The Spending Review (tackling the Socialists debt mountain)

[AndyNorthernSaints]

The story was in the Daily Mail so it can hardly be described as racial incitement.

 

Post of the year.

[dubai_phil]

Wow.

 

So Maggie was actually dead right on something, and actually tried to stand up for something that has now been proved to be right (and so was William Hague). A very cutting piece about the Euro crisis and the recessionary mess we are in globally and all those who had a hand in promoting the gravy train.

 

http://blogs.telegraph.co.uk/news/peteroborne/100064330/margaret-thatcher-knew-the-single-currency-would-devastate-europe/

 

Note The above article doesn't reflect my views on Maggie just an interesting way that The Euro Bandwagon was promoted and could still lead to even bigger financial disasters

[dune]

Wow.

 

So Maggie was actually dead right on something, and actually tried to stand up for something that has now been proved to be right (and so was William Hague). A very cutting piece about the Euro crisis and the recessionary mess we are in globally and all those who had a hand in promoting the gravy train.

 

http://blogs.telegraph.co.uk/news/peteroborne/100064330/margaret-thatcher-knew-the-single-currency-would-devastate-europe/

 

Note The above article doesn't reflect my views on Maggie just an interesting way that The Euro Bandwagon was promoted and could still lead to even bigger financial disasters

 

Of course she was right. Countries like Greece, ireland, Portugal, Spain and Italy would've devalued long ago if they'd kept their currencies, but being tied to the Euro has left them powerless. It's unsustainable and it'll Portugal next. Nigel Farage was also spot on.

 

[Thorpe-le-Saint]

I've just seen something on Sky News about the NHS 'reforms' coming up. Dear God! 60 years of progress down the ****ing drain with the stroke of a pen.

 

Just like everything else in this **** hole country we end up following what the Americans have: fragmented care and postcode lotteries. You cant put a price on healthcare, (well, you can if you're a Tory) the NHS works well (in my VAST experience unfortunately).

 

Just taken the Australian visa test, passed easily, it's got to be worth considering.

[Thedelldays]

I've just seen something on Sky News about the NHS 'reforms' coming up. Dear God! 60 years of progress down the ****ing drain with the stroke of a pen.

 

Just like everything else in this **** hole country we end up following what the Americans have: fragmented care and postcode lotteries. You cant put a price on healthcare, (well, you can if you're a Tory) the NHS works well (in my VAST experience unfortunately).

 

Just taken the Australian visa test, passed easily, it's got to be worth considering.

if you think australia is much better then you have another thing coming...

your UAF views in aus will be frowned upon there for more than anywhere here

[dune]

Just seen that a load of scruffy tramps were protesting in Nottingham today in a demo organised by the Marxist Unions. By the look of them i'd say half of them were on benefits. I for one think this recession could be a blessing in disguise as it's an opportunity to really shrink the public sector and in the process strike another blow against the Unions. That is what this country needs.

[solentstars]

Just seen that a load of scruffy tramps were protesting in Nottingham today in a demo organised by the Marxist Unions. By the look of them i'd say half of them were on benefits. I for one think this recession could be a blessing in disguise as it's an opportunity to really shrink the public sector and in the process strike another blow against the Unions. That is what this country needs.

 

yawn so predicable:shakey:when will you commies ever learn to stop dressing has tramps on your days off

[rocknrollman no2]

Just seen that a load of scruffy tramps were protesting in Nottingham today in a demo organised by the Marxist Unions. By the look of them i'd say half of them were on benefits. I for one think this recession could be a blessing in disguise as it's an opportunity to really shrink the public sector and in the process strike another blow against the Unions. That is what this country needs.

 

Public sevices going down the pan,higher bills,no pay rises(if you are lucky enough to still have a job),less police,more criminals,workers rights diminished,higher waiting lists for hospital treatment,fewer nurses,higher taxes,less government money to councils so their services are cut and council tax bill are higher.

This is how the Condems are ruining the country.You still think the country needs this Dune?

