Adkins: 1 or 2 new players by Saturday?

[The Kraken]

I would agree had we walked the league. We did not !

Norwich City were League 1 champions and did it with ease, yet they strengthened their squad almost immediately with very decisive and shrewd signings. IMO Paul Lambert has done this again over the summer and i think Norwich will hold their own in the Premier league.

If we do not strengthen I stand by my prediction of 19th and a season were we are looking over our shoulder not up to the promised land.

 

Agree with this, right up to the part about 19th. I think we have plenty for a mid-table finish, potentially scraping inside the top ten. Still think we're at least 3 players from a tilt at the top though.

[S-Clarke]

Mellor scores and Treacy looking the most dangerous player in their pre-season match tonight according to the PNE website...

 

I think that rules both of them out as potential signings then.

 

(phew on mellor...)

[NickG]

I would agree had we walked the league. We did not !

Norwich City were League 1 champions and did it with ease, yet they strengthened their squad almost immediately with very decisive and shrewd signings. IMO Paul Lambert has done this again over the summer and i think Norwich will hold their own in the Premier league.

If we do not strengthen I stand by my prediction of 19th and a season were we are looking over our shoulder not up to the promised land.

 

in time Adkins was manager we out performed Lambert's time with Norwich in league 1.

 

think your point fails straight away

[The Kraken]

in time Adkins was manager we out performed Lambert's time with Norwich in league 1.

 

think your point fails straight away

 

His point is based in complete fact about how Norwich performed in League 1 and how they approached their season in the championship. How does it fail in that respect?

[Fan The Flames]

His point is based in complete fact about how Norwich performed in League 1 and how they approached their season in the championship. How does it fail in that respect?

 

It hasn't passed the NickG 'Points won divided by games played' analysis.

[saint lard]

It hasn't passed the NickG 'Points won divided by games played' analysis.

 

This statement amused me,thankyou.

[NickG]

It hasn't passed the NickG 'Points won divided by games played' analysis.

 

true.

[NickG]

This statement amused me,thankyou.

 

strange man - finding it amusing that manager is judged on results.

[The Kraken]

strange man - finding it amusing that manager is judged on results.

 

Are you deliberately missing the point? This is a comparison to how Norwich won the league and then significantly strengthened their squad. It's not a direct comparison of results in League 1 (which are extrordinarily close in any case).

[Ivan Katalinic's 'tache]

So 1 or 2 new players by Saturday and a new shirt to be released on Weds. What price a new shirt/new signing combo on Weds???

[Gordon Mockles]

no I am not...often against the popular mind set...

burley was crap

wotte will keep us up

guly is not that great

hammond is bloody good

no need to sign many players

etc etc

 

Have you ever considered why the popular opinion is in fact popular, not taking the p*ss? It's likely that it's popular because the general consensus is correct or the collective opinion more balanced. Having said that, everyone in the 80s seemed to love Good Morning Vietnam & I thought it was utter cr*p.

 

IMHO: You started off well, then walked straight off the cliff edge!

[locksheathsaint101]

Have you ever considered why the popular opinion is in fact popular, not taking the p*ss? It's likely that it's popular because the general consensus is correct or the collective opinion more balanced. Having said that, everyone in the 80s seemed to love Good Morning Vietnam & I thought it was utter cr*p.

 

IMHO: You started off well, then walked straight off the cliff edge!

 

Tbf it's only the popular opinion on here and I wouldn't say it is the same offline!

[Dig Dig]

Actually we did. Despite huge turmoil, a poor pre-season under a disinterested manager, an owner death, manager leaving, an awful start and no management at all for quite a few games, Adkins having to get to know the squad, pick up morale, deal with the huge expectations of being favourites by such a long way, AND overhaul points on many teams above us....

 

Despite all that, we clocked up 92 points and werent far off winning the league. That's fcking impressive and only happened because of the sheer talent we have in the squad that made us such strong favourites in the first place, and Adkins doing what so many fail to do and actually getting he best from that talent.

 

Another year of development, another year of gelling, another year of Adkins getting his messages across, a few good additions, removal of huge expectations, better grounds, better pitches and the chance for our players to prove themselves at a higher level - all reasons to be optimistic.

