Cortese's biggest mistake: Forget Alan Pardew...

[Deppo]

What irritates me is the inference that everyone who doesn't praise and support Cortese completely is fickle or unintelligent.

 

Agreed. It should have been made more implicit.

[benjii]

Rationality usually is the first casualty when football fans discuss their clubs.

 

Yes, I agree.

 

And usually it is harmless fun. Bravado, outright lies ("Graham Potter would batter Ronaldo in a dribble-off" etc), banter etc... I just hope that a negative atmosphere doesn't take hold without real justification. There is no cause to fight at the moment. We are still in a good position relative to our immediate competitors. This is not a "Lowe out" situation. There is no short-term pain that needs to be felt for long-term gain. All IMO, but I still think we're on an upward trajectory.

Edited 1 September, 2010 by benjii

[dune]

His biggest mistake as far as i'm concerned was the £3 ticket tax because people don't like being ripped off.

[benjii]

What irritates me is the inference that everyone who doesn't praise and support Cortese completely is fickle or unintelligent.

 

I don't think that at all but I suspect that many of those who would abuse and crucify him based on unsubstantiated hearsay probably are.

[georgeweahscousin]

forget the faux-annoyance of some **** at The Sun...

forget the Plymouth Argus...

forget not being able to ram a filthy thermo-nuclear pie down your cake hole...

forget not being given interest free payment options (and having to arrange one yourself)...

forget match-day increases (not the only club, by the way)...

forget booking fees...

hell, even forget masterminding the entire resurrection of the club if you want...

 

no, I'll tell you what Cortese's biggest mistake has been:

 

Overestimating the intelligence of our fan base.

 

Clearly Cortese thinks we're sensible human beings. People who appreciate that things are seldom black and white. People who realise that you can't make an omelette without breaking some eggs. People who appreciate the complexities of life. People who understand that instant gratification is not available to everyone, and certainly not for free.

 

What one of his advisors needs to do is take him to one side, and have a quiet word:

 

"Nicola, many of these people are simple folk. They lack emotional maturity. They look for any excuse to get outraged. They need to feel part of something, as they are a bit empty. They have limited intellectual capacity for patience. They like to moan about a lack of success or ambition, yet woe-betide anyone who dares to exhibit a modicum of either. They like to be debased by anodyne platitudes and spoon-fed sickly pastry-pouches of attention. They want the best, for the least. They hate footballers, football, the Premier League, the opposition, the opposition fans, the ref, yet they want them all in abundance - the more consumable and digestible the better; they want to swallow it all, **** it out and eat it again with sugar on top. Just feed them a few lines now and again - they will lap it up".

 

Hallelujah.

[Winchester_Saint]

YEH!!! Hell to finding out anything that cruelly goes on at our club. Let's remain totally and utterly in the dark about every single part of it! Let's enjoy feeling totally and utterly detached!

 

I mean... What right do I have to have the faintest idea of what goes on at SFC? I only pay a weeks earnings to buy a season ticket and travel the length and breadth of the country to support our players... That gives me no right to know anything!

 

So for me Cortese, you just carry on with leaving us fans (who are this club, as without us, this club is precisely NOTHING) feeling completely and utterly detached from every single aspect of it.

 

Best in Class? SFC ate best in class at one thing, treating the fans like SH*T. I wasn't a Cortese basher, but the whole way this Pardew situation has been handled (going right back to when the echo were reporting he was under pressure) has absolutely stunk!

 

I no doubt he will pull a rabbit out of the hat and make some wonderous appointment, fooling me into thinking he is our messiah again, only to be reminded a few weeks or months down the line that the guy is a *****.

 

I don't want to feel like this, as I appreciate what his ambition is for us, but personally, I beginning to not want it. F*ck the premier league, just give me my club back.

 

This is a great post

[landford.saint]

I don't think that at all but I suspect that many of those who would abuse and crucify him based on unsubstantiated hearsay probably are.

 

Exactly.

[hughieslastminutegoal]

To be fair to Cortese, I am a "match-going" supporter and I think that most of our support are idiots.

 

How many do you know personally? Remember now, stick to the facts.

[S-Clarke]

I don't believe that as a fan base we should sit back and accept what we all feel are poor decisions.

