Professor Posted 24 February, 2011 Posted 24 February, 2011 One important difference between Brighton and Saints this season is that during the close season, Brighton made significant improvements to their squad and seem to have done more on that front than SFC. If our lack of close season squad building and the weak pre-season were due to a falling out between AP and NC, than NC in particular should take responsibility as the senior person involved.
Colinjb Posted 24 February, 2011 Posted 24 February, 2011 One important difference between Brighton and Saints this season is that during the close season, Brighton made significant improvements to their squad and seem to have done more on that front than SFC. If our lack of close season squad building and the weak pre-season were due to a falling out between AP and NC, than NC in particular should take responsibility as the senior person involved. That in itself set us back by 10 points. Exactly the gap now. That's what has ultimately cost us a shot at the title.
Window Cleaner Posted 24 February, 2011 Posted 24 February, 2011 Perhaps we should sack the Manager every time we fail to win, would that make people happy? Poyet seems to be attracting a lot of praise on here, so I thought I would look at his record and compare his first few months in charge with NA's. He joined Brighton when they were 20th and gained 45 points from 31 games. Nigel joined us in 22nd and has gained 42 points from 23 games. Also in there was a 2-0 loss at Hartlepool, but Gus somehow managed to cling on to his job despite that massive setback. My maths isn't great and maybe the BBC stats might have the odd error, but Nigel's record seems pretty good. Then again we are Southampton and we do not lose or draw matches in League 1. Lawrie took over from a legend and then promptly got us relegated. I'm just glad none of the moaners on here were in charge of the Club then, because we would have missed out on the greatest era in the clubs history. We've had 8 years of chopping and changing Managers, perhaps we should try something else. So Poyet starting from scratch with a very poor side got 45 points from 31 games, this season he's got 59 from 29 whereas our man has got about the same as last season's manager.Poyet came in and improved everything, we had a manager who gradually improved the side as well, then we sacked him and got one who's blanc bonnet and bonnet blanc.We have changed a good manager for a so so one. There was no need to do that, we should have gotten someone a darn sight better.Why change a manager after 4 games of the season if you're not going to get anyone better?? I have nothing against Adkins but he wasn't the best we could have got.
barney Posted 24 February, 2011 Posted 24 February, 2011 One important difference between Brighton and Saints this season is that during the close season, Brighton made significant improvements to their squad and seem to have done more on that front than SFC. If our lack of close season squad building and the weak pre-season were due to a falling out between AP and NC, than NC in particular should take responsibility as the senior person involved. what he says
Window Cleaner Posted 24 February, 2011 Posted 24 February, 2011 One important difference between Brighton and Saints this season is that during the close season, Brighton made significant improvements to their squad and seem to have done more on that front than SFC. If our lack of close season squad building and the weak pre-season were due to a falling out between AP and NC, than NC in particular should take responsibility as the senior person involved. We bought players Dickson and Richardson, both played in our benchmark win against Oldham, now they're on the bench and in the stands. WTF is that all about then?? Adkins showed his limitations with Puncheon..end of story.
Lord Duckhunter Posted 24 February, 2011 Posted 24 February, 2011 So Poyet starting from scratch with a very poor side got 45 points from 31 games, this season he's got 59 from 29 whereas our man has got about the same as last season's manager.Poyet came in and improved everything, we had a manager who gradually improved the side as well, then we sacked him and got one who's blanc bonnet and bonnet blanc.We have changed a good manager for a so so one. There was no need to do that, we should have gotten someone a darn sight better.Why change a manager after 4 games of the season if you're not going to get anyone better?? I have nothing against Adkins but he wasn't the best we could have got. We were lower when Adkins took over then when Poyet took over Brighton. So who was the poor side? Why was Poyet starting from scratch and not Adkins?
BHA Posted 24 February, 2011 Posted 24 February, 2011 If there's anyone likely to be more biased towards that stadium than Seagul fans, it's the bloke building it. Not saying it won't be nice, but I'd hardly take it as Gospel. Makes your ground look very average though. You will see in time.
Window Cleaner Posted 24 February, 2011 Posted 24 February, 2011 We were lower when Adkins took over then when Poyet took over Brighton. So who was the poor side? Why was Poyet starting from scratch and not Adkins? There is no arguing with all you adkinslovvies, he's no better than Pardew and we exposed ourselves to a disastrous 3 game period with Wilkins for no reason whatsoever. Just a whim from Cortese.
The Cat Posted 24 February, 2011 Posted 24 February, 2011 Makes your ground look very average though. You will see in time. Not particularly hard to be fair. Our ground is a soulless, identikit, characterless jelly-mould of a football stadium.
