(not THE) Kevin Moore Posted 15 January, 2012 Posted 15 January, 2012 I can't see us spending what would be an obscene amount of money in ccc terms for him. Looks like a good player but is he 14 times better than a current Japanese international?
Golden Balls Posted 15 January, 2012 Posted 15 January, 2012 Looks like a good player but is he 14 times better than a current Japanese international? lol, if only it worked like that.
(not THE) Kevin Moore Posted 15 January, 2012 Posted 15 January, 2012 lol, if only it worked like that. But it kind of does though doesn't it? Half-decent British players don't really represent great value.
djk2g09 Posted 15 January, 2012 Posted 15 January, 2012 Can't wait for hoopsy to sign, he's gonna have great bants with corky etc
saintmatt Posted 15 January, 2012 Posted 15 January, 2012 But it kind of does though doesn't it? Half-decent British players don't really represent great value. I think he may be referring to the law of diminishing returns.
Norm Posted 15 January, 2012 Posted 15 January, 2012 In terms of English football vs Scottish football, here's how it breaks down in real terms. (ie. where the money comes from) English football attracts far more interest from foreign markets, The Championship is marketed in Australia, Brazil, Bulgaria, Canada, Germany, Hungary, Italy, Sweeden, France, Norway, and the huge market of Asia (although this doesn't include Japan and Korea). The SPL is marketed in Australia, Canada, France, Norway, Poland, Russia, and Sweeden. This means that, despite their obviously far higher attendances, and us not being in the Prem, Saints will have been watched this season by a number of people an order or two of magnitude higher than Celtic. These far higher viewing figures mean that advertising is more effective for those audiences (ie. fans buy products they see during matches. Yes, YOU personally might not, but enough do to make a huge difference). Some of the money companies can make extra from advertising pays for that advertising to the tv company. The tv company uses that money to buy the rights to show football from the league, and that money is distributed to the clubs themselves. That money is then ploughed back into the teams, helping to keep the league competitive, the matches entertaining, and the interest in watching high. This means that while Celtic fans might moan that the only reason English football is better is because of the Sky money, that money comes from exactly the same place as people going through the turnstiles, from the fans. It's not Sky that's made the English league the best in the world, it's the fans, from all over the world. If we get back to the Prem, those differences are even bigger, and that combined with the fact that England international players are very VERY rarely get selected from outside the English league, and you can make a strong case for why Southampton could be seen as a bigger draw for a player than Celtic. Most Celtic fans seem to be assuming that there's no chance of Hooper coming here because they see themselves as the far bigger club. I don't agree with that view, and that's the reason I think there's every chance we'll manage to sign Hooper. Jimmy, your post was worth reading until I reached the sentence I highlighted. The way I read it, you seem to suggest that Saints are a bigger club than Celtic. You really can't be serious, can you? You might live to be 150 years of age but we will never be as big as Celtic. Behave yourself.
Appy Posted 15 January, 2012 Posted 15 January, 2012 People who think that we are a bigger club than Celtic are deluded. People who think we have a better team than Celtic and play in a better league, are right.
dannysfc Posted 15 January, 2012 Posted 15 January, 2012 It just beggers belief that how Gary Hooper is worth £35 mill according to Celtic and Neil Lennon I'l never know so we'l either stick at it and try and make a deal or just move on to the next player or whatever but we'l see!!! COYR !!!
Norm Posted 15 January, 2012 Posted 15 January, 2012 People who think that we are a bigger club than Celtic are deluded. 110% Correct. People who think we have a better team than Celtic (Umm, unsure) and play in a better league, are right (100% Correct). Next we will be saying Lambert is off to Barca.
Crazy Diamond Posted 15 January, 2012 Posted 15 January, 2012 I don't know what's worse, Lennon saying he's worth £35m or people thinking Lennon believes it himself.
Jimmy_D Posted 15 January, 2012 Posted 15 January, 2012 [/b] Jimmy, your post was worth reading until I reached the sentence I highlighted. The way I read it, you seem to suggest that Saints are a bigger club than Celtic. You really can't be serious, can you? You might live to be 150 years of age but we will never be as big as Celtic. Behave yourself. No. I was disagreeing with the view that Celtic being a bigger club will keep Hooper there. The entire point of the post was to point out that the relative size of the leagues could more than counteract the relative size of the clubs. Sorry if that didn't come across clearly.
hutch Posted 15 January, 2012 Posted 15 January, 2012 Wenger's giving the model a trial run for us at the moment. He's currently got Oxo, Theo, Henry & van Persie all on at the same time.
