Wade Garrett Posted 6 July, 2011 Share Posted 6 July, 2011 For anyone who doesn't think Forte was a good signing, remember the MK Dons game that really turned our season. Adkins and Cortese chose not to splash the cash in January because they were confident the squad was good enough for promotion. As a result of this, we have probably got a bigger budget to play with now. For me that shows shrewd judgement. For the more hysterical on here, it shows 'lack of ambition'. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
benjii Posted 6 July, 2011 Share Posted 6 July, 2011 Another one slips through net!!1!1 http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/mobile/football/14051735.stm?psdata=11_3Cp8_4__P9_10CpCD11__CK12_14_15_ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thedelldays Posted 6 July, 2011 Share Posted 6 July, 2011 anyone ever thought our booing fans are the problem...word gets around you know Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PokingFun Posted 6 July, 2011 Share Posted 6 July, 2011 Not when this fantastic football is concearned, we are more than just a pay cheque, we are a way of life. And you're a bore with your constant stream of trivial sarcasm. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Turkish Posted 6 July, 2011 Share Posted 6 July, 2011 And you're a bore with your constant stream of trivial sarcasm. Please explain. I was educated over the weekend as to why players will join this fantastic football club, thank you very much. We are not just a pay cheque and footballers aren't like checkout operators who will down tools and move supermarket for an extra £1 an hour you know. Players will come here for the dream, the vision, the fact their wives will love shopping at West Quay and thier kids will love living near Peppa Pig world etc etc... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Windmill Arm 2 Posted 6 July, 2011 Share Posted 6 July, 2011 No I don't mean that type of attract...... (Now that is out the way). Basically at work had a good convo with a fellow Saint and I think he raises an interesting point. Maybe the reason for the lack of arrivals and players wanting to move here has a little to do with Adkins? The guy has a great record in League One with both S****horpe and Saints. However beyond that he has a pretty awful record in The Championship. Two seasons there, one relegation and one 20th place finish. If you look back at his signings over the past year you have to say most were average at best. Chaplow is the only one who did well even though he had some poor spells too. In my opinion the reason Pardew could bring players in of the quality of Fonte/Lambert etc was in part down to his experience and reputation he gained. He went from us to Newcastle so that shows he is at least respected for his football experience. Adkins on the other hand is a guy who has to work his way up the ladder and obviously Saints is his best way of doing that. As my mate say's maybe these players don't think playing under Adkins is that big a deal? Especially when you consider the other managers in the league i.e. Sven, Big Sam,Mclaren,Holloway,Hughton,Jewell,Grayson,Mowbry etc who all have experience above what Adkins has. Now this isn't an "Adkins is the problem, Adkins out" type thread, don't be stupid. It is a thread asking if the manager’s name/reputation/experience plays a big role in attracting players to a club? The other threads suggest the problem is money or even Cortese and agents being the issue. But maybe it is just the players we are after want to play under a manager with more experience, maybe one who has managed in the top flight?Another mongy post..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JustMike Posted 6 July, 2011 Share Posted 6 July, 2011 Another mongy post..... and another! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saint-Armstrong Posted 6 July, 2011 Share Posted 6 July, 2011 maybe Adkins cant sell the vision very well You are joking right? Seen any of his interviews in the past year or so? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charlie Wayman Posted 6 July, 2011 Share Posted 6 July, 2011 Also about the whole money thing. There are always going to be greedy players in it for the money. But there will also be players who want to win stuff. They certainly won't be winning anything here for a few years and that's all most of them have got at the top. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aintforever Posted 6 July, 2011 Share Posted 6 July, 2011 Its a bit more complicated than paying the right money. A player will arguably accept less money from a club if he believes that club is going places and will boost his future earning power -whether because he'll put himself in the shop window by playing for a successful team or he'll earn an uplift by getting the team promoted. Or a player will accept less cash in return for match time - not necessarily for any love of the game, but because he can build a reputation. Things will also depend on the age of the player - younger players will typically place less emphasis on current salary than older ones. True, but generally if a club is willing to pay more in wages it generally means it is more likely to be is going places. A player will see a club offering them more money as a club being more ambitious. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
