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Goalie66
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He makes the walk along the canal sound like something from a Turner landscape :?

 

Nice touch but lets just to say its always easier to be magnanimous when times are good. And the skate remark is bizarre.

Edited by shurlock
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Was well received by their fans as well. You do feel that Coventry are a club in dispair, having been there ourselves not so very long ago I can only wish them well. Hopefully they will find Markus Liebherr mk2, then again maybe not - there is only one ML..!

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Strange that he can't get the history of his own club right though. Makes it sounds as though the Swiss only came on the scene at the very end when they have publicly stated they came over as soon as the club was available and put a bid on the table. It wasn't accepted because the administrator wanted more, and he only went back to them when he realised it was the only genuine offer he had on the table.

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Nice to see one of ours appear on an opposition site and appear eloquent and not in search on winding them up and taking the p*ss.

 

But I think he does gloss over our takeover a little, as if administration is a definite answer. It isn't. We should never, ever forget that we got massively lucky by being taken over by a billionaire. The Pinnacle debacle highlights the chancers that are out there; there was absolutely no guarantee we would get new owners as good as the ones we have. Look at that lot down the road, they've been in admin a couple of times and have a rag tag collection of crooks and shady characters in control of them. Of course, Coventry have far better facilities than them, but not having ownership of the stadium is a massive disadvantage to them.

 

Administration doesn't always bring the owners you hope for; it's a roll of the dice and is no guarantee of an upturn in fortunes.

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This is interesting :

 

"My message to our Sky Blue brothers and sisters in the footballing community is that good things really can come from administration. You have awesome facilities, a pedigree history and a solid fan base (albeit hibernating). Get rid of these corporate muppets, take the -10 points and have faith that someone - some INDIVIDUAL - will come along and be your saviour just as the late Herr Liebherr was for us. And if it comes to pass that you do play in division three next season, it is not the end of the world. It really isn't. It is still football, still entertaining and think of all those grounds which you haven't been to in yonks!"

 

*smug mode* to all those who saw admin as the end of the world and were extremely abusive to those of us who saw it as the clubs best chance to make it back to the good times

Edited by alpine_saint
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This is interesting :

 

"My message to our Sky Blue brothers and sisters in the footballing community is that good things really can come from administration. You have awesome facilities, a pedigree history and a solid fan base (albeit hibernating). Get rid of these corporate muppets, take the -10 points and have faith that someone - some INDIVIDUAL - will come along and be your saviour just as the late Herr Liebherr was for us. And if it comes to pass that you do play in division three next season, it is not the end of the world. It really isn't. It is still football, still entertaining and think of all those grounds which you haven't been to in yonks!"

 

*smug mode* to all those who saw admin as the end of the world and were extremely abusive to those of us who saw it as the clubs best chance to make it back to the good times

 

The joy of hindsight as others have posted we got very lucky, things could have been a lot different.

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The joy of hindsight as others have posted we got very lucky, things could have been a lot different.

 

It was hindsight in respect of the fact we "got lucky" with Mr Liebherr buying us, but I would argue there was a fair element of foresight too from those of us who didn't sign up to the "avoid administration at all costs" camp.

 

Yes, it was a big hunch that going into Administration would be the best thing for the club in the long run, but our instinct was that whatever happened as a result it couldn't be worse than the situation we were in before administration (boardroom infighting etc).

 

Even if Mr Liebherr hadn't come along we would still have had a phoenix club to support in a lower league and that, in my opinion, is better than what we had towards the end of the 'three amigos' era.

 

So, yes, an element of hindsight given we ended up with the 'best case scenario' but an equal element of foresight too.

Edited by trousers
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It wasn't smug and patronising, it was magnamimous. But no surprise that you find it difficult to give any credit to somebody saying nice things about others. Most on here and on their forum thought that it was a nice piece and welcomed it.

 

TBF, I think Alpine was saying that HE had gone into 'smug mode' as he had predicted admin as being our best option, NOT that SympatheticSaint had made a smug post on the Cov website !

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TBF, I think Alpine was saying that HE had gone into 'smug mode' as he had predicted admin as being our best option, NOT that SympatheticSaint had made a smug post on the Cov website !

