Cortese Questions

[doddisalegend]

He obviously cares so much it hurts him when things dont go right.

 

Its worrying because the guys health is at risk.

 

Its pleasing that we have someone who cares about the success of the team at last.

 

Anyone on here trying to make captial out of Up and Away's post should be ashamed of themselves.

 

They are not human and they certainly arent Saints fans.

 

Hahaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa coming from you that is F ucking funny.

[saintjay77]

What has largely been overly looked in this thread so far...

 

 

 

If that is true, then Markus has left the club with access to a huge amount of funding. Just look how much Man City are spending to win the Champions League. I'm sure Nicola and Markus would be fully aware of the amount of investment that would be required.

 

 

Yes but just imagine the possibilities had he widened both eyes!!

[up and away]

Originally Posted by alpine_saint

Do you want him to fail ?

 

Do you get a kick out of hearing the stress the guys suffers, just because he's dared add some small fees to a few things ?

 

Grow up, FFS.

No one wants him to fail Alps, but be honest, that post by Up & Away was a bit creepy wasn't it?

 

Not that different to many of our committed supporters. Most successful businessman I have come across are focused to the point of minor obsession at least, it is what drives them. That does not mean that the social aspect is completely over looked, but normally comes second place to Saints. If you think Cortese is creepy, just have a look at the other side of that coin to find your own profile.

[dubai_phil]

No I would worry about anyone in charge carrying that sort of baggage around, No one in that sort of postion should be that emotionally involved he should be making descions with his head not his heart. Everyone kows you back everything NC does good for you. I'd rather take a more balanced view. Personally I couldn't give a **** about booking fees or carpark charges. However IMO the **** with the press and the whole episode with the managers has been less than well handled. and If you don't like my opinion feel free to F uck off.

 

 

Oh dear.

 

We've been moaning for years that we didn't have a fan in charge and lo and behold we have a bloke in charge who feels the way we do about our club and we then decide that is a weakness.

 

Again, second simple statement this week that has knocked back the NC baiters. Les Reed runs Staplewood and has nothing to do with the first team. Cue some more debate on that one.

[sadoldgit]

not really...am amazed that you have not dismissed it out of hand..like burleys drinking habbits

 

What do you know of Burley's "drinking habits" DD? Do you really think an alcoholic could run for 26 miles? If you are that sure that he is such a drunk please forward the evidence.

[alpine_saint]

Oh dear.

 

We've been moaning for years that we didn't have a fan in charge and lo and behold we have a bloke in charge who feels the way we do about our club and we then decide that is a weakness.

 

Again, second simple statement this week that has knocked back the NC baiters. Les Reed runs Staplewood and has nothing to do with the first team. Cue some more debate on that one.

 

Some real toys out of prams moments coming up on here, methinks...

[sadoldgit]

Not that different to many of our committed supporters. Most successful businessman I have come across are focused to the point of minor obsession at least, it is what drives them. That does not mean that the social aspect is completely over looked, but normally comes second place to Saints. If you think Cortese is creepy, just have a look at the other side of that coin to find your own profile.

 

Focus is one thing but when your "obsession" interferes with your decision making then that is cause for concern. As for your personal jibe, I'll let that slide.

[doddisalegend]

Oh dear.

 

We've been moaning for years that we didn't have a fan in charge and lo and behold we have a bloke in charge who feels the way we do about our club and we then decide that is a weakness.

 

Again, second simple statement this week that has knocked back the NC baiters. Les Reed runs Staplewood and has nothing to do with the first team. Cue some more debate on that one.

 

Have WE I'm glad you know how I've felt all these years. I never wanted a fan in charge Wilde was a fan so was Crouch that didn't work out great. NC has done some good stuff, but I'm not going to agree with everything he does or says I have a mind of my own. The last few weeks regardless of the reasons have not been good for this club or it's image, no reason why NC can't turn it round and if he does I shall praise him for it, but equally no reason why I should tow the party line if he doesn't.

[S-Clarke]

This is very lengthy, but worth the read. Very revealing.

 

I was one of the 15 who met with NC. I would be surprised if any of us was anything less than impressed by him. I certainly was, hugely so. He was open, businesslike, clear and concise in all that he said, not avoiding any of the questions raised and points made. On all the complaints he had a good answer, either convincing to me or, where I still disagreed with his position, at least putting up a good and logical argument. Perhaps more surprisingly, he also came across as a rather nice man, friendly, humorous and convivial. The kind of man you would want to work for if you were committed and good at your job - but hard and unforgiving if you were not up to it.

 

The main points, from my recollection, included the following (quotes are an approximation of the words he used, not verbatim”:

 

 

The decision to sack AP was sudden and unavoidable. For legal reasons, he was prevented from providing any details – “we would end up in an Employment Tribunal”. I know a fair bit about employment law and it was clear to me that a Compromise Agreement, including a confidentiality clause, had already been signed. Neither the Club nor those dismissed will be disclosing the reasons. NC said that if he had wanted to get rid of AP for any performance reason he would have done it over the summer and had a replacement ready. He was obviously aghast that his commitment to management stability had to be set aside. It wasn’t raised but the fact that another two staff were dismissed must mean that all three were involved in whatever the misdemeanour was.