 

Surely most would agree if Adkins had been here last summer we'd have topped 100 points? Sounds like walking it to me. The quality was always there, as it should be with the amount we've spent.

 

Bingo

[Gordon Mockles]

Your very own`has Skacel signed yet?' post gets better every time you tell it.

 

OMFG That line is so tedious & unfunny. Yet, the crazy TSW Beatniks still peddle the quip more cringily than Paul McCartney performs on stage (please retire Paul, you've had your days in the sun). Not one to cast dispersions or stereotype, but I bet these same potential Perrier Award Winners from our forum also laugh extra loud at the bosses unfunny quips & think getting a tiny bit squiffy on alcohol makes them ruddy faced, crazy, care-free lunatics! ;0)

Edited 18 July, 2011 by Gordon Mockles
Typo

[Crazy Diamond]

Actually we did. Despite huge turmoil, a poor pre-season under a disinterested manager, an owner death, manager leaving, an awful start and no management at all for quite a few games, Adkins having to get to know the squad, pick up morale, deal with the huge expectations of being favourites by such a long way, AND overhaul points on many teams above us....

 

Despite all that, we clocked up 92 points and werent far off winning the league. That's fcking impressive and only happened because of the sheer talent we have in the squad that made us such strong favourites in the first place, and Adkins doing what so many fail to do and actually getting he best from that talent.

 

Another year of development, another year of gelling, another year of Adkins getting his messages across, a few good additions, removal of huge expectations, better grounds, better pitches and the chance for our players to prove themselves at a higher level - all reasons to be optimistic.

 

Surely most would agree if Adkins had been here last summer we'd have topped 100 points? Sounds like walking it to me. The quality was always there, as it should be with the amount we've spent.

 

Indeed. Pardew had spent all summer teaching HIS players HIS methods with HIS backroom staff. Adkins came in and oversaw the transition to his style and miraculously pulled it off. Not many can do it. He did, and that's a brilliant achievement.

[Gordon Mockles]

Sorry Clarke i agree that we have a good squad and are a "team"...that does not mean that we can afford to rest on our laurels and make no improvements...

We are playing in the league above with significantly better teams to what we are used to. If we were in League 1 i would argue that we wouldn't need any signings but we are trying to get to the Premiership now.

 

If you are so deluded you think that a strong League 1 squad is good enough to canter into the play offs...you are wrong.

For me it is all about expectations...we have been told that we want to be a promotion contender...well that is currently not reflected in the transfer activity we are seeing as we are painfully inactive.

 

I am not asking for an overhaul...just 3-4 players who can come in and improve the team. I think you will find that the best teams in the world improve their squads each year...you can't afford to stand still in football.

Lets look at it....Puncheon will go for around a million, as will fish mills and Gobern has gone...we signed Cork for around a million but we will get that back from the Puncheon deal.

 

I am only frustrated because yes we are a good squad but even the most optimistic fan knows that the current squad is mid-table at best...however 2-3 more key signings and i think we would be a strong contender...i can't beleive some fans are happy to walk into a division with teams like Leicester, West Ham and Birmingham with a league 1 squad...madness

 

"we don't know how lucky we have it"...you say....well i say yet another Saints fan happy with mediocrity....yes we have had a terrible last 6 years that doesn't mean we can't expect better in the future.

The club are lucky that they will have around 26,000 capacity to watch their team every week, which shows how big the support base is and just think...excite the fans for once with a big signing and expect to sell more season tickets....simple economics

 

That's a very astute post & echoes my sentiments exactly. We have a strong spine but need a few vital, key additions which most fans seem to rightly identify (Oxo back up/replacement, CF & CB minimum). We could then (hopefully) compete, galvanise our squad & push for the play offs. Step by step marching forwards. Slowly but steadily.

 

Sadly, too many of our fans seem to settle for adequate. In some ways, I can't blame such fans for lack of ambition since it's been the mantra of every single board that's run the club in my lifetime up until now. That attitude has clearly permeated through to certain fans. Possibly "make do" osmosis leeched from the old wooden Dell seats! ;0)

[monosaint]

People are talking about strengthening the squad and I am absolutley with them. BUT.. I also think that most of us were expecting AOC to depart which he may now not do. With that I believe that our squad is now probably only one player short. Good Centre Back. That's all we need. Let's also not forget that a fit Lee Holmes would be a welcome addition to any Championship squad..

