hypochondriac Posted 12 January, 2011 Posted 12 January, 2011 True which is why I wasnt trying to compare Oxo to Messi. But the idea is there all the same. If Oxo had been found by Barcalona and developed in a setup that is further ahead of our setup then he would still get to the top level producing top form at the same rate as we are aiming for. Barca are at a stage where they are at the top and they can bring through new tallent over 2 or 3 seasons while they sit high up the food chain. We want to bring the tallent through over 2 or 3 seasons while we climb the football food chain in the same period. As long as we are moving up that food chain then we have a possability of competing against the big clubs to keep the tallented youngsters. If at any point we look like we are a club on hold however, the lure of the big clubs will make our decissions for us IMO. As much as the club want to do things in its own way, I agree with you in that every player has a price on his head. But the position we are in I dont think big clubs are willing to go to that figure for some of our brightest tallents. I doubt Cortese will take much notice of £10 million for Oxo as if we get promoted then £10 mill next season will look more like a good deal for the buying club. I disagree. The majority of players will want instant success.
Chez Posted 12 January, 2011 Posted 12 January, 2011 (edited) The problem from Liverpools perspective is that they are not wholly awash with cash, and the pressure is on to invest in already proven players to a) galvanise the moribund mood in the club and b) to supplement the relatively sparse quality they have. I'm really not sure if they can afford use £10 million or whatever on a youngster in his first year - And then take time to "mould him" ! They need big names NOW ! In a way I agree with you. They don't have the money to spend on top class young great potential players, but they also don't have the money to spend on big names. One things for sure they don't have money for both. What Alex chamberlain does is bridge both gaps IMO. He is fantastic potential AND a big name, allbeit only on the scene for about three weeks. All I see is Owen, Joe Cole, Rooney, Walcott, Bale and Wiltshire. Even at 17 you already know they are the nuts. Also he doesn't need moulding. Did Owen need moulding when Liverpool picked him for their first team? With this lad its not a case of `is it a gamble', its more a case of how can we get him to come to us rather than Manu, Chelsea, Arsenal, City or Spurs. Why would Chamberlain want to go to Liverpool and not those other five clubs? Edited 12 January, 2011 by Chez
Katalinic Posted 12 January, 2011 Posted 12 January, 2011 The key to this for me is to make sure that whatever deal gets done it is a very, very good one for us. We didn't make the most of the Walcott and Bale deals so should learn, and I am sure if (when) we do sell AOC then Cortese will drive a good deal for us. £10m up front, 5m in installments, 25% sell on, first refusal on loan players from that team for the next two seasons and AOC on loan next season. Otherwise no deal, we are in the strong position, we don't need the money and he has 2 years left on his contract. If anyone says he isn't worth that much then why are Liverpool, Man Utd, Arsenal, Chelsea etc all watching him. Not many FL players attract that amount of attention. If they won't do a good deal then we can gladly keep him. Agree with all of this except AOC back on loan - would be like seeing a recently ex-girlfriend flirting with another man in your local pub.
John Boy Saint Posted 12 January, 2011 Posted 12 January, 2011 The bottom line falls at young Alex's feet. I hope that he see's that something positive is happening at this club, and that he wants to be part of it.
maysie Posted 12 January, 2011 Posted 12 January, 2011 http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/football/teams/southampton/8255951/Alex-Oxlade-Chamberlain-Southamptons-New-Walcott-is-set-for-a-very-fast-track-to-top.html
SamyCM Posted 12 January, 2011 Posted 12 January, 2011 On a side note Arsenal are losing to Ipswich !
shurlock Posted 12 January, 2011 Posted 12 January, 2011 Liverpool looking pretty clueless upfront against Blackpool. Open the emergency chequebook time...