 

 

NC confirmed that he expects the new manger to be capable of taking us right up to the Premiership and whoever is appointed will have to demonstrate their ability to manage at that level. He emphasised that the ability to manage in the Premiership does not mean that the person appointed will already have done that job previously. He had been astonished at the number and calibre of people who applied or expressed interest via their agents or solicitors, including two “serving” premiership managers and lots from the championship. By contrast, when he arrived he had to go knocking on doors to get anyone to apply. He expected an appointment to be made “very soon”. He warned us to be ready for lots of stories from those who had never been offered the post claiming they had turned it down etc. and lots of other speculation and untrue stories in the press.

 

It seems clear that hard nosed negotiations are going on with S****horpe over compensation. This is one smart businessman who won’t be wasting the Club’s money on sweetheart deals – on players or managers. I’m not sure whether to laugh or cry at the fans on this site who swallowed what S****horpe were saying to the press and blaming NC for the delay. Quite ridiculous that our fans back S****horpe rather than Saints in these negotiations.

 

 

On the media, many of us made the point that NC should make more effort to get his views across. If all the fans had heard what we did, all but the most cynical would be very satisfied with the decisions he has taken and his plans for the future. On the Echo, which anyone who has had any dealings with it know has only a passing and occasional relationship with the truth, NC said he has no problems with any of their reporters - “only one man”. No names mentioned but there was a knowing laugh when I offered the name of the Editor. He is adamant that he will not spend time putting right every untruth and correcting every error – “it would be a full time job”. He is obviously convinced that the proof of the pudding will be in the eating and doesen't care much about what was written about him in the meantime. Some of us argued that he was damaging his reputation and that specific concerns of the fans do need addressing, perhaps by using the broadcast media where his words can’t be twisted. He accepted that he had been too quite over the summer and said that a radio fans forum was being organised.

 

 

The revised planning application for Staplewood was in hand and work should start before the end of the year.

 

He said that he did not involve himself in the manager role but he was accountable to him (NC) so there would always be times when questions would be raised. For example, it had become clear in July that the players were unfit and they are still not in the right condition, “a disgrace after the amount spent on pre-season”. He was also critical of how many similar injuries we have suffered.

 

Les Reed is not involved with managing the first team – that was purely the manger’s role. Les was in charge of non-first team coaching, the Development Centre, scouting, medical support etc. It is obvious these are two very separate roles, both reporting to NC.

 

On player recruitment, the manager tells NC what positions he needs to strengthen, NC sets the budget, Les Reed and his scouts come up with suggestions and the manager alone decides who is recruited, subject to budget. This all seemed very clear and sensible.

 

 

He hopes that by the time the Club is in the Premiership, 50% of the players will have been raised though the ranks of the Club. I think that’s overly ambitious but it’s certainly an admirable ambition. He was clearly unhappy that other clubs, including Chelsea, were very active in scouting in the Southampton area “Charlie Austin should have been playing for us on Saturday”.

 

 

NC will appoint the new manger alone. He has sought he views of Les Reid – who coached most of the likely applicants through their badges and knows them all. He laughed at the Echo’s notion that Les Reid was the “Kingmaker”. A short list is in place.

 

 

NC was very conscious of the “unacceptable match day catering”. Part of the problem with the stadium specification which was cut back to reduce costs and there were physical constraints. There are lots of other problems with the stadium because no money had been spent on it since it was opened. PA system, screens etc all needed replacing and will be.

New smartcard ticket system on the way but costs nearly £2million – seems unduly high to me. This will allow for cashless purchasing and a return to easy payment season tickets. There was a big problem with the previous system where 300 out of 1000 or so direct debits were reneged on while the tickets continued to be used.

 

When they took over, he was surrounded by ex directors, players, sponsors and other hangers on who all wanted something for nothing e.g. former players who wanted to be paid £70k a year to be “ambassadors” - to which NC’s response was “fine, if you bring in £200k”. He has cut down Saints presence in the Board Room hospitality to eight - and has now told away teams they too must restrict their numbers. This was one of mnay examples of how costs are being cut.

 

 

NC was pretty convincing on ticket pricing policy as a whole. He explained that for cup games visiting teams had power to veto any cut price offers. Interesting debate on letting children in for very little while other children are paying lots more via season tickets. I rather agreed with him that it was very difficult to strike the right balance.

 

 

Re complaints from fans and others about having to pay to parking at the stadium, we had been loosing £150,000 a year on parking, including lots who simply used it to commute into town. It was argued by one of us that it was unfair that the keenest fans that paid lots to go to away matches were now having to pay to park at the stadium as well. The parking system doesn’t , apparently, have the ability to differentiate between these fans and other parkers. Another of us pointed out that fans could park for free at Fleming Park at Eastleigh and catch the bus from there.

 

 

Lots of positive interest from NC in community engagement – he invited one of us to meet with the relevant staff to discuss her ideas.

 

 

He has recruited from UEFA someone who used to market the Champions League to revitalise the Saints sponsorship and marketing operation. We will appoint a new main sponsor. Flybe received more in free tickets etc than what they paid in sponsorship!

