Are we better off than when Crouch was here?

[NickG]

We've been down this road before, Snowballs. You had faith in tommac. I didn't. So I think it's best to be safe and base our trust on results - even with the small details, such as: was Salz really at the game?

 

still can't believe that people kept hanging onto his words! I had pm from a mod saying he was the real deal and give him some slack!

[Roman]

still can't believe that people kept hanging onto his words! I had pm from a mod saying he was the real deal and give him some slack!

 

Morph's promise that Salz would be Crouch's guest in the corporate boxes is an exact mirror of the claims tommac used to make. I have enough sense to know that Morph and LS are not in the same utterly brain-deficient, angry-dervish, weirded-out league as tommac...

 

...but it would be nice if they were right for a change.

[Delmary]

Long Shot,

 

Thank Goodness for your input in these trying times.

 

Unfortunately there are a few on this board who cannot see the wood for the trees.

 

Who knows, we may surprise them !!

 

Er, may I say we will definately surprise them, and sooner rather than later.

 

Keep the faith Long Shot

 

Kindest Regards

 

Morph

Did Salz bump into Lowe tonight?

[Snowballs2]

still can't believe that people kept hanging onto his words! I had pm from a mod saying he was the real deal and give him some slack!

 

 

Tell me...what is it like to be sooo perfect?. You must be exceedingly boring

[NickG]

Tell me...what is it like to be sooo perfect?. You must be exceedingly boring

 

if I was perfect I wouldn't be supporting saints!

 

just cos not fooled by childish bragging fanticists doesn't make me perfect, just annoys me when they play on all of our desperation to have a more positive future.

 

No need to get catty!

[Tamesaint]

If you read the article above you can see how Salz was head hunted by the largest players in the global economy. This man must be special!

 

Lowe is a non entity compared to Anthony Salz.

 

 

Hiw can you say that???? Rupes was head hunted by that world renowned firm WH Ireland. Scooby and Sundance (god rest their souls) told us on many occasions that they were a major financial institution.

:-) :-)

[alehouseboys]

"many" - yes.

"always" - no.

 

There were about 2500 tickets that were available for each home game after STs and away allocation was deducted. I got tickets to all the games I wanted to before becoming a ST holder.

 

Not once did I not get a ticket because it was a sell out

 

Once the Dell went 15,000-ish-all-seater most games were a sell-out for 'home fans', empty seats were usually to be found in the away section that couldn't be sold on to home supporters (like at other grounds nearby) due to segregation and access. I remember only once did they ever release the entire lower tier to Saints fans and that was for a game against Wimbledon as they had barely 100 or so in the top tier and they never had hoolies.

 

It was then that they restricted season ticket sales and also memberships to a total of something like 26,000, I believe it was estimated that there was a 5 year waiting list for STs. And as you say they they left x-amount of seats available for those without STs so they all at least had a chance of going to a game.

 

You may have always been able to get a ticket as I bet you got yours earlier in the week, many of our lot have always been notorious for leaving it to the last minute and they regular turned people away from the ticket office on matchdays.

 

And we may now have a 'hardcore' of 14,000-odd that are turning up inspite of everything but I now plenty that have been 'hardcore' for 40-odd years but are presently staying away.

[Snowballs2]

if I was perfect I wouldn't be supporting saints!

 

just cos not fooled by childish bragging fanticists doesn't make me perfect, just annoys me when they play on all of our desperation to have a more positive future.

 

No need to get catty!

 

 

Miaow !

[up and away]

There are many ITK people posting on this forum but for the most part they only know one side.

 

It can have its pitfalls and many have fallen in. Some have managed to climb back out but many have disappeared from this forum.

 

A good ITK is now someone who has an ear of both sides (or 3 if you include the potential of Fulthorpe) and realises that there is no point posting information any more as matters can change so swiftly as to make that poster look a fool and open to ridicule.

 

There have been and will be many more twists and turns in this long suffering saga but Lowe/Wilde hold the baton at present. That may or may not change in the near future. No one can predict or if they do, be certain of their prediction.

 

That said, at least the ITK's make this forum interesting and worth revisiting on a regular basis

 

You only have to look back on past events and you can point to several ITK. The small fact they charged off in the other direction with this knowledge, or could not separate the spin from the truth is another matter.

