Fuengirola Saint Posted 13 December, 2010 Author Share Posted 13 December, 2010 Dear, oh dear. The entire premise of this thread is what, that you generalise about a group of many millions of people? Or hundreds of thousands? Or just the parliamentary party? Depends what you mean by "Tories", I guess but if you need it pointed out to you that making crude generalisations is facile, immature and the action of a sad, bitter, political pigmy then I, for one, care not what you mean. As i pointed out to somebody else i was talking about people who vote Tory, so could you please read the thread properly and answer my question in a constructive manner or ****in do one you muppet Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Verbal Posted 13 December, 2010 Share Posted 13 December, 2010 As i pointed out to somebody else i was talking about people who vote Tory, so could you please read the thread properly and answer my question in a constructive manner or ****in do one you muppet I must admit that cheered me up. I will try to include your ending peroration in every conversation I have today. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dog Posted 13 December, 2010 Share Posted 13 December, 2010 Unbelieveable. Agreed, that EMF track would suit the Tories far better than anything by Pink Flloyd. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dibden Purlieu Saint Posted 13 December, 2010 Share Posted 13 December, 2010 Deep down in every one of us is the heart of a Tory. It's just some of us are so swayed by the untrue notion that Tories are a mixture between the Third reich and Mugabe's administration that they vote the wrong way just to keep up appearances. It is a disturbing notion that people cut their nose off to spite their face, instead of voting the best way for the country and it's people. And they call Tories selfish. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thedelldays Posted 13 December, 2010 Share Posted 13 December, 2010 Deep down in every one of us is the heart of a Tory. It's just some of us are so swayed by the untrue notion that Tories are a mixture between the Third reich and Mugabe's administration that they vote the wrong way just to keep up appearances. It is a disturbing notion that people cut their nose off to spite their face, instead of voting the best way for the country and it's people. And they call Tories selfish. this country is generally tory too Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
View From The Top Posted 13 December, 2010 Share Posted 13 December, 2010 Not every tory is a c**t but every c**t I've ever met has been a tory. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dune Posted 13 December, 2010 Share Posted 13 December, 2010 this country is generally tory too Nobody supported the Tories in the 80's.... until polling day. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jones91 Posted 13 December, 2010 Share Posted 13 December, 2010 Labour is a Scottish party who live of southern England, just like Wales and northern England. We should give at least half our PAYE tax to the local area instead of everywhere else that needs repairing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Viking Warrior Posted 13 December, 2010 Share Posted 13 December, 2010 John Prescott is very Greedy he has two jags four if you include his wifes , and look at the mansion he lives in its something I cannot afford. While Im at what about tony Blair and his missus , they are ultra greedy. hw many millions and homes do they have he was new labour . Maybe new labour equals greed + greed plus even more greed and my fellow cronies will prosper ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dune Posted 13 December, 2010 Share Posted 13 December, 2010 John Prescott is very Greedy he has two jags four if you include his wifes , and look at the mansion he lives in its something I cannot afford. While Im at what about tony Blair and his missus , they are ultra greedy. hw many millions and homes do they have he was new labour . Maybe new labour equals greed + greed plus even more greed and my fellow cronies will prosper ! Don't forget the Union fat cats. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thedelldays Posted 13 December, 2010 Share Posted 13 December, 2010 bob crowe is a greedy ****....the worst sort Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dune Posted 13 December, 2010 Share Posted 13 December, 2010 bob crowe is a greedy ****....the worst sort But he's working class, and has a regional accent. Let's not tar him with the same Brush as those born with silver spooon in their mouths. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colinjb Posted 13 December, 2010 Share Posted 13 December, 2010 Not greedy necessarily, just selfish. And disdainful and dismissive of the poor and needy. "Money" by Pink Floyd should be the Tory party anthem. Actually a little bit offended by that one! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stubby Posted 13 December, 2010 Share Posted 13 December, 2010 Not every tory is a c**t but every c**t I've ever met has been a tory. Sadly, such people are not restricted to any political party. I really hope you weren't serious. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stubby Posted 13 December, 2010 Share Posted 13 December, 2010 This statement displays such a fundamental understanding of socialism and the anti-fees protests that it would clearly not even be worth trying to start a debate with you. Further, I think many people on here don't really understand socialism as well as conservativism. To bring up one example: Working 8am-6pm does not make you a Tory, while knocking off at 4.55 does not make you a socialist. Voting Labour doesn't mean you believe in Government waste, it means you think the Government should take a greater role in people's lives. Voting Tory doesn't mean you disregard the needy, it means you probably think the needy are better served by a system that places a greater emphasis on enterprise to create work for all. Shades of grey. Exactly. The difference between a thinking tory, a thinking lib dem and a thinking socialist is that they have different analyses of what will help. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Verbal Posted 13 December, 2010 Share Posted 13 December, 2010 There's often a very fine line between a capitalist and a criminal. It takes enormous amounts of state power to reign in the kind of rampant greed that would otherwise destroy capitalism from within. Ergo, if all Tories are capitalists, some capitalists are criminally greedy, then most Tories are greedy AND criminal. QED. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GenevaSaint Posted 14 December, 2010 Share Posted 14 December, 2010 http://www.guardian.co.uk/society/2010/dec/13/poorest-councils-face-biggest-cuts The poorest councils face the biggest cuts next year under a settlement announced today that left town halls claiming they are now powerless to protect frontline services from a wave of library, social services and leisure centre closures. Eric Pickles, the communities secretary, today allocated a last-minute emergency £85m fund in an attempt to insulate the poorest areas from the worst cuts next year. But despite his efforts, deprived inner-city areas of London and large cities in the north are facing the most drastic reductions of up to 8.9% this year alone, with the shires and county councils relatively protected by their burgeoning council tax revenue. The Local Government Association labelled the cuts the "toughest in living memory". Hackney, Tower Hamlets, Newham, Manchester, Rochdale, Knowsley, Liverpool, St Helens, Doncaster and South Tyneside are among the 36 local authorities that take the maximum cut of 8.9%. Meanwhile Dorset gets a 0.25% increase in funding and Windsor and Maidenhead, Poole, West Sussex, Wokingham, Richmond upon Thames and Buckinghamshire all get cuts of 1% or below. Self serving, self centered, not sure about greedy. So much for progressive.......typical tories. They could keep a sports centre or two open longer if that fat bastard pickles cut his food bill in half. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dune Posted 14 December, 2010 Share Posted 14 December, 2010 http://www.guardian.co.uk/society/2010/dec/13/poorest-councils-face-biggest-cuts The poorest councils face the biggest cuts next year under a settlement announced today that left town halls claiming they are now powerless to protect frontline services from a wave of library, social services and leisure centre closures. Eric Pickles, the communities secretary, today allocated a last-minute emergency £85m fund in an attempt to insulate the poorest areas from the worst cuts next year. But despite his efforts, deprived inner-city areas of London and large cities in the north are facing the most drastic reductions of up to 8.9% this year alone, with the shires and county councils relatively protected by their burgeoning council tax revenue. The Local Government Association labelled the cuts the "toughest in living memory". Hackney, Tower Hamlets, Newham, Manchester, Rochdale, Knowsley, Liverpool, St Helens, Doncaster and South Tyneside are among the 36 local authorities that take the maximum cut of 8.9%. Meanwhile Dorset gets a 0.25% increase in funding and Windsor and Maidenhead, Poole, West Sussex, Wokingham, Richmond upon Thames and Buckinghamshire all get cuts of 1% or below. Self serving, self centered, not sure about greedy. So much for progressive.......typical tories. They could keep a sports centre or two open longer if that fat bastard pickles cut his food bill in half. Does anyone have the list of all the councils? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dune Posted 14 December, 2010 Share Posted 14 December, 2010 http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1338299/On-yer-bike-Tory-councillor-says-unemployed-Northerners-pick-fruit-claim-benefits.html This is why I love the Tories. Nobody winds up the Lefties better. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