Saint Garrett Posted 12 January, 2011 Posted 12 January, 2011 True which is why I wasnt trying to compare Oxo to Messi. But the idea is there all the same. If Oxo had been found by Barcalona and developed in a setup that is further ahead of our setup then he would still get to the top level producing top form at the same rate as we are aiming for. Barca are at a stage where they are at the top and they can bring through new tallent over 2 or 3 seasons while they sit high up the food chain. We want to bring the tallent through over 2 or 3 seasons while we climb the football food chain in the same period. As long as we are moving up that food chain then we have a possability of competing against the big clubs to keep the tallented youngsters. If at any point we look like we are a club on hold however, the lure of the big clubs will make our decissions for us IMO. As much as the club want to do things in its own way, I agree with you in that every player has a price on his head. But the position we are in I dont think big clubs are willing to go to that figure for some of our brightest tallents. I doubt Cortese will take much notice of £10 million for Oxo as if we get promoted then £10 mill next season will look more like a good deal for the buying club. How did you write all that without using 'we're on the bus and we know where we want to get to'
Graffito Posted 12 January, 2011 Posted 12 January, 2011 http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/football/teams/southampton/8255951/Alex-Oxlade-Chamberlain-Southamptons-New-Walcott-is-set-for-a-very-fast-track-to-top.html That's a good read and interesting to hear this from his dad: “He’s a clever boy. I’m just glad he’s at a nice club with a great infrastructure and good support.”
Jimmy_D Posted 12 January, 2011 Posted 12 January, 2011 http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/football/teams/southampton/8255951/Alex-Oxlade-Chamberlain-Southamptons-New-Walcott-is-set-for-a-very-fast-track-to-top.html This makes me think we miiight just have a chance of keeping hold of him.
shurlock Posted 12 January, 2011 Posted 12 January, 2011 This makes me think we miiight just have a chance of keeping hold of him. Remember the article is written by a saints fan - so it might be a case of heart over head. a good propaganda piece though.
goneawol Posted 12 January, 2011 Posted 12 January, 2011 http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/football/article-1346607/Southampton-kid-Alex-Oxlade-Chamberlain-favours-champions-Chelsea.html?ito=feeds-newsxml
Stepgar Posted 12 January, 2011 Posted 12 January, 2011 All this hype and attention could do damage to OXO. We really need to protect him form this in my opinion. A bit like Rooney and Moyes at Everton. Didn't play him very game if i remember. Kept him away from the cameras etc. Good man management. On the more mercenary side the same media attntion is pushing up the price by the minute. Maybe 10 mill is just the beginning and now the club may see this as "if you want him the price just went up by a couple of mill"Would be quite interesting to see if Manc City and Chelsea both started a bidding war. Just for the record - would prefer to see him stay.
MarkSFC Posted 13 January, 2011 Posted 13 January, 2011 Im sure AOC has known for weeks which if any clubs really want him and Im also certain that his Dad knows what is best for him. He proved this when he left him at Saints when "his team and employer" at the time tried to poach Alex!! But you couldnt blame Alex or his Dad to take the money and run because he could break his leg in a years time and lose it all! Theres no doubt in my mind that Cortese has it all under control and anew improved contract is on the table from Saints and I also have no doubt that if AOC turns it down then NC will do whats best for Saints and get the best deal we have ever recieved. And unlike years gone by, however disappointing it would be to lose such a talent, we now are in a position where we could use all the money on replacement(s).
Toomer Posted 13 January, 2011 Posted 13 January, 2011 Dave Merrington said on Solent that Oxo reminds him of Rod Wallace.
Chez Posted 13 January, 2011 Posted 13 January, 2011 That's a good read and interesting to hear this from his dad: “He’s a clever boy. I’m just glad he’s at a nice club with a great infrastructure and good support.” the words "Nice" and "good support" leave room for improvement.
Chez Posted 13 January, 2011 Posted 13 January, 2011 (edited) Dave Merrington said on Solent that Oxo reminds him of Rod Wallace. He doesn't remind me of him in any way other than they are/were both quick. Liverpool fan at my work tells me that John Henry (liverpool owner) is now in England so transfer dealing will commence. I still wonder why Alex would want to go there though. Edited 13 January, 2011 by Chez
SnailOB Posted 13 January, 2011 Posted 13 January, 2011 http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/football/article-1346607/Southampton-kid-Alex-Oxlade-Chamberlain-favours-champions-Chelsea.html?ito=feeds-newsxml Loved the comment : ...... Chelsea - the club he supported as a boy -.... He's 17 and been at Southampton since he was 7. Does the quote mean that he is a fully grown man now who doesn't support Chelsea anymore ? One thing is for certain, thanks to all the recent publicity, 1. By selling its own pictures, SFC must have made a good return on the AOC pic thats been used for both the Mail & Telegraph articles, 2. IF he was to go, we must surely get top price for him now, although, like virtually all othe Saints fans, I would prefer to see him stay.