[OldNick]

Morph hasnt posted to tell us about Salz with LC. Did anyone see them there yesterday?

It is frustrating people coming on and telling us we are nearing the pit of hell but there is a saviour but then nothing happening

[um pahars]

Which, when they were locked into a room by the much maligned LLS & others they actually came close to being able to do. (As we saw from the Runnymede minutes)

 

Again, right now the need for UNITY is probably as critical as anything else, unified fanbase with all sides pulling together will help attendances.

 

All that is actually needed is a large dose of humble pie all round, pragmatism, realism, some PROPER straight talking about the future and 3,000 extra people through the gate.

 

THEN we can survive long enough for the "many alleged" wealthy people out there to get their money moving around again.

 

We need a white knight - rarer than two consecutive good performances from DMG at the moment - so we need to SURVIVE until we can find one.

 

You need to read through those minutes again Phil, as they (and that's all three of the major shareholders) never once showed any inclination to look outside the three major shareholding groups.

 

Each of the proposals/combinations that were put forward always included a substanital make up pf the status quo. There was never any mention of an outsider, an independent etc etc etc.

 

The only person who I am aware looked outside the interested parties was Crouch when he attempted to get Salz and others involved. You need to ask why that idea never came to fruition.

[NickG]

have we decided on an answer to OP yet?:confused:

[Long Shot]

Morph hasnt posted to tell us about Salz with LC. Did anyone see them there yesterday?

It is frustrating people coming on and telling us we are nearing the pit of hell but there is a saviour but then nothing happening

 

Pretty sure LC was not in his box yesterday, I think there was a late change of plan.

Edited 9 November, 2008 by Long Shot

[NickG]

why are we not shocked!

[Roman]

Pretty sure LC was not in his box yesterday, I think there was a late change of plan.

 

Although in the larger scheme of things, it doesn't make much of a difference, Morph did say three times over the last few days that Salz would be there as Crouch's guest.

 

I do wonder...

 

I notice that one of Morph's other recent bombshells was to confirm that Sundance was Lord Marland. Now if that were actually true, I'd be sorely tempted to direct the gossips in Fleet Street to a member of the House of Lords cavorting with the delightfully Pickwickian characters on b-anter.

[Long Shot]

Although in the larger scheme of things, it doesn't make much of a difference, Morph did say three times over the last few days that Salz would be there as Crouch's guest.

 

I do wonder...

 

I notice that one of Morph's other recent bombshells was to confirm that Sundance was Lord Marland. Now if that were actually true, I'd be sorely tempted to direct the gossips in Fleet Street to a member of the House of Lords cavorting with the delightfully Pickwickian characters on b-anter.

 

I am sure Morph can answer this for himself, Roman but in the meantime I do gather LC's plans did unavoidably change at a late stage.

 

Did not see the Lord Marland bit, must check Morph's sources on that one.

[Mole]

Once the Dell went 15,000-ish-all-seater most games were a sell-out for 'home fans', empty seats were usually to be found in the away section that couldn't be sold on to home supporters (like at other grounds nearby) due to segregation and access. I remember only once did they ever release the entire lower tier to Saints fans and that was for a game against Wimbledon as they had barely 100 or so in the top tier and they never had hoolies.

 

It was then that they restricted season ticket sales and also memberships to a total of something like 26,000, I believe it was estimated that there was a 5 year waiting list for STs. And as you say they they left x-amount of seats available for those without STs so they all at least had a chance of going to a game.

 

You may have always been able to get a ticket as I bet you got yours earlier in the week, many of our lot have always been notorious for leaving it to the last minute and they regular turned people away from the ticket office on matchdays.

 

And we may now have a 'hardcore' of 14,000-odd that are turning up inspite of everything but I now plenty that have been 'hardcore' for 40-odd years but are presently staying away.

 

Anyone remember us playing Crewe in the league cup. The club sold tickets at the turnstile and there must have been over 17,000 in the 15,252 capacity Dell. People were having to stand three abreast in the gangways!

[um pahars]

Did not see the Lord Marland bit, must check Morph's sources on that one.

 

He's not Lord Marland, no way in the world!!!!!!