 

We're not just talking about the timing of sacking Pards, there are plenty of other decisions that have been made in the past few months that are seriously questionable to say the least.

 

I have said before that i believe he has the interests of the club at heart, but he doesn't do things the right way and is a PR disaster. He has no experience of doing this and it's starting to show, as we all know - managing a football club is nothing like managing a bank.

[sperm_john]

I dissagree

[aintforever]

I agree, failure to understand football fans is definitely one of Cortese's problems. I wouldn't say it was his biggest though.

[benjii]

I dissagree

 

Furry muff!

[hughieslastminutegoal]

Agreed. It should have been made more implicit.

 

Ah, I see what you did there. The inference in an explicit post should have been more implicit. Very witty piece of sarcasm. You are a card.

[arfurdent]

forget the faux-annoyance of some **** at The Sun...

forget the Plymouth Argus...

forget not being able to ram a filthy thermo-nuclear pie down your cake hole...

forget not being given interest free payment options (and having to arrange one yourself)...

forget match-day increases (not the only club, by the way)...

forget booking fees...

hell, even forget masterminding the entire resurrection of the club if you want...

 

no, I'll tell you what Cortese's biggest mistake has been:

 

Overestimating the intelligence of our fan base.

 

Clearly Cortese thinks we're sensible human beings. People who appreciate that things are seldom black and white. People who realise that you can't make an omelette without breaking some eggs. People who appreciate the complexities of life. People who understand that instant gratification is not available to everyone, and certainly not for free.

 

What one of his advisors needs to do is take him to one side, and have a quiet word:

 

"Nicola, many of these people are simple folk. They lack emotional maturity. They look for any excuse to get outraged. They need to feel part of something, as they are a bit empty. They have limited intellectual capacity for patience. They like to moan about a lack of success or ambition, yet woe-betide anyone who dares to exhibit a modicum of either. They like to be debased by anodyne platitudes and spoon-fed sickly pastry-pouches of attention. They want the best, for the least. They hate footballers, football, the Premier League, the opposition, the opposition fans, the ref, yet they want them all in abundance - the more consumable and digestible the better; they want to swallow it all, **** it out and eat it again with sugar on top. Just feed them a few lines now and again - they will lap it up".

 

Well I for one am pleased that our beloved Chairman has taken on the Sun. There use of the phrase "South Coast Club" is five letters longer than "Southampton". The extra ink used is really going to dent their profit margin.

[manji]

To be fair to Cortese, I am a "match-going" supporter and I think that most of our support are idiots.

 

Your are not wrong Jeez did you see some of them yesterday. Special needs or what ? "one Alan Pardew theres only one Alan Pardew hur hur hur".......

[Deppo]

How many do you know personally? Remember now, stick to the facts.

 

Ok: I think that most of our support are idiots.

[del boy]

I am so sick of people on this forum telling others that they're 'stupid', an 'idiot', a 'negative ****' etc. etc.

 

If it so irritates you to read other people's views, don't go on a forum

 

Thats genius - deserves a roly eyes thingy at least!

[saintwiz]

Benjii,

you clearly enjoy winding people up!

look at your avatar.....

whats all that about?

[Miffy]

Strangely I feel myself agreeing with views from most of the posters on here.

 

I don't believe Pardew was sacked for 1st team performance or results, the timing makes this unlikely. So it was for something else and it seems to have been quite sudden as no-one else is lined up. We are unlikely to find out the truth and we certainly won't get it from Cortese as this would be unprofessional and could lead to a law-suit. So in this matter I will trust Corteses judgement.

 

In some of his dealings with the media and communications with the fans he has caused himself unnecessary criticism by appearing to be high-handed and not valuing the opinions of other stakeholders. Definate improvement required here.

 

Overall, good leadership is about making the right decisions not the popular ones, but also about pursuading others of your vision. Cortese is getting it about half right IMO.

 

Grade C - Could do better.

[Wes Tender]

I agree with the original post although I think Cortese does understand what a fickle bunch we football fans are. He knows that if we had lost to Swindon with Pardew still in post (which could have happened) and then drawn 0-0 with Rochdale (which could have happened) many of the fans chanting Pardew's name last night would have been calling for him to be sacked by 5pm on Saturday. That is just the way we are these days. Equally, he probably knows that if he gets a decent manager in and we win 2 or 3 games in a row then within a few weeks we will all be happy bunnies again.

