The Peak

[conaero]

Ok, you cant deny it, Saints are on the up.

 

They have surged through the tables and even I, the most pessimistic Saints fan ever (been there, seen it all before) have to agree that promotion to the promised land is a reality this season.

 

Its no secret that NC is aiming for top 6 Prem, and European involvement.

 

I dont want this post to be seen as a downer, but where do you all see the peak....the point were the club stops surging forward, and the only way is down.

 

For me, I will never moan about Prem mid table mediocrity again, after all the turbulent times of the past 5 years, I look forward to the comfort of this.

[Colinjb]

Ok, you cant deny it, Saints are on the up.

 

They have surged through the tables and even I, the most pessimistic Saints fan ever (been there, seen it all before) have to agree that promotion to the promised land is a reality this season.

 

Its no secret that NC is aiming for top 6 Prem, and European involvement.

 

I dont want this post to be seen as a downer, but where do you all see the peak....the point were the club stops surging forward, and the only way is down.

 

For me, I will never moan about Prem mid table mediocrity again, after all the turbulent times of the past 5 years, I look forward to the comfort of this.

 

Frankly, I don't see there being a defined peak. We will I believe have a period of inclement form at some point this season and that will be the acid test of our current team and infrastructure. I wouldn't see it being the start of a decline though, at worst a plateau. We may end up yo-yoing over the next few years if promotion happens and providing the club remains stable we will keep progressing.

[alpine_saint]

I am not sure I am looking forward to the Premier League.

 

What is its attraction, really ? Will we see much better or more committed players in the red-and-white than we have now, really ? Also I personally dont need to w*nk over all the foreign mercenaries from the other teams when they visit St. Marys, and I also dont care about the media attention so much.

 

Its too much fun where we are now; maybe if we could win a cup or two it would be perfect. Then we get the odd European excursion as well.

 

I understand that financially it is important to NC, of course.

[Frank's cousin]

I agree with Alps to some extent. The 'normal' expectation is for fans to want to be the very best ands compete at the highest possible (realistic) Level. But if you look at what the prem has become, its insipid 'values', greed of players, the fact that without 200 mil+ investment its impossible to really compete, its no longer a 'sporting' challenge in the truest sense, but one in which you can buy success. Its a shame, because if you look at leagues such as the Bundesliga, you get more sides being competitive now and again as young players stay, at least for a few years (before heading for Bayern Munich or abroad) so you see clubs of similar size to saints winning the odd title and doing well in the CL... even if they eventually have to start again when teh best playesr are lured away... we will never get that again in the prem, unless the rules are changed on transfers under 22... which will never happen. Culturally, pour young players seem hell bent on a big money move the moment anyone sniffs around and so its impossible to build a side in that way...

[Alanh]

I am not sure I am looking forward to the Premier League.

 

What is its attraction, really ? Will we see much better or more committed players in the red-and-white than we have now, really ? Also I personally dont need to w*nk over all the foreign mercenaries from the other teams when they visit St. Marys, and I also dont care about the media attention so much.

 

Its too much fun where we are now; maybe if we could win a cup or two it would be perfect. Then we get the odd European excursion as well.

 

I understand that financially it is important to NC, of course.

 

Can understand elements of this view but think that there are various aspects to look at it from. From a sportsmans perspective they want to win every competition that they are in. From a business perspect any company has to want to grow if it is to be successful. Fans want to celebrate success and aviod disappointment. Your reply is from the fans perspective and you seem to want to protect yourself from possible dissapointments should we not win as many matches in the Prem as we are at present.

 

To answer the OP, I think that the peak will be determined by how much money our owners are prepared / allowed to invest in the squad. Just about every team in the Prem has third party finance supporting their losses to some degree and we will need more that we are getting at the moment if we are to compete in the Prem. The peak may be top 10 if they invest like Villa / Bolton / Stoke / Fulham. It may be top 6 if they invest like Spurs / Arsenal. I doubt it will be top 4 unless we find that the financial fair play rules change the way that the likes of Man City and Chelsea spend.

 

One thing I am sure of is that NA can get a team playing the sort of football that is required to compete in the top half of the Prem, subject to the quality of players that are available within the budget.

