Jimmy Savile

[pap]

What drives you to write this crap Pap? bull**** or ignorance?

 

Haut de la Garenne, the dead politicians that have been revealed to be paedophiles, the support network they must have enjoyed, Thatcher's PPS, the titular monster of this thread, his close links with royalty and the establishment and the broad scale of his operations. More recently, Patrick Rock.

 

No VIPs were arrested during Operation Ore.

 

Leverage is more important than justice, I guess.

 

Still, serve up some more light entertainers for the crowd, eh?

[buctootim]

Haut de la Garenne, the dead politicians that have been revealed to be paedophiles, the support network they must have enjoyed, Thatcher's PPS, the titular monster of this thread, his close links with royalty and the establishment and the broad scale of his operations. More recently, Patrick Rock.

 

No VIPs were arrested during Operation Ore.

 

Leverage is more important than justice, I guess.

 

Still, serve up some more light entertainers for the crowd, eh?

 

Thats just shape shifting. Get called out on one piece of nonsense so ignore it and move onto another.

[pap]

Thats just shape shifting. Get called out on one piece of nonsense so ignore it and move onto another.

 

I'm sorry, I wasn't taking a single letter from a Conservative MP as complete refutation too seriously there.

 

Was I meant to?

[hamster]

Haut de la Garenne, the dead politicians that have been revealed to be paedophiles, the support network they must have enjoyed, Thatcher's PPS, the titular monster of this thread, his close links with royalty and the establishment and the broad scale of his operations. More recently, Patrick Rock.

 

No VIPs were arrested during Operation Ore.

 

Leverage is more important than justice, I guess.

 

Still, serve up some more light entertainers for the crowd, eh?

 

This.

[hamster]

Facts (alone) are for fools.

 

Trust no one , believe nothing.

[hypochondriac]

So growing up, many years ago the main 3 saville rumours going round all the time were a) he liked kids, b) he liked dead bodies, and c) he was, or was involved with the yorkshire ripper.

 

So when will we get the hattrick?

 

There is a pic of him with Peter Sutcliffe tbf.

[View From The Top]

Haut de la Garenne, the dead politicians that have been revealed to be paedophiles, the support network they must have enjoyed, Thatcher's PPS, the titular monster of this thread, his close links with royalty and the establishment and the broad scale of his operations. More recently, Patrick Rock.

 

No VIPs were arrested during Operation Ore.

 

Leverage is more important than justice, I guess.

 

Still, serve up some more light entertainers for the crowd, eh?

 

I'll agree with that.

[pap]

So growing up, many years ago the main 3 saville rumours going round all the time were a) he liked kids, b) he liked dead bodies, and c) he was, or was involved with the yorkshire ripper.

 

So when will we get the hattrick?

 

There is a pic of him with Peter Sutcliffe tbf.

 

Not sure it'll ever be proved, but I've read further on all three of those rumours. His sexual abuse of children is now pretty well known.

 

There's a piece from CNN on how he apparently claimed to have spent time in mortuaries.

 

http://edition.cnn.com/2014/06/26/world/europe/uk-jimmy-savile-abuse-report/

 

Also, the Louis Theroux documentary is pretty revealing in this respect. He talks about how having his dead mother in his flat for five days was one of the happiest of his life, as he had her all to himself. Paul Gambaccini also made the necrophiliac claims, but he is now under suspicion himself, and is still under bail conditions.

 

Finally, I've seen it suggested several times that Savile might have been involved in some of the Yorkshire Ripper murders. They definitely corresponded.

 

So, this is a man accused of all these things and more. Friends with successive prime ministers, friends with royalty, a knight of the realm, a papal knight and the Order pro merito Melitensi. He was reportedly called in to help Charles and Di patch things up in the early days (his claim). Regardless of whether that last story is true, the rest is verifiable through documentary and photographic evidence. Are we to believe that Cold War vetting didn't pick his proclivities up, when it was an "open secret" at the BBC and he had so much access to so many VIPs?

 

Spinning back to the D-Notice point (or DA Notice point), high profile paedophiles within the establishment do constitute a national security risk. They're all compromised, can all be blackmailed and can all be made to work against the interest of the people they are supposed to serve.

[pap]

News in today.

 

Leon Brittan is being asked to comment on a dossier of paedophiles within Westminster in the 1980s.