 

 

NC was very convincing that the strategy of investing £millions up front to get to the premiership will survive Marcus’s passing. I pressed him on why a Swiss family would be interested in an obscure third level club and he basically replied that he was pretty much part of the family! He was flying out to Switzerland the next day to take part in the family discussion on the future of the main company itself. We will see what happens but there are no grounds for believing that the five year plan has been endangered by Marcus’s passing. Cortese is the only link now, however. Those who criticise him, usually but not always, through crass ignorance, need to be careful for what they wish for.

 

 

NC explained that they had considered buying a Premiership Club but were put off by how much would have to be paid to pay of the debts and cover the cost of their expensive assets. With Saints, the cost was much cheaper, leaving more to invest to get the Club up the divisions.

 

 

All in all, it was a very informative and enjoyable evening. In my view, Cortese deserves our full support, not only for his part in saving the club but for now running it in a highly professional manner, single mindedly set on taking us bac

[SuperSAINT]

This is very lengthy, but worth the read. Very revealing.

 

Fantastic post - Where did it come from?

 

I have ZERO clue why Pards got the boot now. If anyone knows, please PM me!

[Colinjb]

I was one of the 15 who met with NC. I would be surprised if any of us was anything less than impressed by him. I certainly was, hugely so. He was open, businesslike, clear and concise in all that he said, not avoiding any of the questions raised and points made. On all the complaints he had a good answer, either convincing to me or, where I still disagreed with his position, at least putting up a good and logical argument. Perhaps more surprisingly, he also came across as a rather nice man, friendly, humorous and convivial. The kind of man you would want to work for if you were committed and good at your job - but hard and unforgiving if you were not up to it.

 

The main points, from my recollection, included the following (quotes are an approximation of the words he used, not verbatim”:

 

 

The decision to sack AP was sudden and unavoidable. For legal reasons, he was prevented from providing any details – “we would end up in an Employment Tribunal”. I know a fair bit about employment law and it was clear to me that a Compromise Agreement, including a confidentiality clause, had already been signed. Neither the Club nor those dismissed will be disclosing the reasons. NC said that if he had wanted to get rid of AP for any performance reason he would have done it over the summer and had a replacement ready. He was obviously aghast that his commitment to management stability had to be set aside. It wasn’t raised but the fact that another two staff were dismissed must mean that all three were involved in whatever the misdemeanour was.

 

 

NC confirmed that he expects the new manger to be capable of taking us right up to the Premiership and whoever is appointed will have to demonstrate their ability to manage at that level. He emphasised that the ability to manage in the Premiership does not mean that the person appointed will already have done that job previously. He had been astonished at the number and calibre of people who applied or expressed interest via their agents or solicitors, including two “serving” premiership managers and lots from the championship. By contrast, when he arrived he had to go knocking on doors to get anyone to apply. He expected an appointment to be made “very soon”. He warned us to be ready for lots of stories from those who had never been offered the post claiming they had turned it down etc. and lots of other speculation and untrue stories in the press.

 

It seems clear that hard nosed negotiations are going on with S****horpe over compensation. This is one smart businessman who won’t be wasting the Club’s money on sweetheart deals – on players or managers. I’m not sure whether to laugh or cry at the fans on this site who swallowed what S****horpe were saying to the press and blaming NC for the delay. Quite ridiculous that our fans back S****horpe rather than Saints in these negotiations.

 

 

On the media, many of us made the point that NC should make more effort to get his views across. If all the fans had heard what we did, all but the most cynical would be very satisfied with the decisions he has taken and his plans for the future. On the Echo, which anyone who has had any dealings with it know has only a passing and occasional relationship with the truth, NC said he has no problems with any of their reporters - “only one man”. No names mentioned but there was a knowing laugh when I offered the name of the Editor. He is adamant that he will not spend time putting right every untruth and correcting every error – “it would be a full time job”. He is obviously convinced that the proof of the pudding will be in the eating and doesen't care much about what was written about him in the meantime. Some of us argued that he was damaging his reputation and that specific concerns of the fans do need addressing, perhaps by using the broadcast media where his words can’t be twisted. He accepted that he had been too quite over the summer and said that a radio fans forum was being organised.

 

 

The revised planning application for Staplewood was in hand and work should start before the end of the year.

 

He said that he did not involve himself in the manager role but he was accountable to him (NC) so there would always be times when questions would be raised. For example, it had become clear in July that the players were unfit and they are still not in the right condition, “a disgrace after the amount spent on pre-season”. He was also critical of how many similar injuries we have suffered.

 

Les Reed is not involved with managing the first team – that was purely the manger’s role. Les was in charge of non-first team coaching, the Development Centre, scouting, medical support etc. It is obvious these are two very separate roles, both reporting to NC.

 

On player recruitment, the manager tells NC what positions he needs to strengthen, NC sets the budget, Les Reed and his scouts come up with suggestions and the manager alone decides who is recruited, subject to budget. This all seemed very clear and sensible.

 

 

He hopes that by the time the Club is in the Premiership, 50% of the players will have been raised though the ranks of the Club. I think that’s overly ambitious but it’s certainly an admirable ambition. He was clearly unhappy that other clubs, including Chelsea, were very active in scouting in the Southampton area “Charlie Austin should have been playing for us on Saturday”.

