Richard Keys and Andy Gray

[Viking Warrior]

I do not like Andy Gray either. but I do not think he should have been sacked for what he has said

 

There is a thing about natuaral justice prevailing. With out knowing the the ins and outs of the earlier case? but it seems like ky have been over zealous with dealing with this matter. There is a right to a fair hearing in accordance with ACAS guidance.

what is not adding up though is was AG already subject to a final written warning for the previous allegation? The fact he was suspended from lastnight broadcast just add icing on the cake and was summarily dismissed again thats not in accordance with disciplinary rules. But then Murdoch is an arse and would dismissed him there and then instead of allowing for a proper hearing

 

maybe gray was ****ed off with the sky bosses and pressed the self destruct button on purposes.

 

 

I notice it was alright for Kenny Dalglish's daughter to make a comment about the incident

The Scot's daughter Kelly, a former presenter on Sky Sports News, joked on her Twitter account: "Phew, am exhausted. Just read about something called 'the offside rule'. Too much for my tiny brain. Must be damaged from nail polish fumes."

 

She would have been better to say nothing.

 

OH and that nice well respected referee Mr Mike Riley is getting in the act now

Edited 25 January, 2011 by Viking Warrior

[bridge too far]

Fair enough, this is true. I must admit, I've never heard someone question a man's ability to be a midwife or something similar. Do you not feel though, that if there was a 'Loose men' making the same kind of comments/jokes, there would be complaints?

 

Well, I admit I've never watched Loose Women so I can't really make a reasoned comment. But I think over the years, there've been any amount of comedy-type programmes where blokes make jokey remarks about women. Even these days it happens. And I don't have a problem with that (I'll even laugh along where the observations are in fact funny and true).

 

I don't think you can compare a discussion about a man's ability to deal with a cold with a discussion about whether a professionally qualified official can do the job JUST BECAUSE SHE'S A WOMAN.

 

Huge difference.

[Viking Warrior]

I think whats more important about the whys and where for's of what AG said is that we have lost another serviceman in Afghan today. The news readers should give that more prominence

[Thedelldays]

I think so many people getting in on the act could have something to do with that they dislike gray...IMO

[Papa Shango]

Not really that fussed about what was said, but glad to see the back of Gray (And hopefully Keys as well). Their style of punditry is incredibly dated and clichéd. Would love it if Sky brought in people like James Richardson and Gabriele Marcotti to replace them, but I expect we'll get more of the same.

[Thorpe-le-Saint]

Well, I admit I've never watched Loose Women so I can't really make a reasoned comment. But I think over the years, there've been any amount of comedy-type programmes where blokes make jokey remarks about women. Even these days it happens. And I don't have a problem with that (I'll even laugh along where the observations are in fact funny and true).

 

I don't think you can compare a discussion about a man's ability to deal with a cold with a discussion about whether a professionally qualified official can do the job JUST BECAUSE SHE'S A WOMAN.

 

Huge difference.

 

I agree with you BTF, I just think I'm being a bit precious about it all if I'm honest. Again, I know this isn't a question of professional ability but I remember when at Uni back in 2005 they offered women only cut price tickets to the next Saracens game as Johnny Wilkinson was playing against them for Newcastle Falcons. I hate rugby, but I was outraged yet didn't do anything about it, thankfully the Uni withdrew the promotion after complaints from the rugby society under the Uni's anti-discrimination code of conduct yet some of the female members of the society and of the Uni were disgusted.

 

As I've said I agree sexism and professional ability have no place in 2011, yet sometimes (but not on this occasion) I feel that the fairer sex like to have their cake and eat it when it comes to sexism.

[Thorpe-le-Saint]

Not really that fussed about what was said, but glad to see the back of Gray (And hopefully Keys as well). Their style of punditry is incredibly dated and clichéd. Would love it if Sky brought in people like James Richardson and Gabriele Marcotti to replace them, but I expect we'll get more of the same.

 

Richardson would be excellent.

[Thedelldays]

Not really that fussed about what was said, but glad to see the back of Gray (And hopefully Keys as well). Their style of punditry is incredibly dated and clichéd. Would love it if Sky brought in people like James Richardson and Gabriele Marcotti to replace them, but I expect we'll get more of the same.

totally agree........100%.

 

this SHOULD be a time for SKY to go down a slightly different route IMO..the combination of one all knowing nob head and ask the "dumb" question line up is tiresome and old..

 

I can see jamie redknapp getting more air time (annoying) but if sky got in those two you mention it would be great

[southamptonfc]

There is a football god!!!

