hypochondriac Posted 13 December, 2010 Share Posted 13 December, 2010 Just leave them to their argument Fair enough Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NickG Posted 13 December, 2010 Share Posted 13 December, 2010 Stats summary of Adkins Last season Pardew 1.8 points per game This season Pardew 1.3 points per game This season pre Adkins 0.8 points per game With Adkins 1.7 points per game Personally would give him benefit of the doubt with MK game as only just arrived and not even had a week training which makes figures (know some will disagree) points rate this season before Adkins 0.6 points per game points rate this season since Adkins 1.85 Not perfect but quite a turn around - would give us about 80 points, possibly bit short so we need to improve. Although Sheff W in 2nd are geting 1.65 points per game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
saintbletch Posted 14 December, 2010 Share Posted 14 December, 2010 Whatever you say, sweetheart. At least I don't come out with horseplop like this garbage: ...as you were saying on Wembley Way last season. If you think we were suffering "malignancy" last season then your expectations as a football supporter are shot to f u ck and you have the perspective of an autistic eight year old. Rocketing up the table and winning a trophy is not "malignancy", darling. Remember, it's not just me disagreeing with your nonsense on this thread. Because you are pitifully wrong. Well in an attempt to inject some grey into your joint "black is not white" ego rutting, I'd say that most fans thought we were in remission whilst walking along Wembley Way but they also feared that the disease had returned when Pardew was sacked. Was the sacking of Pardew and the behind the scenes cliques evidence of a long-term malignancy? Was Puncheon leaving having been the victim of fans' displeasure further evidence of long-term malignancy? Is our criticism of our new manager on this thread evidence of a long-term malignancy? Maybe, maybe not. But to me, it certainly is evidence of our continuing over-inflated expectations. To the original poster, I'd say no he isn't. And that is more about the disappointing style of play than results. I think he's a good manager and will get us promoted this year. But I was led to believe that Adkins was a purist who got his teams playing high-tempo, passing football. But time and again I've seen disappointing performances where we've hoofed long, high 'passes' to a 6'3" striker who, this season, doesn't appear to be able to win a header or hold the ball up. In balance I'd have to say that I've also seen some very encouraging performances that make me feel that Adkins will get it right. And to my eyes, those performances have coincided in the main with Chaplow being in midfield, or at least the splitting up of the Schneiderlin/Hammond 'partnership'. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Turkish Posted 14 December, 2010 Share Posted 14 December, 2010 Stats summary of Adkins Last season Pardew 1.8 points per game This season Pardew 1.3 points per game This season pre Adkins 0.8 points per game With Adkins 1.7 points per game Personally would give him benefit of the doubt with MK game as only just arrived and not even had a week training which makes figures (know some will disagree) points rate this season before Adkins 0.6 points per game points rate this season since Adkins 1.85 Not perfect but quite a turn around - would give us about 80 points, possibly bit short so we need to improve. Although Sheff W in 2nd are geting 1.65 points per game. If the top two continue to go at their current rate 76 points will be enough to get automatic promotion, only 3 more than we got last season not including the -10, inlcuding the -10 the same points as last year would be enough to get automatic promotion, based on teams current performance. It's quite clear that whoever goes up automatically is not going to need the totals of last season as the league is a lot closer and IMO weaker this year. The simple fact is that if we dont go up, it is our own fault and the team has gone backwards. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harry Faz Posted 14 December, 2010 Share Posted 14 December, 2010 And that is more about the disappointing style of play than results. I think he's a good manager and will get us promoted this year. But I was led to believe that Adkins was a purist who got his teams playing high-tempo, passing football. But time and again I've seen disappointing performances where we've hoofed long, high 'passes' to a 6'3" striker who, this season, doesn't appear to be able to win a header or hold the ball up. This. When Adkins arrived there seemed to be an attempt to play crisp quick passing game with the ball on the deck, and Ricky being pushed forward as the apex. We are now playing at a much slower tempo, and as a result opposing teams seem to find it easier to defend against us , and in desperation we pump a long high ball towards Ricky, who even if he wins it , doesnt seem to have support close enough to benefit from it. So for me Adkins startted very well, but at this point in time im not quite sure what style of play he asking the team to adopt - it seems we have , maybe temporarily, lost our way...... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John B Posted 14 December, 2010 Share Posted 14 December, 2010 Yes he is living up to expectations - nothing out of the ordinary Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Window Cleaner Posted 14 December, 2010 Share Posted 14 December, 2010 (edited) If the top two continue to go at their current rate 76 points will be enough to get automatic promotion, only 3 more than we got last season not including the -10, inlcuding the -10 the same points as last year would be enough to get automatic promotion, based on teams current performance. It's quite clear that whoever goes up automatically is not going to need the totals of last season as the league is a lot closer and IMO weaker this year. The simple fact is that if we dont go up, it is our own fault and the team has gone backwards. You do spout bollix sometimes , firstly it's 77+ because you haven't used the right sample, and then you assume that we'll get better and the other won't.If you want to compare promotion chances by using statistics you've got to be objective and treat everyone equally. What you don't factor into your argument at all is that we've 12 home games and 15 away games left.Others have it the other way round. If you take our home form under Adkins it gives us 17 points from 8 games away it's 7 points from 5 games. Extrapolate all that over the remaining games and we come up with 25 and a half points at home and 21 away. Total it up and that says we're on target for a staggering 74 and a half points this season. Aren't stats wonderful. Edited 14 December, 2010 by Window Cleaner Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paris Posted 14 December, 2010 Share Posted 14 December, 2010 Mt expectations of him were quite low however they have gone up of late and excpect us to be winning most of our games now ........ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Turkish Posted 14 December, 2010 Share Posted 14 December, 2010 You do spout bollix sometimes , firstly it's 77+ because you haven't used the right sample, and then you assume that we'll get better and the other won't.If you want to compare promotion chances by using statistics you've got to be objective and treat everyone equally. What you don't factor into your argument at all is that we've 12 home games and 15 away games left.Others have it the other way round. If you take our home form under Adkins it gives us 17 points from 8 games away it's 7 points from 5 games. Extrapolate all that over the remaining games and we come up with 25 and a half points at home and 21 away. Total it up and that says we're on target for a staggering 74 and a half points this season. Aren't stats wonderful. Read it again clown. What are you talkng about? Where have i said we will get better and the others wont? Leeds went up with 86 points, Norwich won it with 95, based on performances this season so far it aint going to take that many points to win it or go up? RIght or wrong? Brighton Played 19 Points 36 = total over 46 games 87.15 Sheff Wed played 20 points 33 = total over 46 games 75.9 Saints played 19 points 28 = total over 46 games 67.78 points Based on our season so far, over the course of the season we will get less points than we did last season, right or wrong? The league is arguably weaker this season so therefore if we get less points in a weaker league have we improved or not? Given the hype, the supposed money, the squad and the fan base and the weaker league if we dont go up it's out own fault, right or wrong? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Window Cleaner Posted 14 December, 2010 Share Posted 14 December, 2010 Read it again clown. What are you talkng about? Where have i said we will get better and the others wont? Leeds went up with 86 points, Norwich won it with 95, based on performances this season so far it aint going to take that many points to win it or go up? RIght or wrong? Brighton Played 19 Points 36 = total over 46 games 87.15 Sheff Wed played 20 points 33 = total over 46 games 75.9 Saints played 19 points 28 = total over 46 games 67.78 points Based on our season so far, over the course of the season we will get less points than we did last season, right or wrong? The league is arguably weaker this season so therefore if we get less points in a weaker league have we improved or not? Given the hype, the supposed money, the squad and the fan base and the weaker league if we dont go up it's out own fault, right or wrong? Sheffield Wednesday isn't the right example though is it,you need to take the 3rd side who've a higher/points game average. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paris Posted 14 December, 2010 Share Posted 14 December, 2010 Handbags time...... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John B Posted 14 December, 2010 Share Posted 14 December, 2010 Read it again clown. What are you talkng about? Where have i said we will get better and the others wont? Leeds went up with 86 points, Norwich won it with 95, based on performances this season so far it aint going to take that many points to win it or go up? RIght or wrong? Brighton Played 19 Points 36 = total over 46 games 87.15 Sheff Wed played 20 points 33 = total over 46 games 75.9 Saints played 19 points 28 = total over 46 games 67.78 points Based on our season so far, over the course of the season we will get less points than we did last season, right or wrong? The league is arguably weaker this season so therefore if we get less points in a weaker league have we improved or not? Given the hype, the supposed money, the squad and the fan base and the weaker league if we dont go up it's out own fault, right or wrong? Just Forget Logic and Stats to