Plastics Or Not?

[Turkish]

Damn ... I own a Ford Focus and was hoping that it was my passport to Uberfandom.

 

I didn't go to see The Man Yoo game ..... so I could still be in with a shout though

 

You will always be an uberfan in my eyes princess xx

[Barry the Badger]

What bizarre logic. You really cannot compare the two. Supporting a footabll team is nothing like choosing between a Ferrari and a Focus!!

 

People say they are Saints fans right? So they are going along to support Southamtpon football club right? So why does it matter who the opposition are? Why were "Saints fans" depserate for Man United tickets but not interested in going to see us play Charlton on the very same day at a cheaper price? It cant be financial reasons. It cant be family commitments. It cant be work reasons. Afterall they'd have those blockers regardless of who we were playing as the matches were due to be played on the very same day. Were they there to see Saints or Man United?

 

No. YOU really cannot compare the two, because you can't get your head around it.

 

Saints vs Charlton - Probable win for the Saints, decent atmosphere, good feeling if we win.

Saints vs Man Utd - Probably defeat for the Saints but an amazing atmosphere and going bloody mental IF we win.

 

If you can't understand why some people would prioritize the latter game, there is little point trying to explain this.

[Turkish]

No. YOU really cannot compare the two, because you can't get your head around it.

 

Saints vs Charlton - Probable win for the Saints, decent atmosphere, good feeling if we win.

Saints vs Man Utd - Probably defeat for the Saints but an amazing atmosphere and going bloody mental IF we win.

 

If you can't understand why some people would prioritize the latter game, there is little point trying to explain this.

 

No i cant understand it. If you are a fan and can afford to and are able to why would the opposition matter? You'd be going regardless.

 

People didn't proritise the Man United game over Charlton. They didn't have to, it wasn't like one was played on a saturday and one the following tuesday and they could only afford/have time for one of them. The fact is 5000 or so extra fans could afford to, didn't have work or family commitments and turned out for a game against a big club that wouldn't have bothered if it had been a league game against a smaller club. Why? Who were they there to see?

[Graffito]

Saints fans, followers, customers. Each can mean something slightly different. All welcome at St Mary's. Whyever not?

[This Charming Man]

We've got a couple of those. A "Man United fanatic" who has been to Old Trafford twice and support consists of watching games on Sky and owning a replica shirt.

 

Now that is one thing that irritates me, getting into work monday morning and the "banter" between fans of big London and northern club who never go but may have seen the highlights on goals on sunday. All the talk of "we" this and "we" that. FFS.

 

That's why I can't watch football in pubs. Full of pub bores who have never bothered to attend a game but give it the biggun in front of a TV screen.

 

I normally have mates trying to wind me up when Saints lose and they all follow someone out of 'The Big 4'. So I've adopted a simple policy, if you don't attend your teams matches on a regular basis, your opinion on all things football related is null and void and any attempts at 'banter' won't even register.

[holepuncture]

We've got a couple of those. A "Man United fanatic" who has been to Old Trafford twice and support consists of watching games on Sky and owning a replica shirt.

 

Now that is one thing that irritates me, getting into work monday morning and the "banter" between fans of big London and northern club who never go but may have seen the highlights on goals on sunday. All the talk of "we" this and "we" that. FFS.[/b[

 

Agree 100%, that is the worst type of 'fan', and utterly clueless... its when they mug off the lower leagues which really irritates me, they dont have a clue... at the local recently a non football fan was asking why we all chose our clubs, mine was pretty straightforward... but f*ck me, when the chelsea fan came out with... "well, my favourite colour is blue" it was a real face palm moment and i no longer consider anything he says worthy of my attention - ****ing plastic JCL ****. The other excuse of 'well all my family supports Spurs, so I chose Arsenal just to annoy them' lame excuse and you can see the vacant, pathetic look in their eyes when they see themselves for what they are...