 

I was so tired of him preaching like he is the be all and end all of football knoweldge.

 

His constant on air character assasination of refs and linesmen (and women!) have justified and encouraged a lack of respect towards them by professional players and kids alike.

 

Giving him a voice is bad for the game and I'm glad he's gone.

[southamptonfc]

Sorry I realise I shouldn't have opened this in the Saints area.

[Gingeletiss]

Gray definitely doesn't, he continues to bang on about "daylight" between the defender and the attacker, when that was removed from the rules at least two years ago

 

I'd be delighted to see the back of the pair of them, half-decent presenters who actually know what they're talking about and don't ask dumb questions just to get a layman's response are ten-a-penny - most of the SSN presenters would do a better job than Keys. Granted, it's harder to find decent pundits, but Sky do have a few on their books among the utter dross. Le Tiss, Alan McInally, Dion Dublin... all decent enough, but they only ever get the chance when one of their former teams are being shown, while the rest of the time we have to listen to Jamie Redknapp literally not knowing his arsehole from his elbow.

 

Laws even;)

[stevegrant]

sam matterface (ex sky sports employee) is on Talksport saying he is in no way surprised that more remarks from gray have come out....gray acted like he was untouchable and not popular at all with many of the employees there

I'm quite surprised so many people both in broadcasting and in the game have been so quick to throw their weight into the argument as football does tend to be quite a secretive business when things like this happen.

 

How many times have people been sacked as a broadcaster and they've just been ushered out the back door without a word said by anyone? Yet Sky News and Sky Sports News have produced in-depth reports, public statements from the head of Sky Sports, etc. It's almost as if they're glad they found an excuse to bin him.

 

One thing some people may learn from this is that you take on Rupert Murdoch at your peril. Gray is suing the News of the World - another of Murdoch's media outlets - as part of the phone-tapping scandal, and it's odd and rather convenient how the initial leak was made (with Sky implying they won't be conducting an inquiry to discover the source) and then when everything kicked off, additional clips were then leaked to add extra weight.

[Gingeletiss]

I'm quite surprised so many people both in broadcasting and in the game have been so quick to throw their weight into the argument as football does tend to be quite a secretive business when things like this happen.

 

How many times have people been sacked as a broadcaster and they've just been ushered out the back door without a word said by anyone? Yet Sky News and Sky Sports News have produced in-depth reports, public statements from the head of Sky Sports, etc. It's almost as if they're glad they found an excuse to bin him.

 

One thing some people may learn from this is that you take on Rupert Murdoch at your peril. Gray is suing the News of the World - another of Murdoch's media outlets - as part of the phone-tapping scandal, and it's odd and rather convenient how the initial leak was made (with Sky implying they won't be conducting an inquiry to discover the source) and then when everything kicked off, additional clips were then leaked to add extra weight.

 

The plot thickens, well spotted Steve.

[Deppo]

Some of the comments on this thread are incredible. stevegrant and thedelldays have got it spot on, FWIW.

[SaintRichmond]

It's not the first time they've been caught out either, though this was quite funny http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p7gCYAtmYSI

 

Im not sure they know the off side rule either

 

 

I don't understand it either until after five pints

 

What I do think funny though is that EVERY week they question some linesmans parentage re some dubious decision, so to single out a female BEFORE the match was laughable

[NickG]

Comments that you may feel appropriate with your mates at football etc maybe insulting to female colleagues at work or make them feel uncomfortable - they become inappropriate and your employer has every right to do something about it.

 

These comments were made at work.

 

Think a lot who support these views are pretty insecure - what difference can a match official gender possibly make? Only one I can think is a positive one.

[Red&White]

andy gray has been sacked.....for this comment and others totted up...

 

time to move on from this arrogant ****

 

This

[swannymere]

It smacks of SKY wanting them both out to be replaced by younger/cheaper presenters, they were dinosaurs but its a shame the over-reaction that's been made, don't see the population rising up against the Boots TV advert!

[Wade Garrett]

Sky have a legend on the payroll who could f*cking lose Hairy Keys and his Scottish mate.

 

Step forward Mr Jimmy Hill.

[St Marco]

http://www.talksport.co.uk/radio/drivetime/blog/2011-01-25/see-video-got-andy-gray-sack-sky

 

....

 

[Special K]

's on the other fred...

 

Cheers for that, sorry should have looked.

 

Seems a bit of a fuss about nothing to me, but he should have known better, although it's not in the Frank Bough league of presenter type scandal.