[up and away]

I agree with Alps to some extent. The 'normal' expectation is for fans to want to be the very best ands compete at the highest possible (realistic) Level. But if you look at what the prem has become' date=' its insipid 'values', greed of players, the fact that without 200 mil+ investment its impossible to really compete, its no longer a 'sporting' challenge in the truest sense, but one in which you can buy success. Its a shame, because if you look at leagues such as the Bundesliga, you get more sides being competitive now and again as young players stay, at least for a few years (before heading for Bayern Munich or abroad) so you see clubs of similar size to saints winning the odd title and doing well in the CL... even if they eventually have to start again when teh best playesr are lured away... we will never get that again in the prem, unless the rules are changed on transfers under 22... which will never happen. Culturally, pour young players seem hell bent on a big money move the moment anyone sniffs around and so its impossible to build a side in that way...[/quote']

 

Completely agree, it's just the practicalities that get in the way of the Championship being a nirvana away from the Premier. If we are not in the Premier, all our assets will get picked off by even mediocre clubs from the Premier. If there was some way we could hold onto most of our good stuff, I have no problems about staying in the Championship, it's more as football should be to me.

 

As to the OP, I am having difficulty imagining things being better when you consider our position and the style of football that has got us there. The other thing I see as really important is the manner we are conducting ourselves from the lowesst to the CEO. We don't go blabbing to the press unsettling players or opposing fans, Adkins is that diplomatic you could imagine he came via the UN rather than S****horpe, a CEO who understands the value of silence and apart from Chaplows kung fu exibition, one of the cleanest sides in the league that just want to play football. I can see this era bringing in a lot of neutral fans and being a club others will have a good word for.

[pap]

There are a number of limiting factors that'll need to be addressed if the club has any ambitions of say, consistently compete in the Champions League.

 

If you look at all the English clubs that have qualified for the CL in the past 10 years, they're all based in major population centres and all have a pre-existing massive fan base. I know that people. myself included, bang on about Southampton's catchment area - but when you consider that the whole Hampshire has a population of 1.8 million, and a good number of those don't support Southampton, a major challenge will be finding the fans that'll underpin the continuing success.

 

This is a contentious suggestion, sure - but I think the club should market itself to glory hunters as a second team that they could go see every fortnight. Given our present success on the pitch, now would be the perfect time to do it. I know that people have a strong sense of affinity with their first choice team, but I know loads of people that support other teams that have a soft spot for Southampton.

 

Unless we dramatically improve our numbers, I can see our peak being mid-table Prem, perhaps sneaking into the UEFA League during the good years.

[Webby]

There are a number of limiting factors that'll need to be addressed if the club has any ambitions of say, consistently compete in the Champions League.

 

If you look at all the English clubs that have qualified for the CL in the past 10 years, they're all based in major population centres and all have a pre-existing massive fan base. I know that people. myself included, bang on about Southampton's catchment area - but when you consider that the whole Hampshire has a population of 1.8 million, and a good number of those don't support Southampton, a major challenge will be finding the fans that'll underpin the continuing success.

 

This is a contentious suggestion, sure - but I think the club should market itself to glory hunters as a second team that they could go see every fortnight. Given our present success on the pitch, now would be the perfect time to do it. I know that people have a strong sense of affinity with their first choice team, but I know loads of people that support other teams that have a soft spot for Southampton.

 

Unless we dramatically improve our numbers, I can see our peak being mid-table Prem, perhaps sneaking into the UEFA League during the good years.

IMO that's a load of rubbish. We can easily sell out the stadium when we're in the prem. We have fans from further afield than Hampshire you know.

[pap]

IMO that's a load of rubbish. We can easily sell out the stadium when we're in the prem. We have fans from further afield than Hampshire you know.

 

 

I'm not suggesting for a minute we can't sell 32K seats in the Prem. We've done it before and should we secure promotion, we'll do it again. The OP was asking about the potential peak of our achievement, and I said that absent a large increase in fans, our peak will be the occasional entry into the UEFA league.

 

When you look at the teams that go beyond that, as in teams that regularly get into the CL, they are characterized by having huge fanbases, having (or trying to get) huge and impressive stadia.