 

And as an aside I'm not sure what Marland's Sport Nexus Lobby Group would make of the current shennanigans at St Mary's when you consider this is a part of their aims:

 

We believe that poor quality of leadership and misguided strategy has too often failed British sport at all levels.

Constantly scrutinise the issues in sport to highlight areas where poor management is acting against the public interest.

 

To be the independent voice which challenges the structures, practices and accountability of British sporting institutions.

Maybe Marland should be looking closer to home and having a word in lowe's ear. LOL.

[Amesbury Saint]

I am sure Morph can answer this for himself, Roman but in the meantime I do gather LC's plans did unavoidably change at a late stage.

 

.

 

 

well he saved himself £24 and seeing another defeat

 

Seriously - can anyone point to any fact that says we will have a change in ownership / boardroom soon.

 

Whilst I enjoy reading LS and Morphs comments, I see little has changed over the last 6 months except we are further in the brown stuff.

[NickG]

well he saved himself £24 and seeing another defeat

 

Seriously - can anyone point to any fact that says we will have a change in ownership / boardroom soon.

 

Whilst I enjoy reading LS and Morphs comments, I see little has changed over the last 6 months except we are further in the brown stuff.

 

the only change is the prediction goes back!

[Morph]

well he saved himself £24 and seeing another defeat

 

Seriously - can anyone point to any fact that says we will have a change in ownership / boardroom soon.

 

Whilst I enjoy reading LS and Morphs comments, I see little has changed over the last 6 months except we are further in the brown stuff.

 

Er,

 

I think we will have a change in boardroom, but a far as I know their is no white knight out there wanting to take us over.

 

And before you ask, neither Salz or Leon were there yesterday. I put it down to the rain.

 

Kind Regards

 

 

Morph

[NickG]

I am sure there will. One day.

Going to predict when?

[NickG]

Er,

 

I think we will have a change in boardroom, but a far as I know their is no white knight out there wanting to take us over.

 

And before you ask, neither Salz or Leon were there yesterday. I put it down to the rain.

 

Kind Regards

 

 

Morph

 

the true saint for the board doesn't go when it rains?

 

only teasing know he is a long standing fan -but strange post!:confused:

Edited 9 November, 2008 by NickG

[Mole]

And before you ask, neither Salz or Leon were there yesterday. I put it down to the rain.

 

Tommac always used to like getting digs in at Salz...

[NickG]

Er,

 

I think we will have a change in boardroom, but a far as I know their is no white knight out there wanting to take us over.

 

And before you ask, neither Salz or Leon were there yesterday. I put it down to the rain.

 

Kind Regards

 

 

Morph

 

I hope we are going to have a positive change -I first came to these forums not to read the Allen and Wilde stuff -each time hoping for a brighter future.

Unfortunately we read, in hope, posts from anyone purporting to be ITK. Hoping this to be the one.

From Leesaint, LLS, Rhonda, Tommac and Morph we have been promised change and news. None of it has come through.

I hope they are posting in good faith, and are putting 2&2 together due to not really being that close -rather than deliberately taking the p1ss out of us.

 

Morph - if it is in good faith but with your quirky style then of course keep us updated on what you hear. There is no need to big it up. Why play games rather than answer questions - don't mean say who you are etc but you could say why you were so wrong last time and what has changed.

[dubai_phil]

You need to read through those minutes again Phil, as they (and that's all three of the major shareholders) never once showed any inclination to look outside the three major shareholding groups.

 

Each of the proposals/combinations that were put forward always included a substanital make up pf the status quo. There was never any mention of an outsider, an independent etc etc etc.

 

The only person who I am aware looked outside the interested parties was Crouch when he attempted to get Salz and others involved. You need to ask why that idea never came to fruition.

 

Can't be arsed to read all the way back through the threads, but I was sure I saw Mike Richards proposed.

Look, we all know there isn't a really a snowballs chance in hell of any of the 3 working together voluntarily, but at the MOMENT, Saints need MONEY to be able to change any of the mess we are now in, and the only player around at the moment who MAY have some seems to be Crouch. I just do not see ANY point in him blowing that cash simply to get rid of the incumbents (again) when a compromise THAT THE CLUB NEEDS could ring-fence a preferential loan from Leon to keep us afloat and get us through the worst of thre recession until investors start to have loose cash around OR can sell existing assets to buy new ones.