saint lard Posted 6 July, 2011 Share Posted 6 July, 2011 You are joking right? Seen any of his interviews in the past year or so? Depends on how gullable you are and if you can make sense of them once you have clawed your way through the repetative non sensical terms he uses on occasions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Duckhunter Posted 6 July, 2011 Share Posted 6 July, 2011 Makes you wonder how Lawrie signed Osgood, Ball,Keegan ect. He was hardly a big name manager like Don revie, Bill Shankly or Brian Clough. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John B Posted 6 July, 2011 Share Posted 6 July, 2011 Well he is a big name ex manager and whats more is still alive He was a big name when he signed both Keegan and Ball after 1976 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LostBoys Posted 6 July, 2011 Share Posted 6 July, 2011 We will find out Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
offix Posted 6 July, 2011 Share Posted 6 July, 2011 I think the issues with players is Adkins likes team players - many of the likes we have been linked with do not appear as team players, more individuals. His methods seem to work - he's got the best out of the squad and they all look to be loving it. It is a developing squad and to be honest some players might be intimidated by the togtherness of the existing squad. I think any player coming in has to be a bit special - he must have the thumbs up from Adkins (without overloading us with his old boys) and fit in with the squad. Most of all they have got to want to play for Southampton...and believe it or not I think that is where the problem lies. Many people over the years were attracted by lucrative contracts and easy money and no will to win due to expectations. It's different now - sensible money and an air of expectation...it's all pressure!! Good summing up of the situation. Totally agree! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NickG Posted 6 July, 2011 Share Posted 6 July, 2011 (edited) Who would a player rather sign for Paul Lambert or the mad clown holloway? its a boss you are talking about - not someone they are going to ask for an autograph. Edited 6 July, 2011 by NickG Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dune Posted 6 July, 2011 Share Posted 6 July, 2011 Eventually I think he will as both his and the clubs profile is raised, BUT we're never going to be able to compete with London, Birmingham or North West clubs because basically Southampton is a sleepy backwater. That will not change. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Red And White Barmy Army Posted 6 July, 2011 Share Posted 6 July, 2011 CMS is probably not a good example as 1) it doesn't seem we were in for him during the summer and 2) Gus Poyet cannot be classed as an experienced and high profile manager that can attract players simply due to his reputation. I think CMS proves the opposite in fact ... players will go anywhere if the money and guarantee of playing time is there. 1) Fair point - I haven't been keeping track of all the constant rumours so just plucked 1 out the air tbh. 2) Gus Poyet gains players' respect for his playing career more than anything. Rightly or wrongly, some (most) players don't take much notice of where they got their reputation. Even (supposedly) more educated chairmen can't see the wood thru the trees at times - plenty of examples of players given management roles without any coaching experience whatsoever (e.g. Shearer). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Miltonroadboy Posted 6 July, 2011 Share Posted 6 July, 2011 Do feel that the thread about NA not being able to attract bigger names has validity. The fact that Gobern - not a big name I know but has been touted by NA as one for the future - has opted to stay in League 1 says a lot to me. Do not think that any player would turn down the chance of playing in the Championship and thus putting themselves in the shop window if all was well in house? Forte, N'Guessen.... not a promising track record here I'm afraid!! Hopefully I will be proven totally wrong and made to eat my words! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saint Charlie Posted 6 July, 2011 Share Posted 6 July, 2011 Gobern needs games. He would always have been 4th or 5th choice next season. If we really wanted to keep him we would have not let him get so close to the end of his contract. I think we just want the best fee possible for him, hence Adkins bigging him up a bit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Supersubpuckett Posted 6 July, 2011 Share Posted 6 July, 2011 We're one of very few championship clubs not to have signed anyone yet. The recent interviews with NA see him talk about how we've made offers and the chairman is fully behind - all delivered with a very concerned expression. Could it be he's coming under pressure because we haven't landed any targets yet. Must admit i'm quite surprised we still haven't made a signing - especially given our ambitions. We so obviously need 4/5 new players as the current squad just won't be good enough. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NickG Posted 6 July, 2011 Share Posted 6 July, 2011 also one of few championship sides not to have lost any first squad players. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
saints-cris Posted 6 July, 2011 Share Posted 6 July, 2011 also one of few championship sides not to have lost any first squad players. Considering some of the talent we have, I think this is a pretty good point. That to me says that Adkins has the current players backing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BallBoy Posted 6 July, 2011 Share Posted 6 July, 2011 Makes you wonder how Lawrie signed Osgood, Ball,Keegan ect. He was hardly a big name manager like Don revie, Bill Shankly or Brian Clough. That's just the point. Lawrie had CHARISMA which, sadly I think, Adkins lacks. I know this will sound like a personal criticism but he does look like a maths teacher. The sweater does not help. I really hope that the money, potential, training ground and structure will help convince the quality players we need that they should come. I think that we need a "marquee" signing to help show the way. Others would follow. Kevin Nolan was a good signing for this league. I am not sure Adkins would have even thought of that sort of signing. I do believe that Adkins is a very good coach and he has built a very solid team ethic. He has excellent qualities but he is no Keegan or Lawrie. It is my only question mark about him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NickG Posted 6 July, 2011 Share Posted 6 July, 2011 would rather a good manager than a celebrity Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thedelldays Posted 6 July, 2011 Share Posted 6 July, 2011 this thread is quite sad....just been promoted and the daggers are out for the manager already... guess its just the southampton way.