dune Posted 26 July, 2011 Share Posted 26 July, 2011 That that comment was a bit over the top... That's all For me the word cancer refers to something evil, destructive, malignant. I have never been able to see how people can refer to people like Lawrie McMenemy as a cancer because he gets a few free tickets or, unbelievably, The9 because he dares question the wage a chairman gets… For me it's just over the top. Cancerous was another word and I can understand people using it to describe someone's influence but for me, personally, to refer to an indivual as cancerous is, again, over the top… Nothing more, nothing less. Is that so hard to understand? Or am I just not getting the point across well enough? If they'd said evil or malignant I'd still be saying the same thing… It's just over the top… Maybe my experiences with it have clouded my judgement here but I don't think so.... Do I find the word cancer offensive on here? No, not really Do I find the word cancer really applicable to Rupert Lowe, Lawrie McMenemy or The9? No, not really Do I find it offensive that someone intimates that i'm somehow using my mother's death through cancer to score cheap points on a ****ing internet messageboard over a nothing argument on a nothing point? Yes I do... So what are you moaning about? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alpine_saint Posted 26 July, 2011 Share Posted 26 July, 2011 Its is a complete disgrace that this thread is still going. NC has delivered the performances and results we could only dream of under Lowe, in a much more competitive and financially rapacious era that when we last had any success (mid 70s - mid 80s) ML, the owner and saviour of the club, and ultimately the only opinion which matters considering it was his money that bailed the club out, deemed NC to be worthy of this salary. END of DISCUSSION Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dune Posted 26 July, 2011 Share Posted 26 July, 2011 Its is a complete disgrace that this thread is still going. NC has delivered the performances and results we could only dream of under Lowe, in a much more competitive and financially rapacious era that when we last had any success (mid 70s - mid 80s) ML, the owner and saviour of the club, and ultimately the only opinion which matters considering it was his money that bailed the club out, deemed NC to be worthy of this salary. END of DISCUSSION But he hasn't delivered the XL shirts or the socks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alpine_saint Posted 26 July, 2011 Share Posted 26 July, 2011 I think the "I'm Nick Illingsworth, and I thínk we deserve a fan on the board" mentality of thinking the club owes us something and is accountable to us, is f**king hillarious. If you DONT like what is going on, vote with your feet and dont go. If enough people agree, the attendance and revenue will drop an maybe the club will pay some attention. Otherwise, if you must persist with the "I have an ST" p*ssing contest Über Fan mentality, put up with it and STFU with the whining about business decisions nothing to do with you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The9 Posted 26 July, 2011 Author Share Posted 26 July, 2011 Over the top is about right. Grr, damn me, I'm a menace to the club with my merchandise puchasing and attending matches. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dune Posted 26 July, 2011 Share Posted 26 July, 2011 If you DONT like what is going on, vote with your feet and dont go. Is that what you do? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The9 Posted 26 July, 2011 Author Share Posted 26 July, 2011 But he hasn't delivered the XL shirts or the socks. There are XL shirts. Not "more than one X"L shirts though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alpine_saint Posted 26 July, 2011 Share Posted 26 July, 2011 Is that what you do? I like very much what is going on; you know I live abroad. Give it a rest with the broken record, dune. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alpine_saint Posted 26 July, 2011 Share Posted 26 July, 2011 Over the top is about right. Grr, damn me, I'm a menace to the club with my merchandise puchasing and attending matches. So you are either a whinging old sh*tbag or a hypocrite. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dune Posted 26 July, 2011 Share Posted 26 July, 2011 (edited) There are XL shirts. Not "more than one X"L shirts though. This is a disgrace. Just because people are fat doesn't mean they don't have feelings. Edited 26 July, 2011 by dune Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dune Posted 26 July, 2011 Share Posted 26 July, 2011 So you are either a whinging old sh*tbag or a hypocrite. You will be able to listen to the text messages on saintsplayer now you've signed up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The9 Posted 26 July, 2011 Author Share Posted 26 July, 2011 So you are either a whinging old sh*tbag or a hypocrite. You think it's hypocrisy to criticise some of the club's off the field policies yet still attend matches ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dune Posted 26 July, 2011 Share Posted 26 July, 2011 You think it's hypocrisy to criticise some of the club's off the field policies yet still attend matches ? Alpine never moans. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The9 Posted 26 July, 2011 Author Share Posted 26 July, 2011 Alpine never moans. But even if he did, he doesn't attend matches anyway... so... that's... alright? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dune Posted 26 July, 2011 Share Posted 26 July, 2011 But even if he did, he doesn't attend matches anyway... so... that's... alright? He has Saintsplayer and posts on the match thread until we score. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wes Tender Posted 26 July, 2011 Share Posted 26 July, 2011 Its is a complete disgrace that this thread is still going. NC has delivered the performances and results we could only dream of under Lowe, in a much more competitive and financially rapacious era that when we last had any success (mid 70s - mid 80s) ML, the owner and saviour of the club, and ultimately the only opinion which matters considering it was his money that bailed the club out, deemed NC to be worthy of this salary. END of DISCUSSION Quite. For crissakes there has even been a futile attempt at justifying this belly-aching by saying that we don't want to go the way of the Skates, when there is no evidence that we are being run beyond our financial means. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frank's cousin Posted 26 July, 2011 Share Posted 26 July, 2011 He's not banking though, he running a football club. Nail on head with respect to this debate really ..... but IMHO how we view the actions and direction of NC, depends on your opinion of how a football club should be run in the modern age.... there are many who still feel that clubs have moved too far away from the heart of the community and that the overiding issues of money and business and media have alienated many fans, or at the very least make it very difficult for fans to reconcile the actions of clubs and the game with the traditionally held values. For me its always been a case of 'if you cant beat them, join them' - whether we like it it or not the modern game IS about money and business - the choices for clubs are simple, attract investment and be a business first to remain as competitive as possible in teh higher divisions and thus benefit from the gulf in TV revenues, or stay local and stay in the lower divisions, with the odd flirtation with success. We simply dont have the global brand or numbers or appeal to negotiate luractuve TV deals independently (even if that were possible under FA/Prem rules) to do a Barcelona - fan ownership with global success. So the only realistic option is to have a strong business focus without the distractions - and that means its going to go against many of the principles held dear by many with respect their club... in some respects its no different to Lowe. Customer focus? well sure I also think NC has maybe made a few mistakes , but mostly in the way price increases have been presented and communicated - the investment and price of success is increased costs - but the way in which fans have found out is perhaps not the best - If you give fans knowledge, then in general most will at the very least understand the rationale, even if still not pleased with the results. As to 600k? what is it worth as a CEO and Chairman of a 14mil TO company? Depends again on what how much we let the 'football club' ideal determine our judgement - there is a school of thought that would argue we need to think and act big if we are to succeed... think small and local and thats all we will ever be... and there are plenty of 'fan chairman/owners' that believe they know how to run clubs, and feck it up - We were blessed with Marcus who like all those who really understand business follow a golden rule... know the limits of your knowledge - and get in experts to run thsoe areas beyond your knowledge base. Saints needed a financial restructure, total overhaul and as I undrstand it when Marcus was presented with the opportunity, he insisted only if his friend and trusted partner NC was at the helm would he do invest - given that NC could earn a huge amount more in is native industry, I really dont see how some make all this fuss over it - whilst we have a strategy and solid foundations are being built for the futur,we are already seeing some success, then as far as I am concerned we shoudl be happy and get on with it. If we have cause for concern in results on the pitch, then quite rightly we should all be asking more questions, but for some fans to have been on NCs case sinse day 1 is just an illustration of either envy, political ideals or wind up IMHO..... Its because we were not charging ENOGH for services and products before MLand NC arrived and our expenditure was greater than income that we ended up in admin - now we welcome teh additioanl investmenta nd expenditure, but dont all feel happy paying for it - we need as a fan base to decide what we want I guess. BUt teh idea of success on a budget or expecting ML to pay for it all, is naive at best, and personnally, there is something a lot more satisfying if our success ends up being bought and paid for by the fanbase. Mike's Flag tribute is a perfect example - it means so much more because the vast majority was paid for by fans -saame goes if we get promotion... for me anyway. If we get there, it will be because we have credible, ethical and shrewd direction from NC, at times challenging to our beliefs, at times difficult, but overall, our success will taste sweeter because we wanted it and were prepared to pay for it - and NC will have been worth every penny! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frank's cousin Posted 26 July, 2011 Share Posted 26 July, 2011 Its is a complete disgrace that this thread is still going. NC has delivered the performances and results we could only dream of under Lowe, in a much more competitive and financially rapacious era that when we last had any success (mid 70s - mid 80s) ML, the owner and saviour of the club, and ultimately the only opinion which matters considering it was his money that bailed the club out, deemed NC to be worthy of this salary. END of DISCUSSION Feck Me - This sums it up for me... well said Alps Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alpine_saint Posted 26 July, 2011 Share Posted 26 July, 2011 Nail on head with respect to this debate really ..... but IMHO how we view the actions and direction of NC, depends on your opinion of how a football club should be run in the modern age.... there are many who still feel that clubs have moved too far away from the heart of the community and that the overiding issues of money and business and media have alienated many fans, or at the very least make it very difficult for fans to reconcile the actions of clubs and the game with the traditionally held values. For me its always been a case of 'if you cant beat them, join them' - whether we like it it or not the modern game IS about money and business - the choices for clubs are simple, attract investment and be a business first to remain as competitive as possible in teh higher divisions and thus benefit from the gulf in TV revenues, or stay local and stay in the lower divisions, with the odd flirtation with success. We simply dont have the global brand or numbers or appeal to negotiate luractuve TV deals independently (even if that were possible under FA/Prem rules) to do a Barcelona - fan ownership with global success. So the only realistic option is to have a strong business focus without the distractions - and that means its going to go against many of the principles held dear by many with respect their club... in some respects its no different to Lowe. Customer focus? well sure I also think NC has maybe made a few mistakes , but mostly in the way price increases have been presented and communicated - the investment and price of success is increased costs - but the way in which fans have found out is perhaps not the best - If you give fans knowledge, then in general most will at the very least understand the rationale, even if still not pleased with the results. As to 600k? what is it worth as a CEO and Chairman of a 14mil TO company? Depends again on what how much we let the 'football club' ideal determine our judgement - there is a school of thought that would argue we need to think and act big if we are to succeed... think small and local and thats all we will ever be... and there are plenty of 'fan chairman/owners' that believe they know how to run clubs, and feck it up - We were blessed with Marcus who like all those who really understand business follow a golden rule... know the limits of your knowledge - and get in experts to run thsoe areas beyond your knowledge base. Saints needed a financial restructure, total overhaul and as I undrstand it when Marcus was presented with the opportunity, he insisted only if his friend and trusted partner NC was at the helm would he do invest - given that NC could earn a huge amount more in is native industry, I really dont see how some make all this fuss over it - whilst we have a strategy and solid foundations are being built for the futur,we are already seeing some success, then as far as I am concerned we shoudl be happy and get on with it. If we have cause for concern in results on the pitch, then quite rightly we should all be asking more questions, but for some fans to have been on NCs case sinse day 1 is just an illustration of either envy, political ideals or wind up IMHO..... Its because we were not charging ENOGH for services and products before MLand NC arrived and our expenditure was greater than income that we ended up in admin - now we welcome teh additioanl investmenta nd expenditure, but dont all feel happy paying for it - we need as a fan base to decide what we want I guess. BUt teh idea of success on a budget or expecting ML to pay for it all, is naive at best, and personnally, there is something a lot more satisfying if our success ends up being bought and paid for by the fanbase. Mike's Flag tribute is a perfect example - it means so much more because the vast majority was paid for by fans -saame goes if we get promotion... for me anyway. If we get there, it will be because we have credible, ethical and shrewd direction from NC, at times challenging to our beliefs, at times difficult, but overall, our success will taste sweeter because we wanted it and were prepared to pay for it - and NC will have been worth every penny! I agree with the gist of your post, but as usual it was f**king painful to discover it.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frank's cousin Posted 26 July, 2011 Share Posted 26 July, 2011 I agree with the gist of your post, but as usual it was f**king painful to discover it.... LOL . I'll let you get away with that this time you miserable sod ;-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chez Posted 26 July, 2011 Share Posted 26 July, 2011 NC has delivered the performances and results we could only dream of under Lowe,Hate him or despise him, Lowe oversaw 8th in the top flight and a cup final. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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