SFC Announcement

[S-Clarke]

I hope they leave it as it is, reporting the truth not our embarrassing fingers-in-ears-not-listening denial of everything.

 

....+1

[waggy]

Why are we saying that the reports are misleading? The fact that scunny have said we're hard to deal with is backed up throughout football.

 

I have no idea what Cortese is doing.

 

exactly, so stop trying to second guess him and let the guy get on with trying to run our club. If you wanna believe hear say from other sources so be it.

[sandwichsaint]

exactly, so stop trying to second guess him and let the guy get on with trying to ruin our club. If you wanna believe hear say from other sources so be it.

 

Corrected it for you.

[The9]

exactly, so stop trying to second guess him and let the guy get on with trying to run our club. If you wanna believe hear say from other sources so be it.

 

Yeah, cos of course Scvnthorpe's chairman had a huge problem with Saints before this week and he's making stuff up to make us look bad...

 

Hearsay my ar5e.

[dubai_phil]

Well, shouldn't let our brains get in the way of analysing what has been going on over the past week.

 

I'm with colinjb on this.

 

50 something applicants. A number have been interviewed, possibly 5 maybe more

 

Each time someone has been interviewed, the media and the bookies have used Old Style football speak to shoot off one and scoop everyone else with the news that X will be the new manager. All done to sell papers. (How many extra Echo copies got sold yesterday?)

 

It seemed clear that Adkins (as was Brown) was one on the list.

 

The Media just decided that the Adkins interview (because it was done PROFESSIONALLY - ie permission was asked) was actually an appointment. They are shown as being really dumb, NC seems to do things his way, the media assumed the whole Brown Envelope smoke and fire circus was continuing.

 

My guess? Adkins was told the club were interested, they would talk to other candidates and get back to him. Wharton then shoots off (rightly) buggers ain't offered nuffink - true because only the Echo believed we had made him an actual OFFER.

 

NC sails happily on to his next one two or three interviews as a firestorm breaks.

 

Doesn't absolve NC from being naive or even being the DBP source of all evil. Just think it is FUNNY in a "self harm oh bugger didn't mean to cut myself there sort of way"

[Norm]

Sorry Norm not meant the way it came across - what I was trying to say is I'll beleive my club before S****horpe

 

Thanks and I'm sorry for 'firing' back.

[Raging Bull]

Well, shouldn't let our brains get in the way of analysing what has been going on over the past week.

 

I'm with colinjb on this.

 

50 something applicants. A number have been interviewed, possibly 5 maybe more

 

Each time someone has been interviewed, the media and the bookies have used Old Style football speak to shoot off one and scoop everyone else with the news that X will be the new manager. All done to sell papers. (How many extra Echo copies got sold yesterday?)

 

It seemed clear that Adkins (as was Brown) was one on the list.

 

The Media just decided that the Adkins interview (because it was done PROFESSIONALLY - ie permission was asked) was actually an appointment. They are shown as being really dumb, NC seems to do things his way, the media assumed the whole Brown Envelope smoke and fire circus was continuing.

 

My guess? Adkins was told the club were interested, they would talk to other candidates and get back to him. Wharton then shoots off (rightly) buggers ain't offered nuffink - true because only the Echo believed we had made him an actual OFFER.

 

NC sails happily on to his next one two or three interviews as a firestorm breaks.

 

Doesn't absolve NC from being naive or even being the DBP source of all evil. Just think it is FUNNY in a "self harm oh bugger didn't mean to cut myself there sort of way"

 

If only evereyone this type of mature rational

[buctootim]

Yeah, cos of course Scvnthorpe's chairman had a huge problem with Saints before this week and he's making stuff up to make us look bad...

 

Hearsay my ar5e.

 

If you actually read his statement he said he didnt actually know what was going on and was going into the ground to find out. Still dont let that stop you in a good old rant about our club.

[yorkiesaint]

Well unfortunately NC has brought this upon himself by toying with the media. They, like certain members of this forum, are just waiting for any chance to hang him out to dry. It's making it all too easy for Wharton, who has got away with a personal attack on NC. For all we know Wharton may be demanding the earth.

[greg_hill]

Just get on with it. Wilkins may be a very good coach but he is clearly no good even as a caretaker manager. I don't want us dropping more points this weekend and then reading all the usual, tired platitudes next week. Time is points.

[OldNick]

Yeah, cos of course Scvnthorpe's chairman had a huge problem with Saints before this week and he's making stuff up to make us look bad...