get promotion the team has to play well home and away something the team is not doing at the moment. If it does start playing well then we can start thinking about promotion at the moment I dont feel confident but that hopefully might change Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Turkish Posted 14 December, 2010 Share Posted 14 December, 2010 Sheffield Wednesday isn't the right example though is it,you need to take the 3rd side who've a higher/points game average. Depends on if it is the current top two that get promoted at the end of the season or not isn't it. In any case, Huddersfield played 19, points 32, total 77.47. Guess what? Twas a difference of 1.63 points, ohhh but Still less than Leeds, still only a few more than we finished on last season including a 10 point deduction and we would still not achieve automatic promotion based on our season performance and probably still not enough for the play offs in a weaker division. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Window Cleaner Posted 14 December, 2010 Share Posted 14 December, 2010 Just Forget Logic and Stats to get promotion the team has to play well home and away something the team is not doing at the moment. If it does start playing well then we can start thinking about promotion at the moment I dont feel confident but that hopefully might change Anyway at the end of the day both Adkins and the team have got to get their act together in the more difficult games and above all we need to kick Lambert down to the bench and get a striker in who can score goals on a reasonably regular basis, say 1 in every 3 games without needing penalties (which he doesn't win) to boost his total.I think Adkins is guilty of extreme naivety in the striker situation and needs to sort himself out to conform to the expectations of a club with a plan and not be as he was at S****horpe where anything was acceptable because they have no expectation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pedro Posted 14 December, 2010 Share Posted 14 December, 2010 "Is Adkins living up to your expectations". No he isn't, a good manager can deal with difficult players like Puncheon, the easy option was to ship him out and now we're short of options. Last Saturday at 2 down he could have brought on one of the young subs, we had nothing to lose instead he waited until he had to take RL off injured and kept Alex on who was totally knackered and looked cramped up. Thought NA's tactics, team selection and motivation was poor. Luckily other results meant we didn't lose too much ground so hoping for better against Walsall. COYS Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Window Cleaner Posted 14 December, 2010 Share Posted 14 December, 2010 "Is Adkins living up to your expectations". No he isn't, a good manager can deal with difficult players like Puncheon, the easy option was to ship him out and now we're short of options. Last Saturday at 2 down he could have brought on one of the young subs, we had nothing to lose instead he waited until he had to take RL off injured and kept Alex on who was totally knackered and looked cramped up. Thought NA's tactics, team selection and motivation was poor. Luckily other results meant we didn't lose too much ground so hoping for better against Walsall. COYS We will muller Walsall though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PaulGilchrist_76 Posted 14 December, 2010 Share Posted 14 December, 2010 Whatever you say, sweetheart. At least I don't come out with horseplop like this garbage: ...as you were saying on Wembley Way last season. If you think we were suffering "malignancy" last season then your expectations as a football supporter are shot to f u ck and you have the perspective of an autistic eight year old. Rocketing up the table and winning a trophy is not "malignancy", darling. Remember, it's not just me disagreeing with your nonsense on this thread. Because you are pitifully wrong. Is it really necessary to use words like fu ck and make fun of autistic people when delivering your rubbish opinions? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hypochondriac Posted 14 December, 2010 Share Posted 14 December, 2010 Is it really necessary to use words like fu ck and make fun of autistic people when delivering your rubbish opinions? Sorry to wade once more into the debate, but it wasn't exactly making fun was it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NickG Posted 14 December, 2010 Share Posted 14 December, 2010 decent manager doing decent job - will be judged at end of season. automatic = success 2-6 = grey area, depnds on how we do in play offs out of top 6 = failure Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PaulGilchrist_76 Posted 14 December, 2010 Share Posted 14 December, 2010 Sorry to wade once more into the debate, but it wasn't exactly making fun was it. What would you call it then pal? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John B Posted 14 December, 2010 Share Posted 14 December, 2010 Most Managers do a decent job and most managers would do a decent job with our squad But I dont think Adkins has done much that it out of the ordinary. The last game I saw was against Brighton and apart from Lambert's miss with a header I never thought that we would score. Lets hope we do better in the last few games in 2010 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PaulGilchrist_76 Posted 14 December, 2010 Share Posted 14 December, 2010 decent manager doing decent job - will be judged at end of season. automatic = success 2-6 = grey area, depnds on how we do in play offs out of top 6 = failure Playing badly + Losing = No chance of promotion Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NickG Posted 14 December, 2010 Share Posted 14 December, 2010 playing well and winning and drawing = good chance of promotion Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Turkish Posted 14 December, 2010 Share Posted 14 December, 2010 decent manager doing decent job - will be judged at end of season. automatic = success 2-6 = grey area, depnds on how we do in play offs out of top 6 = failure Sorry fella, anything less than promotion this season is faliure. It should be automatically too. 3-6 is only good enough if we go up. There are no excuses. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Window Cleaner Posted 14 December, 2010 Share Posted 14 December, 2010 Sorry fella, anything less than promotion this season is faliure. It should be automatically too. 3-6 is only good enough if we go up. There are no excuses. Correct. Back in the euphoria days of last summer I predicted that we would get nigh on 100 points this season and I thought I was being conservative in my estimates. Obviously we can't win every game but a round 100 looked reasonable.Now I sincerely doubt that we have the arms to obtain automatic promotion, trouble is I placed great faith in AP, seeing as NC said all was well and AP had his full support blah blah blah. Then AP gets the sack and we get this "manager" who reminds me as some sort of scoutmaster or bumbling history professor.I really don't think he can handle "problem players" so I guess he leaves that to his sidekick or Santa's Elf. I have come to doubt his judgement in the matter of players and I am afraid that it will leave us short in the long run. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
derry Posted 14 December, 2010 Share Posted 14 December, 2010 At the moment we are not playing the pass and move football that Adkins and Cortese want. We tried to, but Davis has no idea how to start playing from the back, more often than not because of his indecision and delay, passes to a player already closed down.This is why he takes so long and invariably kicks long. He wastes as much time as the Brighton keeper did on purpose. If we want to play passing football, there has to be instantaneous release to players expecting the pass, ready to move it on to players already on the move. The central midfield's pass and stand style also ends up with the ball back with Davis as soon as we are closed down, due to the slowness of the passing. We are going to have to bring in players that play this way and then Adkins can be judged. This has to include a goalkeeper that is part of the defence and moves the ball on quickly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saint_clark Posted 14 December, 2010 Share Posted 14 December, 2010 Sorry fella, anything less than promotion this season is faliure. It should be automatically too. 3-6 is only good enough if we go up. There are no excuses. That's what he means by "depends on how we do in the play-offs". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Turkish Posted 14 December, 2010 Share Posted 14 December, 2010 That's what he means by "depends on how we do in the play-offs". Thanks for pointing that out, that must be why they made you a mod. Is play offs good enough though? In my opinion, no. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Window Cleaner Posted 14 December, 2010 Share Posted 14 December, 2010 Thanks for pointing that out, that must be why they made you a mod. Is play offs good enough though? In my opinion, no. If we were succesful then I guess the play-offs are better than nothing. But you're always at the mercy of an individual mistake or collective off day, you end up playing your whole season on 1 or 2 games. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saint_clark Posted 14 December, 2010 Share Posted 14 December, 2010 Thanks for pointing that out, that must be why they made you a mod. Is play offs good enough though? In my opinion, no. Well you said "sorry fella" as if his opinion was the opposite of yours, when in actual fact he was making exactly the same point. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Turkish Posted 14 December, 2010 Share Posted 14 December, 2010 (edited) Well you said "sorry fella" as if his opinion was the opposite of yours, when in actual fact he was making exactly the same point. Well no he isn't because he said play offs is a grey area, depends how we do. For me it isn't. If we get to the final and lose that is not acceptable, the ONLY thing that is acceptable is promotion. There is no grey area or sympathy cards for unlucky losers. Whilst i would accept promotion via the play offs give the status of us as a club and the preseason hype i would almost consider this a scrape across the line. Finishing lower than second is a faliure given what is in place at this club, this was the expectiation at the start of the season and should not lowered because we have struggled so far and there are no excuses for those that are failing. Edited 14 December, 2010 by Turkish Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NickG Posted 14 December, 2010 Share Posted 14 December, 2010 That's what he means by "depends on how we do in the play-offs". it was thanks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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