Shroppie Posted 19 April, 2012 Share Posted 19 April, 2012 So how did he actually cut his hand in half? His defence was that he was hit and fell with bottles in his hand. Just possible that could have done it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sadoldgit Posted 19 April, 2012 Share Posted 19 April, 2012 I should add that the reviewing lawyer will consider a) is there enough evidence to convict and b) is it in the public interest to prosecute. There are no guarantees in any case of a guilty verdict no matter how srtong the CPS may feel the evidence is. The defence do what they can to discredit the evidence and it is down to a jury to decide. The CPS has a budget and does not prosecute for the sake of it. Barney has been found innocent so good luck to him. That doesn't mean that the decision to prosecute was the wrong one. It is very difficult to get a guilty verdict in a rape case and we spend shedloads of money to bring them to court non the less because, if we believe that there is a case to answer, it is only right and proper that the evidence is put before a jury. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dune Posted 19 April, 2012 Share Posted 19 April, 2012 The CPS would not have prosecuted if they felt the evidence was too weak for a conviction. These things go through extensive processes so as not to waste the public money. If the jury were not convinced of his guilt, so be it, it does not mean that the prosecution decision was not correct. That is why we have a defence system, to put the other side of the story. The CPS are useless. I was on a Jury in a case and we were seated ready to go and CPS then dropped the case before it started. They must've spent thousands right up to that point. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sadoldgit Posted 19 April, 2012 Share Posted 19 April, 2012 That doesn't mean they are useless. There are a number of reasons that cases get dropped at the last minute. Sometimes key witnesses do not turn up or retract their evidence. There are thousands of successful prosecutions every day, but hey, let's just label the CPS as useless because not all cases go ahead. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saint Without a Halo Posted 19 April, 2012 Share Posted 19 April, 2012 He'll be off in the summer without a doubt. Very lucky to get a Not Guilty for that. How do you know the echo was very selective in giving details about the prosecution witnesses but strangley silent about the defence witnesses the paper had already found him guilty but the jury didnt. Unless you were in court for the whole trial and heard both sides in full you cant possibly decide if he was lucky or not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saint Without a Halo Posted 19 April, 2012 Share Posted 19 April, 2012 The CPS are useless. I was on a Jury in a case and we were seated ready to go and CPS then dropped the case before it started. They must've spent thousands right up to that point. err maybe new evidence came to light the convinced the prosecution they were wrong. Isnt that called justice! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
doddisalegend Posted 19 April, 2012 Share Posted 19 April, 2012 This case should never have gone to court - a waste of everyone's time and money. As for Lee Barnard in the PL - i can't see it myself. Well technically Lee has had more PL experince than most of the current team including playing against Man U in the PL..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
um pahars Posted 19 April, 2012 Share Posted 19 April, 2012 I should add that the reviewing lawyer will consider a) is there enough evidence to convict and b) is it in the public interest to prosecute. There are no guarantees in any case of a guilty verdict no matter how srtong the CPS may feel the evidence is. The defence do what they can to discredit the evidence and it is down to a jury to decide. The CPS has a budget and does not prosecute for the sake of it. Barney has been found innocent so good luck to him. That doesn't mean that the decision to prosecute was the wrong one. It is very difficult to get a guilty verdict in a rape case and we spend shedloads of money to bring them to court non the less because, if we believe that there is a case to answer, it is only right and proper that the evidence is put before a jury. Indeed and I remember a stat that showed something like 2/3rds of those who plead not guilty at a Crown Court were acquitted, so just because the CPS want to pursue the case is not an indication of guilt (not a slight on the CPS by the way). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
musesaint Posted 19 April, 2012 Share Posted 19 April, 2012 Spoke to the arresting copper 3 days after event - he didnt do it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Suhari Posted 19 April, 2012 Share Posted 19 April, 2012 Spoke to the arresting copper 3 days after event - he didnt do it So what happened? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hamster Posted 19 April, 2012 Share Posted 19 April, 2012 Excellent news. Seemed a good lad when I've spoken to him outside SMS & always has time 4 a quick chat with my 5 year old too. Should-a been a character witness too! Does this mean he's not f**king hard now though? On the contrary , it means that he is very ****ing hard. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hamster Posted 19 April, 2012 Share Posted 19 April, 2012 Brilliant! If its tricky to sing' date=' we could say 'used a get out of jail free card'?[/quote'] Lee Barnard, Barnard, he's short and he can't remember, That boxer he tried to dismember Lee Barnard, Barnard This on a t shirt. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
