Guly good, Guly bad?

[Ken Tone]

Guly good for me - one of the few of our players who might make the step up and survive in the Premiership. Then again, I thought/think Puncheon isn't really good enough - so I know nothing.

 

On that subject... why do so many people think Harding is crap? I don't get it - he always seems to be a great L1 player to me. The times he is out of position are made up for by his reliability defending when he is in the right place.

 

Not sure so many people do feel Harding is crap. I for one rate him highly, and did not understand why we bought Dickson (who is also good) when we already had Mills as cover anyway.

[hamster]

how?

 

Because IMHO we will sell oxo well below what he will be worth in the future.

 

Not many clubs can afford the risk/luxury of buying him and not playing him week in week out, which is what his development requires. It's a circa £10mill gamble in essence.

 

I think Guly will be a more polished player if we keep him one more season and he gets the opportunity to hone his skills in CCC.

 

Does that make sense?

[saintfully]

Not sure so many people do feel Harding is crap. I for one rate him highly, and did not understand why we bought Dickson (who is also good) when we already had Mills as cover anyway.

 

I agree, he would be one of my first names on the teamsheet (but have not seen so much of Dickson or Mills I suppose). Its just what I hear when I'm at St Marys and occasionally on here.

 

If anyone can explain why they think Hardings rubbish, please do.

 

(Also, while I'm at it, is there anyone out there who still wishes we had Leon Best, but doesn't regret losing Dexter Blackstock - reckon he'd kill in this League)

[Saint_Mabes]

To be fair i'd like Best, Blackstock and McGoldrick back! I do love the team at the moment though.

 

So the key 'MOST MOANED ABOUT' players seem to be;

 

Kelvin

Guly

Harding (possibly)

 

Kelvin and Harding would be two of the first on the team sheet for me! Thought Hammond may be getting more of a moan, but to be honest i do think he's upped his game.

[doddisalegend]

To be fair i'd like Best, Blackstock and McGoldrick back! I do love the team at the moment though.

 

So the key 'MOST MOANED ABOUT' players seem to be;

 

Kelvin

Guly

Harding (possibly)

 

Kelvin and Harding would be two of the first on the team sheet for me! Thought Hammond may be getting more of a moan, but to be honest i do think he's upped his game.

 

You missed Lambert last season he was the golden boy but these days he seems to get all sorts of abuse down at SMS, oh and Chaplow has gone from hero to zero in a short space of time. On the plus side Forte is now a god and must start every match yet was being labeled crap only a week a go. Football fans = fickle?

[Saint_Mabes]

Oh yeah I forgot they hate Lambert too - lazy bugger lol!

[Dogs]

Guly....brilliant!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[brmbrm]

You missed Lambert last season he was the golden boy but these days he seems to get all sorts of abuse down at SMS, oh and Chaplow has gone from hero to zero in a short space of time. On the plus side Forte is now a god and must start every match yet was being labeled crap only a week a go. Football fans = fickle?

 

Mostly opinionated, pretty ignorant and semi-****ed. And not too bright. They pay their money, they are entitled to theior opinion, but that doesn't meant its not a furken idiotic opinion.

[Jonnyboy]

goal and an assist tonight i believe. glad he wasnt dropped

[hamster]

Some will take more convincing alas.

[SaintBobby]

Because IMHO we will sell oxo well below what he will be worth in the future.

 

Not many clubs can afford the risk/luxury of buying him and not playing him week in week out, which is what his development requires. It's a circa £10mill gamble in essence.

 

I think Guly will be a more polished player if we keep him one more season and he gets the opportunity to hone his skills in CCC.

 

Does that make sense?

 

Do I have this right?

 

1. You think we could probably sell Oxo for £10m

2. You think we could easily sell Guly in the future for more than Oxo

3. You therefore think we could easily sell Guly in the future for more than £10m

 

Hmmm....I'm not sure I'm yet totally persuaded of point 1.....

[hamster]

/\

I have been correct in the past and felt that tonight he once again displayed superior awareness off the ball. With Oxo I do not feel that he is that noticeable without the ball at his feet.

 

Time will tell.

[SaintBobby]

/\

I have been correct in the past and felt that tonight he once again displayed superior awareness off the ball. With Oxo I do not feel that he is that noticeable without the ball at his feet.

 

Time will tell.

 

If you don't mind me asking, what have you been correct in the past about?

[hamster]

Punch playing PL level, Jackson better than L1 as is Holt.

