Pardew settlement with SFC

[saint_mears]

 

So why did Guly only just make his first start then? Stop being a mentalist.

 

Because the row was with Pardew and cortese ! tit for tat stuff

[The Kraken]

Yes, The Kraken. It is my opinion and I agree that there are no facts to substantiate it and I made a judgement call from what I have read and what I have heard from a source I trust that made me consider the element of doubt. It is a fact that the club made a statement on the official site saying that Pardew left because of footballing reasons, but then again, history is littered with instances of one thing happening and another version of events being reported in the media as an explanation for the sake of expediency.

 

You can believe what you want and I am perfectly entitled to reach my own conclusions. Either of us could be right or wrong, but neither of us is likely to find out the truth. It is not impossible that the truth was a mixture of the two and that we are both half right. I have concluded that in my opinion there is reasonable doubt, which is something that you are not prepared to concede.

 

However, I take it that whatever the circumstances, we are both content with the outcome. I think that from what I've seen so far, Adkins is the better manager and I agree with somebody else's comment that the Tranmere match was better football than anything we saw last season under Pardew.

 

Incorrect. In this thread alone I have admitted that I do not know for sure that the club statement is 100% truthful. The difference is, I am choosing to believe the statement until I see evidence that proves otherwise.

 

In any case, this argument has run its course (I'm actually not even sure what was being talked about half the time). Time will tell if Adkins is a better manager, but I've certainly been impressed so far, and I hope our progress continues with a win today; that would definitely be a real achievement.

[Legod Third Coming]

I'm with you on this and the perfectly reasonable approach you have adopted throughout this debate. There is no firmer evidence that supports either the position that Pardew was sacked because of football reasons or that there was some gross misconduct. It is not beyond the bounds of possibility that in the event of the latter reason, a statement such as was made by Cortese could have been an expedient excuse to deflect press intrusion, both for the sake of Alan Pardew and for the club. There is nothing peculiar in the dismissal of Pardew's asistants either, as that is entirely normal that a new manager might want his own assistants. Other questions have been raised about the sudden timing after a 4-0 victory and the fact that Cortese had not lined up a replacement. For the reason of the sacking to have been because of gross misconduct, it would have been strange that the stories that surfaced were a total fabrication without any basis of substance at all.

 

Taking all of these things into account, I feel that at the very least there is reasonable doubt that makes it not so clear cut that anybody can say with total certainty that either one position or the other can be totally watertight.

 

God Almighty. The statement tells you that the management team are being relieved of their duties BECAUSE they are not expected to help the club meet its targets. Those targets are PROMOTION(S). That is it. End of. The rest it total conjecture and frankly cobblers put about by people on here. It's not a case of opinions or speculation. It's a case that some people felt a need to justify the decision so made some stories up. The Chairman felt no such need. He told you in a statement that he felt a change was needed to reach our targets.

[Legod Third Coming]

Or: 'Having looked into it, weve realised that our current management team aren't (for reason unknown) expected to achieve our targets'.

 

[NB, this could mean that the current management/coaching team are a limiting factor; or equally it could mean that Cortese thinks he's identified better]

 

 

No, not at all. This means: 'our targets are for a substantial progress over a (long) period of time, and all parts of the club need to achieve these targets'

 

 

Or: 'as a result (of the current management team not being expected to meet the targets), we are removing them from their positions'

 

So to summarise: 'we have high expectations, which we don't feel the current management team will live up to, therefore, they are being removed from their duties'.

 

I'm beginning to think you are either stupid, bored or both.The Chairman did not say expectations. He said TARGETS. Those are HIS words. Not mine. Not conjecture. Not summary. Not paraphrase.... Perhaps what he meant was "one of our targets is that the manager should not sleep with a player's wife". Perhaps in your bizarre world that's exactly what he meant. Perhaps that's why he sacked the Manager and his coaches. Perhaps all three were in a bunk up on The Northam. Anyway I am now offically bored of this and off to watch QPR Norwich.

[sadoldgit]

I heard from a reliable source why Pardew went. The bloke's an arrogant ***** and deserved the sack.

 

Pardew or Cortese?

 

McMenemy was no shrinking violet. Perhaps we should have sacked him too?

[Joensuu]

I'm beginning to think you are either stupid, bored or both.The Chairman did not say expectations. He said TARGETS. Those are HIS words. Not mine. Not conjecture. Not summary. Not paraphrase....

 

Goodness, you're very much into your semantics. 'Targets', 'expectations', 'objectives', 'ambitions' - I've used all interchangably so as to not continuously be repeating the word 'target'. Where I have used a different word, please feel free to swap it with 'target' if it makes you feel better.

 

Anyhow, I really like your summary below (it reads the way that I have read the club statement, and here was me starting to doubt my ability to read):

 

The statement tells you that the management team are being relieved of their duties BECAUSE they are not expected to help the club meet its targets. Those targets are PROMOTION(S). That is it.

