Mali group.....

[Tom]

Right. So the various others that have spoken to people at the club and have been told its on hold were making it up? I drove past last week and couldn't see any signs at all of construction set-up. Would happily be proved wrong, but it does look like they're waiting until the end of the season which is fair enough.

 

Not starting until around Easter time m'laddo.

[Sour Mash]

Not starting until around Easter time m'laddo.

Good to hear, I look forward to further updates!

[Legod Third Coming]

Right. So the various others that have spoken to people at the club and have been told its on hold were making it up? I drove past last week and couldn't see any signs at all of construction set-up. Would happily be proved wrong, but it does look like they're waiting until the end of the season which is fair enough.

 

Depends where they are in the process, they might be sat with architects in London for weeks on end trying to decide whether the windows should open out or in... Been there...

[Pugwash]

It makes sense to start the training ground scheme at Easter, so there's a minimum 'downtime' to the facilities. I'm guessing the bulk of the construction interruptions will then be out of the way by the start of training for next season.

 

Anyway, back to the thread - I'd be more concerned if NC was to take his eye off the ball at SFC. If he is getting more involved at Mali, will he delegate the running of the club to someone else?

[CHAPEL END CHARLIE]

 

Anyway, back to the thread - I'd be more concerned if NC was to take his eye off the ball at SFC. If he is getting more involved at Mali, will he delegate the running of the club to someone else?

 

It's not uncommon for a Chairman to maintain outside interests while still running a football club, indeed I've known some business's to actually run better when the boss is away. The interesting news that 'Don' Cortese is apparently so relied upon by the Liebherr family is potentially very good news for SFC.

 

I myself still think that SFC will be sold sometime in the not too distant future however.

[Dan]

Perhaps this is the real reason for the Training ground being on hold.

 

The training ground being on hold is because Cortese is looking for the best I mean cheapest contractor. I believe Leadbitter have one the contract though and work will start in the next few months. Just finalising all the paper work.

[Chez]

I myself still think that SFC will be sold sometime in the not too distant future however.

how do you think promotion effects the timing of any sale. Is promotion the prerequisite for any sale?

[Faz]

Just speculation, but it's not beyond the bounds of possiblity that ML appointed NC as an Executor, and he's on the Mali Board in that capacity. In these cicumastances, and given NC's previous statements, I only see it as positive.

 

But I am an eternal optimist.

[CHAPEL END CHARLIE]

how do you think promotion effects the timing of any sale. Is promotion the prerequisite for any sale?

 

I claim no inside knowledge but given the enormous ongoing costs of maintaining premiership status in the modern game, you'd think that the plan is/was to get us promoted and then within a year (or two) sell SFC to the highest bidder. That makes some kind of business sense I suppose.

 

In any case I just can't see ML's family having sufficiently deep pockets, or the will-power for that matter, to be plowing large sums of money into the club indefinitely given that the record of comparable clubs to SFC currently in the premier league shows most of them hemorrhaging substantial amounts of cash every year. As has been said many times before, football as a longterm business proposition makes little or no sense.

 

It's all very well having a grand hobby, and honoring your late fathers dream shows admirable ambition from his children, but there are limits surely ......

[sotonjoe]

We know that Liebherr's wish was to return the club to the Premiership as some sort of 'gift' to the city which he had had business dealings with in the past. That is how he put it to us in his early interviews just after the takeover. It is only Cortese who has spoken since Liebherr's death and started talking about a plan which goes beyond Saints' return to the Premiership, and it is him who has started talking about targets of reaching the Champions League.

 

It is my personal opinion that, with Liebherr's original ambition seemingly what I described above and his untimely death moving the club ownership on to his nearest and dearest, selling Saints once they are a Premiership side is very likely. Whether it would make more sense to do this immediately upon promotion or to wait a year in order to make the club look like more of a stable Premiership team remains to be seen. The crux of the matter is that I can't see why the Liebherr estate would have any interest in holding on to Saints once Liebherr's original wishes had been achieved.

 

If Cortese has got the bug then I don't see why he couldn't continue to play a role in running the club, provided the new owners want this. Indeed he has suggested in interviews that he has contact with parties who are willing to invest in the club should the Liebherrs wish to sell in the near future. It's perfectly feasible that we continue our Cortese relationship for a longer period than our Liebherr one.

[Dalek2003]

I claim no inside knowledge but given the enormous ongoing costs of maintaining premiership status in the modern game, you'd think that the plan is/was to get us promoted and then within a year (or two) sell SFC to the highest bidder. That makes some kind of business sense I suppose.

 

In any case I just can't see ML's family having sufficiently deep pockets, or the will-power for that matter, to be plowing large sums of money into the club indefinitely given that the record of comparable clubs to SFC currently in the premier league shows most of them hemorrhaging substantial amounts of cash every year. As has been said many times before, football as a longterm business proposition makes little or no sense.

 

It's all very well having a grand hobby, and honoring your late fathers dream shows admirable ambition from his children, but there are limits surely ......

