Small Independent Retailers Going To The Wall

[View From The Top]

They appear to be dropping like flies at the moment, even quicker than pubs!

 

One very good retailer, who I've been doing business with for a good few years, shut his doors for the last time today crippled by his rent.

 

What I don't understand is why landlords won't drop their prices and get some money instead of seeing a business fold and then getting no money.

 

Another one I know, who expanded into another couple of properties 5 years ago, is closing down 2 shops, again, due to rent despite having a very healthy order book.

 

Only good thing is I got to buy £2.5k worth of stock at cost from the 1st one so silver linings and all that but soon we will be left with only the big boys and charity shops on the High St which would be a great pity.

[dune]

soon we will be left with only the big boys and charity shops on the High St which would be a great pity.

 

It depends on the area you live in. Yes this is true for grotty towns such as Corby Northants, but in more affluent towns small retailers remain although they do now tend to be restricted to luxury items as oposed to essentials.

[bridge too far]

Perhaps if the archaic system of paying rent quarterly should be looked at. Much easier to manage your cash flow if you pay monthly.

[gaz]

This is a local business I visit regularly, know the owner well but he's had to shut his smaller shop to consolidate business at the more profitable one.

http://www.granthamjournal.co.uk/news/local-business-news/another_one_bites_the_dust_but_business_leaders_say_grantham_has_plenty_to_offer_1_2741682

 

The business is hobby and crafting BTW, niche but sustainable with the likes of Scalextric, Hornby, Warhammer, Tamiya, Revell, Airfix etc.

[dune]

This is a local business I visit regularly, know the owner well but he's had to shut his smaller shop to consolidate business at the more profitable one.

http://www.granthamjournal.co.uk/news/local-business-news/another_one_bites_the_dust_but_business_leaders_say_grantham_has_plenty_to_offer_1_2741682

 

The business is hobby and crafting BTW, niche but sustainable with the likes of Scalextric, Hornby, Warhammer, Tamiya, Revell, Airfix etc.

 

I remember the days when everyone had a radio controlled car. I had a Marui Ninja, as oposed to common Tamiya cars. I was brown band.

 

[gaz]

I had a Marui Galaxy recently to restore for a friend.....non-existant parts supply these days, very valuable cars!

[angelman]

It depends on the area you live in. Yes this is true for grotty towns such as Corby Northants, but in more affluent towns small retailers remain although they do now tend to be restricted to luxury items as oposed to essentials.

I am not so sure it is. Around my neck of the woods, I suppose that I have Bournemouth, Christchurch, Ringwood, New Milton, Lymington. Of those I guess Lymington is the most affluent, and while there are some smaller indys, it is generally the mainstream retailers that you find throughout the country. Out of interest, which town were you thinking of?

 

Perhaps if the archaic system of paying rent quarterly should be looked at. Much easier to manage your cash flow if you pay monthly.

If that is the only reason then maybe buinesses "deserve" not to survive. You can either make this arrangement with your landlord, as I am sure that he would prefer monthly to quarterly as he gets it in quicker, or if for some reason he couldn't take it, then why not set up a system where you pay into another account on a monthly basis and then to the landlord 1/4ly?

[Dr Who?]

I am a credit manager in fashion wholesale, and in the last 8 weeks I hae seen 10 sole traders/partnerships, shut up shop. Some of them have shuttered down and vanished and are being traced. Some of these traders order £5k and then clear off within weeks, others have been trading with us for years and have no gone to the wall. I have many calls a day and I know I have heard all the excuses for non payment, but was told the other day that one of our customer took £28 in the whole day.

 

We do know it is tough out there for our customers and you really have to feel a little for them, and there is no real point going legal with them if they do not have the money. I have a few customers that we have gone legal with and gone all through the courts with legal fees and interest being added to their debt for them to be order to pay £50 a month or something sill like that. One of my legal customers have been paying £250 a month on a £14k debt!!

 

I have been told that it is a good time to try and get a better deal with the leases at the moment as landlords are looking in some cases to just cover their basic costs, and at least just cover their repayments. This of course makes sence and some run on really short leases.

 

It is really tough and it is really sad to see our customers struggle! Some of the things you hear from other do make me think that they should not be in business at all!!

[angelman]

I also think that the internet does cause a lot of problems. People, like me, use shops as a shop window to look at the goods and then go on line to get it cheaper. I was recently in B'mouth buying some trousers. Shop price £65, their own web price £46. While the shop is a lot more expensive to run, I am afraid that if there is going to be a 40% price difference from the same company, then I am always going to buy on-line. I asked whether they would match their on-line price and they said no! They added that if people always did that they would soon have to close their shop. What would you do? Pay a 40% surcharge so that they could keep their shop open?

[bridge too far]

Angelman talks about internet shopping being one cause of small independent retailers failing. And I've talked about archaic leasehold law requiring quarterly rental payment (in advance, Angelman, not in arrears).

 

And of course the big boys undercut the little guy because of their sheer buying power. Another consideration could be the cost of parking. I've lived in two towns in Oxfordshire. One charges (quite a lot) for parking. The other one doesn't. One high street is deathly quiet during the week and not that busy at weekends. The other one? Vibrant all the time. I wonder why?

