Antonio??

[Saint Charlie]

Nobody really wanted ? I thought Reading said no to us having an option ?

 

Interesting to note that we have an option with Goolie and had one with Papa - maybe AP felt less confident about Antonio and didnt bother ?

 

Who knows if there was an option, come over to the fans forum and ask AP.

 

What I meant was that Antonio was nowhere near the Reading team yet Pards recognised his potential, good management I think. Now, Reading have seen how good he could be and rightly have kept him, frustrating as that may be. We will deal with it and hopefully AP will sign someone just as good if not better- which he has a good track record of.

 

Antonio was our 3rd choice wideman last season and Pardew has said today we will sign a pacy winger.

[alpine_saint]

2 wrongs make a right then? Says alot about you. Carry on, you're clearly not worth engaging with.

 

This whole site is made up of people trying to score points against one another. But you can be dishonest and single me out if you wish...

[The Kraken]

I really think it's becuase Reading wanted Antonio his loan was away to get him some experince as he'd just come from non-league. Papa and Gulys clubs didn't/don't want them but we were/are not sure enough about the players just to buy them straight up hence an option to buy if they turn out to be what we want.

 

If I had to guess, I'd agree. It would be akin to us loaning out young Chamberlayne and agreeing with the loan club that they could buy him after a year. Or like Man U letting Beckham go on loan to Preston with an option to buy. Or Rio Ferdinand to Bournemouth. Or Jermaine Defoe to Bournemouth. Or......

[NickG]

nope, saints fault.

[alpine_saint]

I really think it's becuase Reading wanted Antonio his loan was away to get him some experince as he'd just come from non-league. Papa and Gulys clubs didn't/don't want them but we were/are not sure enough about the players just to buy them straight up hence an option to buy if they turn out to be what we want.

 

Its a valid explanation, as is that AP didnt show enough strength of conviction when Antonio's loan was arranged.

 

Ho-hum. If there is no chance of him coming back now, I suppose this is all academic. AP said we will sign a pacy winger. Let's hold him to it.

[Saint Charlie]

Its a valid explanation, as is that AP didnt show enough strength of conviction when Antonio's loan was arranged.

 

Ho-hum. If there is no chance of him coming back now, I suppose this is all academic. AP said we will sign a pacy winger. Let's hold him to it.

 

Antonio will be out of contract at end of season so can come then.

 

Also, an option would have to be agreed by both sides. If Reading didn't want one then tough ****! And thats probably what happened.

[alpine_saint]

Antonio will be out of contract at end of season so can come then.

 

Also, an option would have to be agreed by both sides. If Reading didn't want one then tough ****! And thats probably what happened.

 

Why is it the probable explanation ? Why is it more probable than we simply didnt ask ?

[Windmill Arm 2]

Why are so many posters surprised that Antonio will not be returning to Saints??, he's featured for Reading all season so far, he was never coming back NEVER, yet still the forum Jessies (of which there are many) continued to delude themselves. I've no doubt AP will have a few tricks up his sleeve yet. Its worth noting that he hasn't made a bad signing yet ( even Goolie is brilliant on paper ).

[Saint Charlie]

Why is it the probable explanation ? Why is it more probable than we simply didnt ask ?

 

You might be right. Nobody knows and it doesn't really matter now. We tried to sign him but havent and will move on. Hopefully you will too, we need a positive atmosphere to help the players remember!

[alpine_saint]

You might be right. Nobody knows and it doesn't really matter now. We tried to sign him but havent and will move on. Hopefully you will too, we need a positive atmosphere to help the players remember!

 

Who knows if there was an option, come over to the fans forum and ask AP.

 

What I meant was that Antonio was nowhere near the Reading team yet Pards recognised his potential, good management I think. Now, Reading have seen how good he could be and rightly have kept him, frustrating as that may be. We will deal with it and hopefully AP will sign someone just as good if not better- which he has a good track record of.

 

Antonio was our 3rd choice wideman last season and Pardew has said today we will sign a pacy winger.

 

As long as this happens in order to widen our attacking options, I will try to restrain myself.

[hypochondriac]

As long as this happens in order to widen our attacking options, I will try to restrain myself.

 

Please do.

[Saint Charlie]

As long as this happens in order to widen our attacking options, I will try to restrain myself.

 

Ok, fair enough.

[hypochondriac]

Erm, no, not really.

 

Nobody retracts comments about me, and some real humdingers have been flying around last couple of days.

