What's wrong with Lord Young's comments?

[Essruu]

I think he's right. Our mortgage being at 2.5% for the last 18mths has meant that we've been chucking more money into savings and an ISA, buying premium bonds and overpaying the mortgage each month in order to reduce the term.

 

Sure, some people might've lost their jobs; But for the majority, particularly those with mortgages, surely things are great at the moment.

 

All of this hoo-ha and calls for him to resign are stupid.

[GenevaSaint]

I think he's right. Our mortgage being at 2.5% for the last 18mths has meant that we've been chucking more money into savings and an ISA, buying premium bonds and overpaying the mortgage each month in order to reduce the term.

 

Sure, some people might've lost their jobs; But for the majority, particularly those with mortgages, surely things are great at the moment.

 

All of this hoo-ha and calls for him to resign are stupid.

 

Because we haven't had it good. Yes, mortgage rates are low, prices are rising fast and alot of people haven't had a payrise for 2 years.

 

Oh BTW, saving money in todays climate is a fools game. Pay everything off the mortgage or credit cards.

 

His comment is typical of the Tory parties thinking.

[Weston Super Saint]

I agree that those of us lucky to have a mortgage are indeed seeing good times. Those of us on a bank of England Base rate plus 0.16% are even luckier

 

However, for the people who are unable to get a mortgage and have to pay inflated rental income to people like me life is not so sweet.

 

I too have only had one small pay rise in the last three years - no where near as much as inflation - so use the surplus from rental income against mortgage payments to pay for holidays that would normally be covered by bonuses. Still, even with those downsides - no bonuses, no pay rise etc - I still consider myself lucky to be employed at all.

 

This year is gonna be boring though, because the surplus is all going to be used to overpay the mortgage

[richie]

Be grateful for having a mortgage. For someone like me touching 30 I have **** all prospects of ever buying a house!!!!!!!!!!!

[dune]

Because we haven't had it good. Yes, mortgage rates are low, prices are rising fast and alot of people haven't had a payrise for 2 years.

 

Oh BTW, saving money in todays climate is a fools game. Pay everything off the mortgage or credit cards.

 

His comment is typical of the Tory parties thinking.

 

1. I've had a 3.5% pay increase year on year throughout the recession.

 

2. Saving is never foolish - it's where you invest your money. With the BOE base rate being an annoying 0.5% you've got to speculate a bit to beat inflationary pressures; The Stock Market is an example of an alternative and if you trade through an ISA you don't pay capital gains tax.

 

3. When my old man grew up in the 30's and 40's (a family of 8 children) they used to trap blackbirds to eat. We really have never had it so good as now, but most people don't realise how lucky they are.

[GenevaSaint]

1. I've had a 3.5% pay increase year on year throughout the recession.

 

2. Saving is never foolish - it's where you invest your money. With the BOE base rate being an annoying 0.5% you've got to speculate a bit to beat inflationary pressures; The Stock Market is an example of an alternative and if you trade through an ISA you don't pay capital gains tax.

 

3. When my old man grew up in the 30's and 40's (a family of 8 children) they used to trap blackbirds to eat. We really have never had it so good as now, but most people don't realise how lucky they are.

 

1) Typical tory, I've also had rises but do think of others.

2) Saving is foolish when you could be paying even more off your capital on a mortgage. The rates won't stay low forever, make hay while the sun shines Dune.

3) It's all relevant, we could make that comparison with 1640. We're on target for some very tough times ahead that we didn't have in 2005.

[buctootim]

He's right and shouldnt resign. The only problem with what he said is that its politically naive to point out that some peoples lives have been improved by the recession because the press will always make out that by implication he doesnt care about those adversley impacted. My mortgage is currently a ridiculous 1.49% - so Im £500pm better off in this recession than during the peak of the economic 'boom'.

[CB Saint]

Lord young may think that is the case and isn some cases he may be right, however he is naive bordering on stupid if he thinks that any good will come of broadcasting these thoughts to a newspaper.

 

He has been put back in his box by DC and publically reprimanded so he has been punished sufficiently IMO.

[Turkish]

Be grateful for having a mortgage. For someone like me touching 30 I have **** all prospects of ever buying a house!!!!!!!!!!!