Hammill finally clicking. Crouch being class act (from day 1 at SMS).

 

Tfic ;-/

[Bailey]

It sounds ridiculous as he scored and got an assist, but I thought Guly was pretty poor last night.

 

He took his goal very well and set up Barnard nicely, but he didn't do a lot else.

 

Defensively he's a liability, and Adkins and Crosby were going potty on the sidelines, trying to encourage him to get tighter and to close his man down.

 

On two occasions it almost cost us, as Charlton had some success going forward down our right side.

 

Also, he drifts in and out the game too much, he often comes across quite arrogant and doesn't always seem interested.

 

He's frustrating as hell as on his day he's brilliant, but getting any level of consistency out of him over 90 minutes seems impossible.

[hamster]

IMHO he is at his best drifting in and out. His markers get complacent. Watch him communicating with the other players, they know precisely what his gameplan is and it works well. When he needs to run by golly he can run.

[Saint_Donovan]

It sounds ridiculous as he scored and got an assist, but I thought Guly was pretty poor last night.

 

He took his goal very well and set up Barnard nicely, but he didn't do a lot else.

 

Defensively he's a liability, and Adkins and Crosby were going potty on the sidelines, trying to encourage him to get tighter and to close his man down.

 

On two occasions it almost cost us, as Charlton had some success going forward down our right side.

 

Also, he drifts in and out the game too much, he often comes across quite arrogant and doesn't always seem interested.

 

He's frustrating as hell as on his day he's brilliant, but getting any level of consistency out of him over 90 minutes seems impossible.

 

Yep you're right that does sound ridiculous!!

 

Scored 1 and set the other up in a 2-0 win (and was involved in some other nice passages of play) = a good game in my opinion.

[Barry the Badger]

I think you have to say he had a good game, as he scored and got an assist. That said, his defensive frailties were concerning, when the man he was marking passed and moved he rarely went with him quickly enough.

 

If Adkins can get him to concentrate he will be very very good at RM until oxo returns.

[Paul75]

I think he makes space for himself at ease at times and looks real quailty, but as a player who likes to drift and sometimes be out of position i think when the ball comes to him he needs to be effective more often to make up for the space he has left open

[Whitey Grandad]

He had a good game last night and I did notice him chasing back a couple of times, but there is considerable room for improvement and he can only get better.

[SaintBobby]

Punch playing PL level, Jackson better than L1 as is Holt.

Hammill finally clicking. Crouch being class act (from day 1 at SMS).

 

Tfic ;-/

 

Yeah, well, I wouldn't say any of those predictions are as "brave" as suggesting that Guly will be sold for £11m+

[influx]

I remember people moaning and groaning about Matty at times. Means bugger all.

[Jonnyboy]

He gave the ball away against MK Dons and then sprinted half the pitch and put in a good tackle on the edge of the box, so he can be defensively minded if needed.

[Ohio Saint]

Guly good. Rest of the team good. Matchplay inconsistent.

[Chez]

I thought he was poor last night. I don't care that he scored (Lambert's ball was everything) and crossed to Barney for the goal (Lambert had done most of the hard work), he looked totally disinterested at times, didn't press, didn't track back, didn't follow runners, didn't get goal side, in fact he didn't look like he wanted to play right midfield one bit. He ws a weak link in the first half and if BWP had tucked away his chance early doors everyone would have been wondering where the **** was Guly when it came to the two on one against Richardson.

 

He actually just stood around doing nothing for the first quarter of an hour in the second half. I watched him right in front of me doing the absolute bare minimum and I thought he should have been subbed. Only when moved into the middle did he wake up and look genuinely happy to work.

 

I'm not doubting his ability, but he certainly didn't look the answer to our right midfield problem to me.

 

I just want to add that I could not have been happier with the performance of the side or the other players last night. We were excellent last night.

[astrasri]

Couldn't disagree more. I thought he made a positive contribution last night. His first time lay-offs were less wasteful and he tracked back when it counted. Our back line was not under so much pressure last night that they coped with pretty much every thing that was put into them. Therefore Guly did not need to be back defending the way he has done in previous games. I think others in the team were less effective - but that is not this thread.

[Whitey Grandad]

I thought he was poor last night. I don't care that he scored (Lambert's ball was everything) and crossed to Barney for the goal (Lambert had done most of the hard work), he looked totally disinterested at times, didn't press, didn't track back, didn't follow runners, didn't get goal side, in fact he didn't look like he wanted to play right midfield one bit. He ws a weak link in the first half and if BWP had tucked away his chance early doors everyone would have been wondering where the **** was Guly when it came to the two on one against Richardson.

