Turkish Posted 24 November, 2011 Share Posted 24 November, 2011 I have to admit when I found out this the other day, I was shocked AS levels count towards points as well! However, AS levels aren't a cop out, though obviously they aren't as hard as A2 levels. I'd like to see you do my 15,000 word chemistry coursework! A levels aren't easy. And if AS levels are included, how would that improve a college's stats compared to another college in the tables... as ALL colleges would use AS... You seem to forget in your bleating about how hard they are, that other people have done A levels as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
View From The Top Posted 24 November, 2011 Share Posted 24 November, 2011 What now? Have you met anyone like that? Every single immigrant I have met has a job(often a low paid one) and works bloody hard in it. They do respect this country and don't live off benefits! You've clearly never been to the Black Country or Birmingham. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Turkish Posted 24 November, 2011 Share Posted 24 November, 2011 I work with Romanians and they are very polite and hard working, amiable people. I didn't say they were all lazy and claiming benefits, but some are. What would you do about them? And to ensure that only ones allowed here contributed something back to society? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saintandy666 Posted 24 November, 2011 Share Posted 24 November, 2011 I didn't say they were all lazy and claiming benefits, but some are. What would you do about them? And to ensure that only ones allowed here contributed something back to society? How many are like this? I want statistics. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saintandy666 Posted 24 November, 2011 Share Posted 24 November, 2011 You've clearly never been to the Black Country or Birmingham. I have not. I can only speak for those who reside in my area. As can you for those that live near you. What we need are statistics. Anecdotal evidence doesn't really show much. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saintandy666 Posted 24 November, 2011 Share Posted 24 November, 2011 You seem to forget in your bleating about how hard they are, that other people have done A levels as well. Good, and those people will know that getting 3 A's at A level isn't a walk in the park. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Turkish Posted 24 November, 2011 Share Posted 24 November, 2011 How many are like this? I want statistics. Why? It's a simple question. How would you stop immigrants coming in and living off the state? You've usually got all the answers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Turkish Posted 24 November, 2011 Share Posted 24 November, 2011 Good, and those people will know that getting 3 A's at A level isn't a walk in the park. It sure isn't, although I'm sure it's easier now than when I did them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saintandy666 Posted 24 November, 2011 Share Posted 24 November, 2011 It sure isn't, although I'm sure it's easier now than when I did them. Well, neither of us know that unless we actually experienced it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saintandy666 Posted 24 November, 2011 Share Posted 24 November, 2011 Why? It's a simple question. How would you stop immigrants coming in and living off the state? You've usually got all the answers. I do not have all the answers. I merely have my opinions as this is a debate forum so people should stop getting so het up when they happen to be different to theirs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
View From The Top Posted 24 November, 2011 Share Posted 24 November, 2011 I have not. I can only speak for those who reside in my area. As can you for those that live near you. What we need are statistics. Anecdotal evidence doesn't really show much. That's right, as a Head of Community maths for a whole metropolitan area, tasked with breaking into hard to reach areas, I only have anecdotal evidence. None of it, at all, comes from in depth studies from the DWP, Dept of Ed, IFL, B'ham Uni and the local authority. Nope, none, just my experience of working in mosques, temples, Gurdwara's, community outreach centres and colleges and of course, it's totally random that I visit these places, as no studies, of course, have been done, ever. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saintandy666 Posted 24 November, 2011 Share Posted 24 November, 2011 That's right, as a Head of Community maths for a whole metropolitan area, tasked with breaking into hard to reach areas, I only have anecdotal evidence. None of it, at all, comes from in depth studies from the DWP, Dept of Ed, IFL, B'ham Uni and the local authority. Nope, none, just my experience of working in mosques, temples, Gurdwara's, community outreach centres and colleges and of course, it's totally random that I visit these places, as no studies, of course, have been done, ever. I'm sorry for not knowing your job. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saintandy666 Posted 24 November, 2011 Share Posted 24 November, 2011 Here are some more indepth stats - http://www.guardian.co.uk/news/datablog/2010/jun/26/non-eu-immigration-uk-statistics Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saintandy666 Posted 24 November, 2011 Share Posted 24 November, 2011 Why's it worse for immigrants to live off the state than domestic people? If it's people who don't want to work it's really not helping the economy wherever they're from. Many British people and many immigrants are hard working and contribute a lot. I don't see how immigration comes into it, it's just a case of properly dealing with those not wanting to work. Make them work or take away benefits if they refuse or don't perform. That in itself would remove the motivation for people to come into the country and not work, leaving the majority of immigrants who do want to work and contribute. Whenever I picture the workshy benefit cheat, I have to admit I picture a chavvy English person. Meanwhile the high flying city guy is chinese. I'm a racist. Yep, the trick is to deal with those who just don't want to work wherever they come from. From my own personal experience(que someone like Dune/Turkish/VFTT coming in saying I have none), the Immigrants I have met work just as hard and if not harder than us lot! It's a just a very small minority that need dealing with. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saintandy666 Posted 24 November, 2011 Share Posted 24 November, 2011 Also, the original post says 252,000 more people in 2010. How can you start a debate without giving the previous stats? It sounds a lot on its own, but is it much more than 2009? Or the years before? What is the actually % growth rate? I don't think Britain's is actually that high, and that increase isn't growing much itself. Certainly well behind many other countries. It's funny though, when you fly over Britain it looks far more empty and green than many countries, especially for its size. Primark is too crowded though, i'll give you that one, and any Apple store is unbearable. Looking at the Guardian stats, what has led to this rise is less people leaving the UK. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saintandy666 Posted 24 November, 2011 Share Posted 24 November, 2011 How many of the 591,000 people who arrived here last year do people think came here to 'scrounge off benefits'? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Turkish Posted 24 November, 2011 Share Posted 24 November, 2011 Well, neither of us know that unless we actually experienced it. Lack of experience never usually stops you commenting and having an opinion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saintandy666 Posted 24 November, 2011 Share Posted 24 November, 2011 Lack of experience never usually stops you commenting and having an opinion. You got me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saintandy666 Posted 24 November, 2011 Share Posted 24 November, 2011 But then again, you always have a go at me for saying something of which you assume I have not experienced. Therefore, in future, no one should say anything. I think we are both hypocrites here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saintandy666 Posted 24 November, 2011 Share Posted 24 November, 2011 But then again, what amount has anyone REALLY experienced? I think we have all only seen a narrow portion of what is. Most of what people think and say is based on hearsay and second hand reports. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Turkish Posted 24 November, 2011 Share Posted 24 November, 2011 Why's it worse for immigrants to live off the state than domestic people? If it's people who don't want to work it's really not helping the economy wherever they're from. Many British people and many immigrants are hard working and contribute a lot. I don't see how immigration comes into it, it's just a case of properly dealing with those not wanting to work. Make them work or take away benefits if they refuse or don't perform. That in itself would remove the motivation for people to come into the country and not work, leaving the majority of immigrants who do want to work and contribut e. Whenever I picture the workshy benefit cheat, I have to admit I picture a chavvy English person. Meanwhile the high flying city guy is chinese. I'm a racist. I didn't say it was different. I've met may great people who have moved to this country and made a great contribution. These are more than welcome. It's the ones that bum off the state, contribute nothing back and in some cases even go out of their way to say how much they despise this country and it's culture and Its culture that are not welcome and should not be allowed in. Australia doesnt put up with it, why should we? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dune Posted 24 November, 2011 Share Posted 24 November, 2011 I'm sorry for not knowing your job. You've finally met your match when it comes to knowing and doing everything. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saintandy666 Posted 24 November, 2011 Share Posted 24 November, 2011 You've finally met your match when it comes to knowing and doing everything. Yep. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dune Posted 24 November, 2011 Share Posted 24 November, 2011 But then again, what amount has anyone REALLY experienced? I think we have all only seen a narrow portion of what is. Most of what people think and say is based on hearsay and second hand reports. As you get older you gain experience. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saintandy666 Posted 24 November, 2011 Share Posted 24 November, 2011 (edited) As you get older you gain experience. But still... most people have done **** all in the grand scheme of things and only experienced from one narrow perspective. EDIT: And I don't necessarily think age is always necessarily a prerequisite of being 'right'(whatever right means). Otherwise, why would older people form different opinions from each other(back to the experiencing from a narrow perspective perhaps?)? If your attitude is correct, we might as well just get every centurion going and put them in charge of the country now! Edited 24 November, 2011 by Saintandy666 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dune Posted 24 November, 2011 Share Posted 24 November, 2011 But still... most people have done **** all in the grand scheme of things and only experienced from one narrow perspective. Have you been on the space cakes? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saintandy666 Posted 24 November, 2011 Share Posted 24 November, 2011 Have you been on the space cakes? Brilliant. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dune Posted 24 November, 2011 Share Posted 24 November, 2011 Brilliant. Anyway what are you doing on here when your favourite programme is on bbc1? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saintandy666 Posted 24 November, 2011 Share Posted 24 November, 2011 Anyway what are you doing on here when your favourite programme is on bbc1? Multitasking my friend Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brussels Saint Posted 24 November, 2011 Share Posted 24 November, 2011 (edited) When I worked in UK, before the major East European immigration, employers simply could not fill many of the menial low paid jobs. We Brits were typically not interested in being hotel porters, toilet cleaners and factory workers. These jobs were in the vast majority, filled by immigrants, who pay taxes and have a work ethic not seen in a generation by the average Brit. Economically there is little doubt that our immigration has been a big plus (which is why the CBI and all politicians are happy to allow it, despite what they say to satisfy public opinion). Socially however there has no doubt been some negatives, but also many positives (East European totty anyone?) The problem is, its easier for the media to portray the benefit cheating, job stealing, non-culture adapting negative, as its sensational and sells papers, rather than make the more nuanced view of the positive. As I'm now an immigrant myself, I can assure you the continent is also full of economic migrants, aiding the economy or leeching off the state depending on your viewpoint. What is strange is why so many head for the UK also..... generally here in continental Europe the benefits, education and health service are better and should therefore be more attractive to the idle migrant.........is it possible that those willing to work hard, commit to making a positive contribution are better rewarded in the UK than anywhere else....... I think thats something to be proud of and not to actually knock Britian about. When its all said and done as a nation we will always generally welcome those who want to come and work hard and that cannot be said of everywhere. Our national character is why they come, not the generosity of our benefit system. Edited 24 November, 2011 by Brussels Saint Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SuperMikey Posted 24 November, 2011 Share Posted 24 November, 2011 With the points system, doesn't AS levels count as well??? None of my unis do points so not entirely sure, but that's what I was told by someone the other day. They do, but only if you haven't received a full A-level qualification in them. Didn't include them in the post because I couldn't remember the points thresholds... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saintandy666 Posted 24 November, 2011 Share Posted 24 November, 2011 They do, but only if you haven't received a full A-level qualification in them. Didn't include them in the post because I couldn't remember the points thresholds... Fair enough. Here are the tables - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/UCAS_Tariff Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SaintBobby Posted 25 November, 2011 Share Posted 25 November, 2011 I find the whole immigration debate really interesting, but often clouded by nonsense. Anyone who says "sod off, we're full" is just wrong IMHO. The population of the UK has about doubled in 150 years. And we have got much richer in that time. I guess that there may have been general hysteria when the population got to 10m then 20m then 30m etc. The latest horror story is that the population might reach 70m before too long. Good. So far, the more densely populated we've got, the richer we have become. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Turkish Posted 25 November, 2011 Share Posted 25 November, 2011 But then again, what amount has anyone REALLY experienced? I think we have all only seen a narrow portion of what is. Most of what people think and say is based on hearsay and second hand reports. I would suggest people living in parts on London, Birmingham and towns like thus have a much better understanding of the real impact of immigration than some middle class teenager sitting behind his computer screen in his suburban dream. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
saintbletch Posted 25 November, 2011 Share Posted 25 November, 2011 If it was so successful why did that fella at the top have to resign? Good question. Back when the coalition took control and we first started to hear that public spending would be cut, I thought that the obvious consequence of that would be poorer public services. But I heard politician after politician state that they firmly believed that services could be maintained through 'efficiency' savings. This to me was alchemy of the highest order. I naively had thought that if we dramatically slashed people and budget from public services there would be no way that we could maintain the standard of services. I thought that if we cut police budgets dramatically we would ultimately have more undetected crime. Had I thought about it at that time, I would also have assumed that if we cut the border control budgets, we would have less control over our borders. In the specific instance you talk about, I assume Brodie Clark was given the task of achieving immigration alchemy. He was asked to manage the same number of visitors with reduced budgets whist ensuring health and safety standards were met and that aeroplanes and ferries were not waiting an undue amount of time to deliver all the potential illegal immigrants and terrorists to our shores. He had pressure from everywhere and made a difficult choice which has resulted in him apparently being hung out to dry. To be even more specific, he resigned to attempt to stop his name from being sullied further because as a serving civil servant he felt that he was not able to defend himself properly as that would mean criticising the Home Secretary. The Home Secretary apparently had no such qualms as she trashed his reputation in parliament before the results of an investigation into his actions had completed. Whilst I don't know all the facts, Clark should at least win the constructive dismissal claim he has made. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saintandy666 Posted 25 November, 2011 Share Posted 25 November, 2011 I would suggest people living in parts on London, Birmingham and towns like thus have a much better understanding of the real impact of immigration than some middle class teenager sitting behind his computer screen in his suburban dream. A different perspective, yes. Middle class teenager, yes. Suburban dream, no. Sent from my HTC Hero using Tapatalk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sour Mash Posted 25 November, 2011 Share Posted 25 November, 2011 I'm not sure how anyone can argue that there hasn't been too immigration over the last 30 years. Parts of our country, the south-east of England in particular is over populated. Some how this once great nation has got itself into a position whereby it pays huge sections of its settled population to stay at home and not work, while importing vast amounts of cheap transient labour. It's a ridiculous situation and one that's completely unsustainable. The only people that really benefit are the wealthy middle classes out in the suburbs and shires that get the use of cut price plumbers/taxi drivers/child care for their kids. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shurlock Posted 25 November, 2011 Share Posted 25 November, 2011 (edited) Elephant in the room are demographics and an ageing population. All other things being equal, as the working population declines, so growth will slow. To offset this, Government can encourage greater participation of women and the elderly in the workforce and make younger people more productive; another option obviously is to import workers through immigration. Some estimates suggest that in the UK, the immigrant population would have to rise from around 10 percent to 20-25 percent in 2050 to maintain the size of the current workforce. The situation is even worse in places like Italy, Japan, Germany and South Korea where the total number of immigrants would have to rise to 30-40 percent of the population by 2050. The debate is going to get much more lively in the decades ahead; you ain't seen nothing yet. Edited 25 November, 2011 by shurlock Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Window Cleaner Posted 25 November, 2011 Share Posted 25 November, 2011 They do, but only if you haven't received a full A-level qualification in them. Didn't include them in the post because I couldn't remember the points thresholds... I don't believe it, they've actually downgraded what an AS level means. To me an S level is the result of convincing the examiners in a "Special Paper" a prowess of only the brightest and best.Advanced Supplementary became the term I think. Now an AS is just a stage of an eventual (and no doubt very downgraded)A level. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scotty Posted 25 November, 2011 Share Posted 25 November, 2011 D'ya think Tony Blackburn gives guest lectures, he's from Bournemouth isn't he? Noel Edmonds.....did he have a formal study based radio background? Mr Blobby is probably a 3rd year study project. Three of the Worlds Biggest C***s in one post!!!! Way to go, windowcleaner..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buctootim Posted 25 November, 2011 Share Posted 25 November, 2011 Elephant in the room are demographics and an ageing population. All other things being equal, as the working population declines, so growth will slow. To offset this, Government can encourage greater participation of women and the elderly in the workforce and make younger people more productive; another option obviously is to import workers through immigration. Some estimates suggest that in the UK, the immigrant population would have to rise from around 10 percent to 20-25 percent in 2050 to maintain the size of the current workforce. The situation is even worse in places like Italy, Japan, Germany and South Korea where the total number of immigrants would have to rise to 30-40 percent of the population by 2050. The debate is going to get much more lively in the decades ahead; you ain't seen nothing yet. Thats the problem of using growth as the only important metric. Its perfectly possible to have a declining population with gently rising incomes, less overcrowding and cheaper housing. A labour shortage is a good thing as it drives up wages. Increase the pension age by a couple of years and bingo you've got a balanced budget. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saintandy666 Posted 26 November, 2011 Share Posted 26 November, 2011 (edited) I don't believe it, they've actually downgraded what an AS level means. To me an S level is the result of convincing the examiners in a "Special Paper" a prowess of only the brightest and best.Advanced Supplementary became the term I think. Now an AS is just a stage of an eventual (and no doubt very downgraded)A level. In my opinion, I think they should make the A2 year worth more UMS marks than than the AS year, as it is harder. Too many people get A's based on a good AS year while others consistently get A's over the exam periods(2 sets of exams or 4 depending on the subject). Though, on AS being part of a downgrade... lots of people fail at AS and drop out, or at least have a culture shock and fail their first modules. Edited 26 November, 2011 by Saintandy666 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Create an account or sign in to comment
You need to be a member in order to leave a comment
Create an account
Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!
Register a new accountSign in
Already have an account? Sign in here.
Sign In Now