 

Absolutely, that's exactly what it tells us. So can we agree, that anything which might impede, prevent or inhibit the target of promotion(s) could be inferred as the reason for the sacking? Would this not include anything affecting squad morale?

[sadoldgit]

We will probably never know the truth. Pardew did a good job for us last year and I believe he would have taken us up this year. Hopefuly Adkins will. Pardew will get a decent job in football somewhere else. There will be people on here who support him and people who were gald to see him go and they will both believe what they want to believe. This, like most of are squabbles on here, will go nowhere.

[Wes Tender]

God Almighty. The statement tells you that the management team are being relieved of their duties BECAUSE they are not expected to help the club meet its targets. Those targets are PROMOTION(S). That is it. End of. The rest it total conjecture and frankly cobblers put about by people on here. It's not a case of opinions or speculation. It's a case that some people felt a need to justify the decision so made some stories up. The Chairman felt no such need. He told you in a statement that he felt a change was needed to reach our targets.

 

Well, you believe what you believe and I'll believe what I want to. To try and force your views onto somebody else without concrete proof to back them up is arrogance. I know what the statement says and my command of the English language is sufficently good enough to comprehend it. That is not to say that it is totally unambiguous or that it was not put out to gloss over another set of circumstances for the sake of expedience.

 

Furthermore, you are not in a position to state what the chairman felt a need to do or otherwise. That is between him and Pardew.

[up and away]

Originally Posted by aintforever

Surely if there is a settlement that rules out gross misconduct.

Unfortunately not

 

[take for example an employee at my current company who refused to undertake any work at all. Verbal warning. Still no work. Writen warning, still no work out of her. When sacked she pleaded racial discrimination. The legal costs were estimated at around 4x her annual wage. The out of court settlement was agreed at c. 1x her annual wage. Quite simply, it's hard to dismiss any employee, and settlements are now now very frequent, even when the employee is completely in the wrong]

 

I really am bemused why so many people cannot understand this was just the sacking of a person under contract. Just because you sack the person does not mean that you do not have to continue to pay what was agreed in the contract. That also means that the person receiving the money is not free to take up employment elsewhere and continue to get paid. So what happens if the person wants to get back to another job, they agree a settlement figure, less in total what would be paid out eventually and in one reduced lump sum. That then allows the person to take on other positions with a reduced payout, the employer having to pay out less, a compromise that suits both parties.

 

 

Pardew could even have been caught in a compromising position with Mrs Cortese and I doubt there would be justification to stop payment under the contract. Nothing to stop him being sacked for any reason, at any time, but you still have to pay him.

[Wes Tender]

So can we agree, that anything which might impede, prevent or inhibit the target of promotion(s) could be inferred as the reason for the sacking? Would this not include anything affecting squad morale?

 

Well, there's an interpretation which would cover the argument that some element of expediency could have been involved.

 

But as SOG says, we probably will never know the truth of the matter, so impossible to prove any viewpoint conclusively. But it is amusing that some are prepared to take everything said as gospel without any element of cynicism. I always remember the famous line of Mandy Rice-Davies in the Profumo scandal, responding to an accusation against her, when she responded well he would,(say that) wouldn't he?

[Legod Third Coming]

Well, you believe what you believe and I'll believe what I want to. To try and force your views onto somebody else without concrete proof to back them up is arrogance. I know what the statement says and my command of the English language is sufficently good enough to comprehend it. That is not to say that it is totally unambiguous or that it was not put out to gloss over another set of circumstances for the sake of expedience.

 

Furthermore, you are not in a position to state what the chairman felt a need to do or otherwise. That is between him and Pardew.

 

I'm not forcing views on anyone. There is no proof of anything needed unless you don't believe the Chairman. I can only comment on what he said and what he said was he sacked the manager because he wasn't going to meet the targets set by the club. Of course, he might be lying. I'm not.

[Block 5]

I fully expect to hear of a human torso being washed up on the Isle of Wight not long after reports of AP going 'missing'.

[saint_mears]

All the evidence as to why Pardew was sacked is out there for all to see and obviously you will have to ignore the lies spread by a pr company. I will repeat that Guly only getting five minutes at Bristol rovers was the last tit for tat move that Pardew made. Cortese was livid and sacked him within 48hrs. Every wondered why the southend programmes where withdrawn from sale last season ? Cortese didnt like the fact that in Pardews column it made him look good. There are many little things like those examples that went on. The bottome line of course is Cortese was doing all he could to get Pardew to walk and not have to pay out his contract. This was going on for months but went up a gear pre season. Hence all the pre season prep being rather poor. All the players knew the situation as well.