Window Cleaner Posted 24 February, 2011 Posted 24 February, 2011 Not particularly hard to be fair. Our ground is a soulless, identikit, characterless jelly-mould of a football stadium. Still at least it's paid for, or rather we escaped the vast majority of the outstanding debt on it;must count for something.I wish I could get a 30 million £ house and only end up paying 14 or 15 million for it.
The Cat Posted 24 February, 2011 Posted 24 February, 2011 There is no arguing with all you adkinslovvies, he's no better than Pardew and we exposed ourselves to a disastrous 3 game period with Wilkins for no reason whatsoever. Just a whim from Cortese. I think Adkins is better than Pardew, although maybe football wise there's not a lot in it. However Pardew is an arrogant **** and Adkins isn't, which means that he's by far the better man for the job. People need to remember there's a lot more to managing a team day in day out than what happens on the pitch. Not sure if you remember the start of the season, but a team clearly low on morale played some god awful football under Pardew. The club seems a lot happier under Adkins.
Window Cleaner Posted 24 February, 2011 Posted 24 February, 2011 Not sure if you remember the start of the season, but a team clearly low on morale played some god awful football under Pardew. The club seems a lot happier under Adkins. Probably because they knew he was going to be sacked come what may.
BHA Posted 24 February, 2011 Posted 24 February, 2011 Funny that, as our match at Rochdale was called off when I was half way there last weekend I decided to go to Stoke v Brighton instead. You lot were embarrassingly bad in the first half against a Stoke side that had little more than strength, a quick right winger, and decent execution of set pieces. It took them stopping trying for 20 minutes when 3-0 up before you could play your passing football. Meanwhile when we played Man Utd we passed the ball around beautifully whilst leading against them, even keeping possession for a significant period when we should have been under the cosh. We both lost in the end, but only one of us looked like a quality passing team against Prem opposition. In addition, your lot were cynical time-wasting garbage from 5 minutes gone at St Mary's and didn't do much then either. And as far as arrogant goes, we also happened upon a couple of your fans in a local pub. Blimey, you'd think you were already in the Championship ! Apologise for our so called poor football. Get me a ticket and i will come and watch your quality passing team if only Brighton passed the ball i would be so happy.
Lord Duckhunter Posted 24 February, 2011 Posted 24 February, 2011 There is no arguing with all you adkinslovvies, he's no better than Pardew and we exposed ourselves to a disastrous 3 game period with Wilkins for no reason whatsoever. Just a whim from Cortese. I'm not an "Adkinslovvie" just a guy who thinks that Managers should be judged over a longer period than 23 games and after (as Poyet has shown) a preseason. Having witnessed what Lawrie did after a very average start, find it unbelievable that people are making judgements over the guy already.
The Cat Posted 24 February, 2011 Posted 24 February, 2011 Apologise for our so called poor football. Get me a ticket and i will come and watch your quality passing team if only Brighton passed the ball i would be so happy. Well, we can all see for own eyes in April when we play each other.
beardy Posted 24 February, 2011 Posted 24 February, 2011 We were lower when Adkins took over then when Poyet took over Brighton. So who was the poor side? Why was Poyet starting from scratch and not Adkins? This really is nonsense and I believe you know it. Poyet took over a poor side 15 games into the season. We had been poor for a number of seasons. The transformation has been remarkable by anyones standards. How many games played when Adkins took over? You're saying that Southampton were a poorer side than the Brighton team Poyet took over? They weren't, quite obviously to everybody. Apart from you it would seem.
Window Cleaner Posted 24 February, 2011 Posted 24 February, 2011 I'm not an "Adkinslovvie" just a guy who thinks that Managers should be judged over a longer period than 23 games and after (as Poyet has shown) a preseason. Having witnessed what Lawrie did after a very average start, find it unbelievable that people are making judgements over the guy already. It's not about Adkins himself with me, I still haven't heard any valid reason for sacking Pardew after the season had started and leaving us thus to flounder around looking for a replacement. I personally think it was a crass decision which could only be justified by obtaining a manager of vastly superior quality and of proven attributes.I really don't think that Adkins fits that description. If we'd dumped AP in May or June then I could see sense in it, as it is it's just not comprehensible.