 

My response was to Sour Mash, not Alpine. I know that Alpine predicted that admin was our best option and it was an opinion that I shared at the time.

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It was hindsight in respect of the fact we "got lucky" with Mr Liebherr buying us, but I would argue there was a fair element of foresight too from those of us who didn't sign up to the "avoid administration at all costs" camp.

 

Yes, it was a big hunch that going into Administration would be the best thing for the club in the long run, but our instinct was that whatever happened as a result it couldn't be worse than the situation we were in before administration (boardroom infighting etc).

 

Even if Mr Liebherr hadn't come along we would still have had a phoenix club to support in a lower league and that, in my opinion, is better than what we had towards the end of the 'three amigos'.

 

So, yes, an element of hindsight given we ended up with the 'best case scenario' but an equal element of foresight too.

 

Foresight suggests you could have predicted the outcome... you are right in suggesting a 'pheonix' like club would always have been an option, but for many this was NOT somthing they would have been happy with. Even if it meant continued baord room turmoil.

 

I still find it exasperating how some 'blessed with hindsight' feel that it was better - that some how the arrival of ML was preordained - when the reality is we were very very lucky - and we should also acknowledge that our 'luck' was in no small part generated (ironically) by the very things so many (the same who had these amazing chrystal balls) moaned about on here and previous forums for years - the investment in the infrastructure and academy instead of first team... we had that ad infinitum, yet it should be obvious that those things being in place made us 'worth a punt' for Markus' 'modest investment'.

 

We were also ant attrctaive proposition because we only had two main creditors to deal with - Aviva and Barclays - everyone else includig HMRC had been paid, and this was a direct result of the clubs various board room members striving to run teh club financially in teh right way (even with Leon's slight rush of blood to the head) overall none of them went mad with teh pursestrings, and in our final PLC season, we cut eveything back to the bare minimum to avoid doing a pompey and racking up more debt and dbt and debt with no intenstion of paying it back... we should be proud of that.

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It was hindsight in respect of the fact we "got lucky" with Mr Liebherr buying us, but I would argue there was a fair element of foresight too from those of us who didn't sign up to the "avoid administration at all costs" camp.

 

Yes, it was a big hunch that going into Administration would be the best thing for the club in the long run, but our instinct was that whatever happened as a result it couldn't be worse than the situation we were in before administration (boardroom infighting etc).

 

Even if Mr Liebherr hadn't come along we would still have had a phoenix club to support in a lower league and that, in my opinion, is better than what we had towards the end of the 'three amigos'.

 

So, yes, an element of hindsight given we ended up with the 'best case scenario' but an equal element of foresight too.

 

My position entirely. The risk was entirely worth taking to rid ourselves of the parasites and charlatans dating back to the reverse takeover. We were a good proposition in terms of the price to buy us and the infrastructure we had in place. Where we got really lucky beyond our expectations was with Markus Liebherr and Nicola Cortese.

 

Looking back historically though, we might equally have been better off a decade or more ago when the old Askham board showed undue haste to go for the reverse takeover (which considerably enriched them), when it was rumoured that there were at least two other consortia sniffing around as well. Frankly, I'm extremely happy at the turn of events since our administration and the fact that the old board shareholders and Lowe and Co lost their loot when the shares became worthless is a bonus. I feel for the smaller fan shareholders who lost their money, (of which I was one), but it is a price I gladly pay to have our current situation.

 

I'm glad that at least we didn't get into bed with SISU and would like to know the background as to how Ken Dulieu became their Chairman. That smells a bit.

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Foresight suggests you could have predicted the outcome

 

A doctor who decides to amputate a diseased limb is showing a similar level of foresight. He ultimately doesn't know what the overall outcome will be but his instinct and experience tells him that the amputation is more likely to save someone's life than try and treat the diseased limb in situ.

 

Yes, none of us knew what the final outcome would be, we simply had an instinctual hunch that it was the best way forward.

 

I simply don't see that as 100% hindsight per se.

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Foresight suggests you could have predicted the outcome... you are right in suggesting a 'pheonix' like club would always have been an option, but for many this was NOT somthing they would have been happy with. Even if it meant continued baord room turmoil.

