david in sweden Posted 3 May, 2012 Share Posted 3 May, 2012 (edited) this is only just the end of the season and already threads are rife with everybody's HCDAJFU suggestions for August... Somehow it seems (for some) ...that only a hefty price tag will surfice for it to be a "good buy". New club record?...perhaps... maybe a bit less ?.....Does £1 million sound too little to be "good enough" ? Many of the best players we've had in the past have cost next to nothing ..or nothing at all.. often a free, but the very word " free transfer " or OOC sounds like the worst of the worst to some contributors. Let's leave aside the list of youth players who've come through the system in previous decades, when players like (the late) Dean Richards saw out his contract with Wolves and joined Saints because he wanted a better class of football. Others came for a mere pittance, but saw light at the end of the tunnel. Some times players don't get along with their prev. club managers; Chaplow and Hooiveld are two recent examples of this, others like Fonte and Sharp saw greener fields ahead when they signed, and they didn't cost an arm and a leg, either. We saw a glimpse of T. Lee's skill (before his injury) but when I first heard the rumour of his possible signing my thought was "Aha ..international striker ..Mmm £2 million, maybe a bit less - if we're lucky? "....but instead he was a free transfer (!) Others will say "can't be much good if he's a free transfer ". In the end, the deciding factor is a players ambition, rather than a club's demand for a huge fee. Based on this seasons performances, I'm glad we didn't lash out those millions on CMS or Nicky Maynard. Nigel Adkins negotiating tactic to any player he wants to sign will simply be .." how'd you like to play in the Premier League? " Any international player on a free..and with any ambition left ...will certainly want to listen. Edited 3 May, 2012 by david in sweden Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CB Saint Posted 3 May, 2012 Share Posted 3 May, 2012 Free transfers make us look cheap. We must strive hard not to be viewed as the lidl of the premier league. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trousers Posted 3 May, 2012 Share Posted 3 May, 2012 Free transfers make us look cheap. We must strive hard not to be viewed as the lidl of the premier league. Even if that means we do really well because people weren't expecting us to...? Seems like an excellent tactic to me... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
doddisalegend Posted 3 May, 2012 Share Posted 3 May, 2012 I have no problem with free transfers if the club reckon they're good enough. A free transfer does tend to imply a player isn't wanted though and following that logic if someone is not good enough that a club want to keep him you have to wonder if they're the sort of player we should be looking at. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
norwaysaint Posted 3 May, 2012 Share Posted 3 May, 2012 I remember when people on here were angry that we hadn't signed a million pound striker (Clinton Morrison to be specific, but it was the price thing that was seen as most important, not the player) and that instead we had bought a 90k player, Ricardo Fuller. People actually believed that this meant Morrison was more than ten times better than Fuller and that we'd set our sights too low. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Turkish Posted 3 May, 2012 Share Posted 3 May, 2012 Has anyone said There was then? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mancsaint Posted 3 May, 2012 Share Posted 3 May, 2012 A free transfer is only free as far as his last club is concerned, The player can still get a substantial "signing on fee" equivalent to a transfer fee. Mancsaint Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
saintsmike25 Posted 3 May, 2012 Share Posted 3 May, 2012 As long as the player improved us I don't mind how much or little a player costs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
derry Posted 3 May, 2012 Share Posted 3 May, 2012 Kevin Keegan saw out his contract at Liverpool, went to Hamburg saw out his contract and came to us on a free transfer. Good players who have decided not to re new their contracts would be ideal and I would have thought high on the club's wanted list if suitable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dubai_phil Posted 3 May, 2012 Share Posted 3 May, 2012 Define "Free Transfer". If it is a top level out of contract PL player then they would be expecting the "value they would be sold for" to be included in their wages. Which would wreck the harmony and equality in the squad (which WILL be crucial to us next season) If it is an unknown or someone being released by a club with financial problems and they are within the wage structure then there is no problem. In the PL as in life, statements about the size of your **** are irrelevant. Normally people who have large Dicks don't need to shout about it, so who needs big transfer fees? It's all about the results not the talking about it/showing off. I think we are all pretty happy with our last free transfer and would take a whole bunch more like him (Lee) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JPTCount Posted 3 May, 2012 Share Posted 3 May, 2012 i bet when u play FM12 u pick ur team based on value, u gotta use the assistants reports transfer fees are so subjective and so many things influence a price tag, like contract expiry, the selling club, the buying club, position, and finally ability. just look at some of the dealings last summer. downing and young were both at the same club, both left attacking midfielders/wingers, young went for £16m, and downing was around £20m. now you can't tell me downing is worth £4m more than young. that's one whole rory delap, or 2x M. Svenssons, or 5x Jack Corks!! but that's what liverpool paid, it's a market and each product is unique, to a point. and there will be a handful of players who go cheap every summer because of clauses written into their contracts, be it a relegation release clause, or one that kicks in a minimum fee release upon not being promoted Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