 

in a strange way the last 5-6-7 years has taught me alot about the game, spending time in league one with the proper supporters, sure we have some who rock up for the 'big name' teams but as other have said,they still come to support the Saints so its all good in my opinion

 

Real Football, Real Fans

[Turkish]

Agree 100%, that is the worst type of 'fan', and utterly clueless... its when they mug off the lower leagues which really irritates me, they dont have a clue... at the local recently a non football fan was asking why we all chose our clubs, mine was pretty straightforward... but f*ck me, when the chelsea fan came out with... "well, my favourite colour is blue" it was a real face palm moment and i no longer consider anything he says worthy of my attention - ****ing plastic JCL ****. The other excuse of 'well all my family supports Spurs, so I chose Arsenal just to annoy them' lame excuse and you can see the vacant, pathetic look in their eyes when they see themselves for what they are...

 

in a strange way the last 5-6-7 years has taught me alot about the game, spending time in league one with the proper supporters, sure we have some who rock up for the 'big name' teams but as other have said,they still come to support the Saints so its all good in my opinion

 

Real Football, Real Fans

 

I met a bloke on holiday who was a Norwich AND Chelsea fan. The reason. He was a Norwich fan originally but when they got relegated to the championship he thought he'd better support a premier league team as well so he chose Chelsea and has supported them both ever since.

 

I work in Reading and we have a few Reading and someone fans as well, in fact the bloke who sits on my bank of desk supports Reading and Liverpool. IMO nothing says i know f*ck all about football than someone who says "i support xxxxx and xxxx" or "i support xxxx and my second team is........."

[John Boy Saint]

Amazing how times change, I can remember being on a waiting list for a Season Ticket when we were at the Dell. At the same time buying tickets on the internet was impossible, phoning up was a chore. I am sure I was not alone in queuing up Milton Rd on a Saturday morning to get a ticket, for a game in 3 weeks time, as a paid up member only to have a Steward come along counting folks getting 2 in front on me saying "cant guarantee you will get a ticket, sorry!!". When the game came you never had the 12,000ish, Season Ticket holders waving their books at the 2000 lucky souls who managed to get a ticket via what was a lottery!

If we had got to a minor glamorless Cup Final at Wembley and 55,000 Saints fans had snapped up every seat available back then no one would have questioned where all those extra folks came from.

 

So here we are today with a ground that can hold more than double what the Dell did, no one has to suffer the upset of getting up on a Saturday morning to stand in the rain outside the Stadium only to have after being there 2 hrs someone counting folks and telling them, despite all the effort, they might not get a ticket. Now you can stroll up to most games at 14:50 in the afternoon and get a ticket.................... but what you run the gauntlet of now is someone, who has been able to acquire enough money and in a position to take every Saturday afternoon off, thinking that because they have a little floppy book they have a licence to mock and abuse those who who do not have said book. It is discrimination akin to the caste system in India, which is even more spiteful than skin colour, as you are picking on your own based on perceived self greatness.

 

Something that has not popped up in any post so far is the attendance at games where just about everyone has the day off like Boxing Day and New Years Day the attendance on those days is always much much higher, New Years Day 2011 over 22,000 folks turned up to see us play Exeter City in league One we had the 4th or 5th highest gate of the day over the 4 leagues, and no disrespect to the Grecians they are not exactly top drawer glamorous crowd pullers.

 

Like I posted elsewhere on a similar subject thread: The message from Nigel Adkins and the the club is Together as one some people really need to take that message on board.

[doddisalegend]

I met a bloke on holiday who was a Norwich AND Chelsea fan. The reason. He was a Norwich fan originally but when they got relegated to the championship he thought he'd better support a premier league team as well so he chose Chelsea and has supported them both ever since.

 

I work in Reading and we have a few Reading and someone fans as well, in fact the bloke who sits on my bank of desk supports Reading and Liverpool. IMO nothing says i know f*ck all about football than someone who says "i support xxxxx and xxxx" or "i support xxxx and my second team is........."

 

I can understand people having a local non-league team for weekends when saints aren't playing or they can't do an away game (though I personally can't be fagged to go to Eastleigh) but two league sides that's a bit wierd.

Edited 11 November, 2011 by doddisalegend

[Barry the Badger]

No i cant understand it. If you are a fan and can afford to and are able to why would the opposition matter? You'd be going regardless.

 

People didn't proritise the Man United game over Charlton. They didn't have to, it wasn't like one was played on a saturday and one the following tuesday and they could only afford/have time for one of them. The fact is 5000 or so extra fans could afford to, didn't have work or family commitments and turned out for a game against a big club that wouldn't have bothered if it had been a league game against a smaller club. Why? Who were they there to see?