 

 

NC will appoint the new manger alone. He has sought he views of Les Reid – who coached most of the likely applicants through their badges and knows them all. He laughed at the Echo’s notion that Les Reid was the “Kingmaker”. A short list is in place.

 

 

NC was very conscious of the “unacceptable match day catering”. Part of the problem with the stadium specification which was cut back to reduce costs and there were physical constraints. There are lots of other problems with the stadium because no money had been spent on it since it was opened. PA system, screens etc all needed replacing and will be.

New smartcard ticket system on the way but costs nearly £2million – seems unduly high to me. This will allow for cashless purchasing and a return to easy payment season tickets. There was a big problem with the previous system where 300 out of 1000 or so direct debits were reneged on while the tickets continued to be used.

 

When they took over, he was surrounded by ex directors, players, sponsors and other hangers on who all wanted something for nothing e.g. former players who wanted to be paid £70k a year to be “ambassadors” - to which NC’s response was “fine, if you bring in £200k”. He has cut down Saints presence in the Board Room hospitality to eight - and has now told away teams they too must restrict their numbers. This was one of mnay examples of how costs are being cut.

 

 

NC was pretty convincing on ticket pricing policy as a whole. He explained that for cup games visiting teams had power to veto any cut price offers. Interesting debate on letting children in for very little while other children are paying lots more via season tickets. I rather agreed with him that it was very difficult to strike the right balance.

 

 

Re complaints from fans and others about having to pay to parking at the stadium, we had been loosing £150,000 a year on parking, including lots who simply used it to commute into town. It was argued by one of us that it was unfair that the keenest fans that paid lots to go to away matches were now having to pay to park at the stadium as well. The parking system doesn’t , apparently, have the ability to differentiate between these fans and other parkers. Another of us pointed out that fans could park for free at Fleming Park at Eastleigh and catch the bus from there.

 

 

Lots of positive interest from NC in community engagement – he invited one of us to meet with the relevant staff to discuss her ideas.

 

 

He has recruited from UEFA someone who used to market the Champions League to revitalise the Saints sponsorship and marketing operation. We will appoint a new main sponsor. Flybe received more in free tickets etc than what they paid in sponsorship!

 

 

NC was very convincing that the strategy of investing £millions up front to get to the premiership will survive Marcus’s passing. I pressed him on why a Swiss family would be interested in an obscure third level club and he basically replied that he was pretty much part of the family! He was flying out to Switzerland the next day to take part in the family discussion on the future of the main company itself. We will see what happens but there are no grounds for believing that the five year plan has been endangered by Marcus’s passing. Cortese is the only link now, however. Those who criticise him, usually but not always, through crass ignorance, need to be careful for what they wish for.

 

 

NC explained that they had considered buying a Premiership Club but were put off by how much would have to be paid to pay of the debts and cover the cost of their expensive assets. With Saints, the cost was much cheaper, leaving more to invest to get the Club up the divisions.

 

 

All in all, it was a very informative and enjoyable evening. In my view, Cortese deserves our full support, not only for his part in saving the club but for now running it in a highly professional manner, single mindedly set on taking us bac .

 

Very very revealing. It well and truly does seem to be a case of 'In Cortese we trust.'

 

On the basis here, so be it.

[RonManager]

Fantastic post - Where did it come from?

 

I have ZERO clue why Pards got the boot now. If anyone knows, please PM me!

 

It is a post on the Echo website, from the comments section of the match thread, posted at about 5.20 pm which should help you find it. It was posted by a chap or chappess known as F Fan. It looks like it has been cut short "set on taking us bac ." but that is how it ends on the original post.

 

As a (partial) academic I understand the importance of acknowledging one's sources.

 

Yours piously and holier than thou - ly,

Ron.

[Saints foreva]

That sounds very promising.

[moon monkey]

The reading makes the sacking of Pardew, Downes and Murdoch all that more interesting.

[torsaint]

Don Corteose rides free again. I look forward to one of these every time the new movie comes out.

[kpturner]

This is very lengthy, but worth the read. Very revealing.

Well written too which makes a change....apart from saying "loosing" when he/she meant "losing"

 

A similar (poorly written) piece: http://boards.footymad.net/forum.php?tno=479&fid=224&sty=2&act=1&mid=2120208945

[Saint Fan CaM]

We are extremely lucky to have NC around to look after the clubs affairs. He seems to be a very motivated and motivational character. I just hope he can secure the right 1st team Manager asap.

[dune]

We are extremely lucky to have NC around to look after the clubs affairs.

 

He has hardly showered himself in glory so far. Personally I think he's acted incompetently far too many times to consider him good at his job. I just hope that him having to go cap in hand to The Sun has brought him down a peg or two and he learns from what must have been a hard pill to swallow.

[NickG]

it makes sense, rather than the rumours that he was going to sack Pardew due to performance in summer but decided to wiat until 3 games in and after an away win!

[dubai_phil]

it makes sense, rather than the rumours that he was going to sack Pardew due to performance in summer but decided to wiat until 3 games in and after an away win!

 

To be honest, anyone who reads the media or this site with an open mind would have worked out that NC was either a complete fool or something had happened to make him act the way he did with AP.

 

But then, most of the open minds left ages ago so just a few of us left who aren't surprised.