david in sweden Posted 3 May, 2012 Author Share Posted 3 May, 2012 just look at some of the dealings last summer. Downing and Young were both at the same club, both left attacking midfielders/wingers, Young went for £16m, and Downing was around £20m. now you can't tell me Downing is worth £4m more than Young. but that's what Liverpool paid, it's a market and each product is unique, to a point. Liverpool. I know they got £50 mill. for Torres (only Chelski would have paid that)...but they must have been underwhelmed with the purchase of Carroll. He can surely only get better, as he's been rubbish most games this season, and 'pool fans have only partly forgiven him because of his late winner in the FA CUP SF. Big money players esp. strikers ...(for Saints anyway) have in the main been a catastrophe. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SuperMikey Posted 3 May, 2012 Share Posted 3 May, 2012 (edited) I don't think money comes into the equation too much tbh, it's more about finding the right player. Whether they're a free transfer or cost £5m, it's important that the player isn't defined by their transfer fee but by their performances on the pitch, their image off it and their contribution to the club and dressing room harmony. In some repects Andy Carroll has been defined by his transfer fee, and as a result he's got added pressure on him to justify what Liverpool paid for him. However, his replacement at Newcastle Demba Ba has also been defined by what Newcastle paid for him (zilch) in a sense, because people look at him and think "value for money" instead of "waste of money" like some do with Carroll. I don't think there's a culture at this club where players are judged on money though. Fair enough, people talk about Rickie and him costing £1m, but we've seen in the way that transfer business here is conducted (all behind the scenes, undisclosed transfer fees) that the management want our players to be judged about what they deliver on the pitch and in the dressing room. If we make any big money signings then i'm sure they will be treated just like somebody who comes here on a free. Edited 3 May, 2012 by SuperMikey Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
david in sweden Posted 3 May, 2012 Author Share Posted 3 May, 2012 I don't think money comes into the equation too much tbh, it's more about finding the right player. Whether they're a free transfer or cost £5m, it's important that the player isn't defined by their transfer fee[/b] but by their performances on the pitch, their image off it and their contribution to the club and dressing room harmony. I agree totally. My real point is that MANY people come on and suddenly "pre-judge a player" (they sometimes have never seen) based on the fee (free or not). I recall quite a few negative comments when we bought a 27 y.o. L1 striker called ..Rickie Lambert. What a waste of money he was going to be - they said. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Kraken Posted 3 May, 2012 Share Posted 3 May, 2012 Has anyone said There was then? I don't think so, but Swedish Dave has clearly got a bee in his bonnet about it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
doddisalegend Posted 3 May, 2012 Share Posted 3 May, 2012 I agree totally. My real point is that MANY people come on and suddenly "pre-judge a player" (they sometimes have never seen) based on the fee (free or not). I recall quite a few negative comments when we bought a 27 y.o. L1 striker called ..Rickie Lambert. What a waste of money he was going to be - they said. Did they? I'm seem to remember everyone saying what a good idea it was to buy the season befores top scorer in L1..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Kraken Posted 3 May, 2012 Share Posted 3 May, 2012 Did they? I'm seem to remember everyone saying what a good idea it was to buy the season befores top scorer in L1..... I'm starting to think this whole thread is based on stuff in Dave's mind rather than actual reality. Still, to each their own. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MINIBARCELONASAINT Posted 3 May, 2012 Share Posted 3 May, 2012 david in sweden ALWAYS makes a valid point Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saint-Armstrong Posted 3 May, 2012 Share Posted 3 May, 2012 I'm starting to think this whole thread is based on stuff in Dave's mind rather than actual reality. Still, to each their own. Agree, no one said such things! I do remember some "why are we signing him?" when we announced Tadanari Lee's arrival on a free though... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jam Posted 3 May, 2012 Share Posted 3 May, 2012 I agree totally. My real point is that MANY people come on and suddenly "pre-judge a player" (they sometimes have never seen) based on the fee (free or not). I think that if people pre-judge a player, it's based on if they've heard of him, what they know of him and the circumstances around the transfer. The fee often only becomes an issue if it relates to other concerns around the club - i.e. 'do we have any money?' The signings of Jos and Ricardo Fuller are cases in point. I recall quite a few negative comments when we bought a 27 y.o. L1 striker called ..Rickie Lambert. What a waste of money he was going to be - they said. Really? I'm sure the overall response on here was one of pant dirtying excitement when Lambert signed... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Window Cleaner Posted 3 May, 2012 Share Posted 3 May, 2012 Is this a trick question? tranfser isn't a real word being the most simple reply I suppose. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Turkish Posted 3 May, 2012 Share Posted 3 May, 2012 To give Allerdyce his due one of things he did very well at Bolton When they were establishing themselves in the Premier league was use the free transfer market wisely. He managed to bring the likes of Campo, Jay Jay Okocha and Kevin Davies to Bolton for nothing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
david in sweden Posted 6 May, 2012 Author Share Posted 6 May, 2012 Is this a trick question? tranfser isn't a real word being the most simple reply I suppose. ANOTHER error(!)...put in down to my arthritic fingers and no spell-checker! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