[dune]

Public sevices going down the pan,higher bills,no pay rises(if you are lucky enough to still have a job),less police,more criminals,workers rights diminished,higher waiting lists for hospital treatment,fewer nurses,higher taxes,less government money to councils so their services are cut and council tax bill are higher.

This is how the Condems are ruining the country.You still think the country needs this Dune?

 

The Conservatives are not ruining the country, they are bringing it back from the brink of ruin. Labour, as always, spent more than we could afford and we are now seeing a responsible government sorting the mess out.

[badgerx16]

The Conservatives are not running the country

I've corrected it for you.

 

Try repeating this mantra 'NOBODY won the election, so now we have a COALITION Government' until you get a grip on reality.

[bridge too far]

Public sevices going down the pan,higher bills,no pay rises(if you are lucky enough to still have a job),less police,more criminals,workers rights diminished,higher waiting lists for hospital treatment,fewer nurses,higher taxes,less government money to councils so their services are cut and council tax bill are higher.

This is how the Condems are ruining the country.You still think the country needs this Dune?

 

Very damning comments from the leader of the GPs' union:

 

http://www.guardian.co.uk/society/2010/nov/19/doctors-warned-expect-unrest-reforms

[Fuengirola Saint]

Public sevices going down the pan,higher bills,no pay rises(if you are lucky enough to still have a job),less police,more criminals,workers rights diminished,higher waiting lists for hospital treatment,fewer nurses,higher taxes,less government money to councils so their services are cut and council tax bill are higher.

This is how the Condems are ruining the country.You still think the country needs this Dune?

 

Don't take this gimp seriously, it only gives him the platform to spout more ****e. He doesn't believe half of what he says, he just says it to get a rise.

[dune]

Don't take this gimp seriously, it only gives him the platform to spout more ****e. He doesn't believe half of what he says, he just says it to get a rise.

 

I do believe it Fungi. With a passion.

[Fuengirola Saint]

Don't take this gimp seriously, it only gives him the platform to spout more ****e. He doesn't believe half of what he says, he just says it to get a rise.

 

I was referring to Dune in this post, in case there is any confusion.

[rocknrollman no2]

I was referring to Dune in this post, in case there is any confusion.

 

Thank god for that.lol!

[Whitey Grandad]

Public sevices going down the pan,higher bills,no pay rises(if you are lucky enough to still have a job),less police,more criminals,workers rights diminished,higher waiting lists for hospital treatment,fewer nurses,higher taxes,less government money to councils so their services are cut and council tax bill are higher.

This is how the Condems are ruining the country.You still think the country needs this Dune?

 

Oh yes. We have got to stop pouring money down the gullets of the public sector so that we can be allowed to spend it for ourselves. Where do you think this money has to come from? It's from the poor bloody workers.

[bridge too far]

Oh yes. We have got to stop pouring money down the gullets of the public sector so that we can be allowed to spend it for ourselves. Where do you think this money has to come from? It's from the poor bloody workers.

 

It's a circular thing, lovey. The 'poor bloody workers' make stuff and sell it to, amongst others, the poor bloody workers in the public sector. What comes around, goes around.

[dune]

Oh yes. We have got to stop pouring money down the gullets of the public sector so that we can be allowed to spend it for ourselves. Where do you think this money has to come from? It's from the poor bloody workers.

 

That's not strictly true. Labour borrowed as well as taxed us to the hilt, so we'll be paying for Labours obscene spending for years to come.

[scotty]

It's a circular thing, lovey. The 'poor bloody workers' make stuff and sell it to, amongst others, the poor bloody workers in the public sector. What comes around, goes around.

 

"There is only one holistic system of systems, one vast and immane, interwoven, interacting, multi-variate, multi-national dominion of dollars! Petro-dollars, electro-dollars, multi-dollars, reichmarks, rins, rubles, pounds and shekels! It is the international system of currency which determines the totality of life on this planet. That is the natural order of things today. That is the atomic, and subatomic and galactic structure of things today."

 

[rocknrollman no2]

Oh yes. We have got to stop pouring money down the gullets of the public sector so that we can be allowed to spend it for ourselves. Where do you think this money has to come from? It's from the poor bloody workers.