 

I liked the detail anout the freebies and hangers on, Flybe got more tickets that the value of the sponsorship and the rest. No wonder so many moan or leak negativity about the club or NC.

 

We shall see what happens in the next day or so on the manager front. Maybe I'll rant and call him an idiot, maybe I won't, but the fact is he met with fans (heck even technically uberfans) and told it from the heart.

 

Still think he's a c*ck though - why hasn't he invited us expats back for dinner?

 

What a night that would be TT, Alps, Window Cleaner, Ohio, EoA, Suewhistle & some of our down-under heroes fighting off the jet lag from a day trip.....

Heck, even Viking Warrior from his tiny rock could get down in a rowing boat for that one! and we could get some of the Swedes down, we'd have fun lol'ing about some of the Turnips on here

[alpine_saint]

This is very lengthy, but worth the read. Very revealing.

 

Fascinating, truly fascinating.

 

And a real pity that he hadnt taken the opportunity to speak out to the great fan base earlier.

 

30% of our ST installment payers defaulted - quite disgusting and shameful. Wonder how those who condemned NC for dropping the scheme feel now ?

Edited 14 September, 2010 by alpine_saint
As a mark of respect.

[sadoldgit]

I get the flesh pressing and the PR initiative and it obviously did the trick on those fortunate enough to be granted an audience.

 

I would say though that the people at the others clubs would expect their fans to believe their version of events as much as NC expects ours to.

 

We don't seem to have much cash at the moment so I can see why we would be stalling on compensation.

 

I am also confused.

 

He is saying that Les Reed's set up has nothing to do with the 1st team yet in the piece on the OS it seemed like it was all supposed to be linked? I am sure something was lost in translation.

 

Still, at least somone seems to have told him to sharpen up his act as far as the fans are concerned, so no bad thing.

[sadoldgit]

To be honest, anyone who reads the media or this site with an open mind would have worked out that NC was either a complete fool or something had happened to make him act the way he did with AP.

 

But then, most of the open minds left ages ago so just a few of us left who aren't surprised.

 

I liked the detail anout the freebies and hangers on, Flybe got more tickets that the value of the sponsorship and the rest. No wonder so many moan or leak negativity about the club or NC.

 

We shall see what happens in the next day or so on the manager front. Maybe I'll rant and call him an idiot, maybe I won't, but the fact is he met with fans (heck even technically uberfans) and told it from the heart.

 

Still think he's a c*ck though - why hasn't he invited us expats back for dinner?

 

What a night that would be TT, Alps, Window Cleaner, Ohio, EoA, Suewhistle & some of our down-under heroes fighting off the jet lag from a day trip.....

Heck, even Viking Warrior from his tiny rock could get down in a rowing boat for that one!

 

There is still time Phil!!!

[RonManager]

Still think he's a c*ck though - why hasn't he invited us expats back for dinner?

 

Coz he wouldn't get a word in edgeways.

[Lymsaint]

This is very lengthy, but worth the read. Very revealing.

 

This should be up as a Sticky.....to few board members have read this overview in my opinion.

[georgeweahscousin]

What will the Cortese knockers do now?

 

Very good post and in my opinion a lot of our so called "fans" have been backing the wrong horse.

 

Let's let NC sit back and do is job now.

[iansums]

Absolutely fascinating report on the Cortese meeting. It answers a lot of questions. NC is clearly running the football club as a sound business, quite unusual in this industry.

[doddisalegend]

What will the Cortese knockers do now?

 

Very good post and in my opinion a lot of our so called "fans" have been backing the wrong horse.

 

Let's let NC sit back and do is job now.

 

 

Oh FFS it is possible to be a supporter of Southampton football club and not agree with everything NC does. I love the way the world is so black and white to people on here no dergrees of grey you're either an NC supporter and everything he does is wonderful or your NC hater and everything he does is terrible. Funnily enough I have no major feeling about NC one way or another I'll take each desicion he takes on merit and if I don't agree I'll say so doesn't mean I want the club to crash and burn.

[SaintRichmond]

Taken from the "synopsis" of the Cortese meeting

 

Read this short sentance and read it well

 

Cortese is the only link now, however. Those who criticise him, usually but not always, through crass ignorance, need to be careful for what they wish for.

 

He may be SFC No 1

His manner may not go down with everybody

His decisions may not please everybody

 

But, he is basically the same as us, with the same feelings

 

There is nothing wrong with Constructive criticism

 

But surely the last thing we want now is to drive him away ?????

[Charlie Wayman]

Nobody gave him a tough time 'though. What happened to the seacrching questions that make people squirm in their chairs. Invite 15, they feel special, sell them the 'poor me' routine and off they go, pleased as punch! Works every time.

 

Go along and listen by all means but make sure you shove your tongue up your cheek and not elsewhere.

[Fowllyd]

Nobody gave him a tough time 'though. What happened to the seacrching questions that make people squirm in their chairs. Invite 15, they feel special, sell them the 'poor me' routine and off they go, pleased as punch! Works every time.

 

Go along and listen by all means but make sure you shove your tongue up your cheek and not elsewhere.

 

Ever thought of changing your user name to Frank Sinatra?

