Daily Fail: Southampton players told to boycott 125th centenary dinner...

[hypochondriac]

OK. That is your opinion and you are entitled to it. But it seems to me that you are perfectly happy to be critical of Cortese's supposed lack of communication skills, but allow MLT/Benali and Lawrie carte blanche to say and do as they like, with no obligation towards the reputation of the club, or no forethought of how their reputations might suffer. It rather looks as if they are somehow above criticism in your eyes because of their past contributions.

 

But is it a prerequisite of a football club chairman that they be gifted communicators? I wouldn't have thought that it had that much relevance compared with the ability to ensure that the club was able to be run in a financially astute manner, that attention be given to its investment in the infrastucture encouraging youth development and that the manager was supported when he asked for additional players to gain our promotion.

 

Easy enough for a chairman to delegate the PR responsibility, although he is entitled to lay down the policy structure that he wants.

 

I am sure that Cortese will sit up and take notice whenever you advise him that he needs to improve his communication skills. Not.

 

So Cortese is supposedly tough on others, which means to me that he requires full commitment from his staff, that perhaps he doesn't suffer fools gladly. Maybe he is single-minded in the pursuit of his target for the club (business) that he has the responsibility of running.

 

As far as I can see, those are all positives, but if all he needs to do is improve his communication skills to gain the approval of a few over sensitive fans, the Paparazzi, or ex-players with bruised egos, then I'm happy that he concentrates his energies on other more important matters.

 

I'm not advising him to improve his communication, he admitted himself that it is something he wants to improve.

[Wes Tender]

So you call the mail a rag and totally dismiss everything it says yet then believe a different article? How selective.

 

Whether an article in the Mail has any credibility or not surely depends on the source the information came from. So yes. One article could be of dubious provenance, whereas another might have some credibility. With a rag like the Mail, being selective about whether you believe everything written in there is a sensible trait. The same goes for the local rag too. Often articles in both need to be taken with a pinch of salt.

[shurlock]

And so by extension the article which buctootim quoted is b*llocks yes?

 

Not necessarily - depends who's written it - different people can write for any one paper (need to know the individual journo - his sources and networks etc).

 

More important, i'm more likely to belive something, regardless of the source, if there's an official line, quote or attribution upon which the journo can hang himself if he f**ks up - at least, there's one in this article (though I dont put it past a journo to twist words if the statement is an opinion - but this is simply reporting a statement of fact which is harder to spin)

Edited 8 February, 2011 by shurlock

[shurlock]

Whether an article in the Mail has any credibility or not surely depends on the source the information came from. So yes. One article could be of dubious provenance, whereas another might have some credibility. With a rag like the Mail, being selective about whether you believe everything written in there is a sensible trait. The same goes for the local rag too. Often articles in both need to be taken with a pinch of salt.

 

this

[JustinR]

MLT and Benali are no longer on the bus or in the building and havent been for some time. MLT nearly stopped the bus ever getting going. They should just review their behaviour, draw a blue line under it. Cortese is taking care of business and its about winning games of football simple as that.

[hypochondriac]

Whether an article in the Mail has any credibility or not surely depends on the source the information came from. So yes. One article could be of dubious provenance, whereas another might have some credibility. With a rag like the Mail, being selective about whether you believe everything written in there is a sensible trait. The same goes for the local rag too. Often articles in both need to be taken with a pinch of salt.

 

I will hold a healthy skepticism of everything written in the Mail whilst realising that their could be some truth in it then. Hopefully others will adopt a similar attitude.

[Wes Tender]

I'm not advising him to improve his communication, he admitted himself that it is something he wants to improve.

hypochondriac

I would prefer if Cortese continued to learn on the job and improve his communication skills (he has admitted himself that he still needs to learn things and improve.) Because of this I will pick him up on things where I believe he needs some improvement.

 

Ah! So your comments on here detailing his shortcomings will be the place where you will demonstrate that he needs to improve himself. So how is he to improve his performance unless you are to show him the error of his ways? Or do you expect him to notice your advice from on here?

[Jimmy_D]

Cortese is the current chairman of the club, and it is clear he has a vision of making Southampton one of the big clubs in the country, and nothing is going to stop him, not money nor ex players nor the media. He's going to be here for a long time no matter what.

 

Le Tissier was one of the greatest players this club ever had, an absolute legend on the football pitch, and those accomplishments will never be forgotten, but he isn't anything to do with the club in an official capacity any more, he's part of the media outside the club.

