Nexstar Posted 10 December, 2011 Share Posted 10 December, 2011 Bart definitely needs more game time. He's a very good keeper and I imagine in training he shows that, but training doesn't prepare you for a match situation. Ideally he could go out on loan, but he's in a situation where going on loan and playing more games aren't really viable options. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sotonist Posted 10 December, 2011 Share Posted 10 December, 2011 As much for your sake as ours, its time for you to move on and re-establish yourself at a club. Good Luck elsewhere... Agree with this. He might still have potential, but ever since his injury his nerves have been shot. Playing second fiddle is not what he needs. It's just a crutch. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dune Posted 10 December, 2011 Share Posted 10 December, 2011 Bart definitely needs more game time. He's a very good keeper and I imagine in training he shows that, but training doesn't prepare you for a match situation. Ideally he could go out on loan, but he's in a situation where going on loan and playing more games aren't really viable options. Not more game time at this level i'm afraid. He needs to move on to a L1/L2 club. We need to invest heavily (relative to the cost of keepers) in a good keeper who can fill KD's boots. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
st.sj Posted 10 December, 2011 Share Posted 10 December, 2011 As much for your sake as ours, its time for you to move on and re-establish yourself at a club. Good Luck elsewhere... Yeah Bart had a Stinker, maybe its a position that needs lookin at, maybe, but I would leave that decision to Adkins. What Bart needs now is support, hes worked hard without too many games, I guess that cant be too easy. My message is Alpine, As much for your sake as ours, move on and "support" [in the loosest sense of the word]" another club. Good luck elsewhere Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
st alex Posted 10 December, 2011 Share Posted 10 December, 2011 I was very surprised that after the first half he had, the gk coach didn't come out with him at half time and take some shots at him, especially since Bart usually gives Kelvin a few catches at the start of the second half, but he got nothing! Someone that was clearly struggling and needed a bit of help not none, and with an ex goaly as manager I found that very surprising and disapointing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dalek2003 Posted 10 December, 2011 Share Posted 10 December, 2011 Well,if KD and Bart cannot play, who is our third choice keeper ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
S-Clarke Posted 10 December, 2011 Share Posted 10 December, 2011 Well,if KD and Bart cannot play, who is our third choice keeper ? a young academy kid......or.................................................forecast. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Minty Posted 10 December, 2011 Share Posted 10 December, 2011 Well,if KD and Bart cannot play, who is our third choice keeper ? It's a valid question, but then it's all about risk management, and the likelihood of needing a third choice - plenty of clubs do go through spells when they only have 2 professional keepers on the books. That said, if we needed to, I'm sure we could recall Forecast or even Jack Dovey if need be, so i wouldn't be overly concerned. As I've highlighted elsewhere, it's a team game and when you also look at some of the missed chances, and poor decision making in the final third, then that arguably cost us more than one goal. Now, long term is slightly different. Adkins has to decide whether Bart is an option for longer term, and that depends on more than just one performance. I trust his judgement and I would hope most fans would also do so at the present time, given our progress so far. I'm concerned that Bart's confidence issue is not something that can be rectified at Saints. I just don't know, and given that I've always thought that he has a good natural goalkeeping ability, it's one I'll watch with interest. However, to kick any player out after one performance is knee-jerk in the extreme. I know some will say that they've seen poor performances in more than just this game, but then we have people tell us that about Kelvin too. As always, to some people it's a black and white situation but is it ever? I don't think so. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LGTL Posted 10 December, 2011 Share Posted 10 December, 2011 Kelv was "almost fit" for today according to Adkins, so I imagine we won't have to worry about Bart for next week. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hypochondriac Posted 10 December, 2011 Share Posted 10 December, 2011 We can never risk a performance like that again. Get rid I think. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
saint_ben Posted 10 December, 2011 Share Posted 10 December, 2011 how long is davis out for? Any chance of an emergency loan? Was veey suprised to see no goalkeeper but then again having tommy forepast is not much of a goalkeeper Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