 

I guess ultimately we can't complain if the little individual high street shops shut if we don't patronise them. But I reckon that once the little guys have been driven out of business the big boys will hike their prices because they've got rid of the opposition.

 

Still, who can blame anyone for hunting out the best deals when we're all feeling the pinch so much. I think this is the tip of the iceberg - even Habitat's gone to the wall FFS!

[EastleighSoulBoy]

Angelman talks about internet shopping being one cause of small independent retailers failing. And I've talked about archaic leasehold law requiring quarterly rental payment (in advance, Angelman, not in arrears).

 

And of course the big boys undercut the little guy because of their sheer buying power. Another consideration could be the cost of parking. I've lived in two towns in Oxfordshire. One charges (quite a lot) for parking. The other one doesn't. One high street is deathly quiet during the week and not that busy at weekends. The other one? Vibrant all the time. I wonder why?

 

I guess ultimately we can't complain if the little individual high street shops shut if we don't patronise them. But I reckon that once the little guys have been driven out of business the big boys will hike their prices because they've got rid of the opposition.

 

Still, who can blame anyone for hunting out the best deals when we're all feeling the pinch so much. I think this is the tip of the iceberg - even Habitat's gone to the wall FFS!

 

Here in Eastleigh the myopic council have raised parking charges 3 times in the last year, the first being a hefty 25% rise! There is now no discount for buying more than one hour's parking as all prices are an exact multiple of the hourly rate. So rather than pay for two hours and meander around the town, possibly spending more money?, the shoppers park up, rush round and do their minimum before shooting off elsewhere. Some now just buy on the internet and others decamp to where parking is cheaper. This council have now even removed, yes removed, disabled parking in one of the newly refurbished multi storeys in the town centre. This council do not want cars in the town!

 

Couple that with exorbitant rentals and it's no wonder that many shops are closing down. Even Currys/Dixons have closed their shop down after being on the street for some 20 years!

 

While shoppers, under the financial strain, are cutting back the landlords are asking for more. Something has to give so the shops move out. The retailers, although they have had it good, are under attack from all sides and will move to where it's cheapest to operate.

[dune]

I think there is a correlation between independent shops and affluence. To use independent shops you have to pay more and thus in grotty areas they will inevitably go out of business. Also in more rural area the big chains will attract less footfall so this puts them off opening branches aside from the main supermarkets which are everywhere.

 

In response to angelmans query the towns i'm thinking of are Oakham and Uppingham which are in an area ranked 13th in a Halifax best quality of life report and is the only area out of the South of England to be ranked in the top 20.

 

http://news.sky.com/skynews/Home/Sky-News-Archive/Article/20080641288680

[Lord Duckhunter]

 

I have been told that it is a good time to try and get a better deal with the leases at the moment as landlords are looking in some cases to just cover their basic costs, and at least just cover their repayments. This of course makes sence and some run on really short leases.

 

My father in law is in his 80's, he owns a building that is at present a night club, he owns it outright with no mortgage. The people who rent off him struggle to pay the rent, but the last thing he wants is the building empty. If they have a good weekend they turn up on Sunday afternoon with some cash for him if not, he can go weeks without receiving a penny and they are thousends in arrears. He has reduced their rent time and time again, and is doing everything he can to help them, as he just does not want the building empty. I suggest that a lot of landlords are in the same boat, whether he would feel the same if he was 57 rathher than 87 I dont know, but surley getting something in rent is better than nothing.

[bridge too far]

The problem is that a lot of High Street premises are owned, indirectly, by pensions funds. If they don't get their rents, the pension fundss, and ultimately the pensioners, lose out.

[moon monkey]

The high street is dead, long live the internet

[bridge too far]

The high street is dead, long live the internet

 

We're very lucky in that our High Street isn't. Lots of independents and specialist shops. But we are on the cusp on the Cotswolds so I guess the tourists keep it going (and the news camera crews today )

[Whitey Grandad]

The Local Authorities don't help. They keep on increasing parking charges and introducing restrictions. I struggled for years with Eastleigh BC to convince them that cheap and free parking were essential but they didn't listen. I see that Winchester has now suspended Sunday charging shortly after introducing it.

[the stain]

The times, they are a-changing.

[thefunkygibbons]

Underlying it all is the steady increase in input costs, notably anything sourced from China where inflation plus commodity prices are being passed onto retailers, who cannot pass them onto customers

[OldNick]

I find it sad that so many are not worried that our high streets independents are going to the wall. In the next few years every high street will be the same with the same goods and retailers. how sad is that?

The charity shops get low cost staff and rates, and can compete against independent retailers,and can easily take on the best prime small retail units. Southampton used to have lots of secondhand shops but now some down to the large charity shop in Shirley have closed.

I try to go to independents and as long as they are within 15% of the internet I will buy from them for the personal service alone. I recently purchased a digital camera that way.

When the high street is a monopoly to a few major players watch the prices then, as the not only will dominate the high street their muscle will get them to the top of the web and be able to afford the miore expensive key words on Google Adwords. Some of the keywords I have to use cost £1.89 a click.