 

Le Tissier unfortunately came into conflict with Cortese right from the start of the whole Pinnacle saga, with the Liebherr takeover delayed because of them, and they've never seen eye to eye since, as Le Tissier admits in that article. Cortese has shown he won't be moved once he sets his mind to something, and whatever the rights and wrongs of this situation, Le Tissier isn't going to win out here. He's not going to be able to make Cortese back down, so unless Le Tissier does something to change his own stance, he's going to be left out in the cold by the club.

 

As for Cortese not wanting players to turn up... My own experience with Ex Saints amounts to a spam e-mail trying to sell me 'bonds'. It initially looks like you're owning something to do with the club by buying these bonds, but they're nothing more than raffle tickets for Saints related prizes. My first reaction on looking at the website was that it was a scam website, trying to use images of players etc. to make it look like it was officially Saints related while using language ambiguous enough to not get into legal trouble ("The Ex Saints enjoy a close relationship with Southampton FC and have an affiliation agreement with the club.") It was only after I saw a photo of Le Tissier under the Ex Saints banner that I realised it was legitimate at all, but the current situation of players not being allowed to attend and imagery not being allowed on the site shows that it is definitely not officially associated.

 

Their charity work is admirable, but Ex Saints is not a registered charity (nor does it claim to be) and one of their stated aims is to help former players that have fallen on hard times, which is understandable and admirable, but means that not all donations to Ex Saints do go to 'charity' as such.

 

Saints do have an official charity in the Saints Foundation, and one possible theory I have is that Cortese doesn't want the 'brand' of Saints Foundation diluted by appearing to give an official link to a non charity by having current players attending, especially as there currently appears to be a dispute over it appearing to be official, but as I said, that's just one of my own theories.

 

I'm not sure where I stand on this. I don't personally see anything wrong with current players supporting a charity dinner, but it seems to be a result of several different factors coming together. Cortese and Le Tissier not seeing eye to eye, Ex Saints appearing to be official when it isn't, and the relatively recent launch of Saints Foundation.

 

Just my own perspective on things.

[hypochondriac]

Ah! So your comments on here detailing his shortcomings will be the place where you will demonstrate that he needs to improve himself. So how is he to improve his performance unless you are to show him the error of his ways? Or do you expect him to notice your advice from on here?

 

If we had a fans forum (as we were told we would have) I would be able to put across my views in person...

[scotty]

Cortese is the current chairman of the club, and it is clear he has a vision of making Southampton one of the big clubs in the country, and nothing is going to stop him, not money nor ex players nor the media. He's going to be here for a long time no matter what.

 

Le Tissier was one of the greatest players this club ever had, an absolute legend on the football pitch, and those accomplishments will never be forgotten, but he isn't anything to do with the club in an official capacity any more, he's part of the media outside the club.

 

Le Tissier unfortunately came into conflict with Cortese right from the start of the whole Pinnacle saga, with the Liebherr takeover delayed because of them, and they've never seen eye to eye since, as Le Tissier admits in that article. Cortese has shown he won't be moved once he sets his mind to something, and whatever the rights and wrongs of this situation, Le Tissier isn't going to win out here. He's not going to be able to make Cortese back down, so unless Le Tissier does something to change his own stance, he's going to be left out in the cold by the club.

 

As for Cortese not wanting players to turn up... My own experience with Ex Saints amounts to a spam e-mail trying to sell me 'bonds'. It initially looks like you're owning something to do with the club by buying these bonds, but they're nothing more than raffle tickets for Saints related prizes. My first reaction on looking at the website was that it was a scam website, trying to use images of players etc. to make it look like it was officially Saints related while using language ambiguous enough to not get into legal trouble ("The Ex Saints enjoy a close relationship with Southampton FC and have an affiliation agreement with the club.") It was only after I saw a photo of Le Tissier under the Ex Saints banner that I realised it was legitimate at all, but the current situation of players not being allowed to attend and imagery not being allowed on the site shows that it is definitely not officially associated.

 

Their charity work is admirable, but Ex Saints is not a registered charity (nor does it claim to be) and one of their stated aims is to help former players that have fallen on hard times, which is understandable and admirable, but means that not all donations to Ex Saints do go to 'charity' as such.

 

Saints do have an official charity in the Saints Foundation, and one possible theory I have is that Cortese doesn't want the 'brand' of Saints Foundation diluted by appearing to give an official link to a non charity by having current players attending, especially as there currently appears to be a dispute over it appearing to be official, but as I said, that's just one of my own theories.

 

I'm not sure where I stand on this. I don't personally see anything wrong with current players supporting a charity dinner, but it seems to be a result of several different factors coming together. Cortese and Le Tissier not seeing eye to eye, Ex Saints appearing to be official when it isn't, and the relatively recent launch of Saints Foundation.