Chicken With A Banjo Posted 15 January, 2012 Posted 15 January, 2012 From twop tips twitter feed today: GET the live Scottish premiership football feel by letting your dog play on FIFA.
derry Posted 15 January, 2012 Posted 15 January, 2012 Probably in one third of the matches Celtic play to crowds down around 5000. Of the rest all but the Edinburgh and Aberdeen clubs have very poor attendances.
derry Posted 15 January, 2012 Posted 15 January, 2012 Mick Channon after an England match in Scotland was asked what he thought the best thing about Scotland. Quick answer, "The road out of it". I think Hooper is a Londoner and a move South might well appeal. I was based in Aberdeen for a couple of years, commuted for about four nights max every week but I couldn't wait to move back South.
Webby Posted 15 January, 2012 Posted 15 January, 2012 I can't see us spending what would be an obscene amount of money in ccc terms for him. Looks like a good player but is he 14 times better than a current Japanese international?Why is that people think that player A that cost XX amount is, or should be, better than player B who cost X amount? It's just a valuation that was made and paid at that particular time for whatever reason. The only thing to ask is could we serve ourselves better by getting 2 or 3 players for the same amount that this 1 might cost.
SO16_Saint Posted 15 January, 2012 Posted 15 January, 2012 Wenger's giving the model a trial run for us at the moment. He's currently got Oxo, Theo, Henry & van Persie all on at the same time. And that worked a treat
Cabrone Posted 15 January, 2012 Posted 15 January, 2012 Just had a look at the SPL and it really is a tiny tiny league. Take out Rangers\Celtic and the highest average attendance is Hearts with 13,441. That would put them 18th in the Champ (between Burnley and Bristol C). 7 teams (out of 12) get lower attendances than ANY championship club and all but the top 3 get less than 10k per game. Bottom is St Johnstone with 3,918 (lower than almost half of league 2 teams). Outside of the old firm + Hearts every SPL team would have a tough time in the champ and quite a few of them would even find league 1 tough. Just to show how lopsided it is Celtic (49,426) and Rangers (45,493) average over 30,000 more per game than ANY other club in that league. I thought the prem was bad but it's positively fair and balanced compared to the SPL. Just imagine if we played in the SPL.....it'd be regular Euro football for us. Unfortunately unlike Celtic we have the misfortune of having to compete in proper football leagues. PS: We average 26,097. Championship Stats SPL Stats
Webby Posted 15 January, 2012 Posted 15 January, 2012 Just had a look at the SPL and it really is a tiny tiny league. Take out Rangers\Celtic and the highest average attendance is Hearts with 13,441. That would put them 18th in the Champ (between Burnley and Bristol C). 7 teams (out of 12) get lower attendances than ANY championship club and all but the top 3 get less than 10k per game. Bottom is St Johnstone with 3,918 (lower than almost half of league 2 teams). Outside of the old firm + Hearts every SPL team would have a tough time in the champ and quite a few of them would even find league 1 tough. Just to show how lopsided it is Celtic (49,426) and Rangers (45,493) average over 30,000 more per game than ANY other club in that league. I thought the prem was bad but it's positively fair and balanced compared to the SPL. Just imagine if we played in the SPL.....it'd be regular Euro football for us. Unfortunately unlike Celtic we have the misfortune of having to compete in proper football leagues. PS: We average 26,097. Championship Stats SPL StatsThis isn't a fair comparison because the Scottish league is smaller than the english league and the 2 glasgow teams will inevitably 'take' fans away from the smaller clubs. Instead, take 2 prem league clubs from the same city with similar average attendances to rangers and Celtic. Then, work out the distance of the radius of the clubs in the spl using glasgow as the centre and apply that to the 2 prem teams that you just chose. Then see what league teams are in your radius and what their attendances are.