[The Kraken]

Taken from the "synopsis" of the Cortese meeting

 

Read this short sentance and read it well

 

Cortese is the only link now, however. Those who criticise him, usually but not always, through crass ignorance, need to be careful for what they wish for.

 

He may be SFC No 1

His manner may not go down with everybody

His decisions may not please everybody

 

But, he is basically the same as us, with the same feelings

 

There is nothing wrong with Constructive criticism

 

But surely the last thing we want now is to drive him away ?????

 

Drive him away?

 

Cortese is very ruthless in business; he started this project with long term plans; he started this project with his long term close friend; his close friend has since passed away, leaving the legacy of SFC solely to Cortese.

 

If you really think for for just a second that he is even slightly bothered by the rantings of a minority of disgruntled anonymous faces an an internet message board, I think you might seriously have misjudged his character.

 

And as you say, constructive criticism is fine, and in my opinion to be encouraged. The majority of us are able to look at club decisions on an individual basis and judge them on their own merits.

[fish fingers]

Nobody gave him a tough time 'though. What happened to the seacrching questions that make people squirm in their chairs. Invite 15, they feel special, sell them the 'poor me' routine and off they go, pleased as punch! Works every time.

 

Go along and listen by all means but make sure you shove your tongue up your cheek and not elsewhere.

 

You still here?

[dubai_phil]

Nobody gave him a tough time 'though. What happened to the seacrching questions that make people squirm in their chairs. Invite 15, they feel special, sell them the 'poor me' routine and off they go, pleased as punch! Works every time.

 

Go along and listen by all means but make sure you shove your tongue up your cheek and not elsewhere.

 

Such as?

 

What questions would you have asked seeing as you know so much more about the Dark Side?

[iansums]

Such as?

 

What questions would you have asked seeing as you know so much more about the Dark Side?

 

Apparently CW was invited but got a bit confused and ended up at the Emirates stadium.

[Toadhall Saint]

Apparently CW was invited but got a bit confused and ended up at the Emirates stadium.

 

Where he is best suited if you ask me.

[Daren W]

Fascinating, truly fascinating.

 

And a real pity that he hadnt taken the opportunity to speak out to the great fan base earlier.

 

30% of our ST installment payers defaulted - quite disgusting and shameful. Wonder how Daren W feels now ?

 

How do I feel? I feel disgusted, anyone would, that's not the issue.

Did half season ticket holders default? Oh no, they paid in full.

Did the club not promise to uphold those payment options? Yes they did

Did the club not give fans no time whatsoever to find the funds to pay for their season tcikets? They they did.

Did you, quite disgustingly and shamefully, berate fans for not being able to magic £400 out of they backsides for tickets and lecture them about managing their finances? Yes you did.

Those are the issues...

 

Don't try and paint me as some deluded irrational anti Corteseite as I am not. I'm simply someone who has the balls to point out if something's wrong rather than bury my head in the sand and not question things.

 

How do I feel? I feel that if Nicola Cortes makes a wrong decision I will say something. When he makes a right decision I will say something.

 

What I will say is that despite the fact I'm grieving and in absolute pain, I won't rise to the bait and seek an argument...

 

That's what I feel....

[saintjay77]

Taken from the "synopsis" of the Cortese meeting

 

Read this short sentance and read it well

 

Cortese is the only link now, however. Those who criticise him, usually but not always, through crass ignorance, need to be careful for what they wish for.

 

He may be SFC No 1

His manner may not go down with everybody

His decisions may not please everybody

 

But, he is basically the same as us, with the same feelings

 

There is nothing wrong with Constructive criticism

 

But surely the last thing we want now is to drive him away ?????

 

TBF that comment was made by the guy who went and not by NC himself. It sounds like he is saying that we have actually got something good here and to drive him out would be a mistake as we could end up with allot worse.

 

It doesnt actually say NC is ready to pack his bags if the abuse carrys on.

 

I think NC's biggest mistakes so far have all been about comunication. No doubt that there will be some and sometimes many that disagee with some decissions but leaving the comunication to a minimum or letting those with there noses out of joint break the news only snowballs against him.

 

Re the ticket plan, he could have made a statement saying the old system costs as 30% dont bother to pay and they are trying to bring in the swipte card system to stop that happening. They have failed to get that installed in time so for 1 year will have to go without the payment plan.

 

They could have then installed a quarterly season ticket for this year where people can buy a block of tickets to make it a little easier.

 

Letting the press run riot with whats going on and letting us lot make our own minds up blew it all out of proportion.

 

Maybe he has learnt his lesson on that but time will tell.

[alpine_saint]

How do I feel? I feel disgusted, anyone would, that's not the issue.

Did half season ticket holders default? Oh no, they paid in full.

Did the club not promise to uphold those payment options? Yes they did

Did the club not give fans no time whatsoever to find the funds to pay for their season tcikets? They they did.

Did you, quite disgustingly and shamefully, berate fans for not being able to magic £400 out of they backsides for tickets and lecture them about managing their finances? Yes you did.Those are the issues...

 

Don't try and paint me as some deluded irrational anti Corteseite as I am not. I'm simply someone who has the balls to point out if something's wrong rather than bury my head in the sand and not question things.