[sotonist]

Actually we did. Despite huge turmoil, a poor pre-season under a disinterested manager, an owner death, manager leaving, an awful start and no management at all for quite a few games, Adkins having to get to know the squad, pick up morale, deal with the huge expectations of being favourites by such a long way, AND overhaul points on many teams above us....

 

Despite all that, we clocked up 92 points and werent far off winning the league. That's fcking impressive and only happened because of the sheer talent we have in the squad that made us such strong favourites in the first place, and Adkins doing what so many fail to do and actually getting he best from that talent.

 

Another year of development, another year of gelling, another year of Adkins getting his messages across, a few good additions, removal of huge expectations, better grounds, better pitches and the chance for our players to prove themselves at a higher level - all reasons to be optimistic.

 

Surely most would agree if Adkins had been here last summer we'd have topped 100 points? Sounds like walking it to me. The quality was always there, as it should be with the amount we've spent.

 

Impressivefor sure, but Norwich took their pre-season with Bryn Gunn.

[MerceSaint28]

If AOC goes...we will need to get a quality right winger in that is for sure...Holmes hopefully will be a good squad player but with his injury record, he cannot be relied upon.

 

As it stands we are going to lose Puncheon, Mills and possibly AOC...we need another commanding centre half (Seabourne is not good enough), Pacey striker and right winger (if AOC goes)...

I can't beleive that Adkins and Cortese won't have the AOC situation under control, so im sure if he is gonna go we have replacements lined up...we shall see, just hope it is sorted out the sooner the better as Arsenal have done everything in their power to unsettle the lad

[Gordon Mockles]

Tbf it's only the popular opinion on here and I wouldn't say it is the same offline!

 

That is true. A cyber world of loners, trolls, sh*t stirrers, wind up merchants, compulsive liars, attention seekers, sporting agents, prevaricating businessmen, axe grinders...plus a few more "every day" types certainly isn't atypical to a cross section of a football club's fan base.

[Gordon Mockles]

Popular opinion gets us reality shows, soaps and tedious pop in the charts.

 

It falls down on account of a depressingly high proportion of people being complete morons.

 

That's a very good point. Big Brother...I rest my case in agreement with you. In the sporting world, if fan opinion is all shouting the same, maybe there's some sense in it. However, football fans are fickle and you only need to sit in St Mary's for an afternoon to hear the shouts and jaunts and realise how f*ckin clueless and stupid some fans really are. The mean intellect of 10 idiots will be poor. Throw in a few high scoring Mensa academics and the average will increase...although I can't see that happening on this forum anytime soon! ;o)

[EBS1980]

. Let's also not forget that a fit Lee Holmes would be a welcome addition to any Championship squad..

 

But history has shown we can't rely on him staying fit.

[Johnny Shearer]

That's a very astute post & echoes my sentiments exactly. We have a strong spine but need a few vital, key additions which most fans seem to rightly identify (Oxo back up/replacement, CF & CB minimum). We could then (hopefully) compete, galvanise our squad & push for the play offs. Step by step marching forwards. Slowly but steadily.

 

Sadly, too many of our fans seem to settle for adequate. In some ways, I can't blame such fans for lack of ambition since it's been the mantra of every single board that's run the club in my lifetime up until now. That attitude has clearly permeated through to certain fans. Possibly "make do" osmosis leeched from the old wooden Dell seats! ;0)

 

But I can turn that around and say people with adequate ambitions for Saints are just being realistic surely?

 

Take in what other clubs are doing, players leaving and coming in - would it not be realistic to think a top 10 finish would be good?

[The Kraken]

Indeed. Lambert did a brilliant job, but not too much different, I think he had more games in charge didn't he? No owner death obviously. Overall similar records.

 

But comparing clubs is dodgy territory. Every club's situation is different and anything can happen. For me we have a great long term advantage over many clubs because of our infrastructure, the players coming through and the fact we've got a core team who've played together quite a while and can rise through the leagues together. Buying a new team for L1, the championship and the top flight is probably the quickest way to get up, but not staying up and progressing long term, and not actually connecting with the fans, being remembered etc. You can't buy that experience in playing together. it's that which we're following from barcelona, not the quality or titles etc., but the model of concentrating on a consistent team that can progress together.

