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Season tickets, 2011/12


sotonian

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season ticket holders are just looking to get in for cheaper than other supporters and what makes me laugh some of them think they are superior and more of a fan? saying that i might buy one next season not to be called more of a fan but to make it simpler for me to get a ticket etc

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IT does seem to be the case though. Compared to the vast majority of other clubs, both this year and last, we really haven't pushed or encouraged fans to get season tickets at all. I assume someone at the club has some sort of financial model that shows the club is likely to make more money from fans paying on the day (not surprising considering the price + booking fee), than shifting a load of season tickets. I guess that model is based on the club having a really good season and demand remaining high and growing throughout the year, as oppossed to a club expecting a rubbish year that hopes/needs to get as much money upfront as possible before s**t team performances drain away a lot of the demand.

 

Makes sense financially, just a pity, as I reckon our crowds could have been even higher this year with a positive campaign to sell season tickets upfront.

 

I'm not sure who is the winner, STH or Pay-On-The-Day-Fan. I bought an ST but could only attend 17 out of 23 matches. Did I win or lose?

 

Any other ST's miss more matches and was it worth buying the ST?

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season ticket holders are just looking to get in for cheaper than other supporters and what makes me laugh some of them think they are superior and more of a fan? saying that i might buy one next season not to be called more of a fan but to make it simpler for me to get a ticket etc

 

Nice one Vince!.....

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I'm not sure who is the winner, STH or Pay-On-The-Day-Fan. I bought an ST but could only attend 17 out of 23 matches. Did I win or lose?

 

Any other ST's miss more matches and was it worth buying the ST?

 

 

You must have come out on the plus side of the ledger, just the booking fees or the matchday supplement on 17 games would make up any shortfall.

If you paid say 374 £(easy maths) for your ST that works out at £22 a match . 17x matchday comes to about the same and you'd have either had to pay the booking fees or

the matchday supplement. Unless you had time to go to the TO in person on 17 occasions that is.

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I guess until you know what you've spent on players, you don't know what your costs are and how much you need to charge.

 

And the other point is I don't think ST is an impulse purchase... It's a necessity!!

 

Yeah, because THAT'S not all the wrong way around...

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The club can't win. I'm sure if they announced season ticket prices the day after the last game and gave renewals a month to claim, then people would be moaning that the club are taking the money so early prior to start of season.

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Also, with or without marketing, it is pretty safe to say that we will still receive a substantial amount of income from ST sales this year - at the very least i would expect almost everyone to renew, and at a slightly increased cost.

 

I have to say that's a somewhat naive failure to appreciate the financial situation for a lot of people at the moment - success or not, there are only so many times you can extend the overdraft or add a bit to the loan. If the club goes with "pay us £450+ up front within a month or forget it" this season, plenty of people are going to think they just can't justify the cost, and a lot of them will be annoyed enough about it not to pay on a match-by-match basis.

 

Even though there's every reason to think the club's going to do the same thing again, and there's been a year to TRY and save up...

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The club can't win. I'm sure if they announced season ticket prices the day after the last game and gave renewals a month to claim, then people would be moaning that the club are taking the money so early prior to start of season.

 

Personally I took up March Madness at every possible opportunity - having the ability to pay in instalments is more important than whether it's paid before the season or not.

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I'm not sure who is the winner, STH or Pay-On-The-Day-Fan. I bought an ST but could only attend 17 out of 23 matches. Did I win or lose?

 

Any other ST's miss more matches and was it worth buying the ST?

you won as would anyone that went to 14 or more games.

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season ticket holders are just looking to get in for cheaper than other supporters and what makes me laugh some of them think they are superior and more of a fan? saying that i might buy one next season not to be called more of a fan but to make it simpler for me to get a ticket etc

 

does that apply to all clubs or just ours.....in your opinion of course ?

 

Also, does that also apply to people who are members of the National Trust or a golf club or a sports centre etc cos it makes them, in your opinion, feel superior to those who just visit one National Trust home or park every year or play the odd round of golf when the weather is nice or use a Sports Centre swimming pool in the hot weather ?