 

How do I feel? I feel that if Nicola Cortes makes a wrong decision I will say something. When he makes a right decision I will say something.

 

What I will say is that despite the fact I'm grieving and in absolute pain, I won't rise to the bait and seek an argument...

 

That's what I feel....

 

That's quite a distortion of the truth you've come out with there, Daren. But forget it, you have bigger things on your plate at the moment.

 

My sincerest sympathies, btw.

[The Kraken]

TBF that comment was made by the guy who went and not by NC himself. It sounds like he is saying that we have actually got something good here and to drive him out would be a mistake as we could end up with allot worse.

 

It doesnt actually say NC is ready to pack his bags if the abuse carrys on.

 

I think NC's biggest mistakes so far have all been about comunication. No doubt that there will be some and sometimes many that disagee with some decissions but leaving the comunication to a minimum or letting those with there noses out of joint break the news only snowballs against him.

 

Re the ticket plan, he could have made a statement saying the old system costs as 30% dont bother to pay and they are trying to bring in the swipte card system to stop that happening. They have failed to get that installed in time so for 1 year will have to go without the payment plan.

 

They could have then installed a quarterly season ticket for this year where people can buy a block of tickets to make it a little easier.

 

Letting the press run riot with whats going on and letting us lot make our own minds up blew it all out of proportion.

 

Maybe he has learnt his lesson on that but time will tell.

 

Agree completely.

 

I think a huge majority of the fan base would have accepted the many changes we have had at face value if the club had simply communicated them better, or not suddenly gone back on previous promises with no warning given. The removal of half season tickets and payment plans, while both coming completely out of the blue, also totally reversed the club's decisions in their own supporters' charter. If you're going to bring out such a document in the first place then you have a responsibility to either abide by the principles you've laid out, or provide sufficient communication that the policies are changing. The club did neither.

 

Cortese has said he hates dealing with the press; that's fair eenough, and no-one can argue that in this country we've got amongst the worst press in the world. However, he simply has to learn that shutting everything out except his own internal Ofiicial Site will not do the club any favours in the long term. I hate to say it, but Redknapp is a complete master at manipulating the press to suit his own needs. Cortese is a very clever guy and can surely learn to do the same, albeit in a much more classy and understated way.

[Joensuu]

A week ago Cortese could do no right, and the 'pro' Cortese posters (like myself) were suggesting that we should judge his actions on their merits, and criticise constructively.

 

Now, in the light of the new information the 'anti' Cortese posters have now started to argue the same thing, but they seem to be trying to make out that the 'pro' Cortese group are still somehow suggesting that Cortese is above criticism. We're not. Don't try to undermine the argument with a straw dummy. We are still saying Cortese should be judged rationally, that he should be criticised where he has made mistakes, and that we shouldn't leap to conclusions without evidence.

 

As such, my position on Cortese has not been changed at all this week, I still see him as someone very professional, who has made few mistakes, but who should be rightly criticised if he has definately messed up (of which I have seen no evidence). I will continue to criticise him over the ticket booking fee (just add an extra £3 to the cost of the ticket and be done with it), and on his photographer ban (the reversal of which demonstrates that Cortese is willing to back down, he's willing to acknowledge when he has made a mistake, and is willing to try out different ideas).

[dune]

I will continue to criticise him over the ticket booking fee.

 

So will I.

[The Kraken]

Joensuu; simple question for you. Why do you categorise fans as either "pro-Cortese" or "anti-Cortese"?

 

Your last paragraph makes reference to it, but I think it needs pointing out again that many of us are completely neutral to him as an individual and are more than capable of judging each of his decisions on an individual basis. At the moment I, like many people, think he has presided over a number of good decisions (Pardew and coaching staff in at that time, Adkins now, Lou Reed and the development centre etc), and also over a number of poor decisions (lack of communication over ST renewals, payment plan, half-season tickets). I wouldn't even be able to tell youy if I was pro or anti the man, I can only comment on the decisions he has made for the club.

[iansums]

A week ago Cortese could do no right, and the 'pro' Cortese posters (like myself) were suggesting that we should judge his actions on their merits, and criticise constructively.

 

Now, in the light of the new information the 'anti' Cortese posters have now started to argue the same thing, but they seem to be trying to make out that the 'pro' Cortese group are still somehow suggesting that Cortese is above criticism. We're not. Don't try to undermine the argument with a straw dummy. We are still saying Cortese should be judged rationally, that he should be criticised where he has made mistakes, and that we shouldn't leap to conclusions without evidence.

 

As such, my position on Cortese has not been changed at all this week, I still see him as someone very professional, who has made few mistakes, but who should be rightly criticised if he has definately messed up (of which I have seen no evidence). I will continue to criticise him over the ticket booking fee (just add an extra £3 to the cost of the ticket and be done with it), and on his photographer ban (the reversal of which demonstrates that Cortese is willing to back down, he's willing to acknowledge when he has made a mistake, and is willing to try out different ideas).

 

Agree with much of what you say apart from this. As someone else pointed out many people buy 'batches' of tickets on-line i.e. if you buy 5 tickets there is still just a £3 booking fee. What you suggest would mean an extra £15 for 5 tickets. this would in effect be a 10% (ish) rise in ticket prices.