[scott_saints]

Women should stay in the kitchen. It's no surprise the nation is unhealthier since they've spent less time in there, they're good at it.

[Wade Garrett]

Sky have given enough rope for the arrogant Gray to hang himself with.

 

If Charlotte was my daughter(from the clip on an earlier post), I'd want to smash Gray's head in.

 

I'm glad he's gone, hope Keys follows him out the door.

 

Jeff Stelling is their best presenter by a country mile, and as an added bonus seems like a nice bloke, and not an arrogant c*nt.

[Sergei Gotsmanov]

Absolutely and she did very much show them up for the idiots they are. But, at the time, she didn't know what they'd said about her, did she? To her credit, AFAIK, she's kept a dignified silence.

 

If someone questioned your ability PURELY BECAUSE OF YOUR GENDER, and you didn't know about it, but subsequently found out, I guess you'd be a tad annoyed.

 

BTF I really would not care. The fact remains that female linesman have not proved their ability is equal to that of men; there simply has not been enough evidence to judge it. What is right is that they have been given the opportunity. Believe it or not woman are better at some jobs than men and vice versa. In a free world people should be able to debate the subject; personally I think most linesmen do a bad job.

[saint_bert]

I'm quite surprised so many people both in broadcasting and in the game have been so quick to throw their weight into the argument as football does tend to be quite a secretive business when things like this happen.

 

How many times have people been sacked as a broadcaster and they've just been ushered out the back door without a word said by anyone? Yet Sky News and Sky Sports News have produced in-depth reports, public statements from the head of Sky Sports, etc. It's almost as if they're glad they found an excuse to bin him.

 

One thing some people may learn from this is that you take on Rupert Murdoch at your peril. Gray is suing the News of the World - another of Murdoch's media outlets - as part of the phone-tapping scandal, and it's odd and rather convenient how the initial leak was made (with Sky implying they won't be conducting an inquiry to discover the source) and then when everything kicked off, additional clips were then leaked to add extra weight.

 

Stan Collymore via his Talksport twiter account alluded to something similar yesterday.

[saint_bert]

Sky have given enough rope for the arrogant Gray to hang himself with.

 

If Charlotte was my daughter(from the clip on an earlier post), I'd want to smash Gray's head in.

 

I'm glad he's gone, hope Keys follows him out the door.

 

Jeff Stelling is their best presenter by a country mile, and as an added bonus seems like a nice bloke, and not an arrogant c*nt.

 

Can confirm that is 100 percent correct. At least it was when I met him.

[dune]

Someone else has been suspended for saying the lino was a "looker".

 

This country has gone PC mad.

[S-Clarke]

It's going to screw up sky sports ''20 years'' celebrations......seeing as most of their celebration footage includes Gray!

 

I'd expect Gray to be picked up by a station in Dubai with the other former Sky Sports presenter...

[Crab Lungs]

It's going to screw up sky sports ''20 years'' celebrations......seeing as most of their celebration footage includes Gray!

 

I'd expect Gray to be picked up by a station in Dubai with the other former Sky Sports presenter...

 

Yup, I think you're right there. He'll defo end up on one of the Prem channels in the Middle East.

[sadoldgit]

Someone else has been suspended for saying the lino was a "looker".

 

This country has gone PC mad.

 

Indeed, she looks like a bit of a moose to me!

[aintforever]

The fact remains that female linesman have not proved their ability is equal to that of men;

 

The ones currently working have, otherwise they wouldn't be doing the job.

 

Having a pair of norks and a muff instead of a nob won't effect anyones ability to run up and down a touchline.

[GenevaSaint]

Those comments were stupid, in conjunction with the sexual harassment I can see why they sacked him.

[Sergei Gotsmanov]

The ones currently working have, otherwise they wouldn't be doing the job.

 

Having a pair of norks and a muff instead of a nob won't effect anyones ability to run up and down a touchline.

 

That is your view; lets debate without the shacles of PC. I felt Wendy Toms struggled to keep up with play - is that because she was a woman or because she was not up to it. I can only go on my experience. You must have seen more evidence than me?

[Deppo]

I thought they were joking around. There'll be lots of sackings if everyone is taken seriously all the time.

 

What if they were deadly serious and said 'I don't believe we should have women officials'? Agreeing with them or not, it doesn't stop them being good at their job, and it is just an opinion.

 

I'll miss Andy Gray on Sky Sports he's been good and a part of many football memories because of the commentary.

