um pahars Posted 23 January, 2011 Share Posted 23 January, 2011 Trouble its not just an opinion. They both have agenda. I suspect Matt is embarrased by his Pinnacle bid and the more succesful the Liebherr regime the worse the Pinnacle fiasco looks and as for Lawrie it is alledged he has lost out considerably since Cortese took over. What is this agenda??? I am missing something sinister??? I would venture that whilst in hindsight Matty is embarrassed by what turned out to be a dud I don't really think he would harbour any grudge about the Club being saved. Certainly, in the context of where we were at the time I struggle to understand why he should be hung out to dry for trying to do something in our darkest hour. I'm not sure what Lawrie has lost out on since Cortese arrived back on the scene. His ambassadorial role and the money that went with it disappeared under the previous regime and at worst he thinks he is being frozen out of being held up in the high regard he believes he should be. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
St Marco Posted 23 January, 2011 Share Posted 23 January, 2011 Great manager for us and deserves all the respect in the world for what he did for us. Our only real domestic piece of silverware. That said i think he has to understand that it is a new era. You should always remember your past but you should also always look to the future. I think he needs to respect what Markus and Cortese did for us. If it wasen't for them we probably wouldn't be playing at all this saturday let alone against Man Utd. Is walking into the stadium with the rest of us really so bad? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
um pahars Posted 23 January, 2011 Share Posted 23 January, 2011 Perhaps it's because they are genuinely concerned by the way the club we all love is being run? That's nothing new, Kenny Dalglish had plenty to say about Liverpool in the years he wasn't there. People who are so happy to fawn over NC at every chance, need to bear in mind who gave us the greatest day in the history of the club, and the bed rock for success that was established there after. Lawrie Mac and Matt Le Tissier have done more for this club than any others in the last 40 years and are more than entitled to have there say. And as well as comparing Lawrie with Dalglish who was happy to voice his concerns about the direction of "his" club, you could also draw parallels with the way in which Bobby Charlton acted when United were having diificulties, in that he kept a diplomatic silence. Not saying either is the right way and there are probably merits to both. However, I would say that whichever path they have chosen to take shouldn't preclude them from being held in the highest regard for their past efforts at the Club. I struggle to see why it has to be a Cortese or McMenemy/Matty way. Surely there is a compromise here where all the sets of egos can be massaged and channelled in to a positive for the Club and its supporters. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
um pahars Posted 23 January, 2011 Share Posted 23 January, 2011 Do ex-Managing Directors of Tesco get their shopping free when they go back? If there is one analogy that I will always struggle with, it's the comparison of a Football Club with a normal high street business. It's the very fact that they are so different and that a football club is at the cornerstone of the fabric of a community's that makes it so special to all of us (and why we get so passionate about it). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
doddisalegend Posted 23 January, 2011 Share Posted 23 January, 2011 I keep seeing it brought up on this thread but were does LM say in the article that he wanted free tickets? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RobM Posted 23 January, 2011 Share Posted 23 January, 2011 I keep seeing it brought up on this thread but were does LM say in the article that he wanted free tickets? He said: It is a fact there was more chance of me being invited to sit with United and long-time friends like Sir Bobby Charlton and Sir Alex Ferguson than with Southampton,' Then, 'I just accept it and, in a way, I understand it. The club secretary told me, "Lawrie, what you have to realise is the game has moved on". Well, of course I do realise that. But does it mean you must totally ignore what has gone before?' So no, if you're out to defend him you're right, he doesn't say he has asked for free tickets, nor that he wants them. But he does say he hasn't been invited and implies he feels that's wrong as he is part of 'what has gone before'. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RobM Posted 23 January, 2011 Share Posted 23 January, 2011 The key bit for me is this line: But McMenemy, now 74, fears that he has been airbrushed out of the history of the club he did so much to influence. You haven't. But if we spend all our time looking backwards, how can we possibly move forwards. Nobody has forgotten or will ever forget what you have done for us, but that doesn't mean we should spend our days looking backwards as if it was the only important thing ever to happen. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ottery st mary Posted 23 January, 2011 Share Posted 23 January, 2011 I hope and pray he is in one of the executive boxes on Sat...Ex Saints at least....and MLT please... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jam Posted 23 January, 2011 Share Posted 23 January, 2011 And as well as comparing Lawrie with Dalglish who was happy to voice his concerns about the direction of "his" club, you could also draw parallels with the way in which Bobby Charlton acted when United were having diificulties, in that he kept a diplomatic silence. Not saying either is the right way and there are probably merits to both. However, I would say that whichever path they have chosen to take shouldn't preclude them from being held in the highest regard for their past efforts at the Club. I struggle to see why it has to be a Cortese or McMenemy/Matty way. Surely there is a compromise here where all the sets of egos can be massaged and channelled in to a positive for the Club and its supporters. I can't help but feel that this story has been worked up to make it more controversial. Firstly going on about the picture, when that has nothing to do with Cortese. Secondly, McMenemy was on Five Live a couple of months ago and while he noted that the current chairman is running the club like a business, to me he made no effort to put the boot in. I totally agree with you, Um, that there surely must be a compromise that allows this all to be put to bed. However if push comes to shove I can't see why Cortese shouldn't try and run the club as a business. Surely his first responsabilty is to look out for the Liebherrs' interests, not dish out freebies and invites (no matter how much we as fans might feel they are deserved). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
um pahars Posted 23 January, 2011 Share Posted 23 January, 2011 Surely his first responsabilty is to look out for the Liebherrs' interests, not dish out freebies and invites (no matter how much we as fans might feel they are deserved). Indeed, his first interest is to succeed and with that success comes reward in monetary and other terms. However, alongside my somewhat sentimental and romantic notion that we should also engender a warm feeling about "our" Club is the thought that in doing so it could actually make business sense in that it might generate some positive PR and a feelgood vibe. Would this transfer in to £££'s and could this be quantified, I don't know, but for the sake of massaging a few egos I'd give it a punt (neither of the two "breaking stories" seem to be costing us anything). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
up and away Posted 23 January, 2011 Share Posted 23 January, 2011 Perhaps it's because they are genuinely concerned by the way the club we all love is being run? That's nothing new, Kenny Dalglish had plenty to say about Liverpool in the years he wasn't there. People who are so happy to fawn over NC at every chance, need to bear in mind who gave us the greatest day in the history of the club, and the bed rock for success that was established there after. Lawrie Mac and Matt Le Tissier have done more for this club than any others in the last 40 years and are more than entitled to have there say. Concerned, the only thing Lawrie is concerned with is Lawrie, always has been. When he has had any power his true light always shines through, a bully, ego the size of a planet and holds more grudges than a super tanker. These things made him the great manager he was, along with many other similar greats of the time. Try working under him in another capacity and you will find it difficult to get a good word. Mention his name at the wrong moment to John McGrath and you would find yourself the other side of the wall. Alan Ball when asked about their relationship when he was manager "He looks at the team sheet and says he would not have played so and so". Almost everyone has to pay for their tickets at Saints, unless they are working, something started immediately by Cortese. That does not mean ex players do not get offered freebies, something Lawrie availed himself of at the start, it's just not done on a consistent basis. The fact Cortese no longer sees value in paying for his services cannot of helped matters, but I have to question why anyone with the good of the club at heart was taking money out in those previous desperate times. If Lawrie wanted any form of a relationship with the club, he would not spout off to the press when they are running an anti Cortese thread. Seeing those who that tend to congregate around him spread rumours can hardly endear him with Cortese. I would really like to see Matty and Cortese put things behind them, but I am not going to even bother holding my breath for Lawrie. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jam Posted 23 January, 2011 Share Posted 23 January, 2011 Indeed, his first interest is to succeed and with that success comes reward in monetary and other terms. However, alongside my somewhat sentimental and romantic notion that we should also engender a warm feeling about "our" Club is the thought that in doing so it could actually make business sense in that it might generate some positive PR and a feelgood vibe. Would this transfer in to £££'s and could this be quantified, I don't know, but for the sake of massaging a few egos I'd give it a punt (neither of the two "breaking stories" seem to be costing us anything). I must admit I'm not Lawrie Mac's biggest fan - I was getting into football about the time he left us the first time - but I also feel that he could add value to the club. Aside from the hospitality side of things, I reckon he would be excellent at persuading players to come here, really selling the club to them. Cortese clearly feels that he needs to see the benefit in anything that he invests in and I sadly don't think that there's anyone at the club who is willing / able to sell the idea of bringing Lawrie back into the fold. As you say, it's worth a punt. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leicestersaint Posted 23 January, 2011 Share Posted 23 January, 2011 There are some people who write on this forum who just don't strike me as real saints fans at all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