 

Then you look at other clubs who have peaked, such as Wigan or Blackburn. They will not rise any further because they simply don't have the numbers.

 

Ultimately, the growth of any business is dependent on the customer base.

[Webby]

I feel that we will only need to increase the capacity, say to 42k. I think we have the fan base to cover that, if not now, then it will grow as we grow as a club.

[pap]

I feel that we will only need to increase the capacity, say to 42k. I think we have the fan base to cover that, if not now, then it will grow as we grow as a club.

 

I honestly hope we do, mate.

 

Problem is, footy clubs aren't as rational as other choices we all make - and one of the key strategies that other businesses might use, nicking customers off the competition, is a bit trickier in the footballing world.

[Hurricane163]

I am not sure I am looking forward to the Premier League.

 

What is its attraction, really ? Will we see much better or more committed players in the red-and-white than we have now, really ? Also I personally dont need to w*nk over all the foreign mercenaries from the other teams when they visit St. Marys, and I also dont care about the media attention so much.

 

Its too much fun where we are now; maybe if we could win a cup or two it would be perfect. Then we get the odd European excursion as well.

 

I understand that financially it is important to NC, of course.

 

Its not often that I agree with Alpine but on this issue I agree with every word. I realy do not see the Premier League as the promised land. Just the land of utter greed and corruption. To ride high in the Championship and give any team a good game in the cups will suit me fine.

[Monk]

Biggest concern is when we reach the Premiership. What transfer policy will we be adopting?

[B Rabbit]

Villareal as a population of about 50,000 people or something daft....They were often in the champions league and getting half the city to come to their games.... I don't think catchment or capacity is an issue for us based on that. Although could be an anomaly ....

[doddisalegend]

The PL holds little appeal for me as a fan. Sadly any club that wants to get anywhere has to jump on the money band wagon that the PL has become. I'm also not convinced that we will sell out 32k every week in the PL we can't fill SMS after our best start to a season in living memory, can't see people paying more to see us lose more often in the current economic climate. If we go up we might manage a lower mid table finish with the odd unexpected result but how long we 'd stay in the PL unless the owners chucksome serious spending at the team who knows?

[mikee]

I don't think it will ever be our intention to compete with the likes of ManU and ManC on a financial basis.

 

I can however see a time when by playing our style of football and keeping our youngsters as well as attracting others that aren't in it for the money, we could compete on the football pitch and challenge for at least a top 6 spot.

 

It is just that most managers these days are too lazy to coach players and seem to rely on buying success. Which requires money we will never be able to support.

 

This is what I think that Cortese means when he talks about the "southampton way". Mercenaries can go elsewhere but if you want to upset the big boys playing great football with a great bunch of team mates, then come to saints.

[Gingeletiss]

Just heard those two sky cast outs, talking on talksport, saying that the Championship is the third most watched league in the world, I'm happy with that!

[Jez]

Everyone enjoys winning, this means we end up top of the league, everyone is happy and says how wonderful the Championship is. The problem being, the more we win, the more likely we will get promotion. And then we'll end up in the Premier league that everyone seems to be saying is so awful.

 

So if we weren't winning, we would be mid table, or lower, everyone would be trying to figure out what is going wrong, which players are our weak links, which players we need to sign, arguing with one another, being grumpy at home after losing to Rochdale again, and demanding we buy better and more expensive players to achieve this. Suddenly being in the Championship won't be so rosy and everyone would want to be in the Premier League.

 

So enjoying ourselves in the Championship, and then ending up in the Premier League aren't really mutually exclusive, unless everyone hoped we lost in the playoffs each season after finishing 3rd by one point (as much success we could get without achieving promotion).

 

As for any peaks, I hope it is Champions League football, but right now, will settle for the Prem! Although that isn't aiming very high considering our current form/position!

[moonraker]

The fan base and access to games (ground) capacity are key issues for English clubs. The top 5-6 PL teams have significantly larger fan bases and bigger capacities even tough Liverpool and TH both need new grounds and are searching for a solution. Catchment area is only the starting point for attracting fans I would surmise that the top 5-6 PL teams have more fans outside their geographical catchment area than within it. The reason fan base is key is more than just attendance and ground capacity it impacts on corporate, sponsorship and merchandising, to compete financially in the CL as a PL team you must maximise all of these.

