Sam's "long" shortlist...

[david in sweden]

It's not a two horse race, but most people see West Ham as our main challengers in the Prem. promotion race, so I was very surprised to see that Sam Allardyce admitted that he had a "short list " of .. 25 players, who he's been looking.. at as possible targets when the "window " opens in January.

 

It means that he's convinced his Board that he needs to buy in... more than a few players... to guarantee the Hammers a quick return to the Prem.

If thats the case..then I'm sure they will find the money ..." from somewhere ", but in reading the storyline on the BBC site,

I considered that it really sounded a note of desperation in a statement like that.

 

Surely there is a warning here following the recent dismissal of Sven-Göran Eriksson at Leicester who bought in about a dozen players in the summer.

It's clear that just having extra players in the squad is one thing... but moulding them into a team good enough to win promotion in the Spring sounds like Mission Impossible...as Eriksson found to his cost.

 

I'm sure that Nigel Adkins has a list for buys in January, I just hope that it's short enough that he knows who he will buy and where they will fit in.

[derry]

This month has made the situation obvious that we are a bit short on the numbers, quality reinforcement for striker, centre back, goalkeeper, right side midfield, pace.

[sambosa75]

I think the only immediate urgency is a right winger capable of creating an impact from the first minute, ideally with pace to burn and another forward. I have a feeling we'll look to sign someone who could do both jobs though.

[dronskisaint]

I detest that bacon faced tw*t of a Manpoo manager but he and NA sing the same song - only buy if it genuinely adds quality and something that you don't have.

 

We can almost (when everyone is fit) put out two teams that can compete at a high level in this league...sure we're a little short of cover short term and certainly if we did go up we'd need to buy but I'm in full agreement with keeping a team that knows each other's play extremely well having played together for getting on for three seasons in many cases and who have an enviable team spirit.

 

This is what I hope for our January...no 'Hollywood' signings - just genuine additional quality if available. Credit Pardew, Nige and Cortese for buying quality and moulding it in to the current squad - they know/knew what they were doing.

[S-Clarke]

WHU are panicking. They havent' really taken the league by storm, even when they had all their players available.

 

Carlton Cole for e.g. has been rubbish this season, and has been used as a sub more often than a start. Based on his history and record at PL level you'd expect him to be banging them in all year.

 

I know some WHU fans and they all detest big sam, they hate what he's done to their club in the time he's been there. In their opinion, which surprised me, they say they're in the worst place they've ever been and the longer he's there the worse it will be. They say it's mainly down to not using the players correctly. He's trying to play long ball football with footballers like Noble, Collison, Fabuert, and it clearly isn't working - but he's not trying any other alternative.

 

We saw a fine example of their decline when they played us. They were utterly hopeless, truly inept and didn't have a clue other than to hoof it - that isn't the West Ham way and it must be painful viewing for their fans right now.

 

If we can regain a bit of form and start stringing wins together again I think we can fly ahead of them. I can see them continuing to stutter.

[Toadhall Saint]

Probably Sam giving a little message to the players he already has - 25 players is ridiculous.

[sambosa75]

They're a short term club, leads to overspending and inflated squads on inflated wages. It'll probably get them up, probably as champions, but it'll leave a big squad of players largely not good enough for the top flight and stuck there on big wages. Another club who've learnt NOTHING.

 

As for Saints, I still don't understand the idea of signing quality back-up. How does it work? What quality players want to come and sit on our bench? When our first 11 is out there, let's say Davis, Fox, Fonte, Jos, Richardson, Lallana, Cork, Schneiderlin, Chaplow, Guly, Lambert...there are many you'd see as obviously in need of replacement. Centre back maybe, but should we break up that partnership? CM? But is that not because our 3 CMs have lost a bit of form? You can't sign a new player whenever existing ones lose form. Striker? Yes, a different option needed, but they wouldn't start immediately. RM? If SDR isn't trusted, maybe Chaplow can move to CM. AOC back would be nice. I'd like to see a midfield of Lallana-Cork-Chaplow-Chamberlain in this league.