egg Posted 19 April, 2012 Share Posted 19 April, 2012 Indeed and I remember a stat that showed something like 2/3rds of those who plead not guilty at a Crown Court were acquitted, so just because the CPS want to pursue the case is not an indication of guilt (not a slight on the CPS by the way). And being found not guilty is not necessarily an indication of innocence (eg OJ Simpson). I'm not saying the Barney decision was wrong ( the unanimous verdict in less than an hour suggests it was probably correct) but Barney has not been found innocent as many think. As to the stats, when I had a criminal defence practice it's fair to say that the vast majority of my clients who were acquitted were probably guilty as hell. They got off as a result of decent defence lawyers and/or crap prosecutors. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Legod Third Coming Posted 19 April, 2012 Share Posted 19 April, 2012 A great result in the spirit of British justice. And just a word for the 12 jurors in Salisbury... Ladysaint Fitzhugh Fella Um Pahars Dune Sour Mash.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Legod Third Coming Posted 19 April, 2012 Share Posted 19 April, 2012 And being found not guilty is not necessarily an indication of innocence (eg OJ Simpson). I'm not saying the Barney decision was wrong ( the unanimous verdict in less than an hour suggests it was probably correct) but Barney has not been found innocent as many think. As to the stats, when I had a criminal defence practice it's fair to say that the vast majority of my clients who were acquitted were probably guilty as hell. They got off as a result of decent defence lawyers and/or crap prosecutors. You got guilty people off??!!! How do you sleep at night??!! Don't tell me, on a bed made of money... Lawyers, tsk. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lighthouse Posted 19 April, 2012 Share Posted 19 April, 2012 He stands just over 5ft 10 Barnard, Barnard He'll take us to the top again Barnard, Barnard He strikes the ball with lots of pace He'll smash a bottle round your face* ... I'm stuck on the last line. *Legal disclaimer: There is no evidence to suggest Barnard will smash a bottle round your face, but he might if you really annoy him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dan17 Posted 19 April, 2012 Share Posted 19 April, 2012 He stands just over 5ft 10 Barnard, Barnard He'll take us to the top again Barnard, Barnard He strikes the ball with lots of pace He'll smash a bottle round your face* ... I'm stuck on the last line. *Legal disclaimer: There is no evidence to suggest Barnard will smash a bottle round your face, but he might if you really annoy him. I laughed........a lot :-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paulwantsapint Posted 20 April, 2012 Share Posted 20 April, 2012 Now that is over what are the odds on barney scoring the goal that gets promotion? As for not being a saint come next season there are worse players than barney in the prem & had we had a barney 04/05 we might have had a better chance of staying up Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ex Ringwood Saint Posted 20 April, 2012 Share Posted 20 April, 2012 He stands just over 5ft 10 Barnard, Barnard He'll take us to the top again Barnard, Barnard He strikes the ball with lots of pace He'll smash a bottle round your face* ... I'm stuck on the last line. *Legal disclaimer: There is no evidence to suggest Barnard will smash a bottle round your face, but he might if you really annoy him. I think the legal disclaimer makes a great last line.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ken Tone Posted 20 April, 2012 Share Posted 20 April, 2012 Now that is over what are the odds on barney scoring the goal that gets promotion? As for not being a saint come next season there are worse players than barney in the prem & had we had a barney 04/05 we might have had a better chance of staying up I too think many on here are writing Barnard off far too quickly. He's not a bad player at all. And let's face it, he never bottles a challenge ............. or if he does, it hasn't been proven Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Victor Posted 20 April, 2012 Share Posted 20 April, 2012 why take it so personal? No....haven't forgotton what he's done but doesn't mean he is good enough now or for the prem. I dont understand why w*nkers like you get hung up on players who have done little and would go tomorrow for 50k extra. You never know, he may punch above his weight in the Prem. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Son of Bob Posted 20 April, 2012 Share Posted 20 April, 2012 Is it just possible he would prefer somethimg that doesn't refer to the court case that has hung over him for so long? What's wrong with the original "He's better than Frank Lampard" (except of course he isn't, but then does Adam really make Messi ......? What about "He's thinner than Frank Lampard". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shroppie Posted 20 April, 2012 Share Posted 20 April, 2012 What about "He's thinner than Frank Lampard". Or "you'd better not drop your guard" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