 

He actually just stood around doing nothing for the first quarter of an hour in the second half. I watched him right in front of me doing the absolute bare minimum and I thought he should have been subbed. Only when moved into the middle did he wake up and look genuinely happy to work.

 

Barnard fed Guly for the first and wasn't it Hammond's shot that was pushed out to Guly?

[red&white56]

Guly Good: going forward, moving the ball around, moevments forward down the wings. Took his goal well (how many times did we have the ball in their area or just outside and we wanted someone to shoot and nobody did).

Guly Bad: didn't really track back to cover, made some effort but not as much as the rest of the team.

 

Overall he was OK, but clearly not MOTM.

[Barry the Badger]

Just to reopen this debate. I just had a chat with a guy at work who says Guly is **** and should have been brought off Saturday. He said Guly is "too unpredictable". That would be the same unpredictablility that took it round two players and slotted home to keep us second then!

 

Now I know he had a dodgy game overall, but I don't get why some fans cannot accept that he is just one of those players who can struggle for most of the game then come up with a moment of brilliance to win it for us. The important thing is he seems to ignore the moans and groans and at least keeps trying to make stuff happen.

 

He then went on to moan about Stephens only playing simple passes and not trying anything out of the ordinary. I gave up at this point.

[miserableoldgit]

I am glad that someone has bumped this thread. I am fed up with this "Guly is sh1t" business. I agree that football is all about opinions, but it is clearly obvious that he has plenty of skill and ability. I don`t think that he is a League One player - more of a "luxury" player in the cut and thrust of this division, but I am utterly convinced that he will become an important player for us as and when we climb up the ladder. I didn`t hear too many moans when we signed him permanently after his "purple patch" around Christmas time. Too many people only "notice" when he makes a mistake, but won`t give credit for what he does well.

[mitch01]

He's an enigma. He'll burst past a player one minute and look fired up, the next he will receive the ball on the touchline and slow the game to walking pace before sending his cross behind for a goal kick. Its all about whether it is worth putting up with the frustrating moments for the times his movement/skill split the opposition defence, and he got us 2 extra points on saturday that could be crucial. My conclusion; infuriating but justified.

[slickmick]

Think Guly is better in the middle where he can go inside or outside his man. On the wing he doesn't seem to have a trick up his sleeve to go past his man.

One thing he does well in the centre is that he gambles and overlaps the strikers to get into the box. Something we don't have in the centre of midfield at the moment.

Most frustrating player for me is Hammond. He rarely passes the ball for a player to run on to, they always have to check their run, or recieve the ball behind them and the number of times he had 10 or 20 yards to make a surging run forward but opted to pass sideways.

[Saint Charlie]

Once he has a pre season with Saints, and obviously has experienced a year of English football he will definately be better for it. I would say he is better than Papa Waigo and has had more of an impact.

[John B]

To be fair i'd like Best, Blackstock and McGoldrick back! I do love the team at the moment though.

 

So the key 'MOST MOANED ABOUT' players seem to be;

 

Kelvin

Guly

Harding (possibly)

 

Kelvin and Harding would be two of the first on the team sheet for me! Thought Hammond may be getting more of a moan, but to be honest i do think he's upped his game.

 

Strange that both Davis and Harding are in the players team of the year

[miserableoldgit]

He's an enigma. He'll burst past a player one minute and look fired up, the next he will receive the ball on the touchline and slow the game to walking pace before sending his cross behind for a goal kick. Its all about whether it is worth putting up with the frustrating moments for the times his movement/skill split the opposition defence, and he got us 2 extra points on saturday that could be crucial. My conclusion; infuriating but justified.

He has scored 10 goals in 22 starts. Hardly "sh1t".

[Clifford Nelson]

Some players are seemingly made for being scapegoated. At the first mistake Guly made on Saturday the sighs started, exactly as it did with Papa Waigo last year. The week before Barnard miscontrolled and lost the ball seven times consecutively (I counted) but he was repeatedly forgiven.

 

Guly isn't the greatest Brazilian player ever, or he wouldn't be here, but for control, moving the ball around and seeing a killer pass we haven't got anybody better. I nearly forgot that he has also scored 10 goals so far. Sh*t he ain't!