 

Indeed, i am 33, decided, foolishly not to buy 10 years ago when i shold have but rented instead, thinking houses prices wouldn't continue to go up, llike many i know got in a bit of financial difficulty through overspending on loans and credit card which screwed my credit rating so didn't even consider a mortgage for a few years. I now have no debt but am probably in the worst position, i earn a decent wage but not enough to save the £25k deposit needed for anywhere decent quickly as i dont want to move out of the house i rent and not on a low enough income so dont qualify for any key worker/low income assistance. Rang up Barratts about the shared equity scheme on their new builds and they said as i wasn't a key worker needed to have kids or one on the way FFS!! For First time buyers involved getting your parents to help with your deposit seems to be the advice churned out by a lot of "experts!, which is all very well if they are rich enough, mine aren't! It seems for "normal" people you are screwed if you want to buy anywhere.

Edited 19 November, 2010 by Turkish

[GenevaSaint]

Should add from OP, yes I don't think he should resign. As CBSaint says, he's been reprimanded but it really doesn't paint a good picture of the Cons as a changed party.

 

Young obviously uses the same publicity company as Nicola.

[GenevaSaint]

Indeed, i am 33, decided, foolishly not to buy 10 years ago when i shold have but rented instead, thinking houses prices wouldn't continue to go up, llike many i know got in a bit of financial difficulty through overspending on loans and credit card which screwed my credit rating so didn't even consider a mortgage for a few years. I now have no debt but am probably in the worst position, i earn a decent wage but not enough to save the £25k deposit needed for anywhere decent quickly as i dont want to move out of the house i rent and not on a low enough income so dont qualify for any key worker/low income assistance. Rang up Barratts about the shared equity scheme on their new builds and they said as i wasn't a key worker needed to have kids or one on the way FFS!! For First time buyers involved getting your parents to help with your deposit seems to be the advice churned out by a lot of "experts!, which is all very well if they are rich enough, mine aren't! It seems for "normal" people you are screwed if you want to buy anywhere.

 

Turkish, have you looked at the shared equity schemes with http://www.homesinhants.co.uk/about_whocanapply.asp

[AndyNorthernSaints]

This makes my blood boil!!!!!!!!!!!!!! people today don't know anything about hardship.

When i was a lad we lived in a shoe box on the M1 and i started work 5 hours before i got up. I worked from 5 years old as a chimney sweep working a 22 hour day, i never had time off even when i had the plague and small pox. We lived on bread and dripping and a bit of jam at christmas if we were lucky.

I didn't spend ten years getting my HND to listen to these scroungers moaning because they can't afford cigs and beer and get free laptops for the kids. All these unemployed oiks need to be branded scrounger on their foreheads and made to do national service.

 

Bring back Thatcher, National service, slavery, Hanging, Rhodesia, Ian Smith, Darwin, National Front, Victorian values, segregation, ban unions, burn down council estates, Hitler was misunderstood..... nurse nurse.....

 

Disgusted

 

Col. Stanley Mustard

Righwingbarsteward

Ivory Tower

Middle England

The Empire

BNP 1LU.

[dune]

This makes my blood boil!!!!!!!!!!!!!! people today don't know anything about hardship.

When i was a lad we lived in a shoe box on the M1 and i started work 5 hours before i got up. I worked from 5 years old as a chimney sweep working a 22 hour day, i never had time off even when i had the plague and small pox. We lived on bread and dripping and a bit of jam at christmas if we were lucky.

I didn't spend ten years getting my HND to listen to these scroungers moaning because they can't afford cigs and beer and get free laptops for the kids. All these unemployed oiks need to be branded scrounger on their foreheads and made to do national service.

 

Bring back Thatcher, National service, slavery, Hanging, Rhodesia, Ian Smith, Darwin, National Front, Victorian values, segregation, ban unions, burn down council estates, Hitler was misunderstood..... nurse nurse.....

 

Disgusted

 

Col. Stanley Mustard

Righwingbarsteward

Ivory Tower

Middle England

The Empire

BNP 1LU.

 

That's quite funny for you.