 

Thanks Benji for the succinct summary and the further comments you made on it. Bang on the money for me.

 

But this post above is also very true and recognises that we fans will accept many things provided that the team is doing well. Personally, I reckon that it was eminently possible that we would have lost the match last night under Pardew and it was not impossible either that we might also have lost to Rochdale under him too. Why? Because the team that beat Bristol Rovers so convincingly did not have Lallana available against Swindon to pull the strings with his creativity and Lambert also seems off-colour. For Rochdale, we are now without Barnard too. If as you say, SouthportSaint, Cortese realised that as a distinct possibility, then all he had to do was wait until next Monday and many would be applauding him for sacking Pardew. But although nothing is known for sure as concrete fact as to why the decision could not wait, I seem to be one of the few who believes that Cortese must have had very good reasons and I still trust his judgement.

 

With luck, those who went off in a huff and raged at Cortese without any foundation for their anger, will now be starting to feel a bit stupid with themselves and as you say, most will have forgotten what it was all about if we appoint a top name manager and go on a run of wins.

[RonManager]

I feel that one majorly positive thing that has come out of this recent eruption is that, like him and his methods or not, we can be pretty sure now of Cortese's allegiance to SFC and his fierce intention that by hook or by crook, our club is going to succeed.

 

I think that any concerns that he might give up on us in the wake of Markus' untimely departure can now be put to bed.

 

Keep the Faith.

 

COYS.

[up and away]

 

Originally Posted by hypochondriac

What irritates me is the inference that everyone who doesn't praise and support Cortese completely is fickle or unintelligent.

 

I don't think that at all but I suspect that many of those who would abuse and crucify him based on unsubstantiated hearsay probably are.

 

You only have to look at the posts trying to imply that Cortese was interfering in team affairs and transfers being his choice, Waigo being the classic example. Even when informed Pardew knew all about Waigo from an Italian dof at West Ham and was still his choice, that gets totally over looked in the continual ****** being spouted.

 

Followed by MLT thinks Cortese is a ****, when all Matty said was that a training ground rift does not make sense in getting rid of all Pardew's management immediately. Escalating into MLT has the perfect right to call Cortese a ****, never mind what anyone says.

 

Quickly followed by this being a Cortese master plan irrespective of results. Done at such a time to produce maximum self inflicted damage to the club and it's promotion challenge.

 

Please, just a smidgen of common sense or fact finding, but trying to twist anything to form an argument you support, just takes us back to the Lowe days.

[yorkiesaint]

The problem with the arguments proposed on this thread is that rumours do sometimes turn out to have a base in reality, as often they do not. Think about the rumours of the breakdown in the Blair-Brown relationship, with today we learn were spot on and perhaps even underestimated the truth, even so far that Brown was blackmailing Blair. To brand everyone interested in rumours as of low intelligence and reactionary is to brand all journalists idiots, as that is their job. Should the News of the World have investigated the rumours surrounding the pakistani cricket team and corruption? Perhaps you think instead they should just stick to reporting official information on the pakistani cricket board website?

 

I can't disagree that fans are fickle and often remember only the last few games...but Cortese clearly also understands this as even the BBC say he waited until a positive result before sacking Pardew to underline that it was not a footballing decision.

 

And Cortese is treading a dangerous line taking on the Sun. Just ask all the other people whose careers have been ruined by Murdoch's cooperation.

[benjii]

Benjii,

you clearly enjoy winding people up!

look at your avatar.....

whats all that about?

 

That was in recognition of HMRC sorting out the skates. Obviously, it's a tad redundant now (although they're still fooked!). Might get a new one later if I can be arsed.

 

And no, not a wind-up. A tad polemical, sure, but then if you're going to start a new thread you should write something interesting. The underlying message is authentic and quite a few posters seem to have agreed with me.

[The9]

Interesting how the original poster starts by asking us to forget all NC's balls ups. At least he's good enough to appreciate they are mistakes.