[doddisalegend]

All the evidence as to why Pardew was sacked is out there for all to see and obviously you will have to ignore the lies spread by a pr company. I will repeat that Guly only getting five minutes at Bristol rovers was the last tit for tat move that Pardew made. Cortese was livid and sacked him within 48hrs. Every wondered why the southend programmes where withdrawn from sale last season ? Cortese didnt like the fact that in Pardews column it made him look good. There are many little things like those examples that went on. The bottome line of course is Cortese was doing all he could to get Pardew to walk and not have to pay out his contract. This was going on for months but went up a gear pre season. Hence all the pre season prep being rather poor. All the players knew the situation as well.

 

incoming hope you've got your helmet on.

[leftback]

All the evidence as to why Pardew was sacked is out there for all to see and obviously you will have to ignore the lies spread by a pr company. I will repeat that Guly only getting five minutes at Bristol rovers was the last tit for tat move that Pardew made. Cortese was livid and sacked him within 48hrs. Every wondered why the southend programmes where withdrawn from sale last season ? Cortese didnt like the fact that in Pardews column it made him look good. There are many little things like those examples that went on. The bottome line of course is Cortese was doing all he could to get Pardew to walk and not have to pay out his contract. This was going on for months but went up a gear pre season. Hence all the pre season prep being rather poor. All the players knew the situation as well.

 

absolutely, exactly, completely,totally,spiffingly,correct!!!

[Wes Tender]

absolutely, exactly, completely,totally,spiffingly,correct!!!

 

Ah! Smears and leftback. There's reliable.

[enzo gambaro]

I'm a Bolton fan but I lurk on here from time to time because I used to stand on the Milton when I was at uni 92-95.

 

I was talking to a ruggedly handsome ex-Saints striker at the Bolton Beer Festival on Friday night who said he speaks to AP quite often.

 

He said there was nothing sinister behind his dismissal but that Pardew had told him months ago that NC would sack him for nothing the first chance he got.

 

Said ruggedly handsome ex-Saint also said that he "facking laaved it dahn there".

[The Kraken]

Iain Dowie has got quite the c o ckney accent, to be fair.

[Smirking_Saint]

absolutely, exactly, completely,totally,spiffingly,correct!!!

 

Course it is leftback, of course

 

Quite the storyteller though Leftie, i'll give you that.

[leftback]

Course it is leftback, of course

 

Quite the storyteller though Leftie, i'll give you that.

 

If we are going to to the intimate level of shortening nicknames I would prefer to be known to you as "leftini" as i am known on the continent!!

[Smirking_Saint]

If we are going to to the intimate level of shortening nicknames I would prefer to be known to you as "leftini" as i am known on the continent!!

 

Leftini it is

 

I like you, but i still don't believe you

[Wes Tender]

I'm a Bolton fan but I lurk on here from time to time because I used to stand on the Milton when I was at uni 92-95.

 

I was talking to a ruggedly handsome ex-Saints striker at the Bolton Beer Festival on Friday night who said he speaks to AP quite often.

 

He said there was nothing sinister behind his dismissal but that Pardew had told him months ago that NC would sack him for nothing the first chance he got.

 

Said ruggedly handsome ex-Saint also said that he "facking laaved it dahn there".

 

Pleased to see that Pardew is keeping to his side of the non-disclosure agreement, even talking with Kevin Davies, although ruggedly handsome isn't how I'd describe him.

[enzo gambaro]

Pleased to see that Pardew is keeping to his side of the non-disclosure agreement, even talking with Kevin Davies, although ruggedly handsome isn't how I'd describe him.

Not Super Kev, silly, even if his performance on Saturday did suggest he'd been out on the lash the night before.

[Legod Third Coming]

I'm a Bolton fan but I lurk on here from time to time because I used to stand on the Milton when I was at uni 92-95.

 

I was talking to a ruggedly handsome ex-Saints striker at the Bolton Beer Festival on Friday night who said he speaks to AP quite often.

 

He said there was nothing sinister behind his dismissal but that Pardew had told him months ago that NC would sack him for nothing the first chance he got.

 

Said ruggedly handsome ex-Saint also said that he "facking laaved it dahn there".

 

I don't believe any rumours but when the WHOLE of football was talking about how long it would be before Pardew was sacked you end up thinking, no fire without fire...

[simo]

MOVE ON NOW nothing too see here anymore!

[NickG]

I'm a Bolton fan but I lurk on here from time to time because I used to stand on the Milton when I was at uni 92-95.

 

I was talking to a ruggedly handsome ex-Saints striker at the Bolton Beer Festival on Friday night who said he speaks to AP quite often.

 

He said there was nothing sinister behind his dismissal but that Pardew had told him months ago that NC would sack him for nothing the first chance he got.

 

Said ruggedly handsome ex-Saint also said that he "facking laaved it dahn there".

 

so planned months ago, was for nothing, but Cortesse couldn't sack him months ago when he wantes to because he had to wait for nothing to happen to give him the chance he had been waiting for to sack him for nothing?

 

Get it now.