saintjay77 Posted 13 January, 2011 Posted 13 January, 2011 I disagree. The majority of players will want instant success. Majority may want it but how many actually get it? Theo warmed the Arsenal reserves bench for some time before he made the break through to the 1st team on a regular basis. he left a club that wasnt really going anywhere for a club that is pushing for the top. Would the same decission be made by a kid in the same boat now we are a club that has champions league asperations? It hugley depends on the youth in our squad believing that is where the club is headed and also believing that they will be a part of it once its there. I will be amazed if we turn out more than 1 decent kid a year that can play at the highest level.
NickG Posted 13 January, 2011 Posted 13 January, 2011 Differences with Walcott In contract - Walcott wasn't more in need of quality players than money. Really can't see Ox-c having an issue with club saying they won't talk to anyone in this window, he has plenty of time on his contract, will be enjoying winning 6-0 and would only have to wait 4 months to re-assess. The club would get just as much in the summer and would have improved our chances of going up.
derry Posted 13 January, 2011 Posted 13 January, 2011 I think the key issue will be the amount of the fee that Cortese will want up front. It may well be that the top clubs may well baulk at the prospect of having to pay a massive fee up front for potential. I just can't see Cortese buying a long term multi incentive transfer fee with the bulk jam tomorrow plus he will want a sell on percentage.
CWD Posted 13 January, 2011 Posted 13 January, 2011 Loved the comment : ...... Chelsea - the club he supported as a boy -.... He's 17 and been at Southampton since he was 7. Does the quote mean that he is a fully grown man now who doesn't support Chelsea anymore ? One thing is for certain, thanks to all the recent publicity, 1. By selling its own pictures, SFC must have made a good return on the AOC pic thats been used for both the Mail & Telegraph articles, 2. IF he was to go, we must surely get top price for him now, although, like virtually all othe Saints fans, I would prefer to see him stay. I believe he was born and raised in Portsmouth and was a big fan of the blue few. Chamberlain snr made the decision to send him here instead because a) he was a coach here at the time, and b) we could offer him so much more in terms of support, infrastructure etc. It's a similar story with James Ward-Prowse who is also a boyhood p*mpey fan
NickG Posted 13 January, 2011 Posted 13 January, 2011 I believe he was born and raised in Portsmouth and was a big fan of the blue few. Chamberlain snr made the decision to send him here instead because a) he was a coach here at the time, and b) we could offer him so much more in terms of support, infrastructure etc. It's a similar story with James Ward-Prowse who is also a boyhood p*mpey fan his dad was youth team coach with skates when he decided, against the wishes of his boss (Hart) to send him here
dubai_phil Posted 13 January, 2011 Posted 13 January, 2011 I think the key issue will be the amount of the fee that Cortese will want up front. It may well be that the top clubs may well baulk at the prospect of having to pay a massive fee up front for potential. I just can't see Cortese buying a long term multi incentive transfer fee with the bulk jam tomorrow plus he will want a sell on percentage. this. The Telegraph article alluded to it having to be an offer that simply could not be refused as well. A somehow maybe sometime deal? Right now, next to worthless - let's face it, when are Liverpool likely to get back into the CL? But more than that if he is worth 5mil plus add ons now, then in June he'll be worth more if he keeps developing as the other clubs start to see he can produce more consistently.
Saint_clark Posted 13 January, 2011 Posted 13 January, 2011 Loved the comment : ...... Chelsea - the club he supported as a boy -.... He's 17 and been at Southampton since he was 7. Does the quote mean that he is a fully grown man now who doesn't support Chelsea anymore ? One thing is for certain, thanks to all the recent publicity, 1. By selling its own pictures, SFC must have made a good return on the AOC pic thats been used for both the Mail & Telegraph articles, 2. IF he was to go, we must surely get top price for him now, although, like virtually all othe Saints fans, I would prefer to see him stay. I believe Saints no longer charge for use of pictures in papers.