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Avenue Saint Posted 6 July, 2011 Share Posted 6 July, 2011 Mong thread! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NickG Posted 6 July, 2011 Share Posted 6 July, 2011 Mong thread! think would have saved time if that was first replied and we moved on Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Channon's Sideburns Posted 6 July, 2011 Share Posted 6 July, 2011 For all the Adkins dissenters, I give to you....George Burley. Supposed big name manager, who bought, mainly, dross. Judge Adkins at the end of this season, not before. Seems to have been overlooked that we signed the likes of Fonte who is already championship standard. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dubai_phil Posted 6 July, 2011 Share Posted 6 July, 2011 (edited) this thread is quite sad....just been promoted and the daggers are out for the manager already... guess its just the southampton way.. Totally agree with you on this one. That undercurrent was there even up to the MKD game. It was clear to anyone that we were playing winning football. Some people simply do not like being happy and have to look for something to moan about, more so historically as Saints Fans. FFS we could get into the CL in 3 years time and there would STILL be people moaning. Pardew? Ask any Geordie fan what they think of him after selling carroll and p1ssing away 35mil on nothing http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/football/teams/newcastle-united/8618782/Alan-Pardew-defends-Newcastle-spending-policy-but-fans-fear-team-will-suffer-without-significant-reinvestment.html Wenger? nobody wants to play for him http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/football/teams/arsenal/8616694/Arsenal-Telling-time-for-Arsene-Wenger-as-one-player-leaves-and-others-consider-move.html We have a bloody good TEAM for the first time in YEARS. We need a couple of BETTER players who could develop into PL players, not a hundred names off the internet rumours mill. IF we fail to find any in the next 9 weeks or so then fair enough but to moan now? jeez Edited 6 July, 2011 by dubai_phil Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SW11_Saint Posted 6 July, 2011 Share Posted 6 July, 2011 Looking for an issue that isn't there... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NickG Posted 6 July, 2011 Share Posted 6 July, 2011 re-assured that most see this as more crap Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prince Jazzbo Posted 6 July, 2011 Share Posted 6 July, 2011 He has excellent qualities but he is no Keegan or Lawrie. It is my only question mark about him. Thank god for that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sfc4prem Posted 6 July, 2011 Share Posted 6 July, 2011 I think this is just another person fretting about lack of signings trying to find a reason why. Silly. Adkins has great potential, and we should give him the chance to build a good reputation and make himself a "big name". If that means we have a period of not being able to attract stupidly short-sighted players, then so be it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
corsacar saint Posted 6 July, 2011 Share Posted 6 July, 2011 Mcmenemy was his own publicist and loved to massage his big ego,Adkins does niether,so what point are some of you trying to make? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dig Dig Posted 6 July, 2011 Share Posted 6 July, 2011 this thread is quite sad....just been promoted and the daggers are out for the manager already... guess its just the southampton way.. Well said. Trust Saints not to follow the promotion feel good factor to at least the start of the season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gordon Mockles Posted 6 July, 2011 Share Posted 6 July, 2011 this thread is quite sad....just been promoted and the daggers are out for the manager already... guess its just the southampton way.. I think what you say holds absolute credence. I've lived here all my life & whilst I have many good, life long friends here, every time I travel elsewhere (bar B'mouth), the general (not all, but significant enough to notice) attitude of people seems friendlier & less hostile. Certainly not as big a chip on the shoulder. Is it a Hampshire thing? It's like with all the cruise liners & a new shopping centre, Sotonites think they're in Monaco (Oxford St has similar prices without any of the prestige) & have developed an attitude like those tedious upper middle class snobs or the worst denominator of society, the noveau riche. Sadly, So'ton is quite chavy & it's great potential as a city will likely never be met whilst constantly ruined by inept town planners & a consensus of arrogance & superiority. I'm not anti So'ton as I love my home town but the attitude of many, including some Saints fans, stinks. Just read the more level headed forums from other clubs (bar the Skates) & you'll here much reasoned debate & a more understanding, coherent consensus. Many of our fans think we have a god given right to success & Adkins isn't good enough. Same people arrogantly slating & complanning before a ball has so much been kicked in anger. We got promoted & have the busiest transfer month or 2 ahead. Our board are shrewd, we have a solid backing, we have lost no players of discernible quality, we are keeping our youth starlets (Oxo may go but that won't be our fault) & FINALLY we have a board who care about the FOOTBALL (not the dividends for themselves or their piers) & a board that have done so much right & barely put a foot wrong AND with an up & coming manager yet still you f**kin complain. Spoilt brats springs to mind. Be thankful. Some have short memories! I have faith & fans should be grateful & show more support. If we've signed no-one come Aug, then perhaps it's acceptable to be concerned but until then, have some patience & be f*ckin thankful. Plymouth fans must think we're a bunch of whining, ungrateful tossers! We will bolster & we will progress. Get behind your club! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
