Nazi sympathiser killed

[Guest Dark Sotonic Mills]

 

Austrian populist far-right leader Joerg Haider was killed in a car accident on Saturday, two weeks after staging a major comeback in a national election.

Haider, 58, who led the right into a coalition government from 2000 to 2006, polarised his nation and drew condemnation across Europe and beyond with his blunt anti-foreigner statements and for seeming to flirt with Nazi sympathies.

 

 

You won't find me crying into my breakfast over this...

[Nexstar]

oh dear...

[Saint Martini]

From the look of that wreckage I'm guessing he (or his driver) was speeding?

[Guest Dark Sotonic Mills]

From the look of that wreckage I'm guessing he (or his driver) was speeding?

 

On his own at 2am.

 

Accidental or ???

[Nexstar]

On his own at 2am.

 

Accidental or ???

 

Drunken possibly, looks like something ploughed right into him.

[Roman]

Never mind.

 

My guess is he missed a gear change because he couldn't bend his right arm.

[Kadeem Hardison]

Why do we always berate the far right for their lack of intolerance and understanding, then when one does declare themself a sympathiser of other humans, we judge that too? I think it might be us who has the problem.

[swannymere]

Is he the new Princess Di? how many crackpots with conspiracy theories will crawl out of the woodwork? Good riddance

[Nexstar]

Why do we always berate the far right for their lack of intolerance and understanding, then when one does declare themself a sympathiser of other humans, we judge that too? I think it might be us who has the problem.

 

I believe it is more who they sympathise with, in this case being the regime that started a war which ended with 55,000,000 people killed.

[St Landrew]

Never mind.

 

My guess is he missed a gear change because he couldn't bend his right arm.

 

Nice one.

[Barney Trubble]

Why do we always berate the far right for their lack of intolerance and understanding, then when one does declare themself a sympathiser of other humans, we judge that too? I think it might be us who has the problem.

 

I'm impressed Tiggs, first time ever I have agreed with you. Far left,far right or down the centre.

 

It's no worse than the religious loons spreading their bile and divisive hatred disguised as being in the name of God, but as it's their belief it's tolerated by a democratic society.

 

If Joerg was some Saudi religious nut berating any person that doesn't believe in Islam and condemning women as second class citizens if they even dare to walk alongised their owners[sorry husbands] or have the audacity to show their face then nobody would bat an eyelid and he'd probably be allowed to preach his sick hatred openly on the streets of the UK.

 

I find it laughable that some are happy that this guy died and they think themselves as reasonable people - you're all sick ****ers too if you think that someone deserved to die in that way because they had some pretty hard opinions.

 

Put this in the Muppet Show as it'll turn into a load of pretentious ******** from a few of the holier than thou brigade - I have to LOL at the self-righteousness of some on here.

 

:smt042

[Atticus Finch of Maycomb]

I bet b-anter is up in arms about this 'tragedy'

[EastleighSoulBoy]

On his own at 2am.

 

Accidental or ???

 

What I thought when I heard it on the radio.

 

Can't say I'm crying in my beer over this, just a shame he had to die to stop his extreme fascist support.

[Guest Hacienda]

His Nazi views were objectionable to any sane person. However, his views on the wave of unregulated immigration into Europe were spot on.

[Essruu]

http://b-anter.co.uk/viewtopic.php?t=4127

[Wiltshire Saint]

Why do we always berate the far right for their lack of intolerance and understanding, then when one does declare themself a sympathiser of other humans, we judge that too? I think it might be us who has the problem.

 

I'm impressed Tiggs, first time ever I have agreed with you. Far left,far right or down the centre.

 

It's no worse than the religious loons spreading their bile and divisive hatred disguised as being in the name of God, but as it's their belief it's tolerated by a democratic society.

 

If Joerg was some Saudi religious nut berating any person that doesn't believe in Islam and condemning women as second class citizens if they even dare to walk alongised their owners[sorry husbands] or have the audacity to show their face then nobody would bat an eyelid and he'd probably be allowed to preach his sick hatred openly on the streets of the UK.

 

I find it laughable that some are happy that this guy died and they think themselves as reasonable people - you're all sick ****ers too if you think that someone deserved to die in that way because they had some pretty hard opinions.

 

Put this in the Muppet Show as it'll turn into a load of pretentious ******** from a few of the holier than thou brigade - I have to LOL at the self-righteousness of some on here.