The Cat Posted 24 February, 2011 Posted 24 February, 2011 It's bot about Adkins himself with me, I still haven't heard any valid reason for sacking Pardew after the season had started and leaving us thus to flounder around looking for a replacement. I personally think it was a crass decision which could only be justified by obtaining a manager of vastly superior quality and of proven attributes.I really don't think that Adkins fits that description. If we'd dumped AP in May or June then I could see sense in it, as it is it's just not comprehensible. What if a large majority of the staff at the club hated working with Pardew? That would be a valid enough reason for me. If my manager at work was a total **** yet mildly competent at their job I'd be delighted if they were replaced by another manager of similar (or slightly better, but definitely not worse) ability who wasn't a ****.
BHA Posted 24 February, 2011 Posted 24 February, 2011 Well, we can all see for own eyes in April when we play each other. Will be champions by then. Gus will put out our reserves for you.
Window Cleaner Posted 24 February, 2011 Posted 24 February, 2011 This really is nonsense and I believe you know it. Poyet took over a poor side 15 games into the season. We had been poor for a number of seasons. The transformation has been remarkable by anyones standards. How many games played when Adkins took over? You're saying that Southampton were a poorer side than the Brighton team Poyet took over? They weren't, quite obviously to everybody. Apart from you it would seem. Correct: Anyone who can not see, or will not admit that Poyet is by far a superior manager to Adkins is just plain dumb or deluded. We have spent millions of £ on our side, vastly more than Brighton, yet our manager cannot get better results with that side.
Lord Duckhunter Posted 24 February, 2011 Posted 24 February, 2011 It's not about Adkins himself with me, I still haven't heard any valid reason for sacking Pardew after the season had started and leaving us thus to flounder around looking for a replacement. I personally think it was a crass decision which could only be justified by obtaining a manager of vastly superior quality and of proven attributes.I really don't think that Adkins fits that description. If we'd dumped AP in May or June then I could see sense in it, as it is it's just not comprehensible. Whatever the reasons, he was sacked and Adkins is our Manager. Surely he should be judged over a longer period than 23 games and after he's had a preseason in which to condition the players and make his own signings. had you judged Lawrie after 23 games, and compared him Ted, he'd have been out on his ear.
Window Cleaner Posted 24 February, 2011 Posted 24 February, 2011 What if a large majority of the staff at the club hated working with Pardew? That would be a valid enough reason for me. If my manager at work was a total **** yet mildly competent at their job I'd be delighted if they were replaced by another manager of similar (or slightly better, but definitely not worse) ability who wasn't a ****. Me personally I'd give the staff the push and keep the manager. Starting with Les Reed.
West End Saint Posted 24 February, 2011 Posted 24 February, 2011 Perhaps we should sack the Manager every time we fail to win, would that make people happy? Poyet seems to be attracting a lot of praise on here, so I thought I would look at his record and compare his first few months in charge with NA's. He joined Brighton when they were 20th and gained 45 points from 31 games. Nigel joined us in 22nd and has gained 42 points from 23 games. Also in there was a 2-0 loss at Hartlepool, but Gus somehow managed to cling on to his job despite that massive setback. My maths isn't great and maybe the BBC stats might have the odd error, but Nigel's record seems pretty good. Then again we are Southampton and we do not lose or draw matches in League 1. Lawrie took over from a legend and then promptly got us relegated. I'm just glad none of the moaners on here were in charge of the Club then, because we would have missed out on the greatest era in the clubs history. We've had 8 years of chopping and changing Managers, perhaps we should try something else. I would agree with you the last thing we need is chopping & changing Managers I think NA is doing ok but if we dont go up I just cant see him keeping his job. We need promotion have to get promoted so we can keep going forward with the Manager & team if we dont I can see a lot of changes starting with NA We need stability so we can progress as a club for that to happen we have to go up imo
Window Cleaner Posted 24 February, 2011 Posted 24 February, 2011 Whatever the reasons, he was sacked and Adkins is our Manager. Surely he should be judged over a longer period than 23 games and after he's had a preseason in which to condition the players and make his own signings. had you judged Lawrie after 23 games, and compared him Ted, he'd have been out on his ear. He had a chance to make signings, he could not obtain the wherewithal that's all. We put in bids apparently but we did not obtain our targets.I like the look of N'Guessan, Forte I know nothing about but it's clear that they're here to warm the bench.When poyet bought Noone it was to play him in the first side.
BHA Posted 24 February, 2011 Posted 24 February, 2011 Correct: Anyone who can not see, or will not admit that Poyet is by far a superior manager to Adkins is just plain dumb or deluded. We have spent millions of £ on our side, vastly more than Brighton, yet our manager cannot get better results with that side. Totally agree. If Gus was managing you with those players you would be top playing our style of football and liking every moment of it.