St Marco Posted 6 July, 2011 Author Share Posted 6 July, 2011 (edited) this thread is quite sad....just been promoted and the daggers are out for the manager already... guess its just the southampton way.. Oh do give over..... Nobody is calling for Adkins to be sacked so don't try and make it into that.... I am one of the positive ones, far more so then you. I am not fretting about signings or anything like that. It is a simple question that in it's simplist form is this "Can a manager influence where a player decides to play?". And if you read Nolans remarks about Sam then obviously they do. It seems on here we have a bunch of people who can't handle debate. If it is something negative they must have an agenda. If they talk and say something bad about the manager they must want him out. If they mention something the chairman did that was wrong then they must be ungrateful. And all the rest of that ********. I am not fretting that we have not had signings. Read my post in the ambition thread. I said pretty clearly most people me included would be happy to start the season with our current squad. I even said that i actually am glad we didn't sign CMS or Nugent. Hardly negative.... Me and a mate were talking about why Cork and possibly Sharp/Maynard did not want to move here. Maybe the manager and his lack of experience at the highest level play's some part even if just a tiny % in that. Based on what some people on here are suggesting signings go like this Player - How much are you offering me? Club - 1k a week Player -10k a week and we got a deal Club - done Which is just silly. There are far more things involved then just money. Because if it was about money why have these guy's not signed? We had bids accepted for them? To wonder and speculate why is the whole point of having a forum isn't it? By the looks of it some people think the point is to come on giving it the large and have some kind of **** waving contest....that is what is sad. That you can't even have discussion on here without the usual knobs invading it and turning it into something it isn't... Edited 6 July, 2011 by St Marco Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hypochondriac Posted 6 July, 2011 Share Posted 6 July, 2011 Gordon Mockles, it works both ways. You complain about the quality of this board but then anyone with an opposing view is shouted down an jumped upon. Personally I welcome alternative views because it makes things more interesting. Te same cannot be said for nickg and his ilk. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trader Posted 7 July, 2011 Share Posted 7 July, 2011 The point about McMenemy is well made. Southampton were never a fashionable club, but he got some fantastic players to come and play for Saints because he sold them the vision. I believe that the manager of a club can make a big difference in the players that club can attract. If Alex Ferguson, for instance, moved to any other club he could still get the best to come and play for him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pilchards Posted 7 July, 2011 Share Posted 7 July, 2011 I think the issues with players is Adkins likes team players - many of the likes we have been linked with do not appear as team players, more individuals. His methods seem to work - he's got the best out of the squad and they all look to be loving it. It is a developing squad and to be honest some players might be intimidated by the togtherness of the existing squad. I think any player coming in has to be a bit special - he must have the thumbs up from Adkins (without overloading us with his old boys) and fit in with the squad. Most of all they have got to want to play for Southampton...and believe it or not I think that is where the problem lies. Many people over the years were attracted by lucrative contracts and easy money and no will to win due to expectations. It's different now - sensible money and an air of expectation...it's all pressure!! Well said Yorkie! I hope some of the current players are telling others it's a great place to be in the hope it might attract a player that Adkins might be interested in. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ghq Posted 7 July, 2011 Share Posted 7 July, 2011 Not many, if even one, of the posters on this thread, know for certain whether or not players sign for any of the reasons put forward. I think the original question asked is valid. Those who have had a go at the author of it obliously don't agree, but why get upset over a question, not even a point of view? I think the sooner the season kicks off, the better. Hopefully we end up with "N Adkins Football Legend Star Of the Champions League.", but surely it's a little way off as yet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John B Posted 7 July, 2011 Share Posted 7 July, 2011 Well at the moment Adkins appears to be able to attract quality players to the club but that could easily change and he has put one quality player Puncheon is in the naughty corner. Although posters feel