 

:smt042

 

True to form as ever. Is there any topic at all that you cannot turn into a thread about Islam/foreigners/migration/a display of xenophobia?

 

You end your ridiculous post with "I have to LOL at the self righteousness of some on here" after typng this out "I find it laughable that some are happy that this guy died and they think themselves as reasonable people - you're all sick ****ers too if you think that someone deserved to die in that way because they had some pretty hard opinions.". There is irony in there somewhere, I'm sure of it.

 

For what it's worth I have no sympathy for bastards that die. I don't care what colour or religion they are, if they're a c*nt who went out of their way to put others down and discrimate and persecute, then the world is better off without them.

[Essruu]

Wiltshire Saint, you seem to go out of your way to put Barney Trubble down. Maybe the world would be a better place without you too? I'm not saying that I hope you die in a car crash, but those that share your uncaring views might.

[alpine_saint]

Wow, so much ignorant ****** spouted on here....

 

I live in Carinthia. Joerg Haider was an extreme populist who liked grabbing the headlines, winding up the members of the two big centrist parties in Austria who have carved up power and all positions of responsibility in Austrian public service dishonestly since WW2 at the cost of achieving any economic or social progress for the people of Austria, and he revelled in causing chaos. Yes, he made some dubious comments in the past, but most of them were blown out of all proportion by his political opponents. He was also not helped in this respect with his family's historical involvement in the 1930's German Nazi party, but again this is sifting facts to support the political objective.

 

He worked tirelessly to promote the interests of the people of Cartinthia, and over my 11 years of association with this region, brought about drastic changes in social policy that were so popular and drastic that they were quickly adpoted by the Austrian national government. He was the first administrator in Europe to introduce the idea of paying new mothers an allowance for the first 3 years of a childs life to allow the mother to stay at home, bond with the child, and improve the financial lot of new families. He also introduced a voucher system to give parents a kick-start in September to handle the "back-to-school" costs. Thanks to him, I only pay 20 quid a month for my younger sons private kindergarten, the rest paid by Carinthia.

 

Because of these initiatives, he was exceptionally popular in Carinthia, and in the recent election his BZOe party got 40% of the vote here, compared to 11% average for Austria. I can assure you all (though you choose no doubt to disbelieve me), that he campaigned the last election purely on a protest vote against the SPOe/OeVP coalitions that have strangled Austria for 60 years, and on social issues. He didnt even intend to stay in the leadership of his party, he was just a celebrity leading candidate - he wanted to continue serving his region...Yes, he had forthright immigration views, but it is interesting to note that parties in the rest of Europe (including the UK Labour Party) often have more right-wing and radical opinions than he espoused in the 90s. He was simply ahead of his time in this respect. However, he barely raised these issues in the recent election, he left the mud-slinging and shiit-stirring to the members of his ex-party, the FPOe.

 

No doubt this post will have me tarred as a Nazi (if I wasnt already), but I am compelled to try to put the record straight. I have witness speeches of his first hand, and I found him to be charismatic and deeply concerned with the lot of the average Austrian in life.

 

Maybe the UK has needed a bit more of that recently.....

Edited 11 October, 2008 by alpine_saint

[Robsk II]

I have no sympathy with his views etc, and if any politician gets killed, I'd rather Heider than quite a few. Yet as has been pointed out, celebrating someones death is never a positive. It's always a human tragedy whateer other issues are involved. Even someone akin to Hitler dying - I wouldn't celebrate it fundamentally, only because of the positivity it would bring the greater number.

[1976_Child]

oh here we go. the anti-fascist brigade are out in force again. Just to remind you all that he was voted for by more than one third of Austria. That means that proportiionaly more people in Austria liked his policies than British people like the lib-dems policies. So what if he thought Hitler was a good bloke? A lot of people in 1930s Germany also thought Hitler was a good bloke. The funny thing about democracy is that as soon as enough people hold "far right" views the country is told that in the interest of democracy those people's views will not be tolerated. Go figure.

[alpine_saint]

oh here we go. the anti-fascist brigade are out in force again. Just to remind you all that he was voted for by more than one third of Austria. That means that proportiionaly more people in Austria liked his policies than British people like the lib-dems policies. So what if he thought Hitler was a good bloke? A lot of people in 1930s Germany also thought Hitler was a good bloke. The funny thing about democracy is that as soon as enough people hold "far right" views the country is told that in the interest of democracy those people's views will not be tolerated. Go figure.

