Would You Keep Hooiveld?

[Daren W]

After yesterday, it's a no brainer... The man was immense..

[Viking Warrior]

yes. celtic messed up with him, hes their loss now

[kipstryker]

Looked a class act last night - understanding with Fonte/Fox improving all the time. Takes the pressure off Jose as well.

And he wants to be here and wants to stay past January.

[alpine_saint]

Nah, he's crap.

[kelkel31]

really had a good game last night, improved on the little niggles we had in his first few games like clearing the ball away from danger rather than just getting the ball away from the attacker, good commitement and positioning throughout and add in the goal well worth the MOM. After the game made an obvious rallying call for the team to go and salute the northam which to me was a show to us fans and the club that he wants a seat on the bus for the long term.

 

overall i like the idea of extending the loan to the end of the season just to see how he reacts to us having a sticky patch where things arent so rosy but is looking like he could be an unexpected solution

[The Angel Gabriel]

Nah, he's crap.

 

Absolutely. He played one short pass in 2nd half and gave the ball away.

Must iron out these errors before we consider permy status

[toofarnorth]

Apparently he wants to stay. In dutch but I think that's the general gist of it.

 

http://www.seginternational.com/football/page=site.news_article/id=976/matchwinner_hooiveld_hoopt_bij_de_saints_te_blijven.html

[Jimmy_D]

http://www.skysports.com/story/0,19528,12874_7251379,00.html

 

Also http://yfrog.com/kj738paj and http://yfrog.com/khr7uacj on Twitter.

 

I think he likes it here

[LGTL]

http://www.skysports.com/story/0,19528,12874_7251379,00.html

 

Also http://yfrog.com/kj738paj and http://yfrog.com/khr7uacj on Twitter.

 

I think he likes it here

 

Lovely view of Fawley Refinery he has there

[davefizzy14]

Yes for me, Jos has settled in very well and last night especially I thought he was immense

[musesaint]

No brainer

 

Give him a contract in January

[James]

After last night, definitely. Proved he can deal with strikers who have played in the Prem (i.e Carew). I'd sign him on a permanent if he's available at the right price.

[Saint Without a Halo]

certainly and we will

[westofshannonsaint]

Celtic fans still think he's 'pish' apparently... I don't think we should correct them - Jos can do that himself when we play them in Europe.

 

there is 1 or 2 interesting comments on this thread...

 

Terrible players can cut it in the Championship as we know.

 

Doing well at Southampton should not have us yearning for his return. Lets just hope it means we might have some mug club out there willing to give us a fee.

 

Looked alright on his debut, but I don't think rushing him through so quickly, especially as he was in between seasons due to the Swedish season, and playing him through injury helped him.

 

Every time he played for us, on top of everything else, he didn't look fit. It wouldn't be the first time we have rushed a player into the first team to the detriment of their overall fitness.

 

In the 2-2 game against Inverness, he looked as if he was tring to hard. After every mistake he made, he would shout and rant at himself. Don't think he was helped that day with the 3-5-2 formation.

 

{another poster replied} - To be fair we didn't concede any goals in that game until he was taken off

[SNSUN]

Yes. He seems comfortable on the ball. I feel sorry for Seaborne, but Jos is our future.

[Saint_clark]

Yes. He seems comfortable on the ball. I feel sorry for Seaborne, but Jos is our future.

 

In fairness Jos looks like what Seaborne will be one day.

[paulwantsapint]

Is it fair to say that Jos is fitting in a similar way to how Killer did? Slow start ( killer off on debut) then grown since

 

Looks like he is enjoying being part of a positive squad

[23rdSaint]

In answer to the OP's question: yes. Without a shadow of a doubt.

[hypochondriac]

Celtic fans there highlight his lack of pace as his biggest weakness. I can't say that has been particularly evident the times I have seen him. Maybe he is just fitter with us.

[del boy]

He looked more reliable that Jose against West Ham - I think Fonte has not had the greatest start to the season by his hight standards, and so often looks close to giving a pen away.

