Saint_clark Posted 24 August, 2011 Share Posted 24 August, 2011 Why not do that but also form an initial opinion based on those who have seen him play week in week out for five years? Put it this way, I would be feeling a bit better about rejecting better players and going for this one if we had similar comments from fans like crystal palace with fonte or cork with burnley. How do you know Gorkss is better? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Appy Posted 24 August, 2011 Share Posted 24 August, 2011 Why not do that but also form an initial opinion based on those who have seen him play week in week out for five years? Put it this way, I would be feeling a bit better about rejecting better players and going for this one if we had similar comments from fans like crystal palace with fonte or cork with burnley. Alot of fan's opinions change when players leave, they become bitter and say things like "Oh he isn't that good anyway". Even some Burnley fans were saying that about Cork when he joined us. I'll reserve judgement until he has a run in the side, if he does sign. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Avenue Saint Posted 24 August, 2011 Share Posted 24 August, 2011 Plenty of people saying he is their best defender; would you get any on here saying the same about Richardson or Fonte?! Lots seem disappointed they're losing him; others not so bothered. General consensus seems to be that he has takent but has stagnated a bit in the last season or two, possibly due to being played as one of various different centre-half pairings. They say he's quick, which is a leg-up on Gorkss. He's been a fixture in a side that has finished 4th, 10th, 10th and 16th in this league in the last 4 years. It's also rumoured that we've gone for him after turning down the opportunity to sign Gorkss, so if that's true we see him as a better option than someone who is nudging 30 and has signed for £1M for a significant rival of ours. Good points. Would be content with this. Has undoubted potential to be improve and given age has time to grow with team. Good championship experience with pace and can play it out. For all of Seaborne's improved performances of late and Martin's inexperience, he is most definately an upgrade. Potentially a good buy. Happy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shurlock Posted 24 August, 2011 Share Posted 24 August, 2011 Why not do that but also form an initial opinion based on those who have seen him play week in week out for five years? Put it this way, I would be feeling a bit better about rejecting better players and going for this one if we had similar comments from fans like crystal palace with fonte or cork with burnley. Why? Quite a lot of Burnley fans didn't think losing Cork was a big deal, said he was too lightweight, that McCann was a much better player etc. Unless the player's an absolute world beater in a world beating side, fans have a fantastic ability to rationalize anything. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dibden Purlieu Saint Posted 24 August, 2011 Share Posted 24 August, 2011 ...sarcasm? Lol, yeah... ...as long as it doesn't get me an infraction. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saint_clark Posted 24 August, 2011 Share Posted 24 August, 2011 Lol, yeah... ...as long as it doesn't get me an infraction. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
corky morris Posted 24 August, 2011 Share Posted 24 August, 2011 Comment on their forum about him being the 2nd centre half which worries me. That is what Fonte is. We need a dominant ball winning defender IMHO. I dont remember him playing so to comment on his ability is a little early, but he not what i was expecting............ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Appy Posted 24 August, 2011 Share Posted 24 August, 2011 Comment on their forum about him being the 2nd centre half which worries me. That is what Fonte is. We need a dominant ball winning defender IMHO. I dont remember him playing so to comment on his ability is a little early, but he not what i was expecting............ We want players good on the ball, he seems to be that, Its not like Fonte doesn't win his fair share of headers and i'm sure Fontaine does too. I think pace may of been the issue with Gorkks perhaps. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scott_saints Posted 24 August, 2011 Share Posted 24 August, 2011 Where has the myth come from that Fonte is the "second defender"? He isn't..... he's just been playing with Jaidi who stands out more when winning headers due to being such a beast. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LGTL Posted 24 August, 2011 Share Posted 24 August, 2011 I can't remember Fonte being beaten once in the air so far this season, and I do every game. Perhaps i'm always more intoxicated then I think. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Born In The 80s Posted 24 August, 2011 Share Posted 24 August, 2011 Why not do that but also form an initial opinion based on those who have seen him play week in week out for five years? Put it this way, I would be feeling a bit better about rejecting better players and going for this one if we had similar comments from fans like crystal palace with fonte or cork with burnley. If Stoke City had searched this forum for fans opinions on Ricardo Fuller, they would never have signed him. Same could be said for several players that have left us over the past decade and gone on to make an impact at other clubs. Look at Kevin Davies. How many of us would have predicted he'd leave us and go on to play for England? On the Gorkks/Fontaine debate, some seem to have formed an opinion without actually seeing either of them play - laughable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kingsland Red Posted 24 August, 2011 Share Posted 24 August, 2011 BBC suggesting a done deal ? http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/football/14645578.stm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