 

I still find it exasperating how some 'blessed with hindsight' feel that it was better - that some how the arrival of ML was preordained - when the reality is we were very very lucky - and we should also acknowledge that our 'luck' was in no small part generated (ironically) by the very things so many (the same who had these amazing chrystal balls) moaned about on here and previous forums for years - the investment in the infrastructure and academy instead of first team... we had that ad infinitum, yet it should be obvious that those things being in place made us 'worth a punt' for Markus' 'modest investment'.

 

We were also ant attrctaive proposition because we only had two main creditors to deal with - Aviva and Barclays - everyone else includig HMRC had been paid, and this was a direct result of the clubs various board room members striving to run teh club financially in teh right way (even with Leon's slight rush of blood to the head) overall none of them went mad with teh pursestrings, and in our final PLC season, we cut eveything back to the bare minimum to avoid doing a pompey and racking up more debt and dbt and debt with no intenstion of paying it back... we should be proud of that.

 

Good summing up.

 

I'm glad some where so confident that Admin would work out this well for us, I didn't feel it at the time though only a fool would argue it hasn't.

 

Interesting list of clubs in Admin from the 80s below not to many of them setting the world alight these days. In hindsight we were probably one of the most attractive clubs on that list but it didn't feel like that at the time to me (just look at stockport who went into admin a few months after us).

 

Charlton 1984

Middlesbrough 1986

Tranmere 1987

Newport County 1989

Walsall 1990

Northampton 1992

Kettering 1992

Aldershot 1992

Maidstone 1992

Hartlepool 1994

Barnet 1994

Exeter 1994, 2003

Gillingham 1995

Doncaster 1997

Millwall 1997

Bournemouth 1997, 2008

Darlington 1997, 2009

Chester 1998, 2009

Hereford 1998

Portsmouth 1999, 2010

Crystal Palace 1999, 2010

Oxford Utd 1999

Barrow 1999

Swindon 2000, 2002

Scarborough 2000

Hull 2001

QPR 2001

Chesterfield 2001

Leicester 2002

Barnsley 2002

Carlisle 2002

Notts County 2002

Bury 2002

Bradford 2002

Port Vale 2002

Lincoln City 2002

Swansea City 2002

York 2002

Halifax Town 2002, 2008

Derby 2003

Ipswich 2003

Huddersfield 2003

Oldham 2003

MK Dons 2003

Wimbledon 2003

Wrexham 2004

Cambridge 2005

Crawley Town 2006

Rotherham 2006, 2008

Leeds United 2007

Boston United 2007

Southampton 2008

Luton 2008

Stockport 2009

Salisbury 2009

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My position entirely. The risk was entirely worth taking to rid ourselves of the parasites and charlatans dating back to the reverse takeover. We were a good proposition in terms of the price to buy us and the infrastructure we had in place. Where we got really lucky beyond our expectations was with Markus Liebherr and Nicola Cortese.

 

You make it sound as if it were a simple option we had up our sleeve; that's not quite how administration worked for us. We were placed into administration at the behest of the bank when they deemed we could no longer sustain paying back our overdraft facility.

 

I'm glad that at least we didn't get into bed with SISU and would like to know the background as to how Ken Dulieu became their Chairman. That smells a bit.

 

Given that you recognise how much worse off we would/could have been with SISU, does it not highlight the potential pitfalls of administration, and who your club can end up being owned by? as you say, we got extremely lucky with the owners we ended up with; but I really wouldn't care to speculate just how bad it could have been instead.

 

Administration was always going to be a massive gamble. Yes, we were very attractive to a well-intentioned investor; but we were also very attractive to any old punter looking for a quick way to make money. And the job of the administrator is to find the best deal for the creditors, not for the football club and it's future endeavours. History does tell us that, in many cases, clubs have entered administration and (after the initial setbacks) come out much stronger. But there are also clubs that have actually come off worse from adminsitration too; that could have happened to us too.

 

The likelihood was that administration was going to be the best option to us, but I don't think I'd have massive issue with anyone who didn't just assume everything would be fine and approached the whole scenario with a good deal of trepidation.