Sure they had positions, but the meeting never quite found the RIGHT compromise candidate that took ALL their interests into account - ie a TRUE independent.

Whether Salz is now seen as being in the Crouch camp or could be that man we just don't know.

Wishful thinking on this is probably less depressing on wishful thinking of our formation and tactics at home.....

[um pahars]

Can't be arsed to read all the way back through the threads, but I was sure I saw Mike Richards proposed.

 

Richards is firmly a part of the Lowe cabal. Always has been.

 

Quite simply, there was never any attempt at that Runnymede meeting (or at any point up until Crouch sounded out Salz) of them looking outside their own circle.

 

Look, we all know there isn't a really a snowballs chance in hell of any of the 3 working together voluntarily, but at the MOMENT, Saints need MONEY to be able to change any of the mess we are now in, and the only player around at the moment who MAY have some seems to be Crouch. I just do not see ANY point in him blowing that cash simply to get rid of the incumbents (again) when a compromise THAT THE CLUB NEEDS could ring-fence a preferential loan from Leon to keep us afloat and get us through the worst of thre recession until investors start to have loose cash around OR can sell existing assets to buy new ones.

 

I reckon Crouch could, and probably would, put some money in even if it meant just buying us some time.

 

However, there is no way he should be expected to that without some movement from others. Now that could mean asking others to contribute as well, or it could be them forfeiting their shares.

 

As long as we're a commercial PLC then I fail to see how Crouch can put his money in. Of course it might buy the Club some time, but this isn't a charity and it would be particularly galling for him to pump money in knowing that if it comes off, then one of the biggest smiles will be on Lowe's face.

 

Sure they had positions, but the meeting never quite found the RIGHT compromise candidate that took ALL their interests into account - ie a TRUE independent.

Whether Salz is now seen as being in the Crouch camp or could be that man we just don't know.

Wishful thinking on this is probably less depressing on wishful thinking of our formation and tactics at home.....

 

Rewind back a few months and Lowe and Wilde's attacks in the press as we were fighting a relegation battle was nothing about a compromise.

 

As it stands at the moment, I fail to see what Lowe (& Wilde) brings to the party at the moment apart from division, rancour and failure.

 

And if their presence is stopping an SOS from Crouch, then their position becomes close to being untenable.

 

I'm not sure of exactly how it would/could work, but if there is a chance to buy some time with a Crouch bail out, then it has to be seriously examined. If it means some have to dip out and forfeit their shares then maybe so be it.

 

It might not be ideal, it might not be a long term solution, but if the alternative is going under then it might be all we have.

[dubai_phil]

Richards is firmly a part of the Lowe cabal. Always has been.

 

Quite simply, there was never any attempt at that Runnymede meeting (or at any point up until Crouch sounded out Salz) of them looking outside their own circle.

 

Oh and it went without saying that I would expect a price to be extracted. The CLEVER thing is making that acceptable, and there is no way Leon would get the train set back "as a victor" which is what all the egos would see, so it needs that acceptable compromise candidate.

 

I reckon Crouch could, and probably would, put some money in even if it meant just buying us some time.

 

However, there is no way he should be expected to that without some movement from others. Now that could mean asking others to contribute as well, or it could be them forfeiting their shares.

 

As long as we're a commercial PLC then I fail to see how Crouch can put his money in. Of course it might buy the Club some time, but this isn't a charity and it would be particularly galling for him to pump money in knowing that if it comes off, then one of the biggest smiles will be on Lowe's face.

 

 

 

Rewind back a few months and Lowe and Wilde's attacks in the press as we were fighting a relegation battle was nothing about a compromise.

 

As it stands at the moment, I fail to see what Lowe (& Wilde) brings to the party at the moment apart from division, rancour and failure.

 

And if their presence is stopping an SOS from Crouch, then their position becomes close to being untenable.

 

I'm not sure of exactly how it would/could work, but if there is a chance to buy some time with a Crouch bail out, then it has to be seriously examined. If it means some have to dip out and forfeit their shares then maybe so be it.

 

It might not be ideal, it might not be a long term solution, but if the alternative is going under then it might be all we have.