 

Just my own perspective on things.

 

Thats the first chunk of sense Ive seen on this thread.

[manji]

Osman amongst others - including Lawrie Mac - has done some good things for Saints - but they've also made money from the club - particularly under the Wilde and Crouch regimes.

Theyve made money from the club in the past ? Cant think why they dont like Cortese then.........

[Fan The Flames]

I know most people want Cortese to be successful with SFC but it doesn't mean it always has to be 'Cortese Good Disagreers Bad'. Whatever you think of Lawrie or Le Tissier they are entitled to their opinion. Personally I believe because of what they have done for the club they both desearve a bit more respect.

 

Before Cortese there was 123 years of history and there will be hundreds of years after he has gone, so he might pull the strings now but he is merely a tempoary guardian of the club. The club is financially owned by Markus Liebherrs daughter but is spiritually owned by the fans.

Edited 8 February, 2011 by Fan The Flames

[Fan The Flames]

Whether an article in the Mail has any credibility or not surely depends on the source the information came from. So yes. One article could be of dubious provenance, whereas another might have some credibility. With a rag like the Mail, being selective about whether you believe everything written in there is a sensible trait. The same goes for the local rag too. Often articles in both need to be taken with a pinch of salt.

 

So without access to the details of the source you fall back on your own prejudices.

[Andoverian]

I know most people want Cortese to be successful with SFC but it doesn't mean it always has to be 'Cortese Good Disagreers Bad'. Whatever you think of Lawrie or Le Tissier they are entitled to their opinion. Personally I believe because of what they have done for the club they both desearve a bit more respect.

 

Before Cortese there was 123 years of history and there will be hundreds of years after he has gone, so he might pull the strings now but he is merely a tempoary guardian of the club. The club is financially owned by Markus Liebherrs daughter but is spiritually owned by the fans.

Excellent post. Couldn't agree more.

[St_Tel49]

The original story is bad enough, but some of this second-guessing is worse IMO.

 

We don't know the facts, we don't know why the decision was made, and so speculating and making judgements on the back of that speculation is pointless.

 

That will reduce the post count to about 1 a week for most people

[St_Tel49]

More like the ones with actual quotes from the club are the ones i'll trust.

 

This

[MarkSFC]

Oh goodie. Let's face it, if it wasn't for the moaning minnies we'd have nothing to talk about.

 

So, my take on it - a local celebrity and do-gooder organises a charity event. He wants some players to come.

 

OK, but according to the article he invited players & manager. Now, I would hazzard a guess that at most Football clubs, players are contracted and have an Image Rights Value, meaning that IF you wish to invite them to attend any sort of event there would be a process that you have to follow. After all, although a Charity event, the appearance of players is still what would be termed "An Endorsement" and is designed to gain more media coverage and more money being raised.

 

My guess is that you would likely have to approach the CLUB with a request (probably the Commercial Depratment) to explain the event, the benefit to the club OR the charity and would in most cases be given the club's support to invite the players. (I would expect it to be a little different with say player appearances at say a Player Testimonial Event)

 

Someone in the Club would have to ensure that it is a valid event, does not contravene any internal contracts or agreements or endorsements and then gives their blessing. After all, if something went wrong, the club would get it in the neck. Not to mention for example Liverpool players being invited to a Chairty event that (for eg) was to benefit something to do with The Sun newspaper.

 

Due processs has to be followed. The article states that Osman invited the players. The club refused. So, once again, a shortage of FACTS. Did he follow process? Did he give the club the right reasons? If he DID contact the club, perhaps some inside the club thought that it would be a BAD thing from a Team Morale perspective to allow players to spend an entire evening amongst people who are extremely negative to the club.

 

Shame they cannot go and mix with our legends, and help out worthwhile charities, but sorry Mike, Franny & MLT you are starting to look REALLY stupid. There has been a line used since forever - You reap what you sow.

 

So STFU

 

Oh, and my guess? He thought he was such a big celebrity and it was such an important event he didn't have to bother asking the club first

 

I like this post.

 

It seems to me that Osman, LM, LeTss and co have (admirably in some senses) organised what will be for the audience/fans a fun and enjoyable event and a chance to see some of their "heroes" and for some of the younger ones, playters they would never have seen in person before. For some thats a good enough reason, and thats why the organisers would want as many former players turn-up.

 

Thepointss that need to be answered though are:

1) Did the organisers approach the CLub BEFORE announcing this event in order to seek their agreement and/or partnership and/or assistance and/or support?