[dune]

Indeed, i am 33, decided, foolishly not to buy 10 years ago when i shold have but rented instead, thinking houses prices wouldn't continue to go up, llike many i know got in a bit of financial difficulty through overspending on loans and credit card which screwed my credit rating so didn't even consider a mortgage for a few years. I now have no debt but am probably in the worst position, i earn a decent wage but not enough to save the £25k deposit needed for anywhere decent quickly as i dont want to move out of the house i rent and not on a low enough income so dont qualify for any key worker/low income assistance. Rang up Barratts about the shared equity scheme on their new builds and they said as i wasn't a key worker needed to have kids or one on the way FFS!! For First time buyers involved getting your parents to help with your deposit seems to be the advice churned out by a lot of "experts!, which is all very well if they are rich enough, mine aren't! It seems for "normal" people you are screwed if you want to buy anywhere.

 

Same age, same situation, but there are contingy plans and the outlook in the rentak market should improve. There will be less students in future and that will free up more rental capacity forcing down rental prices, and the incapacity slobs are having their rental allownaces cut which will force dow prices. The real issue potentially is in retirement so start making provisions now by joining an AVC which you get tax relief on and should be a good long term investment but ideally you'll need to the BOE base rate being high as you near retirement to benefit most. Also take advantage of an ISA if possible with a DIY ISA being a good option. PM me if youd like some details on this.

[benjii]

Basically, this thread bears out that what he says is manifestly right. A lot of people are better off and some aren't.

 

He may have been silly to say it but that's probably more of an indictment on the hysterical left wing BBC than anything else.

[Special K]

The points he made are, politically, bloody stupid coming off the back of the announcement of impending spending cuts during which time, many people will lose their jobs. He should have known better after all the time he has spent in politics. There's no fool like an old fool.

[buctootim]

The points he made are, politically, bloody stupid coming off the back of the announcement of impending spending cuts during which time, many people will lose their jobs. He should have known better after all the time he has spent in politics. There's no fool like an old fool.

 

But that right there is the problem with the electorate. Young was right. He spoke the truth and got slaughtered for it. His 'mistake' was to not dodge the question, avoid the subject and talk about something else instead. Then people complain about where all the honest and direct politicians have gone. Too many people cant accept honesty anymore, they need it wrapped up in a sympathy blanket.

[trousers]

Bring back Thatcher

 

^This

[trousers]

What's wrong with Lord Young's comments?

 

Nothing. Cameron's first mistake as PM.

[dronskisaint]

Some extremely flawed arguments here.

 

People who got their mortgages within a certain timespan & on a deal are laughing and considerably better off as is anyone who can pay a large deposit to get one even now.

 

To describe this as a 'majority' demonstrates such a lack of understanding of the reality as to deserve the sack for saying it out loud!

 

He's only right for a small percentage of the population of which I'm one - it's his maths and arrogance that are his undoing!!

[EastleighSoulBoy]

This makes my blood boil!!!!!!!!!!!!!! people today don't know anything about hardship.

When i was a lad we lived in a shoe box on the M1 and i started work 5 hours before i got up. I worked from 5 years old as a chimney sweep working a 22 hour day, i never had time off even when i had the plague and small pox. We lived on bread and dripping and a bit of jam at christmas if we were lucky.

I didn't spend ten years getting my HND to listen to these scroungers moaning because they can't afford cigs and beer and get free laptops for the kids. All these unemployed oiks need to be branded scrounger on their foreheads and made to do national service.

 

Bring back Thatcher, National service, slavery, Hanging, Rhodesia, Ian Smith, Darwin, National Front, Victorian values, segregation, ban unions, burn down council estates, Hitler was misunderstood..... nurse nurse.....

 

Disgusted

 

Col. Stanley Mustard

Righwingbarsteward

Ivory Tower

Middle England

The Empire

BNP 1LU.

 

That's quite funny for you.

 

Whooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooosh ?

[dune]

Whooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooosh ?

 

Not at all. Alf Garnett was supposed to mock those with right wing attitudes but he became a cult hero. Andy is the forums Alf.