 

I agree with a lot of that, but I think the comparisons with Norwich are very relevant. You could argue that we're clubs of a similar size, and have had similar recent successes (and failures). Relegated to League 1, make a whole load of signings, new manager early into the season, much increased fortunes, and promotion to the Championship (albeit ours was one year later).

 

Norwich then made at least 7 early new signings on their arrival in the Championship. So far, we've made one. Of course it's yet to be seen whether we'll make more (I believe 1 or 2 signings will be made but no more), but it also looks like we'll be losing Puncheon (who played in the Prem), Mills (who played in the Championship), we've also lost Gobern and there still remain doubts whether AOC will still be here come kick off.

 

Of course, it's not all about a numbers game, and you could perhaps argue that our overall squad strength was maybe stronger than Norwich's when they went up. But Norwich have set the benchmark, and their way of doing it was to sign a number of Championship and above quality players. We may well yet do that, or indeed our squad may surprise peopl and actually out-perform the majority of expectations. But until it happens it's fair for some (including myself, by the way) to register an opinion that the current squad isn't going to be strong enough for a play-off push.

[NickG]

who were those 7 signings? Not chasing names like Leicester and West Ham are doing, but adding players in the main from the lower leagues

[The Kraken]

who were those 7 signings? Not chasing names like Leicester and West Ham are doing, but adding players in the main from the lower leagues

 

"Names" don't mean anything, and don't guarantee success.

 

In any case, they weren't predominantly from the lower leagues. 2 from the Premier League (Surman, Ruddy), 1 from the Championship (Ward), 1 from Glasgow Rangers (Smith). The 3 other players were signed from League 1 (Simeon Jackson, Andrew Crofts, David Fox), they had all had successful seasons with their respective clubs and all went on to become 1st team regulars. As did all the other signings except for Smith.

[Minsk]

Actually we did. Despite huge turmoil, a poor pre-season under a disinterested manager, an owner death, manager leaving, an awful start and no management at all for quite a few games, Adkins having to get to know the squad, pick up morale, deal with the huge expectations of being favourites by such a long way, AND overhaul points on many teams above us....

 

Despite all that, we clocked up 92 points and werent far off winning the league. That's fcking impressive and only happened because of the sheer talent we have in the squad that made us such strong favourites in the first place, and Adkins doing what so many fail to do and actually getting he best from that talent.

 

Another year of development, another year of gelling, another year of Adkins getting his messages across, a few good additions, removal of huge expectations, better grounds, better pitches and the chance for our players to prove themselves at a higher level - all reasons to be optimistic.

 

Surely most would agree if Adkins had been here last summer we'd have topped 100 points? Sounds like walking it to me. The quality was always there, as it should be with the amount we've spent.

 

Good post Adrian. However, you will not convince Lardy, Doody, et al, that he did well last season. As soon as Adkins was appointed they made it perfectly clear they were not happy, and that anything bar auto-promotion would have had them calling for his head. I fully expect them to start doing so if we are below mid-table a couple of months into the new season/more than 10 points from the play-offs at Christmas.

 

P.S. I believe Lambert took over at Norwich only 1 or 2 games into the season. I know for certain he was the opposition manager who gave them a 7-1 drubbing, at home, first game of the season. If I remember correctly, he was their new manager only a few days later.

[Quickfire Double]

Popular opinion gets us reality shows, soaps and tedious pop in the charts.

 

It falls down on account of a depressingly high proportion of people being complete morons.

 

This. If you're finished with this quote, please may I have it?!

[up and away]

I agree with a lot of that, but I think the comparisons with Norwich are very relevant. You could argue that we're clubs of a similar size, and have had similar recent successes (and failures). Relegated to League 1, make a whole load of signings, new manager early into the season, much increased fortunes, and promotion to the Championship (albeit ours was one year later).