 

I'm not saying they directly prioritised it but some people will only have the money/goodwill/time to attend a certain number of games. Certainly when I wasn't lucky enough to have a season ticket this is what I did.

 

Hmmm, I can only really get away with one game this month... so what games do we have...

 

Charlton

Yeovil

Peterborough

Man Utd

Huddersfield

 

Right then, well we do have a great chance of beating Yeovil, but for atmosphere the Man U game will be fantastic to be at, plus if we beat them it will be ****ing amazing. So I will do that one this month.

 

That doesn't mean that for those other games I wasn't listening to the radio, or nervously checking my phone, but if a choice has to be made over a period of time of course people are going to gravitate towards the "big games".

 

I do understand what you're saying, why should it matter, it's always Saints playing. It's great that you have the same level of commitment to every single game, but I would suggest that the vast majority of people would look forward to a game against a team at the top of the league more than a game against a team at the bottom.

 

I really dont get why you find this so hard to understand.

[100%Red&White]

I think our biggest problem is that we haven't encouraged fans to buy season tickets. It's too easy to just pick and choose your games without that commitment, it was different when fans could just roll up on the day and pay at the turnstile but the "hassle" of buying tickets in advance leaves some that "can't be bothered" for lesser games that quickly becomes a habit.

 

So I've got no problem with most fans this applies to, I enjoy my days at SMS far more with packed stands. There's one thing I'd like to see though, the club should paint the block and seat numbers with arrows pointing in the appropriate direction in large on the backboards at the top of each aisle - the West Ham match was a classic case (in the Kingsland North where my ST is) where fans were still piling in 15 minutes after kick-off going up and down aisles looking for their seats. If they could have easily seen what way the numbers run that would have helped.

[John Boy Saint]

There's one thing I'd like to see though, the club should paint the block and seat numbers with arrows pointing in the appropriate direction in large on the backboards at the top of each aisle - the West Ham match was a classic case (in the Kingsland North where my ST is) where fans were still piling in 15 minutes after kick-off going up and down aisles looking for their seats. If they could have easily seen what way the numbers run that would have helped.

 

They have those numbers on the wall alongside the stairs from the concourse, so you would still get the aimless meanderers on the grand tour of the rows, most of these are folks with no sense of direction or awareness of their location. The amount of times we have people at 10 past kick off shuffle along our row to eventually find & take up their seats 4 from the steps on the other side of our block then at 40 minutes past kick off shuffle back across a whole block to get in the beer queue early via the same steps they mistakenly came up beggars belief, as I have said especially when they are only 3 seats away from the nearest steps.

[suewhistle]

We have a support some other teams can only crave. Long may that remain.

 

I live abroad too and get to the games I can, although didn't bother with the early season cup game: finances could be better. But a couple of seasons ago at Christmas I was in a 30k crowd against Exeter. Plastics coming out for _Exeter_, I think not. Finances, opportunity, christmas presents, free time all helped the crowd and made a much better atmosphere. It also allows us more money to spend on players: you do wonder how some clubs manage..

[Turkish]

I live abroad too and get to the games I can, although didn't bother with the early season cup game: finances could be better. But a couple of seasons ago at Christmas I was in a 30k crowd against Exeter. Plastics coming out for _Exeter_, I think not. Finances, opportunity, christmas presents, free time all helped the crowd and made a much better atmosphere. It also allows us more money to spend on players: you do wonder how some clubs manage..

 

A lot of people are missing the point. You were able to go to the Exeter game and chose to because you could, not because of who the oposition were. My point is that 5,000 fans were able to attend the Man United cup game that wouldn't have gone to the Charlton game, a game due to have been played the same day. They could afford it, the Man U game was more expensive. They didn't have work or family commitments, the game was the same day. Clearly they went to the game based on who the opposition were. I dont understand why a Saints fan would do that.

[View From The Top]

That's why I can't watch football in pubs. Full of pub bores who have never bothered to attend a game but give it the biggun in front of a TV screen.

 

I normally have mates trying to wind me up when Saints lose and they all follow someone out of 'The Big 4'. So I've adopted a simple policy, if you don't attend your teams matches on a regular basis, your opinion on all things football related is null and void and any attempts at 'banter' won't even register.