Lets just recap them:

1. Introducing a booking fee, making it a lot more expensive for fans on a budget

2. Discontinuing the payment scheme, making owning a season ticket more difficult for loyal fans

3. Introducing a £10 parking fee for people traveling with the travel club to support their team.

4. Banning long term loyal fans for criticising him.

5. Banning the local newspaper for not following his agenda on a tiny matter.

6. Banning all press photographers in the hope of making a few hundred quid extra. Not realising that if this was a workable business model clubs with a lot more clout would have done it years ago, and now has simply removed any chance of additional exposure in the national press.

7. All sorts of PR gaffs surrounding local footballing legends

 

But lets put all that aside..... Oh hang on.... I forgot one..

 

8. Sitting on his ass all summer and waiting until three games into the season, and a day before the transfer window closes, to sack the manager.

 

A blinding summary from the original poster though. Truly blind.

 

Can we sticky an individual post ? I just want this lot left here somewhere to link to it in response to the "he saved our club so therefore we must love everything he does ad infinitum" drivel.

 

PS docker, well done for resisting the temptation to add "stupid sash shirt" to your list, I know that must have been difficult for you. Maybe if you just slip "hugely underestimating demand for the new shirt so many people are unable to buy one" in there too ?

[so22saint]

Rationality usually is the first casualty when football fans discuss their clubs.

 

**** off..

 

ho ho

[benjii]

The problem with the arguments proposed on this thread is that rumours do sometimes turn out to have a base in reality, as often they do not. Think about the rumours of the breakdown in the Blair-Brown relationship, with today we learn were spot on and perhaps even underestimated the truth, even so far that Brown was blackmailing Blair. To brand everyone interested in rumours as of low intelligence and reactionary is to brand all journalists idiots, as that is their job. Should the News of the World have investigated the rumours surrounding the pakistani cricket team and corruption? Perhaps you think instead they should just stick to reporting official information on the pakistani cricket board website?

 

I can't disagree that fans are fickle and often remember only the last few games...but Cortese clearly also understands this as even the BBC say he waited until a positive result before sacking Pardew to underline that it was not a footballing decision.

 

And Cortese is treading a dangerous line taking on the Sun. Just ask all the other people whose careers have been ruined by Murdoch's cooperation.

 

I hope it didn't come across that I was doing that.

 

By all means, be interested in rumours, be sceptical, don't believe everything you are told. But that virtue of independent thought also demands that you don't swallow everything that is an alternative view to what "the Man" is telling you.

[benjii]

Can we sticky an individual post ? I just want this lot left here somewhere to link to it in response to the "he saved our club so therefore we must love everything he does ad infinitum" drivel.

PS docker, well done for resisting the temptation to add "stupid sash shirt" to your list, I know that must have been difficult for you. Maybe if you just slip "hugely underestimating demand for the new shirt so many people are unable to buy one" in there too ?

 

 

I don't think anyone's said that - they just get annoyed at the selfish, short-sighted, ungrateful little ****s that abound round here.

[yorkiesaint]

I hope it didn't come across that I was doing that.

 

By all means, be interested in rumours, be sceptical, don't believe everything you are told. But that virtue of independent thought also demands that you don't swallow everything that is an alternative view to what "the Man" is telling you.

 

Yes you are absolutely right, but I guess I was rather hoping that that was a bit of a straw man and that most people on here realise that.

[HK_Phoey]

Well I for one am pleased that our beloved Chairman has taken on the Sun. There use of the phrase "South Coast Club" is five letters longer than "Southampton". The extra ink used is really going to dent their profit margin.

 

 

 

Personally think this is a stroke of genius. Even if the don't mention us by name more column inches dedicated to our club in The Sun in the last three weeks than in the last three years

[docker-p]

Can we sticky an individual post ? I just want this lot left here somewhere to link to it in response to the "he saved our club so therefore we must love everything he does ad infinitum" drivel.

 

PS docker, well done for resisting the temptation to add "stupid sash shirt" to your list, I know that must have been difficult for you. Maybe if you just slip "hugely underestimating demand for the new shirt so many people are unable to buy one" in there too ?

 

Thanks for appreciating how difficult that truly was.