I doubt it. Therefore, regardless of who is organinsing it they are not an employee or associate of Southampton Football CLub therefore it is not official and therefore the club cannot be expected to support it. Nor should they ridicule it, which they havent. They (it would appear) merely refused permission for their employees to attend it in an official capacity. Nothing intrinsically wrong with that at all because if its not official and something happens at the event Southampton FOotball Club could be open to anything.

 

2) Is the event a not-for-profit one and will the accounts be publically available? Without knowing the answers to these points, you cannot expect SFC to be involved.

3) The Ex-Saints organisation, however good, is not an official part of the club and for that reason alone, the use of the badge should not be permitted. We live in a very harsh corporate world and although on the face of it, not allowing a body like the Ex-Saints use of the official Club badge may seem petty there are distinct legal lines to protect companies under patent and copyright law preventing any grey areas. LEt one "unofficial body" use and set precedent and open the flood gates.

 

 

I agree with the posters on here who say that our "heroes" are making themselves look stupid. The fans will never forget the contribution you made to the club and some far far more than others but that does not come with a cast iron gaurantee that you will always get free tickets, free hospitality or whatever. You should accept that and remember that the most loyal people are the fans and they get no favours whatsoever!!

 

I disagree that the club is forgetting the past, it is merely being selective at present on which parts it is publically recalling and aknowledging.

 

Both sides should just move on get on with their lives and do what everyone else does....support The Saints unconditionally.

[Saint Keith]

lets face it these events should be organised with the blessing and support of the club. It should be organised through the club and i think this is where the problem lies.

 

As the saying goes. There are 3 sides to every story. Cortese, le tissier and the truth. Please don't wash your dirty laundry in public. Get round a table and sort out what is best for the club. Public squabbling is not the answer.

 

this

[JackFrost]

There's no question that MLT and Cortese got off on the wrong foot when MLT got taken in by the Fialka Fiasco.

 

MLT has since publicly criticized Cortese more than once and some been far more than simply stating he disagrees with a decision Cortese has made. Regardless of where you are on the debate of whether Cortese is ignoring the club's history, MLT hasn't exactly done a lot to endear himself to the current chairman

Edited 8 February, 2011 by JackFrost

[grammy]

Lawrie Mac/Le tiss/Franny You were all legends for the club and all Saints fans will be eternaly grateful. But that was in the past (great memories) but you are not part of the future of the club. Get over it! You had good careers thanks to this club and no doubt were renumerated very well indeed I am sure. I too have given this club great service in a different way but my contribution to this club has cost me big time 35 years home and many away games (cant bear to think what that would add up to). Despite what I feel is fantastic service I would not expect the club to give me freebies/parking spaces or to leech off the club in any form etc. You will forever live in my memories but not my future dreams. Please if you are genuine fans and really do care about the club draw a line under it and support the future.

[Victor]

FFS. Lawrie, Tiss and Benali are starting to make themselves look very silly indeed.

 

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/football/article-1354685/Southampton-players-told-boycott-125th-centenary-dinner-Keegan-McMenemy--Co.html

 

 

Please could you help an old man with failing eyesight and point out where Benali is mentioned?

[Brussels Saint]

Interesting that there have been a few comments concerning Cortese' PR blunders, but if you simply take this fans forum as a rough guide (full of Saints uber fan obsessives ), I would guess 95% of posters are broadly sideing with Cortese over a dispute with 3 club legends.

 

For me thats an effing PR masterstoke not a blunder................

[um pahars]

it doesn't mean it always has to be 'Cortese Good Disagreers Bad'.

 

Indeed.

 

Why do some people find it impossible to judge each situation on its individual merits, as opposed to launching in to the:

 

"Cortese speaks, must be brill"

 

or

 

"Cortese speaks, must be shyte".

[Pedro]

When one company buys out another (especially if it was close to liquidation) then surely the incumbents select which of the outgoing personnel they want to retain and trust. Thats how I view the current situation, NC is a top foreign businessman (not necessarily a football club chairman) who wants to see his investment at the very least break even. Considering his business happens to be a football club he knows that there are certain criteria he has to involved in but doesn't have to mean that he has to suck up to people from the past just for the sake of it. Just how many players, managers, coaches and hangers on are we expected to accomodate free of charge, I quite like the fact that most of the leaks have been plugged from Stapelwood and that the ****stirrers have moved on.

 

We won't appreciate NC until such time he has gone.

[Wes Tender]

So without access to the details of the source you fall back on your own prejudices.