 

I imagine we pushed Arsenal too far to consider a loan move though.

 

Totally agree. I'd dearly love to see them fail to win promotion. If they don't get up whilst they are receiving paracute payments, they will be screwed.

[eelpie]

As for Saints, I still don't understand the idea of signing quality back-up. How does it work? What quality players want to come and sit on our bench? When our first 11 is out there, let's say Davis, Fox, Fonte, Jos, Richardson, Lallana, Cork, Schneiderlin, Chaplow, Guly, Lambert...there are many you'd see as obviously in need of replacement. Centre back maybe, but should we break up that partnership? CM? But is that not because our 3 CMs have lost a bit of form? You can't sign a new player whenever existing ones lose form. Striker? Yes, a different option needed, but they wouldn't start immediately. RM? If SDR isn't trusted, maybe Chaplow can move to CM. AOC back would be nice. I'd like to see a midfield of Lallana-Cork-Chaplow-Chamberlain in this league.

 

But we don't need back up for existing players so much as replacements where the quality has been found wanting. Like a fast quality striker upfront of the class of Maynard which we don't have, and because Guly, brilliant as he can be is inconsistant, as is also Deano (who I can't see as premiership first team quality). We are an up and coming pre-Premiership team heading for promotion and three points ahead of the field at half season. That should be of interest to the right quality players , so long as we can match wage demands. One reason that we dropped out of the premiership (and failed to return) was that our previous owner made false economies. A difficult balance for Cortese, but now is the time, because if we miss this opportunity we may again lose our best players to top tier clubs.

[RobM]

Probably Sam giving a little message to the players he already has - 25 players is ridiculous.

 

I'm sure there is an element of that to it, but also a sign that the transfer market is competitive and you can't simply choose three or four players and focus on only those. It always surprises me that our own fans seem to think this is the case, that if we're linked with somebody it means they are certainly about to sign - it doesn't, it just means we're aware of a wider group of targets, just as Sam is.

[thegaffer]

Absolutely spot on Sam is a mind games manager.

Probably Sam giving a little message to the players he already has - 25 players is ridiculous.

[Redondo Saint]

perhaps we should recall a certain loan player from London...

[ericofarabia]

perhaps we should recall a certain loan player from London...

 

Heard that Redkrap was looking to loan out a few players .... Mr Gareth Bale come on down.

[Itchen_block4]

A shortlist of 25 doesn't mean he's going to sign them all. NA certainly wouldn't come out and say it, but I'd imagine he has or had quite a long shortlist too. I'd imagine a hint towards lots of signings is meant to motivate his players.

[Mowgli]

Absolutely spot on Sam is a mind games manager.

 

Not sure how that is mind games. Telling your existing underperforming squad that he needs 25 players is hardly going to motivate them to play better. More likely they will feel he has no faith in them and will seek their fortunes elsewhere.

[thegaffer]

yeah whatever!!

Not sure how that is mind games. Telling your existing underperforming squad that he needs 25 players is hardly going to motivate them to play better. More likely they will feel he has no faith in them and will seek their fortunes elsewhere.

[Tamesaint]

I think Big Sam is losing the plot a little. They aren't walking this division in the way that they thought they would.

 

Big Sam seems to be doing the media circuit a lot as well. Barely a week goes by when he isn't interviewed on Talksport. Yesterday he was interviewed on Five Live where he claimed that they were the best team in the league and that is why they were top of the league !! I suppose that if you keep saying this sort of thing your fans will believe you.

 

I still think that they will go up automatically .... but it would be quite amusing if they did fail to go up. it seems to be S h i t or bust for them and it will not be at all pretty if it is bust.

[david in sweden]

A shortlist of 25 doesn't mean he's going to sign them all.

NA certainly wouldn't come out and say it, but I'd imagine he has or had quite a long shortlist too. I'd imagine a hint towards lots of signings is meant to motivate his players.