 

So the question for us "real" fans is what sort of club we want, if its CL football and top 6 PL then there will have to be some significant changes in the culture and character of SFC. It is only the arrival of NC that has given any validity to this discussion; people must therefore believe he can achieve something more than mid table mediocrity.

 

The other challenge is that you have to dislodge and incumbent and they will not go quietly

[Aardvark]

I agree with Alps to some extent. The 'normal' expectation is for fans to want to be the very best ands compete at the highest possible (realistic) Level. But if you look at what the prem has become' date=' its insipid 'values', greed of players, the fact that without 200 mil+ investment its impossible to really compete, its no longer a 'sporting' challenge in the truest sense, but one in which you can buy success. Its a shame, because if you look at leagues such as the Bundesliga, you get more sides being competitive now and again as young players stay, at least for a few years (before heading for Bayern Munich or abroad) so you see clubs of similar size to saints winning the odd title and doing well in the CL... even if they eventually have to start again when teh best playesr are lured away... we will never get that again in the prem, unless the rules are changed on transfers under 22... which will never happen. Culturally, pour young players seem hell bent on a big money move the moment anyone sniffs around and so its impossible to build a side in that way...[/quote']

 

True, but do you really think the Championship (or any other professional league for that matter) is that different? Why do you think that the likes of Southampton, West Ham, Middlesborough, Derby and Leicester are among the promotion favourites whilst Doncaster, Barnsley et al are destined for the other end of the table? Similarly look at League 1 - Charlton, Huddersfield and the Sheffield clubs are the giants here - Colchester, Orient and Chesterfield are much smaller (i.e. poorer) clubs. I'm afraid money rules at all levels of the game, it's just a bit more visible and vulgar the higher up you go.

[PhilippineSaint]

Just heard those two sky cast outs, talking on talksport, saying that the Championship is the third most watched league in the world, I'm happy with that!

 

I think they need to get there figures sorted as in the Far East you never get to see any Championship games but You do get the other major European games so I would think they are maybe slightly out

[The Cat]

Could they mean in terms of match attendance? Probably helps that with 24 teams in the league there's loads more games than in Italy or Germany.

[farawaysaint]

I think they need to get there figures sorted as in the Far East you never get to see any Championship games but You do get the other major European games so I would think they are maybe slightly out

 

In terms of average attendance I believe.

[david in sweden]

I am not sure I am looking forward to the Premier League.

I understand that financially it is important to NC, of course.

 

 

..'think you're in for a bit on stick on this one Alps!

 

...for a start the odd £60 million that comes with being a Prem.side will not only please Cortese, but the players who are presently on contracts worthy only of L1/CCC players.

 

If we are to buy " better / more experienced / higher level " players , as we surely must when we go up, then our present

transfer record £4 million for Rory Delap (more than 10 years ago) will soon just become a interesting statistic in the clubs long history).

 

If we are to become a " top Prem. side " (or however you want to phrase it) ..do you see Saints spending say, £10 million on a new player ? ..( that's about the cost of an " average " top Prem. player, (not to metion their £3 million a year salary....)

and there are only a handful of Prem. sides who haven't spent that much on at least ONE player. Indeed that sort of figure hardly dents the budget of the top six Premmers.

 

I agree that it's nice to break records (in CCC) and score lots of goals, and play attractive football (at this level), but anyone

who has reached the top of CCC must surely have the ambition to play at the highest level..otherwise they shouldn't be in the club.

 

Having seen Saints spend 27 consecutive seasons " up there " I do feel that just playing teams like Chelsea, Liverpool and the Manchester sides is a thrill in itself, win or not. I recal l the first promotion to Div 1 (as was) in 1966. It was fantastic. Nail-biting at the end of each season on occasions, but very entertaining nevertheless.

 

So ..are you really advocating another 5 years of " attractive football " down in CCC....or, do you not want to go higher and see our ultimate capacity?

Edited 20 September, 2011 by david in sweden

[doddisalegend]

..'think you're in for a bit on stick on this one Alps!