 

Where are we pouring money down the gullets of the public sector?I know a lot of people who work in the public sector from the justice system to council workers and everyone of them has had to endure a pay freeze and worse working conditions.Most are very worried about their jobs.

As for the "Poor bloody workers",what do you think nurses,polce,binmen,streetcleaners are?

[badgerx16]

"There is only one holistic system of systems, one vast and immane, interwoven, interacting, multi-variate, multi-national dominion of dollars! Petro-dollars, electro-dollars, multi-dollars, reichmarks, rins, rubles, pounds and shekels! It is the international system of currency which determines the totality of life on this planet. That is the natural order of things today. That is the atomic, and subatomic and galactic structure of things today."

 

And few greedy merchant bankers and speculative mortgage brokers nearly brought it crashing to it's knees.

[badgerx16]

As for the "Poor bloody workers",what do you think nurses,polce,binmen,streetcleaners are?

Left out TheDellDays.

[dune]

And few greedy merchant bankers and speculative mortgage brokers nearly brought it crashing to it's knees.

 

Under the watch of Labour and the FSA. But as you well know that was only part of the story. Labour maxing out on the giant card during the good times when we should have been stashing away in a war chest ensured that when the bust came along we were broke. But hey Gormless Brown declared boom and bust was a thing of the past so that div would never have even thought about being prudent.

[badgerx16]

Under the watch of Labour and the FSA. But as you well know that was only part of the story. Labour maxing out on the giant card during the good times when we should have been stashing away in a war chest ensured that when the bust came along we were broke. But hey Gormless Brown declared boom and bust was a thing of the past so that div would never have even thought about being prudent.

Please explain how much jurisdiction the British Prime Minister and the FSA had over FannieMae & FreddieMac, and the Euro Zone. The quote I responded to was about the 'one system' that binds the globe, not feeding your obsessive fascination with Gordon Brown.

[Sergei Gotsmanov]

I hate bankers with a passion; what they did to the global economy and ordinary people's lives was despicable. Unfortunately we need the bankers to rebuild the system that they screwed; it is just the way it is.

[Whitey Grandad]

It's a circular thing, lovey. The 'poor bloody workers' make stuff and sell it to, amongst others, the poor bloody workers in the public sector. What comes around, goes around.

 

But they buy these things with money that has been legally stolen from the pbws in the private sector. The public sector is an overhead which is far too costly.

[Whitey Grandad]

Where are we pouring money down the gullets of the public sector?I know a lot of people who work in the public sector from the justice system to council workers and everyone of them has had to endure a pay freeze and worse working conditions.Most are very worried about their jobs.

As for the "Poor bloody workers",what do you think nurses,polce,binmen,streetcleaners are?

 

They may be subject to a pay freeze but there are an awful lot of them. Of course these people work hard but just ask yourself where the money comes from. Spending on the Health Service has doubled but 'output/productivity' has only gone up by 30%.

[badgerx16]

The public sector is an overhead which is far too costly.

And yet again we come back round to the Police, Fire Brigade, NHS, Armed Forces, Social Care, etc,etc,etc. All of these can be classified as just 'an overhead' ?

 

Mind you, if you start with MPs.....

[Whitey Grandad]

Please explain how much jurisdiction the British Prime Minister and the FSA had over FannieMae & FreddieMac, and the Euro Zone. The quote I responded to was about the 'one system' that binds the globe, not feeding your obsessive fascination with Gordon Brown.

 

You're quite right, the collapse was rooted in the US but this last lot had put us all in a very parlous position with their frivolous overspending.

[Whitey Grandad]

And yet again we come back round to the Police, Fire Brigade, NHS, Armed Forces, Social Care, etc,etc,etc. All of these can be classified as just 'an overhead' ?

 

Mind you, if you start with MPs.....

 

That is indeed what they all are, but if you look at the relative costs of defence, police, fire service you'll find that the Health Service far outweighs all of them put together, even if you throw in education.

[Whitey Grandad]

I hate bankers with a passion; what they did to the global economy and ordinary people's lives was despicable. Unfortunately we need the bankers to rebuild the system that they screwed; it is just the way it is.