 

 

If you read the BBC article - he doesn't suggest that he's going to sign 25, but as I read it - he's got all sorts of ideas, players he's looked at, perhaps one or two that he's set up deals for ..but I'm sure that by the end of January he'll have signed more players than we have..and probably got rid of a handful, too.

 

As I wrote in #1...I find it rather strange that he's saying ....so many. Nigel obviously has a shopping list too, but it was clear in the summer that when we didn't sign..Sharp, or Jay Rod ..or Maynard (Brizzle said we never bid for him anyway)... that NA had run out of " targetted options " and didn't make a panic buy anyway. If (Sam) has so many options (as he says) on his list...he obviously hasn't thought through who in particular he wants - for what role.

 

When Nigel didn't get who he wanted..he left it. Sounds to me like Sam is panicking.....though the " mind games " theory put forward here may well be true but is a dangerous ploy - if it suggests he doesn't trust ANY of his present squad. Not good for team morale, either.

Edited 17 December, 2011 by david in sweden

[Saint_clark]

I think Big Sam is losing the plot a little. They aren't walking this division in the way that they thought they would.

 

Big Sam seems to be doing the media circuit a lot as well. Barely a week goes by when he isn't interviewed on Talksport. Yesterday he was interviewed on Five Live where he claimed that they were the best team in the league and that is why they were top of the league !! I suppose that if you keep saying this sort of thing your fans will believe you.

 

I still think that they will go up automatically .... but it would be quite amusing if they did fail to go up. it seems to be S h i t or bust for them and it will not be at all pretty if it is bust.

 

Jesus. That's proper mental.

[Itchen_block4]

If you read the BBC article - he doesn't suggest that he's going to sign 25, but as I read it - he's got all sorts of ideas, players he's looked at, perhaps one or two that he's set up deals for ..but I'm sure that by the end of January he'll have signed more players than we have..and probably got rid of a handful, too.

 

As I wrote in #1...I find it rather strange that he's saying ....so many. Nigel obviously has a shopping list too, but it was clear in the summer that when we didn't sign..Sharp, or Jay Rod ..or Maynard (Brizzle said we never bid for him anyway)... that NA had run out of " targetted options " and didn't make a panic buy anyway. If (Sam) has so many options (as he says) on his list...he obviously hasn't thought through who in particular he wants - for what role.

 

When Nigel didn't get who he wanted..he left it. Sounds to me like Sam is panicking.....though the " mind games " theory put forward here may well be true but is a dangerous ploy - if it suggests he doesn't trust ANY of his present squad. Not good for team morale, either.

 

As you say, the huge shortlist is there because Big Sam has left it too late to narrow it down to players he is preparing to approach. Well done to Nigel if he's been narrowing down the scouting pool to players he'd like to sign since September. It's good to have backups incase you don't get your first choice, but the length of Big Sam's "short"list indicates that he doesn't have a plan. I think he's trying to engage people by saying there will be lots of action, but I wouldn't be surprised if this backfires.

[david in sweden]

As you say, the huge shortlist is there because Big Sam has left it too late to narrow it down to players he is preparing to approach. Well done to Nigel if he's been narrowing down the scouting pool to players he'd like to sign since September. It's good to have backups incase you don't get your first choice, but the length of Big Sam's "short"list indicates that he doesn't have a plan. I think he's trying to engage people by saying there will be lots of action, but I wouldn't be surprised if this backfires.

 

 

Absolutely...I think Leicester were pretty dumb to sack Eriksson after such a short time, but they had no patience in the short term and expected overnight success. You can sign as many players as you like (Sam), but they'll expect you to create a promotion side just like that - and you'll, find yourself out in the cold when they fail.

[Mattio]

I wonder if any of our players are on their list? (Not that anyone would go to them)

[dubai_phil]

I wonder if any of our players are on their list? (Not that anyone would go to them)

 

Conversely, Big Sam likes hoofball but has a lot of quality ball players in the squad. Let him get his hoofers in and we can cherry pick the quality