 

You are not alone.

 

My retort is "I only talk football to those who go to games".

[buctootim]

A lot of people are missing the point. You were able to go to the Exeter game and chose to because you could, not because of who the oposition were. My point is that 5,000 fans were able to attend the Man United cup game that wouldn't have gone to the Charlton game, a game due to have been played the same day. They could afford it, the Man U game was more expensive. They didn't have work or family commitments, the game was the same day. Clearly they went to the game based on who the opposition were. I dont understand why a Saints fan would do that.

 

By that reasoning friendly games against Werder Bremen would attract the same support as Eastleigh and all friendly games would get the same attendance as a league game.

 

As it happens when I go to a match alone or with mates I dont think that much about the opposition. If I take my kids I give it a lot of thought - want an almost full stadium, very likely to win, ideally lots of goals - but not too full on charged like a Pompey or Millwall game. I dont know why its so hard to understand that factors like that play a role when you arent just planning for yourself.

[The Kraken]

A lot of people are missing the point. You were able to go to the Exeter game and chose to because you could, not because of who the oposition were. My point is that 5,000 fans were able to attend the Man United cup game that wouldn't have gone to the Charlton game, a game due to have been played the same day. They could afford it, the Man U game was more expensive. They didn't have work or family commitments, the game was the same day. Clearly they went to the game based on who the opposition were. I dont understand why a Saints fan would do that.

 

Do you think this is an condition that applies only to Saints fans, and not to fans of other clubs?

[The Cat]

You are not alone.

 

My retort is "I only talk football to those who go to games".

 

Yep. Cracks me up when I have the misfortune to listen to 606 and people ring up saying "I didn't watch the game but I listenend on the radio and this is my opinion." Zzzzzzz.

 

I'm in full agreement with the people who say you go to watch Saints and it shouldn't matter who the other team are. Reminds me of a cartoon that was in Roy of the Rovers years ago where a fan is at the turnstile asking if he can pay half price because he'd "only come to see the home team."

[Turkish]

Do you think this is an condition that applies only to Saints fans, and not to fans of other clubs?

 

Well no, but we are talking about Saints.

[The Kraken]

Well no, but we are talking about Saints.

 

Clearly. But you're talking about a scenario that happens with pretty much every other club in the country.

 

Take Leeds for example, a club much bigger than us. Last season their home league games saw crowds of anywhere between low 20 thousands to just above 30 thousand. Arsenal went to Elland Road in the FA Cup and the attendance was 38,000, more than 5 thousand higher than any other home game that season. It's just human instinct that a lot of people will be attracted by the standard of opposition.

 

Not saying I agree with it; I've been to far more games in the Championship and League 1 than I ever managed in the Premier League. But for most non die-hard fans it's just a fact that the games against the top sides will be much more appealing.

[trousers]

A lot of people are missing the point. You were able to go to the Exeter game and chose to because you could, not because of who the oposition were. My point is that 5,000 fans were able to attend the Man United cup game that wouldn't have gone to the Charlton game, a game due to have been played the same day. They could afford it, the Man U game was more expensive. They didn't have work or family commitments, the game was the same day. Clearly they went to the game based on who the opposition were. I dont understand why a Saints fan would do that.

 

The good thing is that you don't need to understand them because it doesn't bother you.

 

Why not just be content with the amount of amusement you get out of them?

 

Where would the fun be if these 5,000 people started acting like 'proper' football fans?

[The Mac Attack]

No i cant understand it. If you are a fan and can afford to and are able to why would the opposition matter? You'd be going regardless.

 

People didn't proritise the Man United game over Charlton. They didn't have to, it wasn't like one was played on a saturday and one the following tuesday and they could only afford/have time for one of them. The fact is 5000 or so extra fans could afford to, didn't have work or family commitments and turned out for a game against a big club that wouldn't have bothered if it had been a league game against a smaller club. Why? Who were they there to see?

 

Turkish, are you on the autistic spectrum?

 

(apologies to anyone with one with autism for the association)

[trousers]

Can someone help me out here....

 

I've just started to plan which games I can make in the new year and I've worked out that I've got enough spare time and budget to attend one home game in January with my 12 year old son.