St_Tel49 Posted 20 April, 2012 Share Posted 20 April, 2012 He'll be off in the summer without a doubt. Very lucky to get a Not Guilty for that. I don't think luck came into it. If the jury took less than an hour to find him not guilty then the evidence must have been weak - very weak. Why would he be off in the summer if he has not long signed a new contract? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sandwichsaint Posted 20 April, 2012 Share Posted 20 April, 2012 She fell over? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saint_Donovan Posted 20 April, 2012 Share Posted 20 April, 2012 Spoke to the arresting copper 3 days after event - he didnt do it Absolute rubbish, I know mike and several people who were in the group that were involved and he certainly DID do it, Mike has a nice scar on his eyebrow to show for it. But what actually happened and what you can prove in court are 2 separate things. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thedelldays Posted 20 April, 2012 Share Posted 20 April, 2012 Absolute rubbish, I know mike and several people who were in the group that were involved and he certainly DID do it, Mike has a nice scar on his eyebrow to show for it. But what actually happened and what you can prove in court are 2 separate things. I have no doubt your mate got what he deserved mind.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jamesfp1 Posted 20 April, 2012 Share Posted 20 April, 2012 She fell over? Lee fell over will do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saint_Donovan Posted 20 April, 2012 Share Posted 20 April, 2012 I have no doubt your mate got what he deserved mind.... I wouldn't disagree with that at all Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
derry Posted 20 April, 2012 Share Posted 20 April, 2012 Spoke to the arresting copper 3 days after event - he didnt do it A close mate has a friend in the Police who thought that there just wasn't the evidence to convict but the CPS pressed ahead regardless. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thedelldays Posted 20 April, 2012 Share Posted 20 April, 2012 He stands just over 5ft 10 Barnard, Barnard He'll take us to the top again Barnard, Barnard He strikes the ball with lots of pace He'll smash a bottle round your face* ... I'm stuck on the last line. *Legal disclaimer: There is no evidence to suggest Barnard will smash a bottle round your face, but he might if you really annoy him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The9 Posted 20 April, 2012 Share Posted 20 April, 2012 (edited) Now that is over what are the odds on barney scoring the goal that gets promotion? As for not being a saint come next season there are worse players than barney in the prem & had we had a barney 04/05 we might have had a better chance of staying up I'd say the odds were quite long given that he rarely gets on the pitch. As for your complete nonsense about 04/05, unless you were planning on playing him out of position (maybe right back ahead of Telfer, Kenton or Nilsson would have worked), I doubt he'd have got many games ahead of Crouch, Phillips, Camara or Ormerod - the last of whom has a MUCH better lower league goalscoring record than Barnard on his best day. We scored more goals than anyone else in the bottom 6 and as many as the side who came 4th. Scoring goals was not the problem in 2004/5 and a glorified League One striker wouldn't have helped at all. In case anyone's in any doubt here, I think we extended his contract to get more money for him when we sell him to a bottom half Championship or top table League One side, and doubt very much he has the ability to make it in the Prem on a regular basis. He's not skilful or quick enough, nothing special in the air either, and his lack of pace means he won't get enough chances to use his good finishing skill. If he was part of the future plans we wouldn't have 4 strikers ahead of him in the queue already, and he'd have played a LOT more this season once fit. Edited 20 April, 2012 by The9 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
david in sweden Posted 20 April, 2012 Share Posted 20 April, 2012 He might yet have a part to play this season and he was given a 3-year extension to his contract this season so he may well be around for a while yet. A useful man to have on the bench IMO (especially over the next 10 days). I'd go along with that FF, except that it took half-a-season to convince most of the fan base that Rickie Lambert was "good enough " for the Npc, - let alone the Prem. The main problem is that Lee Barnard has hardly played a full game in almost a year....and that was in L1...and if we are playing Prem.football next season then he has a lot of ground to make up ...if he's to be considered a suitable striker to have in the squad. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
doddisalegend Posted 20 April, 2012 Share Posted 20 April, 2012 Well all those saying that Barney ain't good enough maybe sheffield UTD will buy him they need a new striker as top scorer Ched Evans has just been sent down for five years for rape..... http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-wales-17781842 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PinkScarf Posted 20 April, 2012 Share Posted 20 April, 2012 Well all those saying that Barney ain't good enough maybe sheffield UTD will buy him they need a new striker as top scorer Ched Evans has just been sent down for five years for rape..... http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-wales-17781842 While Barney is still here the Girls think that this is the best version : Wonder if we will see him at Middlesborough ?? Lee Barnard Barnard He's short and he's f*cking hard He's better than Frank Lampard Lee Barnard Barnard Lee Lee Lee Barnard Well the Girls think he is better than Frank Lampard - Frank is getting past it ... let's be honest !!! and Barney could do with being cut a bit of slack after the stress of the last year. Barney needs to focus on his football and score for Saints ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lighthouse Posted 20 April, 2012 Share Posted 20 April, 2012 He stands just over 5ft 10 Barnard, Barnard He'll take us to the top again Barnard, Barnard He strikes the ball with lots of pace He'll smash a bottle round your face* ... I'm stuck on the last line. *Legal disclaimer: There is no evidence to suggest Barnard will smash a bottle round your face, but he might if you really annoy him. Having thought about it, the best last line I can come up with is: Leeeeee Barnard, his lawyer's f**king great Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paulwantsapint Posted 20 April, 2012 Share Posted 20 April, 2012 Stand by my opinion that we could have used a barney in 04/05 seem to remember there was a time when Beattie, Phillips & crouch were all out injured for about a month while ormerod was missing ( injured or loaned ) then in the run in when hard working battler was required when Phillips was again injured Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