 

Hearsay my ar5e.

 

the9, you are normally the voice of reason! have you been taken over by an alien?

[derry]

What a load of crap is being spouted by supporters, press and especially the loose mouthed S****horpe chairman. What do we really know about Nicola Cortese? not a lot is the answer.

Yet a lot of people are casting judgement. One thing we do know about him is that he allows no publicity, leaks etc and NOTHING is put out until every i and t is dotted and crossed.

 

Whatever has come out about the candidates, has come from them or their associates certainly not from SFC. The statement on the OS is professional and rebutts every accusation simply. If the ante was being raised over compensation it wouldn't be the first time, if it was an attempt by his chairman to manipulate the situation to keep him it will backfire in the fullness of time. SFC know he is under contract and that there is a liability for compensation. If Adkins breaks his contract he is liable, if his employer agrees compensation and SFC pay it the contract is terminated by agreement. Clearly Adkins isn't going to breach his contract but it could be that the value of the contract is less than the compensation being demanded. Clearly if SFC are prepared to settle the contract default figure, but are facing a demand that is greater than the contract value, it would not be unreasonable to expect Adkin to resign and then settle the outstanding contract liability. If he was not prepared to do this it would also be reasonable to look elsewhere.

 

In the light of his publicity I would be surprised if it was Brown. For me it could bring the likes of Sean O'Driscoll, Eddie Howe, Lee Clarke or Paul Tisdale into the equation. I like Adkins and am disappointed by the unprofessional premature ejaculations from their end, but if it's it not going to be him, it's time to move on. One thing I feel certain of, is that Cortese doesn't do business in public and has no part in this.

Edited 9 September, 2010 by derry

[surrey1saint]

As has been said before,all the premature reports are just that....maybe they have screwed Adkins chances now.

[The9]

Oh come on, no-one was jumping the gun - with the noises coming out of Scunny, Adkins was ours save for agreeing compensation.

 

Now there's no guarantee there aren't other people in the same boat as implied on the OS, but it's a pretty sharty way to conduct business, to line up all the candidates at the last stage - where they're asked to resign, for instance, and then write off all but one of them.

 

Of course if the "still looking" story is true, and we would have had to have been at that late stage for ALL applicants, then we'll be appointing someone TODAY won't we ? If not, the OS statement is utter crap.

 

But I think we know that it's utter crap already, TBH.

[trousers]

Sounds to me like Cortese slept on his decision last night and woke with cold feet. Perhaps considers Adkins to risky and would prefer a 'bigger' name to make the immediate impact that the players would respond too.

 

You mean he was up late at night reading the views on this forum....? ;-)

[The9]

the9, you are normally the voice of reason! have you been taken over by an alien?

 

No, but the statement is completely at odds with what a chairman with no axe to grind previously has said.

[Deano6]

See this is what happens when people talk before it is confirmed by the club first. (See Echo issue on training ground and also that defender from Voventry as well). That means Phil brown is out as well as he blabbed on talk sport yesterday. So far MON and EH have been very silent on all fronts.

 

A certain J Mourinho has been very silent on all fronts too of late. Read into that what you will.

[OldNick]

Oh come on, no-one was jumping the gun - with the noises coming out of Scunny, Adkins was ours save for agreeing compensation.

 

Now there's no guarantee there aren't other people in the same boat as implied on the OS, but it's a pretty sharty way to conduct business, to line up all the candidates at the last stage - where they're asked to resign, for instance, and then write off all but one of them.

 

Of course if the "still looking" story is true, and we would have had to have been at that late stage for ALL applicants, then we'll be appointing someone TODAY won't we ? If not, the OS statement is utter crap.

 

But I think we know that it's utter crap already, TBH.

I suspect that NA was in poll position but i wouldn't side with the Scunny chairman before hearing our side. The OS statement was clear and cut down all the accusations. By recognising the fact that the manager was under contract and that the club accepted compensation was due pours scorn on the Scunny chairmans version IMO

[Jimmy_D]

I hope they leave it as it is, reporting the truth not our embarrassing fingers-in-ears-not-listening denial of everything.

 

I was arguing they should present both sides to let people make up their own mind.

 

Are you saying they should only present one side of it because you happen to believe that side and no one else should think any differently to you?

 

Idiot.

[buctootim]

No, but the statement is completely at odds with what a chairman with no axe to grind previously has said.

 

What a Chairman who knows hes about to lose a very good manager, wont be able to replace him and will likely get relegated as a result. That kind of '**** it i'll do what i can to disrupt the deal' kind of no axe to grind?