 

I suspected you would say that. Ho hum just shows your mentality.

[thefuriousb]

Nobody really wanted ? I thought Reading said no to us having an option ?

 

Interesting to note that we have an option with Goolie and had one with Papa - maybe AP felt less confident about Antonio and didnt bother ?

 

I thought that we were not allowed to have a formal option as Antonio's contract had it written into it that if Reading wanted to extend his contract then they could.

 

They could wait until the end of the original loan period to decide what they wanted to do

 

Only if they decided not to offer a further year could we then step in.

 

Having decided to enforce this extension to his contract, whether AP wanted him to come back, is rather a moot point

 

This may not have been the case, and I may be incorrect, but something along these lines sounds familiar

[dubai_phil]

I love it

 

So on one thread we have moans and groans because AP is not buying the players NC is.

Then we have a thread with moans and groans because AP did not INSIST on a purchase option with Antonio. (But I thought NC was doing the buying back then - eg Papa?)

 

This is a lolage thread simply because of Deja Vue there was a similar on the Bournemouth forum criticising the Board, Manager, Slagging off Saints. Simply because we WOULDN'T give them an option to buy Adam Lallana and wanted silly money for him.

 

A player we sent out on loan to DEVELOP by getting PLAYING TIME.

 

So we can moan at Saints being used to develop players for other clubs as well, yet when we did it to help develop AL into the player he is now becoming it was wise.

 

I just love the way that this forum has gone from being a discussion about Opinions and DEBATING those opinions into a magical kingdom where NOBODY accepts that maybe, just possibly, what they KNOW and INSIST to be RIGHT may possibly not be.

 

So many people on here must be zillionaires because they are always right.

 

Don't suppose by chance this forum is actually now only populated by Politicians by any chance?

[Smirking_Saint]

Why is it the probable explanation ? Why is it more probable than we simply didnt ask ?

 

So hold on, at the start of the season nobody really knew about him and noone really knew he would have the half decent impact that he had (he isn't any where near the god everyone thinks he is) and now you are moaning about not having an option.

 

Now we have signed Gully WITH an option you are moaning its not good enough.

 

Exactly what do you want alpine ? Really ? Its rediculous. We have a better team than we had last season permanent wise, we lost two players who were 'risks' at the end of the season and this season replaced with a better RB, another utility man who looks good (RB,CB,CM) a LB/LM who looks promising and another 'risk'

 

We have played 4 games, dominated against Plymouth, Orient wasn't great and Bolton we dominated plus the win at Bournemouth.

 

Christ no wonder people get annoyed at you

Edited 26 August, 2010 by Smirking_Saint

[hypochondriac]

So hold on, at the start of the season nobody really knew about him and noone really knew he would have the half decent impact that he had (he isn't any where near the god everyone thinks he is) and now you are moaning about not having an option.

 

Now we have signed Gully WITH an option you are moaning its not good enough.

 

Exactly what do you want alpine ? Really ? Its rediculous. We have a better team than we had last season permanent wise, we lost two players who were 'risks' at the end of the season and this season replaced with a better RB, another utility man who looks good (RB,CB,CM) a LB/LM who looks promising and another 'risk'

 

We have played 3 games, dominated against Plymouth, Orient wasn't great and Bolton we dominated plus the win at Bournemouth.

 

Christ no wonder people get annoyed at you

 

Haha I didn't consider that. Good point.

[doddisalegend]

So hold on, at the start of the season nobody really knew about him and noone really knew he would have the half decent impact that he had (he isn't any where near the god everyone thinks he is) and now you are moaning about not having an option.

 

Now we have signed Gully WITH an option you are moaning its not good enough.

 

Exactly what do you want alpine ? Really ? Its rediculous. We have a better team than we had last season permanent wise, we lost two players who were 'risks' at the end of the season and this season replaced with a better RB, another utility man who looks good (RB,CB,CM) a LB/LM who looks promising and another 'risk'

 

We have played 4 games, dominated against Plymouth, Orient wasn't great and Bolton we dominated plus the win at Bournemouth.

 

Christ no wonder people get annoyed at you

 

Totally off topic but I thought we played better against Orient than we did against Plymouth.

[Smirking_Saint]

Totally off topic but I thought we played better against Orient than we did against Plymouth.

 

I didn't see the orient game but i did see Plymouth and Bournemouth.