 

Aye. Hence the absolutely absurd spectacle in 2000 of the EU bringing sanctions against Austria, one of its OWN members, because the democratic election and coalition-forming process brought Haider's then party into government, even though he QUIT the party leadership in order to facilitate the forming of an acceptable coalition with the OeVP.

[Guest Dark Sotonic Mills]

The EU was specifically formed to prevent extreme right wing countries from doing what Germany did in the 1930s and 1940s. It is not surprising that they applied sanctions to Austria as that was precisely their remit.

 

There are millions more people who would not be of the opinion that Hitler was "a good bloke" but unfortunately they cannot speak.

[alpine_saint]

http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2008/oct/11/haider-obituary

[alpine_saint]

The EU was specifically formed to prevent extreme right wing countries from doing what Germany did in the 1930s and 1940s. It is not surprising that they applied sanctions to Austria as that was precisely their remit.

 

There are millions more people who would not be of the opinion that Hitler was "a good bloke" but unfortunately they cannot speak.

 

I would really like to take issue with you on your hysterical rhetoric, but then you'd probably exercise that knee-jerk tendency you have of banning me.

 

However, are you claiming the EU can say "F**k Democracy" if it turns out a result it doesnt like ?

 

Ridiculous.

[Ludwig]

Nazi sympathiser sympathiser killed.

[Weston Super Saint]

Nazi sympathiser sympathiser killed.

 

What if a Muslim sympathiser sympathiser were killed?

[Guest Dark Sotonic Mills]

I would really like to take issue with you on your hysterical rhetoric, but then you'd probably exercise that knee-jerk tendency you have of banning me.

 

However, are you claiming the EU can say "F**k Democracy" if it turns out a result it doesnt like ?

 

Ridiculous.

 

There is no hysterical rhetoric there, 6 million Jews died in WW2. Where was the democracy then?

 

The EU is, amongst other things, a guardian of democracy within Europe. To take action against a country which shows an alarming indication of lurching towards Nazism is perfectly justified.

 

Many people 'voted' for the National Socialist Party in the 1930s, but it soon became apparent that democracy was the furthest thing from their leaders minds.

 

Extreme politics never beget democracies, be they left or right; just dictatorships.

[Guest Hacienda]

The funny thing about democracy is that as soon as enough people hold "far right" views the country is told that in the interest of democracy those people's views will not be tolerated. Go figure.

 

If people hold far right views in the UK then they are told that their views are "wrong", "mistaken" or "unfortunate".

 

The BNP grows stronger in the UK due to the failure of the other democratic parties to address the concerns of a large tract of the population and then we are told that it's rise is a treat to democracy itself!

[Ludwig]

What if a Muslim sympathiser sympathiser were killed?

 

Then they get only 18 virgins. They are not Muslim, not even a Muslim sympathiser. So they get half of half the virgins in paradise.

[Guest Hacienda]

The EU is, amongst other things, a guardian of democracy within Europe. To take action against a country which shows an alarming indication of lurching towards Nazism is perfectly justified.

 

Stop being such a drama queen.

 

Austria had about as much chance of becoming a Nazi state as Wales did of winning Euro 2008.

[1976_Child]

There are millions more people who would not be of the opinion that Hitler was "a good bloke" but unfortunately they cannot speak.

 

indeed, and I am by no means one of those who think Hitler was a good bloke. The fact remains though that a democracy is supposed to be democratic - Haider was much more than a Nick Griffin of the BNP. The BNP gets a tiny proportion of the vote and can easily be ridiculed by the main parties. Haider was a main stream politician leading a main stream party. His party was censored by the completely undemocratic EU going against the expressed wishes of the people of Austria. The EU has more in common with a totalitarian fascist state than Haider's Freedom Party ever had.

[alpine_saint]

There is no hysterical rhetoric there, 6 million Jews died in WW2. Where was the democracy then?

 

The EU is, amongst other things, a guardian of democracy within Europe. To take action against a country which shows an alarming indication of lurching towards Nazism is perfectly justified.

 

Many people 'voted' for the National Socialist Party in the 1930s, but it soon became apparent that democracy was the furthest thing from their leaders minds.

 

Extreme politics never beget democracies, be they left or right; just dictatorships.

 

What sloganising rubbish.