 

...for a start the odd £60 million that comes with being a Prem.side will not only please Cortese, but the players who are presently on contracts worthy only of L1/CCC players.

 

If we are to buy " better / more experienced / higher level " players , as we surely must when we go up, then our present

transfer record £4 million for Rory Delap (more than 10 years ago) will soon just become a interesting statistic in the clubs long history).

 

If we are to become a " top Prem. side " (or however you want to phrase it) ..do you see Saints spending say, £10 million on a new player ? ..( that's about the cost of an " average " top Prem. player, (not to metion their £3 million a year salary....)

and there are only a handful of Prem. sides who haven't spent that much on at least ONE player. Indeed that sort of figure hardly dents the budget of the top six Premmers.

 

I agree that it's nice to break records (in CCC) and score lots of goals, and play attractive football (at this level), but anyone

who has reached the top of CCC must surely have the ambition to play at the highest level..otherwise they shouldn't be in the club.

 

Having seen Saints spend 27 consecutive seasons " up there " I do feel that just playing teams like Chelsea, Liverpool and the Manchester sides is a thrill in itself, win or not. I recal l the first promotion to Div 1 (as was) in 1966. It was fantastic. Nail-biting at the end of each season on occasions, but very entertaining nevertheless.

 

So ..are you really advocating another 5 years of " attractive football " down in CCC....or, do you not want to go higher and see our ultimate capacity?

 

Sadly the 1st division of 1966 was a very different place to the modern PL which is a two (possibly three horse race).

[Frank's cousin]

Sadly the 1st division of 1966 was a very different place to the modern PL which is a two (possibly three horse race).

 

For me that is it in a nutshell... teh rest are either happy to stay in middle table mediochrity (they cant afford anything else) or ****e scared of the drop having got themselves into debt and contractual obligations that could mean serious problems if relegated... the majority of games thus played in fear, often negative football... and teh media 'pundits' and prem league and sky carry on spreading the myth its the greatest league in the world... certainly probably watched by huge numbers in the far east, but where is the competition? For me teh greatest league in the world should apply to the league where the competition is broad and deep, not a few rich mega clubs made richer by billionnaires and archair subscription.

 

Of course to some extent all leagues are the same even within the NPC, but at least the gaps are not as ridiculous, and the number sides that could end up in teh top 6 is as least 15-18, based on budget and players, if not manager and spirit.

 

Ye, I enjoyed the 27 years but alot of that was fuelled by the fact that teams like Forest could win, Saints could finish second and sign a current European Footballer of the year... the later prem years, showed us merely the limits of what we could hope for not only without investment, but how culturally players were more motivated by cash and short cuts to success, than the joy of the game playing in a squad that was a real TEAM, who worked for each other as well has having an affinity for the club. Now I hate Man U with a passion and their arrogant fans and miserable **** of a manager, but one thing is for sure. Thie success is made easier by the fact they can keep their best talent and afford the wages necessary to attract the best, but Fergie HAS at least instilled in tehm that sence of what it means to play at that club, more so than those at Chelski and Arsenal and to me that has been the difference between them and their relative success... its also what NA has instilled in our team and why its so enjoyable right now, not just results, but results with spirit.

[K,Billy's supersound]

3-0 chapions league victory over barca.

[Fowllyd]

Everyone enjoys winning, this means we end up top of the league, everyone is happy and says how wonderful the Championship is. The problem being, the more we win, the more likely we will get promotion. And then we'll end up in the Premier league that everyone seems to be saying is so awful.

 

So if we weren't winning, we would be mid table, or lower, everyone would be trying to figure out what is going wrong, which players are our weak links, which players we need to sign, arguing with one another, being grumpy at home after losing to Rochdale again, and demanding we buy better and more expensive players to achieve this. Suddenly being in the Championship won't be so rosy and everyone would want to be in the Premier League.

 

So enjoying ourselves in the Championship, and then ending up in the Premier League aren't really mutually exclusive, unless everyone hoped we lost in the playoffs each season after finishing 3rd by one point (as much success we could get without achieving promotion).

 

As for any peaks, I hope it is Champions League football, but right now, will settle for the Prem! Although that isn't aiming very high considering our current form/position!