 

It was crazy the possession we had against Plymouth and the crosses we put into the box, we had no trouble getting behind them and no trouble keeping the ball. The two guys upfront had poor movement and were never going to challenge in the air. If myself and loads of others could see that why couldn't Pardew ? We didn't need to bring a winger on we needed a lump upfront to play off.

 

I have seen the highlights, when we score a couple in open play they will start flowing but we need to start soon !

[dubai_phil]

I didn't see the orient game but i did see Plymouth and Bournemouth.

 

It was crazy the possession we had against Plymouth and the crosses we put into the box, we had no trouble getting behind them and no trouble keeping the ball. The two guys upfront had poor movement and were never going to challenge in the air. If myself and loads of others could see that why couldn't Pardew ? We didn't need to bring a winger on we needed a lump upfront to play off.

 

I have seen the highlights, when we score a couple in open play they will start flowing but we need to start soon !

 

So you are saying that against Plymouth we played well but simply missed having a big presence in the Penalty area?

 

What a shame we don't have a 36 goal a season striker on the books.

 

 

Oh we do? Well, where was he? AP out for dropping him

[Smirking_Saint]

So you are saying that against Plymouth we played well but simply missed having a big presence in the Penalty area?

 

What a shame we don't have a 36 goal a season striker on the books.

 

 

Oh we do? Well, where was he? AP out for dropping him

 

Lol

 

was a shame as i think he would have opened his account easily. Why oh why have we not got a similar replacement for him ?? Surely target men aren't hard to come by ??

 

As for the breaking down arguement, play 451, or 4-2-3-1 whatever you want to call it, have the 3 behind the striker keep switching positions and dropping into space etc, that should draw the defensive pairing out and bingo you have broken them down.

 

All in my personal opinion obviously

 

Cortese, i am available for appointment

[dubai_phil]

Lol

 

was a shame as i think he would have opened his account easily. Why oh why have we not got a similar replacement for him ?? Surely target men aren't hard to come by ??

 

As for the breaking down arguement, play 451, or 4-2-3-1 whatever you want to call it, have the 3 behind the striker keep switching positions and dropping into space etc, that should draw the defensive pairing out and bingo you have broken them down.

 

All in my personal opinion obviously

 

Cortese, i am available for appointment

 

Get in the queue mate. Myself & nickh before his demise were nailed on certs to get the job thanks to our experience, stunningly handsome good looks, wit, humour and modesty. Shame he screwed it all up by getting sent off and a one season ban

 

As for the "shape argument" I counter with the "team argument". Didier Drogba is a c*ck but a fine footballer. So why not clone him and play 11 Drogba's? obvious answer he wouldn't be any good as a left back.

Team building is the single most important factor in getting 11 players to gel, bond or whatever into a unit. Some are flexible but some simply are not up to it mentally as much as phsyically (George Lawrence - the greatest player ever seen - from the shoulders down - former Saints Fitness Coach tm)

 

We've moaned about Jaidi's distribution against Orient. Imagine putting Connolly into that 1 up front role.... hoof ..... ain't gonna work

Imagine Barnard up there alone? and having Harding or Butterfield banging in diagonal balls into the box from 45 yards because the shape isn't there to give them the confidence to get further down the wing.

 

I DO believe that we SHOULD be more adaptable and I believe with a full team (AND match fit Lambert) we have the players to do it. But it IS a risk.

 

I think we have been told that taking risks is not a good thing THIS season so.. meh we're back waiting for Rickie to get his sharpness back and someone will get a walloping and off we will go

[CHAPEL END CHARLIE]

Michail Antonio is a contracted Reading player, and if they want to keep him (I can't think why they wouldn't) then that's what's going to happen - at least until his contract expires. I happen to think this lad could go far in the game, and if Reading are asking £1m for him then we should make them a offer in that region - providing we have the budget to do that of course.

 

In the meantime I shall monitor his progress with interest - I expect it to be almost as rapid as he is.

[Weston Saint]

We had Surman, he could not get into our first team. We loaned him to Walsall and then Bournemouth. When he returned he went into our first team having gained experience.

 

We have Lallana, he could not get into our first team. We loaned him to Bournemouth and soon after he was in our first team.

 

Both had a contract with Saints.

 

Reading loaned Antonio to us. We nearly did not get him back in January then Reading allowed him to come back on a further loan. Now he is part of their first team.

 

See the connection! That is what clubs in higher divisions do.

 

I am not fussed about him. He was ok, nothing more.