 

 

Others were canvassed about the independent role, they did try but with their blinkers on unfortunately...

 

Rewind back a few months and Lowe and Wilde's attacks in the press as we were fighting a relegation battle was nothing about a compromise.

 

That is because the decision had already been made by then, Leon's FAILING at the time was not to take it seriously and mount an EFFECTIVE defence, he continued to play the "white knight will come" card up until the last day (remember how shocked Morph was? Others weren't it had been obvious for a long while)

 

Taking it a mini step further.

 

Barclays raised capital without touching the shareholders. (As did HMG) Buying existing shares does the club no good whatsoever.

 

A rights issue is a possibility but the cost, length of time and take up is difficult, it would need some kind of underwriting deal and I am no expert on that stuff.

 

It's about the approach, the club is almost on it's knees, so will be the local Barclays account manager. Use that strength but throw away the ego

[um pahars]

That is because the decision had already been made by then, Leon's FAILING at the time was not to take it seriously and mount an EFFECTIVE defence, he continued to play the "white knight will come" card up until the last day (remember how shocked Morph was? Others weren't it had been obvious for a long while)

 

The minute Wilde and Lowe teamed up it was over all bar the shouting for Crouch. Of course there was hope that it wouldn't go through and we wouldn't be facing the disaster we now have.

 

It was their decision to upset the apple cart. We had a manager who had managed to deliver a semblence of pride and unity. We had the support of the bank (within the obvious constraints).

 

They were the ones who decided to undo all that, and now a few months down the line they're going around with the begging bowl with the ar55se hanging out of the team on the pitch.

 

Taking it a mini step further.

 

Barclays raised capital without touching the shareholders. (As did HMG) Buying existing shares does the club no good whatsoever.

 

A rights issue is a possibility but the cost, length of time and take up is difficult, it would need some kind of underwriting deal and I am no expert on that stuff.

 

It's about the approach, the club is almost on it's knees, so will be the local Barclays account manager. Use that strength but throw away the ego

 

It may not have touched the existing shareholders (because arguably like ours they don't have the readies to contribute), but it certainly affected the existing shareholders.

 

There's no way the Club should be asking for a "loan" of any type from Crouch, it has to be in exchange for something. This is a commercial PLC.

 

It appears Lowe wants to have his cake and eat it on this one.

 

Surely if the only way of saving the Club in the short term is to step aside (and maybe even forfiet shares or something similar), then Lowe and Wilde should be prepared to do that, particularly if the alternative is admin and meltdown.

 

What is Lowe currently bringing to the party????

[teamsaint]

anyone how far we are from being at the full extent of our overdraft?

[teamsaint]

anyone know how far we are from being at the full extent of our overdraft?

 

 

Sorry, missed a word out!!

[Roman]

anyone how far we are from being at the full extent of our overdraft?

 

No, but we must be some way into it to have extended it from £6m to £8m.

 

However much it is, it's a problem, because as someone once said: 'Once you get into debt, the bank manager comes into the club to run the team.'

 

Now who could that have been?

[Wade Garrett]

Er,

 

I think we will have a change in boardroom, but a far as I know their is no white knight out there wanting to take us over.

 

And before you ask, neither Salz or Leon were there yesterday. I put it down to the rain.

 

Kind Regards

 

 

Morph

 

Morph, you are just one in a long line of forum bullsh*tters who try to give the impression you know what's going on behind the scenes.

 

Kind Regards

 

Wade (IMHO of course)

[dubai_phil]

The minute Wilde and Lowe teamed up it was over all bar the shouting for Crouch. Of course there was hope that it wouldn't go through and we wouldn't be facing the disaster we now have.

 

It was their decision to upset the apple cart. We had a manager who had managed to deliver a semblence of pride and unity. We had the support of the bank (within the obvious constraints).

 

They were the ones who decided to undo all that, and now a few months down the line they're going around with the begging bowl with the ar55se hanging out of the team on the pitch.

 

 

 

It may not have touched the existing shareholders (because arguably like ours they don't have the readies to contribute), but it certainly affected the existing shareholders.

 

There's no way the Club should be asking for a "loan" of any type from Crouch, it has to be in exchange for something. This is a commercial PLC.

