lee effect. Now we are getting Premier League exposure it can only give us more 'followers'.

 

So basically these extra 3 shirts have given us an extra $300 to play with in the transfer window.

[shurlock]

how many asian fans are wearing bolton shirts do you think...or sunderland shirts......

 

not many what so ever would be my guess

 

I don't think either has made it, though. They've probably done more than other asian players here - and the Bolton lad has looked decent, albeit in a poor team. But he's injured while the Sunderland lad has practically disappeared sinceMON's arrival.

[Legod Third Coming]

you really think loads of the little fellas over there are going round in wigan shirts..?

 

I do know what the biggest selling shirt in the world is...

 

I've no idea in fairness DD (other than the above which I do know) - but Southampton does have a number of things going for it as a name/brand which Wigan does not (being a port where the Titanic sailed from, for a start )

 

I'm not saying it's easy, but it's easier for us to create access to the club, to market it effectively, to make it fun and accessible in a way that was not possible even five years ago.

 

I do not kid myself that we will ever be as big as the Champion's League staples (United, Barca, etc) but we might be fashionable - and that's a start!

[JPTCount]

Asian fans follow players not clubs, who's to say that our presence out there won't spark 'Adam Wawanna' fever?

[The Kraken]

Asian fans follow players not clubs, who's to say that our presence out there won't spark 'Adam Wawanna' fever?

 

I think it would "Adam Rarrana"

[This Charming Man]

Asian fans follow players not clubs, who's to say that our presence out there won't spark 'Adam Wawanna' fever?

 

Because he's not a world class player?

[Sour Mash]

Asian fans follow players not clubs, who's to say that our presence out there won't spark 'Adam Wawanna' fever?

No they don't. Man Utd, Liverpool, Arsenal etc all have massive supporters clubs etc over there.

[JPTCount]

Because he's not a world class player?

 

tosh

[S-Clarke]

tosh

 

What planet are you living on mate? He's not a world class player. I swear you're on a windup.

[doddisalegend]

Personally I can't wait for our far eastern fans to come on board just like this guy......

 

[video=youtube;--CdA8IhE6Q]

[Turkish]

It's a global world these days, With southampton airport flying to loads of places and Heathrow only an hour away there are litterally millions of plastic Real Madrid, Barcelona, Roma, Juventus, Ajax, Bayern Munich, Inter and AC MIllan, Marseille and Paris St Germain fans who could be here with 3 hours of leaving home. Why stop at attracting plastic mancs from Guildford? The world is our oyster and the world is changing. Dont rule out the tens of thousands that would come from these places to see premier league football. It's eniterly possible, if 10 years ago you'd been told people would stop using desk top PC's and would now use hand held tablets and Ipads you'd think they were mental.

Edited 9 May, 2012 by Turkish

[david in sweden]

how many asian fans are wearing bolton shirts do you think...or sunderland shirts......

not many what so ever would be my guess

 

you're quite right, but it depends on whether those clubs had made a concerted effort to get attention in Asia - probably not .

[Turkish]

you're quite right, but it depends on whether those clubs had made a concerted effort to get attention in Asia - probably not .

 

 

Bolton have had two Japanese players and Sunderland have a Korean at the moment. Why isn't everyone in these countries wearing shirts of those clubs?

[ericofarabia]

Sod 5 Year Plans - if we are not 5 points clear at the top of The PL after 5 games I'm not going to set foot in SMS until NC and NA are sacked FFS.

[djharvey]

Bolton have had two Japanese players and Sunderland have a Korean at the moment. Why isn't everyone in these countries wearing shirts of those clubs?

 

They are! it's just their wearing them underneath their Man utd & Real shirts.

[shurlock]

Bolton have had two Japanese players and Sunderland have a Korean at the moment. Why isn't everyone in these countries wearing shirts of those clubs?

 

Coz they're not very good. Not like they've taken the league by storm.

[The Kraken]

Coz they're not very good. Not like they've taken the league by storm.

 

Sunderland have a 49K stadium. They have wracked up millions in debt chasing the Champions League dream, yet have still never finished higher than 7th. What will we do differently to them to assure our own success?

[Matthew Le God]

Sunderland have a 49K stadium. They have wracked up millions in debt chasing the Champions League dream, yet have still never finished higher than 7th. What will we do differently to them to assure our own success?

 

Name some Sunderland academy products.

[Bearsy]

Weren't Jordan Henderson a sunderland whatsit?

[Tokyo-Saint]

Name some Sunderland academy products.

 

http://www.sunderlandecho.com/lifestyle/pupils-design-t-shirt-for-field-music-1-4490360

[Turkish]

Name some Sunderland academy products.

 

Jordan Henderson, he couldn't get away quick enough when a bigger club knocked on the door. It'll be different for us though, of course.

[Matthew Le God]

Jordan Henderson, he couldn't get away quick enough when a bigger club knocked on the door. It'll be different for us though, of course.

 

So one player. Impressive.

[Turkish]

So one player. Impressive.

 

So as many as we've got currently playing on our first team then, despite our supposedly amazing academy and being able to build a champions league qualifying team around them.

 

And Henderson left like a shot when Liverpool knocked on his door, why are ours going to stay with us?

[Tokyo-Saint]

So one player. Impressive.

 

Name 1 player we have sold for £16m? Bonus points given if he is as sh!t as Jordan as well.

[JPTCount]

we can't succeed unless we buy 3 more asians really, and one has to be chinese.

 

do u think city wud be where they are now if they hadn't bought sun jihai a few years back?

[Legod Third Coming]

Sunderland have a 49K stadium. They have wracked up millions in debt chasing the Champions League dream, yet have still never finished higher than 7th. What will we do differently to them to assure our own success?

 

Employ the right manager?