The9 Posted 15 January, 2012 Posted 15 January, 2012 This isn't a fair comparison because the Scottish league is smaller than the english league and the 2 glasgow teams will inevitably 'take' fans away from the smaller clubs. Instead, take 2 prem league clubs from the same city with similar average attendances to rangers and Celtic. Then, work out the distance of the radius of the clubs in the spl using glasgow as the centre and apply that to the 2 prem teams that you just chose. Then see what league teams are in your radius and what their attendances are. Ok, well picking Man C and Man U as my "Rangers and Celtic", that allows Liverpool and Everton to coexist in the radius, and the likes of Bolton, Blackburn, Stoke, Wigan, (not even Prem) Leeds within 40 miles all always topping 15,000 crowds in the league, and Wolves, Villa, Newcastle, Sunderland almost certainly within a similar radius to the SPL's clubs (thanks to ICT and Aberdeen)... and as we know, Man U will pick up a few fans all over the place so there's a similarity there. So it IS a fair comparison, and it shows that English club attendances are a lot more evenly spread in a similar area (though the issue then is probably more about population density anyway).
ART Posted 15 January, 2012 Posted 15 January, 2012 With Lennon quoting 35 million valuation, could it be that Liverpool are aiming to push in and do a swop of Andy Carroll for Gary Hooper?
VectisSaint Posted 15 January, 2012 Posted 15 January, 2012 With Lennon quoting 35 million valuation, could it be that Liverpool are aiming to push in and do a swop of Andy Carroll for Gary Hooper? Lennon's 35 mill is being taken out of context, it was just an off the cuff remark, it is not a valuation by the Club. The factors that may bring Hooper to Saints have little or nothing to do with the SPL or Celtic. More likely he is interested in the move because of (a) his past association with Adkins and (b) the chance next season to play in the PL and perhaps further his possible international career. Playing in Europe for Celtic is not guaranteed and even if they do qualify, they have little hope of being successful, Celtic won the European Cup in 1967, the chance of that ever happening again is about as likely as me playing up front alongside RL (or GH). Maybe Jos and Barney have been having a few words with their old team mate as well, although in Barney's case it would seem that Hoopers arrival would mean the departure of Barnard.
Matthew Le God Posted 15 January, 2012 Posted 15 January, 2012 (edited) Playing in Europe for Celtic is not guaranteed and even if they do qualify, they have little hope of being successful. To be fair to Celtic they were runners up in the UEFA Cup in 2003. But then so were Fulham in 2010 and Middlesbrough in 2006. So hardly something unachievable for Southampton in the future. Edited 15 January, 2012 by Matthew Le God
Monk Posted 15 January, 2012 Posted 15 January, 2012 Celtic = bigger club Southampton = better team easy.
Glasgow_Saint Posted 15 January, 2012 Posted 15 January, 2012 Southampton = better team Not so sure about that
tartan_saint Posted 15 January, 2012 Posted 15 January, 2012 When up visiting family in Kilmarnock, you'll notice more people wearing Rangers or Celtic shirts in town than Kilmarnock ones. It's pretty similar all over the country though. I once met a chap before an Old Firm game who was a Rangers ST holder who used to travel down from Fort William (100miles away) for every home game.
Colbury Posted 15 January, 2012 Posted 15 January, 2012 Celtic are a much bigger club than us. But their star player (apparently) wants to sign for us. And there's every possibility it will happen. Says it all really.
Colinjb Posted 15 January, 2012 Posted 15 January, 2012 It would take a player such as Hooper switching to a championship side to make Celtic realise just how weakened they have become in recent years. Even Birmingham City can make a half decent fist of the UEFA cup, they needed a Swiss side to cheat in order to simply get into the group stage.
SFC Forever Posted 15 January, 2012 Posted 15 January, 2012 So far I have not seen or heard of him saying that he wants to come to Southampton.
Ivan Katalinic's 'tache Posted 15 January, 2012 Author Posted 15 January, 2012 So far I have not seen or heard of him saying that he wants to come to Southampton. Equally, we haven't seen him say he doesn't want to come to So'ton...
krissyboy31 Posted 15 January, 2012 Posted 15 January, 2012 So far I have not seen or heard of him saying that he wants to come to Southampton.If he didn't we wouldn't be wasting our time pursuing his signature.
LGTL Posted 15 January, 2012 Posted 15 January, 2012 Born in Harlow, so closer to friends/family With a manager he knows/likes/wants to work with again Very real possibility we'll be a premier league club in a few months Possible higher salary I see no reason why we couldn't be an option for him. Will have to wait and see.