 

Very well summed up. It seems to me that there's an inherent paradox, or even contradiction, in many people's thinking - and I include myself in that number. We all want to see our team win, we all want to see our team play great football; we'd be very strange supporters if we didn't. But many of us have developed a strong distaste for the Premier League and much of what it represents - the lack of real competition for first place and for the top four places; the mediocre fare served up in so many mid-table matches; the financial excesses; the near-hysterical hype surrounding it all.

 

But what Saints fan would not wish us to continue this season as we've started it? I'm loving this; we all are. And if it carries on in the same vein, we'll be in the Premier League next season. I for one will be overjoyed at that, while still having great reservations about the PL itself - and I'd guess that many others would feel the same way. So would I prefer us to finish seventh this season - and next season, and the season after that? Or even to miss out in the play-offs season after season? Of course not.

 

Premier League, solidly established, snapping at the heels of European qualification - and doing it all by playing great football, not hoofing, clogging and Prozone-obsessed percentage stuff. That'll do me nicely, thanks.

 

Perhaps if the biggest European teams píss off and form their own little super-duper league, it may just have the effect of removing some of the worse features of the current Premier League, all the more so if there's no chance of promotion to said super-duper league. Personally I'd like to see that, and it won't surprise me one iota if it does happen.

[aintforever]

Cortese will aim for the Champions League. I think people underestimate how ambitious he is.

[Turkish]

Cortese will aim for the Champions League. I think people underestimate how ambitious he is.

 

Lets hope he's got £300m buring a hole in his pocket then.

[doddisalegend]

Cortese will aim for the Champions League. I think people underestimate how ambitious he is.

 

It takes more than ambition and a prayer these days you need a few hundred million too.............

[Micky]

..'think you're in for a bit on stick on this one Alps!

 

...for a start the odd £60 million that comes with being a Prem.side will not only please Cortese, but the players who are presently on contracts worthy only of L1/CCC players.

 

If we are to buy " better / more experienced / higher level " players , as we surely must when we go up, then our present

transfer record £4 million for Rory Delap (more than 10 years ago) will soon just become a interesting statistic in the clubs long history).

 

If we are to become a " top Prem. side " (or however you want to phrase it) ..do you see Saints spending say, £10 million on a new player ? ..( that's about the cost of an " average " top Prem. player, (not to metion their £3 million a year salary....)

and there are only a handful of Prem. sides who haven't spent that much on at least ONE player. Indeed that sort of figure hardly dents the budget of the top six Premmers.

 

I agree that it's nice to break records (in CCC) and score lots of goals, and play attractive football (at this level), but anyone

who has reached the top of CCC must surely have the ambition to play at the highest level..otherwise they shouldn't be in the club.

 

Having seen Saints spend 27 consecutive seasons " up there " I do feel that just playing teams like Chelsea, Liverpool and the Manchester sides is a thrill in itself, win or not. I recal l the first promotion to Div 1 (as was) in 1966. It was fantastic. Nail-biting at the end of each season on occasions, but very entertaining nevertheless.

 

So ..are you really advocating another 5 years of " attractive football " down in CCC....or, do you not want to go higher and see our ultimate capacity?

 

I think that all you've managed to do there is highlight the very reason why very many people are happy to stay in the Championship. The reliance on massive amounts of money in the Premiership has totally alienated about 75% of the current incumbants.

 

It is a league that is fast becoming nothing more than a joke - a two horse race which even a blind man can predict the outcome. Until some pretty significant 'field levelling' has taken place, (and not just for the benefit of Saints, but for the benefit of all teams and football in general) - then I am quite happy to sit with Alps and watch competative Championship matches.

[CB Fry]

Cortese will aim for the Champions League. I think people underestimate how ambitious he is.

 

No chance whatsoever. Cortese and the Leibherr estate will find a point to sell the club on. Optimal time to do that would be after one full season in the Premier League where he can "sell" the idea that we can get into the Champion's League to the next mug.

 

There is no way Cortese would sanction the kind of spending required to get us to fourth in the table, and even if he did, those kind of players are just simply not going to come to us anyway. Those that did would be here for the money which means they be a bunch of c%*%s.