for_heaven's_Saint Posted 24 August, 2011 Share Posted 24 August, 2011 Those of you saying about him not being a ball winning defender- I agree neither him nor Fonte have a lot of ariel dominance like Jaidi, but could a defence not be just as competent if not more so with two intelligent cbs who can both cover each other and pass the ball? Like having two Fontes playing together. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LGTL Posted 24 August, 2011 Share Posted 24 August, 2011 How long is Jaidi out for out of interest? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hutch Posted 24 August, 2011 Share Posted 24 August, 2011 Those of you saying about him not being a ball winning defender- I agree neither him nor Fonte have a lot of ariel dominance like Jaidi' date=' but could a defence not be just as competent if not more so with two intelligent cbs who can both cover each other and pass the ball? Like having two Fontes playing together.[/quote'] One plays on the left, one plays on the right, Fonty and Fonty.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saint_clark Posted 24 August, 2011 Share Posted 24 August, 2011 BBC suggesting a done deal ? http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/football/14645578.stm It is thought City have accepted an offer for the 25-year-old and he is now holding talks with Saints. That doesn't sound done at all to me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Toadhall Saint Posted 24 August, 2011 Share Posted 24 August, 2011 Heres one of their forums, mixed view I'd say, similar to this forum's view overall of someone like Richardson or Seabourne. http://www.otib.co.uk/index.php?/topic/138481-fontaine-to-southampton-bid-accepted/page__pid__1417510__st__180#entry1417510 Only read the one page on there and the issue does not seem to be Fontaine more the who will replace him. No comments like "he's **** glad he's gone" etc etc. So i'll wait until A) He actually signs and B) I see him play. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
100%Red&White Posted 24 August, 2011 Share Posted 24 August, 2011 One plays on the left, one plays on the right, Fonty and Fonty.... .......no Gorkssy in sight. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Glasgow_Saint Posted 24 August, 2011 Share Posted 24 August, 2011 We SHOULD be going for Scott Dann. is he better than Seabourne? doubt it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big Bad Bob Posted 24 August, 2011 Share Posted 24 August, 2011 One plays on the left, one plays on the right, Fonty and Fonty.... Actually Fonte is protuguese and his surname is pronounced Font (without the 'e'), so it would be Font and Fonts Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saint_lambden Posted 24 August, 2011 Share Posted 24 August, 2011 Surprise surprise, a potential signing is already not good enough for some people. And those who think we'd have a hope in hell of signing Scott Dann need their head looking at. Adkins would have scouted him and wouldn't even think about bringing him in if he wasn't up to the standard of playing alongside Fonte week in, week out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
itchen_dan Posted 24 August, 2011 Share Posted 24 August, 2011 Conor O'Sullivan Youth Team player on twitter (@c_osullivan93) 24/08/2011 13:59 Swear I've just seen Liam Fontaine at the training ground! Transfer from Bristol City to Southampton isit! Hard luck @Wescott_1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
labibs Posted 24 August, 2011 Share Posted 24 August, 2011 For what it's worth, I asked my Bristol City supporting mate for his views on the deal (and whether he was a ball playing CB like Rio, or a brute CB like Vidic). Comments below: "He was quality when he first signed and I was expecting great things from him. Has not really kicked on though so probably needs a fresh start. Could come good for you so I think the deal is good for all concerned… More of a Rio than a Vidic. He plays better with a thug alongside him. He was outstanding in our play-off season, good pace, positioning and not bad distribution. He is left footed and can play at left back if needed so has a bit of versatility. One thing I have got on him is that he tends to back off too much when defending…invites too many shots! He hasn’t really improved for a while though (infact he seems to be at fault for quite a few goals) so I can understand his departure. At 25 he can still improve but I am delighted with £800k as our defence needs an overhaul…" Seems like a player who has lost his way a bit, but is still young enough to come good. Not a Jaidi replacement, but someone who is more comfortable on the ball. Very much an Adkins type signing. Seems a decent move to me, certainly willing to give him a chance if he does come here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AK Posted 24 August, 2011 Share Posted 24 August, 2011 Only read the one page on there and the issue does not seem to be Fontaine more the who will replace him. No comments like "he's **** glad he's gone" etc etc. So i'll wait until A) He actually signs and B) I see him play. Ive no idea if he's great or garbage, just interested to read their fans' views on him,seems he's quite well liked but no-one seems upset that he maybe going. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hutch Posted 24 August, 2011 Share Posted 24 August, 2011 Actually Fonte is protuguese and his surname is pronounced Font (without the 'e'), so it would be Font and Fonts Actually Fonte is not protuguese Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Toadhall Saint Posted 24 August, 2011 Share Posted 24 August, 2011 Ive no idea if he's great or garbage, just interested to read their fans' views on him,seems he's quite well liked but no-one seems upset that he maybe going. Thats exactly how it came across to me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sfc4prem Posted 24 August, 2011 Share Posted 24 August, 2011 I shall await to see him play 20 games before deciding if this is a good signing or not, as I do with all new players. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big Bad Bob Posted 24 August, 2011 Share Posted 24 August, 2011 Actually Fonte is not protuguese and I corrected the misspelling of pedant too Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Toadhall Saint Posted 24 August, 2011 Share Posted 24 August, 2011 Just a question - has Fonte improved since he joined? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hypochondriac Posted 24 August, 2011 Share Posted 24 August, 2011 How do you know Gorkss is better? I don't know for certain but what I do know is that listening to both sets of fans and the fact that gorkss played the majority of games for a championship winning side he looks the better bet. Could be wrong of course but this is an initial reaction. I was extremely pleased with cork this window and have been proven correct and I was also underwhelmed by the seaborne transfer and was called an idiot by some despite history proving that ward was the errrr choice. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saint_clark Posted 24 August, 2011 Share Posted 24 August, 2011 I don't know for certain but what I do know is that listening to both sets of fans and the fact that gorkss played the majority of games for a championship winning side he looks the better bet. Could be wrong of course but this is an initial reaction. I was extremely pleased with cork this window and have been proven correct and I was also underwhelmed by the seaborne transfer and was called an idiot by some despite history proving that ward was the errrr choice. That's hardly conclusive proof of your infallible knowledge of who will and won't do well though, is it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hypochondriac Posted 24 August, 2011 Share Posted 24 August, 2011 Why? Quite a lot of Burnley fans didn't think losing Cork was a big deal, said he was too lightweight, that McCann was a much better player etc. Unless the player's an absolute world beater in a world beating side, fans have a fantastic ability to rationalize anything. No they didn't. The vast vast majority were absolutely gutted to lose him. He was their player of the season. I think you were looking at the wrong forums or talking to the wrong people. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Appy Posted 24 August, 2011 Share Posted 24 August, 2011 No they didn't. The vast vast majority were absolutely gutted to lose him. He was their player of the season. I think you were looking at the wrong forums or talking to the wrong people. People on the main Burnley forum said this, McCann would be a bigger loss than Cork was the view of quite a few Burnley fans on their forum. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Toadhall Saint Posted 24 August, 2011 Share Posted 24 August, 2011 Not bothered about Cork/Burnley fans view - he's ours now and doing very well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hypochondriac Posted 24 August, 2011 Share Posted 24 August, 2011 If Stoke City had searched this forum for fans opinions on Ricardo Fuller, they would never have signed him. Same could be said for several players that have left us over the past decade and gone on to make an impact at other clubs. Look at Kevin Davies. How many of us would have predicted he'd leave us and go on to play for England? On the Gorkks/Fontaine debate, some seem to have formed an opinion without actually seeing either of them play - laughable. No it is an INITIAL opinion, not one set in stone that cannot be changed once he plays for us. Do you understand the difference? By the same token, I was very pleased with the cork signing. What did I have to base that on? Little apart from what burnley had said and how his play was described as well as being burnley's player of the season. It's exactly the sane thing and yet no one questioned why someone was pleased with the signing simply because it was something positive that you wanted to hear. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chez Posted 24 August, 2011 Share Posted 24 August, 2011 I can't remember Fonte being beaten once in the air so far this season, and I do every game. Perhaps i'm always more intoxicated then I think. check out the chance at 1.12 http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/football/14609091.stm on Saturday when Henderson beats him all end up in the air. Fonte is good, don;t get me wrong, but against Henderson and one or two others (less these days than when we were last in this league) you need a Jaidi like figure if you ask me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Toadhall Saint Posted 24 August, 2011 Share Posted 24 August, 2011 No it is an INITIAL opinion, not one set in stone that cannot be changed once he plays for us. Do you understand the difference? By the same token, I was very pleased with the cork signing. What did I have to base that on? Little apart from what burnley had said and how his play was described as well as being burnley's player of the season. It's exactly the sane thing and yet no one questioned why someone was pleased with the signing simply because it was something positive that you wanted to hear. Did you not see Cork when he was with us on loan Hypo? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chez Posted 24 August, 2011 Share Posted 24 August, 2011 People on the main Burnley forum said this, McCann would be a bigger loss than Cork was the view of quite a few Burnley fans on their forum. Not sure which forum you read of which thread, but certainly when I looked (might have been the local paper comments from fans under a news story) they pretty much all thought he was fantastic and it was a real loss not getting him back. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hypochondriac Posted 24 August, 2011 Share Posted 24 August, 2011 That's hardly conclusive proof of your infallible knowledge of who will and won't do well though, is it. No it is an initial reaction which may be right or wrong. An opinion based on the available evidence does not have infallible proof. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scott_saints Posted 24 August, 2011 Share Posted 24 August, 2011 There aren't even many players in the prem that are better than Jaidi in the air. I think we have just become to used to it! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hutch Posted 24 August, 2011 Share Posted 24 August, 2011 check out the chance at 1.12 http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/football/14609091.stm on Saturday when Henderson beats him all end up in the air. Fonte is good, don;t get me wrong, but against Henderson and one or two others (less these days than when we were last in this league) you need a Jaidi like figure if you ask me. I don't want to be controversial, but I think we've got one of them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hypochondriac Posted 24 August, 2011 Share Posted 24 August, 2011 Did you not see Cork when he was with us on loan Hypo? Cork was one example. Fonte is another if u want to use that instead. I had nothing to go on other than what other fans had said and I thought it was an excellent signing. And so it has proved. An initial reaction is something very different from an opinion after watching him for twenty games of course but then if you want to say no comment until twenty games in then there isn't much point in a forum. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hypochondriac Posted 24 August, 2011 Share Posted 24 August, 2011 People on the main Burnley forum said this, McCann would be a bigger loss than Cork was the view of quite a few Burnley fans on their forum. That could be true for them. The majority were gutted to lose him though. They still talk about it now if you go and read a few topics on Rodriguez to Southampton. The impression I got from their forums was that they were losing an important and decent player. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big Bad Bob Posted 24 August, 2011 Share Posted 24 August, 2011 I don't want to be controversial, but I think we've got one of them. Who ahve we signed now then?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shurlock Posted 24 August, 2011 Share Posted 24 August, 2011 check out the chance at 1.12 http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/football/14609091.stm on Saturday when Henderson beats him all end up in the air. Fonte is good, don;t get me wrong, but against Henderson and one or two others (less these days than when we were last in this league) you need a Jaidi like figure if you ask me. As you say, the old brick sh*thouse CF is becoming a thing of the past. Millwall are probably the most direct team in the division (along with Coventry, Birmingham etc), so if given the choice between someone who has genuine pace and acquit himself in the air and a less mobile but totally commanding CB, I would probably go for the former. Giving Jaidi another season wasn't an act of charity either - he'll have a role to play this season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
saintjay77 Posted 24 August, 2011 Share Posted 24 August, 2011 Not sure if already postyed but one of the Academy nippersjust tweeted to say he thinks he saw Fontaine at the training ground. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ohwhenthesaints Posted 24 August, 2011 Share Posted 24 August, 2011 check out the chance at 1.12 http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/football/14609091.stm on Saturday when Henderson beats him all end up in the air. Fonte is good, don;t get me wrong, but against Henderson and one or two others (less these days than when we were last in this league) you need a Jaidi like figure if you ask me. One or two others? If there are only a handful of giant strikers to contend with then I would say that being a brute isn't the most important attribute, especially after we just kept a clean sheet against one of them. Let's not forget we have the actual Jaidi still either! I think we should be more concerned about the much larger number of quick strikers in this league. Fontaine has pace and plays on the left side of defence - sounds like the perfect match for us to me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hutch Posted 24 August, 2011 Share Posted 24 August, 2011 Who ahve we signed now then?? Big black Tunisian bloke. Signed a 1 year contract in the summer Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shurlock Posted 24 August, 2011 Share Posted 24 August, 2011 That could be true for them. The majority were gutted to lose him though. They still talk about it now if you go and read a few topics on Rodriguez to Southampton. The impression I got from their forums was that they were losing an important and decent player. Absolutely, loads were gutted. But that's not the point I was trying to make. I was suggesting that most fans will typically seek to play down the loss of any player or justifiy his departure by saying he was overrated, no matter how much it stretches reality. Call it sour grapes, denial whatever you want. But this bias is everywhere (look at some of the assessments of Oxo on here) and its important to factor it in when putting weight on the views of opposing fans. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
georgeweahscousin Posted 24 August, 2011 Share Posted 24 August, 2011 I can't see us getting Mascherano.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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