 

Indeed, those bonuses really stick in the throat, don't they?

[rocknrollman no2]

Indeed, those bonuses really stick in the throat, don't they?

 

Especially when they are bailed out with our money,yet still continue to get them.

[rocknrollman no2]

They may be subject to a pay freeze but there are an awful lot of them. Of course these people work hard but just ask yourself where the money comes from. Spending on the Health Service has doubled but 'output/productivity' has only gone up by 30%.

 

Blame the amount of managers and admin staff and the ever rising cost of the drug companies.Expect these costs to rise under the Tories because they were the ones who increased the number of managers and quangos.

[bridge too far]

That is indeed what they all are, but if you look at the relative costs of defence, police, fire service you'll find that the Health Service far outweighs all of them put together, even if you throw in education.

 

I wonder why that should be? Could it be because it's a service that we all use, at one time or another, from cradle to grave as they say?

 

Could it be because we have an ageing population, being kept alive by proactive health education and reactive treatments? Could it be because we're able to undertake radical procedures using hi-tech equipment that costs huge amounts to install and operate? Could it be because the drug companies are finding new treatments on a daily basis to treat and even cure conditions that would have killed us all off only a few years ago. And that those treatments can cost thousands of pounds a year for each patient?

 

A recent report found that our Health Service was in the top 3 of efficient health services in the world, in terms of value for money.

 

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/10375877

Edited 20 November, 2010 by bridge too far

[Sergei Gotsmanov]

Indeed, those bonuses really stick in the throat, don't they?

 

I find them offensive but ultimately in the private sector they are generated by being profitable.

[Big John]

If everyone spent one third of their income on deciding how to spend the other two thirds then i believe that we (joe public) would also be in the smelly stuff.

 

far far too many involved in desk jobs and the buck should stop at their door.

[Thorpe-le-Saint]

But they buy these things with money that has been legally stolen from the pbws in the private sector. The public sector is an overhead which is far too costly.

 

As a case study let's look at British Gas, British Telecom, British Rail, British Airways - the list is endless of former public companies that were privatised and are now, frankly, pure ****. I'm not suggesting that they were 'amazing' when under government control, but if you have shareholders and the like, it's THEIR interests you have to serve by nature, not that of the customer.

[Thedelldays]

in terms of flights to here there and everywhere...british airways are far from "pure sh1t"

[dune]

You miserable doom mongering Socialists have made me think. I don't think we're going to see an apocalyptical scenario when a few public sector workers are forced into the real world of the private sector, but that said it could present an opportunity for an investment. To that end i'm thinking that an investment in cleardebt group might be a good way of turning a bad situation into a ray of sunshine.

[badgerx16]

You miserable doom mongering Socialists have made me think. I don't think we're going to see an apocalyptical scenario when a few public sector workers are forced into the real world of the private sector, but that said it could present an opportunity for an investment. To that end i'm thinking that an investment in cleardebt group might be a good way of turning a bad situation into a ray of sunshine.

[dune]

 

lol.

 

I've actually put it on my watch list. Since 01/11/10 the sp has dipped from 2.2 to 1.73 but looking at the trends it's been up and down in that region for over a year so now is probably a good time to buy. As Lord Young rightly says we haven't yet felt a recession yet, but if we (or the public sector lot) do this investment should do well.

[scotty]

As a case study let's look at British Gas, British Telecom, British Rail, British Airways - the list is endless of former public companies that were privatised and are now, frankly, pure ****. I'm not suggesting that they were 'amazing' when under government control, but if you have shareholders and the like, it's THEIR interests you have to serve by nature, not that of the customer.

 

this.

 

but with the sole caveat about British Telecom, they are pretty grim as a company, but privatisation did massively improve the phone system in this country. Before that sell-off we had pulse-dial phones and a 3 month waiting list to get one. I would argue that BT was the only flotation to benefit customers as well as the shareholders. Trouble is, because it worked once Margaret Thatcher deduced it would work for everything, and the rest is history.