Edited by beatlesaint
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season ticket holders are just looking to get in for cheaper than other supporters and what makes me laugh some of them think they are superior and more of a fan? saying that i might buy one next season not to be called more of a fan but to make it simpler for me to get a ticket etc

 

your reason for buying them is probably what most of us season ticket holders think, its just a pain getting tickets individually, plus the fact you get to know the people around you, i really don't think people buy st's to feel superior,

 

but i guess it is nice to think we don't have to mix with the buy on the day peasants lol

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Email recieved from TO earlier.

 

'We currently do not have any information on season tickets for next season. We are hoping to have more information towards the end of this month. Please keep checking our website for any updates.'

 

only club in the league (not in admin) who cannot sort out ST prices?

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Purely based on my own ST, I saved £8 per match (I included the booking fee!) so this works out at 23 x 8 = £184.

This alone encourages me to purchase, but other factors such as a) same seat every time b) priority for big games etc... add to the benefits !

The fact that 'pay on the day' tickets are much more expensive and incur a £3 booking fee indicates (to me at least!) that the club are actively trying to discourage this method rather than slow down the sale of ST's !

The counter argument goes against any sound knowledge of ecomomics !

As I mentioned before, £6million upfront or an unpredictable amount paid months later ? No contest !

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:Hope no-one moans if there isn't an installment plan this year :facepalm:

 

fair enough, but is anyone allowed to question anything about Saints any more or do we just have to accept everything because the football side is successful right now? It might not always be that way.

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Purely based on my own ST, I saved £8 per match (I included the booking fee!) so this works out at 23 x 8 = £184.

This alone encourages me to purchase, but other factors such as a) same seat every time b) priority for big games etc... add to the benefits !

The fact that 'pay on the day' tickets are much more expensive and incur a £3 booking fee indicates (to me at least!) that the club are actively trying to discourage this method rather than slow down the sale of ST's !

The counter argument goes against any sound knowledge of ecomomics !

As I mentioned before, £6million upfront or an unpredictable amount paid months later ? No contest !

 

Doesn't that economic calculation depend on how confident the club is that we'll sell any of the the more expensive tickets ? For the season just past where we were odds on for promotion the "gamble" was that people would want to see a winning team and would turn up on the day if they didn't have an ST, and therefore pay the premium rate. There was profit to be made in knowing that the demand was there and would be taken up - there's no such guarantee of Championship success, so a similar policy would be foolhardy as the expected walk-up will definitely be heavily dependent on League position and recent form. In that situation, you count the ST money and are glad of it because people don't even have to turn up to have paid for the match, albeit at a slightly lower rate per match.

 

Not allowing people to buy a ticket to 23 matches AFTER some of those matches has happened (whether at the same price or proportionately reduced) doesn't smack of sound business practice unless you're trying to make people pay match by match.

 

For a start they know we have one of the most dispersed fanbases in English football, so a lot of people who wouldn't have an ST due to travelling costs also can't get to the ground in advance to avoid paying Cortese Tax.

 

The £3 charge certainly isn't an incentive for people to use online booking, which is the cheapest way for the club to sell tickets, so it's either profiteering from the most convenient method of buying tickets - or being used as a disincentive to use the online system, which would make no sense because it's cheaper to the club than staffing a ticket office all day.

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Hope no-one moans if there isn't an installment plan this year :facepalm:

Certainly the level of sympathy will be greatly reduced this year as the club set a precedent last season. However, that doesn't mean the club is right not to give supporters a choice as to how they pay for a season ticket.

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Certainly the level of sympathy will be greatly reduced this year as the club set a precedent last season. However, that doesn't mean the club is right not to give supporters a choice as to how they pay for a season ticket.

 

Correct, BUT, 11 months is more then enough time to save £500. I mean it's hardly an earth shattering amount is it!

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:Were there concessions for season children's season tickets in Itchen last season or only family centre?

 

Hope no-one moans if there isn't an installment plan this year :facepalm:

 

As I said last year, if there's no instalment plan this season, it's still crap for the people who want to use it, but at least we had some reason to expect that to be the case based on 2010 and have had the opportunity to prepare for it by saving, or considering other alternatives.

 

Last season there was no reason to think the club wouldn't provide a service which it always had at St Mary's previously.