 

The January home fixtures are thus:

 

23rd Jan - Leicester

31st Jan - Cardiff

 

I suppose I could simply toss a coin as my other non-football committments in January aren't tied to a specific date, so I can make either game logistically.

 

My instinct is to go for the game that I feel will be the most entertaining. I'm thinking perhaps the team that is closer to us at the time would make the better game.

 

But, of course, there's an added complication in my choice of game.....it's FA Cup 3rd round on 7th January. Maybe I should wait for the FA Cup draw and if we get Everton at home I could see if my brother (Everton fan) would like to make a day out of it with his son. I'm sure my son would like the chance to see a Premier League side at St Mary's too.

 

So, what should I do?

 

(a) go to one of the league games. Doesn't matter which, just choose one at random

(b) go to one of the league games. Choose the one that looks like being the most closely fought.

© go to one of the league games. Choose the one that looks like being the easiest for Saints to win

(d) hold out for the cup game. Go to that with your brother if we draw Everton at home

(e) hold out for the cup game. Still go to that if we draw a 'glamour' side as it will be a good experience for your son

 

Choices, choices....

[buctootim]

Can someone help me out here....

 

I've just started to plan which games I can make in the new year and I've worked out that I've got enough spare time and budget to attend one home game in January with my 12 year old son.

 

The January home fixtures are thus:

 

23rd Jan - Leicester

31st Jan - Cardiff

 

I suppose I could simply toss a coin as my other non-football committments in January aren't tied to a specific date, so I can make either game logistically.

 

My instinct is to go for the game that I feel will be the most entertaining. I'm thinking perhaps the team that is closer to us at the time would make the better game.

 

But, of course, there's an added complication in my choice of game.....it's FA Cup 3rd round on 7th January. Maybe I should wait for the FA Cup draw and if we get Everton at home I could see if my brother (Everton fan) would like to make a day out of it with his son. I'm sure my son would like the chance to see a Premier League side at St Mary's too.

 

So, what should I do?

 

(a) go to one of the league games. Doesn't matter which, just choose one at random

(b) go to one of the league games. Choose the one that looks like being the most closely fought.

© go to one of the league games. Choose the one that looks like being the easiest for Saints to win

(d) hold out for the cup game. Go to that with your brother if we draw Everton at home

(e) hold out for the cup game. Still go to that if we draw a 'glamour' side as it will be a good experience for your son

 

Choices, choices....

 

Drop Turkish a pm. He'll give you a well thought out recommendation.

[Turkish]

Clearly. But you're talking about a scenario that happens with pretty much every other club in the country.

 

Take Leeds for example, a club much bigger than us. Last season their home league games saw crowds of anywhere between low 20 thousands to just above 30 thousand. Arsenal went to Elland Road in the FA Cup and the attendance was 38,000, more than 5 thousand higher than any other home game that season. It's just human instinct that a lot of people will be attracted by the standard of opposition.

 

Not saying I agree with it; I've been to far more games in the Championship and League 1 than I ever managed in the Premier League. But for most non die-hard fans it's just a fact that the games against the top sides will be much more appealing.

 

And that is the point. Who are they there to watch? If they are attracted by the standard of the opposition then they are plastic fans.

[Turkish]

Turkish, are you on the autistic spectrum?

 

(apologies to anyone with one with autism for the association)

 

And so the personal insults start. Well done you. Great contribution to the discussion.

Edited 11 November, 2011 by Turkish

[Turkish]

Can someone help me out here....

 

I've just started to plan which games I can make in the new year and I've worked out that I've got enough spare time and budget to attend one home game in January with my 12 year old son.

 

The January home fixtures are thus:

 

23rd Jan - Leicester

31st Jan - Cardiff

 

I suppose I could simply toss a coin as my other non-football committments in January aren't tied to a specific date, so I can make either game logistically.

 

My instinct is to go for the game that I feel will be the most entertaining. I'm thinking perhaps the team that is closer to us at the time would make the better game.

 

But, of course, there's an added complication in my choice of game.....it's FA Cup 3rd round on 7th January. Maybe I should wait for the FA Cup draw and if we get Everton at home I could see if my brother (Everton fan) would like to make a day out of it with his son. I'm sure my son would like the chance to see a Premier League side at St Mary's too.

 

So, what should I do?