[Deppo]

We had Surman, he could not get into our first team. We loaned him to Walsall and then Bournemouth. When he returned he went into our first team having gained experience.

 

We have Lallana, he could not get into our first team. We loaned him to Bournemouth and soon after he was in our first team.

 

Both had a contract with Saints.

 

Reading loaned Antonio to us. We nearly did not get him back in January then Reading allowed him to come back on a further loan. Now he is part of their first team.

 

See the connection! That is what clubs in higher divisions do.

 

I am not fussed about him. He was ok, nothing more.

 

Nutshell

[Kingsbridge Saint]

Disappointing, but plenty more like/better than him out there. Time for the scouting team to deliver on a speedster somewhere. COYR.

[Smirking_Saint]

Get in the queue mate. Myself & nickh before his demise were nailed on certs to get the job thanks to our experience, stunningly handsome good looks, wit, humour and modesty. Shame he screwed it all up by getting sent off and a one season ban

 

As for the "shape argument" I counter with the "team argument". Didier Drogba is a c*ck but a fine footballer. So why not clone him and play 11 Drogba's? obvious answer he wouldn't be any good as a left back.

Team building is the single most important factor in getting 11 players to gel, bond or whatever into a unit. Some are flexible but some simply are not up to it mentally as much as phsyically (George Lawrence - the greatest player ever seen - from the shoulders down - former Saints Fitness Coach tm)

 

We've moaned about Jaidi's distribution against Orient. Imagine putting Connolly into that 1 up front role.... hoof ..... ain't gonna work

Imagine Barnard up there alone? and having Harding or Butterfield banging in diagonal balls into the box from 45 yards because the shape isn't there to give them the confidence to get further down the wing.

 

I DO believe that we SHOULD be more adaptable and I believe with a full team (AND match fit Lambert) we have the players to do it. But it IS a risk.

 

I think we have been told that taking risks is not a good thing THIS season so.. meh we're back waiting for Rickie to get his sharpness back and someone will get a walloping and off we will go

 

I wouldn't suggest the formation if the team wouldn't work. And IMO it would, without Lambert up top leading the line in the 451 it probably wouldn't be as effective but with everyone fit i think it definately would.

 

Drogba is the finest striker on the planet ATM also.

[NickG]

Michail Antonio is a contracted Reading player, and if they want to keep him (I can't think why they wouldn't) then that's what's going to happen - at least until his contract expires. I happen to think this lad could go far in the game, and if Reading are asking £1m for him then we should make them a offer in that region - providing we have the budget to do that of course.

 

In the meantime I shall monitor his progress with interest - I expect it to be almost as rapid as he is.

 

transfer fees are strange but would say £1m is about double his value

[St_Tel49]

I think he did well for us but I saw more good luck at being in the right place at the right time than pure skill. Maybe in training people saw more.

 

Wouldn't throw loads of money at reading though.

That is not luck - that is a skill in its own right.

[Smirking_Saint]

Personally i think he might make it as a championship level striker in the end as opposed to a winger, i will be very surprised however if he ends up plying his trade regularly in the premiership or equivalent.

[eelpie]

This whole site is made up of people trying to score points against one another. But you can be dishonest and single me out if you wish...

 

Not everyone on this site feel they have to score points against others, but sadly the petty point scoring bores are taking over and driving others away. I fear you may be the only one left on here Alps.

[alpine_saint]

So hold on, at the start of the season nobody really knew about him and noone really knew he would have the half decent impact that he had (he isn't any where near the god everyone thinks he is) and now you are moaning about not having an option.

 

Now we have signed Gully WITH an option you are moaning its not good enough.

 

Exactly what do you want alpine ? Really ? Its rediculous. We have a better team than we had last season permanent wise, we lost two players who were 'risks' at the end of the season and this season replaced with a better RB, another utility man who looks good (RB,CB,CM) a LB/LM who looks promising and another 'risk'

 

We have played 4 games, dominated against Plymouth, Orient wasn't great and Bolton we dominated plus the win at Bournemouth.

 

Christ no wonder people get annoyed at you

 

You ask what I want ?

 

I want the manager to take up the resources he has been offered, use them effectively and deliver on all the fine words bandied about and the plan he was brought into execute.

 

Whether you like it or not, we have wasted the transfer window and the ability to build a squad for promotion and beyond in the Championship due to exceptionally low-key activity, and wasted over a month of preparation time to ensure the team was prepared physically and tactically to start as they meant to go on. We are playing catch-up on both the transfer front and the peformance /points front.