Lord Duckhunter Posted 24 February, 2011 Posted 24 February, 2011 Correct: Anyone who can not see, or will not admit that Poyet is by far a superior manager to Adkins is just plain dumb or deluded. We have spent millions of £ on our side, vastly more than Brighton, yet our manager cannot get better results with that side. Did Adkins spend these millions? After 23 games, you can see how superior Poyet is already? Perhaps you should apply to Sky for Andy Grey's old job. I bet Fergie is glad the board at Old Trafford didn't make instant judgements after his first 23 games in charge.
Window Cleaner Posted 24 February, 2011 Posted 24 February, 2011 Totally agree. If Gus was managing you with those players you would be top playing our style of football and liking every moment of it. And we should have taken him off you, pre-season for preference. We knew we were going to sack Pardew, we should have got Poyet, Ankergren and Calderon. Instead wasted 500K on Richardson who no longer gets a game, have Father Christmas Davis in goal and a manager who is run of the mill
BHA Posted 24 February, 2011 Posted 24 February, 2011 He had a chance to make signings, he could not obtain the wherewithal that's all. We put in bids apparently but we did not obtain our targets.I like the look of N'Guessan, Forte I know nothing about but it's clear that they're here to warm the bench.When poyet bought Noone it was to play him in the first side. Noone only comes on in second half hes mainly used as a sub.
Window Cleaner Posted 24 February, 2011 Posted 24 February, 2011 Did Adkins spend these millions? After 23 games, you can see how superior Poyet is already? Perhaps you should apply to Sky for Andy Grey's old job. I bet Fergie is glad the board at Old Trafford didn't make instant judgements after his first 23 games in charge. My whole point in this argument is that Poyet is vastly superior to Adkins and we should have gone for someone of his quality.
Window Cleaner Posted 24 February, 2011 Posted 24 February, 2011 Noone only comes on in second half hes mainly used as a sub. Scores the odd goal though, which is more than you can say for our recruits.Most of our subs get 10 minutes at the end.
BHA Posted 24 February, 2011 Posted 24 February, 2011 Scores the odd goal though, which is more than you can say for our recruits.Most of our subs get 10 minutes at the end. You need some one like Gus to take you forward, with the players and quality you have feel your manager is under achieving. I personally would expect more if i was a saints fan.
Window Cleaner Posted 24 February, 2011 Posted 24 February, 2011 You need some one like Gus to take you forward, with the players and quality you have feel your manager is under achieving. I personally would expect more if i was a saints fan. They're used to mediocrity that's the trouble.Virtually everyone on this forum saw us winning the title this year,we'll probably get second and that's good but I've no great illusions about our progress after that.
Legod Third Coming Posted 24 February, 2011 Posted 24 February, 2011 Perhaps we should sack the Manager every time we fail to win, would that make people happy? Poyet seems to be attracting a lot of praise on here, so I thought I would look at his record and compare his first few months in charge with NA's. He joined Brighton when they were 20th and gained 45 points from 31 games. Nigel joined us in 22nd and has gained 42 points from 23 games. Also in there was a 2-0 loss at Hartlepool, but Gus somehow managed to cling on to his job despite that massive setback. My maths isn't great and maybe the BBC stats might have the odd error, but Nigel's record seems pretty good. Then again we are Southampton and we do not lose or draw matches in League 1. Lawrie took over from a legend and then promptly got us relegated. I'm just glad none of the moaners on here were in charge of the Club then, because we would have missed out on the greatest era in the clubs history. We've had 8 years of chopping and changing Managers, perhaps we should try something else. This is a fatuous argument because of circumstances. Adkins (who I rate and I don't hear a single person calling for his head, but that makes your argument less controversial of course) took over the most expensively assembled squad in this league, and by a margin of ten times by my simple arithmetic. He is doing a good job. No better or worse than the man sacked to make way for him. Gus Poyet did not have the luxury of inheriting an expensively assembled squad. Today he is getting more from his players and therefore can be judged to be doing a better job this season. As for Lawrie, did they have transfer windows then? And was he employed, and/or did he agree that his job would be, to win the league?? If he did, I can tell you categorically he WOULD have been fired. Put it this way, if Ancelotti doesn't win the Champion's League, I would be stunned if he wasn't replaced. Do I like it? Does it matter? That's the commercial reality. Welcome to 2011.
70's Mike Posted 24 February, 2011 Posted 24 February, 2011 Answer to original question is about 70 miles through fish land
benjii Posted 24 February, 2011 Posted 24 February, 2011 Will be champions by then. Gus will put out our reserves for you. Cool, that would be nice thanks.