 

(a) go to one of the league games. Doesn't matter which, just choose one at random

(b) go to one of the league games. Choose the one that looks like being the most closely fought.

© go to one of the league games. Choose the one that looks like being the easiest for Saints to win

(d) hold out for the cup game. Go to that with your brother if we draw Everton at home

(e) hold out for the cup game. Still go to that if we draw a 'glamour' side as it will be a good experience for your son

 

Choices, choices....

 

Seeing as how the Leciester game is on TV and is on a monday night and you have a young son who needs his sleep for his education then i'd go for the Cardiff one.

[trousers]

Seeing as how the Leciester game is on TV and is on a monday night and you have a young son who needs his sleep for his education then i'd go for the Cardiff one.

 

He's got an inset day after each league game....Cardiff is an evening game too, as all proper fans would realise... ;-) , so no problems on that front.

 

We also don't have Sky so that's not an option either.

[shurlock]

It's rather amusing to see so many 'on their high horse' because they assume they are being criticized when they have perfectly valid and understandable reasons for not attending games very often - be it living far away, serving on a ship, or even just being plain broke for example. Only a fool would presume to criticize anybody who falls into that kind of category and this season ticket waving business is pure folly.

 

But lets face it we had 32k in St Marys when we were in the PL and around half that number disappeared pretty damn quick as soon as the glamour of top flight football had departed. I don't personally believe that all the missing 15k 'fans' suddenly emigrated, joined the navy, or lost their job back in May 2005. Now its a free(ish) country and people can spend their money as they will, if they didn't choose to stick by the club in its hour of need then that is their business. But are those who will only opt to return now that we being successful the moral equal of the fans who were there supporting this great club when we were bottom on L1 on minus 10 points ?

 

Well 'No' would be my answer.

 

Don't know if its a moral thing. Am not interested in broadcasting my attendance or judging others. I take more than enough satisfaction from going to games and knowing that I was there when times were difficult and am now witnessing the recovery. What others do is irrelevant.

 

Where I draw the line is when people who don't go to games want to have their cake and eat it. Avoid telling me to sit down when I have been used to standing up etc and don't try and shove your views down my throat. Those people are typically the exception but they exist; other than that, I'm a generally live and let live kind of fan

[Turkish]

He's got an inset day after each league game....Cardiff is an evening game too, as all proper fans would realise... ;-) , so no problems on that front.

 

We also don't have Sky so that's not an option either.

 

Flip a coin then. You never know your luck though, we might get a big cup draw and then the decision will be made for you.

[trousers]

Flip a coin then. You never know your luck though, we might get a big cup draw and then the decision will be made for you.

 

Yeah, I think you're right. A glamour draw in the cup would tick a lot of boxes. I get to see my beloved Saints play with the added bonus of potentially seeing us pit our wits against some premier league players.

 

Cheers for the advice. Appreciated.

[The Mac Attack]

And so the personal insults start. Well done you. Great contribution to the discussion.

 

Thanks!!

[pap]

And that is the point. Who are they there to watch? If they are attracted by the standard of the opposition then they are plastic fans.

 

How's about they're attracted by the prospect of seeing Saints beat decent opposition?

 

If you were going to a boxing match, would you rather see the champ up against another decent fighter, or a resident of a local OAP home? I'm sure there are boxing purists out there saying "I was there when Tyson decked every old biddy in Portswood", but most people, given the choice, especially if that choice doesn't come around too often, would prefer to see a good contest.

[ericb]

or a resident of a local OAP home?

 

Depends i'd pay good money to see Harry Redknapp knocked out

[Special K]

Why do people feel the need to justify their support? Just chose whichever way you want to support the Saints and don't listen to the Ubertools who reckon you're a plastic fan if you don't go to every game.

[shurlock]

As long as we're pushing for promotion, league games are infinitely more important than any cup game regardless the opposition -and should thus be more attractive to a saints fan.

[djharvey]

Flip a coin then. You never know your luck though, we might get a big cup draw and then the decision will be made for you.

 

Yeah, and then you could slag him off for being a plastic fan eh!

[The Cat]

We also don't have Sky so that's not an option either.

 

But you have a computer so, as our oversees fans will testify, a stream will be available. I'd say watch the Leicester game on your pc and come to the Cardiff match.