 

Perhap's he'll form a football show on five with Rodney Marsh and Big Ron.

 

hardly recorded in secret when they were at work.....just because they were not being broadcast across the nation at that time does not mean that are not being filmed...!!!

 

Have you two swapped accounts?

[bridge too far]

That is your view; lets debate without the shacles of PC. I felt Wendy Toms struggled to keep up with play - is that because she was a woman or because she was not up to it. I can only go on my experience. You must have seen more evidence than me?

 

We could throw your argument back at you. What about the thousands of dubious, if not downright ridiculous, decisions given by some male officials. Does that mean that all male officials aren't up to the job?

 

If the officials get through the courses and perform when they're refereeing, does it matter what's in their shorts?

[Sergei Gotsmanov]

We could throw your argument back at you. What about the thousands of dubious, if not downright ridiculous, decisions given by some male officials. Does that mean that all male officials aren't up to the job?

 

If the officials get through the courses and perform when they're refereeing, does it matter what's in their shorts?

 

That is absurd BTF considering that 99.9999999% of linesmen are blokes. What I would suspect has happened is that the few women that want to be lineswomen have been fast tracked. Now I would defend that policy to a degree but my experience of one woman do it was that she was not up to the job. I do not care who does the job as long as they are not parachuted in for pc reasons.

[solentstars]

Sky have given enough rope for the arrogant Gray to hang himself with.

 

If Charlotte was my daughter(from the clip on an earlier post), I'd want to smash Gray's head in.

 

I'm glad he's gone, hope Keys follows him out the door.

 

Jeff Stelling is their best presenter by a country mile, and as an added bonus seems like a nice bloke, and not an arrogant c*nt.

 

good post and i,m glad that relic from the past got his cards.

[Sergei Gotsmanov]

Just seen the off air banter between blokes - no different to girlie banter. These guys lost their livelihoods for that!!!

 

We now live in a nazi state.

[NickG]

and so they should

[Sergei Gotsmanov]

and so they should

 

In life people say things privately that we do not approve of; argue with it, show your dislike, do not quietly report it. That is what nazism advocated and it is repulsive.

[Thedelldays]

In life people say things privately that we do not approve of; argue with it, show your dislike, do not quietly report it. That is what nazism advocated and it is repulsive.

tell me what is private about what they said...they were at work ffs

[Sergei Gotsmanov]

tell me what is private about what they said...they were at work ffs

 

I would think Delldays that on your submarines people express differing opinions - do you report the ones that you disapprove of; or do you tell the person that expressed them they are an arse?

[Thedelldays]

I would think Delldays that on your submarines people express differing opinions - do you report the ones that you disapprove of; or do you tell the person that expressed them they are an arse?

 

if I went (lets say to a coloured fella)....oi monkey, make a noise for us....and that got reported, I would be out of a job...fact

[Sergei Gotsmanov]

if I went (lets say to a coloured fella)....oi monkey, make a noise for us....and that got reported, I would be out of a job...fact

 

If you got a smack everybody would cheer - and it would not just be him that smacked you. Why run to matron?

[saint_bert]

The look on the female Sky sports presenters face proved that she was not comfortable while AG was saying "put it down ere"

 

Hairy hands was chuckeling away too.

 

Listen carefully and someone says "she turns away when you talk to her" or something like that.

 

No one has the right to make people feel that uncomfortable anywhere.

Edited 25 January, 2011 by saint_bert

[Thedelldays]

If you got a smack everybody would cheer - and it would not just be him that smacked you. Why run to matron?

 

what are you on about..

[LGTL]

Someone else has been suspended for saying the lino was a "looker".

 

This country has gone PC mad.

 

I know, poxy Tories.

[Sergei Gotsmanov]

what are you on about..

 

I am saying that if you say something stupid then it should be addressed there and then not by secret recordings. I do agree with Saint Bert though AG was pretty dreadful to the Sky presenter.

[Thedelldays]

I am saying that if you say something stupid then it should be addressed there and then not by secret recordings. I do agree with Saint Bert though AG was pretty dreadful to the Sky presenter.

 

when a camera is pointing t you and you are wearing a mic..(im sure cameras have red lights to show they are recording) then it is hardly secret...

 

now, if they were up the pub and having private chats and being filmed then that would be different...but these two were at work

[pedg]

As has been pointed out elsewhere once they are miked up they can be heard by a large number of people even when not on air. Its an unwritten rule in broadcasting is that when you have a mike on you treat it as if its always on. Obviously AG and Keys decided they were above such things.