 

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-28113517

http://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2014/jul/02/lord-brittan-westminster-paedophile-information-exchange-dossier

 

Somewhat predictably, the World at One revealed that all of the paperwork has gone missing. Brittan is an interesting choice of commentator. Allegations have been made against him in the past.

[buctootim]

News in today.

 

Leon Brittan is being asked to comment on a dossier of paedophiles within Westminster in the 1980s.

 

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-28113517

http://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2014/jul/02/lord-brittan-westminster-paedophile-information-exchange-dossier

 

Somewhat predictably, the World at One revealed that all of the paperwork has gone missing. Brittan is an interesting choice of commentator. Allegations have been made against him in the past.

 

So no D notice then?

[pap]

So no D notice then?

 

Keep contributing, sir

[buctootim]

Keep contributing, sir

 

It was a semi serious point. Yes child abuse was a hidden crime up till the 1970/80s and people of all classes and backgrounds were involved. Social norms were different then and stuff which is now seen as a serious crime was more often dismissed as creepy, bad form and something people got beaten up over but not jailed. Maybe Leon Brittan was even complicit, I dont know. but all of those things are a totally different situation to pretending the was an officially sanctioned conspiracy to use the secret services and non existent draconian secrecy laws to hush things up.

[scotty]

It was a semi serious point. Yes child abuse was a hidden crime up till the 1970/80s and people of all classes and backgrounds were involved. Social norms were different then and stuff which is now seen as a serious crime was more often dismissed as creepy, bad form and something people got beaten up over but not jailed. Maybe Leon Brittan was even complicit, I dont know. but all of those things are a totally different situation to pretending the was an officially sanctioned conspiracy to use the secret services and non existent draconian secrecy laws to hush things up.

 

 

Either way, Brittan was a horribly slimey git.

[Spudders]

Rolf Harris sentenced to five years & nine months.

[bpsaint]

Rolf Harris sentenced to five years & nine months.

 

Out on licence in 2 years 9 months, pathetic sentence really.

[Wurzel]

Came across this site/blog today - http://thecolemanexperience.wordpress.com/ whilst reading about an entirely unrelated matter - or maybe it isn't as that seems to be the whole point of it all. Not sure if it's been mentioned on this thread before.

After a brief browse through a few pages I can't make up my mind if this is a total crank site like David Icke's or it's unearthing some genuine unwelcome connections . The fact it's still up and running leads me towards the former.

[pap]

It was a semi serious point. Yes child abuse was a hidden crime up till the 1970/80s and people of all classes and backgrounds were involved. Social norms were different then and stuff which is now seen as a serious crime was more often dismissed as creepy, bad form and something people got beaten up over but not jailed. Maybe Leon Brittan was even complicit, I dont know. but all of those things are a totally different situation to pretending the was an officially sanctioned conspiracy to use the secret services and non existent draconian secrecy laws to hush things up.

 

P'raps it's the result of having a not very rarified upbringing, but child abuse is something that people I've known have always seen as way beyond creepy or bad form. Some people feel so strongly about having a nonce about that they'll murder the suspect, vigilante style. No euphemisms, no hyperbole. I know someone that got life imprisonment for doing so, and it wasn't even anyone he knew. Same thing would happen every day in prisons, were child sex offenders allowed to mix with general population.

 

I've no idea whether the level of sentiment that exists today was as strong back in the 1970s. Maybe some of the older people on this site can speak to your point about it being creepy or bad form.

 

What has always been true is that anyone engaging in such practices is utterly compromised, a quick and easy target for blackmail and a national security risk.

[hypochondriac]

Out on licence in 2 years 9 months, pathetic sentence really.

 

Is it? Pretty pointless putting an 84 year old man in prison for any longer than that. He's hardly a danger to the public now and will probably die in prison or shortly afterwards.

[bridge too far]

Out on licence in 2 years 9 months, pathetic sentence really.

 

I think the judge can only pass a sentence that would have been passed at the time of the offences. There are much harsher sentences these days than there were in the 60s and 70s

 

Although it's just been stated that the sentence has been referred to the Attorney General as too lenient

 

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-28163593

Edited 4 July, 2014 by bridge too far
additional info

[Bearsy]

Pretty pointless putting an 84 year old man in prison for any longer than that. He's hardly a danger to the public now

 

I still wouldn't let him babysit my kids, and they're only imaginary! i can only imagine how real parents would feel about Rolf Harris being released from prison to babysit their kids.