I'm sure he'll up his game but I'd still be happy to see another top quality CB come here in Jan (along with the striker)

[Professor]

Jos says he wants to stay. Can't imagine the team without him now - would we really feel as confident with Seaborn or Martin as first choice at CB, and sadly, I think Jaidi has been out for just too long at his age to come back into the reckoning. Hope NC signs the Hayfield asap.

[fez]

He's like Killer in that he has goals in him, as we've already seen twice

[ericofarabia]

He certainly seems to love being here and is one of the first to acknowledge the crowd at the end of the game, but in a genuine way rather than an OTT effort like Prutton or Rudi.

 

At the end of the Watford game it was great to see him, Jose and Kelv in a big (manly) hug celebrating the clean sheet as if we'd just scored a goal.

 

I seem to remember in one of his first interviews he commented on just how good the team spirit was and how he'd been made very welcome by everyody.

[Chez]

Celtic fans there highlight his lack of pace as his biggest weakness. I can't say that has been particularly evident the times I have seen him. Maybe he is just fitter with us.

 

I've been wondering what to post on this thread as I've given him top marks in pretty much every match report I've done since he came here, so I could hardly suggest he isn't any good. But the Celtic fans are spot on, he does lack pace, which so far has not been exposed. I think apart form one or two top, top centre backs you will always have to trade pace for arial ability. Right now that extra power in the air is essential to our `well being', but the higher you go the more pace you need. I'm more for worrying about now, so let's get that loan extended and then see where we are in the summer.

[The9]

He's been a great signing. There's a debate in our current position about whether we should be signing players to get up to the Prem or to stay there, but I'd sign Hooiveld within a minute. The flaws in our defensive record have been due to a lack of defensive midfield support and the fullbacks being forward a lot, not because the centre backs have been poor at all. Hooiveld's size and strength, and ability to play a low pass out of defence have all been assets. We should be discussing who else to sign to challenge him and Fonte.

[The9]

Quality, beasted Carew tonight.

 

On the contrary, Carew won pretty much everything there was any point in him winning - Hooiveld won a lot of free headers (and so did Fonte), but Carew won endless flicks in and around the box, especially in the first half when the hoofs were a little more controlled. Had Allardyce not chosen to play Baldock 20 yards away from Carew those would have been much more dangerous than they were with no-one supporting him. Even a lot of the stuff our centre-backs did win when challenged fell into those Pro-Zone Percentage Hotspots Allardyce likes to use so much and therefore to West Ham's midfielders. All of this just makes Carew a good player though, as opposed to any problem with Hooiveld or Fonte.

[Charlie Wayman]

Hoover is a very good nickname, clean sweep and so on... you just know those Celtic barstewards will be effing awkward in January, it won't be as staightforward as we would wish - probably want Lallana in p/e

[shurlock]

He's been a great signing. There's a debate in our current position about whether we should be signing players to get up to the Prem or to stay there, but I'd sign Hooiveld within a minute. The flaws in our defensive record have been due to a lack of defensive midfield support and the fullbacks being forward a lot, not because the centre backs have been poor at all. Hooiveld's size and strength, and ability to play a low pass out of defence have all been assets. We should be discussing who else to sign to challenge him and Fonte.

 

Disagree - the narrowness of our midfield has exposed our fullbacks, putting our defense under pressure but there have been countless times where our CBs have struggled: Ipswich, Millwall, Forest, Leicester and Cardiff to an extent etc. We've looked tidier now that Jos has joined but to absolve the CBs is utterly ridiculous.

[shurlock]

On the contrary, Carew won pretty much everything there was any point in him winning - Hooiveld won a lot of free headers (and so did Fonte), but Carew won endless flicks in and around the box, especially in the first half when the hoofs were a little more controlled. Had Allardyce not chosen to play Baldock 20 yards away from Carew those would have been much more dangerous than they were with no-one supporting him. Even a lot of the stuff our centre-backs did win when challenged fell into those Pro-Zone Percentage Hotspots Allardyce likes to use so much and therefore to West Ham's midfielders. All of this just makes Carew a good player though, as opposed to any problem with Hooiveld or Fonte.