saint_ben Posted 10 December, 2011 Share Posted 10 December, 2011 No goalkeeper on bench I mean Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ericofarabia Posted 10 December, 2011 Share Posted 10 December, 2011 He looked shocking from the first touch, or should I say fumble of the ball. I think the big problem is the lack of proper reserve team games nowadays means a position like reserve goal keeper never gets any match practice and he looked as rusty as hell, which is a shame as he had shown so much potential before he got his injury. I though we were suppose to be setting up loads of friendly games for our 2nd XI to keep their sharpness? Got to hope SKD is back next week as the last thing we need is a fragile keeper stood feet away from the mouth frothing scum at The Fratton End. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stepgar Posted 10 December, 2011 Share Posted 10 December, 2011 easy to criticize whilst sat on your fat arse behind a computer screen. I'd love to see you get up there in front of a stadium full of football fans and a live tv audience and not get nervous. ****ing inbred He has been in the game long enough to be able to handle the game and remeber he is a paid professional. The only time i would expect him or any professional is at a proper derby game. Not a run of the mill league fixture. So what you have just said i am afraid is complete hollocks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
channonball Posted 10 December, 2011 Share Posted 10 December, 2011 I think that is the worst goalkeeping performance I've witnessed in a Saints shirt. Can anyone think of any worse? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Minty Posted 10 December, 2011 Share Posted 10 December, 2011 We can never risk a performance like that again. Get rid I think. It's always a risk - the only way to eliminate that risk is to never play football. Sorry, that might seem silly but it is true. It's a game played by humans who are prone to errors. We simply have to trust in Adkins, he has earned that at least. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saints foreva Posted 10 December, 2011 Share Posted 10 December, 2011 I think that is the worst goalkeeping performance I've witnessed in a Saints shirt. Can anyone think of any worse? Niemi vs that lot down the road. I was confident of a win until I saw Bartosz make those two howlers in the first half, the 2nd goal for Blackpool was no surprise. Very disappointed in Bart. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
de-fence Posted 10 December, 2011 Share Posted 10 December, 2011 All those saying he needs more games etc etc. He's paid to train to play football every day of the week. He must have saved 10,000 shots in his time at southampton. If anybody can tell me that that performance today was a performance that justified our investment in having him at the club I will be amazed. Analysing his performance, nothing come's to mind that he did well. On the flip side he repeatedly had embarrassing cameo after embarrassing cameo. A quick look through his performance: the cross that came across goal that he chested out for a corner when it was a regulation catch. Could have gone anywhere. The inoxious shot that he amazingly decided to chest away with his hands by his side. The goal kicks that didn't reach the half way line. The goal... The high ball that he jumped up for to then take at his waist with Blackpool players attacking. The ball that played back to him that he poked out of play, admittedly it took a bobble, but he handled it terribly, one level up from missing it and it going in the goal.My point being, for someone who has spent the last 6 years of his life training to be a goalkeeper at Southampton FC, he showed no ability to play in goal, whatsoever. There was nothing. Not even a hint of positivity to cling onto to say 'well he did well there, he made one world class save etc etc'. He did absolutely nothing that was positive. We are a top end championship club, pushing to be a premier league club. If any fan can tell me that that performances reached anywhere near the standards that are acceptable for our club then I would be gobsmacked.I've always liked and supported Bart but I was in disbelief with regards to his performance today. Time for him to go elsewhere. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chez Posted 10 December, 2011 Share Posted 10 December, 2011 reminded me of Ian Andrews' display at QPR many moons ago, especially the letting in of a `backpass' through his legs. As bad a keeping display as I've seen in a Saints shirt. Tough to come back from that. Hope Kelvin is ft for next Sunday. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SB Posted 10 December, 2011 Share Posted 10 December, 2011 easy to criticize whilst sat on your fat arse behind a computer screen. I'd love to see you get up there in front of a stadium full of football fans and a live tv audience and not get nervous. ****ing inbred You deluded ****wit! He is paid thousands a week to perform deal with preasure and at least look like a goalkeeper! ****ing inbred. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dune Posted 10 December, 2011 Share Posted 10 December, 2011 You deluded ****wit! He is paid thousands a week to perform deal with preasure and at least look like a goalkeeper! ****ing inbred. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Huffton Posted 10 December, 2011 Share Posted 10 December, 2011 I hate to slate players, especially goalies, but Bart was worse than useless today. He looked like a rabbit in the headlights before a ball was even kicked. He's clearly a confidence player, but every time I've seen him play since his injury he looks scared. IMO our best bet is to get him out on loan to a L1 club with an instant recall clause where he can get a decent run in a side, we all know he has the ability, he just needs to find out again for himself. There is no way he can play next week, in that kind of atmosphere he'll be a gibbering wreck inseide 5 mins. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Weston Saint Posted 10 December, 2011 Share Posted 10 December, 2011 "Bart is outstanding in training and I have so much confidence in him. He has had to wait a long time for an opportunity to play because of the outstanding form of Kelvin Davis." "Today he has had to go and perform in the arena and he will be a stronger person and a stronger character for it. We will support him and the good thing is that although there was a mistake, we didn't lose the game, so let's take the positives and build him back up." "Kelvin was close to being fit today, the game is next Sunday so we have eight days before that great game that we are all looking forward to. I'm really looking forward to it now" Adkins quotes Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
James Posted 10 December, 2011 Share Posted 10 December, 2011 He simply CANNOT play against the Skates - they'll have seen that performance today and will prepare accordingly. Not only did he cost us the win with that ridiculous spill he was simply terrible all game. Can't remember him doing anything well. When I've seen him this season I've been worried about him. The fact is, we didn't actually play too badly today - for those saying we did - it was a knock on effect from the back. Bart put so much pressure on the defence it was untrue. You could see that they did not want to give it to him. We lost our rag at the end of the game because we were behind with only a couple of mins to go - and whose fault was that? Oh wait..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RobM Posted 10 December, 2011 Share Posted 10 December, 2011 He simply CANNOT play against the Skates Who would you play if KD isn't available then? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
James Posted 10 December, 2011 Share Posted 10 December, 2011 Who would you play if KD isn't available then? I'd honestly rather have a half fit KD than Bart at the moment - plus Adkins said KD wasn't far away. My point is I'd rather a 50-60% fit KD than Bart and that is my honest opinion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Under Weststand Posted 10 December, 2011 Share Posted 10 December, 2011 I wouldn't right him off just yet but he needs some serious game time to regain his confidence. Not saying he ever will but I'd loan him out in Jan for the rest of the season & see if he can come back from this. But we cannot afford mistakes like this every time Kelvin is injured. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
david in sweden Posted 10 December, 2011 Share Posted 10 December, 2011 (edited) my first thought is that would be his last game for saints. sad but you cant carry anyone so nervous and unreliable in any position. we do need a new keeper. I beg to differ... BUT we need TWO keepers. ..and I don't mean Forecast either. I'm quite satisfied with KDs performances, but as was seen today (and with Lambert's absence over the last 2 weeeks,).. the team is not the same without him.(KD) If we are talking Premiership...? then a quick look at the Prem. squads will show that many sides have TWO international keepers. albeit from lower grade countries but still.. we're lucky that Kelv. has been so consistant, but today's sorry show is just one of the problems that we are likely to face next season. We need a GOOD no.2 keeper ...and Bart... 'aint it. (maybe better than Forecast but that's not saying much). He looked nervous.. like a rabbit in the headlights. that goal he conceded was pure schoolboy error stuff (Rule .1 - get your whole body behind the ball )! No-one better to judge the situation than Adkins (a former keeper himself)..but let's see the back of Bart and Forecast ASAP and get some reliable back-up for Kelvin (assuming he's fit soon). Edited 10 December, 2011 by david in sweden Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
benjii Posted 10 December, 2011 Share Posted 10 December, 2011 And to think there are lots of idiots on here who have previously said he should be picked ahead of KD. clueless. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Legod Third Coming Posted 10 December, 2011 Share Posted 10 December, 2011 Bart was terrible today. That mistake was awful. Exactly the same as the one made by Rob Green for England. How's he doing out of football... oh... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chivvy1664 Posted 10 December, 2011 Share Posted 10 December, 2011 Im actually a better bet than bart but someone needs to take my ground kicks for me the old quads just cant do it any more. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Huffton Posted 10 December, 2011 Share Posted 10 December, 2011 Who would you play if KD isn't available then? Is Dexter Blackstock available? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skintsaint Posted 10 December, 2011 Share Posted 10 December, 2011 he was laughable today...why do we never play against a keeper like that! lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Huffton Posted 10 December, 2011 Share Posted 10 December, 2011 The only thing that amazed me was the Blackpool players didn't start taking pot shots from 20+yds out, they had plenty of opportunities. It could have been a cricket score... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Window Cleaner Posted 10 December, 2011 Share Posted 10 December, 2011 he was laughable today...why do we never play against a keeper like that! lol before we all get too exited about this look back to the last home league match that we lost, I'm sure it's still on the Saint's Player archives somewhere. Kelvin did exactly the same as Bart today, he was probably at fault for the other goal as well,.Last time we lost, this time we played our "Get out of Jail" card. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bananaman Posted 10 December, 2011 Share Posted 10 December, 2011 Am I right in saying that Bialkowski opted out of the play-off semi 2nd leg due to nerves when Burley was selecting him over Kelv??... if that's the case this is clearly the issue Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