 

In any case I think the short sentence is more because they have to take into account what the laws were at the time of the offences, i.e. in the 70s when paedophilia was not illegal.*

 

* Edit: As confirmed by btf

[Lets B Avenue]

I still wouldn't let him babysit my kids, and they're only imaginary! i can only imagine how real parents would feel about Rolf Harris being released from prison to babysit their kids.

 

In any case I think the short sentence is more because they have to take into account what the laws were at the time of the offences, i.e. in the 70s when paedophilia was not illegal.*

 

* Edit: As confirmed by btf

 

So if someone gets found guilty of a murder from 1960 or earlier, we can hang them?

 

Cool!

[Bearsy]

Yes correct. You would be guilty of hanging someone in 2014 though, which is illegal, so you would have to accept consequences.

[bpsaint]

Is it? Pretty pointless putting an 84 year old man in prison for any longer than that. He's hardly a danger to the public now and will probably die in prison or shortly afterwards.

 

 

 

True, or he could live to 100 and enjoy 12 years of freedom. Hardly seems like justice compared to the life 'sentences' he's dished out to his victims.

[CB Saint]

Well all these faces of my childhood programmes going down. Only need basil brush for full house..

[Saint in Paradise]

i can only imagine how real parents would feel about Rolf Harris being released from prison to babysit their kids.

 

 

 

I don't think that there is anyone likely to be that stupid Bearsy and I even include that strange lot on Portsea Island

[Halo Stickman]

Well all these faces of my childhood programmes going down. Only need basil brush for full house..

 

 

BREAKING NEWS: 52 year-old fox charged with grooming baby owl at BBC garden party.

[Hockey_saint]

 

BREAKING NEWS: 52 year-old fox charged with grooming baby owl at BBC garden party.

 

BOOM BOOM Mr Stickman!!.....seriously though, I just had a quick glance at the first page of this thread....jeez, we've certainly gone a long way from the initial post calling Jimmy a legend!

[Unbelievable Jeff]

Is it? Pretty pointless putting an 84 year old man in prison for any longer than that. He's hardly a danger to the public now and will probably die in prison or shortly afterwards.

 

Can still download and share kiddie porn I would have thought.

[hypochondriac]

Can still download and share kiddie porn I would have thought.

 

Expect if he is released that that sort of thing would be monitored. Not sure we should be spending a load of money to keep a frail old bloke behind bars. Also wasn't aware he had downloaded and shared kiddie porn? Granted he did search for some sick stuff though. Dirty bstard.

[badgerx16]

So if someone gets found guilty of a murder from 1960 or earlier, we can hang them?

 

Cool!

 

No, because that particular punishment has been abolished, The historical aspect in these cases is the guideline on length of punihment, not the type of punishment.

[Unbelievable Jeff]

Expect if he is released that that sort of thing would be monitored. Not sure we should be spending a load of money to keep a frail old bloke behind bars. Also wasn't aware he had downloaded and shared kiddie porn? Granted he did search for some sick stuff though. Dirty bstard.

 

Yep, read it the other day.

[hypochondriac]

Yep, read it the other day.

 

Have a link? What I read was that there was one photo where they were unsure what the age of the female was not that he had actively downloaded and shared kiddie porn.

 

Edit: sort of difficult to tell from this article. Sounds like he could have been downloading and sharing child porn but nothing definitive. Still, I imagine that any condition of release would include not allowing him access to the Internet.

 

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/crime/10945525/Revealed-Rolf-Harris-downloaded-indecent-images-of-children.html

Edited 5 July, 2014 by hypochondriac

[bridge too far]

I think we're about to see a whole very large can of worms open explosively with the latest stuff re Parliament.

[pap]

I think we're about to see a whole very large can of worms open explosively with the latest stuff re Parliament.

 

Potentially, but will probably be more of a "be seen to be doing something" than actually doing something.

 

Brittan himself is the subject of accusations. There are potentially ruinous implications for the establishment if some of the bigger names are mentioned.

[Delmary]

I think we're about to see a whole very large can of worms open explosively with the latest stuff re Parliament.

 

I find it worrying that the police have not launched a criminal investigation of the whole affair, including the potential destroying of evidence. It would seem that the establishment is rotten to the core.