 

Austria has some of the toughest Holocaust/enciting Naziism laws on the planet, as David Irving learnt. If Haider had once advocated the installing of a dictatorship, he would have been prosecuted. He played within the rules of and respected democracy implicity.

 

To argue that Haider and the Freedom Party threatened Austrian democracy by participating in a coalition, and therefore EU sanctions were deserved is complete arrogant nonsense.

 

But hey, you keep referring to events that happened 70 years ago, why dont you ? You havent a clue what you are talking about.

 

I live here and will be the first to say Austria got away with its role in the Holocaust (compared to Germany), and that amongst the older generations the lack of remorse is shocking. But using that as justifcation to dismiss Haider's right in the democratic process is laughable.

[1976_Child]

The EU is, amongst other things, a guardian of democracy within Europe.

 

Oh please! Wake up. The EU a guardian of democracy??? Pull the other one mate. The EU is not democratic in any way shape or form. If you need reminding the people of France and Holland told the EU dictators to shove their constitution up their backsides and what did our EU masters do? Did they say "Ok, fair enough, you don't want it we won't give it to you". Did they heck! They brought it back and now the ****-robbing labour prime minister McBroon has completely disregarded his own manifesto and is not prepared to give us a vote on it.

 

Please, don't anyone tell me the EU is democratic or the "guardian of democracy". The damn EU hasn't even had its accounts signed off for ELEVEN YEARS !!!!

[alpine_saint]

indeed, and I am by no means one of those who think Hitler was a good bloke. The fact remains though that a democracy is supposed to be democratic - Haider was much more than a Nick Griffin of the BNP. The BNP gets a tiny proportion of the vote and can easily be ridiculed by the main parties. Haider was a main stream politician leading a main stream party. His party was censored by the completely undemocratic EU going against the expressed wishes of the people of Austria. The EU has more in common with a totalitarian fascist state than Haider's Freedom Party ever had.

 

Spot on.

 

I never knew the EU was a loony-left club that can punish countries for returning right wing governments.

 

Besides, the Thatcher government was so right wing it makes Haider and his noisy little rabble seem like Vladimir Illych Ulanov (Lenin) and the Bolsheviks. I never saw the EU sanctioning the UK. Wonder why ? Could it be the old Austria = Nazi stereotype so espoused on here by the likes of SadOldGit ???

[alpine_saint]

 

The EU is, amongst other things, a guardian of democracy within Europe.

 

I must have dreamed about the Maastricht and Lisbon treaties then........

[Dog]

My sister was given a personalised watch by that Nazi chap when she lived in Austria, he has his own brand of watches. It may be worth a few quid now.

[Atticus Finch of Maycomb]

His Nazi views were objectionable to any sane person. However, his views on the wave of unregulated immigration into Europe were spot on.

 

Racist sympathising with Nazi sympathiser shocker!

 

(Hacienda is a racist)

[Robsk II]

Vladimir Illych Ulanov (Lenin)

 

Hey, thanks. Thanks a lot. Thanks, because no-one knew who that was otherwise. Thank god for your education, your understanding of the need to lower the tone, your benevolence in sharing your wisdom. I think we should no longer consider Bukharin the darling of the party, my red comrades. Alpine Saintov shall never be purged.

 

People are retards. Clearly, unbridled immigration has its issues and problems, but so do 1000 other more important things. People have always moved and always will, and most people view the situation in an incredibly myopic, backwards way. The empire is gone, boys. The world is in a different place where saying 'kick out jonny foreigner' simply won't cut it, as a concept or an argument.

[alpine_saint]

Hey, thanks. Thanks a lot. Thanks, because no-one knew who that was otherwise. Thank god for your education, your understanding of the need to lower the tone, your benevolence in sharing your wisdom. I think we should no longer consider Bukharin the darling of the party, my red comrades. Alpine Saintov shall never be purged.

 

People are retards. Clearly, unbridled immigration has its issues and problems, but so do 1000 other more important things. People have always moved and always will, and most people view the situation in an incredibly myopic, backwards way. The empire is gone, boys. The world is in a different place where saying 'kick out jonny foreigner' simply won't cut it, as a concept or an argument.

 

Dont recall anyone (including Haider, tbh) claiming that people should be "kicked out", only that limits should be set on the amount allowed in...

 

Oh, and what a totally unconnected and irrelevant anti-colonial rant that was...