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You make it sound as if it were a simple option we had up our sleeve; that's not quite how administration worked for us. We were placed into administration at the behest of the bank when they deemed we could no longer sustain paying back our overdraft facility.

 

Given that you recognise how much worse off we would/could have been with SISU, does it not highlight the potential pitfalls of administration, and who your club can end up being owned by? as you say, we got extremely lucky with the owners we ended up with; but I really wouldn't care to speculate just how bad it could have been instead.

 

Administration was always going to be a massive gamble. Yes, we were very attractive to a well-intentioned investor; but we were also very attractive to any old punter looking for a quick way to make money. And the job of the administrator is to find the best deal for the creditors, not for the football club and it's future endeavours. History does tell us that, in many cases, clubs have entered administration and (after the initial setbacks) come out much stronger. But there are also clubs that have actually come off worse from adminsitration too; that could have happened to us too.

 

The likelihood was that administration was going to be the best option to us, but I don't think I'd have massive issue with anyone who didn't just assume everything would be fine and approached the whole scenario with a good deal of trepidation.

 

It wasn't quite like that. The bank withdrew our overdraft facility, but not before they reduced the level of it, as I recall. And in the same way that it is curious how the Barclays bank manager who pulled the plug on us ended up as a partner in the company that dealt with our administration, is it too much of a coincidence also that Ken Dulieu, who was our Chairman at the time of the approach of SISU, now happens to be Chairman of the Club that SISU took over instead of us?

 

Yes, administration was a gamble, one that happily paid off for us beyond our wildest expectations. But where there was a break-even attendance figure that would have allowed the club to have stumbled on, perhaps indefinitely, there was certainly a sizeable element of the fan base, (me included), who effectively precipitated the administration by boycotting the Lowe/Wilde regime and taking the attendance levels below that break-even figure. I suspect that most were intelligent enough to realise that we might end up in a worse situation, but most thought that the gamble was worth taking to rid the club of Lowe/Askham/Wilde/Richardson and all those other parasites who had dragged us down to that level. Eventually, the club reached the stage that any potential investor/s realised that rather than put money in to save us from administration, it was a far better proposition to wait for us to go under, to pick us up at a bargain basement price. With the infrastructure we had, the stadium and other assets, I was fairly confident that we would be pounced upon by somebody better than those who ran the club before administration. Even the Skates with their delapidated old stadium and no infrastructure at all have attracted buyers. But ours were like bees attracted to the honey pot, whereas they were akin to a pile of **** attracting the flies, or rats actually boarding the sinking ship.

 

Thank God that we avoided the dross that is attracted to the cesspit down the road. But they got the owners they deserve, whereas I was confident that we didn't deserve worse than the Lowe regime and so the situation with us would improve.

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Wes, don't get me wrong I'm with you, I always thought it was more likely than not that we'd emerge from administration in better shape than before; and given the massively concerted efforts of a very significant portion of the fanbase in previously trying to get rid of Lowe, then a lot of supporters couldn't really try to claim the higher ground if it did go t*ts up.

 

But even despite that, while I of course fully accepted that administration was the only realistic avenue for us to take, I'd be lying if I said I saw it as anything but a huge gamble with who we'd end up with in charge. And like you say, thank God we avoided the chancers and charlatans and emerged with the real deal.

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The joy of hindsight as others have posted we got very lucky, things could have been a lot different.

 

Nope, not hindsight. You are assuming that all things are equal between our administration case and that of other clubs, such as those you have pedantically listed further on.

 

Saints had a reasonable team (albeit demoralised), a first-class ground, first-calss training facilities, and a first-class academy. We were an attractive investiment once inflated egos, Walter Mitty-ness and p*ss-poor managment were taken out of the equation.

 

How the f**k can you seriously compare us to the likes of Bury, Halifax and Scarborough ???

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My position entirely. The risk was entirely worth taking to rid ourselves of the parasites and charlatans dating back to the reverse takeover. We were a good proposition in terms of the price to buy us and the infrastructure we had in place. Where we got really lucky beyond our expectations was with Markus Liebherr and Nicola Cortese.