So kindly point out where I have made any judgement on any particular piece published in either rag? I spoke generally and made the point that not every article written in either publication was always accurate. If that were the case, then of course they would not ever have to make any retractions, or end up in court on libel charges.

 

Am I to take it that you believe every word printed in these publications? Because if you do, you are extremely naive.

[hypochondriac]

I know most people want Cortese to be successful with SFC but it doesn't mean it always has to be 'Cortese Good Disagreers Bad'. Whatever you think of Lawrie or Le Tissier they are entitled to their opinion. Personally I believe because of what they have done for the club they both desearve a bit more respect.

 

Before Cortese there was 123 years of history and there will be hundreds of years after he has gone, so he might pull the strings now but he is merely a tempoary guardian of the club. The club is financially owned by Markus Liebherrs daughter but is spiritually owned by the fans.

 

What a great post. Cortese himself said he is merely a custodian. I too think they are worthy of more respect.

[Wade Garrett]

Do you actually know what is going to charities? If the club were doing it I would expect 100%, along with any time given by contributers. I would expect if the club are unsure of any of this they would be wise to stay well clear.

 

The ex-Saints have been going for years, and the late Steve Beaney and others have given up a lot of valuable time to raise money. For the club to say they can't use the badge, if true, is an absolute disgrace and very disrespectful.

 

As for the 'who are the dark forces' argument, I couldn't give a toss. The club is in a decent position, and if multi-millionaire Matt Le Tissier has to wait 10 days for tickets, then I'm sorry but I won't be losing any sleep over it. I suppose Tony Lynham and Mickey Fialka would have looked after him though, only they didn't have a pot to **** in.

[NickG]

Think this is fair summary:

 

“There are two sides to every story, and I have more important things on my agenda to deal with,” he says.

 

“I am well aware that there are people, who used to be involved in the club and who behind the scenes are trying to destabilise it.

 

“In reality their actions are completely ineffective and serve only to damage their own reputations. These same people are obviously frustrated as they are not involved in any way with the club and I can understand that.

 

“Things have changed since we took over - I believe for the better - and whether they like it or not, there is nothing they can do about it. I do not believe that attempting to discredit or backstab is the behaviour of intelligent people and it is definitely not going to help them with regard to this club.”

[Liquidshokk]

I know most people want Cortese to be successful with SFC but it doesn't mean it always has to be 'Cortese Good Disagreers Bad'. Whatever you think of Lawrie or Le Tissier they are entitled to their opinion. Personally I believe because of what they have done for the club they both desearve a bit more respect.

 

Before Cortese there was 123 years of history and there will be hundreds of years after he has gone, so he might pull the strings now but he is merely a tempoary guardian of the club. The club is financially owned by Markus Liebherrs daughter but is spiritually owned by the fans.

 

Theres getting respect and then theres getting freebees and involvement with the club despite going against the wishes of the club. They cant have it both ways. Either support the club and follow the current rules (in place for a reason) and they will get respect or bad mouth the club and try to derail it and as cortese says only their reputations and enjoyment of the club will lose out.

 

Even when Cortese moves on and someone else is in charge if they have any sense and any knowledge of how to run a well structured, profitable company then they too wont let people who USED to be associated with the club do what the hell they like just because they were once connected.

Edited 8 February, 2011 by Liquidshokk

[Brussels Saint]

What a great post. Cortese himself said he is merely a custodian. I too think they are worthy of more respect.

 

Question is, are their actions respectful to the club and its new owners...............I suspect had they both sat quietly in the background, they would have received that respect and acknowledgement due to them for their previous service, as with other legends. They choose an alternative route using press contacts etc. to air grievances, which seems to damage their standing more than it does our owners.

 

It of course does not mean the club is beyond criticism, but there is a better way and means for this rather than what does appear a fairly spiteful approach.

 

It's a real shame they are unable to accept their influence (be it good or bad) in our club is not what it once was.

[CanadaSaint]

What a great post. Cortese himself said he is merely a custodian. I too think they are worthy of more respect.

 

So do I but respect is a two-way street.

 

Cortese is a proud, principled and occasionally arrogant man. You cross him at your peril, and any changes in his tactics will occur on his timeline, not yours.

 

It could well be that Cortese was "ready to bury the hatchet", with Le Tiss at least, but these continual snipes from the trio make that ever more unlikely.

 

Until they STFU things won't improve and will probably deteriorate further. Very sad.

[Matthew Le God]

What a great post. Cortese himself said he is merely a custodian. I too think they are worthy of more respect.