up and away Posted 20 April, 2012 Share Posted 20 April, 2012 The CPS would not have prosecuted if they felt the evidence was too weak for a conviction. These things go through extensive processes so as not to waste the public money. If the jury were not convinced of his guilt, so be it, it does not mean that the prosecution decision was not correct. That is why we have a defence system, to put the other side of the story. For this I give you Alison Saunders, Chief Crown Prosecutor for CPS London. In the case of Barry George, for the murder of Jill Dando, Saunders eulogised over the use of circumstantial evidence to bring a conviction. Crown Prosecution Service lawyer Alison Saunders, who led the work of the prosecution team, said the conviction showed that circumstantial evidence taken together could, despite common misconceptions, be used to build a strong case. What she failed to say was that this circumstantial evidence was a sighting of Barry George near to where Jill Dando lived, several hours earlier in the day. This was of someone cleaning a car windscreen in the street, with the car empty, drivers door open in the middle of the street. This despite the fact George had never owned a car, a licence or the ability to drive. This being only one of 6 witnesses that managed to pick out George from a line out 6 months after the event. Saunders than surpassed herself with the decision to prosecute two 10 year old boys for the rape of an 8 year old girl. Not rape as we know it, but a case of doctors and nurses with no one knowing where all the bits went, financed by the offer of sweets. Now I understand at what point do you prosecute or not but it would have been far better to let the local authorities thoroughly investigate the case privately using child psychologists to see if the case warranted prosecution. Rather than trial to decide that point as well. The trial left may traumatised after the event, not least the judge. With the two boys being found not guilty of rape (no one knew where anything went), but guilty of attempted rape (they may have found where the bits went) and put onto the sex offenders register. Just remember back to your childhood and imagine the possibilities if Saunders had come across yourselves inappropriately. This from the most prominent Crown Prosecutor in England, promoted on the back of crass judgement and lacking any moral compass. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sadoldgit Posted 21 April, 2012 Share Posted 21 April, 2012 It is very easy to pick individual cases and say that a whole organisation is useless, it is also rubbish. People have to make judgement calls because other people lie, or make mistakes, or forget things. The defence will often let a case go to trial in the hope that witness don't turn up and the defendant gets off. They would save everyone a whole lot of time and money if they persuaded the defendent to plead at an earlier stage when they are clearly guilty. Thought about that? Perhaps some moral outrage should be aimed at that - or the firms who bend the rules to get motorists off charges when they are clearly guilty. If prosecuting people and getting guilty verdicts on the guilty was easy the crime rate would be halved overnight. However, people know how hard it is to get a conviction either in fron t of a Magistrates bench or in front of a jury so many will take that chance. Perhaps, again, you should aim your barbs at the guilty who waste you and my money on taking that chance! As for a policeman saying that Barnard was innocent. Despite what you might believe from the Law and Order programme (which is total nonsense by the way) it is the police who provide the CPS with the evidence i.e. witness statements and exhibits. If the evidence did not point towards Barnard he would not have been charged. The very same evidence that the police provided. Once upon a time the jury were asked to provide a verdict on the basis it was beyond "reasonable doubt." Now they are told that they must be "sure" of the guilt. A very different direction. Barnard was given a fair trial and found innocent but he was tried because there was enough evidence (provided by the police) to take the trial to court. Persoannly I feel sorry for the poor guy who was viciously assualted by a drunk criminal. As for Saunders, the CCPs very very rarely make prosection decsions themselves. They are just the figureheads and she would have been speaking for the Reviewing Lawyer and the District Crown Prosecutor and Senior District Crown Prosecutor who bring these charges (often in consulation with very experience counsel form the Bar who actually prosecute our cases in court. As I say, it is very easy to get on your high horse and make ill informed judgements and that is excatly what you get on internet forums. Just give some thought to those people who make money out of getting guilty people off. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saint137 Posted 21 April, 2012 Share Posted 21 April, 2012 He'll see you in church He'll see you in church Lee Barnard He'll see you in church Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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