badgerx16 Posted 14 December, 2010 Share Posted 14 December, 2010 Does anyone have the list of all the councils? It's on the Dept for Communities & local Government website, you can download a spreadsheet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dune Posted 14 December, 2010 Share Posted 14 December, 2010 It's on the Dept for Communities & local Government website, you can download a spreadsheet. Or you could do it for me. Look at me going all Socialist and expecting someone else to do the work. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
badgerx16 Posted 14 December, 2010 Share Posted 14 December, 2010 Or you could do it for me. Look at me going all Socialist and expecting someone else to do the work. I have a copy, thanks. Now all I need is the IP address of your computer, and a user account with administration rights so I can map your hard disc as a networked drive, then I can transfer it over to you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dune Posted 14 December, 2010 Share Posted 14 December, 2010 I have a copy, thanks. Now all I need is the IP address of your computer, and a user account with administration rights so I can map your hard disc as a networked drive, then I can transfer it over to you. Cut and paste it onto here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
badgerx16 Posted 14 December, 2010 Share Posted 14 December, 2010 Cut and paste it onto here. Do it yourself, you lazy, greedy, tory barsteward Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
badgerx16 Posted 14 December, 2010 Share Posted 14 December, 2010 I think it highly appropriate that fat basturd Pickles is the Tory pinup boy for this dogmatic exercise in slash & burn economics. I also liked the question on the radio this morning to the LibDem talking head posted to face up to the real fact the the heath budget is being cut, despite being "ring fenced"; "Why is it that the LibDems are being used as 'human shields' for all the bad news coming out of the spending review ?". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thedelldays Posted 14 December, 2010 Share Posted 14 December, 2010 I think it highly appropriate that fat basturd Pickles is the Tory pinup boy for this dogmatic exercise in slash & burn economics. I also liked the question on the radio this morning to the LibDem talking head posted to face up to the real fact the the heath budget is being cut, despite being "ring fenced"; "Why is it that the LibDems are being used as 'human shields' for all the bad news coming out of the spending review ?". do you really think that is labour had won the election there would not have been deep cuts...? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
badgerx16 Posted 14 December, 2010 Share Posted 14 December, 2010 do you really think that is labour had won the election there would not have been deep cuts...? No, but they would not have been as deep, nor implemented over as short a time. And I doubt that the northern cities and Inner London boroughs with most deprivation would have the largest %age reductions whilst some southern Tory shire councils get a budget rise. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thedelldays Posted 14 December, 2010 Share Posted 14 December, 2010 No, but they would not have been as deep, nor implemented over as short a time. And I doubt that the northern cities and Inner London boroughs with most deprivation would have the largest %age reductions whilst some southern Tory shire councils get a budget rise. how do you know...they agreed that up to 25% in all deprtments would need to go... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GenevaSaint Posted 14 December, 2010 Share Posted 14 December, 2010 how do you know...they agreed that up to 25% in all deprtments would need to go... TDD is it fair? Condems favourite phrase along with progressive that the biggest cuts are being made in the most deprived areas? No dune, I don't have the full list, been along to a nativity play this morning preaching christian ideals, nice to see in a city these days :-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thedelldays Posted 14 December, 2010 Share Posted 14 December, 2010 TDD is it fair? Condems favourite phrase along with progressive that the biggest cuts are being made in the most deprived areas? No dune, I don't have the full list, been along to a nativity play this morning preaching christian ideals, nice to see in a city these days :-) again..how do you know that labour would have made these cuts (that they agree needed to be made) over a longer period of time.? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GenevaSaint Posted 14 December, 2010 Share Posted 14 December, 2010 again..how do you know that labour would have made these cuts (that they agree needed to be made) over a longer period of time.? I don't, can only base it on what they said. What I can say is they wouldn't have given Dorset a .25% increase while cutting 8.9% from St Helens for example. I just don't think they're going about these cuts fairly, live in a big city fecked, live in the home counties or other wealthier areas and you're ok. If I were cynical I'd say that they're giving the highest cuts to areas where they probably not going to win seats anyway while protecting their core voters. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thedelldays Posted 14 December, 2010 Share Posted 14 December, 2010 I stopped when you said this.. I don't, can only base it on what they said Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wade Garrett Posted 14 December, 2010 Share Posted 14 December, 2010 I think it highly appropriate that fat basturd Pickles is the Tory pinup boy for this dogmatic exercise in slash & burn economics. I also liked the question on the radio this morning to the LibDem talking head posted to face up to the real fact the the heath budget is being cut, despite being "ring fenced"; "Why is it that the LibDems are being used as 'human shields' for all the bad news coming out of the spending review ?". The Liberals are taking all the flak because they are spineless and stupid. You've got to admire Cameron for the way that all the bad news is being deflected onto his fag, Clegg. The Libs will get decimated in the next election as they are being found out at last. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
badgerx16 Posted 14 December, 2010 Share Posted 14 December, 2010 again..how do you know that labour would have made these cuts (that they agree needed to be made) over a longer period of time.? That is what they have said on many occasions. There is, of course, the caveat that applies to whatever a politician might say, and it is much easier to say things in opposition, as the Condems are finding out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GenevaSaint Posted 14 December, 2010 Share Posted 14 December, 2010 I stopped when you said this.. Just read it! What I can say is they wouldn't have given Dorset a .25% increase while cutting 8.9% from St Helens for example. I just don't think they're going about these cuts fairly, live in a big city fecked, live in the home counties or other wealthier areas and you're ok. If I were cynical I'd say that they're giving the highest cuts to areas where they probably not going to win seats anyway while protecting their core voters. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thedelldays Posted 14 December, 2010 Share Posted 14 December, 2010 Just read it! What I can say is they wouldn't have given Dorset a .25% increase while cutting 8.9% from St Helens for example. I just don't think they're going about these cuts fairly, live in a big city fecked, live in the home counties or other wealthier areas and you're ok. If I were cynical I'd say that they're giving the highest cuts to areas where they probably not going to win seats anyway while protecting their core voters. you have no idea what their budgets were in the first place... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
badgerx16 Posted 14 December, 2010 Share Posted 14 December, 2010 you have no idea what their budgets were in the first place... Actually, if he's looking and the Dept for Communities spreadsheet he does, because it's all on there. I've seen it, and it's exactly as he says. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thedelldays Posted 14 December, 2010 Share Posted 14 December, 2010 Actually, if he's looking and the Dept for Communities spreadsheet he does, because it's all on there. I've seen it, and it's exactly as he says. im sure there is far more to it than....lets punish the north Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
badgerx16 Posted 14 December, 2010 Share Posted 14 December, 2010 im sure there is far more to it than....lets punish the north Follow this link www.communities.gov.uk/documents/localgovernment/xls/1796201.xls, download the spreadsheet and read it for yourself. What is happening is that all the core social welfare budgets are being squeezed, so areas with high unemployment, low adult literacy, high immigration, poor quality housing, large numbers of HMOs, and/or poor health data will be hit hardest. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colinjb Posted 14 December, 2010 Share Posted 14 December, 2010 im sure there is far more to it than....lets punish the north Finally something we can all agree on! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thedelldays Posted 14 December, 2010 Share Posted 14 December, 2010 Follow this link www.communities.gov.uk/documents/localgovernment/xls/1796201.xls, download the spreadsheet and read it for yourself. What is happening is that all the core social welfare budgets are being squeezed, so areas with high unemployment, low adult literacy, high immigration, poor quality housing, large numbers of HMOs, and/or poor health data will be hit hardest. they will be hit the hardest as they need the state more the money is not there to give out...what do you suggest we do..? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