 

So Lawrie Mac, Matt Le Tiss etc are free to slag Cortese off in the press and should still expect Cortese to do them favours?

[Lord Duckhunter]

I was looking forward to the Mayflower thing on Sunday, I just hope it doesn't turn into a NC bashing event.

[Wes Tender]

What a great post. Cortese himself said he is merely a custodian. I too think they are worthy of more respect.

 

Fan the Flames: Before Cortese there was 123 years of history and there will be hundreds of years after he has gone, so he might pull the strings now but he is merely a tempoary guardian of the club. The club is financially owned by Markus Liebherrs daughter but is spiritually owned by the fans.

 

Hundreds of years? The way that technology has developed over the past half century makes me doubt that. We'll probably have something akin to Rollerball.

 

But make no mistake about it, the ownership of the club, first by Markus Liebherr, then by his daughter/family was the biggest single event in the Club's history in my opinion. Cortese had already mentioned that he was merely the "custodian" of the Club at the first Solent Fans' Forum not long after he arrived. But there is no doubt in my mind that the family are content with the situation provided that Cortese is happy to continue running the Club his way, on their behalf.

 

We might be the spiritual owners of the Club and as such we might well have kept some entity alive with the Saints name in the lower divisions had not ML come in and rescued us. Ultimately though, everybody realises that the business will be more successful if it is run well, providing a product that is attractive to the paying fans. That means ticket prices at a reasonable price, players that we want to watch, playing attractive match-winning football. I believe that most of those boxes are ticked. If there is anybody who is not going to attend matches because they wish to demonstrate solidarity with some ex-players/managers who have had their noses put out of joint, then I admire their principles. But they are going to miss out on a thrilling ride back to the Premiership.

[Liquidshokk]

As much as I admire the work these ex players etc did I don't think they deserve to be treated any better than the fans. At the end of the day thats all they are these days but are still rightly respected for their history with the club. They were paid more than most of us ever will be and no doubt still have more money to enjoy following saints than most fans do today. Why can't they just kick back and concentrate on the football happily in the knowledge that we arent supporting Pimpley and are in a very good position.

[hypochondriac]

I believe that Cortese criticised MLT for his involvement in the other consortium before anything was said in public by MLT (happy to be proven wrong.) I note also that those who think Cortese can do no wrong are also the ones who believe the onus is entirely on those frozen out of the club to offer an olive branch.

[hypochondriac]

As much as I admire the work these ex players etc did I don't think they deserve to be treated any better than the fans. At the end of the day thats all they are these days but are still rightly respected for their history with the club. They were paid more than most of us ever will be and no doubt still have more money to enjoy following saints than most fans do today. Why can't they just kick back and concentrate on the football happily in the knowledge that we arent supporting Pimpley and are in a very good position.

 

Seriously? MLT deserves no better treatment than a fan? The man who (hopefully) we will erect a statue outside the ground for in a few years is no better than a fan?

[St Marco]

Another day another Cortese article. But I think it is becoming increasingly clear "the dark forces" are MLT & LM. Which is sad because the two of them are huge parts of our history and deserve a **** load of respect for what they did.

 

That said though I think they need to stop this media assassination of Cortese. It doesn't help anyone. This article like so many before just seems like an attempt to try and make Cortese look like the bad guy. On each of the points you can counter and say they appear untrue.

 

Like the charity angle. Cortese and the club do a lot for charity since he has been here. In just the last year alone they have done The Red and White Appeal. Which helped to create the transplant centre at Southampton hospital for people with Cancer/Leukaemia and other blood disorders. They had used the home shirt in the game against Peterborough to advertise the charity The Saints Foundation. Became a partner to St James Society. Which is the local charity that deals with the cities homeless people; think they have helped 3000 people already. And most recently the Kenya trip to help local communities. Of which Cortese himself will be going.

Point being you can't really play the "people will suffer because of it" type card as they work a lot with Charities. Can't work with them all. Isn't that the same with every club?

 

The second is the history thing. The shirt design this year. Having no sponsor on it means they lose money. The fact he chose to go back to our first kit shows he respects the history.

In regards to the legends. Just look at all the guys out at St Marys in honour of their cup win when we played Utd recently. Some of those guys are mentioned in this report i.e. Channon. Well i know for a fact Channon is happy as he was asked what he thought of the club now and he said something like "it is now run like a premiership club, and so it should be". No mention of the horrible treatment he has been given by the evil dictator!

 

As for Osman....Just to use a couple of quotes from an interview he did in October.

On sacking of Pardew

" I was shocked at the sacking of Pardew I knew it was coming though, if Cortese had had his way he would have done it at the end of the season" - Attack on Cortese. Wasn’t it Cortese who asked Markus to keep him on?