 

Now, I couldnt care f**king less who he brought in to improve the weak areas (CM, pace, wingers, etc.) as long as he did so. Apart from Richardson and Butterfield, to cover the RB issue, in my opinion until the Goolie signing none of the weak areas had been addressed. Obviously, having had Antoino and Papa on loan last season with a reasonable degree of success, it would have been the lowest risk approach to bring them back. For whatever reason, the club decided not to pursue this, so its down to them to find the players for the weak areas still not addressed.

 

Until Goolie plays and shows us what he is capable of, I see him as high-risk to our promotion aspirations, since he has come from abroad and never played in our league, unlike Antonio.

 

Now, I could go on all night giving justifications for my opinion, but you wouldnt listen anyway. If me sticking to my opinion annoys you and other "people", so be it.

[NickG]

our weakest position was RB.

 

We have signed two good RBs.

[alpine_saint]

transfer fees are strange but would say £1m is about double his value

 

What makes you qualified to express that opinion ?

[Saint_clark]

What makes you qualified to express that opinion ?

 

A lot more than that which makes you qualified to doubt it.

[NickG]

one big aim for this window was to keep Fonte, Lambert, Lallana etc - so far achieved.

 

next priority was RB - done.

 

next were CM - was hoping for someone who I knew to be first name in midfield but looking forward to seeing if Guly can do that

 

Winger - not done yet but still being promised.

 

Transfer window is not over, and busiest part of it still to go so too early to judge it

 

Think Ox-C and Martin have been seen by Pardew as almost new signings for this season

[NickG]

What makes you qualified to express that opinion ?

 

20 years old, I have seen most of his games at league 1 level, was playing in non-league 12 months ago, has now less than 12 months on his contract.

 

what makes you... - no we all know!

[alpine_saint]

A lot more than that which makes you qualified to doubt it.

 

I didnt express an opinion either way.

[alpine_saint]

20 years old, I have seen most of his games at league 1 level, was playing in non-league 12 months ago, has now less than 12 months on his contract.

 

what makes you... - no we all know!

 

And you came up with the figure of 500K how, then ?

[NickG]

ok you win he is worth £50m you have seen that special something we all missed.

[MarkSFC]

When Antonio came here last season he had pace to burn but little else of substance. His touch let him down, he mad bad decisions and couldnt cross consistantly well. When Papa came in he had pace to burn AND a good touch, could score a little but was nearly always offside but could deliver good crosses.

At the end of the season Papa had pace to burn AND a good touch, could score a little but was nearly always offside but could deliver good crosses.

At the end of the season Antonio had pace to burn BUT his touch had improved, his decison makinghad improved his crossing had improved and his goal-scoring had improved.

 

The improvement in Antonio was far more marked hence we all liked him...some more than others mind!!

 

I think he is good and potentially very good but that it...potentially. He's currently not a standout performer for the Championship by a long way and all going to plan that where we will be next year. Can you gaurantee he would be good enough then?

 

So if AP has got someone else in mind who is better now and definitely good enough for the championship next season, but maybe not as much potential for the Premier then that seems the best way forward to me.

 

In two months time I doubt Antonio is even mentioned on here!!

[alpine_saint]

ok you win he is worth £50m you have seen that special something we all missed.

 

Right, I thought so. Completely incapable of justifying that comment, so you decide to be childish.

[Deppo]

Can we all join in? I think he's worth £699,999

 

This is like that house programme where they show a couple some houses and they have to guess how much it costs. We've seen Antonio, so now we have to guess his value. If we get it right then we get to test drive him.

[alpine_saint]

Can we all join in? I think he's worth £699,999

 

This is like that house programme where they show a couple some houses and they have to guess how much it costs. We've seen Antonio, so now we have to guess his value. If we get it right then we get to test drive him.

 

You go right ahead and guess. At least you described it for what it is.

[NickG]

who much do you think he is worth?

[Deppo]

What's your guess Alpy?

[alpine_saint]

What's your geuss Alpy?

 

Half a pint of mild and a pack of salted peanuts.

[NickG]

Think my £500,000 is more reasonable, but if thats base on your knowledge of football go with it

[hypochondriac]

Right, I thought so. Completely incapable of justifying that comment, so you decide to be childish.

 

It was his opinion. How do you expect anyone else to respect your opinion when you are incapable of respecting others?

[NickG]

opinion based on facts I included to assist him