[Robsk II]

Not unconnected at all, comrade. All I'm saying is that sweeping policies on immigration and massively blinkered rhetoric, hate-filled (or obviously likely to be picked up by some as that) agendas, one policy parties and so on are missing the point, imo. Pragmatic politics and common sense, with a bit of humanity where necessary, should prevail.

[Dog]

Very sad news, he was a good man whatever his views. He did a lot of work for charity.

[Guest Hacienda]

People are retards. Clearly, unbridled immigration has its issues and problems, but so do 1000 other more important things. People have always moved and always will, and most people view the situation in an incredibly myopic, backwards way. The empire is gone, boys. The world is in a different place where saying 'kick out jonny foreigner' simply won't cut it, as a concept or an argument.

 

And the fact that mainstream parties have failed to deal with it has led to the re-emergence of the far right.

 

The "celebrating differences" of the Guardian reading types has succeeded in driving the working classes to the right and now they realise that the idea itself is a bankrupt.

 

The most noticeable sign of this is how now no literature is translated into a multitude of languages whereas a few years ago it would have been standard practice and as I work in one of the politically correct organisations in the country you REALLY notice it.

 

Maybe if as a nation we had done it earlier the right could have been checked and many of our ethnic minority communities would be better off.

[Atticus Finch of Maycomb]

And the fact that mainstream parties have failed to deal with it has led to the re-emergence of the far right.

 

The "celebrating differences" of the Guardian reading types has succeeded in driving the working classes to the right and now they realise that the idea itself is a bankrupt.

 

The most noticeable sign of this is how now no literature is translated into a multitude of languages whereas a few years ago it would have been standard practice and as I work in one of the politically correct organisations in the country you REALLY notice it.

 

Maybe if as a nation we had done it earlier the right could have been checked and many of our ethnic minority communities would be better off.

 

i think that the world would be a better place if all football thugs were sent to prison

[alpine_saint]

Not unconnected at all, comrade. All I'm saying is that sweeping policies on immigration and massively blinkered rhetoric, hate-filled (or obviously likely to be picked up by some as that) agendas, one policy parties and so on are missing the point, imo. Pragmatic politics and common sense, with a bit of humanity where necessary, should prevail.

 

And that has what to do with the UK's colonial past, exactly ?

 

And as I've tried to point out in my original post (which you've chosen to ignore) about the work he did, to accuse him of being "one policy" is complete bolllocks.

 

Even the Guardian obituary admits his rehtoric had toned down in recent times.

 

But no, its's better to latch on to ambiguous comments made 10-15 years ago and get all pious and uppity, isnt it ?

[Weston Super Saint]

i think that the world would be a better place if all football thugs were sent to prison

 

They do don't they?

 

Or are they exempt from serving time?

[Weston Super Saint]

And that has what to do with the UK's colonial past, exactly ?

 

And as I've tried to point out in my original post (which you've chosen to ignore) about the work he did, to accuse him of being "one policy" is complete bolllocks.

 

Even the Guardian obituary admits his rehtoric had toned down in recent times.

 

But no, its's better to latch on to ambiguous comments made 10-15 years ago and get all pious and uppity, isnt it ?

 

He was my all time favouritest

 

[Kadeem Hardison]

oh here we go. the anti-fascist brigade are out in force again.

 

1. That's because they are standing up for what they believe in. That's the world we live - many people believe that fascism is fundamentally wrong. Be prepared for people to oppose that. Obviously that is difficult as one of the traits of fascism is the suppression of opposition.

2. It isn't a brigade. Unlike much of the far right, we don't need to gather in groups to justify our beliefs. We can do that as individuals.

 

That means that proportiionaly more people in Austria liked his policies than British people like the lib-dems policies.

 

1. As popular as that? Wow.

2. 8 million people watch X Factor. It doesn't make it good.

[Robsk II]

And that has what to do with the UK's colonial past, exactly ?

 

And as I've tried to point out in my original post (which you've chosen to ignore) about the work he did, to accuse him of being "one policy" is complete bolllocks.

 

Read MY post.I never made a direct accusation against him or his aprty, more general points.

[Deano6]

2. 8 million people watch X Factor. It doesn't make it good.

 

It makes it good at attracting audiences, which is what keeps it on air...

[View From The Top]

i think that the world would be a better place if all football thugs were sent to prison

 

They are. They serve their time, get out, get their banning orders lifted and get on with their lives.

 

You should try it, but that would mean you having a life in the 1st place.