 

Looking back historically though, we might equally have been better off a decade or more ago when the old Askham board showed undue haste to go for the reverse takeover (which considerably enriched them), when it was rumoured that there were at least two other consortia sniffing around as well. Frankly, I'm extremely happy at the turn of events since our administration and the fact that the old board shareholders and Lowe and Co lost their loot when the shares became worthless is a bonus. I feel for the smaller fan shareholders who lost their money, (of which I was one), but it is a price I gladly pay to have our current situation.

 

 

Good post. I completely agree.

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Nope, not hindsight. You are assuming that all things are equal between our administration case and that of other clubs, such as those you have pedantically listed further on.

 

Saints had a reasonable team (albeit demoralised), a first-class ground, first-calss training facilities, and a first-class academy. We were an attractive investiment once inflated egos, Walter Mitty-ness and p*ss-poor managment were taken out of the equation.

 

How the f**k can you seriously compare us to the likes of Bury, Halifax and Scarborough ???

 

Alps, come off it... we had a reasonable team? Our squad was absolutely pony and I am shocked by your naivety if you seriously think administration is guaranteed as a good thing. We got lucky. Very lucky. That Fialka bloke was a bank statement away from taking over at the club and there wouldn't have been a thing Liebherr could have done about it.

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Good summing up.

 

I'm glad some where so confident that Admin would work out this well for us, I didn't feel it at the time though only a fool would argue it hasn't.

 

Interesting list of clubs in Admin from the 80s below not to many of them setting the world alight these days. In hindsight we were probably one of the most attractive clubs on that list but it didn't feel like that at the time to me (just look at stockport who went into admin a few months after us).

 

Charlton 1984

Middlesbrough 1986

Tranmere 1987

Newport County 1989

Walsall 1990

Northampton 1992

Kettering 1992

Aldershot 1992

Maidstone 1992

Hartlepool 1994

Barnet 1994

Exeter 1994, 2003

Gillingham 1995

Doncaster 1997

Millwall 1997

Bournemouth 1997, 2008

Darlington 1997, 2009

Chester 1998, 2009

Hereford 1998

Portsmouth 1999, 2010

Crystal Palace 1999, 2010

Oxford Utd 1999

Barrow 1999

Swindon 2000, 2002

Scarborough 2000

Hull 2001

QPR 2001

Chesterfield 2001

Leicester 2002

Barnsley 2002

Carlisle 2002

Notts County 2002

Bury 2002

Bradford 2002

Port Vale 2002

Lincoln City 2002

Swansea City 2002

York 2002

Halifax Town 2002, 2008

Derby 2003

Ipswich 2003

Huddersfield 2003

Oldham 2003

MK Dons 2003

Wimbledon 2003

Wrexham 2004

Cambridge 2005

Crawley Town 2006

Rotherham 2006, 2008

Leeds United 2007

Boston United 2007

Southampton 2008

Luton 2008

Stockport 2009

Salisbury 2009

 

not sure where you got this list from, but it clearly isn't correct. Not all of those teams went into admin, Wimbledon / MK Dons was a re-location and rebranding, Ipswich, Derby not sure about? QPR i suppose have done the best out of that list

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Nope, not hindsight. You are assuming that all things are equal between our administration case and that of other clubs, such as those you have pedantically listed further on.

 

You are right, we were an attractive investment, but to suggest that we didn't get lucky is stupid.

 

The fact that we were such an attractive investment potentially could have been terrible, in the sense of who that attracted. ...Hedge funds, leveraged buy outs...even rupert lowe.

 

We got lucky because we got ML and NC and not some Micky falikia type

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For me the biggest irony is that what we now have is a club, almost the way Lowe and co would have done had they had a pot to **** in. We are seeing further investment in infrastructure, living within oour means but with a fund from the owner (albeit appearing as 'loans'), and the club run under sensible busness practices - its why we still see some not happy with the regime as the club puts itself first and and that means sometimes costs and fees make some disgruntled. For me the real test for NC will be if we are promoted to the prem. what sort of balance will be put in place to ensure a reasonable level of competitiveness versus ensuring we are financially stable - and if performance wise we struggle, will we see the return of those screaming for 'investment'?

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Very difficult to take seriously.