[Gemmel]

Personally think this is a stroke of genius. Even if the don't mention us by name more column inches dedicated to our club in The Sun in the last three weeks than in the last three years

 

Stroke of genius it certainly wasnt.

To get coverage of the pitch he is now employing (or contracting) 6 (that i counted) photograhers to take pictures that no one has bought. Throw in the fact that the local and national press think he is arse, plus the fact the club now has to pay for pictures from away games (That the Echo used to provide for free) then commercially it has been a disaster.

[JRM]

Can we sticky an individual post ? I just want this lot left here somewhere to link to it in response to the "he saved our club so therefore we must love everything he does ad infinitum" drivel.

 

PS docker, well done for resisting the temptation to add "stupid sash shirt" to your list, I know that must have been difficult for you. Maybe if you just slip "hugely underestimating demand for the new shirt so many people are unable to buy one" in there too ?

 

there are other issues also missed off his list, like the removal of the Ted Bates trophy, re-naming hospitality suites, gagging staff from speaking to anybody about the club before checking with him first

[Viking Warrior]

Spot on Benji well said

[Deano6]

forget the faux-annoyance of some **** at The Sun...

forget the Plymouth Argus...

forget not being able to ram a filthy thermo-nuclear pie down your cake hole...

forget not being given interest free payment options (and having to arrange one yourself)...

forget match-day increases (not the only club, by the way)...

forget booking fees...

hell, even forget masterminding the entire resurrection of the club if you want...

 

no, I'll tell you what Cortese's biggest mistake has been:

 

Overestimating the intelligence of our fan base.

 

Clearly Cortese thinks we're sensible human beings. People who appreciate that things are seldom black and white. People who realise that you can't make an omelette without breaking some eggs. People who appreciate the complexities of life. People who understand that instant gratification is not available to everyone, and certainly not for free.

 

What one of his advisors needs to do is take him to one side, and have a quiet word:

 

"Nicola, many of these people are simple folk. They lack emotional maturity. They look for any excuse to get outraged. They need to feel part of something, as they are a bit empty. They have limited intellectual capacity for patience. They like to moan about a lack of success or ambition, yet woe-betide anyone who dares to exhibit a modicum of either. They like to be debased by anodyne platitudes and spoon-fed sickly pastry-pouches of attention. They want the best, for the least. They hate footballers, football, the Premier League, the opposition, the opposition fans, the ref, yet they want them all in abundance - the more consumable and digestible the better; they want to swallow it all, **** it out and eat it again with sugar on top. Just feed them a few lines now and again - they will lap it up".

 

Nutshell.

[doddisalegend]

forget the faux-annoyance of some **** at The Sun...

forget the Plymouth Argus...

forget not being able to ram a filthy thermo-nuclear pie down your cake hole...

forget not being given interest free payment options (and having to arrange one yourself)...

forget match-day increases (not the only club, by the way)...

forget booking fees...

hell, even forget masterminding the entire resurrection of the club if you want...

 

no, I'll tell you what Cortese's biggest mistake has been:

 

Overestimating the intelligence of our fan base.

 

Clearly Cortese thinks we're sensible human beings. People who appreciate that things are seldom black and white. People who realise that you can't make an omelette without breaking some eggs. People who appreciate the complexities of life. People who understand that instant gratification is not available to everyone, and certainly not for free.

 

What one of his advisors needs to do is take him to one side, and have a quiet word:

 

"Nicola, many of these people are simple folk. They lack emotional maturity. They look for any excuse to get outraged. They need to feel part of something, as they are a bit empty. They have limited intellectual capacity for patience. They like to moan about a lack of success or ambition, yet woe-betide anyone who dares to exhibit a modicum of either. They like to be debased by anodyne platitudes and spoon-fed sickly pastry-pouches of attention. They want the best, for the least. They hate footballers, football, the Premier League, the opposition, the opposition fans, the ref, yet they want them all in abundance - the more consumable and digestible the better; they want to swallow it all, **** it out and eat it again with sugar on top. Just feed them a few lines now and again - they will lap it up".

 

Ahhh the wide sweeping generalisation thread, it's so easy to pigeon hole 30-40K of people in one sweeping statement. Luckily if this thread is anything to go by most saints fans are very intelligent super paitent types so NC has nothing to worry about.