 

It appears Lowe wants to have his cake and eat it on this one.

 

Surely if the only way of saving the Club in the short term is to step aside (and maybe even forfiet shares or something similar), then Lowe and Wilde should be prepared to do that, particularly if the alternative is admin and meltdown.

 

What is Lowe currently bringing to the party????

 

That is sort of what I said - use his money for the club, not the shareholders and of course have strings attached.

Trouble is with the overdraft now so big, even simply reducing it will notallow the surgery we need, but a forced strategy change to a BALANCED side would be the first on the list - ie stop loaning kids and get some old pros in.

 

As for what Lowe currently is bringing - no idea - but what he DID bring at the start of the season was to bet the "farm" on Black. The predecessors bet it on Red. All of them lost

[um pahars]

That is sort of what I said - use his money for the club, not the shareholders and of course have strings attached.

Trouble is with the overdraft now so big, even simply reducing it will notallow the surgery we need, but a forced strategy change to a BALANCED side would be the first on the list - ie stop loaning kids and get some old pros in.

 

It would not solve our long term issues, but there is a possibility it could buy us some time in the short term.

 

If the choice is Administration or Crouch pumping a few million in, then i would bite his hand off.

 

The problem is whether the current regime would accept it, how it would be lent, what strings comed with it etc etc etc. (it would be pretty difficult for Crouch to accept being the only one pumping in money if those who took us down this final track to oblivion are to benefit from it).

 

Some would argue Crouch should accept others from benefitting from it, if it means the Club benefits, but personally as it would be him doing all the fundng, it should be the others who make concessions. If there not prepared to put any money in then maybe they have to step aside.

 

As for what Lowe currently is bringing - no idea - but what he DID bring at the start of the season was to bet the "farm" on Black. The predecessors bet it on Red. All of them lost

 

Hone and co put it all on Red last summer that's for sure, and at that point Crouch was out of the loop. He never got a chance to really do anything during his tenure and it wasn't long after the got his chance to play that the two amigos were launching their 9 point crusade in the local press (it would be interesting to measure them by the same yardstick).

 

And this summer has been nothing more than another gamble, but this time the stakes really were the future of the Club.

 

Even if a cash injection only buys us some time, I would still take it. The problem is can those currently in control find a way of facilitating this???

[dubai_phil]

It would not solve our long term issues, but there is a possibility it could buy us some time in the short term.

 

If the choice is Administration or Crouch pumping a few million in, then i would bite his hand off.

 

The problem is whether the current regime would accept it, how it would be lent, what strings comed with it etc etc etc. (it would be pretty difficult for Crouch to accept being the only one pumping in money if those who took us down this final track to oblivion are to benefit from it).

 

Some would argue Crouch should accept others from benefitting from it, if it means the Club benefits, but personally as it would be him doing all the fundng, it should be the others who make concessions. If there not prepared to put any money in then maybe they have to step aside.

 

 

Even if a cash injection only buys us some time, I would still take it. The problem is can those currently in control find a way of facilitating this???

 

SURVIVAL SURVIVAL SURVIVAL....

 

Keeping the "stratgegy" part out of the loop at the moment, I am convinced that Football in the UK hit a peak with the Abu Dhabi purchase of Man City. Then with the global crash, people started to become much more realistic about the present and "probably" the future.

 

Football will change, not dramatically but running up billions of dirhams or dollars in debt won't be quite as easy for a few years yet.

 

I know from speaking to many businessmen & women here that they are all worried about the turmoil and despite the "rescue packages" there still is a fear that another round of "asset deflation" could happen. These people have all adopted a wait and see strategy. They have ideas, plans and projects that are ALL being cancelled or simply put on hold (oh and are all laughing at the Man City deal - they lost 15% on exchange rates alone already!).

 

This means that for any business, the market (be it fans through the gate, clients for their IT systems or motor cars or property) is also at a virtual standstill. For those people it is at the moment simply a case of cutting back, working extra hard and simply doing whatever is needed to survive. Business activity and confidence WILL return, but will it be one month or one year?

 

I hate to say it but it COULD be argued that hanging on and hoping that 3 of your competitors go bust first is actually a sound strategy in any business and especially ours at the moment!