 

 

After all, if the stadium was on the moon the nearest pubs would be here on Earth rather than "light years away".

 

there are pubs open for all fans within 10 minutes walk. I walked past one.

I had a drink in the bar/bistro inside the complex, no ID or anything, normal pub prices.

Not difficult to take seriously. Their slow decline has brought them to an all too familiar situation..a big city like Coventry deserves better.

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You are right, we were an attractive investment, but to suggest that we didn't get lucky is stupid.

 

The fact that we were such an attractive investment potentially could have been terrible, in the sense of who that attracted. ...Hedge funds, leveraged buy outs...even rupert lowe.

 

We got lucky because we got ML and NC and not some Micky falikia type

 

Exactly this. The sheer scale of our attractiveness could have been our undoing; ownership of Jacksons Farm, training ground, city centre ground plus countless other assets, all extremely attractive opportunities for developers to come in and make a quick buck potentially to the detriment of the football team.

 

As I said earlier the administrator has a duty to extract the best deal for the creditors. The needs and desires of the football club come a distant second to that, thereby putting us at the mercy of the whims of the highest bidder. Add in the fact that our adminsistrator was led a merry dance by a bunch of chancers, you'd also have to question his ability to recognise what was or wasn't a decent future for the club.

 

We got very lucky with the owners we got.

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Nope, not hindsight. You are assuming that all things are equal between our administration case and that of other clubs, such as those you have pedantically listed further on.

 

Saints had a reasonable team (albeit demoralised), a first-class ground, first-calss training facilities, and a first-class academy. We were an attractive investiment once inflated egos, Walter Mitty-ness and p*ss-poor managment were taken out of the equation.

 

How the f**k can you seriously compare us to the likes of Bury, Halifax and Scarborough ???

 

Well it is hindsight unless you tell me you knew a swiss billionaire was buying us before it happened.

 

At no point did I claim we were the same as any of the clubs on that list all it illustrates is how well we did out of admin and how many teams didn't do that well. Some of them have been in admin more than once no doubt becuase the first chancers to buy them didn't have a pot to **** in and end up in trouble only a few years later.

 

If a swiss billionaire had bought pretty much any of the clubs on that list and invested they would probably be in a better place than they're are now. We could have end up like leeds and had someone like Ken Bates FFS.

 

We did very very well out of admin, many clubs don't.

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not sure where you got this list from, but it clearly isn't correct. Not all of those teams went into admin, Wimbledon / MK Dons was a re-location and rebranding, Ipswich, Derby not sure about? QPR i suppose have done the best out of that list

 

Yeah the joys of things on the internet. I think Dons were a close call (supposedly) saved by moving to MK.

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Foresight suggests you could have predicted the outcome... you are right in suggesting a 'pheonix' like club would always have been an option, but for many this was NOT somthing they would have been happy with. Even if it meant continued baord room turmoil.

 

I still find it exasperating how some 'blessed with hindsight' feel that it was better - that some how the arrival of ML was preordained - when the reality is we were very very lucky - and we should also acknowledge that our 'luck' was in no small part generated (ironically) by the very things so many (the same who had these amazing chrystal balls) moaned about on here and previous forums for years - the investment in the infrastructure and academy instead of first team... we had that ad infinitum, yet it should be obvious that those things being in place made us 'worth a punt' for Markus' 'modest investment'.

 

We were also ant attrctaive proposition because we only had two main creditors to deal with - Aviva and Barclays - everyone else includig HMRC had been paid, and this was a direct result of the clubs various board room members striving to run teh club financially in teh right way (even with Leon's slight rush of blood to the head) overall none of them went mad with teh pursestrings, and in our final PLC season, we cut eveything back to the bare minimum to avoid doing a pompey and racking up more debt and dbt and debt with no intenstion of paying it back... we should be proud of that.

This. We were within a day of going out of business according to some reports so the line between brilliant "foresight" and being buried in S**t was very fine indeed.

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Middlesbrough 1986 (admin) haven't done too badly have they.

New 30k+ stadium since then plus numerous cup finals won and lost including a UEFA cup final and a string of world class internationals through the door.

 

Here's hoping our next few years are only half as interesting as this.

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