 

Disagree - Carew didn't win many clean headers -and that's sometimes more than enough- and lacked the mobility to go searching for the ball in the way Lambert does and which would have allowed him to lose his marker and bring others in. Statuesque is being charitable on Carew. Coupled with Schneiderlin who was always at hand to pick the bouncing second ball, I felt comfortable with the straight long balls. Of course, Sam tried to have his cake and eat it - he was reluctant to go 4-4-2 but didn't want to drop Baldock as part of a 4-5-1, so dumped him on the wing. I can understand why he did it, even if it didnt work very well. Of course, had he played him alongside Carew, they would have given up other kinds of space.

[Appy]

He wants to stay because Southampton has a Nandos.

 

He always seems to be in there.

[the saint in winchester]

The question is - is it our decision on whether to offer him a perm contract in January? Depends on what we agreed with Celtic up-front. If we negotiated an option to buy at a particular price, then yes, sign him up. But if we didn't negotiate that option, the fact he has done well with us may encourage Celtic to take him back and keep him. A bit like the Antionio with Reading scenario all over again!

I'm hopeful we can at least extend the loan, preferably buy him. In my team, his place is assured. I would be prepared to drop Fonte if we had an option on another outstanding prospect in January.

[shurlock]

I've been wondering what to post on this thread as I've given him top marks in pretty much every match report I've done since he came here, so I could hardly suggest he isn't any good. But the Celtic fans are spot on, he does lack pace, which so far has not been exposed. I think apart form one or two top, top centre backs you will always have to trade pace for arial ability. Right now that extra power in the air is essential to our `well being', but the higher you go the more pace you need. I'm more for worrying about now, so let's get that loan extended and then see where we are in the summer.

 

Of course, quick CBs are a rare commodity - apart from Gerrard and Reid on Tuesday, I haven't been impressed by many of the CBs in the league. In addition, Adkins wants a left footer which further narrows the pool. Having not seen Jemal play, Fontaine was the closest we got to a pacey CB but he would have given something up in the air. I don't see how Gorkks would have solved any problems either.

[MerceSaint28]

I think the fact that Jaidi is a write off and so could Seabourne also...means we are very thin in this area. I think we should extend the loan until the end of the season and take it from there. From my point of view, we need to be adding players who are capable of playing in the top flight so there is no rush to make this permanent as im sure Celtic would let him have Jos until June.

 

I do think we need to be pushing for another top centre half (left footed) to push Jos and give us more competition also so hopefully the scouting network is in overdrive.

 

Would love Clyne from Palace at right back as well...

[Chez]

On the contrary, Carew won pretty much everything there was any point in him winning - Hooiveld won a lot of free headers (and so did Fonte), but Carew won endless flicks in and around the box, especially in the first half when the hoofs were a little more controlled. Had Allardyce not chosen to play Baldock 20 yards away from Carew those would have been much more dangerous than they were with no-one supporting him. Even a lot of the stuff our centre-backs did win when challenged fell into those Pro-Zone Percentage Hotspots Allardyce likes to use so much and therefore to West Ham's midfielders. All of this just makes Carew a good player though, as opposed to any problem with Hooiveld or Fonte.

I would agree with that. Thankfully we won't come up against the likes of Carew every week, but quite clearly Jos isn't in Jaidi's league for winning headers - he would have been perfect for this particular game - but he's still good in the air and very calm in possession. Edited 21 October, 2011 by Chez

[The9]

Disagree - the narrowness of our midfield has exposed our fullbacks, putting our defense under pressure but there have been countless times where our CBs have struggled: Ipswich, Millwall, Forest, Leicester and Cardiff to an extent etc. We've looked tidier now that Jos has joined but to absolve the CBs is utterly ridiculous.

 

I think the midfield not supporting the defence is the issue, whichever way it manifests itself. And yes, there have been some CB errors, but it's a lot harder to look like a solid defensive pairing if you're the only two actually defending.