[lutz]

The high street is dead, long live the internet

 

Try getting your hair cut on the internet!!!

[View From The Top]

Independent Shops Day 2011

[Jonnyboy]

They appear to be dropping like flies at the moment, even quicker than pubs!

 

One very good retailer, who I've been doing business with for a good few years, shut his doors for the last time today crippled by his rent.

 

What I don't understand is why landlords won't drop their prices and get some money instead of seeing a business fold and then getting no money.

 

Another one I know, who expanded into another couple of properties 5 years ago, is closing down 2 shops, again, due to rent despite having a very healthy order book.

 

Only good thing is I got to buy £2.5k worth of stock at cost from the 1st one so silver linings and all that but soon we will be left with only the big boys and charity shops on the High St which would be a great pity.

 

doesnt you being an ebay retailer hit all the high street stores hard?

[View From The Top]

doesnt you being an ebay retailer hit all the high street stores hard?

 

Fair point although I buy deadstock from Indies at cost which benefits all parties.

[Minty]

As a potentially new independent retailer in the coming months, I'm very interested in this, and have been for some time as part of the discussions about sustainable business and local economies.

 

Supporting independent shops is a hard habit to get into. Cost of living is going up, income is being stretched, and these shops are widely perceived, and in many cases are, more expensive than chains supermarkets. However, as always with these issues, the price of product and the cost of a product are not necessarily the same thing, and equally, the price/value relationship is far from clear too.

 

At a simple level, most people simple compare the basic product and the price. That's life, we all do it, some more than others depending on their awareness. Many more in this day and age are starting to take other things into account. Some support Fairtrade because they are aware of the impact on producers abroad having their margins squeezed to the point where their families cannot afford even the basic... some support local businesses and trades because they know it benefits the local economy and that in turn supports them. There are environmental/resource concerns too... the distance products have had to travel, how they're made and by whom.

 

On the face of it, a cheaper product may be 'better' but the actual cost to us in the long term may create more problems. For example, the current waste issues we're experiencing (referring to the build up, not the political/financial issues) would be far less if more packaging was compostable or recyclable. A relatively small increase in cost per item (which would more than likely be negated as it is used more as demand increases) would see far more able to be recycled or composted, which would reduce waste processing costs, better value for council tax money etc, etc.

 

Independent retailers also tend to use local independent tradesmen for things like their essential services and maintenance... continuing the investment in the local economy. There's a whole range of indirect effects of people taking their trade elsewhere.

 

Unfortunately the root cause of a lot of these issues (as well as the wider financial situation) is that we as individuals have got used to spending more and more of our money on 'luxuries' and less on the essentials. This is why, when people are interviewed or asked about what they can afford, when people say 'i can't afford to eat' they actually mean, 'if i wanted to continue with my current level of spend on luxuries, i can't afford it'... something has to give. If we support independent shops by spending a bit more on a bit less, we are helping to create a far more sustainable economy with localised resilience, maintaining a diversity of skills in the local marketplace, supporting the local economy and councils more (through tax and rates) which in turn helps subsidise local services... and so it continues.

 

The more we want, the less we want to pay for it. The less we want to pay, the more the systems and margins are squeezed, the more retailers and suppliers go out of business, the more people are either unemployed or have to work for larger dominant companies who can monopolise markets, and the more we lose skills and more money in local areas... etc, etc. I think I've covered it!

 

BUT, as with all of these things that rely on individual choice, how many people are capable of looking at things longer term and on a less selfish basis?

[Dibden Purlieu Saint]

I think there is a correlation between independent shops and affluence. To use independent shops you have to pay more and thus in grotty areas they will inevitably go out of business. Also in more rural area the big chains will attract less footfall so this puts them off opening branches aside from the main supermarkets which are everywhere.

 

In response to angelmans query the towns i'm thinking of are Oakham and Uppingham which are in an area ranked 13th in a Halifax best quality of life report and is the only area out of the South of England to be ranked in the top 20.

 

http://news.sky.com/skynews/Home/Sky-News-Archive/Article/20080641288680

 

I live in Elmbridge, so turns out I win!!

[dune]

Unless you're an independent that offers something different then you're going to struggle. Antiques shops, art gallerys, craft shops etc will eventually be all that's left.

[View From The Top]

Indies really do need to have a niche but also need to evolve with the market.

 

Alas I feel the days of B&M indies are long gone but thankfully the majority that I'm used to dealing with still have an online existance.

[AndyNorthernSaints]

Still lucky enough to live fairly near local shops with green grocers, health food shop, fishmonger, butcher, hardwear/DIY shop... etc Sad to see local Oddbins closing. Too many people buying wine from Tesco (world domination) etc with their limited bland collection which people put up with for some reason?

 

Recent trips back to Southampton i find a bit depressing with the lack of independent shops/pubs/cafes replaced by chains throughout the city centre. I used to live near St Marys street with at least four record shops and thriving pubs/cafes/grocers and market there. Didn't need to go to a supermarket back then.