 

I'm afraid that is how I see it. Always happens. Grandfather has a hobby, like a yacht, children not interested, sale takes place. I agree with your sentiments exactly. Possibly the Liebherr's are waiting to see the outcome of the season. If we get promoted they could even get some of their money back even if we stay up for one season.

[Dalek2003]

We know that Liebherr's wish was to return the club to the Premiership as some sort of 'gift' to the city which he had had business dealings with in the past. That is how he put it to us in his early interviews just after the takeover. It is only Cortese who has spoken since Liebherr's death and started talking about a plan which goes beyond Saints' return to the Premiership, and it is him who has started talking about targets of reaching the Champions League.

 

It is my personal opinion that, with Liebherr's original ambition seemingly what I described above and his untimely death moving the club ownership on to his nearest and dearest, selling Saints once they are a Premiership side is very likely. Whether it would make more sense to do this immediately upon promotion or to wait a year in order to make the club look like more of a stable Premiership team remains to be seen. The crux of the matter is that I can't see why the Liebherr estate would have any interest in holding on to Saints once Liebherr's original wishes had been achieved.

 

If Cortese has got the bug then I don't see why he couldn't continue to play a role in running the club, provided the new owners want this. Indeed he has suggested in interviews that he has contact with parties who are willing to invest in the club should the Liebherrs wish to sell in the near future. It's perfectly feasible that we continue our Cortese relationship for a longer period than our Liebherr one.

 

Cortese may have another wealthy individual in mind...hope and dream.

[up and away]

It's not uncommon for a Chairman to maintain outside interests while still running a football club, indeed I've known some business's to actually run better when the boss is away. The interesting news that 'Don' Cortese is apparently so relied upon by the Liebherr family is potentially very good news for SFC.

 

I myself still think that SFC will be sold sometime in the not too distant future however.

 

The closure of Mali underlines our position. A project initiated by Markus Leibherr more from interest than generation of wealth, but with his expertise both points could be satisfied. It appears the Mali group can no longer function without it's wealthy entrepreneurial late leader. With no one of sufficient understanding of the technical aspects to say invest 10's 100's £M's in a particular project. Unless those now in control of the purse strings are confident of any decisions, it comes as no surprise for it to be shut down.

 

When you look at Saints with the same objective eye, Cortese is the only peice that keeps us in place. If the Leibherr family cannot get to grips with Mali, just imagine the concept of a wealthy, Swiss / German family headed by a middle aged woman continuing to run a Championship club? It is my firm belief that if Cortese no longer wanted to be associated with Saints, we would be sold.

 

So why is Cortese still here and what are his intentions? I don't believe it's an over riding financial issue, because I expect Liebherr left Cortese independently wealthy from his will. Both Cortese and Liebherr had a passion for Saints which gripped both of them firmly, such Markus made elaborate plans for the project to continue long after his death. So how much longer can we expect Cortese to be around? All the long term investment in the infrastructure gives the feel of a further 5-10 years, because most will only add a fraction of what's spent to any purchase price, worse in this market. The extension to the Academy being a good example. Nothing to be concerned about at present but would start getting worried if nothing started by spring and the writing would be on the wall if nothing was done by the summer. Cortese continues to live in Southampton with his family so that is very reassuring.

 

I still believe Cortese is in it for the long term, more from love than money. Things may change if we are cut of funds but Cortese is the glue that keeps everything in place. Unless one of the Liebherr family is an avid player of FM, Cortese is the only reason I believe we still have the Liebherrs with us. We should see all the clues if Cortese were to decide to call it a day, but as yet I cannot see anything to worry ourselves.

[sotonjoe]

Cortese may have another wealthy individual in mind...hope and dream.

 

Well that's exactly what he has claimed but we've no way of knowing whether it's true or not.

[spyinthesky]

The closure of Mali underlines our position. A project initiated by Markus Leibherr more from interest than generation of wealth, but with his expertise both points could be satisfied. It appears the Mali group can no longer function without it's wealthy entrepreneurial late leader. With no one of sufficient understanding of the technical aspects to say invest 10's 100's £M's in a particular project. Unless those now in control of the purse strings are confident of any decisions, it comes as no surprise for it to be shut down.

 

When you look at Saints with the same objective eye, Cortese is the only peice that keeps us in place. If the Leibherr family cannot get to grips with Mali, just imagine the concept of a wealthy, Swiss / German family headed by a middle aged woman continuing to run a Championship club? It is my firm belief that if Cortese no longer wanted to be associated with Saints, we would be sold.

 

So why is Cortese still here and what are his intentions? I don't believe it's an over riding financial issue, because I expect Liebherr left Cortese independently wealthy from his will. Both Cortese and Liebherr had a passion for Saints which gripped both of them firmly, such Markus made elaborate plans for the project to continue long after his death. So how much longer can we expect Cortese to be around? All the long term investment in the infrastructure gives the feel of a further 5-10 years, because most will only add a fraction of what's spent to any purchase price, worse in this market. The extension to the Academy being a good example. Nothing to be concerned about at present but would start getting worried if nothing started by spring and the writing would be on the wall if nothing was done by the summer. Cortese continues to live in Southampton with his family so that is very reassuring.