S-Clarke Posted 10 December, 2011 Share Posted 10 December, 2011 Am I right in saying that Bialkowski opted out of the play-off semi 2nd leg due to nerves when Burley was selecting him over Kelv??... if that's the case this is clearly the issue Yes, you're right. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
krissyboy31 Posted 10 December, 2011 Share Posted 10 December, 2011 Am I right in saying that Bialkowski opted out of the play-off semi 2nd leg due to nerves when Burley was selecting him over Kelv??... if that's the case this is clearly the issueYes but he was a nipper then, if he's not ready now he'll never be. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dimond Geezer Posted 10 December, 2011 Share Posted 10 December, 2011 Unfortunately I have to agree with Alps. I've always defended KD against the Kelvin bashers when he's had the odd shakey moment, and I've always said that one day Bart will be a good keeper, although not yet. However, after todays match I think I was wrong, Bart was apalling, and clearly not good enough, or confident enough for this league. His distribution was terrible, something often leveled at KD (unfairly in my opinion), and his shot-stopping was literally non-existent. I take no pleasure in this, but I think we need a decent 2nd choice keeper. KD has done a fine job and we would always miss him when he is out, but Bart is not the man to step in for him. I fear that if he plays at Fratton Park next week, we might as well not turn-up, the crowd will be on his back from the off & he won't be able to handle it & will fall apart. Hopefully one good thing to come out of this though will be and end to those ridiculous "Davis out" type threads we get when he puts a goalkick into the Kingsland. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
up and away Posted 10 December, 2011 Share Posted 10 December, 2011 Why dont you read my words ? I chose them very carefully. I havent said he isnt capable of being a brilliant goalkeeper, just the way its worked out with us hes never got an extended run as first choice and now we have resources he wont get it either; he needs to go elsewhere, be first choice, and work out his mental issues during an extended run. He was as nervous as a cat in hell today,I felt sorry for the lad. The only way he is going to get over this is to get more games, something difficult to square if Kelvin is fit. He's in that catch 22 situation now where any action to remedy the situation means a move away from St Mary's. If we loan him out, we will need to get someone good in to replace him. His only chance is to get some games at Kelvins expense and work his way through the problem, easier said than done. If he goes to another club, permanently or or loan, I firmly believe he will become an excellent goalie, just find it very difficult to see how he can do it at Saints now. I thought his distribution was good, very good at throwing the ball out, though his dead ball kicks were a little too flat. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
S-Clarke Posted 10 December, 2011 Share Posted 10 December, 2011 He was as nervous as a cat in hell today,I felt sorry for the lad. The only way he is going to get over this is to get more games, something difficult to square if Kelvin is fit. He's in that catch 22 situation now where any action to remedy the situation means a move away from St Mary's. If we loan him out, we will need to get someone good in to replace him. His only chance is to get some games at Kelvins expense and work his way through the problem, easier said than done. If he goes to another club, permanently or or loan, I firmly believe he will become an excellent goalie, just find it very difficult to see how he can do it at Saints now. I thought his distribution was good, very good at throwing the ball out, though his dead ball kicks were a little too flat. Agree with every word of that. Exactly how I see the situation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
surrey1saint Posted 10 December, 2011 Share Posted 10 December, 2011 I remember in our play off season, he refused to play in the 2nd leg and was a bundle or nerves - which is why Davis replaced him. That came from Malcolm Webster. If this is true,he is no use to us,bye Bart. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