[badgerx16]

Yep, I've never had it so good: I have a mortgage, so benefit from the low interest rates. Whoop de doo. I am in the first of 3 years with no pay rise, in fact due to 'pay review' will take a pay CUT of £1400 effective from April 1st. Mind you, that assumes I am still in a job by then, what with somewhere between 850 & 1000 slated for redundancy out of a workforce of 3700.

 

My son left Uni & seems to have zero prospects of a job in the current environment.

 

Many of my friends work at BAe, and are fretting about their futures.

 

Yep. I'm over the moon.

 

Lord Young, you are an out of touch, outdated, TIT !

Edited 19 November, 2010 by badgerx16

[Sour Mash]

But that right there is the problem with the electorate. Young was right. He spoke the truth and got slaughtered for it. His 'mistake' was to not dodge the question, avoid the subject and talk about something else instead. Then people complain about where all the honest and direct politicians have gone. Too many people cant accept honesty anymore, they need it wrapped up in a sympathy blanket.

 

Exactly. Even if what he said wasn't "right", he was making a valid point worth considering - that should then be debated and considered by us all.

[pedg]

Plus of course many of those on low mortgages may be better off financially but will that translate into a better standard of living once the cuts in public services start to bite? How do you factor in the effect of children being taught in schools that will be increasingly underfunded in decaying building that are no longer being replaced? How do you factor in all the local services that will be cut to the bone or chopped all together? Cuts in policing? etc..

[GenevaSaint]

Well regardless he has fallen on his own sword.

 

Old school Tory has gone, doesn't suit Cameron's caring sharing party veneer (under the veneer they're still the same!)

[dune]

Plus of course many of those on low mortgages may be better off financially but will that translate into a better standard of living once the cuts in public services start to bite? How do you factor in the effect of children being taught in schools that will be increasingly underfunded in decaying building that are no longer being replaced? How do you factor in all the local services that will be cut to the bone or chopped all together? Cuts in policing? etc..

 

I'm not worried or concerned at all about public spending cuts. The cuts will only take spending back to the levels of a few years ago. Get a grip.

[dune]

Old school Tory has gone, doesn't suit Cameron's caring sharing party veneer (under the veneer they're still the same!)

 

Good. We need Tory policies and attitudes to sort out the mess left by Labour.

[badgerx16]

I'm not worried or concerned at all about public spending cuts. The cuts will only take spending back to the levels of a few years ago. Get a grip.

How many less Police officers would you accept ? How many public libraries & swimming pools can close ? How many day care centres for the elderly can be shut down ? It's all well and good claiming that expenditure is simply going back to the level of a few years ago, but the nature of the cuts, and where they are being applied, will hit real front-line services, despite all the bluster that emanates from Downing Street.

[pedg]

I'm not worried or concerned at all about public spending cuts. The cuts will only take spending back to the levels of a few years ago. Get a grip.

 

Does not counter my point that with the cuts public services will get worse that they are now and that this will have a negative impact on people compared to now. Possible 'we have never had it so good' and will not have it so good again for quite a while.

 

Anyway off to see a house elf die to cheer me up

[scotty]

I think he's right. Our mortgage being at 2.5% for the last 18mths has meant that we've been chucking more money into savings and an ISA, buying premium bonds and overpaying the mortgage each month in order to reduce the term.

 

Sure, some people might've lost their jobs; But for the majority, particularly those with mortgages, surely things are great at the moment.

 

All of this hoo-ha and calls for him to resign are stupid.

 

Because we haven't had it good. Yes, mortgage rates are low, prices are rising fast and alot of people haven't had a payrise for 2 years.

 

Oh BTW, saving money in todays climate is a fools game. Pay everything off the mortgage or credit cards.

 

His comment is typical of the Tory parties thinking.

 

1. I've had a 3.5% pay increase year on year throughout the recession.

2. Saving is never foolish - it's where you invest your money. With the BOE base rate being an annoying 0.5% you've got to speculate a bit to beat inflationary pressures; The Stock Market is an example of an alternative and if you trade through an ISA you don't pay capital gains tax.

 

3. When my old man grew up in the 30's and 40's (a family of 8 children) they used to trap blackbirds to eat. We really have never had it so good as now, but most people don't realise how lucky they are.

