Turkish Posted 15 January, 2011 Posted 15 January, 2011 I've got to say, thinking about what happened and the charge, it doesn't make sense. ABH is generally used for bruising, small cuts etc. By all accounts Barnard smashed the **** out of this guy. I am guessing that part of the fight was seen as self defence because there is no doubt in my mind that this is a GBH case (by injury). I would confirm this but my Criminal Law books are in the garage in boxes and I really can't be arsed to get them out. It's all hearsay, however if it is true that he hit him with a bottle and beat the sh*t out of someone then a "mate" of mine got 4 years for GBH with intent about 8 years ago for doing something not disimilar.
derry Posted 15 January, 2011 Posted 15 January, 2011 If it goes to a jury trial would a Southampton jury convict? Would he get a fair trial anywhere in the south bearing in mind the antipathy from Brighton to Bristol and Southampton to Oxford?
alpine_saint Posted 15 January, 2011 Posted 15 January, 2011 I'm not criticsing you going to see Saints, if l lived abroad i would hardly see them either, in fact when i lived in Yorkshire for 18 months 12 years ago i only made about 6 or 7 games one season. What i find hard to understand is you say you use this forum to inform yourself, fair enough, yet argue the toss with anyone who is willing yet expect everyone to accept your opinion. That's simply not true. I know for example, there are people on here that will ridicule my opinion even if they agreed with it deep down. When I feel strongly about something, yes, I will argue the toss and it can get personal (from both sides). But I do not expect that person to change their opinion just because I said so. This is a critical difference between me and the likes of NickG, for example, who seems to demand I change my opinion on something.
Dibden Purlieu Saint Posted 15 January, 2011 Posted 15 January, 2011 It's all hearsay, however if it is true that he hit him with a bottle and beat the sh*t out of someone then a "mate" of mine got 4 years for GBH with intent about 8 years ago for doing something not disimilar. Exactly, ABH is, effectively, nothing. So either the reports are false, or he has been charged incorrectly. If you pushed someone over and he grazed himself and the police decided to act then that would be ABH (broken skin).
Chez Posted 15 January, 2011 Posted 15 January, 2011 If it goes to a jury trial would a Southampton jury convict? Would he get a fair trial anywhere in the south bearing in mind the antipathy from Brighton to Bristol and Southampton to Oxford? even if it is in Southampton people sitting on the jury will treat him like any other defendant. You listen to the evidence and if you are sure he did it you will find him guilty no matter who he is. If he comitted this crime he deserves everything coming to him. I don't wish him luck, I just hope justice is served.
Window Cleaner Posted 15 January, 2011 Posted 15 January, 2011 I'd be more worried about the Barnard affair if he was in our regular starting line-up. At the moment he's just a bit part player and we have plenty of options without him.
Dibden Purlieu Saint Posted 15 January, 2011 Posted 15 January, 2011 That's simply not true. I know for example, there are people on here that will ridicule my opinion even if they agreed with it deep down. When I feel strongly about something, yes, I will argue the toss and it can get personal (from both sides). But I do not expect that person to change their opinion just because I said so. This is a critical difference between me and the likes of NickG, for example, who seems to demand I change my opinion on something. To be fair, I don't think Alpine expects people to accept his opinion. If they did it wouldn't be much fun for him.
Turkish Posted 15 January, 2011 Posted 15 January, 2011 That's simply not true. I know for example, there are people on here that will ridicule my opinion even if they agreed with it deep down. When I feel strongly about something, yes, I will argue the toss and it can get personal (from both sides). But I do not expect that person to change their opinion just because I said so. This is a critical difference between me and the likes of NickG, for example, who seems to demand I change my opinion on something. Because your opinion is ALWAYS negative!! Classic case, after the easy 4-1 against Huddersfield "we all know we will f*ck it up against Exeter and Dagenham, after the first day of the first ashes test, "we will lose 5-0" FFS!!!