[Whitey Grandad]

As a case study let's look at British Gas, British Telecom, British Rail, British Airways - the list is endless of former public companies that were privatised and are now, frankly, pure ****. I'm not suggesting that they were 'amazing' when under government control, but if you have shareholders and the like, it's THEIR interests you have to serve by nature, not that of the customer.

 

I agree with you in the case of British Rail, you can't have competition on the railways, if only because one train can't overtake another. BT is a vast improvement but has a long way to go. British Airways no longer soak up our money and when they are working do a pretty good job, if only they could get rid of the old ingrained public-sector working practices. In order to serve the interests of the shareholder then you must first serve the interests of the customers.

 

But these are only a tiny fraction of the Public Sector Monster. Health and Social Services are where it's all draining away.

[bridge too far]

I agree with you in the case of British Rail, you can't have competition on the railways, if only because one train can't overtake another. BT is a vast improvement but has a long way to go. British Airways no longer soak up our money and when they are working do a pretty good job, if only they could get rid of the old ingrained public-sector working practices. In order to serve the interests of the shareholder then you must first serve the interests of the customers.

 

But these are only a tiny fraction of the Public Sector Monster. Health and Social Services are where it's all draining away.

 

Although if you take the trouble to read the link I posted yesterday:

 

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/10375877

 

together with this: http://www.visualeconomics.com/healthcare-costs-around-the-world_2010-03-01/

 

you will see that we are one of the lowest spending countries (measured by percentage of GDP) AND one of the most efficient. Can't ask a lot more than that, really.

[dune]

I agree with you in the case of British Rail, you can't have competition on the railways, if only because one train can't overtake another. BT is a vast improvement but has a long way to go. British Airways no longer soak up our money and when they are working do a pretty good job, if only they could get rid of the old ingrained public-sector working practices. In order to serve the interests of the shareholder then you must first serve the interests of the customers.

 

But these are only a tiny fraction of the Public Sector Monster. Health and Social Services are where it's all draining away.

 

In the case of BA they've got the right man in Willy Walsh to drag the dinosaur Socialist types kicking and screaming into the 21st Century. He stood firm against the Unions and he won a decisive battle. More obviously needs to be done, but he's showed that he won't shy aware from making the right decisions.

[Whitey Grandad]

Although if you take the trouble to read the link I posted yesterday:

 

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/10375877

 

together with this: http://www.visualeconomics.com/healthcare-costs-around-the-world_2010-03-01/

 

you will see that we are one of the lowest spending countries (measured by percentage of GDP) AND one of the most efficient. Can't ask a lot more than that, really.

 

The figures are clearly flawed, as is pointed out in the comments.

[badgerx16]

The figures are clearly flawed, as is pointed out in the comments.

The figures are claimed to be flawed in the comments; there is no corroborative evidence, simply conjecture and the presentation of figures to support a particular line of argument/opinion, which may well have been plucked out of thin air. ( That is if you can decode what exactly the comments are saying ).

[dune]

The figures are claimed to be flawed in the comments; there is no corroborative evidence, simply conjecture and the presentation of figures to support a particular line of argument/opinion, which may well have been plucked out of thin air. ( That is if you can decode what exactly the comments are saying ).

 

Five years of waste in the sickly NHS

In a devastating report, Sir Derek Wanless finds that extra billions spent on the NHS since 2002 have simply been frittered away. Remember him?

He was the Government adviser who, five years ago, persuaded Gordon Brown to embark on the biggest spending spree in NHS history.

 

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-481280/Five-years-waste-sickly-NHS.html

 

Things must've changed dramatically since 2007 then. Yeah right.

[Whitey Grandad]

The figures are claimed to be flawed in the comments; there is no corroborative evidence, simply conjecture and the presentation of figures to support a particular line of argument/opinion, which may well have been plucked out of thin air. ( That is if you can decode what exactly the comments are saying ).

 

Funny, that's what I thought of the main text.

[bridge too far]

Funny, that's what I thought of the main text.

 

I thought the visual display of the data was easy to follow. Perhaps the article should have named the source of the information.

 

However, this Wiki article gives broadly the same level / percentages although for two / three years earlier and attributes its information to the OECD and the WHO

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_total_health_expenditure_(PPP)_per_capita