[OldNick]

No, but the statement is completely at odds with what a chairman with no axe to grind previously has said.

 

but as soon as we approached them to talk to his manager he may have had an axe to grind. i had no axe to grind with Spurs/Man City? Sunderland until they unsettled our managers in the past. The Scunny chairman has his own agenda and may have misread how to deal with NC

[The9]

I suspect that NA was in poll position but i wouldn't side with the Scunny chairman before hearing our side. The OS statement was clear and cut down all the accusations. By recognising the fact that the manager was under contract and that the club accepted compensation was due pours scorn on the Scunny chairmans version IMO

 

Other than the Scun Chairman saying "they don't think compo is due" and the comment about ultimatums, everything else ties in.

 

Given that its his and Adkins' word against Cortese's at that point, there's little point discussing it.

 

What I'm saying is that the OS statement is disingenuous as it completely ignores the advanced stage the Adkins discussions were at - so either he was the "leader" and we're backtracking and denying that's the case, or everyone under consideration is at the same stage, so they're all in compensation discussions or considering the offer, in which case there will be no further need for any delay in appointing the new manager.

 

If of course nothing happens regarding a new manager imminently, it's because we'd offered it to Adkins and Cortese threw a wobbler over compensation, which would be exactly in line with what S****horpe said.

[The9]

I was arguing they should present both sides to let people make up their own mind.

 

Are you saying they should only present one side of it because you happen to believe that side and no one else should think any differently to you?

 

Idiot.

 

I agree with your first sentence, though of course logical argument says the OS statement will be proven to be true or false within a few hours.

[Millbrook Saint]

How do we not know that we got permission to speak to Adkins from S****horpe, we then spoke to Adkins, Cortese told him what the job entailed his reposibilities, wages etc. Adkins agreed this was ok, then Cortese said we'll let you know. Adkins told the S****horpe chairman how the interview went, the chairman assumed it was a done deal and put it on the website, having a whinge that compensation hasn't been agreed when we hadn't even offered Adkins the job. All along Cortese may not have made a decision and is being slated for it.

[Fitzhugh Fella]

This latest statement has echoes of May's "Pardew is going nowhere" press release.

[The9]

If you actually read his statement he said he didnt actually know what was going on and was going into the ground to find out. Still dont let that stop you in a good old rant about our club.

 

He said "last he'd heard Saints had withdrawn".

[Jimmy_D]

Bearing in mind their chairman has been quoted as admitting he hasn't talked to Adkins yet, I think it might have gone something like this:

 

We ask for permission to talk to Adkins, which is granted.

 

We interview Adkins, and start preparing for the next candidate to be interviewed.

 

The media get wind that he's been interviewed, try to get a scoop and assume he's been appointed.

 

Their chairman, hearing in the media he's being appointed, and not having heard anything from us about compensation etc. assumes the worst and goes off on one to the media.

 

We release our statement.

[The9]

What a Chairman who knows hes about to lose a very good manager, wont be able to replace him and will likely get relegated as a result. That kind of '**** it i'll do what i can to disrupt the deal' kind of no axe to grind?

 

I'm assuming you don't feel they were due compensation then ?

 

If the deal was actually done then compensation would have been dealt with already and the chairman wouldn't have been able to stop it, and if it wasn't done, he wasn't losing a manager.

 

Nothing he said at that point would have stopped it other than asking for a stupid amount in compensation, which Adkins could have taken care of by resigning anyway.

 

The overall point is that the Saints OS has utterly whitewashed any of this even having happened and people are actually buying it !

[derry]

Other than the Scun Chairman saying "they don't think compo is due" and the comment about ultimatums, everything else ties in.

 

Given that its his and Adkins' word against Cortese's at that point, there's little point discussing it.

 

What I'm saying is that the OS statement is disingenuous as it completely ignores the advanced stage the Adkins discussions were at - so either he was the "leader" and we're backtracking and denying that's the case, or everyone under consideration is at the same stage, so they're all in compensation discussions or considering the offer, in which case there will be no further need for any delay in appointing the new manager.

 

If of course nothing happens regarding a new manager imminently, it's because we'd offered it to Adkins and Cortese threw a wobbler over compensation, which would be exactly in line with what S****horpe said.