[CHAPEL END CHARLIE]

Don't know if its a moral thing. Am not interested in broadcasting my attendance or judging others. I take more than enough satisfaction from going to games and knowing that I was there when times were difficult and am now witnessing the recovery. What others do is irrelevant.

 

Where I draw the line is when people who don't go to games want to have their cake and eat it. Avoid telling me to sit down when I have been used to standing up etc and don't try and shove your views down my throat. Those people are typically the exception but they exist; other than that, I'm a generally live and let live kind of fan

 

Live and let live ?

 

I'm all for that, and when it comes to filling St Mary's it really is a case of 'the more the merrier' as far as I'm concerned. But should we be so mired in relativism that we've become afraid of passing any form of moral judgment, so fearful that we render ourselves effectively mute about virtually everything contentious ? 'Walk a mile in a another mans shoes before judging him' they say, but I'm not so sure this matter is all that difficult a moral question is it ?

Hackneyed old cliche it may be, but the English language truly is a wonderful thing. The usage of the word 'Fan' (derived from 'Fanatic' of course) in relation to supporting a football club is particularly telling:

 

fanatic (n) An insane person, mad, furious, enthusiastic, inspired by a god, pertaining to a temple

 

So for my money to even call yourself a true football 'fan' then I think you have to recognize at least a smidgen of your own attitude towards our grand old club in the above definition. Without wishing to antagonize anyone, I can't really see how those who abandoned this club, those who were in a position to support this club, but chose not to, the missing 10,000 if you like, can even describe themselves as 'fans' as I understand the term. If you are only going to come to St Marys again because we are winning football matches more often and the prospect of Premier League football returning is on the horizon then welcome back .... but lets be quite clear about this, you're not a fan, you're a customer.

[dubai_phil]

Oh well, another argument that neither side will ever listen to.

 

Still the uber's can console themselves by taking up the well known refrain before Away fans in the PL do....

 

"Where were you when we/you were sh1t?"

 

Strangely, this season I know two people who have had to reduce their attendance at games. One is a manager who has been with a Council for 10 years. He kept his job in the re-orgs & cut backs BUT at age 53 he was told quite simply - 30% pay cut or redundancy. But as he was a nasty Manager he had no Union support.

 

Another mate was kicked out his flat because "The Landlord was returning from overseas" (did he hell he just re-let it at 20% more).

 

Having had no pay rise for the past two years (because of the economy) his rent has gone up and he now struggles.

 

There's a recession on. It is hurting good Saints fans.

 

Will he go see us play Donny? Or will he be at WHU?

 

Anyone who thinks money doesn't come into it - well I actually REALLY hope you get a shock in your life really soon like so many others have done.

 

(Oh & I'm going Saturday not because it's Brighton, simply because it's the only weekend I can get away from here before Xmas. I could have saved about 100 quid coming midweek this week and grief from future Mrs D_P but no, I want to see us play. Sorry I'm a plastic)

[Turkish]

How's about they're attracted by the prospect of seeing Saints beat decent opposition?

 

If you were going to a boxing match, would you rather see the champ up against another decent fighter, or a resident of a local OAP home? I'm sure there are boxing purists out there saying "I was there when Tyson decked every old biddy in Portswood", but most people, given the choice, especially if that choice doesn't come around too often, would prefer to see a good contest.

 

Again an absurd comparison. Top class boxers fight once every six months or so against other top class fighters, football trams in This league play 46 times a season plus cup games.

 

Once again you prove the point by your "going to see saints against a decent oposition" comment that people will choose to go depending on who the other team is.Why? They are meant to be saints fans.

Edited 11 November, 2011 by Turkish

[sandwichsaint]

Looks like we are all barking up the wrong tree - clearly what we need is a ground reduction.

 

Saints have a hard core of uber fans, like all clubs I guess; a Dover fan has just clocked up 1000 consecutive games, home and away, pre-season friendlies and testimonials included, everything! Fifteen years of his life, and God knows how much wonga, he'll never get back. 'Sad loser' or 'paragon of fandom'? You decide....

 

Lets reduce SMS to 24k, pack out the corporates at premium prices, fleece the STs for another 30%, and sell walk-up tkts at 40GBP, but only when the oppo don't want them at 35 pounds a pop.