 

Norwich then made at least 7 early new signings on their arrival in the Championship. So far, we've made one. Of course it's yet to be seen whether we'll make more (I believe 1 or 2 signings will be made but no more), but it also looks like we'll be losing Puncheon (who played in the Prem), Mills (who played in the Championship), we've also lost Gobern and there still remain doubts whether AOC will still be here come kick off.

 

Of course, it's not all about a numbers game, and you could perhaps argue that our overall squad strength was maybe stronger than Norwich's when they went up. But Norwich have set the benchmark, and their way of doing it was to sign a number of Championship and above quality players. We may well yet do that, or indeed our squad may surprise peopl and actually out-perform the majority of expectations. But until it happens it's fair for some (including myself, by the way) to register an opinion that the current squad isn't going to be strong enough for a play-off push.

 

Previously I would have said the comparison with Norwich was meaningless, because we never went on a consistent run. We ended that when we won the play off spot under such pressure, it only underlines how good that run was. Lambert is an exceptionally good manager who had some luck, but mostly of their own making. But to emulate Norwich we are going to need to find our own Holt, a task that is more than likely beyond us and our budget.

[Matthew Le God]

But to emulate Norwich we are going to need to find our own Holt, a task that is more than likely beyond us and our budget.

 

Is that the same Grant Holt that Rickie Lambert outscored in 2009/10?

[Saints foreva]

Clarke we do in essence have a Championship club i agree...Lallana, Fonte, Chamberlain, Lambert and maybe Scheniderlain would walk into any team in the Champ, that much is obvious.

 

Deluded.

[Joesaint]

Deluded.

 

I agree that alot of out players would walk into uther teams as well, we go a quality season coming up I'm sure.

[Saint Charlie]

Deluded.

 

Not at all.

[Village Saint]

in time Adkins was manager we out performed Lambert's time with Norwich in league 1.

 

think your point fails straight away

 

Indeed and of course when we played them there at the alleged height of their powers in their promotion year, we trounced them. And that was before Adkins made us a much better side.

[S-Clarke]

It was once said that to stand a chance when you're promoted, you need to have at least 4 players that are capable of playing at the level above. Otherwise you'll need to spend millions.

 

I say we have an entire team capable of playing at this level...which is much more than can be said about P'Boro and even Brighton to some extent. We've got more championship experience in our squad than both of those sides.

 

And people also seem to forget...we are a newly promoted side too! To expect us to be competing with the likes of Leicester and West Ham straight away is a little naive. - but we've got more than enough to give it a good go, and that's all I ask for from next season really.

[up and away]

Is that the same Grant Holt that Rickie Lambert outscored in 2009/10?

 

That's the one, even scored the same amount of goals as Lee Barnard that season. Interestingly does not take the penalties, so relies upon open play to get his goals. Take away the penalties this season and you are in Guly territory for Ricky. There's dumb and there's dumb, but trying to equate those two after what we saw a league apart last season is blinding. Best to stick to the fantasy side.

[Saints foreva]

Not at all.

 

I think all the listed players in that comment would compete for a space in each squad in this league but there is no way they would walk into every team in this league.

[Window Cleaner]

That's the one, even scored the same amount of goals as Lee Barnard that season. Interestingly does not take the penalties, so relies upon open play to get his goals. Take away the penalties this season and you are in Guly territory for Ricky. There's dumb and there's dumb, but trying to equate those two after what we saw a league apart last season is blinding. Best to stick to the fantasy side.

 

At least I'm not the only one who separates penalties from total goal tally then.Who's better (or more valuable) a striker who scores 15 goals from open play or one who gets 2 from open play and 13 penalties. Players who get fouled in the box to "win" the penalty don't even get an assist to their name.Yet they did the hard work,got taken out and some other player gets all the credit for the goal just because he slots it past the keeper.

[Dig Dig]

At least I'm not the only one who separates penalties from total goal tally then.Who's better (or more valuable) a striker who scores 15 goals from open play or one who gets 2 from open play and 13 penalties. Players who get fouled in the box to "win" the penalty don't even get an assist to their name.Yet they did the hard work,got taken out and some other player gets all the credit for the goal just because he slots it past the keeper.