ChrisPY Posted 15 January, 2012 Posted 15 January, 2012 So far I have not seen or heard of him saying that he wants to come to Southampton. Good mates with Jos, used to be managed by Nige (think we can assume he's got his number). Pretty sure the club have a good idea if he wants to come or not. They've been making bids. 2 + 2...
Colinjb Posted 15 January, 2012 Posted 15 January, 2012 Good mates with Jos, used to be managed by Nige (think we can assume he's got his number). Pretty sure the club have a good idea if he wants to come or not. They've been making bids. 2 + 2... It's always difficult to read between the lines in football, they blur so easily.
Badger Posted 15 January, 2012 Posted 15 January, 2012 Born in Harlow, so closer to friends/family With a manager he knows/likes/wants to work with again Very real possibility we'll be a premier league club in a few months Possible higher salary I see no reason why we couldn't be an option for him. Will have to wait and see. All good reasons, although I doubt the salary would be less at Celtic.
The Cat Posted 15 January, 2012 Posted 15 January, 2012 All good reasons, although I doubt the salary would be less at Celtic. I wouldn't have thought we'd pay him more than Celtic in the Championship but I'd imagine he'd have a hefty promotion bonus and wage rise put in his contract.
Badger Posted 15 January, 2012 Posted 15 January, 2012 I wouldn't have thought we'd pay him more than Celtic in the Championship but I'd imagine he'd have a hefty promotion bonus and wage rise put in his contract. Fair point.
Colbury Posted 15 January, 2012 Posted 15 January, 2012 So far I have not seen or heard of him saying that he wants to come to Southampton. Nor has he come out saying he doesnt want to leave etc, which he could quite easily do...
trousers Posted 16 January, 2012 Posted 16 January, 2012 Nor has he come out saying he doesnt want to leave etc, which he could quite easily do... To be fair, we've not had a statement of denial from Michael Owen yet either.
St Marco Posted 16 January, 2012 Posted 16 January, 2012 With Lennon quoting 35 million valuation, could it be that Liverpool are aiming to push in and do a swop of Andy Carroll for Gary Hooper? To be fair you could probably buy Celtic for that kind of money these days!
saintwiz Posted 16 January, 2012 Posted 16 January, 2012 When up visiting family in Kilmarnock, you'll notice more people wearing Rangers or Celtic shirts in town than Kilmarnock ones. It's pretty similar all over the country though. I once met a chap before an Old Firm game who was a Rangers ST holder who used to travel down from Fort William (100miles away) for every home game. I'm a ST holder at Soton and I travel 96 miles to home games. What about London Man U fans and the like?
Colinjb Posted 16 January, 2012 Posted 16 January, 2012 I'm a ST holder at Soton and I travel 96 miles to home games. What about London Man U fans and the like? Same here, I travel a round trip of 240 miles to every home game. It's not unusual to have season ticket holders living a fair distance from the club.
miserableoldgit Posted 16 January, 2012 Posted 16 January, 2012 I believe that the woman that runs Chichester Folk Club is a Hull City ST Holder.
pap Posted 16 January, 2012 Posted 16 January, 2012 Well, according to some reports, Hooper apparently is going to hand in a transfer request today. Time to measure some of the potential bs against some of the reality!
dingbattigger Posted 16 January, 2012 Posted 16 January, 2012 Why do so many posters think Celtic have money problems?
pap Posted 16 January, 2012 Posted 16 January, 2012 Why do so many posters think Celtic have money problems? No idea. Seems to be widely refuted on the Celtic forum.
buctootim Posted 16 January, 2012 Posted 16 January, 2012 Why do so many posters think Celtic have money problems? Because Rangers do, and Celtic are their blood brothers. Or something.
Ashby Saint Posted 16 January, 2012 Posted 16 January, 2012 Well, according to some reports, Hooper apparently is going to hand in a transfer request today. Time to measure some of the potential bs against some of the reality! Reports from where? All the newspaper links I looked at referred only to Lennon's off-the-cuff evaluation as if it was true (which it clearly can't be).
hypochondriac Posted 16 January, 2012 Posted 16 January, 2012 Well, according to some reports, Hooper apparently is going to hand in a transfer request today. Time to measure some of the potential bs against some of the reality! Only one poster on here posted that and it clearly wasn't true.
pap Posted 16 January, 2012 Posted 16 January, 2012 Only one poster on here posted that and it clearly wasn't true. Like I said, guess we'll see today.
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