Saint Fan CaM Posted 15 January, 2011 Posted 15 January, 2011 My feeling is he will see a custodial sentence. I don't think the club or the footballing authorities will take kindly to this - not exactly the type of attention the club needs right now also. NA/NC need to be looking for a new striker.
John B Posted 15 January, 2011 Posted 15 January, 2011 I hate to say it (becuase I understand peoples frustration with Alpine), but just becuase most people are feeling postive doesn't mean Alpine has to. This is a message board it's about opinions Alpines (no matter how bizzare they can be) are no less wrong/right as anybody elses opinions. There's rather alot of playing the man not the ball going on with Alpine at the moment. I'd rather see reasoned debate than people telling people to shut the F uck up (and I'll hold my hands up to being guilty of that too though I try not to) Yes I agree with what you are saying Alpine is obviously an astute person who does not attend many games but by listening to commentaries and other fans comments as well as watching Live and on TV has a realistic understanding of how the team is performing which unfortunately is not accepted by other posters. I don’t go to that many games but I think I know pretty well what is going on too. However Alpine appears to worry a great deal and strongly wants the club to succeed and possibly posts to many aggressive replies but the forum is not the same when he is not posting. He reminds me of a fanatical Man U friend of mine who took me to the FA CUP Final Replay against Brighton nearly thirty years ago he was so up tight through out the whole game worrying that something highly unlikely would go wrong to stop Man U winning the cup. I think they were 4 0 up after an hour but he was not calm I asked him why to which he replied the floodlights might fail. Of course he may have been worried that we had both been to Cup Final before in 1976 at opposite ends of the Stadium when he obviously expected an easy Man U win - I have never seen a sicker parrot than him when finally met up after the game he still thinks Bobby Stokes was offside I agreed once but that made him worse
Dibden Purlieu Saint Posted 15 January, 2011 Posted 15 January, 2011 My feeling is he will see a custodial sentence. I don't think the club or the footballing authorities will take kindly to this - not exactly the type of attention the club needs right now also. NA/NC need to be looking for a new striker. I doubt he will get a custodial, just because ABH doesn't usually result in one. To be fair, we don't know what he did, and if he did as was rumoured, he would have likely been charged with GBH. CPS charging standards The Crown Prosecution Service service has said that, by way of example, it considers the following injuries to be actual bodily harm and to be sufficiently serious that they could not be adequately reflected by a charge of common assault and ought normally to be prosecuted under section 47: The loss or breaking of a tooth or teeth Temporary loss of sensory function, including loss of consciousness Extensive or multiple bruising A displaced broken nose Minor fractures of bones Minor (but not superficial) cuts requiring medical treatment A recognised psychiatric disorder Causing any of these injuries (by assault or battery) would constitute the actus reus of assault occasioning actual bodily harm.
um pahars Posted 15 January, 2011 Posted 15 January, 2011 even if it is in Southampton people sitting on the jury will treat him like any other defendant. You listen to the evidence and if you are sure he did it you will find him guilty no matter who he is. If he comitted this crime he deserves everything coming to him. I don't wish him luck, I just hope justice is served. Agree with all of that and with a Crown Court guilty/not guilty ratio of something like 60%/40%, I don't think anyone should be pre-judging the outcome. I have confidence in the English Legal System to come to the right decision. Whatever follows that is for another day.
Dimond Geezer Posted 15 January, 2011 Posted 15 January, 2011 If it goes to a jury trial would a Southampton jury convict? Would he get a fair trial anywhere in the south bearing in mind the antipathy from Brighton to Bristol and Southampton to Oxford? Strangely, not everyone is a footy fan. I'm sure you could find 12 good men & true to sit on a jury in Southampton who have never heard of Lee Barnard. My Mother (although she is not a man ) & my boss, are two that I can think of who would have no idea who he is.