Edited 14 September, 2010 by iansums
add bold

[Joensuu]

Joensuu; simple question for you. Why do you categorise fans as either "pro-Cortese" or "anti-Cortese"?

 

Your last paragraph makes reference to it, but I think it needs pointing out again that many of us are completely neutral to him as an individual and are more than capable of judging each of his decisions on an individual basis. At the moment I, like many people, think he has presided over a number of good decisions (Pardew and coaching staff in at that time, Adkins now, Lou Reed and the development centre etc), and also over a number of poor decisions (lack of communication over ST renewals, payment plan, half-season tickets). I wouldn't even be able to tell youy if I was pro or anti the man, I can only comment on the decisions he has made for the club.

 

I categorise myself as 'pro', simply because I seemed to be in a tiny minority who were defending him over the past fortnight. As such, I assume, I am more willing to give Cortese the benefit of the doubt than most seem to be. I don't know the guy, I don't know the reason behind his decisions, but so far I like what I hear, I like the decisions he is making, I like the way he seems to be bringing a professional edge to the role. As such, I consider myself to be 'pro' Cortese.

 

Perhaps you're right, and I should no longer consider myself to be 'pro'. But, when you find yourself consistantly agreeing with something, you tend to naturally consider yourself to be 'pro' that thing. As a neutral, at what point would you consider yourself to have become 'pro' or 'anti' something? Lets say, this some group has made 20 decisions, you support 13 of them, are neutral on 4, and object to 3 of them, are you still neutral, or have you crossed to becoming broadly pro? You can be simulaniously 'pro' and critical over some of the decsions. Acknowedging that you agree with someone over most things, doenst mean you can't criticise (constructively), over some of their decsions you are less happy with.

[St_Tel49]

Well done you've just made him sound like some sort of nut job. I feel rather worried having read that.

Here we go again. Someone posts some stuff and immediately it gets treated like it was gospel and NC is a nut job.

[Dibden Purlieu Saint]

This is very lengthy, but worth the read. Very revealing.

 

Well shut my mouth on Cortese. Very, VERY positive news.

 

Good lad.

[The Kraken]

I categorise myself as 'pro', simply because I seemed to be in a tiny minority who were defending him over the past fortnight. As such, I assume, I am more willing to give Cortese the benefit of the doubt than most seem to be. I don't know the guy, I don't know the reason behind his decisions, but so far I like what I hear, I like the decisions he is making, I like the way he seems to be bringing a professional edge to the role. As such, I consider myself to be 'pro' Cortese.

 

Perhaps you're right, and I should no longer consider myself to be 'pro'. But, when you find yourself consistantly agreeing with something, you tend to naturally consider yourself to be 'pro' that thing. As a neutral, at what point would you consider yourself to have become 'pro' or 'anti' something? Lets say, this some group has made 20 decisions, you support 13 of them, are neutral on 4, and object to 3 of them, are you still neutral, or have you crossed to becoming broadly pro? You can be simulaniously 'pro' and critical over some of the decsions. Acknowedging that you agree with someone over most things, doenst mean you can't criticise (constructively), over some of their decsions you are less happy with.

 

I guess there just seems to be such a demarcation between "pro" and "anti"; it's probably the fault of this site, I see the lables thrown around so often that it's used as a divisive accusation. A bit like "Lowe luvvies", where you couldn't avoid being associated with this moniker if you even dared to agree with just one of Lowe's better decisions. i just think its too easy for some to use the lables in order to try and "win" a petty internet argument than it is to actually debate the real issues. Your stance on Cortese is actually probably consistent with the majority of people who can see the situation rationally; I just find it needless to separate fans into pro and anti factions.

[Joensuu]

 

Agree with much of what you say apart from this. As someone else pointed out many people buy 'batches' of tickets on-line i.e. if you buy 5 tickets there is still just a £3 booking fee. What you suggest would mean an extra £15 for 5 tickets. this would in effect be a 10% (ish) rise in ticket prices.

 

Good point. I agree with you there.

 

I just hate 'additional fees', especially the ubiquitous 'booking fee' surcharge (as such I'll never fly Ryanair). I like all costs to be kept simple.

 

I don't understand why it's £3 in advance (phone/web), but £2 on the day (via ticket office). Surely the processing time is similar? Is it postage fees? Anyhow, I'm going off topic. I'm not slating Cortese over this, I don't consider it to be a mistake, just I always get annoyed whenever anything has addtional fees attached. All I want is to be told the cost, and pay the price, without someone then saying that there is a 'transaction surcharge' or something.

[iansums]

Good point. I agree with you there.

 

I just hate 'additional fees', especially the ubiquitous 'booking fee' surcharge (as such I'll never fly Ryanair). I like all costs to be kept simple.

 

I don't understand why it's £3 in advance (phone/web), but £2 on the day (via ticket office). Surely the processing time is similar? Is it postage fees? Anyhow, I'm going off topic. I'm not slating Cortese over this, I don't consider it to be a mistake, just I always get annoyed whenever anything has addtional fees attached. All I want is to be told the cost, and pay the price, without someone then saying that there is a 'transaction surcharge' or something.

 

I take it you havn't been to the US where they don't display their sales tax, bloody annoying.