 

Interesting point right there; the idea at the moment is to get us to spend our money, not save it. How else are we supposed to get out of this f*cking recession? We need economic growth, not shedloads of money under the mattress, surely thats the point of low interest rates, we just happen to be lucky if we hold tracker mortgages. (I'm not complaining btw, I have one myself.)

[dune]

How many less Police officers would you accept ? How many public libraries & swimming pools can close ? How many day care centres for the elderly can be shut down ? It's all well and good claiming that expenditure is simply going back to the level of a few years ago, but the nature of the cuts, and where they are being applied, will hit real front-line services, despite all the bluster that emanates from Downing Street.

 

1. Police. It's like david Cameron says. Under the Socialists far too much was spent on IT, HR, and other jobs for the Socialist gravy train rider types. Get rid of as many of them as possible. Cut the bureacracy and you can actually increase police presence and save money.

 

2. Shut all the Libraries and swimming pools for all I care about them.

 

3. So long as there are provisions for day care centres for the elderly, and most get picked up, who gives a **** if a few are closed and they have to spend 5 minutes longer on a bus.

 

Badger you need to get your head around the fact that your idiotic Labour lot have created this mess and it must be addressed. Get in the real world.

[Clapham Saint]

He made a vaid point for a significant proportion of the population (maybe the majority, I wouldn't know).

 

However he expressed it monumentally badly from a political standpoint.

[Saintandy666]

He was ignorant of the wider picture of massive job losses and tightened wage packets as well as other pressures like rising VAT. It was a pretty insensitive thing to say and is totally out of touch with the country as a whole. Calling the recession the 'so called recession' also did not help.

[dune]

He was ignorant of the wider picture of massive job losses and tightened wage packets as well as other pressures like rising VAT. It was a pretty insensitive thing to say and is totally out of touch with the country as a whole. Calling the recession the 'so called recession' also did not help.

 

What massive job losses? A few public sector workers is nothing much. I know the interim period between losing their jobs and getting another job won't be pleasant for them, but in the long run it'll be much better for country as we break the Socialist system of state employment and Marxist Unions.

[thefunkygibbons]

Old Tory ambused by Newspaper

 

Where is the story in that

[moonraker]

What massive job losses? A few public sector workers is nothing much. I know the interim period between losing their jobs and getting another job won't be pleasant for them, but in the long run it'll be much better for country as we break the Socialist system of state employment and Marxist Unions.

 

You really are very self centred, you previously stated we have never had it so good, well thats an interesting statement form you considering you have always a hole heatedly derided the past 13 years of New Labour, 6 months of the coalition cannot have created achieved this.

[dune]

You really are very self centred, you previously stated we have never had it so good, well thats an interesting statement form you considering you have always a hole heatedly derided the past 13 years of New Labour, 6 months of the coalition cannot have created achieved this.

 

In terms of material wealth despite Labour, and thanks to ken Clarkes groundwork pre 1997, we have never had it so good. Material wealth isn't everything though and Britain has gone to dogs in other areas i'd rather not expand upon.

[Jonnyboy]

I agree that those of us lucky to have a mortgage are indeed seeing good times. Those of us on a bank of England Base rate plus 0.16% are even luckier

 

However, for the people who are unable to get a mortgage and have to pay inflated rental income to people like me life is not so sweet.

 

I too have only had one small pay rise in the last three years - no where near as much as inflation - so use the surplus from rental income against mortgage payments to pay for holidays that would normally be covered by bonuses. Still, even with those downsides - no bonuses, no pay rise etc - I still consider myself lucky to be employed at all.

This year is gonna be boring though, because the surplus is all going to be used to overpay the mortgage

 

if you arent part of the solution you are part of the problem

[Weston Super Saint]

if you arent part of the solution you are part of the problem

 

I guess that depends entirely upon whose solution it is

[Jonnyboy]

1. Police. It's like david Cameron says. Under the Socialists far too much was spent on IT, HR, and other jobs for the Socialist gravy train rider types. Get rid of as many of them as possible. Cut the bureacracy and you can actually increase police presence and save money.