 

So simply at this time the mess on the pitch needs investment, the bank needs the OD reducing and fans aren't coming, that will take MILLIONS to resolve the way many on here want (so it AIN'T going to happen this month!).

 

So we HAVE to survive. That means looking at EVERY possible angle.

 

And, at the end of the day, I come back to my first point. Leon and the others NEED to have a proposal. At this point, all I am seeing is ITK style point scoring.

Management training course day one tells you to ask the critical question - "What do you propse?". It is damned hard to say yes or no to a moan and so far as I can see there isn't anything sensible being put even close to a table.

 

Simply phoning up Lowe and saying "you fooked it up again, get out & I'll put some money in" just won't hack it. It will need a PROFESIONAL approach and a "Compelling reason to Act" as we used to say in MNC land

 

(ie stop speculating on the internet and start THINKING and TALKING)

 

And before we get the string of "Lowe won't listen because..." replies, there are plenty of middle ground routes to do this, not least the Bank and the fact that they AREN'T being used is why I still think all the Morph/LS style stuff is deckchair moving cr*p and about undermining this month's regime. (And how many times has THAT worked in the last 3 years??)

 

Who was it who said "Once you have eliminated all possibilities, only the impossible is left"? I know it was not in this context but I think people need to examine EVERY single option to get out of this. Working together may be impossible, but if it keeps us alive through the crash, then it has to be done.

 

Otherwise we're left with LLS & Father Christmas as our only hopes............:rolleyes::rolleyes: as you would say!

[miserableoldgit]

SURVIVAL SURVIVAL SURVIVAL....

 

Keeping the "stratgegy" part out of the loop at the moment, I am convinced that Football in the UK hit a peak with the Abu Dhabi purchase of Man City. Then with the global crash, people started to become much more realistic about the present and "probably" the future.

 

Football will change, not dramatically but running up billions of dirhams or dollars in debt won't be quite as easy for a few years yet.

 

I know from speaking to many businessmen & women here that they are all worried about the turmoil and despite the "rescue packages" there still is a fear that another round of "asset deflation" could happen. These people have all adopted a wait and see strategy. They have ideas, plans and projects that are ALL being cancelled or simply put on hold (oh and are all laughing at the Man City deal - they lost 15% on exchange rates alone already!).

 

This means that for any business, the market (be it fans through the gate, clients for their IT systems or motor cars or property) is also at a virtual standstill. For those people it is at the moment simply a case of cutting back, working extra hard and simply doing whatever is needed to survive. Business activity and confidence WILL return, but will it be one month or one year?

 

I hate to say it but it COULD be argued that hanging on and hoping that 3 of your competitors go bust first is actually a sound strategy in any business and especially ours at the moment!

 

So simply at this time the mess on the pitch needs investment, the bank needs the OD reducing and fans aren't coming, that will take MILLIONS to resolve the way many on here want (so it AIN'T going to happen this month!).

 

So we HAVE to survive. That means looking at EVERY possible angle.

 

And, at the end of the day, I come back to my first point. Leon and the others NEED to have a proposal. At this point, all I am seeing is ITK style point scoring.

Management training course day one tells you to ask the critical question - "What do you propse?". It is damned hard to say yes or no to a moan and so far as I can see there isn't anything sensible being put even close to a table.

 

Simply phoning up Lowe and saying "you fooked it up again, get out & I'll put some money in" just won't hack it. It will need a PROFESIONAL approach and a "Compelling reason to Act" as we used to say in MNC land

 

(ie stop speculating on the internet and start THINKING and TALKING)

 

And before we get the string of "Lowe won't listen because..." replies, there are plenty of middle ground routes to do this, not least the Bank and the fact that they AREN'T being used is why I still think all the Morph/LS style stuff is deckchair moving cr*p and about undermining this month's regime. (And how many times has THAT worked in the last 3 years??)

 

Who was it who said "Once you have eliminated all possibilities, only the impossible is left"? I know it was not in this context but I think people need to examine EVERY single option to get out of this. Working together may be impossible, but if it keeps us alive through the crash, then it has to be done.

 

Otherwise we're left with LLS & Father Christmas as our only hopes............:rolleyes::rolleyes: as you would say!