for_heaven's_Saint Posted 23 January, 2011 Share Posted 23 January, 2011 Not sure if it's been mentioned already but Lawrie gets into games for free anyway, in the ex-saints' box, so I don't really think he needs or even wants free tickets. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Redondo Saint Posted 23 January, 2011 Share Posted 23 January, 2011 I don't think he says anything too bad about Saints. It is a shame he feels the club don't recognize his contribution to it over the years but to be granted guest of honour status every time he goes to SMS is never going to happen. I think his ego is hampering his good judgement - but a legend he will always be in my eyes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dellman Posted 23 January, 2011 Share Posted 23 January, 2011 I wonder how he is received when he goes back to Sunderland Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
solentstars Posted 23 January, 2011 Share Posted 23 January, 2011 There are some people who write on this forum who just don't strike me as real saints fans at all. totally agree Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
manji Posted 23 January, 2011 Share Posted 23 January, 2011 totally agree Yeah I agree too many of them live in the past and dont want to see the current leadership do well....... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
solentstars Posted 23 January, 2011 Share Posted 23 January, 2011 Yeah I agree too many of them live in the past and dont want to see the current leadership do well.......i think your using that description but thats up to you. me i respect all our legends or is le tissuer another one you want to put down to with his comments as far as i,m aware lawrie,le tiss and all our greats want us back in the premiership. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thedelldays Posted 23 January, 2011 Share Posted 23 January, 2011 i think your using that description but thats up to you. me i respect all our legends or is le tissuer another one you want to put down to with his comments as far as i,m aware lawrie,le tiss and all our greats want us back in the premiership. you respect them so much, you always spell their names right.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dune Posted 23 January, 2011 Share Posted 23 January, 2011 you respect them so much, you always spell their names right.. He's not very bright. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
waggy Posted 23 January, 2011 Share Posted 23 January, 2011 You cannot have a future without a past. Any race or organisation that fails to keep one eye on what has been will ultimately fail itself. The majority of this clubs fans were in favour of Ted Bates having a statue erected outside of SMS. Lawrie McMenemy is equally as relevant as Ted was in making this club what it is today. What some people need to realise is that had it not been for Lawrie's tenure as manager, the most productive of any SFC manager, this club might have folded years ago. He deserves some respect for what he achieved, yet succesive regimes have seen it fit to carry out a Hollywood style air brushing of the clubs history. I am not advocating for one minute that he should be placed on the board but is a free seat in the executives box not the least he deserves? He certainly gave me and a lot of people in my age group a great deal to feel proud of. Much the same can be said of MLT and perhaps Mr Cortese should remember that had it not been for his exploits in, at times single handedly, the 80's and 90's this club would have been relegated a lot sooner and would have not had SMS and would probably have been off the radar as far as Markus and he were concerned. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
docker-p Posted 23 January, 2011 Share Posted 23 January, 2011 You cannot have a future without a past. Any race or organisation that fails to keep one eye on what has been will ultimately fail itself. The majority of this clubs fans were in favour of Ted Bates having a statue erected outside of SMS. Lawrie McMenemy is equally as relevant as Ted was in making this club what it is today. What some people need to realise is that had it not been for Lawrie's tenure as manager, the most productive of any SFC manager, this club might have folded years ago. He deserves some respect for what he achieved, yet succesive regimes have seen it fit to carry out a Hollywood style air brushing of the clubs history. I am not advocating for one minute that he should be placed on the board but is a free seat in the executives box not the least he deserves? He certainly gave me and a lot of people in my age group a great deal to feel proud of. Much the same can be said of MLT and perhaps Mr Cortese should remember that had it not been for his exploits in, at times single handedly, the 80's and 90's this club would have been relegated a lot sooner and would have not had SMS and would probably have been off the radar as far as Markus and he were concerned. Well said. LM and MLT are probably the two most significant figures over the last 40 years for Southampton FC. To constantly disrespect them and their achievements as NC's agenda appears to be, is to disrespect the history of SFC. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thedelldays Posted 23 January, 2011 Share Posted 23 January, 2011 Well said. LM and MLT are probably the two most significant figures over the last 40 years for Southampton FC. To constantly disrespect them and their achievements as NC's agenda appears to be, is to disrespect the history of SFC. how are they being disrespected..? as far as I am aware they are free to go for nothing still..? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