 

His contract has a finite liability value as far as paying it off is concerned. If that value was exceeded by the figure demanded, resigning and paying off the liability would be one way to resolve the compensation issue. If Adkins wasn't prepared to resign, that's fine. If Cortese isn't prepared to exceed the contract value that's fine. We know the leaks came from their end and we know Cortese doesn't ever comment until the business is complete, so nothing should have come out until the deal was complete or not. That is the way Cortese works so for me in this case the criticism should be levelled at the real culprits.

[OldNick]

Other than the Scun Chairman saying "they don't think compo is due" and the comment about ultimatums, everything else ties in.

 

Given that its his and Adkins' word against Cortese's at that point, there's little point discussing it.

 

What I'm saying is that the OS statement is disingenuous as it completely ignores the advanced stage the Adkins discussions were at - so either he was the "leader" and we're backtracking and denying that's the case, or everyone under consideration is at the same stage, so they're all in compensation discussions or considering the offer, in which case there will be no further need for any delay in appointing the new manager.

 

If of course nothing happens regarding a new manager imminently, it's because we'd offered it to Adkins and Cortese threw a wobbler over compensation, which would be exactly in line with what S****horpe said.

 

I respectfully suggest that we ddint think the compensation he was asking was due, not that it was. The club statement says they accept compensation was due, unless there is a belief that the club is lying, something that i would never adhere to

[Jimmy_D]

Just realised I hadn't taken into account the compensation issue, but it still fits (maybe a bit better now).

 

 

We ask for permission to talk to Adkins, which is granted. During this the issue of compensation comes up, but we can't agree. They let us talk to him as the interview might convince us to pay what they want.

 

We interview Adkins, tell him we'll get back to him, and start preparing for the next candidate to be interviewed.

 

The media get wind that he's been interviewed, try to get a scoop and assume he's been appointed.

 

Their chairman, hearing in the media he's being appointed, and not having heard anything from us about compensation etc. assumes the worst because we couldn't agree compensation, and goes off on one to the media.

 

We release our statement.

[The9]

I'll be interested to see/hear if Adkins makes any comment, or ends up leaving Scvnthorpe anyway.

 

Jimmy_D's timeline makes sense - but the club statement is implying that this brinkmanship is standard in our practices, and that we had a number of other choices lined up in a similar advanced situation.

[del boy]

I've noticed one or two sensible posts creeping in here - can we get back to being Saints Web Forum please?

[alpine_saint]

Bored f**king sh*tless with the game playing.

 

Decide who can get us promoted and f**king pay out what he is worth, FFS.

[Saint Fan CaM]

I'll be interested to see/hear if Adkins makes any comment, or ends up leaving Scvnthorpe anyway.

 

Jimmy_D's timeline makes sense - but the club statement is implying that this brinkmanship is standard in our practices, and that we had a number of other choices lined up in a similar advanced situation.

 

So, you've not heard of the standard business practice of short-listing? And then short-listing again? Nothing to do with brinkmanship FFS - it's just normal practice to whittle the field down until you get the most suitable candidate. If NC feels he's being taken for a ride then he has every right to pull any offer, provisional or otherwise.

[acersaint]

I think Cortese is ace. All the rumour mongers go on a blood letting spree hanging him out to dry and what does he do? He soaks it all up and then at the opportune moment releases a statement and BLOWS everyone out of the water!! Masterful. Believe he is no mug so have a little faith!

[Saint Billy]

Sooooooooooooooooooo feckin tired of this now!

 

Anyone for an afternoon of jabbing matchsticks in our eyes, lots more fun.

[sebastian firefly]

Thanks and I'm sorry for 'firing' back.

 

get a room

[(not THE) Kevin Moore]

Yeah, cos of course Scvnthorpe's chairman had a huge problem with Saints before this week and he's making stuff up to make us look bad...

 

Hearsay my ar5e.

 

Neither is he an impartial commentator. He's trying to make cash for his club, and appears to have done so in a hamfisted fashion.

 

I guess your opinion on who to believe will be informed by whatever your opinion is of NC, if you have doubts about him you'll believe the negative slant put on it by Scunny, if you think NC is doing a good job you're more minded to believe the club statement.

 

For me, I think Scunnys chairman came across as a moron in his statement and my opinion has been informed largely by that. 'as I understand it' this and 'I'll find out more when I get to Glands-ford park' that.

[Nolan]

The Scun+horpe chairman doesn't have a problem? How about having to face the embarrassment of losing a manager to a club in a lower division? how often does that happen? how sh!t does that make his club look?

[Toomer]

I don't agree with some of the things Cortese has done, he may have reflected and looked at what has gone on over the ten years prior to his involvment with the club and thought I must get this appointment 100% correct. He decided that Adkins was not the man IHO to take the club forward.