[pap]

I find it worrying that the police have not launched a criminal investigation of the whole affair, including the potential destroying of evidence. It would seem that the establishment is rotten to the core.

 

Some of the people I've seen named would constitute a serious national security risk.

 

My landlady over in NI, a councillor herself for decades, reckons that in politics, paedophilia is the only thing that would finish a career on its own. A politician can have an affair, take drugs, have dodgy expenses or be involved in corruption. With suitable levels of public contrition, these things can be overcome. Regardless of what buctootim says about it being less serious back in the day, if you mess with kids you're finished, and rightly so.

 

I can remember two cases of people abusing kids growing up, one on the Flower Roads and one over in Aldermoor. Both occurred in the late '80s / early '90s; the sense of shock and revulsion was palpable. However, in both cases, the perpetrators were convicted and sent down. The kids involved got some measure of justice. Those that have been preyed on by members of the establishment have no such chance.

 

I don't think that the incidence of paedophiles within the establishment is necessarily higher than those you might find on a council estate, but those that have power can subvert it to avoid justice in ways that your sink estate nonce cannot. Further, the scandal in the Catholic church shows us that oftentimes, there is tacit institutional support in facilitating or covering up wrongdoing.

 

I'll make the point again. Leverage is more important than justice. Ted Heath is credited with introducing the "dirt book", a means of keeping compromised politicians in line. Heath himself has been named as a regular visitor to Haut de la Garenne, and has been accused of much, much more. It's a good job he never made any important decisions, eh?

 

http://spotlightonabuse.wordpress.com/2013/05/11/the-dirt-book-how-the-sexual-abuse-of-children-is-used-for-political-gain/

 

I hope that May's enquiries shed some light on the issue, but honestly, I've no faith in seeing any big names brought to justice. The implications are too broad and the establishment, as constituted, would be finished. Given it's capacity for self-preservation, I cannot see it committing seppuku via the medium of the robust investigation that the issue requires.

[rallyboy]

The worst thing for me is that it's now difficult for Britain to be taken seriously when telling other countries or hardline religions how they should live their lives when it's becoming obvious that our society has been infested with the worst type of perverts for decades.

How can we be critical of the way women and children are treated elsewhere?

These latest revelations are PR gold dust to the extremists who want to change western society, I hate to think how we as a country are being portrayed in some parts of the middle east.

Harris, Savile etc have done massive damage to the image of the UK, if it is shown that government colluded to protect offenders, this country will look like a cesspit paedo camp.

[pap]

The worst thing for me is that it's now difficult for Britain to be taken seriously when telling other countries or hardline religions how they should live their lives when it's becoming obvious that our society has been infested with the worst type of perverts for decades.

How can we be critical of the way women and children are treated elsewhere?

These latest revelations are PR gold dust to the extremists who want to change western society, I hate to think how we as a country are being portrayed in some parts of the middle east.

Harris, Savile etc have done massive damage to the image of the UK, if it is shown that government colluded to protect offenders, this country will look like a cesspit paedo camp.

 

Oddly enough, that might be the one thing we don't have to worry about. Even without these revelations, the West has been utterly hypocritical on a number of issues.

 

We'll moan the new legislation in Russia preventing kids from being taught about homosexual lifestyles, yet we'll say nowt about the likes of Saudi Arabia or the UAE, where being gay can land you the death penalty. There's the exact same hypocrisy over women's rights, and a somewhat larger one with Israel - the most active rogue state on the planet. All of these problems have been around for decades; we just managed to exacerbate it by adding pre-emptive corporatist wars to our repetoire.

 

Returning to the topic at hand, long-term, revelations can only be a good thing. What's better? A society that shines a light on its darkest recesses, or one unable to deal with its own problems?

[stu0x]

The worst thing for me is that it's now difficult for Britain to be taken seriously when telling other countries or hardline religions how they should live their lives when it's becoming obvious that our society has been infested with the worst type of perverts for decades.

How can we be critical of the way women and children are treated elsewhere?

These latest revelations are PR gold dust to the extremists who want to change western society, I hate to think how we as a country are being portrayed in some parts of the middle east.

Harris, Savile etc have done massive damage to the image of the UK, if it is shown that government colluded to protect offenders, this country will look like a cesspit paedo camp.

Aisha was 6 when Mohammed took her for his wife, and 9 when the marriage was 'consummated'. So I wouldn't worry about it.