Thedelldays Posted 13 January, 2011 Posted 13 January, 2011 I think we all need to accept that he will go sooner rather than later...just hope we keep him here till the end of the season at least... I can see him off in the summer (maybe loaned back for 6-12 months) but that will be that.....
Matthew Le God Posted 13 January, 2011 Posted 13 January, 2011 Adkins in interview today - Extremely confident Chamberlain won't go - Media have made up the £10m figure as Saints haven't given any player a price
trousers Posted 13 January, 2011 Posted 13 January, 2011 Adkins in interview today - Extremely confident Chamberlain won't go - Media have made up the £10m figure as Saints haven't given any player a price ^like
trousers Posted 13 January, 2011 Posted 13 January, 2011 I keep telling people that Cortese categoriically said in December that Chamberlain wasn't leaving in the January transfer window. Have faith people :-)
Dellman Posted 13 January, 2011 Posted 13 January, 2011 NC wont sell for two good reasons: he is building from the roots and no one is more roots than Oxo and Lallana and the second reason is if he was in it for money he will get twice as much in two years time so no way will he sell now. Its a happy time, we are not a selling club, believe it and enjoy it!
beatlesaint Posted 13 January, 2011 Posted 13 January, 2011 I keep telling people that Cortese categoriically said in December that Chamberlain wasn't leaving in the January transfer window. Have faith people :-) Cortese hasn't lied to us yet about the coming and going of any players. I am quite confident he wont start lying now.
cryoman1965 Posted 13 January, 2011 Posted 13 January, 2011 NC wont sell for two good reasons: he is building from the roots and no one is more roots than Oxo and Lallana and the second reason is if he was in it for money he will get twice as much in two years time so no way will he sell now. Its a happy time, we are not a selling club, believe it and enjoy it! This......in NC we trust
goneawol Posted 13 January, 2011 Posted 13 January, 2011 http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/football/article-1346960/Alex-Oxlade-Chamberlain-close-5m-Southampton-Arsenal.html?ito=feeds-newsxml
hypochondriac Posted 13 January, 2011 Posted 13 January, 2011 10 million with a loan till the end of the season. I would take that...
Matthew Le God Posted 13 January, 2011 Posted 13 January, 2011 10 million with a loan till the end of the season. I would take that... Then why not just wait until the end of the season and sell him then for more? In any case, Adkins said this afternoon he isn't going to be sold. As Cortese also said in December.
Matthew Le God Posted 13 January, 2011 Posted 13 January, 2011 (edited) http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/football/article-1346960/Alex-Oxlade-Chamberlain-close-5m-Southampton-Arsenal.html?ito=feeds-newsxml He talks of Saints great relationship with Arsenal, despite Saints having pretty much no one left from the Walcott deal in 2007 that would have been involved in the deal. He is making it up as he goes along. 9 hours ago the same journalist said Liverpool were signing him. Edited 13 January, 2011 by Matthew Le God
buctootim Posted 13 January, 2011 Posted 13 January, 2011 He talks of Saints great relationship with Arsenal, despite Saints having pretty much no one left from the Walcott deal in 2007 that would have been involved in the deal. And the last I heard they were slagging Saints off for over playing him and causing Walcotts injury problems.
LostBoys Posted 13 January, 2011 Posted 13 January, 2011 Why Arsenal? to replace Walcott because he did look crap last night against Ipswich
hypochondriac Posted 13 January, 2011 Posted 13 January, 2011 Then why not just wait until the end of the season and sell him then for more? In any case, Adkins said this afternoon he isn't going to be sold. As Cortese also said in December. How would that work?
Matthew Le God Posted 13 January, 2011 Posted 13 January, 2011 How would that work? Because he would have half a season more experience under his belt. Just like if Bale or Walcott had stayed longer, their price would have gone up if still time left on the contract. There is no pressure financially to sell him now and he is under contract for the next two and a half years.
musesaint Posted 13 January, 2011 Posted 13 January, 2011 NC will not let him go We are not a selling club We have money and do not need to sell. We do not need to put money in the bank to prop the club up. Leibherr's family want to fullfil the dream which Markus L had ...that does not entail cashing in when you don't have to He is well enough advised to stay .... at least until the end of the season and hopefully at least the season thereafter Have faith
Matthew Le God Posted 13 January, 2011 Posted 13 January, 2011 NC will not let him go We are not a selling club We have money and do not need to sell. We do not need to put money in the bank to prop the club up. Leibherr's family want to fullfil the dream which Markus L had ...that does not entail cashing in when you don't have to Problem is most national journalists and fans of other clubs seem unaware of this.
buctootim Posted 13 January, 2011 Posted 13 January, 2011 Problem is most national journalists and fans of other clubs seem unaware of this. Its a calculated attempt by other clubs to unsettle him in response to Saints unwillingness to sell imo.