[Toadhall Saint]

Neither is he an impartial commentator. He's trying to make cash for his club, and appears to have done so in a hamfisted fashion.

 

I guess your opinion on who to believe will be informed by whatever your opinion is of NC, if you have doubts about him you'll believe the negative slant put on it by Scunny, if you think NC is doing a good job you're more minded to believe the club statement.

 

For me, I think Scunnys chairman came across as a moron in his statement and my opinion has been informed largely by that. 'as I understand it' this and 'I'll find out more when I get to Glands-ford park' that.

 

Along with the "I haven't spoken to Nigel yet" but says we are hard to deal with, not sure if we are the right club for Nigel Blah Blah Blah. This forum has gone into melt down because their chairman has been speaking without being fully informed.

[Barry the Badger]

 

The overall point is that the Saints OS has utterly whitewashed any of this even having happened and people are actually buying it !

 

So hang on, you're saying it's ok for you to believe what the Chairman of S****horpe has said to the media, but it's not ok for somebody to believe what their own club have stated.

 

Personally, I think it's ridiculous that you are actually buying the whinging bleatings of the S****horpe chairman. Quite frankly he sounds like he has no idea what is happening.

 

It seems to me that he's trying to use the media to manipulate the situation in his clubs favour, but we aren't having any of it. Fine by me.

[Norm]

get a room

 

 

Seb, many thanks for your PM but I'm really past doing a threesome. So thanks but no thanks.

[ottery st mary]

What a load of crap is being spouted by supporters, press and especially the loose mouthed S****horpe chairman. What do we really know about Nicola Cortese? not a lot is the answer.

Yet a lot of people are casting judgement. One thing we do know about him is that he allows no publicity, leaks etc and NOTHING is put out until every i and t is dotted and crossed.

 

Whatever has come out about the candidates, has come from them or their associates certainly not from SFC. The statement on the OS is professional and rebutts every accusation simply. If the ante was being raised over compensation it wouldn't be the first time, if it was an attempt by his chairman to manipulate the situation to keep him it will backfire in the fullness of time. SFC know he is under contract and that there is a liability for compensation. If Adkins breaks his contract he is liable, if his employer agrees compensation and SFC pay it the contract is terminated by agreement. Clearly Adkins isn't going to breach his contract but it could be that the value of the contract is less than the compensation being demanded. Clearly if SFC are prepared to settle the contract default figure, but are facing a demand that is greater than the contract value, it would not be unreasonable to expect Adkin to resign and then settle the outstanding contract liability. If he was not prepared to do this it would also be reasonable to look elsewhere.

 

In the light of his publicity I would be surprised if it was Brown. For me it could bring the likes of Sean O'Driscoll, Eddie Howe, Lee Clarke or Paul Tisdale into the equation. I like Adkins and am disappointed by the unprofessional premature ejaculations from their end, but if it's it not going to be him, it's time to move on. One thing I feel certain of, is that Cortese doesn't do business in public and has no part in this.

 

 

You always make sense to me derry.........Well put old boy.....

[mikee]

Oh come on, no-one was jumping the gun - with the noises coming out of Scunny, Adkins was ours save for agreeing compensation.

 

Now there's no guarantee there aren't other people in the same boat as implied on the OS, but it's a pretty sharty way to conduct business, to line up all the candidates at the last stage - where they're asked to resign, for instance, and then write off all but one of them.

 

Of course if the "still looking" story is true, and we would have had to have been at that late stage for ALL applicants, then we'll be appointing someone TODAY won't we ? If not, the OS statement is utter crap.

 

But I think we know that it's utter crap already, TBH.

 

I love the way you say that no-one is jumping the gun amd then proceed to do just that.

 

If we approached S****horpe for permission to speak to Adkins would it not follow that Scunny would want to agree a compensation package BEFORE this permission would be granted.

 

Is it also not possible that Scunnny believed the media hype that Adkins was the favourite and therefore thought they held all the aces and could try it on with an unrealistic compensation package which we were not prepared to pay and therefore we move on with the other candidates.

 

Maybe the scunny chairman does not want to be accused of blocking Adkins opportunity and is now back tracking and trying to make out that we were being unreasonable.

 

Not saying any of this is true because we don't know for sure, but it is surely at least as plausible as your assumption.

 

If it was true then it is the scunny chairman who has jumped the gun by believing the media hype and thinking he was in a position of strength.