 

It still doesn't change the situation that without an instalment plan a LOT of people who would want an ST and could cover the cost of one over 10 months or so won't be able to stump up the cash in one lump sum, and that's counterproductive to selling as many STs as possible.

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fair enough, but is anyone allowed to question anything about Saints any more or do we just have to accept everything because the football side is successful right now? It might not always be that way.

 

is prices are ridiculously increased then criticise.

 

say you would prefer installement plan - I would.

 

but don't moan saying you can no longer afford to go - that's crap!

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Correct, BUT, 11 months is more then enough time to save £500. I mean it's hardly an earth shattering amount is it!

 

It's enough to stop people who already had to take out additional borrowing to pay for last year's at such short notice from saving up...

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As I said last year, if there's no instalment plan this season, it's still crap for the people who want to use it, but at least we had some reason to expect that to be the case based on 2010 and have had the opportunity to prepare for it by saving, or considering other alternatives.

 

Last season there was no reason to think the club wouldn't provide a service which it always had at St Mary's previously.

 

It still doesn't change the situation that without an instalment plan a LOT of people who would want an ST and could cover the cost of one over 10 months or so won't be able to stump up the cash in one lump sum, and that's counterproductive to selling as many STs as possible.

 

how many month ago was the installement plan removed? you are allowed to plan ahead! (not that I have!)

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Last season there was no reason to think the club wouldn't provide a service which it always had at St Mary's previously.

 

With new ownership of a company, it is not unreasonable to think that the rules may be rewritten. Liebherr/Cortese were under no obligation to follow the same business strategy as Rupert Lowe, look where that left us...

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fair enough, but is anyone allowed to question anything about Saints any more or do we just have to accept everything because the football side is successful right now? It might not always be that way.

 

apparently not....... if this place is anything to go by these days

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is prices are ridiculously increased then criticise.

 

say you would prefer installement plan - I would.

 

but don't moan saying you can no longer afford to go - that's crap!

 

Another one who's happily inert to the medium term effects of the recession on people's spending ability, evidently. There are PLENTY of people who might just have been able to scrape together the money last year and put themselves in hock for the season just gone who know they have absolutely no chance of being able to do that again this time around.

 

VAT is up 5% on this time last year, energy bills are expected to rise 25%, getting credit is even more difficult than it was, there are more unemployed and inflation is rising overall as well. All of that affects the money available and the chances of being able to put some aside.

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With new ownership of a company, it is not unreasonable to think that the rules may be rewritten. Liebherr/Cortese were under no obligation to follow the same business strategy as Rupert Lowe, look where that left us...

 

That's true, but given the huge number of other clubs with payment plans and Saints' historical use of them there was still no reason to expect it would be withdrawn with absolutely no notice, or that STs would only be sold until the start of the season, or that anyone would have to find a lump sum the same month it was announced in order to get the renewal price.

 

This time around we are at least prepared for the worst, and unfortunately expecting it.

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With new ownership of a company, it is not unreasonable to think that the rules may be rewritten. Liebherr/Cortese were under no obligation to follow the same business strategy as Rupert Lowe, look where that left us...

 

As a private company they are entitled to do what they want, however football is a customer drive business and for people using or relying on the installment plan, to suddenly remove it without notice was a shocking piece of PR. From a fans point of view why would they suddenly think after 10 years of having an installment plan there now wouldn't be one? especially as no one was told there wouldn't be. It would be fair assumption to expect there would be one. I suppose at least this season people aren't expect there to be one, but that doesn't mean it's the right thing to do, considering most other clubs have one and it makes season tickets more accessable to people who cant afford it in one hit.

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how many month ago was the installement plan removed? you are allowed to plan ahead! (not that I have!)

 

About 11 months so far, and despite deciding that I would definitely save in the interim, I've managed to save precisely nowt towards it.

 

I suspect this season's ST will come from going cap in hand to a mate who still has a 0% Barclaycard for Season Tickets and then paying them back in instalments.

 

But at least this time around I'm expecting it to be "one lump sum when we deign to mention it to you, if you're paying attention" from the club, so I, apparently, "can't complain" about the general inconvenience of it.