Seaside Saint 2 Posted 15 January, 2011 Posted 15 January, 2011 If he pleads not guilty, his case will go up to the Crown Court, and unless Southampton's court system is way more efficient than Sussex's where I used to work I'd be surprised if he has a trial before April. If he pleads guilty and the magistrate wants to sentence him to more than 6 months (I think that's their limit) it'll take at least a few weeks for him to be sentenced in the Crown Court. So its unlikely we'll know on Feb 2nd if he's gotten anything serious, only if its a community service order.
trousers Posted 24 March, 2011 Posted 24 March, 2011 Any parallels to be drawn with Etuhu being jailed today? http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-manchester-12846460
Scudamore Posted 24 March, 2011 Posted 24 March, 2011 Any parallels to be drawn with Etuhu being jailed today? http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-manchester-12846460 They look similar?
Colinjb Posted 24 March, 2011 Posted 24 March, 2011 Any parallels to be drawn with Etuhu being jailed today? http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-manchester-12846460 I fear there may be. The line in the sand has now been drawn.
fish fingers Posted 24 March, 2011 Posted 24 March, 2011 Any parallels to be drawn with Etuhu being jailed today? http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-manchester-12846460 I fear there may be. The line in the sand has now been drawn. Ah the old parallel line in the sand. He's dooooomed
Colinjb Posted 24 March, 2011 Posted 24 March, 2011 Ah the old parallel line in the sand. He's dooooomed Here's hoping not!
keithd Posted 24 March, 2011 Posted 24 March, 2011 can they say this... His brother was in the public gallery with their mother, another brother and relatives. s'up
benjii Posted 24 March, 2011 Posted 24 March, 2011 Any parallels to be drawn with Etuhu being jailed today? http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-manchester-12846460 The fact that he decked the bloke and then kicked him in the face three times when he was on the ground is an aggravating factor. Had he just punched him once then left the sentence may have been more leniet. Also worth noting he was guilty of affray as well as ABH. I think Barney has just been charged with ABH and not with anything under the Public Order Act?
OldNick Posted 24 March, 2011 Posted 24 March, 2011 The fact that he decked the bloke and then kicked him in the face three times when he was on the ground is an aggravating factor. Had he just punched him once then left the sentence may have been more leniet. Also worth noting he was guilty of affray as well as ABH. I think Barney has just been charged with ABH and not with anything under the Public Order Act? to be fair the blokes waited for him outside and he gave one of them a hiding. Perhaps warrented
Matthew Le God Posted 24 March, 2011 Author Posted 24 March, 2011 Plus Barney used a weapon!! How do you know with such certainty? Etuthu kicked his victim in the head three times whilst on the ground. Which is likely the reason for the custodial sentence as is extremely dangerous. We know nothing of the Barnard fight other than rumour.
derry Posted 24 March, 2011 Posted 24 March, 2011 It will be interesting to see whether the witnesses/victim/friends get collective amnesia. It's taken a long time to get this far.
benjii Posted 24 March, 2011 Posted 24 March, 2011 Plus Barney used a weapon!! Reports, of what degree of trustworthiness I don't know, at the time suggested that someone's head was gashed open with a bottle. If the CPS had enough evidence that someone had done that they would almost certainly be charged with GBH/wounging with intent (which they might plea-bargain down to ABH).
benjii Posted 24 March, 2011 Posted 24 March, 2011 to be fair the blokes waited for him outside and he gave one of them a hiding. Perhaps warrented Whatever the rights or wrongs of the original dispute, if you deck someone and then proceed to kick them in the face you can, rightly, expect to be treated more severely than if you had just decked them.
Deanovski Posted 24 March, 2011 Posted 24 March, 2011 i got kicked in the face 3 times on the ground and got a broken nose that required surgery and the guy got a warning.
benjii Posted 24 March, 2011 Posted 24 March, 2011 i got kicked in the face 3 times on the ground and got a broken nose that required surgery and the guy got a warning. That is strange.