 

Whilst I realise it is only "Paper Talk" but yesterday one paper stated that an American Consortium were close to buying Newcastle for £200M+, and another one said that there were a number of Middle Eastern consortia trying to buy their way into the PL. How does this fit in with the current financial turmoil??:-?

[dubai_phil]

Whilst I realise it is only "Paper Talk" but yesterday one paper stated that an American Consortium were close to buying Newcastle for £200M+, and another one said that there were a number of Middle Eastern consortia trying to buy their way into the PL. How does this fit in with the current financial turmoil??:-?

 

Newcastle at that price would be about a 35% discount.... and then the exchange rate drop will make it a better deal than it appeared three months ago.

 

I can confirm that a number of Middle Eastern consortiums are interested in buying into English Football using differing approaches.

Even if you take out the fact that it is discussed in business & social meetings down here (because of the Abu Dhabi mob as much as anything), but the REASON I can state this confidently is the fact it IS in the media and Zabeel themselves said something similar when they did their pull out from Charlton. "Focus on local projects and opportunities" at the moment.

 

So my point is that they may not be doing it THIS month.....

 

Which is why I advocate we try and survive as long as possible

[trousers]

Good question, but more importantly....how will we on here know that you were right?

 

Unless, of course, you plan on posting some tangible proof that Salz was indeed Leon's guest (later tonight after the game)....

 

[Gemmel]

Surely if the only way of saving the Club in the short term is to step aside (and maybe even forfiet shares or something similar), then Lowe and Wilde should be prepared to do that, particularly if the alternative is admin and meltdown.

 

I still can't see lowe doing this, I think he would rather take his chances in administration, although i completely agree with the sentiment. May be a nice starting place would be Mr Askam. He sells his shares and gives the monsy raised back to the club.

[Tamesaint]

I still can't see lowe doing this, I think he would rather take his chances in administration, although i completely agree with the sentiment. May be a nice starting place would be Mr Askam. He sells his shares and gives the monsy raised back to the club.

 

 

I probably don't know what I am talking about but couldn't we have another rights issue with Leon underwiting the issue ? That way he could pump some money into the club & at the same time if the two amigos cannot afford to stump up anything themeselves their shareholding would be diluted in Crouch's favour.

 

The only problem in this would be Rupert. His ego means that he has to be top dog ..... but I suppose if things got really bad with the bank , he may have no other option.

[NickG]

is Crouch rich enough to make a real difference?

 

His shares seem a bit of a waste to him at the mo -not a good investment and not part of the club he wanted to get involved with

[Snowballs2]

Quote:

Originally Posted by um pahars

Surely if the only way of saving the Club in the short term is to step aside (and maybe even forfiet shares or something similar), then Lowe and Wilde should be prepared to do that, particularly if the alternative is admin and meltdown.

 

 

Um this would mean writing off a seriously large chunk of money...would YOU be prepared to do that?

As much as I dislike the man, I cannot see anyone doing this...Call it waiting for the last throw of the dice or spin of the wheel...Lowe has nothing to lose.

[Fan The Flames]

Newcastle at that price would be about a 35% discount.... and then the exchange rate drop will make it a better deal than it appeared three months ago.

 

Why 35% discount when Ashley only bought it for £140m less eighteen months ago.

[Window Cleaner]

Why 35% discount when Ashley only bought it for £140m less eighteen months ago.

 

Because he paid off a lot of debts.

[Fan The Flames]

Because he paid off a lot of debts.

 

£140m to purchase + £100m in debts

 

So a offer of £200m+ isn't far off, especially in todays market.

[Amesbury Saint]

so what is the end game for Saints?

 

Anything other than administration and relegation?

[saint lard]

so what is the end game for Saints?

 

Anything other than administration and relegation?

 

The possible return of crouch back into the fold,yippee i can't wait.

 

Sarcastic emoticon thingy required.

[Morph]

Morph, you are just one in a long line of forum bullsh*tters who try to give the impression you know what's going on behind the scenes.

 

Kind Regards

 

Wade (IMHO of course)

 

Thanks for the reference Wade.

 

Unfortunately I don't think I'll need it.

 

But thanks again.

 

Kindest Regards

 

 

Morph

[Amesbury Saint]

Morph

 

Any new information to suggest a brighter future for SFC?

 

Andrew