 

Cortese's campaign for the Champion's League will take the form of "I truly belive that Mr [Thai/Russian/Indian Businessman] is the man to take this great club into the Champion's League" before scarpering off into the sunset.

 

Being in the Champion's League is such a pointless and tedious ambition anyway - who really cares. I would be absolutely delighted if we were never, ever, ever, in the Champion's League ever. No interest whatsoever. It's just not what we're about.

[Gingeletiss]

For me that is it in a nutshell... teh rest are either happy to stay in middle table mediochrity (they cant afford anything else) or ****e scared of the drop having got themselves into debt and contractual obligations that could mean serious problems if relegated... the majority of games thus played in fear, often negative football... and teh media 'pundits' and prem league and sky carry on spreading the myth its the greatest league in the world... certainly probably watched by huge numbers in the far east, but where is the competition? For me teh greatest league in the world should apply to the league where the competition is broad and deep, not a few rich mega clubs made richer by billionnaires and archair subscription.

 

Of course to some extent all leagues are the same even within the NPC, but at least the gaps are not as ridiculous, and the number sides that could end up in teh top 6 is as least 15-18, based on budget and players, if not manager and spirit.

 

Ye, I enjoyed the 27 years but alot of that was fuelled by the fact that teams like Forest could win, Saints could finish second and sign a current European Footballer of the year... the later prem years, showed us merely the limits of what we could hope for not only without investment, but how culturally players were more motivated by cash and short cuts to success, than the joy of the game playing in a squad that was a real TEAM, who worked for each other as well has having an affinity for the club. Now I hate Man U with a passion and their arrogant fans and miserable **** of a manager, but one thing is for sure. Thie success is made easier by the fact they can keep their best talent and afford the wages necessary to attract the best, but Fergie HAS at least instilled in tehm that sence of what it means to play at that club, more so than those at Chelski and Arsenal and to me that has been the difference between them and their relative success... its also what NA has instilled in our team and why its so enjoyable right now, not just results, but results with spirit.

 

Agree with all of this, especially the Manure bit. This has all been fulled by the money pumped in by the CL, which is why in general, the top four are the top four, and why they get into Europe year after year. Summed up here by Fowllyd.....

Perhaps if the biggest European teams píss off and form their own little super-duper league, it may just have the effect of removing some of the worse features of the current Premier League, all the more so if there's no chance of promotion to said super-duper league. Personally I'd like to see that, and it won't surprise me one iota if it does happen.

[conaero]

Thanks for all your comments chaps. I like the idea of the top perm teams going off into their own Euro league where Sky can rape and pillage there customers financially.

 

For me, I would like to see NA, NC and the current saints squad emulate the mid 70's success of LMac. Promotion and then a FA cup victory would be the icing on the cake. I could then buy a new mug as m1976 one is looking a bit tatty now!

[doddisalegend]

Thanks for all your comments chaps. I like the idea of the top perm teams going off into their own Euro league where Sky can rape and pillage there customers financially.

 

For me, I would like to see NA, NC and the current saints squad emulate the mid 70's success of LMac. Promotion and then a FA cup victory would be the icing on the cake. I could then buy a new mug as m1976 one is looking a bit tatty now!

 

Should have picked up a 2010 JPT one as a stand in until our next cup triumph

[mancsaint]

I am not sure I am looking forward to the Premier League.

 

What is its attraction, really ? Will we see much better or more committed players in the red-and-white than we have now, really ? Also I personally dont need to w*nk over all the foreign mercenaries from the other teams when they visit St. Marys, and I also dont care about the media attention so much.

 

Its too much fun where we are now; maybe if we could win a cup or two it would be perfect. Then we get the odd European excursion as well.

 

I understand that financially it is important to NC, of course.

 

Totally agree with Alpine_saint and Up and Away. TBH I don't want to get to the EPL just be where we are and playing the sort of football we are. Cannot see NC EVER spending the sort of money needed to stay in the top seven of the EPL. We are playing sublime stuff and I love it.

 

Mancsaint

[sussexsaint]

Meh , I'm just enjoying this whilst it lasts. Starting a game expecting to win, hell starting a game expecting to score is still a novelty for me.