 

Job done; revenues are similar, the club can save on stewards, bar servers, policing and all the rest. The club gets to play in front of a 24k 'sell out' crowd every week. What more could anybody want - the plastics can all go shopping on a Saturday and real men can all go to the footie.

 

What could go wrong?

[Turkish]

And this is the other problem. Those that stuck by the club through hard times are now "uberfans" like its the modern day leprosy. personally I say hats off to those that stood by the club for sh*t games when we were being relegated to L1 then on minus 10 points. The club is built on those sort of fans. Those that go when times are hard.

[TheCholulaKid]

Again an absurd comparison. Top class boxers fight once every six months or so against other top class fighters, football trams in This league play 46 times a season plus cup games.

 

Once again you prove the point by your "going to see saints against a decent oposition" comment that people will choose to go depending on who the other team is.Why? They are meant to be saints fans.

 

Zzzzzzzzz......seriously, give it a rest. Who gives a **** if some fans are so-called 'plastic'? Why does it bother you so much?

[The Kraken]

And this is the other problem. Those that stuck by the club through hard times are now "uberfans" like its the modern day leprosy. personally I say hats off to those that stood by the club for sh*t games when we were being relegated to L1 then on minus 10 points. The club is built on those sort of fans. Those that go when times are hard.

 

I'm really not sure where you're going with this tirade, other than a bit of spouting off against the trends of human nature. As I said earlier, and stiil stand by:

 

Take Leeds for example, a club much bigger than us. Last season their home league games saw crowds of anywhere between low 20 thousands to just above 30 thousand. Arsenal went to Elland Road in the FA Cup and the attendance was 38,000, more than 5 thousand higher than any other home game that season. It's just human instinct that a lot of people will be attracted by the standard of opposition.

 

I don't see a revolution rising up to moan about how terrible the Leeds support is for only numbering up for the bigger games; so I personally don't see a problme with us.

 

I'm intrigued; do you feel this way for all games to do with Saints? Like why we only got seven thousand odd for League cup games? It's kind of the same principle.

[View From The Top]

Do I feel superior as a fan who had a season ticket when in League 1 to those who rock up to the "big" games? Fu ck yes.

 

Am I bothered in the slightest that they weren't there? Fu ck no.

 

Their loss.

[The Kraken]

Do I feel superior as a fan who had a season ticket when in League 1 to those who rock up to the "big" games? Fu ck yes.[/quoTE]

 

Apologies, but I find that statement thoroughly laughable that you rank yourself as a fan better than any other. Grading yourself as a fan and posturing over others is exactly what leads to this "uber-fan" bullsh*t.

 

Been to more games than others? Yes. Better fan? Do me a favour. It's a choice of terminology but, IMO, a p*ss poor one. A fan is fan in my eyes. There's more loyal ones than others, for sure, but certainly not better ones.

[dubai_phil]

And this is the other problem. Those that stuck by the club through hard times are now "uberfans" like its the modern day leprosy. personally I say hats off to those that stood by the club for sh*t games when we were being relegated to L1 then on minus 10 points. The club is built on those sort of fans. Those that go when times are hard.

 

Yes, but by your own logic, those like my mates who didn't miss a home game in L1 but have real money troubles this year and can't make every game will then be called plastics when we get promoted or they sort out their finances by ctually finding new jobs.

[View From The Top]

Apologies, but I find that statement thoroughly laughable that you rank yourself as a fan better than any other. Grading yourself as a fan and posturing over others is exactly what leads to this "uber-fan" bullsh*t.

 

Been to more games than others? Yes. Better fan? Do me a favour. It's a choice of terminology but, IMO, a p*ss poor one. A fan is fan in my eyes. There's more loyal ones than others, for sure, but certainly not better ones.

 

Apologies, but I don't give a shiny sh*t what you think but I accept your choice on language regarding "better" and "loyal".

[Turkish]

Yes, but by your own logic, those like my mates who didn't miss a home game in L1 but have real money troubles this year and can't make every game will then be called plastics when we get promoted or they sort out their finances by ctually finding new jobs.

 

I don't doubt like your mate there will be some genuine cases. But not 8000-10000 fans that in the premier league had no problem but now can't afford too or are too busy with work and family stuff to go to games.