badgerx16 Posted 14 December, 2010 Share Posted 14 December, 2010 they will be hit the hardest as they need the state more the money is not there to give out...what do you suggest we do..? Why do Dorset get an INCREASE ? The formula used is obviously flawed, and it doesn't come across as fair, does it ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thedelldays Posted 14 December, 2010 Share Posted 14 December, 2010 Why do Dorset get an INCREASE ? The formula used is obviously flawed, and it doesn't come across as fair, does it ? how do we judge what is fair..? is dorset bigger than st helens (or where ever it was)...does dorset spend more money than st helens..? I live in plymouth..one of the lowest income cities in the UK...they are about to lose alot of funding.... maybe..they will now stop dishing out free laptops/computers, holidays and delivering bus passes to people who have no intention of doing anything with their lives other than spawn children (to get a bigger house).. and before you say I am being out of order..my EX worked in that field and she would tell me all sorts of stories about her day..about morons that have no intention of working..do anything and expected the council to provide everything...sure people do need help...but the blanket being provided is clearly too big..even labour said it needed to be cut.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
badgerx16 Posted 14 December, 2010 Share Posted 14 December, 2010 Just for comparison : St Helens : 2010-2011 budget £192.4 million. Reduction for 2011-2012 £18.1 million, = -9.39% Plymouth : 2010-2011 budget £241.1 million. Reduction for 2011-2012 £10.5 million, = -4.35% Dorset CC : 2010-2011 budget £289.3 million. Increase for 2011-2012 £700,000, = +0.25% Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thedelldays Posted 14 December, 2010 Share Posted 14 December, 2010 (edited) Just for comparison : St Helens : 2010-2011 budget £192.4 million. Reduction for 2011-2012 £18.1 million, = -9.39% Plymouth : 2010-2011 budget £241.1 million. Reduction for 2011-2012 £10.5 million, = -4.35% Dorset CC : 2010-2011 budget £289.3 million. Increase for 2011-2012 £700,000, = +0.25% again...dorset is about 10 times the size of plymouth population of st helens - 102k people population of plymouth - 250k people population of dorset - 750k people yeah..seems fair to me. Edited 14 December, 2010 by Thedelldays Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bridge too far Posted 14 December, 2010 Share Posted 14 December, 2010 again...dorset is about 10 times the size of plymouth population of st helens - 102k people population of plymouth - 250k people population of dorset - 750k people yeah..seems fair to me. It's not possible to make a sensible comparison as one is a District (City) Council and the other is a County Council. The County Council will include a number of District Councils, in the same way that Devon County Council will include Plymouth City Council. It is the % cut that is relevant. FYI here are population figures: http://www.plymouth.gov.uk/population http://www.dorsetforyou.com/344863 But note that e.g. Bournemouth will have its own District Council and therefore its own budget. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thedelldays Posted 14 December, 2010 Share Posted 14 December, 2010 going on those figures an populations st helens wins by a country mile...the money per head they can spend.. over 5 times the amount dorset has.. yep...really fair Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thedelldays Posted 14 December, 2010 Share Posted 14 December, 2010 It's not possible to make a sensible comparison as one is a District (City) Council and the other is a County Council. The County Council will include a number of District Councils, in the same way that Devon County Council will include Plymouth City Council. It is the % cut that is relevant. FYI here are population figures: http://www.plymouth.gov.uk/population http://www.dorsetforyou.com/344863 But note that e.g. Bournemouth will have its own District Council and therefore its own budget. ok..take off the 100+k people bournemouth looks after.. st helens STILL has a huge amount of more money to spend per head that dorset and plymouth yep...still not fair on the north Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
badgerx16 Posted 14 December, 2010 Share Posted 14 December, 2010 again...dorset is about 10 times the size of plymouth population of st helens - 102k people population of plymouth - 250k people population of dorset - 750k people yeah..seems fair to me. If you want to divert into silly games try this one : Birmingham City Council, population 1.028 million, budget REDUCTION £105.3 million, -8.32%. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colinjb Posted 14 December, 2010 Share Posted 14 December, 2010 (edited) again...dorset is about 10 times the size of plymouth population of st helens - 102k people population of plymouth - 250k people population of dorset - 750k people yeah..seems fair to me. With a little bit of simple maths that shows that people in Dorset get less then half the amount of money that people in Plymouth and St Helens. Plymouth: £939 per person St Helens: £1080 per person Dorset: £407 per person (Removing 100k population for Bournmouth still leaves this figure at £475... way short) Yes, this budget adjustment is a huge injustice. Edited 14 December, 2010 by Colinjb Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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