 

Not that there's any guarantee anyone would get credit under a payment plan nowadays anyway...

Edited by The9
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Didn't Cortese say at one of those fans dinners that it would be re-introduced in the summer?

 

Sure I remember seeing that on this forum.

 

The fact that there hasn't been any mention of this on the OS (and there's plenty of "fan-friendly club" PR mileage to come from it if they chose to do it) is what makes me think that much of that was about drip-feeding the "select audience" the odd bit of good PR with no intention of following it up. But we shall see.

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Makes no sense at all. Rather than not sell any season tickets at all why not simply hike the price of them? I reckon a good proportion of season ticket holders miss a few games each season - these games would produce no revenue at all from these people if they paid as they went. If the price is right (from the club's point of view) it would be utterly senseless to discourage (or withdraw) the season ticket option. I smell conspiracy theory here.

 

And you'd be right.

 

I have a ST but hardly ever make Tuesday games because of work commitments. The main reasons I buy a ST is to guarantee the same seat, sitting with the same fans around me every weekend/bank holiday game, and saving myself the bother of buying tickets on a match-by-match basis. If the club were to reintroduce a membership scheme that guaranteed me 'my' seat when I wanted it then I'd seriously consider it - even at the risk of losing my ST holder/superfan status (wink wink)

 

Not that I really expect the Don to organise his ticketing arrangements to suite the interests of a mere fan of course.

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Why on earth SHOULD the club offer an instalment plan for STs? It seems that some people expect a huge discount on the renewal price of their ST, yet can't afford to pay for it so want an instalment plan to do so. That makes no sense whatsoever.

 

If there's going to be a discounted renewal price then it should only be available to people who are going to put the full cost into the club upfront. If those people who say they want a ST for the convenience of having their regular seat and not having to buy tickets on a match by match basis want an instalment plan, then it should be at the full matchday ticket price (without the booking fee). Those people who either can't afford to pay for a ST upfront or know they can't make every home game, and aren't bothered about having their 'own' seat guaranteed can then either buy on a match by match basis can then pay the normal matchday price without the booking fee if they buy their ticket at the box office (it's nonsense to use the 'out of towner' argument for not being able to buy a ticket in the week when it can be bought at the previous home match). If people are then worried about the queues on matchdays to buy, or missing out if they sellout, then a £3 booking fee is a small price to pay on the odd occasion for their peace of mind.

 

I don't understand the problem.

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Jeez, Cortese must love you.

 

So aside from the fact that basically every other club does something different, that's how ST pricing should work?

 

One other thing, the club has on a few occasions not put some away tickets for near matches on sale until the Monday after home matches, meaning anyone out of town has no choice but to come back down or pay the £3.

Edited by The9
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Yes. The whole benefit to clubs of offering slightly discounted STs is that they get the cash upfront. Why should people who can't afford to pay for a season ticket upfront be able to have one at a reduced price but pay for it by instalments? There is no logic or commercial sense in this.

 

It could be argued that the club are being socially responsible by not facilitating supporters going into debt.

 

If you can't afford a Season Ticket then don't buy one. If you MUST have one because it's 'your' seat or you don't want to have to buy tickets on a match by match basis, then that's fine: but don't expect a instalment plan to pay the same discounted rate as those who pay upfront in full.

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Yes. The whole benefit to clubs of offering slightly discounted STs is that they get the cash upfront. Why should people who can't afford to pay for a season ticket upfront be able to have one at a reduced price but pay for it by instalments? There is no logic or commercial sense in this.

 

It could be argued that the club are being socially responsible by not facilitating supporters going into debt.

 

If you can't afford a Season Ticket then don't buy one. If you MUST have one because it's 'your' seat or you don't want to have to buy tickets on a match by match basis, then that's fine: but don't expect a instalment plan to pay the same discounted rate as those who pay upfront in full.

 

Have to say that this is actually a very fair point; the idea of offering an installment scheme but at discounted prices really doesn't make commercial sense. Its pretty much a standard practise in various other industries to charge a higher price for paying by installments; just one example would be car or home insurance, whereby you get the benefit of a cheaper price if you pay up front. Paying in installments usually works out around 10%-15% higher.