 

I still believe Cortese is in it for the long term, more from love than money. Things may change if we are cut of funds but Cortese is the glue that keeps everything in place. Unless one of the Liebherr family is an avid player of FM, Cortese is the only reason I believe we still have the Liebherrs with us. We should see all the clues if Cortese were to decide to call it a day, but as yet I cannot see anything to worry ourselves.

 

Up and Away

 

I admire your positive view.

However, whilst I am sure that both Markus Liebherr and Cortese may have warmed towards the club all the feedback I have received, from various sources, that this was initially a purely financial investment where there was a chance of a return at the end.

This is no different than the position almost all football clubs find themselves in so this is nothing to be unduly worried about specifically.

Markus's death has raised some questions going forward but whatever happens I am sure Southampton Football Club is a more saleable proposition than many in Europe

[tttdcs]

I claim no inside knowledge but given the enormous ongoing costs of maintaining premiership status in the modern game, you'd think that the plan is/was to get us promoted and then within a year (or two) sell SFC to the highest bidder. That makes some kind of business sense I suppose.

 

In any case I just can't see ML's family having sufficiently deep pockets, or the will-power for that matter, to be plowing large sums of money into the club indefinitely given that the record of comparable clubs to SFC currently in the premier league shows most of them hemorrhaging substantial amounts of cash every year. As has been said many times before, football as a longterm business proposition makes little or no sense.

 

It's all very well having a grand hobby, and honoring your late fathers dream shows admirable ambition from his children, but there are limits surely ......

 

If I was putting money on the various suggestions, this is where my bet would go.

[up and away]

Up and Away

 

I admire your positive view.

However, whilst I am sure that both Markus Liebherr and Cortese may have warmed towards the club all the feedback I have received, from various sources, that this was initially a purely financial investment where there was a chance of a return at the end.

This is no different than the position almost all football clubs find themselves in so this is nothing to be unduly worried about specifically.

Markus's death has raised some questions going forward but whatever happens I am sure Southampton Football Club is a more saleable proposition than many in Europe

 

More than possible this view is optimistic, but until I start to see the tell tell signs that things are not all right, no reason why not to. I fully understand the possibility that things can change very quickly, but until I see some evidence of this will continue with the half full routine.

 

This was never a purely financial investment, they just do not exist for the likes of sides such as Saints. If they were you would be able to point me towards all those people making vast amounts by selling clubs on. Football clubs are like large yachts, very expensive, both to run and buy and the only reason they are attractive is the pleasure obtained whilst haemorrhaging cash. If Leibherr wanted to make money, he had far better opportunities than Saints, including just let it sit in the bank. It only starts to make sense when you look at the non financial rewards football can deliver. Liebherr bought Saints under fire sale conditions, which based upon all the interest we had and offers, that was about the going market value.

 

For anything to be a financial investment, you have to have a financial out, that means someone to buy it. Looking back at how long Saints and similar clubs have looked for buyers, it's pretty obvious we are edging towards hens teeth. There is no mystical pot of gold here with everyone queuing up to buy into. It's a financial black hole that only emotions attract you towards. It only really makes sense then to billionaire, because if you borrow the money, the loan repayments severely restrict your ability to compete.

[aintforever]

I think they wont flog us until we are in the Prem and I wont care by then anyway.

[Window Cleaner]

I think they wont flog us until we are in the Prem and I wont care by then anyway.

 

NC will still be here though, think he's hooked.Might even find the money to buy the club outright himself...if he doesn't already own a fair old share of it.

[CHAPEL END CHARLIE]

Some really insightful contributions on here today that make my poor efforts seem very inadequate. This forum at its best perhaps.

 

If you're reading this Duncan I'm sure your take on the ownership question would be much appreciated.

[Gemmel]

Some really insightful contributions on here today that make my poor efforts seem very inadequate. This forum at its best perhaps.

 

If you're reading this Duncan I'm sure your take on the ownership question would be much appreciated.

 

Some insightful contributions?

 

Amoungst posters who are discussing what it means about Mali closing down......when in fact it is trading as normal and one of the group companies have made some redundancies.

 

Insightful, is not the word I would have used.

[manji]

Some insightful contributions?

 

Amoungst posters who are discussing what it means about Mali closing down......when in fact it is trading as normal and one of the group companies have made some redundancies.

 

Insightful, is not the word I would have used.

The phrase I would use is ill-informed speculation by a bunch of bed-wetters. As for asking "Duncan" for his opinion Lol ! He has no more idea than anyone else but if he does comment it will be agenda driven.

[CHAPEL END CHARLIE]

The phrase I would use is ill-informed speculation by a bunch of bed-wetters. As for asking "Duncan" for his opinion Lol ! He has no more idea than anyone else but if he does comment it will be agenda driven.

 

Wrong side of the bed dearie ?

[Gingeletiss]

It appears, that as a fanbase, we have more than our fair share of 'glass half empty' types, all I say, is be patient, there is a plan, and is has financial backing.