Deanovski Posted 24 March, 2011 Posted 24 March, 2011 That is strange. And he'd gone out that night with the intent to do it as hed followed me from my friends house, which i'm sure comes under the rules of ABH or GBH or something aha.
kpturner Posted 24 March, 2011 Posted 24 March, 2011 i got kicked in the face 3 times on the ground and got a broken nose that required surgery and the guy got a warning.It has happened to me several times - but I was playing rugby for Trojans at the time so it was OK.
saint simes Posted 24 March, 2011 Posted 24 March, 2011 And he'd gone out that night with the intent to do it as hed followed me from my friends house, which i'm sure comes under the rules of ABH or GBH or something aha. Must be a Lymington thing as the bloke that fractured Alexs skull got let off due to the fings he sawed in Bosnia!
kpturner Posted 24 March, 2011 Posted 24 March, 2011 Must be a Lymington thing as the bloke that fractured Alexs skull got let off due to the fings he sawed in Bosnia!Who is Alexs? Do I have to read back through the thread?
Deanovski Posted 24 March, 2011 Posted 24 March, 2011 Must be a Lymington thing as the bloke that fractured Alexs skull got let off due to the fings he sawed in Bosnia! alex who?
saint simes Posted 24 March, 2011 Posted 24 March, 2011 alex who? Your mate from school. Sorry to digress from thread topic!
swannymere Posted 24 March, 2011 Posted 24 March, 2011 i got kicked in the face 3 times on the ground and got a broken nose that required surgery and the guy got a warning. My brother was hit over the head with a beer bottle whilst sat at a bar in Winchester minding his own business, he then recovered and beat the crap out of his assailant (as you would!) all in front of CCTV and the case was dropped (after flying my brother back from Australia twice!!) when it emerged that said assailant was a trainee copper with Thames Valley (i **** you not!!)
Clash City Saint Posted 24 March, 2011 Posted 24 March, 2011 An old work mate of mine decked someone and kicked him in the head, not on CCTV but in front of a couple of witnesses and I got hold of a brief that all the Shirley lads would know and if I remember correctly he said that kicking someone in the head when they're on the deck carries an automatic custodial of up to 5 years (exceptional circumstances exempt I guess). Brief did a good job but my mate still got the same 8 weeks as Etuhu. The similarity in both Barny and Etuhu cases are that they are both pro footballers, the charges might be the same and even eventually the verdicts but hopefully sentencing guild-lines won't be as severe.
Clifford Nelson Posted 24 March, 2011 Posted 24 March, 2011 Unless you have plenty of previous you will not get a custodial sentence for ABH. If convicted a community sentence will be the outcome.
benjii Posted 24 March, 2011 Posted 24 March, 2011 Unless you have plenty of previous you will not get a custodial sentence for ABH. If convicted a community sentence will be the outcome. Usually this.
Deanovski Posted 25 March, 2011 Posted 25 March, 2011 Your mate from school. Sorry to digress from thread topic! i cant remember any of my mates getting a fractured skull aha? Alex adkin?
saint simes Posted 25 March, 2011 Posted 25 March, 2011 i cant remember any of my mates getting a fractured skull aha? Alex adkin? See last weeks A&T. Hasn,t knocked any sense into him though!
Saint_Donovan Posted 25 March, 2011 Posted 25 March, 2011 How do you know with such certainty? Etuthu kicked his victim in the head three times whilst on the ground. Which is likely the reason for the custodial sentence as is extremely dangerous. We know nothing of the Barnard fight other than rumour. YOU know nothing other than rumour, i know the guy he bottled.
Deanovski Posted 25 March, 2011 Posted 25 March, 2011 See last weeks A&T. Hasn,t knocked any sense into him though! Still bloody confused! but i guess you know who i am from the story i told you? aha
stu0x Posted 27 March, 2011 Posted 27 March, 2011 The judiciary really don't like it when people get kicked in the head on the ground, they consider it rather unsporting.
Matthew Le God Posted 30 March, 2011 Author Posted 30 March, 2011 Court case adjourned until 13th April. Was due for committal at Southampton Magistrates Court tomorrow.
Colinjb Posted 30 March, 2011 Posted 30 March, 2011 What is his plea. Any ideas? I suspect it may be guilty...... but I would prefer 'insanity.'
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