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I agree, the point of discounted season tickets is that the club gets the money upfront - it's a business after all, not a charity.

 

If you can't afford it, then put it on a credit card like i am. If you've got bad credit and cant get a credit card, then why would the club want to let pay by installments? It's a big risk for them!

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Yes. The whole benefit to clubs of offering slightly discounted STs is that they get the cash upfront. Why should people who can't afford to pay for a season ticket upfront be able to have one at a reduced price but pay for it by instalments? There is no logic or commercial sense in this.

 

It could be argued that the club are being socially responsible by not facilitating supporters going into debt.

 

If you can't afford a Season Ticket then don't buy one. If you MUST have one because it's 'your' seat or you don't want to have to buy tickets on a match by match basis, then that's fine: but don't expect a instalment plan to pay the same discounted rate as those who pay upfront in full.

 

Strewth, that was sensible.

 

Doesn't solve the emotive argument of so many but sensible.

 

 

 

One thought I had, many have compared our lateness in getting tickets on sale to other clubs. Yes while it is "inconvenient" one point is that it shows we don't NEED the cash just yet.

 

Smaller clubs (eg poopey) get ST sales out as early as possible and use every possible trick - not as a service to the fans but 'cos they are desperate for some money to pay all the costs during the summer months when they have no income.

 

No not defending the club on this, sensible pricing for paid in full, a handling fee (or interest) charge applied to installments and a members scheme all need to be implemented because? It will make people happy and we all want to be happy fans as we fly up the NPC.....

 

yeah right

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Have to say that this is actually a very fair point; the idea of offering an installment scheme but at discounted prices really doesn't make commercial sense. Its pretty much a standard practise in various other industries to charge a higher price for paying by installments; just one example would be car or home insurance, whereby you get the benefit of a cheaper price if you pay up front. Paying in installments usually works out around 10%-15% higher.

 

On the other hand a football club has a very finite number of customers, if you put off those customers you don't have more waiting in the wings the same way an insurance company does. Is it worth a football club taking a small hit on tickets to make up the money on match day catering, merchindsing and such like? I don't know the answer but it must be a fine line for football clubs between milking every last penny out of the fans and putting said fans off and losing revenue.

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On the other hand a football club has a very finite number of customers, if you put off those customers you don't have more waiting in the wings the same way an insurance company does. Is it worth a football club taking a small hit on tickets to make up the money on match day catering, merchindsing and such like? I don't know the answer but it must be a fine line for football clubs between milking every last penny out of the fans and putting said fans off and losing revenue.

 

On the other hand is it fair and equitable to expect one fan who pays in full for their Season Ticket to not receive some "extra discount" or benefit for that as opposed to paying monthly?

 

Both could be "a cause of unrest" amongst the finite client base.

 

There can still be a discount as the club will still have guaranteed income over match day sales and less Tickets to process, but the cost shouldn't be the same - that isn't equitable at all

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On the other hand a football club has a very finite number of customers, if you put off those customers you don't have more waiting in the wings the same way an insurance company does. Is it worth a football club taking a small hit on tickets to make up the money on match day catering, merchindsing and such like? I don't know the answer but it must be a fine line for football clubs between milking every last penny out of the fans and putting said fans off and losing revenue.

 

I don't believe the club are "putting off customers". But I do believe they are doing the very bare minimum to drive sales of season tickets.

 

I think the club realise that they simply have to have a certain level of season ticket holders; I don't go along with the assertion by some that the club don't want to sell season tickets. They know that they have to. The club are savvy enough to realise that you need a core support, and the only way to assure that is to sell season tickets. That said, they are doing the bare minimum in marketing season tickets as they want to maximise the amount of customers they can get to pay on an individual basis. The hardcore supporters will buy a season ticket whether it is well marketed or not. The club will then take a gamble that those who they can't/won't convince to buy a ST will end up paying more over the course of the season by purchasing on an individual basis.

 

Whether that has worked or not; who knows?

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I've got 2 season tickets but only used them 5 times this season - i do it so that I can ensure going to any choice games that come up during the season. I went to about 10 away games so it makes it easier to get tickets for them

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On the other hand is it fair and equitable to expect one fan who pays in full for their Season Ticket to not receive some "extra discount" or benefit for that as opposed to paying monthly?