Window Cleaner Posted 24 February, 2011 Posted 24 February, 2011 Answer to original question is about 70 miles through fish land As far as that?? I used to bike it to see my little girl-friend down that way. Not there and back in a day though, good excuse for staying over.
Window Cleaner Posted 24 February, 2011 Posted 24 February, 2011 Cool, that would be nice thanks. Would be nice but they'll have their first XI out,count on it.
John B Posted 24 February, 2011 Posted 24 February, 2011 The differences between Southampton and Brighton are 1 Brighton have not sacked their manager this season 2 Brighton have enhanced their team whereas Saints have a new RB and Guly 3 Brighton probably do not have a CEO demanding Promotion
benjii Posted 24 February, 2011 Posted 24 February, 2011 The differences between Southampton and Brighton are 1 Brighton have not sacked their manager this season 2 Brighton have enhanced their team whereas Saints have a new RB and Guly 3 Brighton probably do not have a CEO demanding Promotion Good point. If only we would aim for mid-table we'd probably get promoted.
beardy Posted 24 February, 2011 Posted 24 February, 2011 The differences between Southampton and Brighton are 1 Brighton have not sacked their manager this season 2 Brighton have enhanced their team whereas Saints have a new RB and Guly 3 Brighton probably do not have a CEO demanding Promotion Agree with 1 and 2....however 3.... http://www.theargus.co.uk/sport/7984432.Bloom_targets_top_two_next_season/ .......but I would be really unhappy if we were in the play-offs next season. “We are aiming for the top two, Gus is the same. There are no guarantees but everything is looking good, on and off the pitch.” And with that, my 3 posts for the day are done.
NickG Posted 24 February, 2011 Posted 24 February, 2011 There is no arguing with all you adkinslovvies, he's no better than Pardew and we exposed ourselves to a disastrous 3 game period with Wilkins for no reason whatsoever. Just a whim from Cortese. in the politest possible way - you don't know what you are talking about! We have a good manager, get over it.
Window Cleaner Posted 24 February, 2011 Posted 24 February, 2011 in the politest possible way - you don't know what you are talking about! . But not as good as Brighton's, which is what this thread is about.
NickG Posted 24 February, 2011 Posted 24 February, 2011 Noone only comes on in second half hes mainly used as a sub. don't worry, Cleaner isn't worried about a little thing like facts when slagging off saints!
NickG Posted 24 February, 2011 Posted 24 February, 2011 But not as good as Brighton's, which is what this thread is about. they are doing pretty similarly.
John B Posted 24 February, 2011 Posted 24 February, 2011 in the politest possible way - you don't know what you are talking about! We have a good manager, get over it. I AGREE WITH WINDOW CLEANER By the way what has adkins done which makes him good He has done OK but I would have thought that most managers would have done as well and possibly better
Window Cleaner Posted 24 February, 2011 Posted 24 February, 2011 they are doing pretty similarly. but with vastly inferior means in Brighton's case.Their leading scorer Murray, 17 league goals this season, not one of them from the penalty spot,cost about 300K a few years back, he's been brought on and is improving. Our leading scorer 14 league goals,including 6 penalties, cost us a million £ and isn't as performant as last season.It's not knocking but I personally wish we had Poyet and they had Adkins, I won't change that opinion for all the statistics you can generate. Poyet IS a superior manager end of story.
The9 Posted 24 February, 2011 Posted 24 February, 2011 We bought players Dickson and Richardson, both played in our benchmark win against Oldham, now they're on the bench and in the stands. WTF is that all about then?? Adkins showed his limitations with Puncheon..end of story. Richardson's been toilet the last 3 times I've seen him play (including weirdly in midfield at Peterborough).
The9 Posted 24 February, 2011 Posted 24 February, 2011 Makes your ground look very average though. You will see in time. Our ground is great thanks, why do you think everyone else's looks the same ?
Window Cleaner Posted 24 February, 2011 Posted 24 February, 2011 Richardson's been toilet the last 3 times I've seen him play (including weirdly in midfield at Peterborough). And why would that be, I know he had a long term injury at the start of the season but then he seemed to put in a few decent performances,was first choice right back up until the Tranmere game and then nothing. I mean he might have been pretty awful that day but then so I believe were the whole side. Perhaps he has some sort of injury I really don't know but Adkins does seem to like a scapegoat following a defeat.
PokingFun Posted 24 February, 2011 Posted 24 February, 2011 Brighton have a better manager, simple as. Brighton had a head start on us after the rubbish start caused by others this season, simple as that!
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