opthomps Posted 10 December, 2011 Share Posted 10 December, 2011 He was as nervous as a cat in hell today,I felt sorry for the lad. The only way he is going to get over this is to get more games, something difficult to square if Kelvin is fit. He's in that catch 22 situation now where any action to remedy the situation means a move away from St Mary's. If we loan him out, we will need to get someone good in to replace him. His only chance is to get some games at Kelvins expense and work his way through the problem, easier said than done. If he goes to another club, permanently or or loan, I firmly believe he will become an excellent goalie, just find it very difficult to see how he can do it at Saints now. I thought his distribution was good, very good at throwing the ball out, though his dead ball kicks were a little too flat. This! sensible evaluation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SaintRobbie Posted 10 December, 2011 Share Posted 10 December, 2011 He was as nervous as a cat in hell today,I felt sorry for the lad. The only way he is going to get over this is to get more games, something difficult to square if Kelvin is fit. He's in that catch 22 situation now where any action to remedy the situation means a move away from St Mary's. If we loan him out, we will need to get someone good in to replace him. His only chance is to get some games at Kelvins expense and work his way through the problem, easier said than done. If he goes to another club, permanently or or loan, I firmly believe he will become an excellent goalie, just find it very difficult to see how he can do it at Saints now. I thought his distribution was good, very good at throwing the ball out, though his dead ball kicks were a little too flat. Totally agree - League 1 or 2. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RobM Posted 10 December, 2011 Share Posted 10 December, 2011 He was as nervous as a cat in hell today,I felt sorry for the lad. The only way he is going to get over this is to get more games, something difficult to square if Kelvin is fit. He's in that catch 22 situation now where any action to remedy the situation means a move away from St Mary's. If we loan him out, we will need to get someone good in to replace him. His only chance is to get some games at Kelvins expense and work his way through the problem, easier said than done. If he goes to another club, permanently or or loan, I firmly believe he will become an excellent goalie, just find it very difficult to see how he can do it at Saints now. I thought his distribution was good, very good at throwing the ball out, though his dead ball kicks were a little too flat. I'm with the guys above - agree entirely. One thing to add though, which Alpine touched on, is we now have the resources to buy in talent. When KD's career winds down and we need a new No.1, do we honestly think we would stick with Bart rather than go out and buy an already established No.1 from another club? Bart will become a great keeper with regular games, be that with us or anyone else, but if we have to make a decision about a new No.1 I just can't see it being Bart. The only way I see this changing is if KD tells the club he wants to wind down in preparation for his retirement, perhaps a year in advance, so we can gradually bring in Bart. I can't see it happening though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
martel Posted 10 December, 2011 Share Posted 10 December, 2011 I wouldn't right him off just yet but he needs some serious game time to regain his confidence. Not saying he ever will but I'd loan him out in Jan for the rest of the season & see if he can come back from this. But we cannot afford mistakes like this every time Kelvin is injured. Agreed, and if memory serves me correctly, did he not make some excellent penalty saves against Norwich in the paint pot semi-final; more game time and he will only get better. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ant Posted 10 December, 2011 Share Posted 10 December, 2011 He was as nervous as a cat in hell today,I felt sorry for the lad. The only way he is going to get over this is to get more games, something difficult to square if Kelvin is fit. He's in that catch 22 situation now where any action to remedy the situation means a move away from St Mary's. If we loan him out, we will need to get someone good in to replace him. His only chance is to get some games at Kelvins expense and work his way through the problem, easier said than done. If he goes to another club, permanently or or loan, I firmly believe he will become an excellent goalie, just find it very difficult to see how he can do it at Saints now. I thought his distribution was good, very good at throwing the ball out, though his dead ball kicks were a little too flat. To echo all of the previous posters in agreement, I believe this is a far more fair, measured assessment. Can't really add anything in fact. Simply find it difficult to direct all of the blame towards Bart, there's more factors to the situation than simply picking him as the scapegoat. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saint_clark Posted 10 December, 2011 Share Posted 10 December, 2011 I think we'll stick with him, but I said today that he'd messed up the biggest chance of his career so far. He could have made the number 1 spot his own in a team as close to the Prem as you can get without actually being in it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aintforever Posted 10 December, 2011 Share Posted 10 December, 2011 One bad game and the SWF retards are righting him off. Clueless mongs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Massimo Osti Posted 10 December, 2011 Share Posted 10 December, 2011 OK to put a line under this do a Poll?? who would play him next Sunday??? Put me as a no lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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