 

What do you think of the board?

"There should be one person that is answerable and it seems to me that Nicola Cortese is not answerable to anyone. I don’t know what the situation is in relation to the Liebherr family. I am really disappointed that the clubs history is ignored, I’m disappointed in the way Lawrie Mcmenemy, Matthew Le Tissier and the ex players are treated down there" - Attack on Cortese. Would those ex Saints on the pitch agree with you? Doubt it. And this was in October, before the event had even been announced and he already had issues!

 

Will we get back to the PL

"I have no idea what the situation is, nobody knows. In the days of Lowe there were always little leaks I could always get some information from St Mary’s not anymore, because it’s a one man band. I have no idea what’s going on. I don’t know what Liebherr died of, I don’t know what the family have said. No one has said straight, okay Marcus died but he has left a legacy, like jack Walker did at Blackburn" - For someone preaching about respect i see very little of it there towards Markus. Just a case of do we have Cash?. Which Cortese said we do. He released a statement saying the club was now run by the family who backed him 100%, even saying if they did decide to pull out one day he had a back up plan. Guess he missed that statement. Should he be saying stuff about Markus like that publicly? And you’re annoyed because there are no longer leaks of information? Doesn't that mean the company is now actually running as it should be run then?? And of course one man band = attack on Cortese.

 

"I don’t know the answer to will they get in the Premier League. I am sure eventually yes, if this stays the way it is then yes." - So "the way it is" right now is not so bad then is it? Who is the guy in charge of that?

 

You have a season ticket at St Marys. Where do you sit?

"In the west stand, not the west stand what am I talking about, I think I’m back at the Dell!" - 2011 calling Osman, come in Osman, welcome to St Marys.....

 

On previous Saints fund raiser he did

"I remember we did the night for Kevin Moore and the next day I got a whole load of abuse, that I am a parasite that Lawrie and I took £1,500 each when we did the fundraiser at St May’s, all rubbish" - But don't you charge a fee for your "events"?..... Some on here say no smoke without fire right?

 

I could go on and on. There are so many things the guy has said which are nothing more then attacks on the current regime. It is nothing new and has been going on a longtime. And it has become more obvious this is all down to the gravy train they were used to now having been decommissioned.

The only time Cortese has spoken about these guys is when they have attacked him. But love/hate Cortese he at least keeps it out of the media. The image of our club should be what we do on the pitch not what we did 30+ years ago or what a group say about us in the press. The past is important, we should never forget where we came from. But the future is far more important.

 

Time these guys stopped talking to the press. They obviously have issues with Cortese. Slagging him off in the media will not help your cause. It doesn't make our club look good. If you care for the club as you say then why do it? I think most people me included are starting to see more and more that they are just like a group of bitter men. Which as I said is sad because I respect what they did for the club in the past so much.

[Liquidshokk]

Seriously? MLT deserves no better treatment than a fan? The man who (hopefully) we will erect a statue outside the ground for in a few years is no better than a fan?

 

He can be respected more than a fan based on his contributions but imo it doesnt mean he has to gain anything for it. He's not had it bad on the back of being associated with Saints so he's not owed anything. Too many of these people still expect to profit from Saints FC.

 

Just wish they would move on and enjoy it on the same level as us fully in the knowledge that they have every fans respect and not constantly risk losing it.

Edited 8 February, 2011 by Liquidshokk

[70's Mike]

Problem is NC needs to understand that the great "unwashed" average fan out there will not analyse the issue , they will just agree with Le Tiss and Co, and store up another notch against NC

Right or Wrong this forum is basically made up of intelligent people who try to look at issues from both sides, not your average fan in the pub whose only sources are big mouthed mates.

This will eventually end in tears

[Matthew Le God]

I believe that Cortese criticised MLT for his involvement in the other consortium before anything was said in public by MLT (happy to be proven wrong.) I note also that those who think Cortese can do no wrong are also the ones who believe the onus is entirely on those frozen out of the club to offer an olive branch.

 

Nope, Le Tissier has been making snide remarks in the written and broadcast media for a long time about Cortese. Despite doing this, Le Tiss thinks that Cortese should be doing him favours. I like Le Tiss as much as any Saints fan (as my username suggests), but he is being very naive and seems oblivious to the fact that his actions may have consequences. If you **** someone off in the press with unsubstantiated claims, you can't expect them to give you perks, no matter what you did for the club.