 

You make it sound like taking a penalty is easy and that a goal is a formality. You still need somene with the mental strength, skill and technique needed to score them. I don't hear people constantly taking anything away from le tiss when mentioning his goal scoring record

[terrypward]

Penalties are still goals - cast your mind back a couple of years when McGoldrick, Surman and Wotton were having a go...

[Window Cleaner]

You make it sound like taking a penalty is easy and that a goal is a formality. You still need somene with the mental strength, skill and technique needed to score them. I don't hear people constantly taking anything away from le tiss when mentioning his goal scoring record

 

It's not a question of taking anything away from anybody, for me Le Tissier scored xxxx goals and yyyy penalties to make a total of zzzz. I see all players that way because I personally think that it's the right way to look at it.

[Dig Dig]

It's not a question of taking anything away from anybody, for me Le Tissier scored xxxx goals and yyyy penalties to make a total of zzzz. I see all players that way because I personally think that it's the right way to look at it.

 

Ok, and what about free kicks? Or even tap in's from 1 yard into an empty net? Should these count along with the other conventional goals?

 

For me a goal is a goal and we should be greatful to anyone in our squad who can score them however they come

[Saint Charlie]

Ok, and what about free kicks? Or even tap in's from 1 yard into an empty net? Should these count along with the other conventional goals?

 

For me a goal is a goal and we should be greatful to anyone in our squad who can score them however they come

 

Yes. To suggest otherwise is crazy. Lambert has nailed every penalty for us, some of them very important. Dealing with that pressure and showing such good technique is just as worthy a skill as an open play goal, if not more.

 

So many good players can't consistently take good penalites. They are as much a goal as any other and someone who always scores them should be Championed.

[The Kraken]

Yes. To suggest otherwise is crazy. Lambert has nailed every penalty for us, some of them very important. Dealing with that pressure and showing such good technique is just as worthy a skill as an open play goal, if not more.

 

So many good players can't consistently take good penalites. They are as much a goal as any other and someone who always scores them should be Championed.

 

Exactly right. To try to claim that a successful penalty from 12 yards is less valid as a goal than one that goes in unwittingly off your arse from 1 yard out is a bit of a nonsensical statement.

[up and away]

Yes. To suggest otherwise is crazy. Lambert has nailed every penalty for us, some of them very important. Dealing with that pressure and showing such good technique is just as worthy a skill as an open play goal, if not more.

 

So many good players can't consistently take good penalites. They are as much a goal as any other and someone who always scores them should be Championed.

 

When we get a penalty my only thought is to get that ball to Ricky and add a goal to our score, he's been that good. But in reality lets say you give all the penalties to our second bast taker, what's the difference going to be? IMHO I would estimate that at about 2-3 goals difference in goals and about 5-7 points. That is a fair estimate of the difference in Ricky taking the penalties, no where near the total quantity.

 

We got a lot of penalties last season in comparison to the previous season and there was not a smidgen of doubt about any of them. Just surprised it was only the one clean strike from free kicks, can't really understand the difference with both being dead ball situations.

[NickG]

"Names" don't mean anything, and don't guarantee success.

 

In any case, they weren't predominantly from the lower leagues. 2 from the Premier League (Surman, Ruddy), 1 from the Championship (Ward), 1 from Glasgow Rangers (Smith). The 3 other players were signed from League 1 (Simeon Jackson, Andrew Crofts, David Fox), they had all had successful seasons with their respective clubs and all went on to become 1st team regulars. As did all the other signings except for Smith.

 

A lot of poetic licence there!

 

Ruddy - premier league player? one premiership appearance in 2006 when first 2 keepers injured and 3rd choice got sent off! More likely to be found turning out for Rushden and Diamonds or Crewe!

 

Surman - what was it about 5 premiership appearances

 

Smith was a free agent not signed from Rangers as had hardly played there in years.

 

Yes Ward from playing in Championship having been well down the pecking order at Coventry and loaned out to Doncaster and Preston

 

Probably most of their signings would have scoffed at on here, proves point that balanced team ethic is more important sometimes than doing a Leicester

 

Their squad wasn't one picked from the top of championship or prem

Edited 19 July, 2011 by NickG
poor grammar

[The Kraken]

A lot of poetic licence there!