that the team is pretty good at the moment and I agree there should be no problem with the being able to compete in the Championship this season with the addition perhaps of a couple of players that is not the point if the main goal of the club is to get to the PL in three years time. As the team is plainly not good enough to do that especially if there are serious injuries to key players. I feel that if the club wants to get to the PL it will have to pay over the odds in fees and wages because of the competition from other clubs and it maybe this factor and not Nigel which is stopping players coming. It is easy to say CMS is not worth £2.5m but in today’s market he clearly is and we seem to have bid for Billy Sharp at £3.25m ourselves and Nugent‘s wages are excessive but we paid high wages in the Crouch/Wilde era too To posters who don’t want to discuss threads sensibly and want to ridicule contributions on the forum I would like to say I am not moaning just saying what I have observed and looking forward to the new season which will be the fiftieth in which I have watched the Saints I don’t want Adkins out and I doubt whether anybody does I am just responding to the point raised on the forum and how I see it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NickG Posted 7 July, 2011 Share Posted 7 July, 2011 maybe CMS is worth it to a club without any prestige wanting to improve their image and whose forwards have left them in the summer but not to a club who already have several good league 1 forwards? Nolan went to Allardyce because he was paid sillly money and had played for him before - not because he was famous. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
forever a red and white Posted 7 July, 2011 Share Posted 7 July, 2011 Adkins has answered every question asked of him, the main one, bringing a positive atmosphere for the training camp and getting us promoted BOTH HE AND PARDEW HAVE STATED THAT SIGNINGS MADE IN LEAGUE 1 ARE ALSO FOR THE CHAMPIONSHIP, so don't expect huge purchases because we spent big in League 1 and made financial losses. We will add in small numbers, we only need a big name to keep the naieve and unrealistic happy. Progression should always be made, and that will happen no doubt with a few additions here and there. Patience. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NickG Posted 7 July, 2011 Share Posted 7 July, 2011 We will add in small numbers, we only need a big name to keep the naieve and unrealistic happy. Progression should always be made, and that will happen no doubt with a few additions here and there. Patience. spot on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
doddisalegend Posted 7 July, 2011 Share Posted 7 July, 2011 You are joking right? Seen any of his interviews in the past year or so? Yes sadly, even by football manager standards they are poor, cliched and annoying. Still managers aren't hired for their ability to give good interviews as long as we're winning I couldn't care less if Nigel chooses to give his interviews in latin,while naked and chewing on a sausage. However if he talks to the players the way he talks in interviews I could see him putting people off...... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
doddisalegend Posted 7 July, 2011 Share Posted 7 July, 2011 Well at the moment Adkins appears to be able to attract quality players to the club but that could easily change and he has put one quality player Puncheon is in the naughty corner. Although posters feel that the team is pretty good at the moment and I agree there should be no problem with the being able to compete in the Championship this season with the addition perhaps of a couple of players that is not the point if the main goal of the club is to get to the PL in three years time. As the team is plainly not good enough to do that especially if there are serious injuries to key players. I feel that if the club wants to get to the PL it will have to pay over the odds in fees and wages because of the competition from other clubs and it maybe this factor and not Nigel which is stopping players coming. It is easy to say CMS is not worth £2.5m but in today’s market he clearly is and we seem to have bid for Billy Sharp at £3.25m ourselves and Nugent‘s wages are excessive but we paid high wages in the Crouch/Wilde era too To posters who don’t want to discuss threads sensibly and want to ridicule contributions on the forum I would like to say I am not moaning just saying what I have observed and looking forward to the new season which will be the fiftieth in which I have watched the Saints I don’t want Adkins out and I doubt whether anybody does I am just responding to the point raised on the forum and how I see it Thats the problem the club talks about being sensible with money and self sufficent (which I'm all for) on the one hand while talking of PL/CL football (which I'm not actual to fussed about if I'm honest) on the other. I just don't see the two being very compatible. Either we spend big to achieve PL/CL or we pay what we can afford. To achieve CL football and live within our means would take a massive slice of luck IMO. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Window Cleaner Posted 7 July, 2011 Share Posted 7 July, 2011 It's not just about the manager or the project or the training facilities.Decent players are starting to be exigeant about their potential team mates nowadays. I've heard of players turning clubs down just because there were no plans to sign other 'top' players.Afraid to shoulder all the blame if things go wrong I suppose. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
benjii Posted 7 July, 2011 Share Posted 7 July, 2011 O'Shea going to Sunderland. Another target Adkins has messed up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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