[Wes Tender]

Problem is NC needs to understand that the great "unwashed" average fan out there will not analyse the issue , they will just agree with Le Tiss and Co, and store up another notch against NC

Right or Wrong this forum is basically made up of intelligent people who try to look at issues from both sides, not your average fan in the pub whose only sources are big mouthed mates.

This will eventually end in tears

 

Really? Surely the unwashed average fan couldn't care a **** provided that we're winning games and climbing the league.

[70's Mike]

Really? Surely the unwashed average fan couldn't care a **** provided that we're winning games and climbing the league.

 

I said eventually , at present things are rosey on the pitch but there is a constant drip of these issues and my concern is that they will just fuel the idiots.

Hope i am wrong

[CanadaSaint]

I believe that Cortese criticised MLT for his involvement in the other consortium before anything was said in public by MLT (happy to be proven wrong.) I note also that those who think Cortese can do no wrong are also the ones who believe the onus is entirely on those frozen out of the club to offer an olive branch.

 

hypo, if you have to misrepresent what people are saying in order to make your point, perhaps you don't really have one.

 

Very few people "think Cortese can do no wrong" or that "the onus is entirely on those frozen out of the club to offer an olive branch".

 

But a lot of people seem to think that shutting the frick up instead of sniping from the bushes would be a good start if they truly want this thing resolved. If you count that first step as an "olive branch", I guess I'll have to plead guilty.

[Gingeletiss]

I'm not sure the reason is important. I've told you what I know but cannot say whether it is true or not.

 

He is suing him. I was told (by a relative of Benali) that it was to do with his flooring. I received a PM on here about the pool but absolutely no idea if that is true. He is suing him though, he confirmed it on Soccer AM.

 

Make your mind up!

 

You really have an issue with NC Hypo, fail to sign your autograph book or something?

[thegaffer]

Mike Osman owns 2 season tickets paid for by himself.

failing to embrace clubs history?? The ex-players invited to ground, shirt, montage of old games etc.

 

Does Osman go to games?

 

Mail and these people need to get over themselves.

[Gingeletiss]

Oh! and Hypo, may I remind you of this.

 

I was replying to a post about him in this thread but I was referring to the wider issue of fan communication rather than the specific Nick issue which has nothing to do with NC really. Topics as long as this do have a tendency to go off topic a bit and that was one example. I never discussed the merits of NC in relation to the club withholding Nick's ticket and I never used this issue as an excuse to have a pop at NC like Marco is suggesting.

[simo]

I think its time people stopped slagging Cortese off as much as we all respect Mlt etc and what they did in the past that's it past! Nc is in control of our future and I for one am happy where we're heading under him. Obviously there has been a few slip up's by him but I think he learns by his mistakes quickly and for a someone with no previous football experience I think he's doing well !

[um pahars]

IMHO, the freezing out of the Ex-Saints and removing their usage of the crest is just petty and doesn't reflect well on the Club.

 

You can argue that Saints have their own Foundation/Charity now (we have always been involved in other charitable/good causes, but still supported the Ex Saints) and you can argue that it is within their rights to retain ownership of the logo (fair enough to stop exploitation for commercial reasons, but to stop it being used by a bunch of Ex players trying to do some good????) and you can argue that the Club has no control over the direction and operations of the Ex Saints Foundation, but are we really saying that it is impossible for the Club and the Ex Saints to sit down together and agree some parameters about how things will work and what is allowed and what isn't??

 

There has to be some common ground, a position whereby both parties can benefit from harnassing the goodwill of both ex players and the Club.

 

IMHO, the only reason why this has not happened is due to MLT & Benali being on the board of the Ex Saints. Just like the Nick Illingsworth situation, I believe Cortese has allowed his judgement to be blinded by the ongoing row/dispute with MLT, Benali and others and the Ex Saints have become victims of this wider spat.

 

As for that spat between MLT, Benali, Lawrie V Cortese et al, then why oh why can't someone knock a few heads together. The constant bickering, petty disagreements and actions leave everyone looking rather foolish and dirtying the name and integrity of the Club.

 

Both sides must accept their share of the blame, but sadly there would appear to be too many egos out there to allow for any swallowing of pride.

[dune]

Whether an article in the Mail has any credibility or not surely depends on the source the information came from. So yes. One article could be of dubious provenance, whereas another might have some credibility. With a rag like the Mail, being selective about whether you believe everything written in there is a sensible trait. The same goes for the local rag too. Often articles in both need to be taken with a pinch of salt.

 

It boils down to whether you believe Matt Le Tissier or not. Unlike some traitors I believe MLT and i'd never refer to him in the snide way you did.