david in sweden Posted 6 May, 2012 Author Share Posted 6 May, 2012 Agree, no one said such things! I do remember some "why are we signing him?" when we announced Tadanari Lee's arrival on a free though... I was expecting that we would have paid a fee to Hiroshima. I was surprised to hear afterwards that he was on a free,(or was that widely known beforehand?). Lee's signing actually goes to prove the point that some players acquired on a free can be a very good deal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skintsaint Posted 6 May, 2012 Share Posted 6 May, 2012 To give Allerdyce his due one of things he did very well at Bolton When they were establishing themselves in the Premier league was use the free transfer market wisely. He managed to bring the likes of Campo, Jay Jay Okocha and Kevin Davies to Bolton for nothing. Would be a good avenue to go down, although will we pay the supposedly 40k a week Okacha was on, I guess its ok on a short 2 year contract or something if no transfer fee is involved and they are not too much over the hill! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
capitalsaint Posted 6 May, 2012 Share Posted 6 May, 2012 david in sweden ALWAYS makes a valid point as does MINIBARCELONASAINT... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
capitalsaint Posted 6 May, 2012 Share Posted 6 May, 2012 Somehow it seems (for some) ...that only a hefty price tag will surfice for it to be a "good buy". Who are you talking about? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
david in sweden Posted 6 May, 2012 Author Share Posted 6 May, 2012 Who are you talking about? simply that some fans will judge a player... before he's played a game... by the size of the fee. If it's too low, then he can't be any good and he's a free...then he's bound to be rubbish. you mean that you haven't read those types of posts over the bygone seasons.? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Glasgow_Saint Posted 6 May, 2012 Share Posted 6 May, 2012 as does MINIBARCELONASAINT... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bearsy Posted 6 May, 2012 Share Posted 6 May, 2012 Ain't really buying all this! Lot of people saying we should buy Matt Phillips for like £4 or £5 million, if we was to get him for free I can't see anyone being less pleased. In fact I think Dave has got this completely the wrong way round! I can remember people being far more disappointed by signings where we were perceived to have overpaid. Kelvin being one example, his transfer fee was a millstone for probably 18 months before he got forgiven. Danny Fox was a more recent example though that went away pretty quickly cos the team was doing so well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GAS Posted 6 May, 2012 Share Posted 6 May, 2012 Free transfers make us look cheap. We must strive hard not to be viewed as the lidl of the premier league.You are obviosly confusing cheap with poor quality. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stud mark of doom Posted 6 May, 2012 Share Posted 6 May, 2012 Kevin Keegan saw out his contract at Liverpool, went to Hamburg saw out his contract and came to us on a free transfer. Good players who have decided not to re new their contracts would be ideal and I would have thought high on the club's wanted list if suitable. ? Keegan's transfers pre-dated the Bosman ruling. Although he may have been at the end of his contract, the transfer to Hamburg was a record at £500k I think. The transfer to us wasn't far off the record at that time, at £400k, if my memory serves. Equivalent to us splashing out £30M- £40M now, allowing for mad football inflation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
david in sweden Posted 7 May, 2012 Author Share Posted 7 May, 2012 (edited) In fact I think Dave has got this completely the wrong way round! I can remember people being far more disappointed by signings where we were perceived to have overpaid. QUOTE] Oh I agree with that. With rare exception... most of the big transfer fees we've paid out over the years have been very disappointing. I know there are two camps about the present Rory Delap deal, but most people consider him a waste of money, as was Agustin Delgado, who was " not good enough" to play in Saints' (Strachan) side but still went to the World Cup 2002 - and even scored a goal for Equador. Mixed opinions about Kevin Phillips, too. £3.25 mill. aalthough he wasn't so bad ..in the short time he was here. If you go back far enough, it was always the same. £400 K ..doesn't sound a lot these days but it was in ...1979..when we bought Charlie George with his dodgy knee. A very expensive deal - in the end. Needless to say, we were well and truly shafted when selling Alan Shearer for £3.6 mill. to Blackburn 1992..and they took back half the fee and gave us two real ***** - Kerry Dixon and David Speedie, who didn't manage 30 games between them and they were both gone in a year. Buying Alan Mc Loughlin (from Swindon) for a£1 milklion wasn't just a club record fee (in 1990) but very expensive when you consider he only managed 27 games....before moving to Pomp*y (for half price). No sorry. Big money deals usually mean big trouble, but the mere £1 million for Rickie Lambert.. is the best deal this club has done in the last 25 years....aside that is, from signing Matt Le Tissier ....as a boy ...from the Channel Islands . Edited 7 May, 2012 by david in sweden Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paulwantsapint Posted 7 May, 2012 Share Posted 7 May, 2012 Don't forget that since St Markus saved us we have made some massive money signings for the league we were in Rickie Lambert £1m Jose Fonte £1.2m Guly £1.2m Although all small change to saints to league 1 they would have been the same as signing £10m -15m players in prem Jos Hooiveld £2m? Danny Fox £2m? Billy Sharp £1.75m In championship are again normal saints money but to smaller teams again £5m -£10m in prem Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Danbert Posted 7 May, 2012 Share Posted 7 May, 2012 david in sweden ALWAYS makes a valid point In HIS OWN special way. Green biro anyone? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
david in sweden Posted 7 May, 2012 Author Share Posted 7 May, 2012 In HIS OWN special way. Green biro anyone?[/QUOTE] Red frightens the students! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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