 

Both could be "a cause of unrest" amongst the finite client base.

 

There can still be a discount as the club will still have guaranteed income over match day sales and less Tickets to process, but the cost shouldn't be the same - that isn't equitable at all

 

But wouldn't they have the option to pay monthly too? People are less likely to have the option to pay up front but if you can afford to pay up front you could (most likely) afford to pay monthly if you were bothered. I'll pay up front for my ST (assuming the prices aren't totally over the top) and really couldn't care less if the guy next to me pays monthly.

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can not believe there has been no announcement on season tickets and pricing.its completely unprofessional that a business with no relative income for the next 6 to 8 weeks have delayed this announcement for well over a week why?surely the policy was already in place depending on what league we were in.what is the hold up?why is there no statement?certain fans will turn there attention to other prioritys the longer this continues.the usual poor and unprofessional communication from the club why? to date norwich have sold 76oo tickets in 6 days.saints zero very poor business nicola very poor!

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There is an installment scheme - it works out about £22 per match (or £25 with booking fee) and requires no upfront payment. You don't even have to pay if you can't make it to certain matches!

 

Cortese already knows that the ST is a good deal and doesn't see the need to add further incentives to attract buyers.

 

We all have to make our own choices about how we spend our money but for me a ST is a no brainer - although I will have to stop having my hair cut to pay for it.

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I don't believe the club are "putting off customers". But I do believe they are doing the very bare minimum to drive sales of season tickets.

 

I think the club realise that they simply have to have a certain level of season ticket holders; I don't go along with the assertion by some that the club don't want to sell season tickets. They know that they have to. The club are savvy enough to realise that you need a core support, and the only way to assure that is to sell season tickets. That said, they are doing the bare minimum in marketing season tickets as they want to maximise the amount of customers they can get to pay on an individual basis. The hardcore supporters will buy a season ticket whether it is well marketed or not. The club will then take a gamble that those who they can't/won't convince to buy a ST will end up paying more over the course of the season by purchasing on an individual basis.

 

Whether that has worked or not; who knows?

 

Basically agree with this, only danger in a policy not to encourage season tickets is that it relies entirely on doing well on the pitch. Yes we should do well but football is a competitive sport and end results are arrived at by many things, some of which are a gamble

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I have no problem with there being no instalment plan. As Mikee says, one exists already, its match by match tickets.

 

What annoys me is the ticket tax, especially on away tickets.

 

Look at the number of players thanking fans for amazing away support helping them to win away games in the run in and you know how valued our support is. The club should be helping to encourage big away supports if it has a positive impact on results, but charging a tax to buy an away ticket does the complete opposite IMO.

 

I begrudge paying it. It makes me feel as though I am being ripped off by the very club that relies on my support to exist.

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I have no problem with there being no instalment plan. As Mikee says, one exists already, its match by match tickets.

 

What annoys me is the ticket tax, especially on away tickets.

 

Look at the number of players thanking fans for amazing away support helping them to win away games in the run in and you know how valued our support is. The club should be helping to encourage big away supports if it has a positive impact on results, but charging a tax to buy an away ticket does the complete opposite IMO.

 

I begrudge paying it. It makes me feel as though I am being ripped off by the very club that relies on my support to exist.

 

Especially going into next season where are ticket allocation will be higher for most games

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can not believe there has been no announcement on season tickets and pricing.its completely unprofessional that a business with no relative income for the next 6 to 8 weeks have delayed this announcement for well over a week why?surely the policy was already in place depending on what league we were in.what is the hold up?why is there no statement?certain fans will turn there attention to other prioritys the longer this continues.the usual poor and unprofessional communication from the club why? to date norwich have sold 76oo tickets in 6 days.saints zero very poor business nicola very poor!

 

:lol:

 

There are few walks of life where people are keen to pay for something as soon as possible. Welcome to the half-baked brain of the football fan...

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I'm glad we are not like Norwich where the renewal process starts earlier and earlier each year. Its almost getting to a situation when they renew their season ticket a month after the season starts. Madness. As soon as our renewal process starts shifting earlier in the season then we know our finances are not how they should be.

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