 

2. Shut all the Libraries and swimming pools for all I care about them.

 

3. So long as there are provisions for day care centres for the elderly, and most get picked up, who gives a **** if a few are closed and they have to spend 5 minutes longer on a bus.

 

Badger you need to get your head around the fact that your idiotic Labour lot have created this mess and it must be addressed. Get in the real world.

 

is your real name lord young...

[Wilko]

He is correct to say that people who have a mortgage benefit from low interest rates. However, to say that 'most Britons have never had it so good' is a little crass. Many people have lost jobs and many more will lose their jobs in the coming months. Many of them will have mortgages and a low interest rate won't help them an awful lot.

 

As earlier posters have mentioned, if you're in rented accommodation, you're pretyt much screwed. A single person on about £20k per year has no hope of paying for a one bedroom flat and even a couple will struggle to have anything left over at the end of the month, once they've paid council tax and bills. I spoke to a friend who lives in Germany the other day. He pays 300 Euros each month for his town centre flat. My girlfriend and I pay £695 for ours. While landlords are understandably putting their rents up to meet their own rise in living costs, a lot of people are enduring long-standing pay freezes. Something in our economy just doesn't add up.

 

Having said all that, I don't think Lord Young should have been forced to resign. He was merely expressing an opinion, which is what politicians should be doing.

[georgeweahscousin]

His comments were clearly lacking sensitivity at this time. That doesn't make them wrong though.

[franny]

Whether one agrees or disagrees with Lord Young it is refreshing that at least he had the decency to resign after his comments clearly caused offence to some. Contrast him doing the "decent thing" to the the wasters, cheats, liars and spin merchants from the Blair/Brown coalition. Money for honours, no problem, passports for friends, no problem, dodgy dossiers, no problem they they consistently bent the rules accpeted the roles but never took responsibility for what they said or did - resign for any of that never.

[badgerx16]

He made a vaid point for a significant proportion of the population (maybe the majority, I wouldn't know).

 

However he expressed it monumentally badly from a political standpoint.

He said "the vast majority....", and he was wrong.

[badgerx16]

Badger you need to get your head around the fact that your idiotic Labour lot have created this mess and it must be addressed. Get in the real world.

You don't know what the REAL world looks like.

 

Admittedly there is posturing on both sides, but for instance, Greater Manchester Police are claiming that upwards of 1000 operational front line staff are at risk, notwithstanding the essential ICT and civilian administrative & operations staff required to keep a modern technology dependent Police force working.

 

And as for 'taking spending back to the levels of a few years ago', I will give you a FACT: the budget at my employers, 6 years ago, was a certain amount, measured as £X millions, ( the exact number is not important ). Over the next 4 years, the budget will be slashed by 32%, back to £X million, exactly the same amount ( give or take the odd thousand ), so allowing for 10 years of inflation that is a 'real terms' cut of probably more than 20%.

 

And I am pleased that you are not going to be affected. ( Yet ! ).

Edited 19 November, 2010 by badgerx16

[Johnny Bognor]

He said "the vast majority....", and he was wrong.

 

Whilst Gordon said "No more boom and bust". He was wrong ..... didn't resign though.

[dune]

Just seen the footage and he was talking about those with mortgages. I don't know what the fuss it about. He was right.

 

Also noticed David Millibands geeky brother trying gain political capital from it. The more exposure he gets the better.

[aintforever]

My mortgage isn't any cheaper - it depends what mortgage you have.

 

Anyway, even if some are better off it takes a special sort of **** to say stuff that that whilst making millions unemployed and whilst millions, who can't get a mortgage, suffer real hardship.

[badgerx16]

Just seen the footage and he was talking about those with mortgages. .

No he wasn't - he said "the vast majority" and also referred to the '"so called recesssion", before adding "because anybody, most people with a mortgage who were paying a lot of money each month, suddenly started paying very little each month" - the average reduction over the last 2 years has been just over £100 per month, from £4792 pa to £3466, according to Sainsbury's, ( http://www.everyinvestor.co.uk/personal-finance/mortgages/cost-of-running-average-home-falls-14pc-to--8-059- ), hardly equates to 'paying very little'.

 

And as for " I don't remember in 07 being short of money", he wouldn't, he's a multi-millionaire.