 

Ruddy - premier league player? one premiership appearance in 2006 when first 2 keepers injured and 3rd choice got sent off! More likely to be found turning out for Rushden and Diamonds or Crewe!

 

Surman - what was it about 5 premiership appearances

 

Smith was a free agent not signed from Rangers as had hardly played there in years.

 

Yes Ward from playing in Championship having been well down the pecking order at Coventry and loaned out to Doncaster and Preston

 

Probably most of their signings would have scoffed at on here, proves point that balanced team ethic is more important sometimes than doing a Leicester

 

There squad wasn't one picked from the top of championship or prem

 

Where have you got the notion from that I'm comparing us to Leicester? I've never said that. I'm comparing us to Norwich, and how similar we are to them. Leicester have got nothing to do with, so you've confused me.

 

I'll outline my point to you again, as I'm sure you must have missed it. There are an awful lot of parallels between how Norwich & Saints have fared in the past few years. Relegation from the Premier League. Subsequent relegation to League 1. A lot of player transfers out and in. And, one year apart, a massive improvement with a newly hired manager early in the season which resulted in some great form and promotion.

 

In League 1, Norwich's form under Paul Lambert and our form under Nigel Adkins are staggeringly similar (I know you love a points per game stat, I think it is 2.11 pts per game for Lambert and 2.14 pts per game for Adkins). So its reasonably fair to say that, at the point of promotion, the two teams were relatively of the same strength, give or take.

 

What happened after promotion from League 1 is that Norwich further strengthened; they bought 7 new players. 6 of those players went on to become first team players; 5 of them played well in excess of 30 games in a season, Surman surely would have but for injury. Where these players came from is irrelevant; they came in and improved the team.

 

So the point I'm making is this: We and Norwich were fairly similar in strength when promoted. Norwich deemed that more than half their team wasn't good enough for a crack at the Championship title, so they bought new players.

 

We, on the other hand, have so far signed 1 player. Leaving aside losing Puncheon, Mills, Gobern (and the possibility of losing Chamberlain), we haven't strengthened to anywhere near the same degree. Even Adkins is talking about only signing 1, maybe 2 more players. Now obviously that doesn't tell the whole tale, some of our players may indeed be capable of stepping up and emulating their Norwich counterparts. But I don't think it's unfair to outline a personal belief that this current squad are not good enough to emulate what Norwich did, which is really the ultimate aim.

[NickG]

not saying you personally compared Norwich with Leicester but Norwich are often wheeled out as an example of the need to buy.

 

think some think they went on a spending spree (you seemed to suggest they had bought established players from a higher level - they didn't.

 

Has Ruddy any better pedigree than Bart?

 

Did Surman have more experience than Cork?

 

Do we need the lower level squad signings that Norwich made when we can put two teams out like we have been in pre-season

 

Saying Norwich had gaps in their squad that needed filling means nothing when comparing us.

 

The rest of your comparisons are fair.

[saintpat]

I think the majority of people would have been happy to have added just 3 players to our existing squad and just got rid of Puncheon.

We have Cork, as long as we get a good striker and a CB then I and I think many others will be happy. As Adkins has said 1 or 2 in, and I believe it will be 2, it is likely I will be happy.

[The Kraken]

not saying you personally compared Norwich with Leicester but Norwich are often wheeled out as an example of the need to buy.

 

think some think they went on a spending spree (you seemed to suggest they had bought established players from a higher level - they didn't.

 

Has Ruddy any better pedigree than Bart?

 

Did Surman have more experience than Cork?

 

Do we need the lower level squad signings that Norwich made when we can put two teams out like we have been in pre-season

 

Saying Norwich had gaps in their squad that needed filling means nothing when comparing us.

 

The rest of your comparisons are fair.

 

I'm not saying that at all. Norwich signed first team players.

 

Ruddy played 45 times in the league last season.

Elliott Ward played 39 times.

Andrew Crofts 44 times.

David Fox 32 times.

Simeon Jackson 39 times.

And Andrew Surman 22 times, in a season significantly curtailed by injury.

 

That's not buying lower squad players at all.

 

Norwich also showed that you don't necessarily NEED to do a Leicester and spend huge amounts on high profile players. That's not what I'm advocating at all. They have a good manager and he outlined some very shrewd signings.