[pap]

Aisha was 6 when Mohammed took her for his wife, and 9 when the marriage was 'consummated'. So I wouldn't worry about it.

 

Do you have to pay to be a member of the Nonce Defence League or is it free?

 

Pathetic.

[stu0x]

Do you have to pay to be a member of the Nonce Defence League or is it free?

 

Pathetic.

You seem to have missed the point entirely. But then, you're a grown man who thinks horrific murders committed in front of crowds of people are shadow government/illuminati conspiracies using crisis actors to subjugate populations. And you've got the photoshopped orange hands to prove it. So I probably shouldn't be surprised at your wholesale lack of both comprehension and perspective.

[pap]

You seem to have missed the point entirely. But then, you're a grown man who thinks horrific murders committed in front of crowds of people are shadow government/illuminati conspiracies using crisis actors to subjugate populations. And you've got the photoshopped orange hands to prove it. So I probably shouldn't be surprised at your wholesale lack of both comprehension and perspective.

 

I addressed that specific point far more comprehensively than you did.

 

Your two posts amount to:-

 

1) Two wrongs make a right

2) Ad hominem personal attacks

 

How much more will you do in the service of the Nonce Defence League?

[Viking Warrior]

Surely dickens and co have more than one copy of the document they gave to the home office . Surely someone has a copy out there , They can hand in to the appropriate person/s

There was sexual abuse in the forces as well in the 60's and 70's that I'm aware off , So it was not just in the realms of the civil service politicians etc

[buctootim]

I addressed that specific point far more comprehensively than you did.

 

Your two posts amount to:-

 

1) Two wrongs make a right

2) Ad hominem personal attacks

 

How much more will you do in the service of the Nonce Defence League?

 

Pathetic Pap. You'd be held in less contempt if you held your hands up and just said "sorry, I misunderstood" sometimes.

 

FYI he isnt saying two wrongs make a right, simply that Rallyboy's self flagellation on behalf of the UK as being uniquely abhorrent in this regard was wrong. stuox is right, if you're looking for a moral vacuum, look closer to home.

[pap]

Pathetic Pap. You'd be held in less contempt if you held your hands up and just said "sorry, I misunderstood" sometimes.

 

FYI he isnt saying two wrongs make a right, simply that Rallyboy's self flagellation on behalf of the UK as being uniquely abhorrent in this regard was wrong. stuox is right, if you're looking for a moral vacuum, look closer to home.

 

stu0x's first point (of which he was very proud, I'm sure) was a facile attempt at muck spreading. If you're taking that into serious consideration, that's up to you. Don't make the mistake of thinking others have "misunderstood". How much was there to get wrong, FFS?

[pap]

On the subject of the enquiry, interesting choice of head.

 

http://mikesivier.wordpress.com/2014/07/09/head-of-paedophile-inquirys-own-brother-accused-of-protecting-vip-paedophiles/

[Bearsy]

Do you have to pay to be a member of the Nonce Defence League or is it free?

 

Pathetic.

 

You can't just join, you have to be groomed

[buctootim]

you have to be groomed

 

Everyone likes their knob polished

[buctootim]

stu0x's first point (of which he was very proud, I'm sure) was a facile attempt at muck spreading. If you're taking that into serious consideration, that's up to you. Don't make the mistake of thinking others have "misunderstood". How much was there to get wrong, FFS?

 

No, he was pointing out that the muck is already everywhere, its part of the human condition. Its far better to live in a society where its acknowledged, dealt with and punished (even if imperfectly) than in a society where public authorities don't enquire into what goes on in the home - the large majority of countries around the world.

[pap]

No, he was pointing out that the muck is already everywhere, its part of the human condition. Its far better to live in a society where its acknowledged, dealt with and punished (even if imperfectly) than in a society where public authorities don't enquire into what goes on in the home - the large majority of countries around the world.

 

No he wasn't. This is what he said.

 

Aisha was 6 when Mohammed took her for his wife, and 9 when the marriage was 'consummated'. So I wouldn't worry about it.

 

Frankly Tim, if you're going to be a contrarian and/or personal stalker then exercise a touch more shrewdness in selecting your battles.

 

In your bid to make a point and score one against your nemesis, you seem to have invented an interpretation that just isn't there. Guess you can get something from nothing, eh?