um pahars Posted 23 January, 2011 Share Posted 23 January, 2011 and dont want to see the current leadership do well....... That's a rather strange interpretation/observation of what people have posted on this and other threads. Which posts and posters do you think exhibit that point of view??? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jackie@home Posted 23 January, 2011 Share Posted 23 January, 2011 I don't think he is being disrespected at all. It's just that every time we play Man U this one day in our history, though very important, seems to dominate all the media and we repeat every cliche going ad finitum. We are lucky enough to have had a lot of great victories in Premier League games against Man U in our recent past, the successive victories 3 seasons in a row, 6-3, 3-1, 1-0, a last minute Beattie header to beat them at St. Mary's a few years ago. We don't go on and on and on about these and all the players and managers involved having to be feted every time we play them again. I can't think of another ex-manager who left a club 30 years ago who still gets the amount of media attention Lawrie Mac does; it is only because he seeks it out - his ego has to be constantly fed. I certainly wouldn't put MLT in the same bracket - Matt's a much more modest down-to-earth chap. I sympathise with Cortese. Football clubs, even at non-league level, attract an amazing number of people who think they should get freebies; executives can waste a lot of their time just controlling this. Ex-staff who work for me don't expect free chocolate for the rest of their life, or need me to tell them how brilliant they were when they used to work for me. Where does this massaging of egos end? This doesn't mean you have forgotten your history, but you can see an 84 year old Lawrie Mac still bringing this up when we play them in 10 years time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kpturner Posted 23 January, 2011 Share Posted 23 January, 2011 Can't see anything to get excited about in that article. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ART Posted 23 January, 2011 Share Posted 23 January, 2011 What a vile and sick minded old man MacMenemy has become! For myself, a Saints supporter for 60 years the greatest moment in the clubs history is the day when Markus Liebherr unselfishly saved our club from oblivion, instructing his heirs and Nicola Cortese to do everything in their power to see a return of Southampton Football Club to the Premiership within 5 years. MacMenemy has weaved an evil path, hellbent on seeing that nobody ever succeeds in doing what he himself did for the club all those years ago. I have no time more for you and the other sick minded despictable people like MacMenemy and his kin. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kpturner Posted 23 January, 2011 Share Posted 23 January, 2011 what a vile and sick minded old man macmenemy has become! For myself, a saints supporter for 60 years the greatest moment in the clubs history is the day when markus liebherr unselfishly saved our club from oblivion, instructing his heirs and nicola cortese to do everything in their power to see a return of southampton football club to the premiership within 5 years. Macmenemy has weaved an evil path, hellbent on seeing that nobody ever succeeds in doing what he himself did for the club all those years ago. I have no time more for you and the other sick minded despictable people like macmenemy and his kin. wum :-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wilko Posted 23 January, 2011 Share Posted 23 January, 2011 Reporter: "Alright, Lawrie. Are you going to the game on Saturday?" Lawrie: "No, lad. I'm not." Reporter: "Why not?" Lawrie: "It's on telly and they haven't given me a free ticket." Reporter: "Does that bother you?" Lawrie: "Not really." Reporter: "What about that photograph they took down a few years ago?" Lawrie: "Oh yes. They did take it down. It's a bit like they're trying to airbrush me out of the club's history, ho ho ho." Reporter: "Cheers, Lawrie. That's an easy page lead." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JackFrost Posted 23 January, 2011 Share Posted 23 January, 2011 There was a time when anything printed in the mail had come directly from the lips of Lowe. It does look like a mountain out of a molehill though Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stthrobber Posted 23 January, 2011 Share Posted 23 January, 2011 I get it completly , but do you not think he should have been invited to the game by the club , walk on the pitch before the game with ex fa cup winners , its a special game v Man Utd hence all the media around the game . Cortese should remember the heritage and not brush it under the carpet . For some supporters they will never see glory like we had back then again in their lives . This is so true. Lawrie must realise what Sky and Champions League money have done to the game. The days when 2nd Division clubs could beat Premier League clubs in a major cup final are long gone. The only chance Saints have realistically of winning next week is if Sir Alex plays his reserve team. Having said that LM is a huge part of our history and the guy that led us during our most successful era. Would it hurt the club to give him an honorary season ticket? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hughieslastminutegoal Posted 24 January, 2011 Share Posted 24 January, 2011 For heaven's sake, this game was nearly 35 years ago. I was there, and enjoyed all the celebrations afterwards, but what's the point in keep on bringing this game up? How many more times does he want patting on the back? You won it once, Lawrie, but a Furguson you aint. How many of us actually care a toss who won last year's cup final? The only people who can really be arsed to remember are the fans of the winning club (and a few other anoraks). We won it once. Good. Now get on and focus on winning something else, and the most important at the moment is promotion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thedelldays Posted 24 January, 2011 Share Posted 24 January, 2011 jesus...the way people are coming out of the woodwork for this one you would think it was the cup final itself.. its a 4th round tie where we will go out.....get over it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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