[Chez]

Would love Clyne from Palace at right back as well...

likewise, but with them going well too I can;t see them selling in January. If we should go up then he'd be one of the first players on my shopping list, perhaps with his mate Saha (spell) joining him.

[The9]

Disagree - Carew didn't win many clean headers -and that's sometimes more than enough- and lacked the mobility to go searching for the ball in the way Lambert does and which would have allowed him to lose his marker and bring others in. Statuesque is being charitable on Carew. Coupled with Schneiderlin who was always at hand to pick the bouncing second ball, I felt comfortable with the straight long balls. Of course, Sam tried to have his cake and eat it - he was reluctant to go 4-4-2 but didn't want to drop Baldock as part of a 4-5-1, so dumped him on the wing. I can understand why he did it, even if it didnt work very well. Of course, had he played him alongside Carew, they would have given up other kinds of space.

 

He didn't win many clean headers, but there were plenty of times when he won contested headers, put the ball in the right areas and West Ham's tactics didn't allow anyone to pick up the loose ball (as Baldock was out wide). Ask my wife, she had to put up with me saying "eek" every time he did it and was sick of it by half an hour when nothing much came of most of the knock downs.

 

From seeing him absolutely run the game on the deck and in the air against Brighton last season I assure you he is much much mobile and skilful than Lambert has ever been, but if he's the target man in a 4-5-1, "going to look for the ball" is just going to get him a bollocking, especially if their only tactic is to hump the ball up the pitch at him and suddenly he's not there to challenge for it.

 

As for Schneiderlin picking up the loose balls, that happened more and more as the game went on, presumably as West Ham's midfield tired from the constant 40 yard sprints they needed to make to get into the "second ball" zones after the hoof.

 

As yet I haven't figured out what the point of bringing Piquionne or especially one foot hoof donkey O'Brien was, but then I don't have The Stats.

[shurlock]

He didn't win many clean headers, but there were plenty of times when he won contested headers, put the ball in the right areas and West Ham's tactics didn't allow anyone to pick up the loose ball (as Baldock was out wide). Ask my wife, she had to put up with me saying "eek" every time he did it and was sick of it by half an hour when nothing much came of most of the knock downs.

 

From seeing him absolutely run the game on the deck and in the air against Brighton last season I assure you he is much much mobile and skilful than Lambert has ever been, but if he's the target man in a 4-5-1, "going to look for the ball" is just going to get him a bollocking, especially if their only tactic is to hump the ball up the pitch at him and suddenly he's not there to challenge for it.

 

As for Schneiderlin picking up the loose balls, that happened more and more as the game went on, presumably as West Ham's midfield tired from the constant 40 yard sprints they needed to make to get into the "second ball" zones after the hoof.

 

As yet I haven't figured out what the point of bringing Piquionne or especially one foot hoof donkey O'Brien was, but then I don't have The Stats.

 

Like you, I rate Carew - he's powerful and skillful and he was on my HCDAJFU list; but ultimately I think he's lost some his mobility since his injury at Stoke and probably before (was going to go to the Brighton game as I only realised that the Rochdale game was off when approaching Stoke!).

 

Don't see why you can't come deep to hold up the ball in a 4-5-1 - whether you stay rooted or move, the job is the same: to win possession, buy time and bring runners into play.

 

If anything, if you play forward-minded players like Baldock or Picquionne on the wings, you want your targetman moving wide -making it easier to beat the usually less commanding FB in the air and closing the gap between you and the runner. The whole ebb and flow of the game at Burnley, for instance, changed when Lambert went on the shoulder of the RB and got closer to Lallana who was able to pick up the flick ons and drive in from the left.

[Thedelldays]

sign him up now..he is our best CB (at present)

[CWD]

Brilliant today.

[EBS1980]

he was given the captains armband once Hammond was sent off today.

[doddisalegend]

yes wasn't sure after his first couple of games but he is looking sh it hot now sign him up (hope he isn't one of those playing for a contract type players)