Matthew Le God Posted 13 January, 2011 Posted 13 January, 2011 You are probably right. It also seems to work on Saints fans aswell, with many thinking we should give in.
John Boy Saint Posted 14 January, 2011 Posted 14 January, 2011 Wind & p!ssing spring to mind.................. Strachan was already sat behind the managers desk and GS already painted in his parking space at Elland Road according to this lot a few years ago. Come Saturday we will be half way through this transfer window, and to be honest no team has splashed any noticeable cash yet (well Man City apart who have money burning a hole in their pocket has bought someone or other). Top of the Prem looks similar to what it does every year, King Kenny is back in his castle, Avram being sacked has dragged on to the point of boredom, All that is left to speculate on is the next Wonderkid everyone wants.
Ric Posted 14 January, 2011 Posted 14 January, 2011 I don't care what money is being waved in front of us at the moment: if Alex wants to stay, then we should make absolutely sure that he stays. If he decides that he wants to go, then by all means let's get as much money as we can for him - but if he decides that he'd prefer to develop his game in a great environment, and get lots of matches under his belt (rather than playing in a big club's reserves and/or warming their bench) then there cannot be any other thought in our minds than to keep a firm grip on his contract. We don't need to sell. We shouldn't sell unless either we want to, or the player in question makes it clear he wants out. Simple as.
St_Tel49 Posted 14 January, 2011 Posted 14 January, 2011 He talks of Saints great relationship with Arsenal, despite Saints having pretty much no one left from the Walcott deal in 2007 that would have been involved in the deal. He is making it up as he goes along. 9 hours ago the same journalist said Liverpool were signing him. This - I think that this report is bollux.
St_Tel49 Posted 14 January, 2011 Posted 14 January, 2011 Problem is most national journalists and fans of other clubs seem unaware of this. That's their problem - not ours.
shurlock Posted 14 January, 2011 Posted 14 January, 2011 Because he would have half a season more experience under his belt. Just like if Bale or Walcott had stayed longer, their price would have gone up if still time left on the contract. There is no pressure financially to sell him now and he is under contract for the next two and a half years. Thats ridiculous - 20+ games in the same division is not long enough to make a substantial difference to your market value; it takes longer with time preferably spent playing at a higher level; of course, the more genuine experience you get, the less time left on your contract - and consequently the weaker the negotiating hand of the club. The only way in which selling Oxo in the summer would command a higher fee is if there were more clubs in the hunt for him, thereby bidding up the price. That's possible: activity tends to be more intense in the summer as clubs are clearer about what they need and don't need and owners make funds more available for the new season; but if you believe the reports, all the usual suspects are interested in the kid, so the market is as competitive as its arguably going to get.
St_Tel49 Posted 14 January, 2011 Posted 14 January, 2011 (edited) Thats ridiculous - 20+ games in the same division is not long enough to make a substantial difference to your market value; it takes longer with time preferably spent playing at a higher level; of course, the more genuine experience you get, the less time left on your contract - and consequently the weaker the negotiating hand of the club. The only way in which selling Oxo in the summer would command a higher fee is if there were more clubs in the hunt for him, thereby bidding up the price. That's possible: activity tends to be more intense in the summer as clubs are clearer about what they need and don't need and owners make funds more available for the new season; but if you believe the reports, all the usual suspects are interested in the kid, so the market is as competitive as its arguably going to get. It is more than possible - its likely. Selling him now would be pointless for us though not necessarily for the bidding club. I still don't understand why people are so desperate to sell him when we have absolutely no need for the money. It seems to me that some of our fans are still locked into the Lowe scenario. Edited 14 January, 2011 by St_Tel49
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