[jamesfp1]

The title of the thread describes Guly perfectly. Sometimes good, sometimes bad = better than consistently bad.

[Avenue Saint]

Gilt is useful more imp

[miserableoldgit]

Gilt is useful more imp

?????

[Avenue Saint]

Lol, typo from iPhone.

 

Was saying that Guly is a useful player to have!

[jam]

He has scored 10 goals in 22 starts. Hardly "sh1t".

 

That's a very interesting figure...

[Whitey Grandad]

That's a very interesting figure...

 

Very impressive, but it should have been a lot more, which is why he is so frustrating, don't you think?

[trousers]

I am glad that someone has bumped this thread. I am fed up with this "Guly is sh1t" business. I agree that football is all about opinions, but it is clearly obvious that he has plenty of skill and ability. I don`t think that he is a League One player - more of a "luxury" player in the cut and thrust of this division, but I am utterly convinced that he will become an important player for us as and when we climb up the ladder. I didn`t hear too many moans when we signed him permanently after his "purple patch" around Christmas time. Too many people only "notice" when he makes a mistake, but won`t give credit for what he does well.

 

^This

[sambosa75]

From what I have seen and heard of him he is the kind of player that makes things happen. He might not be the most clinical finisher in the squad but whenever he plays he gets chances and that cant just purely by coincidence. You have to be a good player to get in to those types of positions in the first place and he does this on a regular basis. Frustrating at times maybe, but bad? Certainly not.

[Barry the Badger]

Some players are seemingly made for being scapegoated. At the first mistake Guly made on Saturday the sighs started, exactly as it did with Papa Waigo last year. The week before Barnard miscontrolled and lost the ball seven times consecutively (I counted) but he was repeatedly forgiven.

 

It's as though every player has a certain amount of goodwill 'in the bank' they can use up before the moaning starts. Barnard gets plenty because he's a grafter and is seen as 'one of the lads', Lallana and Oxo get plenty because they're academy products. Lambert gets a bit, probably for what he acheived last season, but not as much as those three. Guly gets very little because he's foreign and although he covers ground at times he's not a grafter and can look disinterested.

 

Maybe Guly should go out and bottle somebody on a Saturday night :-)

 

I just don't know what people hope to acheive by getting at players who are trying to do something out of the ordinary. It wasn't long ago that we got relegated from the Championship with a team of young players who passed it between themselves nicely enough, but never took a risk, because they were intimidated by the crowd.

Edited 18 April, 2011 by Barry the Badger

[mitch01]

He has scored 10 goals in 22 starts. Hardly "sh1t".

 

Didn't say he was.....

 

Now Barnard is out it might be worth playing him up top with Lambert, I don't think he is at all comfortable on the right. Having said that, I thought Connolly was superb when he came on on Saturday, so maybe he should start vs Brighton.

[miserableoldgit]

Didn't say he was.....

Now Barnard is out it might be worth playing him up top with Lambert, I don't think he is at all comfortable on the right. Having said that, I thought Connolly was superb when he came on on Saturday, so maybe he should start vs Brighton.

There were a number of posters on Saturdays match day thread whose opinions were "Guly is sh`t"

[Griffo]

Basically, our fans are complete mongs who always need someone to moan about. Even though Guly's very erratic, Barnard or Lambert are sometimes not even on his wavelength which makes Guly look bad even if he's actually made a good pass.

[corsacar saint]

Very frustrating and inconsistent. However at times he can be absolutely brilliant,and on his day is streets ahead of the rest of the team with his thought and passing.

He will hopefully stand out in a higher league,when we go up.

[jam]

Very impressive, but it should have been a lot more, which is why he is so frustrating, don't you think?

 

In honestly I don't find it that frustrating, in fact I find it more frustrating when Lambert misses a chance, because of how good his finishing was last year.

 

Look, it's annoying when anyone misses a good chance, obviously but there are definitely people in the crowd who are just waiting to get on his case. Case in point on Saturday is the guy in front of me shouted 'get him off' about two minutes into the game.

 

I think it was the Huddersfield game when he missed a bunch of chances but he also set up two or three of our goals, we played a brilliant game and he was a central part of that and people came away from it saying he's ****. I think that is mental.

 

When played in the right position Guly is great to watch, and makes things happen. The trade off is he's not that consistent a finisher. I can live with the poor finishing because of his other strengths. And I hate it when people come out with this phrase so apologies for using it now, but if he was a great (decent?) finisher in addition to the rest of his game, he simply wouldn't be here.